S&Ding VS. Trimming

[Amber_Maiden]

Ok... I'm wondering if this makes sense:

Can I, essentially, get away with only S&Ding and not trimming my hair? Is it feasible? Instead of trimming every 4-6 months, can I get away with just S&Ding and doing a micro trim when I need it (perhaps once a year or longer)?

I'm wondering if I'm nuts for thinking I can...

[MissHair]

I would definitely do S&D before trimming. My hair is actually smoother all across my head and not just my ends, when comparing when you only trim your ends and you still got loads of split/damaged ends on the top of your head! The only problem is.. or if you do come across this problem, like I did, is that when you don't trim for too long your ends might grow uneven and you might get an uneven hemline, this happened to me which is the reason why I trimmed an inch. So now Im back at a really even hemline AND I am S&D'ing daily!

[Amber_Maiden]

I would definitely do S&D before trimming. My hair is actually smoother all across my head and not just my ends, when comparing when you only trim your ends and you still got loads of split/damaged ends on the top of your head! The only problem is.. or if you do come across this problem, like I did, is that when you don't trim for too long your ends might grow uneven and you might get an uneven hemline, this happened to me which is the reason why I trimmed an inch. So now Im back at a really even hemline AND I am S&D'ing daily!

Ah! I don't think of the uneven hemline! I really don't mind having a uneven one. :p When I do wear it down, I wear it in the front, or to the side and in front, so no one would notice!

[MissHair]

Ah! I don't think of the uneven hemline! I really don't mind having a uneven one. :p When I do wear it down, I wear it in the front, or to the side and in front, so no one would notice!

Then thats even better for you. :D Personally I am obsessed with an even hemline which has set me back more often than not. Had I not trimmed my hair as often as I have, my hair would be far longer. But yea, definitely, S&D'ing is far more benefitial for my hair than trimming. My hair is SO smooth after I do my daily afternoon S&D'ing. It's so nice to get rid of the splits I would normally not catch with a regular half inch trim. Afterall, they travel up. :D

[Amber_Maiden]

Then thats even better for you. :D Personally I am obsessed with an even hemline which has set me back more often than not. Had I not trimmed my hair as often as I have, my hair would be far longer. But yea, definitely, S&D'ing is far more benefitial for my hair than trimming. My hair is SO smooth after I do my daily afternoon S&D'ing. It's so nice to get rid of the splits I would normally not catch with a regular half inch trim. Afterall, they travel up. :D

True! I love s&ding!

[Valorie]

I'm glad this was brought up! I have a question that I've been pondering for a couple days now: Can you s&d too much?
Just in the past few days, I've noticed the damage at the bottom of my hair(particularly where I'm growing out layers toward the front) and it could be a never-ending process! I could s&d all day and I am wondering if it can thin the length or hemline too much?

I will probably trim in a couple weeks again to get rid of some of it; I just don't want to!:)

[MissHair]

I don't believe there is such thing as S&D. At least not for me. The hair you remove is still damaged ends, and from what I reckon, I only remove 2 millimeters or 5. Which is such a tiny bit that the lenght will grow back within days or weeks anyway. And if you happen to cut further up your hair shaft due to white dots/feathering.. that bit was bound to break anyway!

[kittengirl]

This thread is very timely for me. I have sl hair that I'm growing out, it's pretty healthy except for the ends mainly in the front where I had highlighted it before I became wiser! I get almost zero splits but many white dots/breaking hairs. I s&d daily too, and I have been wondering if I should get a trim, but most of the dots are fiurther up so even if I trimmed my worry is that I would lose length but not the damaged bits. Should I just keep s&ding and forget the trim? It was trimmed in January and did not seem to fix the problem.

[spidermom]

I've given up trims for the time being. I like them for keeping ends on the thicker side of possibilities, but as far as controlling splits, trims aren't very useful. I don't often find splits on the ends of my longest hairs. They are far more likely to be up in my length somewhere.

I don't like S&D much, though. It hurts my eyes. I can tolerate a bit of it from time to time if I have good light, but I don't know if I spend enough time at it to make a real difference. I do - however - feel pretty good about it when I've eliminated one of those monsters where the split ends at the ends of my split ends are split or where the hair is like a feather from all the splits radiating off the sides of the central shaft.

[Valorie]

I suppose it's true that it's either going away now or later, hehe. :(
I'll continue with the s&d process regularly most likely.

[Madora]

Ok... I'm wondering if this makes sense:

Can I, essentially, get away with only S&Ding and not trimming my hair? Is it feasible? Instead of trimming every 4-6 months, can I get away with just S&Ding and doing a micro trim when I need it (perhaps once a year or longer)?

I'm wondering if I'm nuts for thinking I can...

Amber_Maiden, I think it depends on how much damage you are contending with. I'd say it might be possible to only do S and D and avoid trims provided you S and D religiously..a little every day.

After a while, if you notice you're not keeping up with splits/white dots, then a trim would definitely be in order.

[heidi w.]

One can over "dust" or what we here call S&D. I myself have skipped years at a time trimming. Every 4-6 months a trim? That's completely alien thinking to me. Way too often in my book.

Take a look at my video and I think you'll understand better where I'm coming from.

heidi w.

[Amber_Maiden]

I'm glad this was brought up! I have a question that I've been pondering for a couple days now: Can you s&d too much?
Just in the past few days, I've noticed the damage at the bottom of my hair(particularly where I'm growing out layers toward the front) and it could be a never-ending process! I could s&d all day and I am wondering if it can thin the length or hemline too much?

I will probably trim in a couple weeks again to get rid of some of it; I just don't want to!:)

I've noticed that my ends aren't as thick as they used to be, but it doesn't bother me. I have tons of hair! lol


I've given up trims for the time being. I like them for keeping ends on the thicker side of possibilities, but as far as controlling splits, trims aren't very useful. I don't often find splits on the ends of my longest hairs. They are far more likely to be up in my length somewhere.

I don't like S&D much, though. It hurts my eyes. I can tolerate a bit of it from time to time if I have good light, but I don't know if I spend enough time at it to make a real difference. I do - however - feel pretty good about it when I've eliminated one of those monsters where the split ends at the ends of my split ends are split or where the hair is like a feather from all the splits radiating off the sides of the central shaft.

Thanks for the info! :) And I agree, S&Ding is hard on the eyes!


Amber_Maiden, I think it depends on how much damage you are contending with. I'd say it might be possible to only do S and D and avoid trims provided you S and D religiously..a little every day.

After a while, if you notice you're not keeping up with splits/white dots, then a trim would definitely be in order.

Agreed, it really does have to do with how much damage you have. I don't have much, and I S&D whenever I feel it needs it, or if I see one then I might take 5 minutes and look for more.


One can over "dust" or what we here call S&D. I myself have skipped years at a time trimming. Every 4-6 months a trim? That's completely alien thinking to me. Way too often in my book.

Take a look at my video and I think you'll understand better where I'm coming from.

heidi w.

Oh, I agree. I was just going on what seems that most members do- trim 4-6 months. I personally don't care that much about trims. I can easily go years, and probably will, especially if I keep S&Ding.

[jeanniet]

What do you mean by "trim"--something like an inch or so? I haven't "trimmed" my hair since 2009; I S & D and do microtrims (about 1/4" usually). I didn't microtrim for six months or more for a while there, but now that I'm at hip I'm trying to do them monthly. My ends are in decent shape, but I can tell that there's a few inches that are on the rough side, so I'd like to gradually trim them off. I think you could definitely get away with mostly S & Ding, but you might need to microtrim every few months or so. I've found that anything taken off by microtrimming is really not at all noticeable.

[Amber_Maiden]

What do you mean by "trim"--something like an inch or so? I haven't "trimmed" my hair since 2009; I S & D and do microtrims (about 1/4" usually). I didn't microtrim for six months or more for a while there, but now that I'm at hip I'm trying to do them monthly. My ends are in decent shape, but I can tell that there's a few inches that are on the rough side, so I'd like to gradually trim them off. I think you could definitely get away with mostly S & Ding, but you might need to microtrim every few months or so. I've found that anything taken off by microtrimming is really not at all noticeable.

I meant any cutting in a straight line, so micro trims as well that are bigger than half an inch!
I guess to be realistic I would nee dot dust or micro trim. So far it's been 6 months though- and I see no damage to cut off! :)

[owlathena]

I s&d while I watch shows on my computer every couple of days. I honestly can't say how much it helps. But trimming, even just a microtrim, always makes my ends feel better/thicker. Its up to you though whether or not you like your fairytale ends.

[littleizz]

Ooo!! So glad you started this!! I had to take out some layers in a recent trim and really am not font of blunt hemlines. Now that I've cleaned up most of the heat damage I was considering S&D only and going for fairy tale ends :) Good info!

[HintOfMint]

Like Spidermom, I also do not get splits where a trim would be. If I wanted to get a haircut that got all my splits, I would be perpetually at APL. Layers help, but most of my splits are in my underlayer, right by the nape of my neck which is supposed to be the longest layer so stylists tend to leave it alone and not get at the splits higher up.

S&D doesn't really replace trims, but they do keep my hair in nice condition between trims. I trim my hair about twice a year. I toyed with the idea of using S&D to postpone trims, but honestly, twice a year I need it. It's not that I get a ton of splits, it's that I don't like the feeling of my ends. They feel ragged and no amount of clarifying or deep conditioning helps.

[jackie_brown]

Ok... I'm wondering if this makes sense:

Can I, essentially, get away with only S&Ding and not trimming my hair? Is it feasible? Instead of trimming every 4-6 months, can I get away with just S&Ding and doing a micro trim when I need it (perhaps once a year or longer)?

I'm wondering if I'm nuts for thinking I can...


I think that S&Ding as one and only cutting method will taper your lenghts down, it's important trimming few centimeters almost twice a year to get rid of damage :)

[Mesmerise]

Trimming helps make your ends look nice... is it all that beneficial compared to S&D though...good question!

S&D I think is great if you've got a few splits and/or white dots here and there. Overall, I think it does better for getting rid of splits because many aren't right at the very end of the hair where it would be trimmed off anyway (depends on your hair though... if you've got a lot of splits at the end I think a trim is certainly beneficial).

I get splits on shorter hairs, or on layered bits that won't be trimmed if I had a trim anyway. I figure the percentage of splits a 1/2" trim would remove would be negligible compared to actually regular S&Ding!

My goal right now is to trim once a year until it's at goal length. This should be enough to keep the ends relatively even. In the meantime I will S&D when I feel it needs it! I don't get a LOT of splits... so I can usually go awhile between S&Ds anyway. (Although I have decided an S&D is in order for today...cause it's sunny... and I like to do it outside in the sun as it's easier to find those ends! AND because autumn is here and there will be fewer and fewer warmish sunny days on which to S&D :D).

[Kitsu]

someone please come and S&D for me, I'll pay you in cookies :3

[Amber_Maiden]

Trimming helps make your ends look nice... is it all that beneficial compared to S&D though...good question!

S&D I think is great if you've got a few splits and/or white dots here and there. Overall, I think it does better for getting rid of splits because many aren't right at the very end of the hair where it would be trimmed off anyway (depends on your hair though... if you've got a lot of splits at the end I think a trim is certainly beneficial).

I get splits on shorter hairs, or on layered bits that won't be trimmed if I had a trim anyway. I figure the percentage of splits a 1/2" trim would remove would be negligible compared to actually regular S&Ding!

My goal right now is to trim once a year until it's at goal length. This should be enough to keep the ends relatively even. In the meantime I will S&D when I feel it needs it! I don't get a LOT of splits... so I can usually go awhile between S&Ds anyway. (Although I have decided an S&D is in order for today...cause it's sunny... and I like to do it outside in the sun as it's easier to find those ends! AND because autumn is here and there will be fewer and fewer warmish sunny days on which to S&D :D).

Trimming once a year sounds pretty good to me! Think I'll join you! :)

[jeanniet]

I've been pondering the mathematical likelihood of seriously changing your hemline by excessive S & D, and I don't see how it's possible. Someone correct me if I'm off here, but say you have 100,000 hairs on your head. If you S & D 100 hairs at a time (and I mean actually cut those 100 hairs, not just look at them)--which really is quite a bit--it's still only 1/1000th of the hairs on your head. Taking into consideration that you're always growing new hairs and those are going to be all different lengths anyway, I think it's very, very unlikely that even a considerable amount of S & D is going to make an obvious difference--and then only if your hair is stick straight. On hair like mine, no one would be able to tell even if I S & D'd four hours a day, every day. :p

[MissHair]

I've been pondering the mathematical likelihood of seriously changing your hemline by excessive S & D, and I don't see how it's possible. Someone correct me if I'm off here, but say you have 100,000 hairs on your head. If you S & D 100 hairs at a time (and I mean actually cut those 100 hairs, not just look at them)--which really is quite a bit--it's still only 1/1000th of the hairs on your head. Taking into consideration that you're always growing new hairs and those are going to be all different lengths anyway, I think it's very, very unlikely that even a considerable amount of S & D is going to make an obvious difference--and then only if your hair is stick straight. On hair like mine, no one would be able to tell even if I S & D'd four hours a day, every day. :p

This is what I wanted/tried to say earlier but you said it oh so well. :D:cheese:

[CurlyCap]

I trim about once a year. 9-14 months. I like to go on my birthday, just as a reminder to myself, but sometimes life gets in the way. I may get my layers touched up every 6 months, but that's more about shape than hair health. Since I'm growing my hair out, I've just admitted to myself that the shape is going to be funky until BSL and roll with it.

My hair grows a bit faster than normal. I average about 10-12" a year, and I cut off ~2". My ends are always immaculate and never look damaged, so the trade off is worth it to me. The good thing about my hair is since I'm growing form a shaved nape, I can really tell what the progress looks like. In 1.5 years, I've got about 12" saved on my head, with perfect healthy ends. Not a bad trade off.

I will admit that I'm biased towards a thick, full hemline...so there's a grain of salt.

I do S&D, but only to remove obvious damage, like fairy knots or hair that must have gotten caught in my headphones. So it's not like I'm trying to remove ALL damage with just S&D. I'm just trying to prevent what damage pops up from propagating. I don't think S&D alone works for me because it never really removes damaged ends (only obvious things like splits). Thing is, damaged ends always turn into splits for me anyway, so the best approach for me is to avoid as much damage as possible and then trim what little damage I do get off once a year. As long as I get net gain, I'm happy.

[jeanniet]

This is what I wanted/tried to say earlier but you said it oh so well. :D:cheese:
I should probably say that in my siggie picture my hemline looks really ragged, but it's not. I have a really hard time getting my hair to lay decently for pictures, but my hemline is actually pretty even--remarkably even for someone who hasn't had it professionally trimmed for almost three years. I'm not all that fanatical about making sure my dustings are even, because with wurly hair no one can tell anyway.

[linnepinne]

My hair is fine and prone to splits and breakage, especially my ends and I have to trim often to keep my hair in good shape. My previous goal has been just to get a good professional trim about once every 4-6 months, but I just realized after my last trim (it had been about 4 months) that I'll probably have to go a little more often. This made me a bit sad because stylists often cut alot, even if I ask them not to, but also, I feel like I want to get rid of all of the damage since I'm there paying for the trim :shrug:

It's now been about 2 weeks since my last trim and I could feel that the stylist had not trimmed all of the damage (my fault beacuse I told her not to cut too much), so I just went ahead and did my very first S&D session :) I combined it with a sort of microtrim, since my hairs are so fine the ends are hard to see even in good lighting. I was very happy with the results!

I think this will be my new routine, S&D/microtrim every so often when my ends feel BLEH and hopefully I'll just have to get 2-3 professional trims per year to even up the hemline (also a fan of blunt/even hemlines, at least on my own hair).

But I'll have to invest in a good pair of :scissors:. Any idea where I could get them? I'd like one of pretty good quality that can be resharpened. Something in the 50-70$ price range? TIA

[Amber_Maiden]

I should probably say that in my siggie picture my hemline looks really ragged, but it's not. I have a really hard time getting my hair to lay decently for pictures, but my hemline is actually pretty even--remarkably even for someone who hasn't had it professionally trimmed for almost three years. I'm not all that fanatical about making sure my dustings are even, because with wurly hair no one can tell anyway.

Same here. My pictures in my album show a very uneven hemline- but in reality I had it trimmed in October/November, and it's pretty straight when wet... I just have very surly hair, so it gives the illusion of an uneven hemline.

[Tizzles]

This thread is like divine intervention for me. I just finished my first S&D. I have a lot of damage in the front of my hair that hangs around my face, from highlights and heat styling. The back of my hair always seems to grow so much faster and always feels more smooth, lays perfect, and I was too naive to figure out it was because there wasn't much highlighting going on back there. I was totally grossed out by my first S&D. I had a lot of splits and white dots :( I really don't want to cut the front of my hair to get rid of the damage, it's my security blanket. I'm growing out an inverted bob and really all the damage in my fine hair is located right at the forefront where everyone can see it.

I've been babying my hair with no super hot water, no heat styling, lots of moisture and air dry, but I guess nothing gets rid of the white dots and splits besides a cut/trim/S&D session. I don't mean to get off track or hijack the thread with my personal issue here, but the questions and answers are really enlightening because while most people trim to get rid of damage, it's not an option for me at the moment. However, the silver lining is, it's not AS bad as I thought it would be, but it's not what I'd like it to be either. So thank you for making this thread, I'll be watching religiously :) I hope everyone has a "split free" day :p

[whitedove]

I've been pondering the mathematical likelihood of seriously changing your hemline by excessive S & D, and I don't see how it's possible. Someone correct me if I'm off here, but say you have 100,000 hairs on your head. If you S & D 100 hairs at a time (and I mean actually cut those 100 hairs, not just look at them)--which really is quite a bit--it's still only 1/1000th of the hairs on your head. Taking into consideration that you're always growing new hairs and those are going to be all different lengths anyway, I think it's very, very unlikely that even a considerable amount of S & D is going to make an obvious difference--and then only if your hair is stick straight. On hair like mine, no one would be able to tell even if I S & D'd four hours a day, every day. :p



I am currently using SnD to advoid trimming so often. My main worry was that my ends would get thin looking. But with this logic I should stop being so worried, thank you :cheer:

Now can you figure out why hairs without splits always the ones that shed? :D

[white.chocolate]

I avoid a trim whenever possible. It takes off a lot of length (for me) and it's too bothersome to try to get it into a nice shape when trimming. I trim my own hair. I S&D whenever I have the opportunity to during the day. I don't think there's such a thing as too much S&Ding. I believe you need a trim only when you can't catch up with spit ends when doing S&D. There's also the uneven hemline factor for some people, but I've never really experienced it even with a blunt hemline before... or I just didn't notice much what with all the new growth. That's excellent if you don't mind an uneven hemline! :) Right now, I have microlayers for a change, so it doesn't really matter. I'll trim when I need to, and that could be in a few years, I think.

[torrilin]

I am currently using SnD to advoid trimming so often. My main worry was that my ends would get thin looking. But with this logic I should stop being so worried, thank you :cheer:

Now can you figure out why hairs without splits always the ones that shed? :D

They're not. I have had hairs shed with splits.

But... I've got fine split prone hair (like most fineys). It's been 6 months since my last trim. My hair is obviously more split, and finger combing means my fingers catch and drag on a lot more hairs than they did right after the trim. Yet if I look at my hair, it's quite hard to find the splits. I might have to examine 100-200 individual hairs to find one split.

Even if I "cheat" and focus on areas that I know are damaged... it's still hard to find actual splits.

So I'm looking at a 0.1 or 0.2% split rate. So I'd expect to find a split hair shedding out around 1 time in every 1000 shed hairs... which is a pretty tiny rate. Especially since most of us don't examine our shed hairs in detail!

It also doesn't take a whole lot of search and destroy to keep my hair in a comfortable place where the tangles are easy to deal with. Since I know I'm prone to obsessive behavior, I tend to limit it as strictly as I limit trimming. Once a month, max. I tend to focus a lot more on the long term stuff I can do to prevent splits, like learning to finger comb really well.

[julya]

I only trim every three or four years, and I have given up on S&D. It was time consuming and didn't seem to make a difference, maybe because my hair is so fine it means there are a lot of strands?

[MinderMutsig]

My method of S&D is probably the most lazy one. My hair isn't very tangly so when I do get tangles and get those tangles in the same spot a couple of times, I know there is a split end there. My solution is to fingercomb after wearing my hair down for a couple of hours. Everywhere my fingers get stuck gets examined and I cut the split end.

I tried S&D-ing the regular way but I'm never able to find any splits that way so I gave up on that.

I do microtrim to keep my hemline looking good but I only trim every 4-6 months or so and never more than 1/4 inch.

[Garnetgem]

I S&D but there is no getting away with the trimming if you need to avoid tangles,iS&D often and have stopped so much trimming as a result my hair seems in better condition for it...

[lapis_lazuli]

I'm very timid about trimming my hair... I prefer to go through it and cut off damage as I see it. Length retention is most important to me right now :)

[parkmikii]

I'm in the no trim challenge but I will try to S&D when I'm a bit less lazy, I haven't done that in quite a while...

[ReneeG]

I do both. I prefer to S&D for splits, but I still microtrim every 6-9 weeks as needed. I say as needed because I growing out bleach damage from old highlights, but really I don't think I would need to trim more than 2-3 times a year if I didn't have that damage. S&D on the other hand, I could do that weekly forever and still need it just due to random mechanical damage. I'm p,awning on 1 real trim a year by a professional (they can see the back of my head properly!) to even up the hemline and the rest I do myself.