When will gravity finally kick in? (Betcha don't hear that very often!)

[Talma]

This question is mainly for the 3c's and tighter folks out there though anyone can weigh in on it.

I am 3c/4a and my hair has hit the MBL-WL range (v shaped hemline) but you can only see the length when I manually pull the curl down. If I let my hair shrink up in it's natural state it looks SL or shorter. So I was wondering if there was anyone out there with a similar hair texture who can tell me at what point their hair started to weigh itself down. I keep hoping I'm going to wake up one day and my curls are just going to be out-muscled by gravity and at least show 75% of their length instead of a whopping 45%!

P.S. I do where my hair stretched by braiding it, which brings it down to BSL, but I want it to hang naturally to show off my curl pattern without the disruption of braid waves or bun waves.

[DarkCurls]

Some people experience curl loosening with length, others don't (and still others find their hair getting curlier...). I don't think there's a way to tell, but...

OMG your hair is gorgeous. :thud:I just had to post.

[torrilin]

From watching the lovely 4s in the BSL to waist thread um... Not then. Your shrinkage sounds like exactly what I see in their length shots. I generally feel that curlies should go by stretched or wet length, because a lot of the issues with long hair are due to the length. And yes, going from midback to shoulder is a lot of shrinkage, and I don't see 3c types reporting that sort of shrinkage very often. 4s report it all the damn time tho. So I'd tend to class you as more of a 4 for this.

It may still happen that the curl can stretch out some at longer lengths, but from cruising the longer length threads it is unlikely to happen before classic, and it probably will not ever happen the way a plain 3 would experience it.

[Talma]

Some people experience curl loosening with length, others don't (and still others find their hair getting curlier...). I don't think there's a way to tell, but...

OMG your hair is gorgeous. :thud:I just had to post.


Thank you so much! You just made my millenium lol. :happydance:



From watching the lovely 4s in the BSL to waist thread um... Not then. Your shrinkage sounds like exactly what I see in their length shots. I generally feel that curlies should go by stretched or wet length, because a lot of the issues with long hair are due to the length. And yes, going from midback to shoulder is a lot of shrinkage, and I don't see 3c types reporting that sort of shrinkage very often. 4s report it all the damn time tho. So I'd tend to class you as more of a 4 for this.

It may still happen that the curl can stretch out some at longer lengths, but from cruising the longer length threads it is unlikely to happen before classic, and it probably will not ever happen the way a plain 3 would experience it.

Actually, my hair has a mix of 3c and 4a. The front and sides are definitely 3c and the crown and back are tighter, either in limbo between 3c and 4a or it's on the slightly looser scale of 4a. My curl pattern changes slightly depending on tools and products used but I'm pretty sure these are the dominant textures present. There may be 3b or straighter hairs popping up now as well. When detangling and removing shed hair, I sometimes notice very loosely wavy strands mixed in with the curls. Yesterday (wash day), I saw more than I ever have at one time before. I don't know if my texture is changing or if it's just by chance that more of these hairs decided to shed at once.


The news about curls not stretching until maybe classic or maybe not at all sucks big time but since I'm shooting for MTL (or maybe even to knee if my hair allows it) I guess I'll have plenty of time to wait and see. :shrug: lol

Maybe those straighter strands of hair will decide to mate with each other and multiply like bunnies so that I can show more length! With my luck though, it will be on one side of my head so the right side will look BSL and the left will look SL lol!

[CurlyCap]

My hair is mostly 3c with 3b in the canopy and a few, random clumps of 4a (smaller than a pencil) around my hairline and nape.

In my opinion, gravity has nothing on tight natural curls.

My hair is quite a bit shorter now, but when my hair was longer, it could be BCL+ stretched and still curl up to above BSL when dry. Here is an example picture from my album. It doesn't look "long" in the sense of body markers or typical LHC pics, but I hated my hair at this length because it was BCL or lower when I washed. It's a LOT of hair and shrinkage made it seem just below APL. People didn't understand where the buckets of conditioner were going. And this was a pampered hair day. It could seem even shorter if my hair was a bit dry or freshly shampoo'd.

http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/picture.php?albumid=8778&pictureid=115356

I only know one long-haired type 4 in real life (WL/HL), and she habitually relaxes and straightens her hair to show off the length. However, I think she pays for it because her hair is so brittle even she doesn't touch it between stylings. It stays under a sleep cap until she's at work and then in an untouchable ponytail the rest of the time. To me, that just isn't worth it for the sake of showing length.

However, there are several quite long haired type 4s in the Kinky 4s thread who will hopefully chime in. From pictures, I don't think they have a lot of hang at their lengths either if they wear their hair in it's curly state.

My basic approach is to just get comfortable with 1) where/how your hair hangs (or doesn't hang) and 2) not having other people understand how long your hair actually is. For some reason, it's just really hard for people to comprehend that spirals require increased length.

One day, if you keep growing, you'll have enough hair that you can't help but have hang, but it may take some serious lengths to achieve.

For me, I've come to terms with the conditioner-eating beast my hair is and want to grow it long again. I also want it to hang, so I know I'm going to need a lot of length. I'm shooting for hip length curly. I very much doubt my curls are going to relax with length, so hip length curly probably means mid-thigh (omg, that is hard type out). I'm almost BSL now and just inching over my shoulders. It sucks, but the trade-off is that our hair is awesomely voluminous and dimensional. I wouldn't trade it for anything.

[CurlyCap]

Also wanted to add, if your at wl/mbl, have you tried damp bunning?

Granted, I used to do this with heavy serums and I'm sure this affected my results, but at that length you can co-wash at night, and sleep with your hair in a damp cinnabon secured with a scrunchie. In the morning, gently shake loose the bun and you'll get a bit more stretch in your curls. The trade off is that it tends to break up clumping, so you may lose the length to....horizontal expansion...instead of curls. XD Heavier products work best for this!

[MandyBeth]

My 7 year old is mid thigh to knee wet curly, pulled straight her hair is mid calf. Her hair dry however tends to be around waist to hip. Nothing relaxes her curls, they do what they want.

[HappyHair87]

Stretched out im almost BSL but my hair just recently has started to hang. I'm currently SL curly. I'm shooting for WL but i hope my curls will at least be at APL by then. Hopefully lol!!!

[Talma]

My hair is mostly 3c with 3b in the canopy and a few, random clumps of 4a (smaller than a pencil) around my hairline and nape.

In my opinion, gravity has nothing on tight natural curls.

My hair is quite a bit shorter now, but when my hair was longer, it could be BCL+ stretched and still curl up to above BSL when dry. Here is an example picture from my album. It doesn't look "long" in the sense of body markers or typical LHC pics, but I hated my hair at this length because it was BCL or lower when I washed. It's a LOT of hair and shrinkage made it seem just below APL. People didn't understand where the buckets of conditioner were going. And this was a pampered hair day. It could seem even shorter if my hair was a bit dry or freshly shampoo'd.

I only know one long-haired type 4 in real life (WL/HL), and she habitually relaxes and straightens her hair to show off the length. However, I think she pays for it because her hair is so brittle even she doesn't touch it between stylings. It stays under a sleep cap until she's at work and then in an untouchable ponytail the rest of the time. To me, that just isn't worth it for the sake of showing length.

However, there are several quite long haired type 4s in the Kinky 4s thread who will hopefully chime in. From pictures, I don't think they have a lot of hang at their lengths either if they wear their hair in it's curly state.

My basic approach is to just get comfortable with 1) where/how your hair hangs (or doesn't hang) and 2) not having other people understand how long your hair actually is. For some reason, it's just really hard for people to comprehend that spirals require increased length.

One day, if you keep growing, you'll have enough hair that you can't help but have hang, but it may take some serious lengths to achieve.

For me, I've come to terms with the conditioner-eating beast my hair is and want to grow it long again. I also want it to hang, so I know I'm going to need a lot of length. I'm shooting for hip length curly. I very much doubt my curls are going to relax with length, so hip length curly probably means mid-thigh (omg, that is hard type out). I'm almost BSL now and just inching over my shoulders. It sucks, but the trade-off is that our hair is awesomely voluminous and dimensional. I wouldn't trade it for anything.


Also wanted to add, if your at wl/mbl, have you tried damp bunning?

Granted, I used to do this with heavy serums and I'm sure this affected my results, but at that length you can co-wash at night, and sleep with your hair in a damp cinnabon secured with a scrunchie. In the morning, gently shake loose the bun and you'll get a bit more stretch in your curls. The trade off is that it tends to break up clumping, so you may lose the length to....horizontal expansion...instead of curls. XD Heavier products work best for this!

Curlycap, I have to say that your hair is absolutely beautiful. I'm hoping my hair will start to hang considerably more at least by TBL for crying out loud! I have a V hemline and the longest part of my hair is roughly 3 inches shy of hip length. So I'm guessing by this time next year the tip of the V would be TBL and the rest would be waist - hip. I can handle the large amounts of required conditioner, I can even live with the massive detangling sessions that take FOREVER to do. I could even learn to live with the fact that the tighter sections of curls are die-hard frizzies at the roots and smooth ringlets from mid-shaft to the ends (Which may account for some of the lost length now that I think of it...).

But to have all of this combined with the fact that my hair looses MORE than half of it's length is just plain unacceptable. Something has got to give. The 3c sections shrink up considerably but it's at an acceptable amount (from below boob length it shrinks up to halfway between SL and APL. But this is also the easy to detangle, most of the time frizz free section). The rest of it just makes me nuts. If it had a face I'd slap the crap out of it! lol


I refuse to relax my hair ever again. My hair was breaking off like crazy. I'd be at my desk typing, look down and see all these short hairs on my desk. Brush them off and later in the day, look down, more would be there. This happened every day. That was the last time I relaxed my hair.

I tried 6 bee butt buns/bantu knots after washing yesterday. I woke up this morning uncomfortable and with sopping wet hair in most sections. Even after sitting under the drier for an hour on warm, the sections closest to the scalp were still pretty wet. I had to immediately put it into a french braid to avoid the eminent poof it would have become. Dry bunning gives me funky results but I have yet to try damp bunning.

It looks like I'll have to get used to gel or braids for the rest of my long haired life. Which is ok, I was just hoping my hair would hang on its own. I detest gel because when applied over my leave-in it takes on this white, sticky, lumpy spoiled milk texture that makes me want to re-wash my hair immediately. I have yet to find one that doesn't do that. Braids or braid outs I don't mind as much but braids don't showcase the hair much and braid outs slightly disrupt my natural curl pattern and I rather it didn't.


My 7 year old is mid thigh to knee wet curly, pulled straight her hair is mid calf. Her hair dry however tends to be around waist to hip. Nothing relaxes her curls, they do what they want.


Wow! What hair type is your daughter? Because of the average difference in height (I'm pretty short) I'm guessing her calf-length would be around classic length on me....which means her hip length is right above waist on me...OMG It's never gonna hang right! Shrinkage really is evil! I hope my powers of deduction make sense as it is 3am.

It's time to go gel shopping again. I loathe the stuff but at least it has the added bonus of weight lol. Either that or the CG method of pinning curls down as they dry. I have yet to try that one on wet curls Hey! Did you feel that?! I think we have a "Eurika!!!!" moment! I do believe I just felt the Earth move...Wait! Listen...birds are singing Elton John's greatest hits! Harps are being played by Centaurs in the forest! Frogs are dancing the merengue...ok, I'm loopy and in need of sleep...

[Talma]

HappyHair87 I have my fingers crossed for you! :)

[CurlyMopTop]

What about several applications of full-strength Henna? I just started using it at the beginning of the year. The first couple of applications had no affect at all. Somewhere between the 3rd and 4th full application my curls loosened. I'm not as curly as you though, but it might be worth a try. I'd say that my hair is more a 2c now than 3a/3b, but with the right products and plopping I can still make it look like 3a/3b, or I can use a tangle teaser and brush after damp bunning (yes, you heard me I can BRUSH) and make it look like 2b hair, without frizz even (no products either). I think it would take several full on applications to work and you'd have to be willing to except the fact that your hair type may change permanently/or maybe not, and your hair will have a red glow to it in sunlight. :D

CurlyCap have you done anymore Henna applications? What's your opinion/input?

[CurlyCap]

I tried 6 bee butt buns/bantu knots after washing yesterday. I woke up this morning uncomfortable and with sopping wet hair in most sections. Even after sitting under the drier for an hour on warm, the sections closest to the scalp were still pretty wet. I had to immediately put it into a french braid to avoid the eminent poof it would have become. Dry bunning gives me funky results but I have yet to try damp bunning.

Try one giant damp bun. Small buns never helped me. In fact, I used them to simulate what straighter haired folks would call pin curls. All bantu knows are in type 3 hair is larger clumping. You still get lots of curls.

And by "damp" I mean quick twist into a turban with a towel and release. No where near dry, but not sopping. Your roots may be dry by morning, but your ends won't be.


OMG It's never gonna hang right! Shrinkage really is evil!Maybe it's a bit political of me, but I don't really think it's healthy to think like this. How can your hair "hang right"? It's going to be what it is...you can only style it differently. Your hair is uber curly! It will never hang like a type 1 or type 2. Even when it gets longer and has some downward aspect to it, you'll still have to fight volume and horizontal space that straight hairs will never have to. I used to heavily layer (like cut off 50% of my hair) because my long hair was easily as wide as it is long, and I wanted that downward column that I saw on other women's hair.

Thinking the natural formation of your hair is evil is just going to make the growing process unpleasant...and I wonder if you'll ever like it it all. If you like being a curly, than shrinkage is part of being curly. If you didn't have it, you wouldn't be a curly at all.

::steps off soapbox::


It's time to go gel shopping again. I loathe the stuff but at least it has the added bonus of weight lol. Just a warning. I found gels over long periods of time to be very drying. You get great curl definition, but over the long term incredible dryness. It's fine for people who are maintaining, but if you're shooting for incredible lengths, you gotta keep the moisture content up!

[CurlyCap]

CurlyCap have you done anymore Henna applications? What's your opinion/input?

LOL! I forgot that I posted that henna experiment on LHC!

I did a total of 2 full-strength henna applications before deciding it wasn't for me. I love my curls and so the curl release made me really unhappy.

Worse than that, though, was that on my hair it acted as a really strong protein treatment, and that makes my hair brittle. I suffered increased breakage after those treatments and that's what caused me to give my henna to a friend who loves the stuff.

Just FYI, I now use about at teaspoon of cassia once a month to make a 4 cup avocado based deep conditioner goop. I adore it. Some of the protein treatment strengthening aspects, not nearly as strong and damaging, and combined with the avocado awesomeness it is great for adding moisture and flexibility back to my curls. I posted the recipe in Herbal Care.

[CurlyCap]

Talma,

If it makes you feel better, last night I brushed a ton of olive oil through my hair to combat some recent dryness.

I used my denman and worked the only through my soaking wet hair. It had separate into only 8-10 clumps by the time I was through.

When I woke up this morning, those clumps had dried into curls that ended up by my ears. My ears!

It was only of those moments where you can only laugh at the insanity of curly hair and roll with it. I put my hair up into a cute bun where the super curls could pop out and act like a custom hairtoy. :D

[Talma]

What about several applications of full-strength Henna? I just started using it at the beginning of the year. The first couple of applications had no affect at all. Somewhere between the 3rd and 4th full application my curls loosened. I'm not as curly as you though, but it might be worth a try. I'd say that my hair is more a 2c now than 3a/3b, but with the right products and plopping I can still make it look like 3a/3b, or I can use a tangle teaser and brush after damp bunning (yes, you heard me I can BRUSH) and make it look like 2b hair, without frizz even (no products either). I think it would take several full on applications to work and you'd have to be willing to except the fact that your hair type may change permanently/or maybe not, and your hair will have a red glow to it in sunlight. :D

CurlyCap have you done anymore Henna applications? What's your opinion/input?


I have thought of trying henna once but I love my hair color the way that it is and I don't want to alter it at all. My hair is black but has brown and red highlights in the sun depending on how the light is shining on it and I just don't want that to go away. I've also heard people say that their texture has become "coarse" from using henna or "damaged". I don't know what kind of damage but I'm just putting it in the adverse reaction category.

[Talma]

Try one giant damp bun. Small buns never helped me. In fact, I used them to simulate what straighter haired folks would call pin curls. All bantu knows are in type 3 hair is larger clumping. You still get lots of curls.

And by "damp" I mean quick twist into a turban with a towel and release. No where near dry, but not sopping. Your roots may be dry by morning, but your ends won't be.


I will have to try it. The went bantu knots just defined my curls like you said but I don't know what the end result would have been as they were still pretty wet.



Maybe it's a bit political of me, but I don't really think it's healthy to think like this. How can your hair "hang right"? It's going to be what it is...you can only style it differently. Your hair is uber curly! It will never hang like a type 1 or type 2. Even when it gets longer and has some downward aspect to it, you'll still have to fight volume and horizontal space that straight hairs will never have to. I used to heavily layer (like cut off 50% of my hair) because my long hair was easily as wide as it is long, and I wanted that downward column that I saw on other women's hair.

Thinking the natural formation of your hair is evil is just going to make the growing process unpleasant...and I wonder if you'll ever like it it all. If you like being a curly, than shrinkage is part of being curly. If you didn't have it, you wouldn't be a curly at all.

::steps off soapbox::
Ok, Let me clarify this. When I say my hair "will never hang right" I mean hang right for me. I never said I expected a long column of hair like type 1's or 2's. I know shrinkage is going to be a factor, always. But the extreme amount of shrinkage is what I'm hoping to reduce. Let me be very clear when I say natural African American hair that creates a bigger than life halo of curls around someone's head is absolutely stunning. But for me, having hair that shrinks up around my ears doesn't fit my personality. I want a little bit of elongation to show off more of the length that I have. And there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. If my concern was to have hair that looks more like the type 1's and 2's I'd either go back to relaxing my hair or take a hot comb to it. That is not what I am going for.

EDIT: My point is, I want to show off my natural texture but still show off at least some of the length that I already have and hope to increase in the future. How many of us on this forum are content with the idea of growing hair down to classic but maybe having it look like it's APL? Probably not many. That negates the whole point of growing your hair very long.

I really like my hair but I'm not in love with it. Like I said in an earlier post, I accept the idea of life long issues with tangles and taking an hour or more to detangle my hair, my hair's conditioner addiction is fine too, I can also deal with the frizzy roots in the tighter sections but all that plus the the extreme shrinkage just makes me nuts. If I could change just one of these factor's I would be so much happier with my hair and the issue that bothers me the most is the prospect of the high amount of shrinkage never reducing. I plan on growing my hair to MTL if I can in hopes that it will appear to at least be TBL and I don't think that is too much to ask or that my hopes for less shrinkage in time gives me an "unhealthy view" about my hair. My hair currently has virtually no "downward aspect". That's the problem. Not the volume of my hair.

[torrilin]

It sounds to me like you're maybe looking for the kind of look that Teri (who writes at Tightly Curly (http://www.tightlycurly.com)) has?

http://www.tightlycurly.com/photos/photohistory/ - the more current pictures are at the bottom

[anachronic]

Gravity just kicked in for me.

[lacefrost]

Well I have an idea for you that could be a compromise. Put your hair into twists and just twirl the last few inches of your hair. That way it will show more length but be more true to your curl pattern.

Honestly, 3c and 4a just don't get much hang on their own. My hair is waist length and when I get it wet and leave it alone, it turns into an afro above my shoulders. Even when it's sooo heavy with water.

Instead I focus on length when my hair is braided or twisted or once I let those styles out. And at waist, my hair (unbraided) hangs at APL. If I blowdry my hair lightly and then braid it, it has significantly more hang. But it's not true to my curl pattern.

You could try to define every curl with gel and conditioner. It would take awhile but then you'd have more hang too. How much hang, I can't say.

[HappyHair87]

It sounds to me like you're maybe looking for the kind of look that Teri (who writes at Tightly Curly (http://www.tightlycurly.com)) has?

http://www.tightlycurly.com/photos/photohistory/ - the more current pictures are at the bottom

I love Teri's hair! Mine seems to behave similarly like hers....mine is hanging just like hers was at her 3 month point of growth:)

[MandyBeth]

I think there are different types of the 3c - 4a curls. There are the curls like Teri at TC or Quixii here that's very curly but it drapes down instead of going out when healthy. Then you have curls like CurlyCap or my daughter who are similar curl patterns, but the curls find it fun to sproing up and out to have hair that easily in J's case gets bam in your face big.

I'm not sure you can convince the second type to do a dang thing it doesn't agree to. But in return, you get away with awesome softball sized feather and lace hair toys that would eat my hair instead of looking amazing.

[Talma]

It sounds to me like you're maybe looking for the kind of look that Teri (who writes at Tightly Curly (http://www.tightlycurly.com)) has?

http://www.tightlycurly.com/photos/photohistory/ - the more current pictures are at the bottom

Thanks. I actually have used her method since my BC right before her book came out. Now I use a modified version of styling my hair. The denman brush is too harsh on my hair and it actually make my curls a lot tighter than they are when using a wood pin brush to smooth and define them. When I had a lopsided TWA due to the hairdresser butchering my hair this is the method that saved me...but for less shrinkage and silicone free conditioners (massive frizzing at roots won't die without cones apparently) it doesn't work well for me.


Gravity just kicked in for me.

what hair type and length are you?


Well I have an idea for you that could be a compromise. Put your hair into twists and just twirl the last few inches of your hair. That way it will show more length but be more true to your curl pattern.

Honestly, 3c and 4a just don't get much hang on their own. My hair is waist length and when I get it wet and leave it alone, it turns into an afro above my shoulders. Even when it's sooo heavy with water.

Instead I focus on length when my hair is braided or twisted or once I let those styles out. And at waist, my hair (unbraided) hangs at APL. If I blowdry my hair lightly and then braid it, it has significantly more hang. But it's not true to my curl pattern.

You could try to define every curl with gel and conditioner. It would take awhile but then you'd have more hang too. How much hang, I can't say.

Thanks for your ideas! I thought about braiding halfway down my hair from the roots and leaving the rest out to get rid of frizz but have the ends the curl naturally but I hadn't thought of your idea of just twisting the ends. I usually braid my hair in sections and once its dry, take them out and wear it that way or in a large braid. This creates more waves/curls in the front and less in the back, changing my curl pattern.

When I was using coconut oil for overnight heavy prewash treatment and then CO, my hair would keep the natural pattern even when I did a braid out. The braids just kept the frizz away and helped to elongate the curls a bit but my curl pattern was stronger and resisted taking on the braid wave pattern. My hair basically looked the same once it was dry as it did when it was wet. Unfortunately, I haven't been able to recreate these results with CWC but my scalp wasn't healthy with CO so I can't go back to that method. I may try my old CO washing method on the length and just S&C the roots after the hot weather is over...I can't wear a conditioning cap overnight with coconut oil in this heat. It's torture just thinking about it lol!

I plan on trying to weigh my curls down with hair clips on the ends as they dry once those arrive in the mail. I think that may help a lot. At least I hope they do.

[Talma]

I think there are different types of the 3c - 4a curls. There are the curls like Teri at TC or Quixii here that's very curly but it drapes down instead of going out when healthy. Then you have curls like CurlyCap or my daughter who are similar curl patterns, but the curls find it fun to sproing up and out to have hair that easily in J's case gets bam in your face big.

I'm not sure you can convince the second type to do a dang thing it doesn't agree to. But in return, you get away with awesome softball sized feather and lace hair toys that would eat my hair instead of looking amazing.

I agree with you. My hair looks a lot like Teri's does at her ends (the back half of my hair where the curls are smaller) but there is no hanging of my curls yet. My hair doesn't seem to go outward so much as hide within itself. I'm hoping it's because a huge portion of my hair hasn't hit waist yet that it does this. I have to try and post pics later but basically my hair looks like I have a bob hair cut once it dries naturally without being braided. Also, I notice that my hair seems to scrunch up more where it comes in contact with the collar of my shirt, I think my problem is the frizzy roots. Maybe if I can reduce the frizz, I'll increase the amount of hang I have.

[lacefrost]

I plan on trying to weigh my curls down with hair clips on the ends as they dry once those arrive in the mail. I think that may help a lot. At least I hope they do.

That may work actually. I use that method to elongate my twists sometimes.

[Talma]

That may work actually. I use that method to elongate my twists sometimes.

Nice! Do you gain a few of inches of length with that method or are the results very slight?

I noticed yesterday when I washed my hair (and a little bit the wash day before that) that it seems to be hanging slightly more than usual. It may be my new wash routine upping the moisture content of my hair that's doing it because I've also noticed that instead of my french or english braid hanging down (or off to the side in a weird angle if it so desires...) and just being stick straight and unmoving, when I turn my head quickly, the braid will flip onto one of my shoulders. WHICH IS UNHEARD OF for me as moisture has always been elusive.

Yesterday I set my hair in 6 large twists to air dry instead of my normal braids so that they would be dry by early this morning and they only shrunk up to the low end of APL which is at least a 2 inch difference than when I usually let them air dry in braids. I don't know about everyone else but when I used to set my hair in twists, my hair would shrink up more than they would in braids. I think because twists are much looser and the hair has more room to shrink when it dries.

I'm sure if I were to let it dry loose it would do its usual gravity defying act so I can't get too excited. We'll see if any more changes will occur though. At least the condition of my hair is much better, so I can't complain. :D

I forgot to mention before, About MandyBeth's theory on the two different types of curls. The back portion of my hair (which has the most shrinkage) Seems to be stuck in between those two curl types. When air dried naturally it gets big and frizzy from the roots to mid shaft. Then from mid-shaft to the ends, I have well defined curls. So it's half way trying to hang down and half way trying to do who knows what. I think this is why my hair kind of "hides within itself" and doesn't completely hang down but can't really fro out like some other's hair. It's in limbo. I think it's because the lower curls are shrunken underneath the canopy of well defined curls above it. So it kind of looks like I have a bob haircut but it doesn't go too far outward like typical afro would. It's weird.

Depending on my routine, my hair most closely resembles this from the ears back (except for with frizzy roots): http://www.luvinmycurls.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/type-4a.jpg From the ears - frontward, my hair most closely resembles the next pic and it never frizzes.

Sometimes my whole head looks like this (... but with frizzy roots from the ears, back) http://www.google.com/imgres?q=corbin+bleu&hl=en&sa=X&biw=1920&bih=873&tbm=isch&prmd=imvnso&tbnid=8Tl7GjveOkGKvM:&imgrefurl=http://students.cis.uab.edu/delicm/webfiles.page3.html&docid=pAn373zVIigMGM&imgurl=http://students.cis.uab.edu/delicm/12-corbin-bleu-400a070907-765950.jpg&w=400&h=400&ei=McLzT9KRGIro0QGO7OSLBw&zoom=1&iact=hc&vpx=433&vpy=13&dur=96&hovh=225&hovw=225&tx=127&ty=133&sig=108380302082263449085&page=1&tbnh=101&tbnw=101&start=0&ndsp=76&ved=1t:429,r:3,s:0,i:150

[MandyBeth]

J's curls stack up on each other also. Weight adds an inch or so, based on my guess. When her ends get too damaged, they don't hold anything, so her curls spring up more. Cut the damage off, the ends are heavier, and it pulls back down. I just cut 2" off when she looked waist, her curls now are top of her shorts or hip.

But good luck getting the curly minion's hair to do the same thing twice.

She's full on 3c, but if 4a is curls smaller than a pencil vs the zigzag pattern, she's actually 75% 4a, 25% 3c. But she's got all spirals, range from Sharpie sized to pencil to 1/8" diameter. As her hair is healthier, she's losing the Sharpie spirals.

[Talma]

J's curls stack up on each other also. Weight adds an inch or so, based on my guess. When her ends get too damaged, they don't hold anything, so her curls spring up more. Cut the damage off, the ends are heavier, and it pulls back down. I just cut 2" off when she looked waist, her curls now are top of her shorts or hip.

But good luck getting the curly minion's hair to do the same thing twice.

She's full on 3c, but if 4a is curls smaller than a pencil vs the zigzag pattern, she's actually 75% 4a, 25% 3c. But she's got all spirals, range from Sharpie sized to pencil to 1/8" diameter. As her hair is healthier, she's losing the Sharpie spirals.


That's really interesting about the damaged ends. Especially to have such a drastic change in hanging length. Before my last trim a few months ago I had some serious splits (which I am convinced came from my tangle teazer and trying to take advantage of it's touted fast detangling skills). I thought I got most if not all of them but every now and then I come across a couple of splits and wonder how many are still lingering in my mass of curls (my last trim before this, I had virtually no splits). I trim once a year unless I happen across one of the little buggers, So I'll have to wait until 2013 to see if the trim will make a difference for me. But I will definitely keep this in mind! :)

Did the curls that are the size of sharpie markers gradually lose its curliness or did it happen very quickly? I've noticed that my curls that are in the very front seem drastically looser this last wash day. They look ok before I comb through them but after that only the bottim 1/3 of the length or so is very curly. The rest is just slightly wavy.

[MandyBeth]

Her Sharpie curls are getting tighter as her hair gets better. Last April when we picked her up, I thought she was 2b or 3a. But her hair is not great and there isn't much we can do to fix it. Short of growing it out, which is what we are doing.

[spirals]

Oh, are we talking about hair? I was going to say after 35....

[Nae]

Oh, are we talking about hair? I was going to say after 35....

Thank goodness I wasn't the only one who had a brain that went in that direction.

*Off to shop for bras on the interwebz*

[ravenheather]

Ok it's not because of curls, but I ask this about my youngest dd all the time. Here is her hair.

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7263/7517997932_5b273e0a8c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/47809319@N06/7517997932/)
DSCN0928 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/47809319@N06/7517997932/) by KailaMama (http://www.flickr.com/people/47809319@N06/), on Flickr

You all have beautiful curls.

[Tisiloves]

Ok it's not because of curls, but I ask this about my youngest dd all the time. Here is her hair.

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7263/7517997932_5b273e0a8c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/47809319@N06/7517997932/)
DSCN0928 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/47809319@N06/7517997932/) by KailaMama (http://www.flickr.com/people/47809319@N06/), on Flickr

You all have beautiful curls.

Hahaha, that's what mine's like too short.

[Nae]

Ravenheather!! That is the most adorable picture ever. She looks kinda edgy with her hair and those shades. Pure awesome!

[Audrey Horne]

I don't have that shrinkage, of course, but just want to come to support! :flower: Remember that you'll have an unbelievable volume! Something truely great and not easy to achieve :cheer:

[Talma]

Her Sharpie curls are getting tighter as her hair gets better. Last April when we picked her up, I thought she was 2b or 3a. But her hair is not great and there isn't much we can do to fix it. Short of growing it out, which is what we are doing.

Mine is a lot looser the last few wash days. I'm wondering if it's the RI conditioner I am using. It has keratin in it. But I didn't think keratin straightened out curls unless you used heat with it. Like a professional Keratin Treatment. The tighter curls seem fine though. It's just the very front section that you would cut for a fringe which is the loosest of the 3c part of my hair already. It could also be the CWC routine doing it. I think I'll lay off the keratin condish in that area tomorrow. My curls already seemed to have loosened with length so at this rate that section will be just a slight wave by the time I hit tailbone and I want to keep those darn curls in dog gone it!

LMBO at Spirals and Nae


Ok it's not because of curls, but I ask this about my youngest dd all the time. Here is her hair.

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7263/7517997932_5b273e0a8c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/47809319@N06/7517997932/)
DSCN0928 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/47809319@N06/7517997932/) by KailaMama (http://www.flickr.com/people/47809319@N06/), on Flickr

You all have beautiful curls.

Thank you so much for the compliment! :) I love that pic of you and your daughter. She is too cute. I second what Nae said. She looks like a little rebel. Like she's saying "I may be small and adorable but don't mess with me!" She has what my Best friend used to call "Kiwi Hair" She's Philippine and although her hair grows like mad (seriously, she went from chin to waist in about a year!), when she got it cut very short it would just stand straight up. She used to use gel to get it into a page style (for probably the two and a half weeks it took to grow to chin!!!*j/k*).



I don't have that shrinkage, of course, but just want to come to support! :flower: Remember that you'll have an unbelievable volume! Something truely great and not easy to achieve :cheer:

Thank you! You are awesome Audrey Horne! :disco:
Volume is definitely a plus. Although I'm still waiting for it to get bigger without stretching it out. My darn hair hides...It's like a turtle I tell ya! :) I hope to one day be able to rock a huge fro but with defined curls. Not for everyday wear but just for one of those daring days that I feel like saying "BAM! In Yo face!" lol The trick will be maintaining curl definition while getting the hair to poof in a perfect circle. I don't know how they do it! My hair goes kinda flat on top...I can use Gorilla Snot (I know, really bad name. It's a hair gel, I swear!) but it will make my hair hard as heck...

For that, I'm aiming towards something like in the picture in this link. NOTE: The girl in the picture although not nude, does have a lot of skin showing. If you are offended by that sort of thing, don't click on it. I am not responsible for anyone's eyes spontaneously combusting...or permanently closing... or melting...or small children in the room being emotionally scarred by big hair for life...

http://i558.photobucket.com/albums/ss26/Talma33/69172544246187100_ayuLTN85_f.jpg

P.S. Don't google for more hair pics using the logo in the corner of that picture. The google results WILL make your eyes bleed. I got this one from Pinterest originally.

[maborosi]

Volume is definitely a plus. Although I'm still waiting for it to get bigger without stretching it out. My darn hair hides...It's like a turtle I tell ya! :) I hope to one day be able to rock a huge fro but with defined curls. Not for everyday wear but just for one of those daring days that I feel like saying "BAM! In Yo face!" lol The trick will be maintaining curl definition while getting the hair to poof in a perfect circle. I don't know how they do it! My hair goes kinda flat on top...I can use Gorilla Snot (I know, really bad name. It's a hair gel, I swear!) but it will make my hair hard as heck...

For that, I'm aiming towards something like in the picture in this link. NOTE: The girl in the picture although not nude, does have a lot of skin showing. If you are offended by that sort of thing, don't click on it. I am not responsible for anyone's eyes spontaneously combusting...or permanently closing... or melting...or small children in the room being emotionally scarred by big hair for life...

http://i558.photobucket.com/albums/ss26/Talma33/69172544246187100_ayuLTN85_f.jpg

Oh man her hair is just beautiful! And I've seen Gorilla Snot- yeah, imagine the look on my boyfriend's face when he caught sight of it in the hair aisle, lol

~maborosi~

[ravenheather]

Thanks Nae and Talma. Unfortunately so far her hair does not grow like your friends. That's all she's got after over 2 years. Hopefully it will kick in gear this year. DD1 is almost apl dry and midback stretched. I love that link it's beautiful. I have no advice on how to achieve it though. Just think it's amazing.

[Talma]

Oh man her hair is just beautiful! And I've seen Gorilla Snot- yeah, imagine the look on my boyfriend's face when he caught sight of it in the hair aisle, lol

~maborosi~

lol The same thing happened to me when someone was telling me her hair gel combo. I had to ask her..."Wait...what do you use in your hair?!" That stuff is rightfully named though. I bought the strong hold to try and it's a funky thick yellow color and when you put some on your finger and test the tackiness of it with your other finger...well...you can see where it got it's name from! That stuff is like super glue for hair though. Just a tiny amount used on a dry curl that had turned to frizz made the curl pop back to life...it was also stuck pointing up and back in the oddest of directions...It was still stuck that way for the next 1 1/2 - 2 days!!!! It was bulletproof!


Thanks Nae and Talma. Unfortunately so far her hair does not grow like your friends. That's all she's got after over 2 years. Hopefully it will kick in gear this year. DD1 is almost apl dry and midback stretched. I love that link it's beautiful. I have no advice on how to achieve it though. Just think it's amazing.

I'm sure your DD's hair will start growing soon. Baby's hair is so strange in that it's usually completely different in character and appearance from what grows on our heads a few years later. What hair type is DD1?

I love that afro picture too. One day I will figure out the mystery of how she got her hair that big. I wonder what it looks like after she styles it straight out of the shower...probably like a totally different head of hair. Her fro's magical I tell you! :)

[ravenheather]

DD1 is either a 2c/3a or 3a. Hard to tell since you can't get her to not touch her hair while drying. I think it's 3a though.