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shutterpillar
July 6th, 2012, 02:27 PM
I hope I am explaining this in a way that everyone can understand...

As of lately I have had very tangly hair when I get out of the shower. It is just the top section of my hair... the bottom section is completely fine and I can run my fingers through no problem. But when I get out of the shower, the top portion of my hair seems to be very tangly. Like it is almost trying to turn itself into one giant dreadlock. It stays like this until it is completely dry and then I am able to run my fingers through it. (I finger comb, I do not use a brush or regular comb.) It's like velcro or something until it dries.

Does it just need to be clarified? I do ACV rinses once a week and my hair seems to be much less tangly when I do them. I currently use Herbal Essences Long Term Relationship shampoo and conditioner. I have tried switching to CO, but it didn't work out very well for me, no matter what brand I used. It works fine the first day but then my hair just goes limp if I CO repeatedly.

Thank you in advance for any advice.

WaitingSoLong
July 6th, 2012, 02:31 PM
I would definitely try clarifying first. I assume you throughly detangle before entering the shower.

shutterpillar
July 6th, 2012, 02:35 PM
I would definitely try clarifying first. I assume you throughly detangle before entering the shower.

Yes, I do. Absolutely no tangles when I get in. I can even run my hands through my hair while I am washing it... it is just when I get out and my hair is just beginning to dry that it does this. And it is just the top 4 inches or so from the scalp.

Can anyone recommend a good clarifier?

Madora
July 6th, 2012, 02:36 PM
The tangles might be the result of how your manipulate your strands while they are wet. Hopefully, you do not "moosh" your hair on top of your head while shampooing or conditioning.

This may or may not work for you, but I thoroughly detangle my hair first before it gets wet (use a wide tooth comb, don't rely on just fingercombing).

Then I part it in two and try and keep each side separate through the entire procedure.

I also use my fingers in a certain way...one side at a time..i.e. down the right side - top to bottom, down the left side, top to bottom, and the back, from crown to nape.

I try to use the fingers in the same direction, not wily nily.

Used to just gently detangle with fingers then wide tooth comb while it was loaded was conditioner but stopped doing that when I learned that a few drops of Mineral Oil (aka baby oil) worked just as well (on hair that was clarified FIRST. The MO was then used on damp hair). MO is very lightweight and it only took me 4 drops. Very happy with the results. Made my clarified hair (which was a mess of tangles) very easy to detangle. Left my hair soft, shiny and feeling great).

WaitingSoLong
July 6th, 2012, 02:37 PM
I recommend Joico chelating shampoo. It clarifies quite well and is not so harsh as others, IMO. You can clarify with any shampoo that says "clarifying" just remember to give it some conditioner afterwards or oil or something as ti will strip all the oils/build-up on your hair.

ETA: I use Joico because I did not like ACV rinses at all.

Madora
July 6th, 2012, 02:39 PM
Neutrogena Anti-Residue clarifying shampoo has gotten good reviews here. That what I used and it worked well.

shutterpillar
July 6th, 2012, 02:41 PM
The tangles might be the result of how your manipulate your strands while they are wet. Hopefully, you do not "moosh" your hair on top of your head while shampooing or conditioning.

This may or may not work for you, but I thoroughly detangle my hair first before it gets wet (use a wide tooth comb, don't rely on just fingercombing).

Then I part it in two and try and keep each side separate through the entire procedure.

I also use my fingers in a certain way...one side at a time..i.e. down the right side - top to bottom, down the left side, top to bottom, and the back, from crown to nape.

I try to use the fingers in the same direction, not wily nily.

Used to just gently detangle with fingers then wide tooth comb while it was loaded was conditioner but stopped doing that when I learned that a few drops of Mineral Oil (aka baby oil) worked just as well (on hair that was clarified FIRST. The MO was then used on damp hair). MO is very lightweight and it only took me 4 drops. Very happy with the results. Made my clarified hair (which was a mess of tangles) very easy to detangle. Left my hair soft, shiny and feeling great).


I am very gentle with them while I am in the shower. All fingers go in the same direction and I certainly do not pile it all on top of my head. I cannot even fathom the disaster that would arise from that. Your washing routine sounds a lot like mine, except I do not part in the middle.

I will try clarifying and mineral oil. thank you for your suggestions. :)

maborosi
July 6th, 2012, 02:42 PM
As far as CO not working, that hurdle is actually something I think a lot of people have to overcome. I had to put up with my scalp begrudgingly getting used to no shampoo for about a week, then it sorted itself out and I can go pretty long without needing to shampoo. ^^ But if you find that it doesn't work for you, that's okay, too. Everyone's hair is different.

Madora's got some excellent tips!

I hope you can find something that works out for you!

~maborosi~

embee
July 6th, 2012, 03:20 PM
There are things we do with a towel that can make a nest of hair at the scalp. I presume you're being very careful and not rubbing and such. :)

shutterpillar
July 6th, 2012, 03:30 PM
maborosi - I may have to give it another try. CO lasted for two weeks for me, up until I needed to attend an important event. Then I got tired of my hair being limp and went back to washing with shampoo and conditioner.

embee- yes, I am being very careful with the towel. I have actually recently adopted the "plopping" method using a cotton t-shirt in hopes to bring out my waves and reduce frizz.

Anje
July 6th, 2012, 03:31 PM
You know, I'm reading this and thinking your hair might be lacking something....

Certainly, clarify first. That's easy, and if it solves the problem, great!

What's the texture like of the tangled hair? Is it sticky? Gummy? Mushy? I'm wondering if your top layer isn't suffering some damage and in need of a bit of protein. Try something fairly mild to start with (don't want to mess up the bottom layer too much), like 1 Tbsp of low-sodium soy sauce in a cup of water, poured on the hair and left to soak for maybe 10 minutes. Follow up with plenty of moisturizing conditioner.

shutterpillar
July 6th, 2012, 03:34 PM
Anje, I was wondering the same thing. The texture is much like the rest of my hair. It just wants to clump together at the top for some reason.

Dovetail
July 6th, 2012, 03:41 PM
Is the top tangled IN the shower, or after you get out? I only wonder because maybe its how the water is hitting your head that is making the top tangle and not the bottom? o.O

Alternatly It could be from the sun outside? I'm not really sure how to help solve it though :/

shutterpillar
July 6th, 2012, 03:44 PM
Dovetail, it is not tangled while I am in the shower. I can run my fingers through it no problem while I am in there. It begins to tangle about 10 minutes after i've gotten out.

It could be the sun. We have been outside more lately since it's summer time. Maybe I should try to wear some scarves or a hat.

So confusing! LOL. Thanks for all the advice and tips. I suppose i'll have to take it one at a time, beginning with clarifying.

Dovetail
July 6th, 2012, 03:49 PM
Huh. I hope you figure it out :) also, maybe if you are growing out layers/damage the top layer is shorter and maybe you can see if it has splits? I don't know your trimming schedule or anything though.

There was a topic all about different ways to wear cute head scarves.

dollyfish
July 6th, 2012, 06:44 PM
This happens to me every single time my hair is wet. It's just my hair type, I guess.

I know what you mean about being able to run your hands through your hair IN the shower. My hair is always the most detangled while it's wet. When it starts to dry the top part gets super tangly and is almost impossible to detangle without ripping or something (like you, my length is usually fine). Once it's dry I can finish detangling, or I can detangle while it's still soaking wet, but if I let it dry to super-damp status, it's tangle city. I've just thought this was what all hair was like!

BlazingHeart
July 6th, 2012, 07:04 PM
My hair does something similar. When it is wet or damp, it clumps and sticks to itself, which means that simple cross-overs act like tangles. Once it's dry, it is slick and brushes through easily. It's worse on the top than on the bottom, but it's a texture thing - my hair is finer on the top, coarser on the bottom, and the coarser stuff just doesn't do this as much. (I'm certain of that because the coarse stuff comes higher on one side, and my tangly stuff starts higher on that side).

For me, it's not damage, it's just the way my hair behaves when wet.

~Blaze

shutterpillar
July 6th, 2012, 07:27 PM
dollyfish and blazingheart - people who understand! LOL. I am so grateful that you posted and now I know that I am not alone with weird hair. I notice both of you have coarse hair, but claim for some of it to be fine. Mine is the same way... fine with coarse hairs scattered throughout (though seems to be more fine on top) which is why I set my type as F/M because there was no F/C option.

It is exactly like you said, BlazingHeart - it clumps and sticks to itself. I wasn't sure what to call it, so I called it tangles because I cant run anything through it while wet.

spidermom
July 6th, 2012, 09:56 PM
I'd clarify, then do a deep moisture treatment.

Phalaenopsis
July 7th, 2012, 03:24 AM
Shutterpillar: the solution is simple. :) It's the herbal essence shampoo you're using. I had your problem with every herbal essence shampoo, because of the sodium lauryl sulfate in it.

jeanniet
July 7th, 2012, 03:56 AM
My hair does something similar. When it is wet or damp, it clumps and sticks to itself, which means that simple cross-overs act like tangles. Once it's dry, it is slick and brushes through easily. It's worse on the top than on the bottom, but it's a texture thing - my hair is finer on the top, coarser on the bottom, and the coarser stuff just doesn't do this as much. (I'm certain of that because the coarse stuff comes higher on one side, and my tangly stuff starts higher on that side).

For me, it's not damage, it's just the way my hair behaves when wet.

~Blaze
Yep. My hair is mixed fine to coarse. I detangle meticulously before I wash, and when I wash I barely move the hair at all. "Clump and stick" is exactly what it does, both in the shower and while it's drying. I just don't detangle unless my hair is dry. Trying to do it any other way simply doesn't work.

afu
July 7th, 2012, 04:43 AM
I know exactly what you mean! its almost as if its not tangled you just can't comb it because it feels so stuck together. I used to get this all the time before LHC but since joining my hair has become much more balanced and I rarely get it anymore. My hair generally hates protein but when this happens (just one spot on the back of my head, i think the hairdresser left bleach on there too long once) I apply just a bit of protein containing conditioner just to that area, just once and not as a long treatment and it seems to sort it out, then i can continue with piling in moisture during CO for another few months :D

My tip would be to clarify and then do a hair stretch test to see of you need protein, if the hair in that spot is easily over stretched just apply some protein product to the affected area only

shutterpillar
July 7th, 2012, 09:37 AM
Shutterpillar: the solution is simple. :) It's the herbal essence shampoo you're using. I had your problem with every herbal essence shampoo, because of the sodium lauryl sulfate in it.


I dont think that is the problem, because I have had this issue through using all different kinds of shampoos (even the very expensive cone and sulfate-free kinds).

What about everyone else? Those that say they experience this, do your shampoos contain lauryl sulfate?

FrannyG
July 7th, 2012, 10:26 AM
Most of us find that our canopy hair is more fragile than the rest of our hair, simply because it is exposed to the elements more. Mine is so much different than the rest of my hair, no matter how well I treat it.

I read the post in which you said that you are outdoors a lot. The sun and wind can be really hard on the exposed hair. If the sun can burn your skin, and it can, then it can do damage to your hair. I second the idea that you wear a hat when you're outdoors.

I also agree with those who suggest clarifying and then using a deep moisturizing treatment.

Good luck. I know that you will be able to see an improvement. :blossom:

shutterpillar
July 7th, 2012, 02:14 PM
Thank you, FrannyG. Are there any particular deep moisturizing treatments that you would recommend?

jojo
July 7th, 2012, 05:48 PM
Try combing your conditioner in whilst in the shower and then rinse without tipping your head forward (if you do that is). I find this helps lots with me.

FrannyG
July 7th, 2012, 06:39 PM
Thank you, FrannyG. Are there any particular deep moisturizing treatments that you would recommend?
Well, a lot of people, including me, like the SMT (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=128). If you want a deep conditioner that is ready-made, I've had really good luck with Garnier's Fructis Triple Dryness Repair deep treatment. It's relatively inexpensive and is the most moisturizing treatment that I've used. You can find it at any drugstore. It's cone-free as well.

shutterpillar
July 7th, 2012, 06:59 PM
Jojo - I will try that as well. I think if I tipped my hair forward then I would have a giant mess! lol.

FrannyG - thanks! My hair does not react well to honey, so I will give the Garnier treatment a shot.

jojo
July 8th, 2012, 10:00 AM
It works well for me and I'm the queen of the tangles lol, I used to wash my hair with it tipped forward oh my word tangle city!

heidi w.
July 8th, 2012, 10:11 AM
Detangling wet hair is not necessarily the best idea. Have you considered the use of a detangling spray to help you out? Have you ever thought about using a wide toothed comb that is coated in conditioner, and glob a lot of conditioner on the hair and comb through, re-coating the comb as needed til your hair is detangled, and do all this in the shower using the power of the shower water? A lot of curly haired folks detangle this way, and it does work.

Just a couple of ideas on how to handle detangling of wet hair that you might keep in mind as options to try....

Good Luck,
heidi w.

shutterpillar
July 8th, 2012, 10:23 AM
Heidi, I don't mind detangling it until after it has dried (in fact, I prefer this. My hair seems really fragile when wet.) I just wanted to make sure there wasn't something wrong with it that was causing the clumping.

spidermom
July 8th, 2012, 10:25 AM
By the way, my hair tends to do the same thing. Combing conditioner through in the shower seems to help.

Also - if you don't already, try diluting your shampoo in warm water. I use an empty conditioner bottle and mix mine every time. Then I can squirt the solution all over my scalp so that it takes far less manipulation to spread it evenly. I think this has helped a lot also.

shutterpillar
July 8th, 2012, 11:15 AM
Spidermom - what kind of comb do you use in the shower? My only comb is wooden, and I worry that if I took it in the shower with me it would get ruined.

Are there any plastic combs that are safe to use? The ones I see always seem to have that little rough seam in the middle of it.

luxepiggy
July 8th, 2012, 06:04 PM
My hair does this when it's got protein overload.

jojo
July 8th, 2012, 06:40 PM
Spidermom - what kind of comb do you use in the shower? My only comb is wooden, and I worry that if I took it in the shower with me it would get ruined.

Are there any plastic combs that are safe to use? The ones I see always seem to have that little rough seam in the middle of it.

You can buy shower combs very cheaply, I dunno if you have a boots but they do a very good one. Be careful with wooden ones, I'm always scared they will splinter and catch my hair.

shutterpillar
July 8th, 2012, 08:52 PM
You can buy shower combs very cheaply, I dunno if you have a boots but they do a very good one. Be careful with wooden ones, I'm always scared they will splinter and catch my hair.

Thanks, jojo. I dont have a Boots (never heard of it) but I do have quite a few beauty supply stores in my area, so I will have to check them out.

As far as my wooden comb - I normally finger comb my hair, and only use my actual comb on occasion when my hair is particularly tangly. I have been meaning to invest in a plastic one.

hairstuck
July 9th, 2012, 07:49 AM
I've had that problem.

My top layer was dryer than the rest of my hair, making it tangle more. I colored my hair a lot, heat styled it more at some point, and sun damage. I used Aussie 3 minute for a few hours an evening for a few weeks. Then, I always sprayed in detangler before and after showering.