terminal? =/

[gothicchick]

hello, i'm new here. I'm currently at mid back (26 inches) and aiming for at leaast another three, but i'm worried about going terminal? =/ i'm currently training to be a hairdresser and my boss thinks i've reached terminal because my ends are quite thin and tapered, is she right? at only 26"? :(

thanks for your help

[InkBones]

You're only considered terminal if you haven't experienced any growth for over 12 months. You're probably just going through a stall. Scalp massages might help with that.

[moon2dove]

You're only considered terminal if you haven't experienced any growth for over 12 months. You're probably just going through a stall. Scalp massages might help with that.


^^This^^ I also agree with.
I wouldn't worry either, not yet anyway. There are some who have tapered ends, they call fairytale ends, so don't be thinking your terminal just yet!
Maybe do a micro trim/dusting, this might help :)

[spidermom]

Agreed.

To be honest, it IS possible to have a short terminal length, but it isn't common. Take good care of your hair, get a small trim, and give it at least a year to grow. Get a from the back picture once every month to every three months, and wear a patterned shirt so that you have a reference to judge growth.

Good luck! And welcome!

[gothicchick]

You're only considered terminal if you haven't experienced any growth for over 12 months. You're probably just going through a stall. Scalp massages might help with that.

yeah i hope so, i mean to me it seems as though it's not growing any longer, but then i found some pictures on my laptop from back in april and i can see from them that i'm a good 2 and a half inches longer than back there..... maybe it's just the 'watching pot never boils senario' :P

[Dorothy]

If you have damage to your hair from heat or rough handling it could be breaking off there. I thought I was at terminal at BSL when I joined and now I'm at waist, following the advice for gentle hair care in the articles section.

[gothicchick]

Agreed.

To be honest, it IS possible to have a short terminal length, but it isn't common. Take good care of your hair, get a small trim, and give it at least a year to grow. Get a from the back picture once every month to every three months, and wear a patterned shirt so that you have a reference to judge growth.

Good luck! And welcome!


thank you for your advice, i'll have to try that. My boss said give it another 6 months then give up, but i'm willing to try everything i can really, i don't give up easily :P it's probably because they all have short hair lol and don't want me to be long

[gothicchick]

^^This^^ I also agree with.
I wouldn't worry either, not yet anyway. There are some who have tapered ends, they call fairytale ends, so don't be thinking your terminal just yet!
Maybe do a micro trim/dusting, this might help :)


yeah i see, i suppose it's just possible that my hair nautrally grows tapered?

[RapunzelKat]

It's unlikely that 26" is your terminal length. It's actually normal for your ends to be thinner and tapered if you are not trimming regularly to maintain an even hemline. Some hairs naturally grow faster than others, creating that natural tapered look.

Also, do you have damage in your hair? For example, bleach damage. If you have a lot of damage, it can cause breakage and prevent your hair from reaching it's true terminal length. Don't worry though, you can learn to protect damaged hair, and even repair some types of damage :)

And welcome to LHC! You have certainly come to the right place to learn more about your hair ;)

[gothicchick]

If you have damage to your hair from heat or rough handling it could be breaking off there. I thought I was at terminal at BSL when I joined and now I'm at waist, following the advice for gentle hair care in the articles section.


yeah, that was something else that crossed my mind, i do colour my hair, at the moment i'm about 4 shades lighter blonde than my natural, with blue sections in the front at back^^ i'll upload some pictures when i find the time

i'm not currently using bleach... but underneath my colour there is bleach from back in the summer, which is terrible i know =/

not alot i can do about that though :( it's probably my biggest hair regret

[gothicchick]

It's unlikely that 26" is your terminal length. It's actually normal for your ends to be thinner and tapered if you are not trimming regularly to maintain an even hemline. Some hairs naturally grow faster than others, creating that natural tapered look.

Also, do you have damage in your hair? For example, bleach damage. If you have a lot of damage, it can cause breakage and prevent your hair from reaching it's true terminal length. Don't worry though, you can learn to protect damaged hair, and even repair some types of damage :)

And welcome to LHC! You have certainly come to the right place to learn more about your hair ;)


yeah i do have old bleach on my hair unfortunately =/ i do have my hair trimmed sorta like every 10 weeks, but work keep trying to perswade me to have three inches off, apparently it will look better, it would kill me to do that though =/

and yeah, i've been reading articles on here for a while and never got round to joining until now xD

[jacqueline101]

I don't think its terminal it sounds too short for that. Its probably just at a stall on its growth. Welcome to the group.

[gothicchick]

I don't think its terminal it sounds too short for that. Its probably just at a stall on its growth. Welcome to the group.


yes thats what i'm hoping, this year and last have been tough for me so maybe it's a stress/illness related stall

[coffinhert]

I think at that length, your hair is probably just breaking off at the ends, not done growing. Even if they are tapered at the end, a hair can break off then smooth down into a taper over time. Stay away from damaging things (heat, chemical dye), oil your ends, and wear your hair up, and you'll likely see growth.

[coffinhert]

Ugh and don't listen to people who are trying tomake you cut your hair shorter than you want. It's YOUR hair not THEIRS! Such an old stupid story. Do what makes you happy, not them!!

I just read you have bleach in it. That'll defintiely make it harder to grow longer. Eventually the bleach will be grown out though and your ends will be much stronger.

Coconut oil is good for making bleached hair stronger.

[gothicchick]

I think at that length, your hair is probably just breaking off at the ends, not done growing. Even if they are tapered at the end, a hair can break off then smooth down into a taper over time. Stay away from damaging things (heat, chemical dye), oil your ends, and wear your hair up, and you'll likely see growth.


thats the problem you see, with my job i have to colour my hair really otherwise i'd have alot of roots, i'm a training hairdress you see and i'm feeling this is stopping me from caring for my hair as good as i can =/

[gothicchick]

Ugh and don't listen to people who are trying tomake you cut your hair shorter than you want. It's YOUR hair not THEIRS! Such an old stupid story. Do what makes you happy, not them!!

I just read you have bleach in it. That'll defintiely make it harder to grow longer. Eventually the bleach will be grown out though and your ends will be much stronger.

Coconut oil is good for making bleached hair stronger.

yeah i think the bleach is my main problem.... =/ at the moment i'm using jojoba on my midlenghts and ends daily with a boar bristle brush, would it be better to change to coconut?

do you reckon i will be able to reach my goal even with bleach underneath?

[Hollyfire3]

You probably will not be able to reach you goal and bleach. Most people lookign to bleach grow to goal length, then bleach. You say you feel pressured to dye your hair because your training to be a hairdresser? How about trying a demi-permanemt in your natural color. If you plan to grow out the bleach, this is a way to color your hair (for your job) and keep from damaging it with bleach. The demi permenant is not damage free but, it is MUCH better than the bleach. Also, if you are choosing to grow your hair out healthily, it is a big commitment, this means telling yourself that it doesnt matter what people say or what your job may make you feel like you have to do. You may not be the stylist with the "hippest" hair, but if you follow LHC tips, you will be the one with the healthiest, prettiest and longest. Good luck!

[gothicchick]

You probably will not be able to reach you goal and bleach. Most people lookign to bleach grow to goal length, then bleach. You say you feel pressured to dye your hair because your training to be a hairdresser? How about trying a demi-permanemt in your natural color. If you plan to grow out the bleach, this is a way to color your hair (for your job) and keep from damaging it with bleach. The demi permenant is not damage free but, it is MUCH better than the bleach. Also, if you are choosing to grow your hair out healthily, it is a big commitment, this means telling yourself that it doesnt matter what people say or what your job may make you feel like you have to do. You may not be the stylist with the "hippest" hair, but if you follow LHC tips, you will be the one with the healthiest, prettiest and longest. Good luck!


i'm not bleaching at the moment, i've been colouring over the top of old bleach, not sure what it is, but it's called silk lift, my boss said it's not damaging, i've currently been having highlights with that but i am considering an all over demi, i mean i'm only 16, i have no greys to conver so permanent isn't nessicary. My boss doesn't seem to like my long hair, she told me the other day it's beautiful, but she's also referred to it as 'curtains' because it's all one length!!!!

i just hope i can reach my goal with bleach on my ends =/

i'm also concerned about my ends, if it's combed out properly there seems to be a sort of gap at the back where a few hair's are shorter, is this just slow hairs catching up or breakage?

[coffinhert]

It's probably breakage.

You will find it difficult to grow your hair long and healthy looking if you keep doing different dyes to it... It might be a good idea to either color it your natural color then stop, or keep dying it and cutting it to keep up with the breakage.

[Hollyfire3]

i'm not bleaching at the moment, i've been colouring over the top of old bleach, not sure what it is, but it's called silk lift, my boss said it's not damaging, i've currently been having highlights with that but i am considering an all over demi, i mean i'm only 16, i have no greys to conver so permanent isn't nessicary. My boss doesn't seem to like my long hair, she told me the other day it's beautiful, but she's also referred to it as 'curtains' because it's all one length!!!!

i just hope i can reach my goal with bleach on my ends =/

i'm also concerned about my ends, if it's combed out properly there seems to be a sort of gap at the back where a few hair's are shorter, is this just slow hairs catching up or breakage?


Honestly about the ends, i would be safe and assume its breakage. Try trimming 1-1/2 inch of it (i know you don't want to but your hair may need it) I say trim off a bit each month until the bleach is gone, this minimizes the shock and gives your hair time to catch up to the trim. Yes, you can reach your goal with bleach on the ends, but the bleach will make it harder to stop breakage and you will need to trim more often. I would trim off at least 1/2 inch a month while the bleach is there because if you don't your hair may continue to break and you will be working backwards. If you are worried your boss doesnt liek long hair, try braiding it or wearing it up, chech the hairstyles section of the articles page for some cool styles. If your hair is up, it is protected and your boss can just keep on guessing about how long it its:D Don't worry, your can get there!:)

[gothicchick]

Honestly about the ends, i would be safe and assume its breakage. Try trimming 1-1/2 inch of it (i know you don't want to but your hair may need it) I say trim off a bit each month until the bleach is gone, this minimizes the shock and gives your hair time to catch up to the trim. Yes, you can reach your goal with bleach on the ends, but the bleach will make it harder to stop breakage and you will need to trim more often. I would trim off at least 1/2 inch a month while the bleach is there because if you don't your hair may continue to break and you will be working backwards. If you are worried your boss doesnt liek long hair, try braiding it or wearing it up, chech the hairstyles section of the articles page for some cool styles. If your hair is up, it is protected and your boss can just keep on guessing about how long it its:D Don't worry, your can get there!:)



yeah i see, there is alot of bleach though, if i was to cut it all off it would to about ear length lol!!!!!

well i'm going to do everything in my power to grow my hair even with bleached ends. Any suggestions on oiling, washing or any other hair related subjects is highly appreciated!! :)

thankyou for your help

[Hollyfire3]

yeah i see, there is alot of bleach though, if i was to cut it all off it would to about ear length lol!!!!!

well i'm going to do everything in my power to grow my hair even with bleached ends. Any suggestions on oiling, washing or any other hair related subjects is highly appreciated!! :)

thankyou for your help


Your welcome, no problem!:D Do you plan on eventually having long hair without bleach or do you entend to bleach at your goal length? If the first is your goal, trims will help. I don't think you should cut it all of at once, too much shock to you! My suggestions, wear hair up often, oil the ends, use a rich weekly treatment, wash twcie a week (like you do) find a new, less harsh shampoo, experiment with using conditioner before washing with shampoo. Try to cut out all heatstling (you are sooo close!) find new heatless hairstyles, try a demi permanet in your natural color (just to see what it will look like if you grow it out) and learn to love your hair at all lengths!

[coffinhert]

You said you're brushing jojoba oil in with a BBB, that's probably the best thing to do. I haven't used that oil in particular but if it's working for you, should be fine.

To minimize breakage you might want to get a 100% silk pillowcase (like this (http://www.dharmatrading.com/featured_products/cbpc.html)) so there's no friction on your hair at night. Also sleeping with your hair in a protected hairstyle will keep the ends from breaking and fraying. I put my hair in pin curls at night sometimes, and I find that's the best for me personally. But whatever you can do to keep your ends wrapped up in something at night.

[gothicchick]

Your welcome, no problem!:D Do you plan on eventually having long hair without bleach or do you entend to bleach at your goal length? If the first is your goal, trims will help. I don't think you should cut it all of at once, too much shock to you! My suggestions, wear hair up often, oil the ends, use a rich weekly treatment, wash twcie a week (like you do) find a new, less harsh shampoo, experiment with using conditioner before washing with shampoo. Try to cut out all heatstling (you are sooo close!) find new heatless hairstyles, try a demi permanet in your natural color (just to see what it will look like if you grow it out) and learn to love your hair at all lengths!

i intend to get to my goal length (at least waist) i definately won't be bleaching, i intend to just use demi permanents like you say, growing the bleach out would be nice because then i'd know it's not so damaged but as long as it's healthy to a certain extent thats ok^^

[Avital88]

my hairdresser used to tell me the same at bsl years ago.. it was just damage why my ends tapered not because of terminal length.

[gothicchick]

my hairdresser used to tell me the same at bsl years ago.. it was just damage why my ends tapered not because of terminal length.

really? were your ends quite thin too?

Hairdressers seem to like to suggest terminal length at any signs of tapering lol

[Hollyfire3]

my hairdresser used to tell me the same at bsl years ago.. it was just damage why my ends tapered not because of terminal length.


Yeah, my hair dresser said that at my last trim, yeah it was damaged but really, was the blow to my self esteem really necessary? How did you get past your so called terminal BSL length?

[swearnsue]

Hi Gothicchick. I like how you stick to your guns and don't believe everything your boss or co-workers say. There are some LHC members that use honey to lighten hair. There are also some herbal treatments like cassia that can strengthen your hair and add shine. If you decide to trim some of your ends, do it yourself because you will do a better job of it I think.

[Hollyfire3]

really? were your ends quite thin too?

Hairdressers seem to like to suggest terminal length at any signs of tapering lol

Yes, they do, when in reality they (the hairdressers) just need to trim it and get on with their dellusions about shoulder length hair being long...sory bad experiences..i'm quite sure BSL is OT terminal, just damaged ends in need of a good trim and TLC to grow along, strong and blunt hemline

[Hollyfire3]

Hi Gothicchick. I like how you stick to your guns and don't believe everything your boss or co-workers say. There are some LHC members that use honey to lighten hair. There are also some herbal treatments like cassia that can strengthen your hair and add shine. If you decide to trim some of your ends, do it yourself because you will do a better job of it I think.


Yes, assertiveness and sticking to your beliefs plays a suprising role in having long hair, it is true. Where do you buy cassia, i'm looking to try it also.

[gothicchick]

You said you're brushing jojoba oil in with a BBB, that's probably the best thing to do. I haven't used that oil in particular but if it's working for you, should be fine.

To minimize breakage you might want to get a 100% silk pillowcase (like this (http://www.dharmatrading.com/featured_products/cbpc.html)) so there's no friction on your hair at night. Also sleeping with your hair in a protected hairstyle will keep the ends from breaking and fraying. I put my hair in pin curls at night sometimes, and I find that's the best for me personally. But whatever you can do to keep your ends wrapped up in something at night.

yes i've used other oils before and found them to make my ends kind of crispy, but jojoba seems to absorb really well with my hair. I have been thinking about investing in a silk pillow case after reading alot about them. At the moment i currently braid my hair in a long side braid, or wear it with about 10-15 hairbands (all metal-less) tied down my lenght keeping it straight, is this ok?

i find it keeps it nice and sleek, and no little hairs can poke out and rub against my pillow

[gothicchick]

Yes, they do, when in reality they (the hairdressers) just need to trim it and get on with their dellusions about shoulder length hair being long...sory bad experiences..i'm quite sure BSL is OT terminal, just damaged ends in need of a good trim and TLC to grow along, strong and blunt hemline


yes i find it ammusing when a client comes in with barely past shoulder length hair, and their like 'yeah because my hair is long....'


i'm like right sure :P

[gothicchick]

Hi Gothicchick. I like how you stick to your guns and don't believe everything your boss or co-workers say. There are some LHC members that use honey to lighten hair. There are also some herbal treatments like cassia that can strengthen your hair and add shine. If you decide to trim some of your ends, do it yourself because you will do a better job of it I think.

thankyou :)

and oh really? could you possibly tell me a bit more about the honey and herbal treatments? anything that i will benefit from i'm interested in :)

and yes i have been giving myself microtrims. When i get it done at work i always feel so broken hearted with about 2 inches of my hard earned length gone, i find i can get by, by just trimming my bare ends. Or going through and trimming any splits i can see, seems to benefit me alot, although lately i haven't noticed many splits at all. I used to have absolutly loads :s

[Hollyfire3]

thankyou :)

and oh really? could you possibly tell me a bit more about the honey and herbal treatments? anything that i will benefit from i'm interested in :)

and yes i have been giving myself microtrims. When i get it done at work i always feel so broken hearted with about 2 inches of my hard earned length gone, i find i can get by, by just trimming my bare ends. Or going through and trimming any splits i can see, seems to benefit me alot, although lately i haven't noticed many splits at all. I used to have absolutly loads :s


I swear, some hairdressers definition of trim is my definition of big cut, i dont like that at all but im too wimpy to attempt my own trims...how do you do it?

[gothicchick]

I swear, some hairdressers definition of trim is my definition of big cut, i dont like that at all but im too wimpy to attempt my own trims...how do you do it?

yeah i agree 'only a tiny trim' is about two inches to hairdressers

i HATE having my hair cut, i feel so flat afterwards :p

[Ms Strangelove]

If you have damage to your hair from heat or rough handling it could be breaking off there. I thought I was at terminal at BSL when I joined and now I'm at waist, following the advice for gentle hair care in the articles section.

Thank you for that information, my hair has been shoulder-lenghted for years now, because there was always the need to cut the totally damaged hair off... Now through following advice on hair care like you said, I hope to gain considerable lenght. Congratulations for being at waist-lenght, sounds wonderful!

[Altocumulus]

For avoiding mechanical damage, I'd skip the brush too, even a boar bristle brush. Detangle very gently with a smooth, seamless wide toothed comb.

Good luck!

[missoj]

I agree with some of the ladies above who suggest that hair growth has stalled, reached a plateau but not terminal. At one point I thought my hair had seemed to stop growing, it took me well over a year to get out of the APL-BSL desert. Now my hair's almost MBL. Don't give up hope.

[auburntressed]

While we are on the subject, does anyone here know what is "average" for a human female's terminal length to be?

I think it is something that may be rather hard to determine, because so few people in general have long hair - let alone terminal. How many folks here have reached terminal, I wonder? And how long was that?

Is there a way to genetically determine what any given individual's terminal length would be without them having to actually grow their hair out to that length?

Guinness World Records says that the longest haired woman has hair that is 18 ft. and 5.54 in. But it doesn't mention if HER hair has reached terminal length.

[coffinhert]

For avoiding mechanical damage, I'd skip the brush too, even a boar bristle brush. Detangle very gently with a smooth, seamless wide toothed comb.

Good luck!

I would disagree, at least in my case. My hair is pretty damaged (bleach, dye) and I use my bbb to prevent further damage. I don't brush it through the whole length, as it catches, but I hold my midway while it's still wet, and smooth the ends with the oiled bbb. I find that it smooths down each individual hair, and if it is kinked in a way that will lead to breakage, the bbb removes the bend and the hair is safe from breaking in that spot for another day. I do detangle with comb or fingers before using the bbb. But for my ends, brushing a good oil in with the bbb is really awesome for them, makes them softer and less bent out of shape, and leads to less splits/breaks. I get a lot of L-shaped and U-shaped bends on my tips and they all tangle together, so the bbb is necessary to straighten them all out.

[Renbirde]

yeah i see, i suppose it's just possible that my hair nautrally grows tapered?
Hair does grow tapered, but at most lengths, regular trims keep things more or less even. If most of your hair is fairly thick and they ends suddenly get wispy a few inches up, I'd bet on breakage. A true terminal will have a very smooth gradual taper all along the length.


thats the problem you see, with my job i have to colour my hair really otherwise i'd have alot of roots, i'm a training hairdress you see and i'm feeling this is stopping me from caring for my hair as good as i can =/
Either dye back to your natural color or use deposit-only dyes in shades darker than your natural color, at least until you get the breaking at your ends under control. You can bleach and still grow pretty long (one of our members is past classic with a rainbow mane on hair that's naturally a vivid red), but you'll want to go very carefully until you know how much your hair can take. I'd grow out the bleach entirely then start doing lots of super careful strand tests before doing any serious lightening.


yeah i think the bleach is my main problem.... =/ at the moment i'm using jojoba on my midlenghts and ends daily with a boar bristle brush, would it be better to change to coconut?

do you reckon i will be able to reach my goal even with bleach underneath?
Yeah, almost certainly, but it will go slower for you than someone with virgin hair. :shrug: I got to waist with bleach (super nasty, fried hair, my stylist forgot about me and left it in about 3x as long as he should have). Your hair is coarser than mine, so you'll probably have an easier time of it. Mine breaks if you look at it cross-eyed, just about, even when it's virgin. :p

Coconut is much heavier than jojoba; personally, I like coconut for deep conditioning, not for daily use. It's just too much. It builds up and goes all crunchy.


really? were your ends quite thin too?

Hairdressers seem to like to suggest terminal length at any signs of tapering lol
It's because it's easier to tell a customer that it's in their genes and "that's just the way it is" than tell them that they've got ridiculously trashed hair that's breaking off all over the place. :D


yes i've used other oils before and found them to make my ends kind of crispy, but jojoba seems to absorb really well with my hair. I have been thinking about investing in a silk pillow case after reading alot about them. At the moment i currently braid my hair in a long side braid, or wear it with about 10-15 hairbands (all metal-less) tied down my lenght keeping it straight, is this ok?

i find it keeps it nice and sleek, and no little hairs can poke out and rub against my pillow
The braid is an excellent idea, but the ponytails can be a little rough on hair, even without metal connectors, since you have to drag the whole length through the band several times to put them in, and then drag the length again pulling them out. The spot at the top of the tail against your head can also rub and cause breakage as you move in your sleep and it rubs against things. :( Braids are a better route, or buns if you find a type you can stand to sleep on.


I swear, some hairdressers definition of trim is my definition of big cut, i dont like that at all but im too wimpy to attempt my own trims...how do you do it?
"Trim" is hairdresser-speak for "take off a measurable amount, like 3 inches or so." If you just want the very, very ends nipped off (1/2 inch or less, give or take) ask for a "dusting." The cut ends should look like dust on the floor. :) Feye's self trim (http://feyeselftrim.livejournal.com/) guides are excellent, though; check them out! I trim my own hair, though it's getting tricky now that I'm past classic. I recruited DBF this last time.

[gothicchick]

Hair does grow tapered, but at most lengths, regular trims keep things more or less even. If most of your hair is fairly thick and they ends suddenly get wispy a few inches up, I'd bet on breakage. A true terminal will have a very smooth gradual taper all along the length.


Either dye back to your natural color or use deposit-only dyes in shades darker than your natural color, at least until you get the breaking at your ends under control. You can bleach and still grow pretty long (one of our members is past classic with a rainbow mane on hair that's naturally a vivid red), but you'll want to go very carefully until you know how much your hair can take. I'd grow out the bleach entirely then start doing lots of super careful strand tests before doing any serious lightening.


Yeah, almost certainly, but it will go slower for you than someone with virgin hair. :shrug: I got to waist with bleach (super nasty, fried hair, my stylist forgot about me and left it in about 3x as long as he should have). Your hair is coarser than mine, so you'll probably have an easier time of it. Mine breaks if you look at it cross-eyed, just about, even when it's virgin. :p

Coconut is much heavier than jojoba; personally, I like coconut for deep conditioning, not for daily use. It's just too much. It builds up and goes all crunchy.


It's because it's easier to tell a customer that it's in their genes and "that's just the way it is" than tell them that they've got ridiculously trashed hair that's breaking off all over the place. :D


The braid is an excellent idea, but the ponytails can be a little rough on hair, even without metal connectors, since you have to drag the whole length through the band several times to put them in, and then drag the length again pulling them out. The spot at the top of the tail against your head can also rub and cause breakage as you move in your sleep and it rubs against things. :( Braids are a better route, or buns if you find a type you can stand to sleep on.


"Trim" is hairdresser-speak for "take off a measurable amount, like 3 inches or so." If you just want the very, very ends nipped off (1/2 inch or less, give or take) ask for a "dusting." The cut ends should look like dust on the floor. :) Feye's self trim (http://feyeselftrim.livejournal.com/) guides are excellent, though; check them out! I trim my own hair, though it's getting tricky now that I'm past classic. I recruited DBF this last time.

thank you for all the information everybody!!! i will certaintely take it all inaccount,

today when out i noticed a few splits so i'm think i'm gunna go through tonight and chop some off

i've also noticed my blonde has gone a slightly green tinge, i've heard this can be through using softened water. Has anybody with lightened hair noticed this problem?

it's not terrible, it's just i'm training to be a hairdresser so i sort of know what i'm looking for.

[Hollyfire3]

Hair does grow tapered, but at most lengths, regular trims keep things more or less even. If most of your hair is fairly thick and they ends suddenly get wispy a few inches up, I'd bet on breakage. A true terminal will have a very smooth gradual taper all along the length.


Either dye back to your natural color or use deposit-only dyes in shades darker than your natural color, at least until you get the breaking at your ends under control. You can bleach and still grow pretty long (one of our members is past classic with a rainbow mane on hair that's naturally a vivid red), but you'll want to go very carefully until you know how much your hair can take. I'd grow out the bleach entirely then start doing lots of super careful strand tests before doing any serious lightening.


Yeah, almost certainly, but it will go slower for you than someone with virgin hair. :shrug: I got to waist with bleach (super nasty, fried hair, my stylist forgot about me and left it in about 3x as long as he should have). Your hair is coarser than mine, so you'll probably have an easier time of it. Mine breaks if you look at it cross-eyed, just about, even when it's virgin. :p

Coconut is much heavier than jojoba; personally, I like coconut for deep conditioning, not for daily use. It's just too much. It builds up and goes all crunchy.


It's because it's easier to tell a customer that it's in their genes and "that's just the way it is" than tell them that they've got ridiculously trashed hair that's breaking off all over the place. :D


The braid is an excellent idea, but the ponytails can be a little rough on hair, even without metal connectors, since you have to drag the whole length through the band several times to put them in, and then drag the length again pulling them out. The spot at the top of the tail against your head can also rub and cause breakage as you move in your sleep and it rubs against things. :( Braids are a better route, or buns if you find a type you can stand to sleep on.


"Trim" is hairdresser-speak for "take off a measurable amount, like 3 inches or so." If you just want the very, very ends nipped off (1/2 inch or less, give or take) ask for a "dusting." The cut ends should look like dust on the floor. :) Feye's self trim (http://feyeselftrim.livejournal.com/) guides are excellent, though; check them out! I trim my own hair, though it's getting tricky now that I'm past classic. I recruited DBF this last time.


Oh wow, this is so helpful! I esspecially like the part about the rest of your hair being thick and the ends being breakage, making you think you reached terminal. I just assumed my hair was thick but stupid because it was breaking off at BSl...i guess twice daily heat styling will do that to you....

[AcornMystic]

Firstly, I know your boss is the one teaching you the ropes and all about hairstyling, but you need to understand that she doesn't appreciate hair. She works with it, but she doesn't really understand it. A true hairstylist would not be insulting one length hair. She would also not be insulting long hair. She is what I like to call an "in it for the money stylist" She's all about the most hip styles and what will force you to come back to their salon ASAP. Salon owners like their employees to have hip funky "fashionable" styles in an attempt to draw customers in. It's not about individuality. So as far as healthy hair is concerned do not listen to her. She's more likely to say, "Use our salon brands, the cones will fix that and then you can have smooth shiny hair while colouring it to high heaven. If it starts to look a little on the ragged side, we'll give it a good trim" than"Oil it and be gentle. Do minimal colouring. Perhaps simply streaks/highlights, streaked clip in extensions if you really don't want to dye your hair and still have that vamped up look, and get the occasional trim." Rare is the hairstylist that won't encourage you to damage your hair while pushing their products on you to cover it up and then make you have to come back when it finally gets too damaged to hide.

Be polite of course, but discard what your boss tells you, ignore her unnecessary insults and listen to LHC. It will take care of your hair and do what is best for it and not to obtain the almighty dollar.


ETA: I also want to say.. If you really want long hair, go virgin (dye it your natural hair colour to avoid demarcation that is what I did and have been growing out for exactly a year this month). Buy clip in streaks if you want to have a funky look going and keep your boss off your back about having a "drab and boring" hair colour. I have been growing an inch a month the last couple months with NO splits or breakage and I attribute it as much to the fact that I am virgin as taking vitamins/mineral tablets and scalp massages. You will get there but you need patience and willingness to do what it takes. Never think you are at your terminal length if there is bleach involved. Especially when there is colour over bleach, yikes.

[gothicchick]

Firstly, I know your boss is the one teaching you the ropes and all about hairstyling, but you need to understand that she doesn't appreciate hair. She works with it, but she doesn't really understand it. A true hairstylist would not be insulting one length hair. She would also not be insulting long hair. She is what I like to call an "in it for the money stylist" She's all about the most hip styles and what will force you to come back to their salon ASAP. Salon owners like their employees to have hip funky "fashionable" styles in an attempt to draw customers in. It's not about individuality. So as far as healthy hair is concerned do not listen to her. She's more likely to say, "Use our salon brands, the cones will fix that and then you can have smooth shiny hair while colouring it to high heaven. If it starts to look a little on the ragged side, we'll give it a good trim" than"Oil it and be gentle. Do minimal colouring. Perhaps simply streaks/highlights, streaked clip in extensions if you really don't want to dye your hair and still have that vamped up look, and get the occasional trim." Rare is the hairstylist that won't encourage you to damage your hair while pushing their products on you to cover it up and then make you have to come back when it finally gets too damaged to hide.

Be polite of course, but discard what your boss tells you, ignore her unnecessary insults and listen to LHC. It will take care of your hair and do what is best for it and not to obtain the almighty dollar.


ETA: I also want to say.. If you really want long hair, go virgin (dye it your natural hair colour to avoid demarcation that is what I did and have been growing out for exactly a year this month). Buy clip in streaks if you want to have a funky look going and keep your boss off your back about having a "drab and boring" hair colour. I have been growing an inch a month the last couple months with NO splits or breakage and I attribute it as much to the fact that I am virgin as taking vitamins/mineral tablets and scalp massages. You will get there but you need patience and willingness to do what it takes. Never think you are at your terminal length if there is bleach involved. Especially when there is colour over bleach, yikes.


thank you for the advice :) i've only been on this site since yesterday and i've already learnt loads.

i'm just relieved that nobody thinks i'm at terminal

[Anje]

While we are on the subject, does anyone here know what is "average" for a human female's terminal length to be?
Very roughly, I've heard it to be somewhere in the rear-end zone or around classic length, with any curl stretched out. Classic is roughly where I estimate my own terminal to be, since I've spent several years maintaining at tailbone to thicken the ends and after a certain point haven't noticed much more improvement. (I'd prefer thicker ends to hitting terminal.) Then again, I've heard enough stories about people here who thought for years that they had a terminal around classic, then were able to grow to knee. There's probably a really huge standard deviation in the mean terminal length, and I doubt there are good statistics on it anyway.

[gothicchick]

Very roughly, I've heard it to be somewhere in the rear-end zone or around classic length, with any curl stretched out. Classic is roughly where I estimate my own terminal to be, since I've spent several years maintaining at tailbone to thicken the ends and after a certain point haven't noticed much more improvement. (I'd prefer thicker ends to hitting terminal.) Then again, I've heard enough stories about people here who thought for years that they had a terminal around classic, then were able to grow to knee. There's probably a really huge standard deviation in the mean terminal length, and I doubt there are good statistics on it anyway.

as long as my terminal is below waist i'm happy^^

[Merkaba]

I was at a stall recently and started taking Calcium pills. Now I can tell that I am growing again.

You may want to try checking your diet and seeing if you are missing out on any food groups.

[gothicchick]

I was at a stall recently and started taking Calcium pills. Now I can tell that I am growing again.

You may want to try checking your diet and seeing if you are missing out on any food groups.

yeah, i haven't exactly been eating the best lately with christmas and everything and intend to eat better and shed some lb's in january!!

i currently take quite alot of pills. i have to taken an antihistimean, and setraline (for depression)

the suppliments i take are: cod liver oil, sea kelp, and a 'lustrious hair' vitimin.

do you reckon the antidepressants could be the cause for my stall? i've heard this can happen

[gothicchick]

I agree with some of the ladies above who suggest that hair growth has stalled, reached a plateau but not terminal. At one point I thought my hair had seemed to stop growing, it took me well over a year to get out of the APL-BSL desert. Now my hair's almost MBL. Don't give up hope.


yes i see, i think the distant between mid back and waist is just one of them 'no mans land' area's, i'm not quite sure where i belong, or when i can start calling it waist.

[Renbirde]

Oh wow, this is so helpful! I esspecially like the part about the rest of your hair being thick and the ends being breakage, making you think you reached terminal. I just assumed my hair was thick but stupid because it was breaking off at BSl...i guess twice daily heat styling will do that to you....
Oooh, yes it will. Especially if you're ironing it while it's still damp from a shower. Tip: the iron will still work on dry hair, but on wet hair (while it does make things dry fast, which is nice) it's not just turning the water outside your hair to steam, but the water inside your hair as well. The pressure from the steam can actually rupture the shaft of the hair and shatter the cuticle, leaving what's called a "white dot" split. It'll look like a bit of dust stuck to the hair, but won't come off if you run your fingers across it.

They're doubly scary because they can happen anywhere along your length, not just the ends like normal splits, and the split can travel in both directions, both up and down the hair shaft. It takes foreeeeeever to grow out. (Ask me how I know...:rolleyes:)

LHC being LHC, folks have turned up straightening methods that don't use heat. :) Look up crown wrapping. If you take your shower in the evening, your hair can dry overnight and you can iron it in the morning with much, much less danger of damage. It's still not great, and you'll still want to use a heat protectant spray, but it's better. If you can stretch washes and don't live anywhere too humid, you might get away with flat ironing just every few days. :)

Out of curiosity, why do you flat iron it?

[Hollyfire3]

Oooh, yes it will. Especially if you're ironing it while it's still damp from a shower. Tip: the iron will still work on dry hair, but on wet hair (while it does make things dry fast, which is nice) it's not just turning the water outside your hair to steam, but the water inside your hair as well. The pressure from the steam can actually rupture the shaft of the hair and shatter the cuticle, leaving what's called a "white dot" split. It'll look like a bit of dust stuck to the hair, but won't come off if you run your fingers across it.

They're doubly scary because they can happen anywhere along your length, not just the ends like normal splits, and the split can travel in both directions, both up and down the hair shaft. It takes foreeeeeever to grow out. (Ask me how I know...:rolleyes:)

LHC being LHC, folks have turned up straightening methods that don't use heat. :) Look up crown wrapping. If you take your shower in the evening, your hair can dry overnight and you can iron it in the morning with much, much less danger of damage. It's still not great, and you'll still want to use a heat protectant spray, but it's better. If you can stretch washes and don't live anywhere too humid, you might get away with flat ironing just every few days. :)

Out of curiosity, why do you flat iron it?

I live where it is VERY humid, so the second i step outside, POOF and not the magic kind...lol i have yet to try wrapping, but i have pretty much given up my straight iron...in amswer t your question, i flat iron because orignally, i hated my curls. Now, my curls are waves due to weight of being at BSL and because my hair is thick, it takes forever, combine this with a BAD (and i mean horrible!) run in with protein and constant blow frying that destoryed my poor poor waves and curls, i have prettty much sworn off the flat iron...i still wish my hair was straighter though...and i hate the poofy, frizzy mess humidy leaves me with but am scared of ruining my waves permanetly with cones...oh the joys of hair!:) OMG! Just saw your a fellow wavy with thick hair! thanks for questioning my reasons for flat ironing, it makes me feel like a person with similar hair to mine cares!

[coffinhert]

I don't think cones permanently ruin waves. They just weigh them down while the product is in the hair. It can be washed out! :)

[Renbirde]

I live where it is VERY humid, so the second i step outside, POOF and not the magic kind...lol i have yet to try wrapping, but i have pretty much given up my straight iron...in amswer t your question, i flat iron because orignally, i hated my curls. Now, my curls are waves due to weight of being at BSL and because my hair is thick, it takes forever, combine this with a BAD (and i mean horrible!) run in with protein and constant blow frying that destoryed my poor poor waves and curls, i have prettty much sworn off the flat iron...i still wish my hair was straighter though...and i hate the poofy, frizzy mess humidy leaves me with but am scared of ruining my waves permanetly with cones...oh the joys of hair!:) OMG! Just saw your a fellow wavy with thick hair! thanks for questioning my reasons for flat ironing, it makes me feel like a person with similar hair to mine cares!
:D Wavy love! Mine's just wavy enough to get itself into trouble, not wavy enough to actually be depended on to make nice waves. It's silly. I'd love it if it was really, properly wavy. Huzzah for braid waves!

Aaaaah, I see. Have you tried doing something like plopping (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2qD38ZYX6A) with a little bit of aloe or mousse to encourage it to be a bit more wavy and a bit less poofy? I go to school somewhere super dry, so I've got the opposite problem... (And hard water. D: Such hard water. I cone up my hair to try and protect it from the dryness and calcium. It means I only have real waves during the summer. :()

And yeah, to second coffinhert, the wave-killing cone effect isn't permanent. Just a few washed till the cones come out. Don't worry about it too much. The only things I can think of that would permanently, permanently kill your waves are things like perms, Brazilian Keratin Treatment.. y'know, proper, hair-melting chemicals, and super hardcore heat or mechanical damage. You'd need to have really messed up the structure of your hair for the wave to go away permanently. A bit too much product or protein or moisture can get sorted out without too much trouble. :)