50 shades of hair

[dollyfish]

So I finally gave in and downloaded an e-book of Fifty Shades of Grey.

I'm only a few chapters in, and besides the fact that it's an awful blow-by-blow rewrite of Twilight, what really stands out to me is that SHE IS HANDLING HER HAIR TOTALLY WRONG!!!! :steam

The protagonist obviously has very thick, frizzy hair, likely curly or at least wavy. Over and over she's described trying desperately to "tame it" by brushing the ever living heck out of it, blow frying it, etc, only to "give in" and put it in a pony tail. JESUS GIRL, you don't brush hair like that! Let it drip dry! This is bugging me to no end...

Maybe this belongs in the 'you know you're an LHCer when' thread :laugh:

EDIT: I decided to google image search "christian grey" for laughs, and I definitely support the fact that most of those pictures are of Ian Somerhalder...

[Tisiloves]

I got quite angry at a book where the protagonist had "luscious curls" yet brushed her hair every night (yes, it was a Mills and Boon).

[ScarletRose]

I know of so many people who have been reading that book lately, that I think I might need to see what the fuss is all about myself.

:heartbeat Ian Somerhalder :heartbeat :lol:

[lmfbs]

That annoyed me when I read the books too. The writing is so terrible. And it portrays bdsm as a mental disorder, which I really, really dislike.

[shutterpillar]

I really tried to like that series.... most of my friends have read it and just rave and go on and on about it.

I am sorry, it is just horribly written and was almost painful to read... and I am not talking about the subject matter. The entire series was just atrocious. It was like I was reading a bad High School fiction piece. I have absolutely no idea how it ever made it on the Best Sellers list.

Rant over.

That being said, I completely relate with you about getting upset over how she was treating her hair! lol.

[brave]

It's true, the writing was awful and I also got frustrated at her hair care. Pony tail. Pony tail. If she's going to do the same thing with it all the time, why even mention it? I only want to hear about a character doing anything to their hair if it's actually interesting.

[ScarletRose]

Now that I have read what some of you think of it, I'm not so sure I want to read them now :shrug:

[dollyfish]

Now that I have read what some of you think of it, I'm not so sure I want to read them now :shrug:

ONLY read them if you want porn. This is definitely not literature.

They literally started as twilight fanfiction, and boy does it show. Mike and Jacob are characters (Paul and José, lol) and practically every scene from twilight is included in the first few chapters... Heck, Christian Grey has copper colored hair. If you like twilight, you will like these books. They're twilight minus the mormonism.

They are badly written fan fiction, and the author obviously knows nothing about what she's writing about (from photography to business, everything is wrong, literally everything). These are trashy beach novels and nothing but.

Edward Cullen is abusive enough...but Christian Grey is a whole new level of evil. But sigh, the giggly girl in me is entertained. Nevertheless, I would not recommend these books. I don't know whether they should be called books, and I'm only 8ish chapters in :laugh:

And on top of everything, this gorgeous curly hair is getting a beat down! >: ( brush brush brush brush PONY TAIL brush brush...


EDIT: Ian Somerhalder is the perfect human being. Jus' sayin'

EDIT 2: Christian Grey just "ripped" the protagonists hair tie out to let down her hair. Nooooooooo....!

[ScarletRose]

I don't mind the Twilight series that much, but I don't think I could read another one like it lol.

EDIT 2: Christian Grey just "ripped" the protagonists hair tie out to let down her hair. Nooooooooo....![/quote]

:headache: Ouch!!

[ScarletRose]

Sorry, not so good at the quoting thing yet :o

[shutterpillar]

See, I have never read Twilight (or seen any of the movies) and I had no idea it was FanFic until I was about halfway through the first book. Still, it meant nothing to me. I almost couldn't get through it, the writing was just horrible. I kept thinking "oh, my friends just love these books, so maybe they get better."

NOPE.

It's just smut. Horribly written smut, which is even worse. LOL.

[MissManda]

I was reading a book series (Wheel of Time and another one I can't remember) and there were descriptions of various female characters with waist length braids, but when their hair is loose, it is also described as waist length. There was another character who was described as pinning her waist-length braid around her head.

It felt quite confusing. :suspect:

[Carissamarie08]

I just started reading this series. Decided to download it to my kindle while bored at the airport..

[chou]

That's so funny, this sort of the thing drives me crazy too! I just read a romance novel, Caressa's Knees, where the female protagonist has wild uncared-for curls that her staid and commanding lover teaches her to blow dry with a diffuser. I almost jumped for joy when I finally read a proper description of how to care for textured hair in a romance, or any book! So many terrible things happen to hair in literature...

[Hollyfire3]

That's so funny, this sort of the thing drives me crazy too! I just read a romance novel, Caressa's Knees, where the female protagonist has wild uncared-for curls that her staid and commanding lover teaches her to blow dry with a diffuser. I almost jumped for joy when I finally read a proper description of how to care for textured hair in a romance, or any book! So many terrible things happen to hair in literature...

comanding lover, not my cup of tea....lol! I agree, so many terrible things DO happen in literature to poor hair.......

[AnqeIicDemise]

comanding lover, not my cup of tea....lol! I agree, so many terrible things DO happen in literature to poor hair.......

I believe it might have been one of the Anita Blake books where she detangles one of her lovers hair form the bottom up and I cheered for joy on that. She also gets told a few times to stop doing xyz to her curly hair because its bad for it and ONE of the boys has ankle-length hair. <3

[HintOfMint]

Back in the day, I used to read really trashy horror novels. The main character was always a beautiful woman and the novels were always written by men.
The main character always had "wild" hair that was perfect, but involved ripping hairbrushes through waves and curls and falling out of hairties and the like.

Men who love women but would rather fantasize about how they function instead of trying to understand how they function end up writing things like that.

[Tisiloves]

I was reading a book series (Wheel of Time and another one I can't remember) and there were descriptions of various female characters with waist length braids, but when their hair is loose, it is also described as waist length. There was another character who was described as pinning her waist-length braid around her head.

It felt quite confusing. :suspect:

It's written by a mostly bald man, you just have to ignore it (because Nynaeve has really thick hair, her braid shrinkage would be intense).

[Kittyxx]

lol - i was reading a bdsm book the other day - the girl had curly hair prone to frizz and he would insist on brushing her hair to make it neater and silky from top to bottom. ouch.
everytime it happened it distracted me from the story and I'm like 'eugh really'

[woolyleprechaun]

Ive just this second ordered this book from Amazon, curious about the fuss. So many people have reccomended it for me, and I felt terribly rude saying 'I dont do 'mommy porn', I like real literature'
Im having second thoughts now. Hair abuse in books realy riles me....but not nearly as much as length discrepancies. AAAAARRRRRGH!!!!! Is she a WL or a BSL? Make up your mind!!! lol

[auburntressed]

It's written by a mostly bald man, you just have to ignore it (because Nynaeve has really thick hair, her braid shrinkage would be intense).
Yeah, it's not just that series. The majority of books are written by people who do not have long hair (because long hair is uncommon these days, so the pool of people who are writers AND have an uncommon trait is then necessarily lessened), and they are written by people who for the most part do not have thick hair (for the same reason). The same would apply to curly hair, straight as a board hair, layered hair, ect. ect. ect. But specifically hair that is either very long or very thick - most writers are not going to have personal experience with this. And usually when someone is writing a story, getting the details about hair right is far less important on the agenda of things to research.

So you just kind of have to expect that if they don't have experience with certain types of hair, they're not going go out of their way to research hair for the sake of accuracy. They are probably too caught up researching the setting or a profession or whatnot.

Not to mention, it may not even occur to them that hair is something that CAN have a difference which needs research. For someone who has straight or wavy hair, it may not even occur to them that curly hair needs different care if they have never discussed hair care with a curly haired person.

But authors make true-to-life mistakes about stuff like that all the time, not just regarding hair. I file it away under the, "Suspension of disbelief," category unless it is too glaring to ignore.

[Annibelle]

:spitting: Mommy porn! Bwahahahahaha!

[pyroliske]

Everyone on my Facebook page is reading these books. I always google to find out what they're about. Synopsis on wikipedia was enough to make me realise it was trash. The women on FB who read these are lonely divorcees who are obviously after a bit of porn and a little heart fluttering. Personally I'd rather watch real porn to get my rocks off, not hiding it behind some crappy romance story .

My most memorable literary hair story is from Little Women when Jo cuts her hair off. I cried. :D

[didrash]

Ha... Not to offend Twilight fans, but I actually think the Twilight series is horribly written. If this book is worse than Twilight, I will not even try to read it...

[auburntressed]

Ha... Not to offend Twilight fans, but I actually think the Twilight series is horribly written. If this book is worse than Twilight, I will not even try to read it...

Ditto.

And to add to it - The reason Fifty Shades of Grey is popular is the same reason that Twilight was popular and the same reason that the Da Vinci Code was popular. The average level of reading comprehension in this country is atrocious. It is so low that most people are barely literate at all. In order for the majority of people to be able to understand two sentences strung together, it has to be written at a third grade reading level. So terribly written books with "grown up" plots become popular overnight because a large number of people are actually capable of reading them.

It's that simple.

[dollyfish]

Ditto.

And to add to it - The reason Fifty Shades of Grey is popular is the same reason that Twilight was popular and the same reason that the Da Vinci Code was popular. The average level of reading comprehension in this country is atrocious. It is so low that most people are barely literate at all. In order for the majority of people to be able to understand two sentences strung together, it has to be written at a third grade reading level. So terribly written books with "grown up" plots become popular overnight because a large number of people are actually capable of reading them.

It's that simple.


That, and they are marketed towards lonely women with impossible standards who lack self esteem to the extent that they believe relationships like Twilight and 50 Shades of Grey to be "romantic" instead of what they really are (horribly abusive).

It kills me how many young girls want a boyfriend like Edward... Oh sigh, if only my boyfriend loved me enough to take the engine out of my car so I couldn't go see my friends that he disapproves of...

[DarkCurls]

Fifty shades of grey? :D That's the Twilight fanfiction with sex, right? I remember it making quite a buzz at a writers' online forum I sometimes hang around in, what with the whole fanfiction getting published thing. (I mean, really, it is fanfiction.)
Add this to my list of reasons for not reading it, yay! Not that I would, I doubt my parents would agree.

[pink.sara]

Bahahahahahahahahahaha, I just read the free snippet of it on Amazon, and deleted it straight back off my Kindle.

So bad it's beyond laughable.

Seriously, Twilight was bad enough but this stuff.... It's for people who are too embarrassed to just go buy porn right? Because that's all it is. And poor quality at that.

I for one would find it incredibly difficult to get my rocks off whilst mentally correcting grammar :headache:

[chou]

I'm all for bashing 50 Shades of Grey, but there's a lot of bashing of people who read the books in this thread... that they're "lonely" or stupid or otherwise damaged for reading this stuff. I don't intend on reading the books because I prefer my bdsm erotica to have stronger female characters and better writing (this does exist!) but if 50 Shades is bringing erotic literature to more women's attention and tapping into some desires they may not have explored before, then this can only be a good thing.
I do have some other thoughts on the serious flaws in some of the book's premises from what I've heard about it from others, but come one, it's meant to titillate. I don't think women need to feel guilty or stupid for being excited by something. There's enough of that already in our culture.

[Pixieish]

I'm all for bashing 50 Shades of Grey, but there's a lot of bashing of people who read the books in this thread... that they're "lonely" or stupid or otherwise damaged for reading this stuff. I don't intend on reading the books because I prefer my bdsm erotica to have stronger female characters and better writing (this does exist!) but if 50 Shades is bringing erotic literature to more women's attention and tapping into some desires they may not have explored before, then this can only be a good thing.
I do have some other thoughts on the serious flaws in some of the book's premises from what I've heard about it from others, but come one, it's meant to titillate. I don't think women need to feel guilty or stupid for being excited by something. There's enough of that already in our culture.

One thousand times this! I love this post.
I haven't read these books, lately all I have been reading are freebies on the Kindle, but I have heard quite a bit about them from my mother-in-law. I think it's awesome that she is getting back into reading and is interested in something that most would consider risqué. :)

[LadyHazel]

This sounds awful to put it simply

[Loviatar]

The thing that ticks me most about the 50 Shades series is that I'm trying to get published, and this woman writes Twilight porn fanfic and gets told they'll publish her stuff if she changes the names. It makes me feel like trying to write something original is really pointless if this is the kind of thing that happens.

And Christian Grey is a name I used for one of my characters SIX YEARS AGO. Darn it. :lol: I shall have to rename him.

Anita Blake's hair woes always annoyed me. And I too cried at Jo March's haircut in Little Women, although not so much as the irritation in the Chalet School books when anyone was ever ill and they chopped their hair to pixie cuts to avoid 'brain fever'!

[Henrietta]

ONLY read them if you want porn. This is definitely not literature.

They literally started as twilight fanfiction, and boy does it show. Mike and Jacob are characters (Paul and José, lol) and practically every scene from twilight is included in the first few chapters... Heck, Christian Grey has copper colored hair. If you like twilight, you will like these books. They're twilight minus the mormonism.

They are badly written fan fiction, and the author obviously knows nothing about what she's writing about (from photography to business, everything is wrong, literally everything). These are trashy beach novels and nothing but.

Edward Cullen is abusive enough...but Christian Grey is a whole new level of evil. But sigh, the giggly girl in me is entertained. Nevertheless, I would not recommend these books. I don't know whether they should be called books, and I'm only 8ish chapters in :laugh:

And on top of everything, this gorgeous curly hair is getting a beat down! >: ( brush brush brush brush PONY TAIL brush brush...


EDIT: Ian Somerhalder is the perfect human being. Jus' sayin'

EDIT 2: Christian Grey just "ripped" the protagonists hair tie out to let down her hair. Nooooooooo....!

Hey, where's the mormonism in Twilight? I'm really curious! :) It's not irony or anything.

[Hollyfire3]

That, and they are marketed towards lonely women with impossible standards who lack self esteem to the extent that they believe relationships like Twilight and 50 Shades of Grey to be "romantic" instead of what they really are (horribly abusive).

It kills me how many young girls want a boyfriend like Edward... Oh sigh, if only my boyfriend loved me enough to take the engine out of my car so I couldn't go see my friends that he disapproves of...


hahahha...No offense to women who read books like this, I personally don't like Twilight for the reasons you describe. Abusive Edward...NOT my ideal boyfriend, EVER. He is stalkerish and controling and creepy and Bella is just SO helpless......

[Hollyfire3]

Hey, where's the mormonism in Twilight? I'm really curious! :) It's not irony or anything.

I'm curious also!

[SwordWomanRiona]

That, and they are marketed towards lonely women with impossible standards who lack self esteem to the extent that they believe relationships like Twilight and 50 Shades of Grey to be "romantic" instead of what they really are (horribly abusive).

It kills me how many young girls want a boyfriend like Edward... Oh sigh, if only my boyfriend loved me enough to take the engine out of my car so I couldn't go see my friends that he disapproves of...

I couldn't agree more!!!! It also kills me, how so many girls look up to Bella (Helpless, low self-esteem, glad to be involved in an absolutely unequal, imo unhealthy and abusive relationship,...) as if she's a "role model". I haven't read the books, but I had the chance to borrow the films and watched them out of sheer curiosity...already imagining how I was going to like them, after reading the synopsis in Wikipedia...well, I was disgusted :mad:. It's quite frightening, how popular and desirable such a relationship seems to be. And Edward is creepy, domineering, paternalizing and an stalker, period (fans don't be offended, but my feminist self was very much angered).

[Hollyfire3]

I couldn't agree more!!!! It also kills me, how so many girls look up to Bella (Helpless, low self-esteem, glad to be involved in an absolutely unequal, imo unhealthy and abusive relationship,...) as if she's a "role model". I haven't read the books, but I had the chance to borrow the films and watched them out of sheer curiosity...already imagining how I was going to like them, after reading the synopsis in Wikipedia...well, I was disgusted :mad:. It's quite frightening, how popular and desirable such a relationship seems to be. And Edward is creepy, domineering, paternalizing and an stalker, period (fans don't be offended, but my feminist self was very much angered).

So very true! All of it, true! And that last line...same for me too....
I think Leo from Charmed or even Peeta from The Hunger Games are MUCH better guys to want to be with...and Katniss (The Hunger Games) and Piper (Charmed) are strong, independant, and good role models.:) Just my two cents.

[faellen]

50 Shades of Grey is so awful. Terribly written with repetitive prose. Oh my, holy crap, foil packets, inner goddess, subconscious, blushing, flushing, grey eyes, oh my...
Plus a very skewed view of BDSM!

Don't get me wrong, I read my fair share of erotica, but this isn't even good porn.

I hate Twilight too, and if I knew this was a Twilight fanfic before I read it, I would never have bothered!

[Jessibear2854]

I really tried to like that series.... most of my friends have read it and just rave and go on and on about it.

I am sorry, it is just horribly written and was almost painful to read... and I am not talking about the subject matter. The entire series was just atrocious. It was like I was reading a bad High School fiction piece. I have absolutely no idea how it ever made it on the Best Sellers list.

Rant over.

That being said, I completely relate with you about getting upset over how she was treating her hair! lol.

I was really excited about these books because I'd heard so much about them. After reading the reviews of it on Amazon, though, I decided to pass. Your post reminded me of what a lot of the reviews said.

[brave]

50 Shades of Grey is so awful. Terribly written with repetitive prose. Oh my, holy crap, foil packets, inner goddess, subconscious, blushing, flushing, grey eyes, oh my...

It's so true. Utterly awful.

The mormonism in Twilight mostly has to do with the abstinence. 50 Shades is not a fan of abstinence.

[Kitsu]

"oh my"

Enough said one page I read, never again >>

[MsBubbles]

I'm all for bashing 50 Shades of Grey, but there's a lot of bashing of people who read the books in this thread... that they're "lonely" or stupid or otherwise damaged for reading this stuff.

Thanks for saying this. There are some very unlonely divorcees out there having a so much less lonely time than the entire duration of their marriages :shrug:. There are a whole lot of lonely married people too, who might read things like this, or they might not. There might also be some lonely never-been-married people too... etc. There might be perfectly well-adjusted and universally popular people reading this.

[Tia2010]

When I read 50 shades I had no idea it was twilight fan fiction. Hell, I read all three books ( for naughty bookclub as we have taken to calling it--which is less about books and more about wine, fun and hella good times :D) and still didn't know it was twilight fan fiction till I read it here in another thread!

I just thought it was badly written, repetitive, utterly awful crap. BUT God did we have fun laughing and talking about it! :D

I never even thought about her lack of hair care...That somehow makes the book even worse :p

[Miss Catrina]

I think it's hilarious that THIS is what bothers you about Fifty Shades of Grey. :p

Those scenes always irked me, too. It's like, girlfriend, you are a grown-a** woman, and you still can't make your hair look presentable?

Now, you're REALLY an LHCer if you applaud Christian's wisdom in braiding her hair for her before the fun times. :p No tangles!

[dwell_in_safety]

Hahahahaha! I HATE reading about terrible hair care in books as well. A lot of the time, it's just reiterating what a lot of people think about certain hair types when conventional care is used on them (read: untameable, frizzy hair, with no hope for discernible curls in sight). Unnecessary.

[caadam]

I mean, I get the appeal of a book like this. Even EL James admitted that this book was a result of her midlife crisis. lol So I can understand why something like this really hits home for a lot of people when it comes to secret fantasies.

However... it's not my fantasy, and I find a lot of stuff very wrong with this book. I find it badly written, among other things. I just... it causes me great distress. lol I can't stand reading it when I try. I'll just say that.

As for the hair care... yeah, it bothers me, too, but let's consider the character in this case. Right.

[Silverbrumby]

I believe it might have been one of the Anita Blake books where she detangles one of her lovers hair form the bottom up and I cheered for joy on that. She also gets told a few times to stop doing xyz to her curly hair because its bad for it and ONE of the boys has ankle-length hair. <3

It was in the blake series. It was the beautiful panther stripper I believe.

Anyway, Stephanie Myers phoned E L James and said she wants her novel back. Here are just a few of the rip offs for the amusement of folks here:

1. Ditzy mother, married several times.

2. Heart rate keeps going up around the fellow.

3. Blushing.

4. Clumbsy bad at sports, always last to be picked in a team.

5. Virgin (well, that's usually a given in these novels)

6. Christian is the epitome of male beauty complete with red highlights.

7. Christian plays the piano beautifully.

8. He is adopted to a loving super rich family who adore him.

9. She is a mystery to him (no, she is actually dull Christian)

10. She loves english literature

11. Tells her to stay away from him.

12. Tells her to breath (please, just let her pass out, she'll learn)

13. Hates her old faithful car. Buys her uber safe new one.

etc etc etc.

I'm only on page 200 but if she mentions inner goddess one more time....

I will probably read the complete series. I'm a dork like that. Plus my sister loves it and we enjoy reading the same novels and discussing them as she lives in Australia and it gives us something in common.

The hair advice. Dreadful.

[GlennaGirl]

B

Seriously, Twilight was bad enough but this stuff.... It's for people who are too embarrassed to just go buy porn right?

That could be, and is that a problem? :) I specifically bought the book for the porn. I was curious about that. I definitely wasn't expecting a literary masterpiece.

But yep, I'm definitely a person who bought the book for the porn and I have no qualms saying that. ETA: I never read any of the Twilight books.

[Silverbrumby]

That could be, and is that a problem? :) I specifically bought the book for the porn. I was curious about that. I definitely wasn't expecting a literary masterpiece.

But yep, I'm definitely a person who bought the book for the porn and I have no qualms saying that. ETA: I never read any of the Twilight books.

I'm all for the hot novels as I prefer to call them. You know all that stuff the Dr's tell women about getting the libido going. Doesn't work for some lol. All that 'improve communication, flowers, long walks along the beach. Give most women an alpha male in a hot book and it certainly peaks the interest so to speak.

Fantasy is just that, fantasy. But that said there are many people who are into the lifestyle talked about in the book. Fantasy can add spice.

[caadam]

I've read way better erotica than this mess. lol Erotica that's elegantly written, more passionate, more realistic, poetic, and much hotter (Kushiel series, anyone? Great books and amazing story). Maybe that is just my opinion, but I am standing by it. You can find way better erotica for less money.

Also... I don't know MUCH about BDSM, but I've had BDSM friends in the past, have met other of people in the community and have gotten to understand the basics of it; 50 Shades of Grey is, like, BDSM gone wrong. lol At least that's what I notice. There's a line between consensual power play and abuse, and it seems like that line kind of gets crossed a few times in the book. Just... no thanks. I don't find anything sexy about that.

Mini-rant done. :D ♥ Ana needs a better hair routine. That will solve all her problems. And a new boyfriend... definitely.

[Bene]

Tried reading this trash. Gave up on it. Got the rage out of my system in the another (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showpost.php?p=2150822&postcount=3333) thread. Still have a little bit left though.

*clears throat*

I don't know who I'm angrier at. The publisher who thought this would be ok, or all the people raving about this. Is this where our collective culture has led us? Poorly written garbage?


Random strangers in the vet's waiting room were gushing over this. GUSHING. I figured if someone is willing to recommend this to a complete stranger, it must be somewhat ok, right? In the the future, I'll only take serious book recommendations from the dog owners, because the people who were getting all excited just to tell me about it were cat owners, but that's a whole other issue. Sorry cat owners, this was THE incident that has completely made suspicious about your taste in literature.


And not finishing this book is what gets me. I always say (about books and movies) you can't say you hate it and properly argue your point until you've experienced it. So keep yer trap shut because grown folks are talking. THAT is what pisses me off about it. IT WAS SO BAD I COULDN'T FINISH IT. I've left books unfinished before, but because they bored me, or I got distracted by something shiny. But this was the first book I dropped because it was THAT bad. I finished up the freaking Twilight series, and while I thought it was crap, I managed to get through it, and I can hold my own in a "Why Twilight eats ass" discussion, but 50 Shades... rage. RAGE! Bloody tears of rage and anguish and despair over everything that is wrong with contemporary society. Have we sunk so low? Are we so starved for pop-smut that this is what we gravitate to? Shameful. This makes Stephanie Meyer look like JK Rowling in comparison. Yes, it's that freaking bad.





tl;dr - I can crap better stuff than this. Someone give me a freaking book deal already!



ETA: Oh yeah, and the hair treatment. I don't expect most authors to know how to care for hair. I THINK she was trying to hint that her heroine is so gosh darn gorgeous with her curly hair, but doesn't know it, so she keeps trying to "tame" it. That whole "awkward hot chick who doesn't know she's hot so she wears a ponytail and all she has to do is just be hot because that's what all little girls should aspire to. Being hot and modest is what boys like so keep faking modesty and some rich dude will fall for you"

[caadam]

I'm a cat owner (have had cats all my life), and I hate this book. Thus, I think your experience was purely coincidence. lol

But sorry about that.

ETA: I also feel your rage. As well, I tend to enjoy lots of classic authors, and some newer ones. I'm currently reading Dune, but also got done reading The Color Purple, and plan to finally finish Myst Reader (I love the Myst games SO MUUUUUCH). I love classic literature because for one, most of it is public domain (and I'm poor), and two, my last English professor really got me interested in 19th century authors. So much love.

[fairystar32]

I haven't read 50 shades of grey, so cannot comment and it does not interest me. however, I LOVE Twilight ;)
I am also not desperate, lonely, unrealistic or expect romance like that, its just a bit of a light fun read for me. The writing was basic, but I actually liked that as I am a busy mum and had little time to absorb and complicated novel.
I love books and read a very wide range.
I know LOTS of people who like it and we are not illiterate, uneducated or lack self esteem ....

[caadam]

I havent read 50 shades of grey, so cannot comment and it does not interest me. however, I LOVE Twilight ;)
I am also not desperate, lonely, unrealisitic or expect romance like that, its just a bit of a light fun read for me.
I know LOTS of people who like it and we are not illiterate, uneducated or lack self esteem ....

One of my best friends has read the whole series and she feels the same way about it. Well, she likes the series but still thinks the books are bad. lol But she likes it! She's also extremely intelligent, reads lots of classic literature, is a bit of a math genius, and does lots of writing herself (does NaNoWriMo every year. Not saying that makes her an incredible writer, but there have been some very good writers who've come from writing their first novels during that annual event).

I, for one, don't really like Twilight (ok, I hate it). But... well, I can't really generalize the kind of people who do like it, because they're honestly not ALL the same. They're simply not. It's like you said, and I totally agree.

And I hope I'm not hijacking this thread. If I am—HIJACK OVER. lol

[didrash]

Well, I also read erotica, lots of it, some of it with "non-mainstream" practices. However, subject matter is not the issue to me with Twilight, rather its the writing style. Some people are just absolutely talentless writers, and no matter what they write about, it shows. The one good thing is that they make you appreciate good writing more. Writing is one of those things that many people do not know how hard it is, and often if one has read mostly decent and talented writers, one has no idea that they ARE indeed good. It takes a crappy "writer" to show them writing really is an art and requires hard work, training and talent, like painting for example.

[auburntressed]

Hey, where's the mormonism in Twilight? I'm really curious! :) It's not irony or anything.

It is very subtle, but it is there if you know where to look. The abstinence is the most glaring example that people point to, but I think that other themes are more stongly Mormon than that. The entire series is written with the idea that you are not complete, you ate not whole, unless you have your other half - your spouse. This is text book Mormon ideology. In Mormonism, the family is the most important thing. You cannot have a family if you do not a spouse. And if you are a woman, you cannot enter the highest level of heaven if you do not have have a husband who is pleased enough with your service to him on earth that he decides to pull you up.

The birth of their daughter is another tip of the hat to the family ideology as well. Without a child, Edward and Bella would never have been able to have a complete family.

The dialogue about Edward being afraid of Bella losing her soul should she be turned could also have been interpreted as a Mormon element, though it was only just mentioned and never really hashed out. Of course - because any potential for interesting character struggles was ignored.

I highly doubt Stephanie Meyer had any intention of allowing Mormonism to get into the story. For one thing, she just isn't a skilled enough writer to slip in subtle subliminal messages on purpose. But she also couldn't help letting her own worldviews bleed into it for the exact same reason. Even very good writers often write under presumptions about how life works. Every story does have to have an underlying existence of existence to it - and it is a lot easier to start with things that reflect our views of real life. Think how difficult it would be to write in a world where there is no gravity, for example.

[Mayflower]

That, and they are marketed towards lonely women with impossible standards who lack self esteem to the extent that they believe relationships like Twilight and 50 Shades of Grey to be "romantic" instead of what they really are (horribly abusive).

It kills me how many young girls want a boyfriend like Edward... Oh sigh, if only my boyfriend loved me enough to take the engine out of my car so I couldn't go see my friends that he disapproves of...

Haha agreed! I haven't read 50 shades of grey and never will, especially if it's twilight fan fiction. Some time ago I was forced to watch the first twilight movie and the first 15 minutes in I thought "is this a joke?". Literally one of the worst movies I have ever seen, extremely bad acting, slow unnatural dialogues etc. etc. It kills me to see how they have become so popular (though I love The Vampire Diaries, but to me they are on a whole other level:D).

[Ice Fox]

Sigh... Not only have I just had to Google the initials BDSM because I didn't know what they meant, but I thought - having only caught the odd glimpse of the title - that 'Fifty Shades of Grey' was a saga set in an old people's home...

[GlennaGirl]

Is this where our collective culture has led us? Poorly written garbage?




Nah, this is where we've always been. :p People have always enjoyed a bit of trash. Nothing new, really. And by "trash," I mean poorly designed and badly thought out, not just trash-y (racy).

I consider myself a bright person. I'm a writer, actually. But I enjoy my total cr*p every once in a while just for a thrill. Not everything I read has to be intellectually stimulating (or even grammatically correct). I'm just not a "literature snob" that way.

Here's an analogy: I love a nicely done steak. But every once in a while, I just crave a Big Mac. No idea why. But boy, does it satisfy at the moment.

And I just don't see anything wrong with that. ;)

I don't believe that means I'm intellectually stunted, culturally hypnotized or an affection-starved "mommy" -- it means I'm human, with all of a human being's faults, including an occasional penchant for something quick, easy and, in one way or another, satisfying (to me).

[akilina]

Ahaha my mom read these books and was so unimpressed. She felt like it was a childish book in that it was written at a very low reading level and she "liked" the nature of the story (dirty book!!) but didn't like the way it was written and the err...terminology used in the book.

[Wiggy Stardust]

I'm not a submissive enough woman to enjoy books like these. If any of you read a novel LIKE 50 shades that is about a big ol' Amazon protecting some wimpy little skinny man, let me know. I read Twilight and the entire time he's telling her what to do and I picture myself calling him a creepy flooger!

[Hollyfire3]

I'm not a submissive enough woman to enjoy books like these. If any of you read a novel LIKE 50 shades that is about a big ol' Amazon protecting some wimpy little skinny man, let me know. I read Twilight and the entire time he's telling her what to do and I picture myself calling him a creepy flooger!

LOLO!!! I will let you know if i find such book...may I suggest Charmed? Its a female led show about girl power with one cute, adorable and completly non-controling or dominant whitelighter named Leo who is sometimes protected by the girls. Its my favorite show.:D

[pink.sara]

That could be, and is that a problem? :) I specifically bought the book for the porn. I was curious about that. I definitely wasn't expecting a literary masterpiece.

But yep, I'm definitely a person who bought the book for the porn and I have no qualms saying that. ETA: I never read any of the Twilight books.

I have no problem with anyone buying porn, as you can probably tell from my original post! :)

I just can't read the same euphamism/descriptive phrase/cliche 3 times in as many pages and not cringe at the lack of vocabulary and imagination.... This ruins it.

It's impossible to be aroused and annoyed at the same time at a book. A bloke yes. But not a book :p

My inner goddess requires more mental stimulation. ;)

[Tisiloves]

Ahaha my mom read these books and was so unimpressed. She felt like it was a childish book in that it was written at a very low reading level and she "liked" the nature of the story (dirty book!!) but didn't like the way it was written and the err...terminology used in the book.

Ahh, the saga of "down there", I've heard of that, well, actually I've read some hilarious Jeeves and Wooster fanfic about that.

[Tabitha]

I saw a woman reading this on the train this afternoon. I laughed inwardly actually, because she was fast asleep and had only got through a few pages. I thought to myself, yes, that's how riveting this book is!

[HintOfMint]

It is very subtle, but it is there if you know where to look. The abstinence is the most glaring example that people point to, but I think that other themes are more stongly Mormon than that. The entire series is written with the idea that you are not complete, you ate not whole, unless you have your other half - your spouse. This is text book Mormon ideology. In Mormonism, the family is the most important thing. You cannot have a family if you do not a spouse. And if you are a woman, you cannot enter the highest level of heaven if you do not have have a husband who is pleased enough with your service to him on earth that he decides to pull you up.

The birth of their daughter is another tip of the hat to the family ideology as well. Without a child, Edward and Bella would never have been able to have a complete family.

The dialogue about Edward being afraid of Bella losing her soul should she be turned could also have been interpreted as a Mormon element, though it was only just mentioned and never really hashed out. Of course - because any potential for interesting character struggles was ignored.

I highly doubt Stephanie Meyer had any intention of allowing Mormonism to get into the story. For one thing, she just isn't a skilled enough writer to slip in subtle subliminal messages on purpose. But she also couldn't help letting her own worldviews bleed into it for the exact same reason. Even very good writers often write under presumptions about how life works. Every story does have to have an underlying existence of existence to it - and it is a lot easier to start with things that reflect our views of real life. Think how difficult it would be to write in a world where there is no gravity, for example.

For the first bolded part... wow. So your afterlife depends on whether someone else put a ring on it and didn't regret it? Poor Mother Theresa. :rolleyes:

As for the second bolded part, I remember reading Ray Bradbury's letter to a schoolboy about symbolism and in his view, symbolism is or should be unconscious and not deliberate. Basically symbolism should be reflective of the author's inner workings of his mind but not deliberately thrown in there. While I may not agree with his conception of symbolism, Stephanie Meyer's unconscious use of Mormon symbolism doesn't necessarily undercut her skill as a writer. She's a horrible writer, but perhaps not for his reason.

Just a thought :)

[jacqueline101]

I'm going to have to read this.

[faellen]

I'm just not a "literature snob" that way.



I don't think you have to be a literature snob to find this book dull and repetitive. The terminology just made me cringe, I don't know how anyone could find this arousing.

I don't want to really talk about my sexual tastes, but as a person familiar with the BDSM subculture I find this book to be terribly inaccurate and actually rather embarrassing and insulting to the community. EL James obviously doesn't have a clue what she's writing about.

For the record, I love both porn and erotic novels. I've read loads of filthy, smutty trash. But 50 Shades is very poorly written, you don't have to be an intellectual to recognise that. ;)

[GlennaGirl]

I just can't read the same euphamism/descriptive phrase/cliche 3 times in as many pages and not cringe at the lack of vocabulary and imagination.... This ruins it.

I skimmed ;)

[GlennaGirl]

I don't want to really talk about my sexual tastes, but as a person familiar with the BDSM subculture I find this book to be terribly inaccurate and actually rather embarrassing and insulting to the community. EL James obviously doesn't have a clue what she's writing about.

Well, again, I guess it's in the way you take it. I didn't see FSoG as having been designed to spread awareness about BDSM. ;) Now if this had been a public service campaign, on the other hand...

She probably doesn't have a clue about BDSM, specifically. But if I want to read a textbook or a collection of real-life anecdotes, that's what I'll read. (And I have! Yay for those too.) This is her fantasy of the way things might go. And fantasy basically is the whole point. You can't really say a certain fantasy is empirically wrong any more than you might say a piece of art is empirically bad.

Not arguing the point that the book was poorly written; it was. The point I am arguing is that a person who can find a book like FSoG amusing in its own right isn't necessarily stupid, a depressed bored housewife, a poorer reader than a sixth grader, a divorcee or ignorant of various lifestyles. Or a crazy cat lady. :p (Didn't I see that in here too? I'm wondering who isn't going to get insulted in this thread... ;) Just sayin'.)

[GlennaGirl]

Oh, as for the hair: old literary device, again, badly done (not arguing with that!). The protagonist who has no clue what her hair is doing at any given time is obviously naturally beautiful no matter what -- even with shaggy hair with twigs in it. That must mean she's sooo beautiful. Unable to contain it, must put it into a ponytail: of course that points to it being incredibly thick, incredibly wild, incredibly...incredible.

The ripping thing? He's ripping her of her inhibitions.

I mean I'm sure most of us here already know that, I just haven't seen it pointed out, and the original post was, after all, about the treatment of hair in the book.

Again, not dissing the book; just saying that for some, it delivers what it promises -- a quick hot time, not a particularly artful one, not a particularly unique one.

I must be the only base person here who can appreciate a literary "quickie" without requiring anything else of it. Slap me with a "heathen" sticker, I suppose. :) (And not an educated heathen, either...)

Meh. I'm havin' fun!

[Kyla]

/snip/

Men who love women but would rather fantasize about how they function instead of trying to understand how they function end up writing things like that.

Quoted for truth, and how well that was worded. :)

About 50 Shades, just....gross. Hilariously so at times, and frighteningly so at other times.

[fairystar32]

I agree ;)

I really do love reading the Twilight books, its a easy read and have read them several times. I do not 'read' any underlying message into them just take them for what they are, trashy quick read novels like the vampire diaries, those books were terribly written!
Infact I think they are worse, it was like reading a childs book.
However, the series is the best series I have ever seen ;)

I really dont get time lately to sit and read a complex novel.



Nah, this is where we've always been. :p People have always enjoyed a bit of trash. Nothing new, really. And by "trash," I mean poorly designed and badly thought out, not just trash-y (racy).

I consider myself a bright person. I'm a writer, actually. But I enjoy my total cr*p every once in a while just for a thrill. Not everything I read has to be intellectually stimulating (or even grammatically correct). I'm just not a "literature snob" that way.

Here's an analogy: I love a nicely done steak. But every once in a while, I just crave a Big Mac. No idea why. But boy, does it satisfy at the moment.

And I just don't see anything wrong with that. ;)

I don't believe that means I'm intellectually stunted, culturally hypnotized or an affection-starved "mommy" -- it means I'm human, with all of a human being's faults, including an occasional penchant for something quick, easy and, in one way or another, satisfying (to me).

[faellen]

Well, again, I guess it's in the way you take it. I didn't see FSoG as having been designed to spread awareness about BDSM. ;) Now if this had been a public service campaign, on the other hand...

She probably doesn't have a clue about BDSM, specifically. But if I want to read a textbook or a collection of real-life anecdotes, that's what I'll read. (And I have! Yay for those too.) This is her fantasy of the way things might go. And fantasy basically is the whole point. You can't really say a certain fantasy is empirically wrong any more than you might say a piece of art is empirically bad.

Not arguing the point that the book was poorly written; it was. The point I am arguing is that a person who can find a book like FSoG amusing in its own right isn't necessarily stupid, a depressed bored housewife, a poorer reader than a sixth grader, a divorcee or ignorant of various lifestyles. Or a crazy cat lady. :p (Didn't I see that in here too? I'm wondering who isn't going to get insulted in this thread... ;) Just sayin'.)


This is the thing - It's obvious from many reviews and comments on articles I've read about this book that people are thinking this is how BDSM really is. Already I've come across people that believe BDSM is misogynistic and practised by either abusive characters or those that have no self esteem, based on reading 50 Shades of Grey. Novels such as this (and it unfortunately isn't the only one) just serve to propagate these unhealthy opinions among the uninformed.
I'm the exact same about historical fiction which contains far-fetched historical inaccuracies. I know it's not EVERYONE, but some people believe that nonsense! It's something that annoys me.

EL James had a good subject matter here, and with more research (and some lessons in how to not repeat yourself so often :rolleyes:) the novel could have been greatly improved, and maybe not been subject to any ridicule.
(Though I doubt she cares much, she's laughing all the way to the bank here!)

I know the book is trashy and a literary "quickie", but there are loads of the same out there, many with much better stories (which aren't exactly "complex") and more likeable characters, I just don't get why this one has received so much hype!

Just sayin'.

[Shiranshoku]

I haven't read the book: reading some snippets of it was enough for me.

In general, I think poor writing contributes to it being such a succes. I've read the Twilight books, and they're not very well written either. This does make them extremely easy to skate through, which means they can attract a very wide audience easily, and thus become bestsellers.

It's not all bad. My sister, for example: At 15, she's spot on in the target demographic for twilight and read all the books. She would never ever have started reading if it wasn't for the Twilight hype and how easy the books are.

I personally really enjoy reading smutty hgss fanfiction, so I'm a perv in my own way too :p

[Shiranshoku]

Double post, sorry! Thinking about Snape does that to me.

[faellen]

I don't know... poor writing =/= easy to read ??

For example, you mention Harry Potter. Now that is very well written yet very easy to read. Always a good combo in my book (no pun intended!)

(I also read smutty Snape fanfic!)

[Shiranshoku]

I don't know... poor writing =/= easy to read ??

For example, you mention Harry Potter. Now that is very well written yet very easy to read. Always a good combo in my book (no pun intended!)

(I also read smutty Snape fanfic!)

It sounds like a contradiction, I know. Now I'm not talking about bad writing in the sense of no interpunction, stream of consciousness, grammar,... Those get edited out by the publisher anyway. But a very plain style, lots of repetition and a limited vocabulary. This will usually irk regular readers, but actually makes it easier to read for a lot of people.

But if you're used to 'better' -like hp!- it will annoy you, and the story seems to lack depth because of it. It can work, though. Look at Dr. Suess.

Glad to have found a fellow Snarky Snape Smut lover!

[Bene]

I never liked Dr. Seuss. I remember daycare, 3 years old, waiting for story time and someone comes out with a Dr. Seuss book, and I'd just sit there all "F**k this s**t!" and mad at the world :mad: The man said he doesn't like green eggs and ham, so leave him alone already, what the hell is wrong with you??!!



Give me a Richard Scarry any day of the week.


But, I digress :laugh:


Bad writing is bad writing. Doesn't matter the what the story is. Pick the worst premise in the world, but add good writing and it will work, somehow. Jim Butcher proved that with the Codex Alera series. Two crappy premises, and he didn't put out great literature but he made it work. So it's not the subject matter of 50 shades of crap that turns me off. It's not even how dumb our heroine is because, hey, not everyone is a rocket scientist. It's not how abusive the guy is because some people dig that. It's just BAD WRITING. Poor planning, no real thought given to what's going on, no discipline. Just 50 shades I'mma bite my lip and climax every time he looks at me.


Or, as I like to put it, 50 shades of f**ked up.

[Shiranshoku]

I never liked Dr. Seuss. I remember daycare, 3 years old, waiting for story time and someone comes out with a Dr. Seuss book, and I'd just sit there all "F**k this s**t!" and mad at the world :mad: The man said he doesn't like green eggs and ham, so leave him alone already, what the hell is wrong with you??!!



Give me a Richard Scarry any day of the week.


But, I digress :laugh:


Bad writing is bad writing. Doesn't matter the what the story is. Pick the worst premise in the world, but add good writing and it will work, somehow. Jim Butcher proved that with the Codex Alera series. Two crappy premises, and he didn't put out great literature but he made it work. So it's not the subject matter of 50 shades of crap that turns me off. It's not even how dumb our heroine is because, hey, not everyone is a rocket scientist. It's not how abusive the guy is because some people dig that. It's just BAD WRITING. Poor planning, no real thought given to what's going on, no discipline. Just 50 shades I'mma bite my lip and climax every time he looks at me.


Or, as I like to put it, 50 shades of f**ked up.

I only read Dr. Suess when I was older, his books aren't that well known in Belgium. I love them, now, but I can imagine them bothering me when I was younger. I loved Richard Scarry, though :)

Your description of the book really cracks me up :)

[Annibelle]

I was obsessed with Goosebumps books when I was little. :) I don't care how bad writing is-- it doesn't matter when you're so scared you don't notice it! :laugh:

Actually, I don't know if those books were poorly written-- I haven't read one since elementary school!

[didrash]

Bene: I so agree with you that bad writing is bad writing. I am actually much more likely to finish a well written book with a boring plot then a poorly written book with an interesting plot. It just gets too irritating.

[woolyleprechaun]

Bene: I so agree with you that bad writing is bad writing. I am actually much more likely to finish a well written book with a boring plot then a poorly written book with an interesting plot. It just gets too irritating.
I think I may love you.

[fairystar32]

I am the opposite.
I can forgive the poorly written book, if the plot is exciting and interesting and keeps me hooked. I have often put down a book due to it being boring and dull. I would hate to read something just because its well written, if it is uninteresting and lacks imagination or does not capture mine.

I read personally now for that imagination, for that fantasy and for that little bit of pleasure, with 4 kids and a very busy life, the last thing I want to do is read a boring drawn out story.

I have better things to do than to sit an analize every little reasoning or sublimal message, rather enjoy it for the fantasy and fun.






Bene: I so agree with you that bad writing is bad writing. I am actually much more likely to finish a well written book with a boring plot then a poorly written book with an interesting plot. It just gets too irritating.