Advice for dry cold climate please

[Hamh]

Hello.. So I am due to visit Calgary in Canada in two months to visit family we haven't seen for 7 years and to meet my two nephews for the for the first time!! So excited and can't wait but also starting to wonder what I should be preparing my hair for? At the moment I seem to be having great results with Aveda Scalp Benefits shampoo with Biolage Conditioning Balm as a deep treatment. I have been using Nightbloomings panacea (I have all 3! :p) on the ends when nearly dry to seal in some moisture. Can anyone who lives in this type of climate advise whether this will be enough to stop my hair freaking out. I am coming from the uk so kind of used to the cold but it's the dryness I am pondering the effects of.

Any thoughts or tips you can offer I would be so grateful.

[Long_hair_bear]

I live in the northeast of the USA which is very cold and dry in the winter. Regular conditioner washings, few shampoos, and jojoba oil treatments work wonders for me. :-)

[ktani]

Alberta Canada is known for its very dry cold winters. I suggest this for your ends, on its own, http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/vbjournal.php?do=article&articleid=225. The key is sparingly. That is enough, with no need to reapply it. My friends in dry climates are loving it. No greasy or sticky hair either. You can use it the same way throughout your hair.

[Shorty89]

I live in Calgary. For me, I do need moisture sometimes, either with CO, or oiling after I shower. Maybe bring some deep treatments with you?

[ladonna]

Ktani's article was very helpful, I oil daily and then use a tiny big of a petroletum based product that works really good to seal in moisture and prevent frizzled and keep my curls in place. I also co and do stm weekly.

[Hamh]

Thanks for all your replies, really useful info that I will try out and my hair will be thankful for!!

[Dizzy_zzz]

umm...not quite hair related, but you should probably carry tissues around at all times, because it seems that quite a lot of people get nosebleeds from the dry air going to and from Calgary via air travel--myself included. :p Have fun! Calgary's very pretty, IMO.

[Viscountess]

Another Calgarian chiming in!!! Calgary is WINDY! Make sure your hair is nicely braided or up if you are out and about or doing any skiing.

I use coconut oil on my ends and my hair is quite happy with that!!

[jacqueline101]

I use cocoa nut oil on my ends and leave in condish on the rest and oil mixture all over.

[Hamh]

(I have no idea how to quote a few people within a reply so here goes in my own little way!)

Jaqueline-do you do this as a deep treatment or just when you are out and about in the elements?
Viscountess-thanks for the heads up, my well used spin pins will be doing their duty I think!
Dizzy- EEEK!! haha thanks for the warning!!

I love this site so much, the support, help and advice is so great and it's nice to go to people who know what they are talking about with the same ideals regarding hair care. Thanks sincerely x

[cmg]

It depends on the temperature of course, but in polar conditions I would never use vaseline or some such products in hair or on the skin. It crackles. The hair gets brittle and the skin also and cannot breathe. Been there done that. But we are talking severe conditions here, not any cold and dry climate. I can only recommend animal based fats for such conditions.

There are several hundreds of vaseline/petroleum products used for cosmetics and other related stuffs. The melting point differs greatly between them.They are much used and considered safe by many. I am not a friend of mineral oils though. Let me quote from below link:


Alberta Canada is known for its very dry cold winters. I suggest this for your ends, on its own, http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/vbjournal.php?do=article&articleid=225. The key is sparingly. That is enough, with no need to reapply it. My friends in dry climates are loving it. No greasy or sticky hair either. You can use it the same way throughout your hair.

" That however, does not mean that mineral oil should be avoided for hair or skin use at all costs. Just the opposite. It can be used effectively, sparingly and can have several uses for hair. It is more effective than natural sebum and vegetable oils in helping prevent moisture loss from skin, and by extension in my opinion, hair, especially in conditions of low humidity.

This study (http://journal.scconline.org/pdf/cc1975/cc026n05/p00227-p00234.pdf), says just that about use on skin."

Unfortunately, this study says nothing about adverse effects that are not on the skin specifically! There are several studies made on mineral oils, and notably baby oil more than others, that have caused arthritis. Also people working with these substances (builders, hair dressers etc.) have a greater risk developing arthritis. Baby oil was the only oil in some studies, that resulted in inflammations in the joints (reversible), after skin-testing on areas that were damaged (for the test to stick onto the skin). They didnt even have to inject the stuff! Tests have been conducted fex in Sweden 1998 and 2007. I dont have any english speaking links for you.

I'am not saying "dont ever use petroleum products", I am saying there is more to that, which the industry doesnt tell us. I dont like it on my lips, it takes weeks before they normalize. It coats and it sticks, also on hair. And to remove it from the hair I suppose you would have to buy another product to get rid of it. Someone always benefits from our needs, created by lifestyle or real neccesity.

[ktani]

It depends on the temperature of course, but in polar conditions I would never use vaseline or some such products in hair or on the skin. It crackles. The hair gets brittle and the skin also and cannot breathe. Been there done that. But we are talking severe conditions here, not any cold and dry climate. I can only recommend animal based fats for such conditions.

There are several hundreds of vaseline/petroleum products used for cosmetics and other related stuffs. The melting point differs greatly between them.They are much used and considered safe by many. I am not a friend of mineral oils though. Let me quote from below link:



" That however, does not mean that mineral oil should be avoided for hair or skin use at all costs. Just the opposite. It can be used effectively, sparingly and can have several uses for hair. It is more effective than natural sebum and vegetable oils in helping prevent moisture loss from skin, and by extension in my opinion, hair, especially in conditions of low humidity.

This study (http://journal.scconline.org/pdf/cc1975/cc026n05/p00227-p00234.pdf), says just that about use on skin."

Unfortunately, this study says nothing about adverse effects that are not on the skin specifically! There are several studies made on mineral oils, and notably baby oil more than others, that have caused arthritis. Also people working with these substances (builders, hair dressers etc.) have a greater risk developing arthritis. Baby oil was the only oil in some studies, that resulted in inflammations in the joints (reversible), after skin-testing on areas that were damaged (for the test to stick onto the skin). They didnt even have to inject the stuff! Tests have been conducted fex in Sweden 1998 and 2007. I dont have any english speaking links for you.

I'am not saying "dont ever use petroleum products", I am saying there is more to that, which the industry doesnt tell us. I dont like it on my lips, it takes weeks before they normalize. It coats and it sticks, also on hair. And to remove it from the hair I suppose you would have to buy another product to get rid of it. Someone always benefits from our needs, created by lifestyle or real neccesity.

English works just fine.

The 1998 study was done on rats.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1532946/pdf/envhper00524-0053.pdf
"There is consequently a need for well performed studies, which include genetic techniques for identification of subgroups of potentially arthritis-susceptible individuals to study the possibility that some commercial cosmetic products may have a capacity to contribute to arthritis induction in humans in some individuals and in certain situations."

http://arthritis-research.com/content/7/6/R1296
Is about motor oils mostly in the results.

http://chealth.canoe.ca/channel_section_details.asp?text_id=3781&channel_id=8&relation_id=30092
"Exposure to mineral oils such as motor and hydraulic oils can raise your risk of developing rheumatoid arthritis, research shows."

Personally, I trust the Mayo Clinic.

If what your sources say applies to the general population and cosmetic mineral oil or pharmaceutical mineral oil, they would not be on the market and in cosmetics.

ETA: Henna can cause problems in certain susceptible human categories too.

This is not the first time you refer to studies and not quote them. Most are available online in English.

ETA: 2
More on the safety of minera oil in cosmetics and food, http://www.cosmeticsinfo.org/ingredient_details.php?ingredient_id=922 Colour added by me.
"Safety Information
The Food and Drug Administration (FDA) has reviewed the safety of Mineral Oil and permits its use as a multipurpose direct food additive. The FDA also permits its use in Over-the-Counter (OTC) skin protectant drug preparations and in ophthalmic emollients.

If there is something I have missed or can be updated on please post it.

[ktani]

Mineral oil myths Part 1 2010
http://personalcaretruth.com/2010/11/the-top-5-myths-about-mineral-oil-part-1/

Mineral oil myths Part 2 2010
http://personalcaretruth.com/2010/11/myths-about-mineral-oil-part-2/

What it comes down to is marketing fraud.

ETA: See also, http://ktanihairsense.blogspot.com/2010/01/setting-record-straight-about-safety-of.html

[Viscountess]

Calgary is hardly polar, and in March would be quite temperate, with temps well above freezing. Dry and windy? sure. Polar, not so much.

[shikara]

Mineral oil is the ONLY thing that makes my hair sooo soft, manageable, keeps needed moisture in in this dry climate, and keeps tangles at bay, and is not greasy like other oils. No stringiness either 'Health products' too want to sell their stuff and also have marketing agendas, and all companies have a right to protect and defend their products.

DRY SCALP can be a problem too. I used to think it was necessarily my shampoo, but now I massage a thin layer of essential and carrier oil tonic to my scalp prior to washing. No problems yet this winter! I used to live in Calgary, and yes - the wind. Very easy to get that Marilyn Monroe effect wearing a skirt as the wind funnels itself through all the downtown towers! lol

[ktani]

Mineral oil is the ONLY thing that makes my hair sooo soft, manageable, keeps needed moisture in in this dry climate, and keeps tangles at bay, and is not greasy like other oils. No stringiness either 'Health products' too want to sell their stuff and also have marketing agendas, and all companies have a right to protect and defend their products.

DRY SCALP can be a problem too. I used to think it was necessarily my shampoo, but now I massage a thin layer of essential and carrier oil tonic to my scalp prior to washing. No problems yet this winter! I used to live in Calgary, and yes - the wind. Very easy to get that Marilyn Monroe effect wearing a skirt as the wind funnels itself through all the downtown towers! lol

http://i1200.photobucket.com/albums/bb328/lmarie29/th_f198f0e8.jpg (http://s1200.photobucket.com/albums/bb328/lmarie29/?action=view&current=f198f0e8.jpg)

Yes, all cosmetic companies have marketing agendas.

Fraudulent claims abound. That just makes choices harder for the consumer and unsupported scare tactics, without studies to back them up are offensive to me. ETA: I am referring to marketers.

From the 1998 study abstract, colour added by me
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9417771
"The aim of this study was to determine if common commercial cosmetic products containing mineral oil could induce arthritis in the highly susceptible DA (Dark Agouti) rat. ... When this product was also assayed for arthritogenicity upon percutaneous administration, it induced a mild and transient arthritis in 5 out of 10 DA rats, whereas control animals showed no clinical signs of joint involvement."

[ktani]

The 2007 thesis pdf ETA:2 Sweden - See page 39, "Conclusion" ETA: and the paragraph above it. ETA: 3 and page 40
http://diss.kib.ki.se/2007/978-91-7357-112-8/thesis.pdf

[long]

We have been having very dry cold weather this winter in Northern California and my ends were feeling very dry and sticky with conditioner and coconut oil. I took ktani's advice and tried some baby oil which is mineral oil and it has been great. My hair feels very balanced, silky and smooth. I have stopped using conditioner and have no tangles or split ends. I know alot of people won't use mineral oil but I just decided to give it a try and I am glad I did.
I just use a few drops on the ends while hair is still slightly damp.

[Gothchiq]

Agree with Ladonna. Oils!

[ktani]

Mineral oil is the ONLY thing that makes my hair sooo soft, manageable, keeps needed moisture in in this dry climate, and keeps tangles at bay, and is not greasy like other oils. No stringiness either

I have heard back from a few friends of mine who have tried mineral oil/baby oil in their hair, sparingly on damp hair. Not only has it worked well for them too in dry winter climates, (some using to replace a detanger or conditioner) the one thing they all noted as well, aside from no greasiness or stickiness, was that there has been no stringiness, a common complaint with using oils.

And in each case they had no problem washing out the mineral oil from their hair with their regular (in some cases non sulfate) shampoo.

ETA: When I tested baby oil on my own hair (catnipped), my hair was damp and there was no stringiness either.

[auroraclio]

I live in Alberta and find oiling really helps, also make sure to moisturize your skin, most people I know get really dry skin in the winter.

[UltraBella]

Hi ! I live in Montana, within an hour of the Canadian border. It is windy, cold and super dry here. In the winter I stay far away from humectants and use extra virgin olive oil quite often as a deep treatment on damp hair. I use Nightblooming's Panacea on my ends and I also like to use a Biolage spray called Daily Leave In Tonic, it's got a bit of cones in it and it helps my hair to behave and stay soft all day, no static.

[WaterMusic]

I grew up in Calgary, and go back there several times a year. I have extremely dry skin/hair, and I find it really difficult to go back. I just got back to my humid home two days ago in fact, and my skin and hair are much happier.

I suggest keeping your ends tucked up as much as possible, and keep your hair lightly oiled with whatever you prefer to use. Try to apply to slightly damp hair to seal moisture in. Make sure to avoid humectants (honey, glycerin, etc)! Because the air is so dry, the moisture will actually get sucked out of your hair. For this reason I would avoid Nightblooming's Panacea (all three blends), and stick to oils.

As far as skin goes, I like to coat my body with a carrier oil in the shower to help moisturize and prevent moisture loss (I use apricot kernel oil). Then I apply a moisturizer to my entire body right after the shower. I wear long pants and sleeves at all times to try to keep moisture loss at a minimum, and I make sure to apply moisturizer to my entire body in the morning and evening regardless of when I am showering. I try to shower as little as possible, I just use a wash cloth on the necessary parts the rest of the time. Also, I get terrible nosebleeds from the dry air, so I stick Aquaphor in my nose once a day to coat the inside of my nostrils. Sounds gross, but it works! And this is coming from someone who has a record of 25 nosebleeds in one week.

Try not to judge Alberta too harshly, March is probably the worst month to visit. It will likely be brown and muddy, instead of green and wonderful smelling, or covered in snow.

[Hamh]

Hi ! I live in Montana, within an hour of the Canadian border. It is windy, cold and super dry here. In the winter I stay far away from humectants and use extra virgin olive oil quite often as a deep treatment on damp hair. I use Nightblooming's Panacea on my ends and I also like to use a Biolage spray called Daily Leave In Tonic, it's got a bit of cones in it and it helps my hair to behave and stay soft all day, no static.

I know the original panacea has the honey in it, are there any other Humecants within summer and winter which cause problems or are they in minimal amounts it does not matter?

[QUOTE=WaterMusic;

Try not to judge Alberta too harshly, March is probably the worst month to visit. It will likely be brown and muddy, instead of green and wonderful smelling, or covered in snow.[/QUOTE]

Promise I will not judge, I love traveling whatever it may bring! I have never been to Canada before and really cant wait! Really the main purpose is to finally spend the hard earned and saved pennies on a much needed trip to see close family that is long overdue! Family is precious, whatever Canada can add to that will just be the icing to me!!

[Hamh]

...and as it's wash day today I might try the mineral oil to see how my hair reacts. Thanks to whoever it was that pointed out that baby oil is mineral oil, saved me looking around the shops for the bottle labelled as such!! haha when I say I require the idiots guide I really do mean it :o

[ktani]

More on the studies - 2007 colour added by me.
http://www.eirasweden.se/Sverdrup_RA_2007.htm
.... A small increased risk of RA was observed in farmers, upholsterers, lacquerers, concrete workers and hair-dressers and in several occupations such as toolmakers, machinery and engine repairmen. ... The highest risk .... was observed after exposure to hydraulic oil. ... Association between cosmetic usage and the risk of developing RA was also investigated ... no increased risk through use of common skin care products such as body lotions and skin creams was observed."

[Shorty89]

Another Calgarian chiming in!!! Calgary is WINDY! Make sure your hair is nicely braided or up if you are out and about or doing any skiing.

I use coconut oil on my ends and my hair is quite happy with that!!

I don't find it that windy compared to Lethbridge haha.

[WaterMusic]

Promise I will not judge, I love traveling whatever it may bring! I have never been to Canada before and really cant wait! Really the main purpose is to finally spend the hard earned and saved pennies on a much needed trip to see close family that is long overdue! Family is precious, whatever Canada can add to that will just be the icing to me!!

You should try to go to Banff while you are there, the mountains will be spectacular in March. And maybe try to go to Drumheller to see the Royal Tyrell Museum if you have time. Although I think the badlands around Drumheller are better than the museum, but then I've been to the museum a few times so it's not a novelty any more.

Enjoy your visit!

[Diamond.Eyes]

I live in a desert with little to no humidity in the air, and I find that covering my length and ends in a small layer of shea butter or Nightblooming Panacea before braiding it really protects my hair very well. My advice to you is to keep your hair moisturized with some kind of oil or butter at all times and to avoid humectants like honey or glycerin as they will suck the moisture out of your hair. Deep condition often if not frequently and maybe give CWC or CO washing a try, as those methods won't dry your hair out very much when you wash.

[CurlyCap]

I use a lot more olive oil and updos, too. It really isn't intentional. What I noticed is that I have to EVOO in order to moisturize/seal...and then I put it up because I don't want the oil in my face while it sinks in.

I don't use mineral oil, but mostly because while it works in my hair, it's bad for my skin. The oils that are absorbed are pretty well tolerated by my skin,but the ones that settle on top give me horrible acne.

[Hamh]

You should try to go to Banff while you are there, the mountains will be spectacular in March. And maybe try to go to Drumheller to see the Royal Tyrell Museum if you have time. Although I think the badlands around Drumheller are better than the museum, but then I've been to the museum a few times so it's not a novelty any more.

Enjoy your visit!

Thanks for the tips!!


I live in a desert with little to no humidity in the air, and I find that covering my length and ends in a small layer of shea butter or Nightblooming Panacea before braiding it really protects my hair very well. My advice to you is to keep your hair moisturized with some kind of oil or butter at all times and to avoid humectants like honey or glycerin as they will suck the moisture out of your hair. Deep condition often if not frequently and maybe give CWC or CO washing a try, as those methods won't dry your hair out very much when you wash.

Thanks for your advice, I think I will take my small winter and summer panacea pots to help. I will try diluting my shampoo too, I cant CO, when I did attempt it it made me shed like a dog hahaha eeeek!

[Hamh]

UPDATE!!!

So I put just under 2 drops of mineral oil in my damp hair after S&C, squeezing out excess water with a cotton shirt. (I also has regular panacea through the last half of my hair for a few hours before washing as a deep treat) it was still a but damp before bed and I put it into a loose cinnamon bun on top of my head with spin pins. It felt soft last night so the anticipation when I took it down and combed it through near killed me! Want to know the result? I HAVE THE MOST AMAZING HAIR EVER!!!! Seriously it looks like it's been blowdried, but better! My hair leans more towards the fine side but a lot of it so I was dubious but well, wow! I have completely fallen in love with my hair again, the ends now feel the same as my LHC cared for roots and it's like my hair has no clue what a dry end is! Before this I was getting sick of my hair just hanging there and looking thin and well crap and was seriously considering a hairdresser trip to get a chunk cut off, now I can't stop looking at my light bouncy hair in the mirror!

If you haven't tried mineral oil, you should! If you don't get the results I have well no harm done but my gosh there could be a lot to gain here with very little expense to at least try. Now a firm part of my routine with no doubt!

Ktani - you are awesome!! Thank you thank you thank you!

[ktani]

UPDATE!!!

So I put just under 2 drops of mineral oil in my damp hair after S&C, squeezing out excess water with a cotton shirt. (I also has regular panacea through the last half of my hair for a few hours before washing as a deep treat) it was still a but damp before bed and I put it into a loose cinnamon bun on top of my head with spin pins. It felt soft last night so the anticipation when I took it down and combed it through near killed me! Want to know the result? I HAVE THE MOST AMAZING HAIR EVER!!!! Seriously it looks like it's been blowdried, but better! My hair leans more towards the fine side but a lot of it so I was dubious but well, wow! I have completely fallen in love with my hair again, the ends now feel the same as my LHC cared for roots and it's like my hair has no clue what a dry end is! Before this I was getting sick of my hair just hanging there and looking thin and well crap and was seriously considering a hairdresser trip to get a chunk cut off, now I can't stop looking at my light bouncy hair in the mirror!

If you haven't tried mineral oil, you should! If you don't get the results I have well no harm done but my gosh there could be a lot to gain here with very little expense to at least try. Now a firm part of my routine with no doubt!

Ktani - you are awesome!! Thank you thank you thank you!

I am thrilled for you:cheese: And you are very welcome. You may be able to get away with fewer other products too.

[Hamh]

I am thrilled for you:cheese: And you are very welcome. You may be able to get away with fewer other products too.

Thought this already, no need for anything else on my hair at all, no leave ins, aloe gel for fluffiness, nothing! Now all I need to do is to leave my hair alone!! Hahaha:D

[ktani]

Thought this already, no need for anything else on my hair at all, no leave ins, aloe gel for fluffiness, nothing! Now all I need to do is to leave my hair alone!! Hahaha:D

LOL, you will be saving money, that is for sure, lol.

[ktani]

I got another email - this time from a curly haired friend with dry hair who could not find a product for frizz and curl that helped with winter dryness. She tried the mineral oil drops on her damp bsl curly hair, without conditioner first. Result? Soft curls with defintion, no dryness and perfect curl formation. ETA: and volume!

[Hamh]

This is great, seems to help any hair type!!

[proo]

How did mineral oil get such a bad reputation?

[ktani]

How did mineral oil get such a bad reputation?

See this link #1. http://personalcaretruth.com/2010/11/myths-about-mineral-oil-part-2/ and 2.

[proo]

Hmmm . . . so it's malarky
Interestingly, this phenomenon is happening often for me nowadays with health stuff
Something I thought was true just isn't, or it's actually the opposite of what I thought

[Carissamarie08]

I live in Kodiak, Alaska...
very cold and dry. My hair feels like sand paper a lot of times...:/

[ktani]

Hmmm . . . so it's malarky
Interestingly, this phenomenon is happening often for me nowadays with health stuff
Something I thought was true just isn't, or it's actually the opposite of what I thought

Not entirely. Coconut oil for instance can penetrate hair and help protect against protein loss but only if it has access to the hair to be able to do so. If it is used over conditioned hair for that purpose or on hair with build-up or on hair with barrier coatings (ETA:2 or in a mix with things like shea butter or jojoba oil or waxes), it is a surface conditioner. So if it is a choice between surface only conditioners, mineral oil aces coconut oil. ETA: Mineral oil is not greasy, sticky, or heavy and does not make hair stringy if used lightly.

ETA:4 Mineral oil used the same way aces any vegetable oil, in that it is more effective in slowing moisture loss used on damp hair and it is antistatic and it should wash out of the hair easily when so little is needed (and it is not a drying oil) It can be used over conditioned hair without problems. It may also replace as I have said, conditioner or a detangler, depending on the hair.

Coconut oil does not need the same access to be able to chelate minerals. It can be used on hair that is not necessarily clarified prior to hair dyeing or bleaching and still be effective in helping to be effective against peroxide damage.

Oil used as a pre-wash can help protect hair against too much water entering the hair during shampooing too. However, in order for oil to penetrate hair, it cannot get through barrier coatings used on the hair first and only oils like coconut oil can deeply penetrate hair when they have access to the hair to be able to do that, through shampooing or with heat. That means clarified hair and on hair with no barrier coatings.

In India, oils were/are used as a pre-wash to help prevent washing herbs from being too harsh because vegetable oils are not as easily removed by them as sebum, so some of the vegetable oils remain behind, to help condition hair.

ETA:3 The same principle of pre-wash is used for conditioners like the 12 minute one by George Michael, when used used as a pre-wash. It no doubt helps prevent some water from entering the hair during shampooing and is not entirely washed out by George Michael shampoos.

[AlexDig]

Product junkie confession: saw this threat and immediately bought some mineral oil at the store. I'm going to try my mister tonight followed up with a mineral oil seal. So excited!