Honey thread - from TBB and bits from old LHC

**BranwenWolf** · March 30th, 2009, 08:02 PM

Originally Posted by ljkforu

BranwenWolf, your hair is beautiful. I would just keep up with the subtle honey lightenings. Don't fry your hair (Like I did).

I'm not a big fan of red hair and yours is just gorgeous on you. It is just such a lovely and complimentary color for you, IMHO.

I hope you feel that this is a compliment

Thank you.

I really do love it and may henna in the future because it makes me sad when it fades out, and I'm done with chemicals for the most part.

Today after I did some braid work I noticed the highlights more, I really liked the way this worked!

ktani- if coconut oil can be added to honey recipes and such I gather it blends easier with water than, um, oil? (does this make any sense?)

**ktani** · March 30th, 2009, 08:34 PM

Originally Posted by BranwenWolf

Thank you.

I really do love it and may henna in the future because it makes me sad when it fades out, and I'm done with chemicals for the most part.

Today after I did some braid work I noticed the highlights more, I really liked the way this worked!

ktani- if coconut oil can be added to honey recipes and such I gather it blends easier with water than, um, oil? (does this make any sense?)

That is great about the hi-lights. I am so pleased that you are happy with them.

It mixes with the honey and water. I have never had anyone report that either of the honey lightening booster oils, evoo and coconut oil, were a problem in a recipe mix, in the amount used, 1 tablespoon or less in total, being the usual amount. The oils like the spices, contribute extra peroxide to a recipe, when added to a mix.

**ljkforu** · March 30th, 2009, 11:27 PM

I see the problem here. When you add coconut oil to honey lightening in our cold climate it is clotted and doesn't melt. Since you can't heat the honey you have a "honey bear" full of white globs

There is 70 degree liquid coconut oil, but ktani I used regular and didn't complain, but it was very solid and required the heat of my scalp to join the mix. What should we do??? Everyone is trying to be polite but not clear

**Fethenwen** · March 31st, 2009, 04:58 AM

Originally Posted by ktani

Thank you for the update! I am glad that you are so pleased with your results.

I am a little confused as to why you massaged the coconut oil into your hair before applying the treatment. You can just add some (about a tablespoon or less, especially if you are using evoo), directly into the recipe. If it is because of the peroxide thread, that is about conventional peroxide use. You can read more about the idea of a preteatment for that here, in the first post of that thread. Honey lightening peroxide has not been reported to damage hair to date, no matter how many times honey lightening has been done, or how long (in hours), a recipe has been left on the hair.

Please continue to update. I look forward to your pictures!

Oh, I thought that there should be coconut added in the hair one hour before application, because of eventual peroxide damage

did not really read these instructions clearly enough. I read them again today and noticed that it says as you said (many times) that honey lightening does NOT damage hair. And I also thought that maybe it would boost the peroxide in the honey, which it does. But I should have left it out, because too much coconut oil is makes my hair oily for days. And the honey seems to also add some oily look.
I tried to shampoo my hair twice this morning, but my hair is still looks very oily and is slippery, it's incredibly soft and shiny but also sticks flat on my head and looks awful. On top of that we had some sort of tv crew filming in my school about our projects today, fortunately I didn't have to participate being on the scene

But this incident did not put me off the honey lightening method. It obviously is very nutritive and softening for hair, so I will do this a few times more to get more lighter result.

**ktani** · March 31st, 2009, 05:13 AM

Originally Posted by ljkforu

I see the problem here. When you add coconut oil to honey lightening in our cold climate it is clotted and doesn't melt. Since you can't heat the honey you have a "honey bear" full of white globs

There is 70 degree liquid coconut oil, but ktani I used regular and didn't complain, but it was very solid and required the heat of my scalp to join the mix. What should we do??? Everyone is trying to be polite but not clear

This is the first I have heard of this being a problem. Body heat worked to melt the oil for you, and you did get results that pleased you, so it is not a problem that way. You can just continue to use coconut oil the way you have been doing, no worries. EVOO, which tends to used more often for honey lightening, also has a higher peroxide value and may be a better choice for you.

**ktani** · March 31st, 2009, 05:21 AM

Originally Posted by Fethenwen

Oh, I thought that there should be coconut added in the hair one hour before application, because of eventual peroxide damage

did not really read these instructions clearly enough. I read them again today and noticed that it says as you said (many times) that honey lightening does NOT damage hair. And I also thought that maybe it would boost the peroxide in the honey, which it does. But I should have left it out, because too much coconut oil is makes my hair oily for days. And the honey seems to also add some oily look.
I tried to shampoo my hair twice this morning, but my hair is still looks very oily and is slippery, it's incredibly soft and shiny but also sticks flat on my head and looks awful. On top of that we had some sort of tv crew filming in my school about our projects today, fortunately I didn't have to participate being on the scene

But this incident did not put me off the honey lightening method. It obviously is very nutritive and softening for hair, so I will do this a few times more to get more lighter result.

No worries. I had a feeling that you were confusing the 2 threads. I am glad for you at least, that you hair is soft and shiny.

Too much oil can be a problem to wash out of the hair. You can just use less oil, or wash out the treatment with conditioner, a CO, which has been reported to take excess oil out of the hair better than shampoo, and with much less effort (coneless conditioner is best for this).

**ktani** · March 31st, 2009, 05:44 AM

Coconut oil chelates more free iron and copper than evoo and is the oil of choice, along with argan oil, for a pretreatment before conventional hair colouring or lightening.

For honey lightening, the honey itself chelates free iron and evoo can chelate some iron an copper too. It is not necessary to use coconut oil only for honey lightening. Honey lightening with either oil used has not been reported to damage hair, even previously damaged hair, to date. Honey lightening with no oil added has not been reported to damage hair, even previously damaged hair, to date. The honey itself, offers sufficient protection for the hair.

The spices as well, contain the protective flavonoids. There is no recommended honey lightening recipe, that requires a protective pretreatment

Adding conventional peroxide to a honey lightening recipe is not recommended and a coconut oil pretreatment is advised, in that case.

**ktani** · March 31st, 2009, 07:04 AM

When to Pretreat and the booster oils

Honey lightening

No pretreatment of any kind is necessary before honey lightening.

Of the 2 booster oils (evoo and coconut oil), evoo has a higher peroxide level, (as long as it is pure evoo and not a mix of evoo and olive oil).

Evoo will mix into a recipe better than coconut oil and either oil should only be used at room temperature. Body heat will melt the coconut oil used in a mix, when the treatment is applied to the hair.

A CO (coneless conditioner, preferrably) has been reported to remove a too oily honey lightening treatment, more easily than shampoo.
__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _____

Conventional lightening chemicals

Yes, for conventional hair colouring or lightening, or adding conventional peroxide to a honey lightening recipe, a pretreatment with either coconut oil or coconut and argan oils is recommended, to help prevent damage to hair.

__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _____

**ktani** · March 31st, 2009, 11:32 AM

I have redone the first post of this thread, to make it more user friendly.

**ShaSha** · March 31st, 2009, 02:29 PM

I did another honey treatment today, just out of curiosity... and the result is again a lot lighter.

I tried to take some photos, but it did not work out. I found it almost impossible to get the same light. Probably the best thing would be to take any photos at night when there is no outside light.

Anyway, (not sure if I can link in this forum) this was my hair before the honey today: http://i566.photobucket.com/albums/s...331_1500ed.jpg
Hair was not washed, and there was daylight from a window, but photo was taken indoors.

The end result is in my avatar, but there is another photo
http://i566.photobucket.com/albums/s...331_2100ed.jpg
Taken in the same place, different angle, under the same lamp, but there was no daylight anymore and the photo was taken from a mirror, so a lot different thing from the "before" photo.
So those photos are not really good as evidence

But I posted those since there might not be any before-after photos. I'm going to be really careful with honey.

I don't want any lighter hair, I do not want to deal with dark roots, so probably I will be looking for ways to condition with honey and no color changes at all.