Hairtoy makers who come and go

**bparnell75** · June 19th, 2017, 09:10 AM

I have had many encourage me to do an etsy shop too. But all of the above reasons are why I do not. Would rather create when the urge comes, then give away or create to give away. Most cost of materials for wood is minimal, its the time and effort.

**DweamGoiL** · June 19th, 2017, 12:11 PM

Originally Posted by bparnell75

I have had many encourage me to do an etsy shop too. But all of the above reasons are why I do not. Would rather create when the urge comes, then give away or create to give away. Most cost of materials for wood is minimal, its the time and effort.

I can definitely see that

**Dendra** · June 19th, 2017, 12:58 PM

Originally Posted by Nightshade

I'd, literally, make more if I got a job at McDonalds for the amount of time I put into it, so it really is for the love of doing it and not about the money.

I think it's wonderful that you do it, then, and I know your products make people very happy! I plan on trying some one day.

**Stormynights** · June 23rd, 2017, 10:26 AM

I wish you could sell your creations on this site.

**lunasea** · June 23rd, 2017, 11:03 AM

Originally Posted by Nightshade

I'm rather bad at percentages (I pay a good friend of mine to do my bookeeping so the IRS doesn't get on my arse when I file taxes), so I'll just give you the numbers.

That $7k does include some postage costs (that and the Etsy fees are all rolled into this thing called the Shop Payment Account), but my revenue was about $25k sales (after shipping costs). Halve it for the cost of materials (for both the products and the shipping: boxes, labels, etc.) to $12.5k.

And then I get to pay taxes on that, too, as income at about 20% (because there's no withholding on it) which is now putting it at closer to $10k.

Figure 25 hours a week, 52 weeks a year, I'm making about $7.70 an hour (this is good, a few years ago before I made some adjustments I was paying myself closer to $4.25 an hour). That's below minimum wage for my state.

I'd, literally, make more if I got a job at McDonalds for the amount of time I put into it, so it really is for the love of doing it and not about the money.

This doesn't even make note of the fact that there is time spent acquiring skills and researching and gathering materials. There are materials that are wasted when you are learning and when you make mistakes. You don't get compensated for that unless you somehow factor it in. There also must be space somewhere (square footage in a house or shop) that is dedicated to shipping, photographing, and crafting; electricity involved in the use of power tools; water use; etc. Oh, and let's not forget that the tools have to be purchased in the first place. Crafters get no health benefits unless they are insured by a spouse, have a second job, or buy their own insurance. There is no paid leave for vacation or being sick. As a matter of fact, if you take either sick or vacation, you make NO money.

Hand workmanship is simply undervalued in a throw-away economy. I don't know how any seller out there can make it...especially when they are targeting a small niche market.

I love my hand-made hairtoys but consider them a vanishing treasure. Make no mistake, I consider a well-made item a luxury.

**Stormynights** · June 23rd, 2017, 11:45 AM

I weave baskets but never to sell There is or was a lady on Etsy that had to be going in the hole. I know what the material cost and you can't buy a basket kit for twice what she was selling her baskets for.

**DweamGoiL** · June 24th, 2017, 02:15 PM

I was having a private conversation today with one of our popular Etsy makers and this person allowed me to share comments from that interaction:

"I read with interest the thread on LHC called "Hairtoy makers who come and go", and if you want to put my 2 cents in, everyone is basically right. I've got a little over $40k worth of tools that are necessary to do what I do, and I get up at 3 am every morning and work until 7:00 pm every day except Sundays, that's the Lords day. Net, net, I make about $4 per hour, and I do it because I love it. I use to make $45/hr. in a previous job, and even on my worst days in the shop, they're all better than the best days at the previous job. So why do they come and go? It's a simple answer... they don't love what they do and that at it's core is why Kimi and Stacey, Richard and Melissa, Doug and Erin, Rich, Ed and the few others that have been around for awhile, that's what we all share in common, and I'm guessing that they don't make much more than $4/hr. either."

I felt strongly that this feedback is invaluable to this discussion

**Stormynights** · June 25th, 2017, 10:45 AM

Maybe this is why Ed doesn't respond to messages. He just doesn't like that part and for 4 dollars an hour doesn't want to do that. He still makes very nice sticks.

**Nightshade** · June 25th, 2017, 02:56 PM

Originally Posted by DweamGoiL

I was having a private conversation today with one of our popular Etsy makers and this person allowed me to share comments from that interaction:

"I read with interest the thread on LHC called "Hairtoy makers who come and go", and if you want to put my 2 cents in, everyone is basically right. I've got a little over $40k worth of tools that are necessary to do what I do, and I get up at 3 am every morning and work until 7:00 pm every day except Sundays, that's the Lords day. Net, net, I make about $4 per hour, and I do it because I love it. I use to make $45/hr. in a previous job, and even on my worst days in the shop, they're all better than the best days at the previous job. So why do they come and go? It's a simple answer... they don't love what they do and that at it's core is why Kimi and Stacey, Richard and Melissa, Doug and Erin, Rich, Ed and the few others that have been around for awhile, that's what we all share in common, and I'm guessing that they don't make much more than $4/hr. either."

I felt strongly that this feedback is invaluable to this discussion

Aw whoever that was, it was nice they gave me a shoutout. Hugs back to them. And they're right, it was about $4 an hour making hair sticks. It's better now, but still under minimum wage. But I miss making sticks and Ficcares :[

**Borgessa** · June 26th, 2017, 04:20 AM

Its like anything crafty, over the yrs i've been a crafter of many things, I use to knit my kids jumpers (sweaters) but if I ever had to sell one, people would object to paying what they were really worth. If you included my time and effort. Heck you'd be lucky to get back the cost of the materials. Where once it was the cheaper option to make your own clothes or knit your own jumpers, its now considered crafting, therefore they charge you and arm and a leg to get your supplies in.

I suspect turning sticks would be hard to make a living at, (considering what I've read here.) What you would have to charge to get anywhere near a decent hourly rate would be too much for the limited market, as someone mentioned, most are only interested in claw clips etc, only a few want sticks and forks.

Here in Auckland, my city, there is a store not far from us, were all the crafters and carvers buy space in a shop, for no less than 6 months, they get small cubical to display and hopefully sell their wares. It is a fantastic shop, i can browse in there for hrs. Not sure if any of you talented folks have anything like that available to you, as $400 dollars for a fair stall seems ridic high.