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GabrielleRose
October 25th, 2011, 12:54 PM
Hello all!

I was wondering if I can still use coconut oil on my hair though I am using cone filled products from Pantene's Restore Beautiful Lengths? Or will the oil not be able to penetrate?

heidi w.
October 25th, 2011, 01:02 PM
Oiling hair length does not intend to "penetrate" hair. It is not a conditioner and doesn't form a bond with interior hair's cortex, as it does in the case of conditioner.

Oiling is a coating for adding suppleness and sheen to the hair's surface, on top of the cuticle. That's it.

So I would contend that you can use this shampoo product and coconut oil just fine. I recommend using the Coconut Oil specifically formulated for use on hair and skin made by Spectrum Naturals and usually in Whole Foods grocers in the Beauty Section. You could consider talking with your local grocer and seeing if they can order it for you, or you can likely purchase directly from their website or call them and place an order, I think. I've always gone through Whole Foods though.

Here's the link from their website. The website offers a store locator too.
http://www.spectrumorganics.com/?id=205&findall=Coconut+Oil+for+use+on+hair+and+skin


heidi w.

bna_rapunzel
October 25th, 2011, 01:02 PM
I'm a conehead and I'm addicted to my coconut oil. Seems to work for me :)

GabrielleRose
October 25th, 2011, 01:25 PM
Oiling hair length does not intend to "penetrate" hair. It is not a conditioner and doesn't form a bond with interior hair's cortex, as it does in the case of conditioner.

Oiling is a coating for adding suppleness and sheen to the hair's surface, on top of the cuticle. That's it.

So I would contend that you can use this shampoo product and coconut oil just fine. I recommend using the Coconut Oil specifically formulated for use on hair and skin made by Spectrum Naturals and usually in Whole Foods grocers in the Beauty Section. You could consider talking with your local grocer and seeing if they can order it for you, or you can likely purchase directly from their website or call them and place an order, I think. I've always gone through Whole Foods though.

Here's the link from their website. The website offers a store locator too.
http://www.spectrumorganics.com/?id=205&findall=Coconut+Oil+for+use+on+hair+and+skin


heidi w.

Thank you for the clarification, and the website as well.

I used the store locator but no one near me carries it, so I will just order it from the site.

May I ask why you use the one specifically for hair? The brand I have at home is nature's way.

GabrielleRose
October 25th, 2011, 01:26 PM
I'm a conehead and I'm addicted to my coconut oil. Seems to work for me :)

I'm glad it works for you! I was worried I wouldn't be able to use it due to the cones.

Panth
October 25th, 2011, 02:14 PM
Oiling hair length does not intend to "penetrate" hair. It is not a conditioner and doesn't form a bond with interior hair's cortex, as it does in the case of conditioner.

Well... actually, coconut oil does penetrate the hair. It is one of a select few oils that can (the others being babassu, cohune, murumuru, palm kernel and tucuma kernel oil). This occurs because these oils have a high lauric acid content. This is the entire basis of the oil shampoo method (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/vbjournal.php?do=article&articleid=191).

So, heidi is partly right: using cones will not affect the ability of oils to coat your hair and add suppleness and sheen. However, in the case of coconut oil and other high lauric acid content oils, the cones will prevent the oil from penetrating the hair and thus can stop you from getting the benefits of this part of the oil's action.

heartgoesboom
October 25th, 2011, 02:21 PM
Well... actually, coconut oil does penetrate the hair. It is one of a select few oils that can (the others being babassu, cohune, murumuru, palm kernel and tucuma kernel oil). This occurs because these oils have a high lauric acid content. This is the entire basis of the oil shampoo method (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/vbjournal.php?do=article&articleid=191).

So, heidi is partly right: using cones will not affect the ability of oils to coat your hair and add suppleness and sheen. However, in the case of coconut oil and other high lauric acid content oils, the cones will prevent the oil from penetrating the hair and thus can stop you from getting the benefits of this part of the oil's action.

oO thanks, i've been wondering this for a while.

SpinDance
October 25th, 2011, 02:28 PM
The only way to know if it will work on your hair is to try it. I used cones and oils for a while, but ended up finding out that my hair prefers no cones and more oils. Scientific-ish testing rules! :)

Panth
October 25th, 2011, 02:36 PM
The only way to know if it will work on your hair is to try it. I used cones and oils for a while, but ended up finding out that my hair prefers no cones and more oils. Scientific-ish testing rules! :)

Empirical data is perfectly scientific! :p

ktani
October 25th, 2011, 02:59 PM
Lauric acid can penetrate hair to the cortex during shampooing or with heat when it is not blocked by certain ingreients. It bonds with protein inside the hair.

Conditioners do not bond with or penetrate to the cortex generally. They work only on the hair surface.

Some conditioners contain ingredients that are molecularly sized to penetrate to the cortex level. However, those ingredients wash out easily.

Re your question about silicones. It is not necessarily the silicone in the shampoo that will block the lauric acid. It depends on what else is in the shampoo like waxy alcohols that build-up and will block it, and what weight the silicones are that are used.

Not all dimethicones are the same weight or thickness to block other ingredients penetrating them.

ETA: Clarification - No conditioner bonds to the cortex of the hair. Certain coatings in conditioner (most conventional ones) are charged to adhere to the cuticles, coat them and some ingredients in those types of conditioners may penetrate a bit (like hydrolized protein).

The conditioners with the sized proteins are usually treatments.

kidari
October 25th, 2011, 03:03 PM
*edit* ^^ thank you Ktani, very informative!

I use cones and proteins and oils all together with no issues. I clarify roughly once every two weeks but that's also because I occasionally use styling products also. I have done the oil shampoo with a shampoo with cones in it- I think L'oreal Everpure moisture shampoo has cones in it but it's fabulous as an oil shampoo with coconut oil.

Loreley
October 25th, 2011, 03:09 PM
In my case when I use cones and oil my dry hair after washing it doesn't seem to work too well. My hair looks oily and feels dry. I have no idea how this can happen. When I'm cone-free oiling is fantastic - no greasy look and my hair feels soft. :shrug:
Just try it and you'll see how it works for you. :)

ktani
October 25th, 2011, 03:10 PM
*edit* ^^ thank you Ktani, very informative!

I use cones and proteins and oils all together with no issues. I clarify roughly once every two weeks but that's also because I occasionally use styling products also. I have done the oil shampoo with a shampoo with cones in it- I think L'oreal Everpure moisture shampoo has cones in it but it's fabulous as an oil shampoo with coconut oil.

You are very welcome.

The shampoo I use Sunsilk Lively Blonde does not build-up and it contains dimethiconal. More than one shampoo with silicone in it worked well with oil shampoo.

GabrielleRose
October 26th, 2011, 04:22 PM
Well... actually, coconut oil does penetrate the hair. It is one of a select few oils that can (the others being babassu, cohune, murumuru, palm kernel and tucuma kernel oil). This occurs because these oils have a high lauric acid content. This is the entire basis of the oil shampoo method (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/vbjournal.php?do=article&articleid=191).

So, heidi is partly right: using cones will not affect the ability of oils to coat your hair and add suppleness and sheen. However, in the case of coconut oil and other high lauric acid content oils, the cones will prevent the oil from penetrating the hair and thus can stop you from getting the benefits of this part of the oil's action.

I knew it penetrated, but I also had a feeling it wouldn't be able to penetrate due to the cones.

So, any recommendations for cone users so that we can benefit the oil actually penetrating? Maybe just shampooing the hair and then oiling?


The only way to know if it will work on your hair is to try it. I used cones and oils for a while, but ended up finding out that my hair prefers no cones and more oils. Scientific-ish testing rules! :)

This is so true, just wanted to see what others experiences were. I tried and LOVE it, the oil makes my hair feel thicker and adds more shine. So, since your hair doesn't prefer cones what do you use, and what oils do you use?


Lauric acid can penetrate hair to the cortex during shampooing or with heat when it is not blocked by certain ingreients. It bonds with protein inside the hair.

Conditioners do not bond with or penetrate to the cortex generally. They work only on the hair surface.

Some conditioners contain ingredients that are molecularly sized to penetrate to the cortex level. However, those ingredients wash out easily.

Re your question about silicones. It is not necessarily the silicone in the shampoo that will block the lauric acid. It depends on what else is in the shampoo like waxy alcohols that build-up and will block it, and what weight the silicones are that are used.

Not all dimethicones are the same weight or thickness to block other ingredients penetrating them.

ETA: Clarification - No conditioner bonds to the cortex of the hair. Certain coatings in conditioner (most conventional ones) are charged to adhere to the cuticles, coat them and some ingredients in those types of conditioners may penetrate a bit (like hydrolized protein).

The conditioners with the sized proteins are usually treatments.

Thank you so much, I will post the ingredients of the products I'm using since I am clueless to what is in it. :p

GabrielleRose
October 26th, 2011, 04:25 PM
*edit* ^^ thank you Ktani, very informative!

I use cones and proteins and oils all together with no issues. I clarify roughly once every two weeks but that's also because I occasionally use styling products also. I have done the oil shampoo with a shampoo with cones in it- I think L'oreal Everpure moisture shampoo has cones in it but it's fabulous as an oil shampoo with coconut oil.

What is this oil shampoo?


In my case when I use cones and oil my dry hair after washing it doesn't seem to work too well. My hair looks oily and feels dry. I have no idea how this can happen. When I'm cone-free oiling is fantastic - no greasy look and my hair feels soft. :shrug:
Just try it and you'll see how it works for you. :)

It works for me, no dry hair but I think I would get potentially oily looking if I over do it. But that is great that you can fantastic results cone-free.

GabrielleRose
October 26th, 2011, 04:30 PM
Here are the ingredients for both shampoo and conditioner

Shampoo-Ingredients: WATER, SODIUM LAURETH SULFATE, SODIUM LAURYL SULFATE, COCAMIDOPROPYL BETAINE, SODIUM CHLORIDE, FRAGRANCE/PARFUM, COCAMIDE MEA, SODIUM BENZOATE, TETRASODIUM EDTA, PEG-60 ALMOND GLYCERIDES, GUAR HYDROXYPROPYLTRIMONIUM CHLORIDE, LINOLEAMIDOPROPYL PG-DIMONIUM CHLORIDE PHOSPHATE, PANTHENOL, PANTHENYL ETHYL ETHER, CITRIC ACID, METHYLCHLOROISOTHIAZOLINONE, METHYLISOTHIAZOLINONE, SODIUM CITRATE, SODIUM XYLENESULFONATE, BLUE 1 RED 33.


Conditioner-WATER, STEARYL ALCOHOL, BEHENTRIMONIUM CHLORIDE, CETYL ALCOHOL, DIMETHICONE, DISODIUM EDTA, BENZYL ALCOHOL, METHYLCHLOROISOTHIAZOLINONE, METHYLISOTHIAZOLINONE, FRAGRANCE/PARFUM, PANTHENYL ETHYL ETHER, PANTHENOL, SODIUM HYDROXIDE, BLUE 1, RED 33.

Chamomile betty
October 26th, 2011, 05:04 PM
I use cones and coconut oil. No problems here.

Lissandria
October 26th, 2011, 05:11 PM
I use cones and coconut oil. No problems here.

+1. I alternate between cones and no cones because my hair isn't picky. coconut oil absorbs very well into my hair regardless.

GabrielleRose
October 26th, 2011, 07:26 PM
I use cones and coconut oil. No problems here.

Yay lol! I am on day 2 of cones and coconut oil and so far so good.


+1. I alternate between cones and no cones because my hair isn't picky. coconut oil absorbs very well into my hair regardless.

It seems to be absorbing pretty well for me. Without cones coconut oil and my hair did not get along so well.

Raiscake
October 26th, 2011, 07:45 PM
Another conehead here and I have no problems with oiling. My hair isnt picky with cones or no cones but it sure loves oiling, so I do that no matter what condish I use.

Panth
October 27th, 2011, 02:00 AM
So, any recommendations for cone users so that we can benefit the oil actually penetrating? Maybe just shampooing the hair and then oiling?


What is this oil shampoo?

Oil shampoo is the method I linked to here:


Well... actually, coconut oil does penetrate the hair. It is one of a select few oils that can (the others being babassu, cohune, murumuru, palm kernel and tucuma kernel oil). This occurs because these oils have a high lauric acid content. This is the entire basis of the oil shampoo method (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/vbjournal.php?do=article&articleid=191).

And, from all the experiences of the people who use that method, no, if you use cones (or any other coating substance, e.g. too much glycerine, waxy plant extracts in your shampoo, etc.) the lauric acid of the coconut oil will not be able to enter the hair shaft.

A key part of the oil shampoo method is to clarify thoroughly before starting the method, and then to not use any products that could coat the hair.

However, many people (myself included) find it's an awesome method. Once you work out the right formula for your hair it works wonders. I used to be pretty heavy on the cones - S&C with Pantene. Now I don't need any conditioner - the coconut oil in the shampoo does all the work that a conditioner would normally do. Except that, unlike my old routine, my hair is softer and shinier but just as tangle-free and I don't get build-up. For me, it is perfect.

Anyway, for all the info about it, follow the link above. There's a ton of information collated on those pages.

ktani
October 27th, 2011, 12:10 PM
That shampoo as I read the ingredients should work well with coconut oil and it has so far for you.

Time will tell if does not but like I said, it looks good to me.

Good luck!

ktani
October 27th, 2011, 12:11 PM
I posted the ingredients for the split end creme in your other thread.

RitaPG
October 27th, 2011, 01:39 PM
I have been using both and my mane seems to be doing just fine ^^ It actually behaves better, my hair is kinda prone to tangles, and even coney products aren't always enough. A light coating of coconut oil does wonders for me :D


Thank you, ktani, always nice to read your informative posts :flower:

SpinDance
October 27th, 2011, 01:59 PM
GabrielleRose, you asked what I use instead of cones and what oils I use. I'm in the midst of a rather huge experimentation phase. I only wash my hair 2 or 3 times a week, and I like to try new things slowly so I can better evaluate the results.

I've tried a number of oils including olive, coconut, Shea butter, Beldaran's Oil (similar to Africa's Best without the scent), a blend that I got at Whole Foods, jojoba, sweet almond, Panacea, etc. I found that my hair likes some oils and hates others. Olive does not work for me. Others, like coconut, work quite well. I've gotten the best results so far from Panacea, but as I said, I'm not done with my testing. I'm happy to switch things up now and again and it's fun to try new things.

After reading here about the penetrating and drying/coating factor of oils, I'm sticking with oil and blends that mainly penetrate the hair and leave hair coating ones, like jojoba, for my skin, especially since jojoba will penetrate the skin.

As for cone free, I used to always rotate through several brands of S&C, and after learning about cones here on LHC I checked my ingredient lists. The S&C that I got the best results with was cone free. My results with cones weren't terrible, just not as good as I got without.

I'm currently doing mainly CO with Suave Naturals conditioners. I've tried a few other conditioners and plan to try them again under this more controlled testing. I had tried CO when I was using cones and it just didn't clean for me. I'm not against shampoo or anything like that, and hadn't actually planned to do CO testing again. However, I had to go on a business trip and ended up needing to get my hair wet/cleaned daily, and I didn't want to shampoo that often. Unlike when I'd tried it before, when I was still using cones, I got some nice results. I decided to learn more about it and have been doing the CO stuff for months now with only one shampoo wash this last Monday.

I'm not against cones as such and may do other experiments at some point using them if I feel the need. My primary goal is to learn how to help my hair be the best it can as long as I enjoy it. I really don't think I'll know what I've got until all of my pre-LHC hair has shed or been trimmed off. Almost daily braiding with bands in the same place, combs/picks with seams from the injection molding and 3.5 years of dye all contributed. I figure it will be another 3 or 4 years before I have all LHC, virgin hair.

ktani
October 27th, 2011, 02:21 PM
Thank you, ktani, always nice to read your informative posts :flower:

Thank you for saying so. I am off work sick today and sitting up (mild case of food poisoning) is about all I can manage so posting if I can be helpful is a good use of my time.

RitaPG
October 27th, 2011, 02:23 PM
Thank you for saying so. I am off work sick today and sitting up (mild case of food poisoning) is about all I can manage so posting if I can be helpful is a good use of my time.
Hoping you better soon :flowers:

ktani
October 27th, 2011, 02:31 PM
Hoping you better soon :flowers:

Thank you. I am feeling much better now. I seem to be susceptible to this kind of thing every once in a while. I did research on it in class at first when I was studying for my paralegal license, which I now have.

A restaurant can have a Pass and be fine one day. All it can take is one employee not washing their hands after using the washroom and bingo, a customer fall ill.

I cannot pinpoint what caused this as I had a meal in one place last night and desert in another.

CavySong
October 27th, 2011, 02:50 PM
What a treasure trove of wonderful information I found by following the link on oil shampoo. If any of you reading this haven't done so yet, check it out. It is well worth the time.

Ktani, have you had any experience with Neelibhringadi Ayurvedic Hair Oil? I read about it in another thread here on LHC and was wondering what you knew about it.

Also is there a link or thread or post in LHC somewhere that shows HOW one oils hair? I have seen some very interesting vids of Indian women Oiling each others hair but was looking for other input as most of those had rather fuzzy/crunchy looking ends, granted they are beyond classic length in most cases.

ktani
October 27th, 2011, 03:00 PM
What a treasure trove of wonderful information I found by following the link on oil shampoo. If any of you reading this haven't done so yet, check it out. It is well worth the time.

Ktani, have you had any experience with Neelibhringadi Ayurvedic Hair Oil? I read about it in another thread here on LHC and was wondering what you knew about it.

Sorry, no. I have used single oils. That particular oil may come up in a search here.

The quality of any oil depends on the company that makes it as well as the ingredients used. It is about manufacturing practices and the quality of the ingredients.

ETA: Here is one, http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=34344

CavySong
October 27th, 2011, 03:22 PM
I headed to the Spectrum Organics website. Apparently the only difference in their coconut oil in the beauty aisle is the plastic container with a wide top for safety and easy access in the bath. I already had some I transferred into a plastic cosmetic jar for that use so I guess I am ready to experiment the next time I need a wash.

ktani
October 27th, 2011, 03:37 PM
I headed to the Spectrum Organics website. Apparently the only difference in their coconut oil in the beauty aisle is the plastic container with a wide top for safety and easy access in the bath. I already had some I transferred into a plastic cosmetic jar for that use so I guess I am ready to experiment the next time I need a wash.

Their refined oil has been reported to work just as well as the unrefined.

It is about the percentage of lauric acid and refined coconut oil works just fine (of course there can be differences in refining).

GabrielleRose
October 27th, 2011, 03:57 PM
Another conehead here and I have no problems with oiling. My hair isnt picky with cones or no cones but it sure loves oiling, so I do that no matter what condish I use.

What oiling method do you use?

GabrielleRose
October 27th, 2011, 04:32 PM
Oil shampoo is the method I linked to here:



And, from all the experiences of the people who use that method, no, if you use cones (or any other coating substance, e.g. too much glycerine, waxy plant extracts in your shampoo, etc.) the lauric acid of the coconut oil will not be able to enter the hair shaft.

A key part of the oil shampoo method is to clarify thoroughly before starting the method, and then to not use any products that could coat the hair.

However, many people (myself included) find it's an awesome method. Once you work out the right formula for your hair it works wonders. I used to be pretty heavy on the cones - S&C with Pantene. Now I don't need any conditioner - the coconut oil in the shampoo does all the work that a conditioner would normally do. Except that, unlike my old routine, my hair is softer and shinier but just as tangle-free and I don't get build-up. For me, it is perfect.

Anyway, for all the info about it, follow the link above. There's a ton of information collated on those pages.

Sorry I missed the link but thanks for pointing it out to me again. I think I just may try this method, but is there a certain shampoo I should be using? Do I stop the use of the conditioner? Can I still use coconut oil as a leave in?


That shampoo as I read the ingredients should work well with coconut oil and it has so far for you.

Time will tell if does not but like I said, it looks good to me.

Good luck!

So, I can put coconut oil into the shampoo I am using now?


I posted the ingredients for the split end creme in your other thread.

Thank you so much for finding the ingredients for me. Do you think any of those ingredients can be somewhat beneficial for the hair?

GabrielleRose
October 27th, 2011, 04:41 PM
I have been using both and my mane seems to be doing just fine ^^ It actually behaves better, my hair is kinda prone to tangles, and even coney products aren't always enough. A light coating of coconut oil does wonders for me :D


Thank you, ktani, always nice to read your informative posts :flower:

What cone products do you use? My hair is very prone to tangles. :( I'm glad coconut oil helps for yours. They help along with my cone products but I think I used a little too much oil yesterday and my blonette hair ended up looking dull and very dark. :(


GabrielleRose, you asked what I use instead of cones and what oils I use. I'm in the midst of a rather huge experimentation phase. I only wash my hair 2 or 3 times a week, and I like to try new things slowly so I can better evaluate the results.

I've tried a number of oils including olive, coconut, Shea butter, Beldaran's Oil (similar to Africa's Best without the scent), a blend that I got at Whole Foods, jojoba, sweet almond, Panacea, etc. I found that my hair likes some oils and hates others. Olive does not work for me. Others, like coconut, work quite well. I've gotten the best results so far from Panacea, but as I said, I'm not done with my testing. I'm happy to switch things up now and again and it's fun to try new things.

After reading here about the penetrating and drying/coating factor of oils, I'm sticking with oil and blends that mainly penetrate the hair and leave hair coating ones, like jojoba, for my skin, especially since jojoba will penetrate the skin.

As for cone free, I used to always rotate through several brands of S&C, and after learning about cones here on LHC I checked my ingredient lists. The S&C that I got the best results with was cone free. My results with cones weren't terrible, just not as good as I got without.

I'm currently doing mainly CO with Suave Naturals conditioners. I've tried a few other conditioners and plan to try them again under this more controlled testing. I had tried CO when I was using cones and it just didn't clean for me. I'm not against shampoo or anything like that, and hadn't actually planned to do CO testing again. However, I had to go on a business trip and ended up needing to get my hair wet/cleaned daily, and I didn't want to shampoo that often. Unlike when I'd tried it before, when I was still using cones, I got some nice results. I decided to learn more about it and have been doing the CO stuff for months now with only one shampoo wash this last Monday.

I'm not against cones as such and may do other experiments at some point using them if I feel the need. My primary goal is to learn how to help my hair be the best it can as long as I enjoy it. I really don't think I'll know what I've got until all of my pre-LHC hair has shed or been trimmed off. Almost daily braiding with bands in the same place, combs/picks with seams from the injection molding and 3.5 years of dye all contributed. I figure it will be another 3 or 4 years before I have all LHC, virgin hair.

Wow, I really love all the experimentation that you are doing. I just don't have the money to be experimenting as much any more as I am a full time student and jobless. But I seriously want to make my hair happy. I am wondering though, how does one know if their hair likes cones or not?


Thank you for saying so. I am off work sick today and sitting up (mild case of food poisoning) is about all I can manage so posting if I can be helpful is a good use of my time.

I hope you are feeling much better ktani, and how rude of me not to say thank you to all you wonderful LHCers for helping me out with my many questions. THANK YOU ALL!!!

ktani
October 27th, 2011, 06:33 PM
I hope you are feeling much better ktani, and how rude of me not to say thank you to all you wonderful LHCers for helping me out with my many questions. THANK YOU ALL!!!

I am feeling much better and you are very welcome for my part in replying. I do not think it rude when someone does not reply.

People are here at different times. If they make a point of not replying at all I choose to reply to different member posts when I have time.

RitaPG
October 27th, 2011, 06:58 PM
What cone products do you use? My hair is very prone to tangles. :( I'm glad coconut oil helps for yours. They help along with my cone products but I think I used a little too much oil yesterday and my blonette hair ended up looking dull and very dark. :(

Lately I have been using a Pantene condish, and it works wonderfully for me. But it is quite heavy so I don't use it all the time.
I also have Gliss Asia Straight and use it not only on the length but also for CO washing, since it is not as heavy and has some lighter, water soluble cone. It also has protein, which my hair loves.
Lately I also tried Elvive Pure Gloss with protein + pearl (it is also known as ElsÚve in other countries) and it works wonderfully as well. It's not heavy at all, but if I leave it on long enough it makes my hair light, soft and free of tangles ^^

As for the oilings, it's okay to overdo it sometimes, it's happened to me before too. The best thing you can do is braid it and leave it on overnight, usually by the next morning your hair will have absorbed it. And if it didn't, re-braid it and leave it like that. Not only your braid will look sleek and shiny, your hair will feel really soft after you wash it :)
Next time go by drops; start by rubbing two drops of coconut oil on your palms and work them through your hair, focusing on the ends. That should be more than enough. If after a couple hours your hair still feels dry and tangley, put two more drops on your palms and run them through your hair again. Usually people get better results when doing this after washing, while hair is still damp.

ktani
October 27th, 2011, 07:07 PM
Coconut oil and other oils too used on conditioned hair can cause a "crunchy" effect. Used on clarified hair on its own, coconut oil does not do that.

If your shampoo contains silicone and does not build-up you can get extra slip from that.

When I experimented with oil shampoo more extensively, the shampoo I use with one cone and the coconut oil used in it provided fantastic slip. The shampoo I used and still use is Sunsilk Lively Blonde. It works extremely well with catnip.

ETA: Coconut oil does not do well used over certain coatings. Used over some conditioners it can work very well, it just cannot penetrate hair.

Panth
October 28th, 2011, 01:41 AM
Sorry I missed the link but thanks for pointing it out to me again. I think I just may try this method, but is there a certain shampoo I should be using? Do I stop the use of the conditioner? Can I still use coconut oil as a leave in?

For the 'classic' oil shampoo, basically just read all the info that I linked. It is a somewhat daunting amount of information. Basically, the key bits are 8 (Optimal Results Shampoos), 10 (Easy as 1, 2, 3 - i.e. the actual method) and 11 (Clarifying Options). That should be enough to start you on your way. It will eventually be necessary to read the sections about Saturation as otherwise you may think the method is beginning to stop working when it isn't.

A lot of people started out with using oil shampoo to wash with and then an additional conditioner or leave-in to act as a conditioner (note - whatever this product is, it must not coat the hair and block the lauric acid of the oil shampoo from working). As the levels of lauric acid in their hairs' cortex built up they needed less and less additional product and usually ended up only needing the oil shampoo.

Personally, I have reasonably undamaged hair (no dye, no bleach, no heat even before I got here) so I either needed less to build up as my hair needed less 'patching' or maybe I retained the oil better without losing so much with each wash. Also, I decided to adjust up rather than adjust down - so, start with a mix that had obviously too much oil and adjust the shampoo levels up instead of starting with a mix with too much shampoo and adjusting the shampoo levels down. That was fine for me at the time as I didn't need to go out or be presentable, so a mistake that resulted in an oil slick didn't matter. Anywho, the point is I never used a conditioner or any extra products (other than a vinegar rinse) from day one of the method and I was perfectly fine.

As for coconut oil as a leave in, well, you're perfectly ok to keep using it as well as the oil shampoo method. However, I suspect (after a bit, at least) that you'll no longer need it - the oil shampoo bit will be all you'll need (other than maybe a vinegar rinse).



So, I can put coconut oil into the shampoo I am using now?


Since ktani OKed it, you can use your current shampoo to experiment with the oil shampoo method. However, if it doesn't work at first, remember you need to experiment to find the right ratio of oil to shampoo for you (and that this may change due to saturation). If it still doesn't work, pick a shampoo off the 'Optimal Results Shampoos' list and try that instead.

SpinDance
October 31st, 2011, 02:59 PM
CavySong, you asked about how to oil. Here (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/vbjournal.php?do=article&articleid=71)is a great article.

CavySong
November 1st, 2011, 04:57 AM
Thank you, spindance, the link was very helpful. I will echo what was said in the link about oil: a little goes a LONG way. Just a sheen on the palms is more than sufficient for post-wash leave-in.
I have a one ounce cosmetic travel pot with solid coconut oil that I have used for the better part of last month for dry skin, lip balm, shampoo additive, as well as oiling and I am not even a third through it.

GabrielleRose
November 1st, 2011, 01:36 PM
I am feeling much better and you are very welcome for my part in replying. I do not think it rude when someone does not reply.

People are here at different times. If they make a point of not replying at all I choose to reply to different member posts when I have time.

I am so glad you are feeling much better, and once again thank you for all the great information.


Lately I have been using a Pantene condish, and it works wonderfully for me. But it is quite heavy so I don't use it all the time.
I also have Gliss Asia Straight and use it not only on the length but also for CO washing, since it is not as heavy and has some lighter, water soluble cone. It also has protein, which my hair loves.
Lately I also tried Elvive Pure Gloss with protein + pearl (it is also known as ElsÚve in other countries) and it works wonderfully as well. It's not heavy at all, but if I leave it on long enough it makes my hair light, soft and free of tangles ^^

As for the oilings, it's okay to overdo it sometimes, it's happened to me before too. The best thing you can do is braid it and leave it on overnight, usually by the next morning your hair will have absorbed it. And if it didn't, re-braid it and leave it like that. Not only your braid will look sleek and shiny, your hair will feel really soft after you wash it :)
Next time go by drops; start by rubbing two drops of coconut oil on your palms and work them through your hair, focusing on the ends. That should be more than enough. If after a couple hours your hair still feels dry and tangley, put two more drops on your palms and run them through your hair again. Usually people get better results when doing this after washing, while hair is still damp.

I can see Pantene being quite heavy. I ended up returning it because my hair started looking really dull and tangled up even more than usual. I am now COing with Tame, and some VO5 scents as well and so far so good.

I haven't tried oiling again yet, because I am experimenting with CO right now, and I've only CO washed for about 4 days now but I will be incorporating coconut oil very soon.

Thanks for the tips on oiling.


Coconut oil and other oils too used on conditioned hair can cause a "crunchy" effect. Used on clarified hair on its own, coconut oil does not do that.

If your shampoo contains silicone and does not build-up you can get extra slip from that.

When I experimented with oil shampoo more extensively, the shampoo I use with one cone and the coconut oil used in it provided fantastic slip. The shampoo I used and still use is Sunsilk Lively Blonde. It works extremely well with catnip.

ETA: Coconut oil does not do well used over certain coatings. Used over some conditioners it can work very well, it just cannot penetrate hair.

Well for now I am giving up shampoo and cones to try out CO washing, and so far so good but if it ends up not working out I will definitely be willing to try out the oil shampoo method.

Do you think the coconut oil will be able to penetrate over VO5 conditioners?


For the 'classic' oil shampoo, basically just read all the info that I linked. It is a somewhat daunting amount of information. Basically, the key bits are 8 (Optimal Results Shampoos), 10 (Easy as 1, 2, 3 - i.e. the actual method) and 11 (Clarifying Options). That should be enough to start you on your way. It will eventually be necessary to read the sections about Saturation as otherwise you may think the method is beginning to stop working when it isn't.

A lot of people started out with using oil shampoo to wash with and then an additional conditioner or leave-in to act as a conditioner (note - whatever this product is, it must not coat the hair and block the lauric acid of the oil shampoo from working). As the levels of lauric acid in their hairs' cortex built up they needed less and less additional product and usually ended up only needing the oil shampoo.

Personally, I have reasonably undamaged hair (no dye, no bleach, no heat even before I got here) so I either needed less to build up as my hair needed less 'patching' or maybe I retained the oil better without losing so much with each wash. Also, I decided to adjust up rather than adjust down - so, start with a mix that had obviously too much oil and adjust the shampoo levels up instead of starting with a mix with too much shampoo and adjusting the shampoo levels down. That was fine for me at the time as I didn't need to go out or be presentable, so a mistake that resulted in an oil slick didn't matter. Anywho, the point is I never used a conditioner or any extra products (other than a vinegar rinse) from day one of the method and I was perfectly fine.

As for coconut oil as a leave in, well, you're perfectly ok to keep using it as well as the oil shampoo method. However, I suspect (after a bit, at least) that you'll no longer need it - the oil shampoo bit will be all you'll need (other than maybe a vinegar rinse).



Since ktani OKed it, you can use your current shampoo to experiment with the oil shampoo method. However, if it doesn't work at first, remember you need to experiment to find the right ratio of oil to shampoo for you (and that this may change due to saturation). If it still doesn't work, pick a shampoo off the 'Optimal Results Shampoos' list and try that instead.

Thank you so much for the info.

Right now I am trying CO, but I will try the oil shampoo method if things don't work out.

But the oil shampoo method does sound rather tempting, so I will continue to keep it in mind and look over the article's information. I also will most likely try one of the optimal shampoos from the list as I have taken back the Pantene shampoo I was using along with the conditioner as well.

ktani
November 1st, 2011, 02:13 PM
I am so glad you are feeling much better, and once again thank you for all the great information.

You are very welcome.

Well for now I am giving up shampoo and cones to try out CO washing, and so far so good but if it ends up not working out I will definitely be willing to try out the oil shampoo method.

Do you think the coconut oil will be able to penetrate over VO5 conditioners?

On clarified hair, if a minimal amount of the conditioner is used after the oil shampoo, a very small amount of the oil may penetrate the hair at first. As the conditioners build-up and that happens fairly quickly, no.

If you conditioner only wash and then try the oil shampoo, as you plan to do if conditioner only washing does not work out, clarify your hair well first.

GabrielleRose
November 2nd, 2011, 01:24 PM
On clarified hair, if a minimal amount of the conditioner is used after the oil shampoo, a very small amount of the oil may penetrate the hair at first. As the conditioners build-up and that happens fairly quickly, no.

If you conditioner only wash and then try the oil shampoo, as you plan to do if conditioner only washing does not work out, clarify your hair well first.

I will clarify.

I think I am running into problems with COing as the length of my hair is suffering from lank looking string locks. :(

So, you may be hearing a lot more questions on the oil method. Sorry.

ktani
November 2nd, 2011, 03:30 PM
I will clarify.

I think I am running into problems with COing as the length of my hair is suffering from lank looking string locks. :(

So, you may be hearing a lot more questions on the oil method. Sorry.

No worries!

GabrielleRose
November 2nd, 2011, 04:04 PM
No worries!

So, should I continue to ask you questions here or just pm you?

ktani
November 2nd, 2011, 06:05 PM
So, should I continue to ask you questions here or just pm you?

Either is fine with me.