Honey thread - from TBB and bits from old LHC

[ktani]

Ground cinnamon is acidic. Like honey, it also works better wth the new dilution, than with previous dilutions.

Of course, ground cinnamon works better with mineral free water (distilled), which does not delpete its peroxide level, but the change of the pH (through the dilution) of the treatment, has been reported to make a difference in a number of reported results. Less ground cinnamon has worked better with the new dilution than with more cinnamon at other dilutions, even with distilled water.

[ktani]

The minimum amount of honey to be used for a lighteng treatment is 10 grams.

1 tablespoon of honey is approximately 21 grams. Depending on the length and thickness of the hair, 1 tablespoon of honey can be used with 6 tablespoons of distilled water = 3 oz. This may help cut down on drips for some.

The hair needs to be very with with a treatmment, (not soaking wet on its own) both before and while covered, during the 1 hour a treatment is on the hair.

Honey lightening recipes can also be applied to residue, leave-in free dry hair. The hair must be fully saturated and very wet with the treatment in this case as well, in order to get the best possible results.

A swim cap is recommeded to cover the hair. There are swim caps for long hair with chin straps to help secure them. I think that this is a much better option than plastic bags that can slip or shower caps that require extra things worn over them.

LHC swim cap thread
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...ead.php?t=8562

A swim cap guide
http://www.geocities.com/lapswimr/scg.html

[ktani]

For vegans who are opposed to using honey, or there is another reason, a mix can be made using distilled water, ground cinnamon or ground cardamon (patch test both) and either coconut or extra virgin olive oil (the honey lightening recipe boosters, each one adds extra peroxide). The honey lightening boosters do not indivdually have a higher peroxide level than most honeys can have.

Both ground cinnamon and ground cardamom are acidic. The new dilution and distilled water with its pH of 7, has been reported to more effective with the spices than previous dilutions. Like honey, less spice with the new dilution, has been reported to be more effective, than more spice at lower dilutions.

Cinnamon caution http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=2382

All of these ingredients have the same or similar (coconut oil contains gallic acid) protective flavonoids as honey. Coconut oil has been reported as a pre treatment, with colour applied over it, to help protect hair from conventional higher level, peroxide hair colour damage, and the flavonoid chemical equivalents were found in P & G research, to help protect hair from conventional peroxide/bleach damage, used the same way. In other research, the same flavonoids were found to protect cells from conventional peroxide damage. No damage to hair has been reported from any of the honey lightening boosters.

A recipe can be

1 tablespoon ground cinnamon or ground cardamom, 1/2 tablespoon of coconut oil or evoo and 6 tablespoons = 3 oz distilled water,

or

2 tablespoons, 1 of ground cinnamon, the other ground cardamon, 1 tablespoon evoo or coconut oil and 12 tablespoons = 6 oz distilled water.

Ground cardamom has been reported to wash out of the hair easier than ground cinnamon as has a higher peroxide level.

Extra virgin olive oil has a higher peroxide level than coconut oil.

The oil will do 3 things.

1. add extra peroxide to the recipe

2. help the spice stick to the hair better than distilled water alone

3. add extra conditiong to the mix

The mix can be shaken, not stirred, lol (a little 007 lightening humour). All other honey lightening guidelines apply (no added heat, the hair needs to be kept very wet with the treatment before and while covered (a swim cap is recommended), and the recommended treatment time is 1 hour).

[ktani]

The peroxide in a honey lightening recipe can be depleted by; minerals, Vitamin C, heat and UV.

The optimal pH for honey to produce peroxide is 6. Most honeys on the market are more acidic than this and the spice boosters are too. I tested ground cinnamon. Its pH is about 4.5 and cardamom hydrosol is pH 4.5 - 4.8, http://www.naturalgreen.ca/Product/C...ntial-Oil.html.

That is why distilled water (pH7), and the new dilution work so well, IMO. Together, they raise the pH level of a recipe and allow the honey to produce more peroxide than it can at lower concentrations (dilutions) and without extra minerals.

The exception to distilled or deionized water (both should work well), is tap water that has a pH of 7 and a very low to no mineral content.

[ktani]

Honey lightening can be done repeatedly with no worries about hair damage.

There been no reports of hair damage from honey lightening in all 5 Honey threads to date, including this one, no matter how long a treatment is left on the hair or how often it is done. The research that supports this is in my signature post, in this thread, http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...ad.php?t=10495 and the Honey Article. There have been no reports of honey damaging hair on these boards, when accidental lightening has occurred.

Honey residue can leave the hair dry and hair ends stiff. This result is temporary and can easily resolved by shampooing. There have been 0 lasting effects reported when this is done.

Not all honeys leave a discernable residue that reqires shampooing out. Both raw and pasteurized honeys, cheap and expensive ones, can leave a residue. The amount of residue depends on the honey but there is no one type or brand of honey that has been singled out to leave more residue than others.

It is important to rinse the hair well but honey residue is best removed by shampoo, based on reports.

[ktani]

Pictures of honey lightening with the new dilution (4 x the amount of water (distilled recommended), to honey by weight). You can also use tablespoons. 1 tablespoon honey requires 6 tablespoons distilled water.

Jan in ID - on mid-brown virgin hair - with the new dilution and distilled water - after 3 more treatments - with ground cinnamon and only 1/2 tblsp EVOO, no conditioner and the condition of her hair, after 5 treaments
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=1721

HalcyonDays - on dark mid-brown virgin hair - with the new dilution using tap water - after 1 treatment - left on the hair for 2 hours - just water and honey. The lighting is dark in the before picture, so I requested a replacement picture.
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=1633

HalcyonDays - on the condition of her hair following honey lightening and a replacement before picture
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=1635

soleluna - on hennaed hair (baq Egyptian henna) - the new dilution - after 1 treatment - with distilled water and only 1 tsp ground cinnamon - no conditioner
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=1375

soleluna - recipe details and the condition of her hair following honey lightening Note: the correct amount of honey used was 2 tablespoons - there was an error made in transcribing the recipe
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=1377

Alley Cat - on chemically dyed, almost black, previously hennaed hair (which shows as red) - after 9 treatments - 8 with no conditioner - 3 with ground cinnamon - the last 5 with just water and honey, the 3 most recent with distilled water and the new dilution
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=1492

Aley Cat - on the condition of her hair following honey lightening
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=1495

LadyPolaris - on hennaed hair - after 4 treatments - the new dilution with distilled water, ground cinnamon and EVOO - no conditioner and the condition of her hair following 4 honey lightening treatments
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=1651

melikai - on previously hi-lighted hair - the new dilution, with distilled water and 1 tablespoon ground cardamom, after 2 treatments
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=2055

melikai - recipe and the condition of her hair after 2 treatments
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=2060

[ktani]

Pictures of honey lightening with just honey and water

kokuryu - on virgin, mid-blonde hair - using only tap water with a pH of 7 and a very low mineral contentand honey, unmeasured - after 3 treatments
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=1799

kokuryu - on the condition of her hair after 3 treatments
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=1801

HalcyonDays - on dark mid-brown virgin hair - with the new dilution using tap water - after 1 treatment - left on the hair for 2 hours - just water and honey. The lighting is dark in the before picture, so I requested a replacement picture.
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=1633

HalcyonDays - on the condition of her hair following honey lightening and a replacement before picture
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=1635

Alley Cat - on chemically dyed, almost black, previously hennaed hair (which shows as red) - 4 to 1 dilution - after 9 treatments - 8 with no conditioner - 3 with ground cinnamon - the last 5 with just water and honey, the 3 most recent with distilled water and the new dilution
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=1492

Aley Cat - on the condition of her hair following honey lightening
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=1495

Alley Cat - more on the condition of her hair following her 9th honey lightening treatment - which was with Jarrah honey, which has a very high peroxide value
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=1596

[ktani]

Honey lightening on hennaed hair

Henna results vary with the individual. There is the water chosen (tap vs distilled), the recipe (whether or not lemon juice is used in the mix), the quality of the henna (dye content, sift, crop year and age (stale henna), the method used, the frequency with which it is applied, and the hair of the individual.

Honey lightening has its variables too in terms of results. There is the water chosen, the honey (peroxide level), the recipe (lemon juice or Viamin C in an ingredient, heat, UV, and minerals deplete peroxide), the method used, the frequency with which it is applied, and the hair of the individual.

However, honey lightening, using the new dilution, with a good peroxide producing honey, the right water (distilled or deionized), recipe, and method, has been reported to work on various types of henna, even baq henna.

Pictures of honey lightening on hennaed hair

Fethenwen, after 2 treatments, using cardamom essential oil , 1 tsp powdered cinnamon and distilled water, using the new dilution on 2 years of hennaed hair (the last 6 months, doing roots only)
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=3528, another picture of the new hair colour, http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=3553

recipe details
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=3538

method details
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=3540

kimki - on hennaed hair - after 2 treatments, 1 with ground cinnamon - no conditioner
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...&postcount=958

kimki's recipe - This was before the new dilution, which has been reported to yield better results. Chamomile tea is no longer recommended for honey lightening. It can add gold tones to hair.
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...&postcount=960

kimki - on the condition of her hair following honey lightening
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...&postcount=822

My response to kimki's questions
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...&postcount=824

soleluna - on hennaed hair (baq Egyptian henna) - the new dilution - after 1 treatment - with distilled water and only 1 tsp ground cinnamon - no conditioner
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=1375

soleluna - recipe details and the condition of her hair following honey lightening Note: the correct amount of honey used was 2 tablespoons - there was an error made in transcribing the recipe
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=1377

LadyPolaris - on hennaed hair - after 4 treatments - with distilled water, ground cinnamon and EVOO - no conditioner and the condition of her hair following 4 honey lightening treatments
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=1651

Sokudo Ningyou, honey, distilled water and 1 teaspoon ground (powdered) cinnamon, on 3 year old henna, grown out for 6 months, and on the condition of her hair.
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=3851

[ktani]

Honey lightening and red tones

Regarding red tones and honey lightening, it depends on the starting hair colour (honey lightening has not been reported to add colour of its own to hair, even with ground cinnamon) but here are 2 results on virgin, mid brown hair, that went from brown to blonde, bypassing red altogether. The tap water used in the 2nd result IMO, had the right pH and a low mineral content. Some tap waters have a very low mineral content and a pH of 7, making them perfect for honey lightening. IMO, such tap water is exceptional, rather than common. I recommend using distilled or deionized water only for honey lightening. Of the two, I recommend distilled, if both are available.

Jan in ID - on mid-brown virgin hair - with distilled water - after 2 treatments - with ground cinnamon and booster oils - no conditioner and the condition of her hair following honey lightening
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=1299

Jan in ID - on mid-brown virgin hair - with the new dilution and distilled water - after 3 more treatments - with ground cinnamon and only 1/2 tblsp EVOO, no conditioner and the condition of her hair, after 5 treaments
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=1721

HalcyonDays - on dark mid-brown virgin hair - with the new dilution using tap water - after 1 treatment - left on the hair for 2 hours - just water and honey. The lighting is dark in the before picture, so I requested a replacement picture.
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=1633

HalcyonDays - on the condition of her hair following honey lightening and a replacement before picture
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=1635


Honey lightening with ground cinnamon, has been reported to reduce brassiness and lighten unwanted red/gold tones, on blonde hair, even before the new dilution. With the new dilution, the recipe used by firebird, would require 12 tablespoons of distilled water, not 8.

firebird - honey lightening on a cassia treatment that had darkened her previously dyed hair, adding a red/gold tone - she used ground cinnamon and EVOO, no conditioner
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...&postcount=489

A thread about cassia stained hair
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...ad.php?t=13332

[ktani]

Honey lightening on henndigoed hair

Indigo is another plant that has varied results on individuals. It can fade easily for some people or be very difficult to lighten.

Honey lightening has been reported to work well on henndigoed hair too. The new dilution, has been reported to work better than previous dilutions, on the more difficult, hard to lighten henndigo. However, some concentrations of henndigo proved resistant to any lightening (except a bleach recipe that all but destroyed test samples), even with conventional peroxide, on test samples of cut off ends, for wintersun99.

bizarrogirl used a previous dilution for her treatments, that included conditioner. However, when more water was added, her results were even better and less ground cinnamon was used. This lead in part to conditioner no longer being recommended for honey lightening. For many others, conditioner did not improve results and in some cases, interfered with honey lightening.

bizarrogirl - on henndigoed hair (2 henndigo treatments) (baq henna) and then on multiple henna layers - after 2 treatments in total - with ground cinnamon
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...&postcount=586

bizarrogirl - picture details
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bizarrogirl/sets/72157594199905645

wintersun99 - due to unforseen circumstances, pictures are no longer available. However, the links below contain valuable information, in terms of her report.

wintersunn99 update
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=2278

wintersun99's honey lightening recipe and method Note: 3/4 cup is a US measurement = 1/2 cup Metric = 6 oz = 12 tablespoons
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=2292