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Annibelle
October 22nd, 2011, 07:24 PM
When I joined in May, I asked if I should chop my WL hair. Most said yes-- to anywhere from APL to just a couple of inches. I decided to trim an inch or so, stop cones, and everyone agreed that it looked MUCH better. Well, since then, I've gone to CO washing, and my hair does look better than it has in years... but it still has a lot of taper. I've been maintaining at WL since I joined, and my hemline doesn't seem to be getting any thicker. :o See for yourself:

Upon joining LHC:

http://i1188.photobucket.com/albums/z414/4nnibelle/P5143627.jpg

After that first trim:

http://i1188.photobucket.com/albums/z414/4nnibelle/P5163643.jpg

One month later... looking worse...:

http://i1188.photobucket.com/albums/z414/4nnibelle/Image06272011202741-1.jpg

I missed a photo in July, so here's August, two months later:

http://i1188.photobucket.com/albums/z414/4nnibelle/Image08062011222406.jpg

Not only is there a lot of taper, but it's lop-sided. :(

I accidentally skipped another monthly photo, so here's two months after the last one. At this point, I began using shampoo weekly because I had a huge shed all summer, and shampoo stopped that:

http://i1188.photobucket.com/albums/z414/4nnibelle/Image10122011093456-1.jpg

It still looks bad... I'm trimming it about 1/2 inch monthly (my entire monthly growth), but there's still so much taper. It doesn't look quite so bad when I wear black, though. Here's an image taken that same morning:

http://i1188.photobucket.com/albums/z414/4nnibelle/Image10122011100221-2-1.jpg

But I'm at a loss. Unless I'm wearing black, which I don't do often, I feel humiliated to have my hair down, even if I'm the only one around. Would you chop it? If so, how much? Do I really have an alternative? And do you actually see much of a difference in my hair over the months? I don't... it seems like the same hairs are growing every month, and they're getting trimmed, but the rest are staying the same length. I need advice! :flower: Thank you all in advance for being so helpful.

Also, please don't be afraid to hurt my feelings... I would rather hear the truth from my LHC friends than walk around with embarrassing taper, having everyone think of how badly my hair needs a cut. :o

Roscata
October 22nd, 2011, 07:28 PM
Personally I think the thickness is moving down your length. It looks better and better each month. :D

xoxophelia
October 22nd, 2011, 07:31 PM
It does look like it is getting better. Do you have a recent picture without the black?

The one before that did look noticably better. I am kind of wondering if there is any chance you have an underlying medical condition though. Has that been ruled out?

It is kind of hard to tell looking at the most recent photo if it needs to be cut. From the one before that though, I would go for maybe 2-3" off personally.

Deborah
October 22nd, 2011, 07:33 PM
If it were me, I would cut back to BSL. It looks as though most of your hair stops there, so that would give you much nicer and thicker ends. Good luck with whatever you decide to do. :)

els23
October 22nd, 2011, 07:34 PM
I'm pretty new here and I don't know what your hair routine was like before you joined but maybe it has something to do with damage from hair higher up growing out and breaking off? If that makes any sense. Anyway, I don't think it looks that bad, but if you don't feel confident wearing your hair down and you think you would feel better after trimming it you should go for it. Maybe start with a little trim and see how it goes?

curlytiff27
October 22nd, 2011, 07:43 PM
Have you been co washing all summer? For me stretching washes, coing and oiling my scalp cause massive amounts if shedding. I'm healthy, no need for blood work because when I go back to my normal everyother day washes no oil or anything, my shed is below normal. I think it does look like your is getting better! Like you I am thjnking of chopping some to thicken up my hemline from the shed I've had. Between severe emotional and post partum, its been a hecktic year. I envy you for being at waist :)

BlazingHeart
October 22nd, 2011, 07:44 PM
I would go back to a little below bsl. In the second to last image, if you look at the longest lock on the right, I would cut to where that last wave at the bottom is the farthest to the right, if that makes sense. But I choose hem over length generally, for what that is worth.

Edited to add - your thickness does seem to be slowly growing down.

danacc
October 22nd, 2011, 07:45 PM
I see improvement, too. I think it looks fine, but I like the look of fairytale ends.

Whether or not to cut it more drastically depends on your own opinion about fairytale ends, and on your hair goal. If you want it waist-length or longer, I recommend continuing to maintain at waist. It will gradually thicken. If you cut shorter, it will taper again as it grows longer.

bobbsi
October 22nd, 2011, 07:48 PM
Seems like it's thinkening up, but veeery slowly.
I'd probably cut it back to Midback if you feel that bad...

kidari
October 22nd, 2011, 07:50 PM
If it were me, I would cut back to BSL. It looks as though most of your hair stops there, so that would give you much nicer and thicker ends. Good luck with whatever you decide to do. :)


I agree. Personally BSL is long to me but it may feel uncomfortably short to someone else. However, the thickness is definitely traveling down your length. You could probably cut 1 or 2 inches and maintain every month also.

Annibelle
October 22nd, 2011, 07:53 PM
It does look like it is getting better. Do you have a recent picture without the black?

The one before that did look noticably better. I am kind of wondering if there is any chance you have an underlying medical condition though. Has that been ruled out?

It is kind of hard to tell looking at the most recent photo if it needs to be cut. From the one before that though, I would go for maybe 2-3" off personally.

The photo right before the black shirt one is from the same day, and each photo is from about two weeks ago. I'll take another photo tonight once my hair dries... but I don't think there will be much of a difference. :(

I'm starting to wonder about the medical condition, though... you see, it's taken me five years to get from APL to WL. :o And I've been at WL for about two years... maybe even three... I think I might be anemic, because I have passed out before from not eating on time (I've found that I have to eat every two hours).

I've changed my lifestyle a lot in the last two months, though. I've begun exercising lightly three times a week (completely sedentary before), taking a multivitamin daily (never had before), and consuming more protein (had iii, shiny, hip hair before going veg 8 years ago-- but I thought the hair change was just hormones since I was a teenager. Maybe it was, but I'll see I guess. Still veg, but eating more balanced meals now). I've also begun drinking water regularly, which I didn't do before. I hope all of these things help my hair. They've begun helping the rest of my body. I've lost extra weight and I feel stronger, and my skin is clearer.

I hope this isn't a more severe medical condition, though. :(


If it were me, I would cut back to BSL. It looks as though most of your hair stops there, so that would give you much nicer and thicker ends. Good luck with whatever you decide to do. :)


That's what my brain has been telling me to do... but my hair is so thin that I won't be able to do any sort of bun at BSL, I think... but I think you're right...


I'm pretty new here and I don't know what your hair routine was like before you joined but maybe it has something to do with damage from hair higher up growing out and breaking off? If that makes any sense. Anyway, I don't think it looks that bad, but if you don't feel confident wearing your hair down and you think you would feel better after trimming it you should go for it. Maybe start with a little trim and see how it goes?

All of my hair is virgin (no heat, dye, chemicals, etc.), and I haven't noticed any broken hairs. The hairs I shed all have the little plug thing from the scalp, and I have very very few split ends. If nothing else, I'll keep trimming each month and hope for the best. :)

longhairedwolf
October 22nd, 2011, 07:58 PM
Hi Annibelle, I would definitely cut it, not because it looks terrible, but because you say that you feel "humiliated" wearing it down. Hair should never make you feel like that. If you really don't like the ends, I'd say cut bask to BSL. Your ends will be nice and thick, and hopefully you'll feel proud of your hair. Good luck with your decision.

lizdini
October 22nd, 2011, 07:59 PM
I think it looks pretty good, actually. Your hemline does look a little thicker. If you cut back to around apl it would look a little thicker, but I don't think you need to do it or anything.

jojo
October 22nd, 2011, 08:01 PM
I think you should maintain your length at waist for the time being, I can see your thickness definitely moving down into your length. i think if you did this for a year, you would be happier with your hemline.

Mine gets thinner too once it reaches waist, so I feel your pain, we are the worst critics, but I don't think your hair looks as bad as you think.

lw8666
October 22nd, 2011, 08:03 PM
I see improvement. Whatever you are doing, (monthly trimming) I feel you should keep doing it. I feel that within another year, it will look how you want it to look. Your hair is very long, so it will take time for the thickness to catch up.

Stay positive. Your hair is looking good.

girlcat36
October 22nd, 2011, 08:11 PM
Have you seen this thread?
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=79937&page=5

There are some pics of similar hemlines in that thread, but longer.
If it were me, I wouldn't cut it. But if you are set on having a blunt hemline, maybe BSL would be a good goal for you.
I feel your pain, though; my hair just won't thicken up past APL. It's frustrating. My hair only looks good against a black shirt, too.

FYI--my daughter was vegan for 4 years, and suffered a lot of hairloss. After adding fish and dairy back into her diet, a year later she has regained all her old thickness.

Madora
October 22nd, 2011, 08:13 PM
I'd trim off 3 inches and then baby it well for the next several months, doing S and D regularly.

Wearing your hair up will help protect the delicate ends.

For your well being, check with your doctor and make sure everything is ok with your blood factors and thyroid. A complete blood panel would be a good idea.

Good luck!

Annibelle
October 22nd, 2011, 08:18 PM
Thank you for the advice, everyone! And for the link, girlcat-- I'll check it out. :) I think that, until I decide for sure what to do, I'll learn more updos... so far, I can do the lazy wrap bun and... that's it. :(

I'm really glad there's a visible difference, no matter how small. I was afraid that my eyes were deceiving me and that I've gained nothing since May.

spidermom
October 22nd, 2011, 08:23 PM
I don't see the improvement that everybody else is talking about. I'm sorry to say that, but you asked for honest feedback, and this is what I see (I know I could be wrong). Since you feel awful about your ends, what I would suggest is getting it trimmed back about 3-4 inches, and then start a regular cycle of trimming - maybe 1/2 inch off every 3-4 months. See if your ends stay on the thicker side as your hair gets longer. Trimming helps to hold back faster-growing hairs so that slower-growing hairs can catch up.

It could be that the majority of your hairs have a slow or short growing cycle (or both), and only a small percentage of hairs grow fast enough and/or long enough to get longer than BSL. Time will tell.

MinderMutsig
October 22nd, 2011, 08:27 PM
I think this:


Personally I think the thickness is moving down your length. It looks better and better each month. :D

And this:


Hi Annibelle, I would definitely cut it, not because it looks terrible, but because you say that you feel "humiliated" wearing it down. Hair should never make you feel like that. If you really don't like the ends, I'd say cut bask to BSL. Your ends will be nice and thick, and hopefully you'll feel proud of your hair. Good luck with your decision.

I would probably cut back to midback and then see how you feel and if you want to cut to BSL or if you feel better about your hair is it is at MBL.

I definitely wouldn't want to walk around with hair that made me unhappy for months while waiting for the thickness to travel further.

It's just not worth it sweety. You are taking good care of it and spending time and energy on it and it is definitely working but you are still miserable about it. I say cut it back to where you feel it looks good so you can enjoy it again and then grow onwards.

Annibelle
October 22nd, 2011, 08:27 PM
I don't see the improvement that everybody else is talking about. I'm sorry to say that, but you asked for honest feedback, and this is what I see (I know I could be wrong). Since you feel awful about your ends, what I would suggest is getting it trimmed back about 3-4 inches, and then start a regular cycle of trimming - maybe 1/2 inch off every 3-4 months. See if your ends stay on the thicker side as your hair gets longer. Trimming helps to hold back faster-growing hairs so that slower-growing hairs can catch up.

It could be that the majority of your hairs have a slow or short growing cycle (or both), and only a small percentage of hairs grow fast enough and/or long enough to get longer than BSL. Time will tell.

Thank you for your honest feedback, spidermom. :flower: I'm starting to think WL might be my terminal, and that maybe BSL is the longest I can go without a lot of taper. I had hip-length when I was younger, BUT I'm not sure if I've gotten taller since then. (I was 14 when I cut it. It was also iii, not the thin side of ii... bummer.) Well, no matter what I do with cutting, I'm gonna keep eating healthier and see if it helps. :)

irishlady
October 22nd, 2011, 08:39 PM
I would just keep maintaining it where it is and trim about half a centimeter or so a month. It is improving from what I can see and I think it looks lovely!

JessiBird89
October 22nd, 2011, 08:54 PM
First of all, well done. I'm trying to grow my 'almost BSL' fine hair to waist and I know how difficult and painfully slow it is!

You have BEAUTIFUL hair, I would not feel embarrassed to wear it down but I know it's hard to see it from other people's point of view.

However, If it is bothering you so much I would probably do something about it. Maybe cut a whole inch off and then continue to maintain and also continue the routine you have because I do see a gradual improvement.

Also, If you are concerned that it could be a medical issue (thyroid, lack of nutrients, etc.) I would get some blood work done just to put my mind at ease :)

Mesmerise
October 22nd, 2011, 08:56 PM
I WANTED to keep trimming my hair regularly to get rid of taper, but like you I was embarrassed to wear my hair down. Quite honestly, I LIKE being able to wear my hair down, so this was not a good situation!

What I did was cut 2" off in both July and August, for a total of 4". I've since had it trimmed a wee bit more since then (I think I'd already cut off about 1/2" at the start of July too), so all up I think I'd have cut off about 5" (although not at once).

I STILL have taper (due to hair loss that's growing back), but my ends do look a LOT better. It certainly looks better when I wear darker colours though :rolleyes:.

I think it's almost a better idea to just bite the bullet and cut it back to where the worst of the taper starts, and just see how it goes from there.

Once upon a time, I would have recommended gradual trimming (in fact, I probably did in your earlier thread :o) but now I'm leaning towards going for a bigger chop.

Honestly, the actual volume of hair I cut off when I trimmed was very very small... there was just, not a lot of hair there at all!!

maborosi
October 22nd, 2011, 08:56 PM
I think your hair does look like it's thickening up at the hemline. Maybe cut it back a bit to BSL, if you're comfortable with that?

~maborosi~

misspurdy06
October 22nd, 2011, 09:09 PM
If you curl it the ends will look much prettier. So you can keep the length till it grows in.

lacefrost
October 22nd, 2011, 09:22 PM
I say cut to MBL. That way it's not a drastic change from WL and you have the option to go to BSL. The reason I say cut it is because you feel humiliated. You should never feel humiliated about your hair. You should always feel good especially since you work so hard on it. Cut to MBL, baby it, and then see where you are in a few months.

Also, please please please go to a doctor. Your hair could be trying to tell you something.

aahavaa
October 22nd, 2011, 09:33 PM
Annibelle I think your hair is beautiful and it does seem very healthy until it gets to the taper. I'm thinking that maybe the taper wouldn't be so obvious if your hair was kind of in a v shape but being blunt it becomes more obvious.
I have seen a similiar kind of thinning past BSL in iron deficiency and since you mentioned it already maybe it is worth getting your iron and B12 checked. Going veggie may mean your getting less of both these nutrients and if your body has difficulty absorbing any of them your hair may be the first place to show low levels.
All in all you have beautiful hair and I'd say don't cut too much as I'm sure with all the steps you're taking it'll be fuller in a few months.

Sundial
October 22nd, 2011, 10:32 PM
Actually I can tell that your hemline is thickening up. If you compare your first photo (taken when you first joined LHC) with your last photo, the latest photo definitely shows a thicker hemline at the same length! So like what other posters have pointed out, your thickness is traveling downwards already.

If you like your hair at waist length, you can probably maintain it by trimming your monthly growth if you prefer thickness over length. If you still want to grow your hair actively, then you can probably trim half or less of your monthly growth. Doing it the first way will probably thicken up your hemline twice as quickly but you will be sacrificing length in the process. Nonetheless, you can always stop trimming when you feel that your hemline as thickened up enough.

Yozhik
October 22nd, 2011, 10:40 PM
I think your hair looks fine. :flower:

If you're self-conscious enough about the taper not to want to wear it down, though, and you do want to wear it down, I'd suggest a trim, either a moderate or a larger one, whichever you decide is better.


That's what my brain has been telling me to do... but my hair is so thin that I won't be able to do any sort of bun at BSL, I think... but I think you're right...

As for this, actually, with thinner hair you should be able to do more updos at a shorter length than thicker-haired people. :flower:
You said that you don't know many buns, well I'd go on youtube and start practicing, because there are many beautiful updos out there, and I began to enjoy my long hair a lot more when I could experiment with various updos. :)

Yame
October 22nd, 2011, 10:42 PM
I'd say trim 1-3 inches, then keep up with more regular trims. I do think your ends are slowly thickening up, so there is hope!

If it were me, I'd also wear it up more often to keep myself from paying too much attention to it, and I'd stop taking regular progress pictures, and follow up with it maybe after 4 months.

Lostsoule77
October 22nd, 2011, 11:44 PM
In your photo's I definitely see your thickness moving down the length more in each picture. If it were me I'd keep maintaining at waist and put my hair up the majority of the time so the thinner ends didn't bother me. Both this site and youtube are great for learning updos. You sound like it really bothers you though. If you want to wear your hair down more than up than you should probably trim about 3 inches and maintain there until your thickness catches up. Not because it looks like it needs it. ONLY because you say you are so unhappy with it and if that is the case then the extra length isn't worth it. :)

Melisande
October 23rd, 2011, 12:17 AM
Your hair looks fine IMO. I would not cut more than a little trim and continue trimming monthly. If you have the length, you can more easily put the hair up and forget it. While your hair is in an updo, you can oil the ends or apply Fox' conditioning cream or whatever makes your hair feel good. This helps to avoid further breaking off.

Once you cut your hair and it's shorter and thicker and you like it more, you'll wear it open more often, and if it's fragile (for example, if the hair around your waist grew out of your scalp when you were lacking iron or vitamin B12...), it will break and you will lose length.

I see fairytale ends like yours as "protective layer" for the hair higher up. I wouldn't cut it in one chop, but that's just me ;-) I have no problem keeping my hair in an updo daily, I like the look, and inside the bun my hair continues to grow.

I would advise you to continue taking your multivitamin, and I would also explore MSM. I had very very good success with it. Of course, this won't replace the visit to a doctor!

I recommend warmly application of jojoba oil with essential oils. there is a whole thread about the recommended oils somewhere hidden in the depths of LHC. If I have the time, I'll look for it. Go easy on the massage part, some people get more shedding from it. I personally believe that post-massage sheds consist of hairs that wanted to shed anyway and instead of raining down all day long, they simply leave all at once. But the essential oils make sure that your hair growth is as plentiful and healthy as your genes and health allow.

Dilute your shampoo, if you want to - I find it made my hair much healthier. And keep treating it well like you do now.

I think a braided bun will look very very lovely. Fairytales give a beautifully varied bun. If you feel your bun is too thin, braid in a silk scarf - if you bun such a braid, the result is really beautiful.

I like the look of your hair. It hugs your figure very nicely.

If you trim, trim in a U shape or V shape. It will look very nice on your hair.

xoxophelia
October 23rd, 2011, 01:39 AM
If you used to have thick hair to your hips, yes I definitely think this is medical in some way. I was sick for about 7 months from mono on top of being veg and I got a "medical haircut". As in, my hair shrunk about half a foot in length. Let me pull up two photos for you to compare:

This was my hair after. Before, it did have some layers but it was slightly above waist length. Even with layers it was thick. I lost my photos from that time though in a computer crash.. >< .. notice how thin and uneven it looks. I did not have a botched haircut.

http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/picture.php?albumid=4575&pictureid=89662

My thickness is still growing out but you can see where it is now:
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/picture.php?albumid=4575&pictureid=116421

What I would suggest is to get some blood work done. Make sure your iron and hormones are all level. You also need to get more protein in your diet. After being so sick and going through all of that I personally decided being vegetarian was no longer for me. You could consider being pescovegetarian or really look into your protein sources and how many grams you get as well as take B12.

Avital88
October 23rd, 2011, 04:01 AM
just maintain microtrimming! no mayor chops, i see your thickness slowly growing down too, maybe try some cassia too for putting some weight on your ends. How did your ends end up like this? i have the same with my hair and it it from hairdye..i decided not to cut it until 2012 and then see from then if there is improvement.

oktobergoud
October 23rd, 2011, 05:03 AM
I think it does look much better now and the ends look fuller! But, I would personally chop it off to BSL, because the ends are still really thin. I wouldn't like that look, so I'd cut it. But it's all up to you, of course :)

julliams
October 23rd, 2011, 05:17 AM
I can see definite improvement each month. The thickness is moving down the length.

If you would rather keep your length, I would cut up to an inch per month until it's all thickened up. If you don't care about the length and would prefer a thicker hemline, I would cut back to BSL.

If it were me, I think I would cut an inch per month because I would want to keep my length for updos etc.

mrs_coffee
October 23rd, 2011, 05:34 AM
If it was me I would cut to wherever would make you feel better about it. But I am someone who doesn't mind cutting/trimming and losing length if it improves how I feel about my hair.

lapushka
October 23rd, 2011, 09:27 AM
The thickness is moving down! The only thing is, it takes time! Hair does not grow that fast. Your starting shots are from May this year. I'd give it at least a year. Keep trimming and maintain WL!

blondie9912
October 23rd, 2011, 10:43 AM
It's hard to tell :shrug:
Your hemline has definitely improved, but your hair looks quite different in all the photos. From the second photo, I would say to cut it to BSL, the third: just below APL, fourth, just below BSL, and same with the fifth. The last photo, however, of you in black, makes your hair look lovely! I'd say start with a 2inch cut and go from there, perhaps re-evaluating to see if you need to cut more off :) Good luck!

Annibelle
October 23rd, 2011, 11:01 AM
Your hemline has definitely improved, but your hair looks quite different in all the photos. From the second photo, I would say to cut it to BSL, the third: just below APL, fourth, just below BSL, and same with the fifth.

You're right about my hair looking different in each photo... I'm really not sure why that is. Each is the morning after a wash, and hasn't been bunned, braided, or anything like that. But it's weird how some months, there seems to be a regression in thickness length. :(

Maktub
October 23rd, 2011, 11:18 AM
I agree with spidermom and lacefrost. You hair is not worst, but I don't see major improvement either.

I would get a big trimm, around BSL, then smaller trimms on a regular basis. And some blood tests would probably be a wise thing to do.

How's your nutrition in general ?

Hope it's not harsh. I still think you are very beautiful from your profile pictures :flower:

Annibelle
October 23rd, 2011, 11:28 AM
I agree with spidermom and lacefrost. You hair is not worst, but I don't see major improvement either.

I would get a big trimm, around BSL, then smaller trimms on a regular basis. And some blood tests would probably be a wise thing to do.

How's your nutrition in general ?

Hope it's not harsh. I still think you are very beautiful from your profile pictures :flower:

You're not being harsh at all; you're being honest, which is exactly what I wanted. :flower: And thank you for your compliment. :)

My nutrition has improved over the last couple of months, I'd say. I'm still trying to make it better, though. I'm going to look into getting a blood test this week. Now that other people have suspected health issues, I feel a little bit better. Health problems are terrible, of course, but I've suspected that I might have iron deficiency for some time... DH thought I was overreacting to symptoms (heart pain, hair loss, brittle nails [though they grow VERY fast], fatique) because these have been issues for at least the last five years... I thought these were all just normal signs of aging, but maybe it's something I can fix. :cheese: This will be the first time I'm looking FORWARD to a call to the doctor. ;)

MonaLisa
October 23rd, 2011, 11:33 AM
Well it's easier for me to say it..or anyone else cause it's not my hair...and i know how awful it is to lose length when you want it longer...but i would definitely chop...
BSL or so...
It will look GOOD, down or up, be healthy...and not something you're ashamed of to wear down. u can then let it grow , being extra gentle, and next summer I'm sure it will be below your waist.

You should do what you FEEL is right, what would make you feel the best.
But speaking from viewer's perspecitve, it would be nicer without those last 2,3 inches.

Hugs

UltraBella
October 23rd, 2011, 11:39 AM
If it were my hair and my choice, I would trim it to where the thickness is uniform. Your hair is beautiful, but the uneven thin ends detracts from it a bit. I would pick shorter and fuller over longer and thinner, but that's always been my preference.

Anywhere
October 23rd, 2011, 11:46 AM
You and I are in the same predicament. I hate wearing my hair down because the ends are so thin, and I've wanted to chop for over a year now (but I'm too afraid).

I'd say chop off a few inches, and if it still looks bad you can always chop off more. I chopped off 4 inches before graduation and the ends were so thin, like they could fit into the little loop part of the back of the bobby pin with room to spare. They're thickening up slowly but surely. :flower:

Babyfine
October 23rd, 2011, 12:12 PM
Gosh I don't think your hair looks bad at all -it's just like mine except mine's a tad bit wavier. Mine thins out terribly past BSL, as well, and as far as I know I have no known medical issues(had thyroid checked, supposedly normal, had a hormone panel done(for non-hair related reasons and nothing jumped out at the doctor).
but maybe it wouldn't hurt to have a blood panel done just to see, and then you'd know.
I'm with the camp that thinks it does look better and thicker down the line as the pictures progress, and I agree with Jojo's plan.
But I hear ya on taper-I cut my hair a lot this past January to get thicker, even ends and am debating if I ever want to get past BSL.
BSL is still plenty long,at least to the non long hair world.

Gypsygirl
October 23rd, 2011, 12:14 PM
You are definitely getting there- you have to remember that hair grows slowly. Just count how many inches the strands that are catching up need to grow until they hit waist length- even if your hair grows a whole inch each month it's still going to take a while. Right? So...I'd say don't give up just yet. There's is definitely some visible improvement, and really...nothing wrong with faerietale ends as long as they are healthy! Your ends look fine to me, especially in the last picture. But...if you want blunt ends very badly then yes- I think cutting back to about bsl would make a giant difference, and you would still have long hair.

A word of caution, though...not that I wear my hair up a lot but the reason I went from blunt ends to layered hair ages ago was that blunt ends are a real pain to put up. My hair just wouldn't stay put no matter what- and buns were pretty much our of the question. Of course my hair is thick and heavy...but still...it's something you might want to ponder.

Maverick494
October 23rd, 2011, 12:17 PM
I'm with UltraBella on this one. Quality over length. Your hair seems to have an equal thickness until around BSL, after that it tapers significantly, which in my opinion detracts from the overall look. After the big trim it'll be easier to maintain the hemline whilst growing.

pepperminttea
October 23rd, 2011, 12:47 PM
Do you prefer a blunt hemline or fairytale ends? Because if your ends are healthy, and not overly tangly, then it's just up to aesthetics, and your preference. :flower: Do what makes you feel happiest in yourself, but as always - use the two week rule.

SlightlySoprano
October 23rd, 2011, 12:50 PM
But I'm at a loss. Unless I'm wearing black, which I don't do often, I feel humiliated to have my hair down, even if I'm the only one around.


YOU have to do what makes YOU feel good. If you feel humiliated with yourself, you MUST do something!

Oksana
October 23rd, 2011, 02:38 PM
I don't see the improvement that everybody else is talking about. I'm sorry to say that, but you asked for honest feedback, and this is what I see (I know I could be wrong). Since you feel awful about your ends, what I would suggest is getting it trimmed back about 3-4 inches, and then start a regular cycle of trimming - maybe 1/2 inch off every 3-4 months. See if your ends stay on the thicker side as your hair gets longer. Trimming helps to hold back faster-growing hairs so that slower-growing hairs can catch up.

It could be that the majority of your hairs have a slow or short growing cycle (or both), and only a small percentage of hairs grow fast enough and/or long enough to get longer than BSL. Time will tell.


I agree with spidermom. BSL looks like a good place to trim too, then grow from there :)

jaine
October 23rd, 2011, 02:47 PM
I also vote for BSL.

trillian
October 23rd, 2011, 03:21 PM
I would say take a good look at your pictures, and think about exactly how many inches of your hemline you don't like. Then I would think about how long you'd have to do your trimming routine to grow out the remainder of your hair. This assumes that all your hair grows around the same rate and about half an inch a month, which based on the history you've provided may not be the case. So if you have say 8 inches of hair you want to thicken, it's going to take you a minimum of a year and 4 months before your hair will look the way you want it to.

Personally, I would be tempted to cut it to APL, or BSL at the longest. Just because I think everyone should feel that their hair looks pretty when it's down, even if you don't wear it that way often.

jeanniet
October 23rd, 2011, 03:59 PM
I see some improvement in your hemline, but I don't think it's happening fast enough to make you feel good about your hair, and that's what matters. If it were me, I'd cut back to BSL where your hemline looks thick, and then go from there. A lot of people don't mind having a thinner hemline, but it sounds like it does bother you, so I'd go for the improved hemline over length.

fiddlefananb
October 23rd, 2011, 04:38 PM
I see some improvement in your hemline, but I don't think it's happening fast enough to make you feel good about your hair, and that's what matters. If it were me, I'd cut back to BSL where your hemline looks thick, and then go from there. A lot of people don't mind having a thinner hemline, but it sounds like it does bother you, so I'd go for the improved hemline over length.
I agree with this. If you are uncomfortable with it, that means you aren't enjoying your hair and that is what it's all about. Cut back until it is thicker and then take extreme good care of it and see you can hold on to some of it. You will probably be much happier in the long run.

torrilin
October 23rd, 2011, 05:22 PM
I'm starting to wonder about the medical condition, though... you see, it's taken me five years to get from APL to WL. :o And I've been at WL for about two years... maybe even three... I think I might be anemic, because I have passed out before from not eating on time (I've found that I have to eat every two hours).

If you have health insurance, GO TO THE DOCTOR! Do not pass go, do not collect $200, just go. With what you describe, chances are good there is something wrong. It is just not normal to faint from missing meals. Your body is seriously upset about something, and you need to find out what.

It sounds like you have made good changes for your body. Exercise is good, since it helps you grow strong... but if you've got an underlying health condition, your body may not be able to grow muscle properly. And if you've got a hormone disorder or something that's not a "simple" nutrition deficiency, all the eating right in the world won't help.

And no, you absolutely shouldn't just chop your hair. The doctor needs to be able to see as much evidence as you can muster. Your hair's condition can be a valuable clue.

After the doctor, then we can talk hemlines and buns and styling.

Maktub
October 23rd, 2011, 05:29 PM
Good idea to wait after the doctor to trimm... mention your hair and show it, as well as other symptoms. You can also bring a picture of "before" if you have one.

Chances are pretty good - if you are anemic - that this can and will be solved ! Then you have you energy and health again :)

Debra83
October 23rd, 2011, 05:57 PM
If you have health insurance, GO TO THE DOCTOR! Do not pass go, do not collect $200, just go. With what you describe, chances are good there is something wrong. It is just not normal to faint from missing meals. Your body is seriously upset about something, and you need to find out what.

It sounds like you have made good changes for your body. Exercise is good, since it helps you grow strong... but if you've got an underlying health condition, your body may not be able to grow muscle properly. And if you've got a hormone disorder or something that's not a "simple" nutrition deficiency, all the eating right in the world won't help.

And no, you absolutely shouldn't just chop your hair. The doctor needs to be able to see as much evidence as you can muster. Your hair's condition can be a valuable clue.

After the doctor, then we can talk hemlines and buns and styling.


Totally agree that you should wait to see the doc before trimming. It's all part of the helps in diagnosing a condition. I would also right down a list of all your symptoms, (brittle nails, hair, fatigue, fainting and EVERYTHING else you can think of.) and 22 is too young to show signs of "aging". I bet it's a medical issue.

When I was in my early 30's, I went through a period (because I didn't have the right multi at the time) of not having enough minerals in my body. My symptoms were brittle nails, aching joints, hair being dry and breaking, and a couple of other things that I've since forgotten. An acquaintance of mine who owned a health food store linked it all together for me and suggested Goat's Whey. I took it for quite a long time, and then found a multi with a good mineral base. Never had the problems again, and I'll be 47 in two months. :cheese:

leslissocool
October 23rd, 2011, 06:42 PM
I vote go to the doctor! IF you are anemic, this could be the cause of your brittle nails, the fainting ( I faint too when I don't have enough protein), and the hair loss (hair = protein). I am and always been heavily anemic, so I have to take certain supplements.

Go get yourself checked out before you do anything. Have some blood tests and make shure you are healthy.

What could be beneficial is picking up a protein drink and drink it every day. If you are under a lot of stress, pick up a yoga DVD and do it. Stress can cause shedding. also take some multi vitamins ( I do a multi with biotin). make sure you get enough calories in your diet, and to eat veggies and drink enough water.

I did see some improvements though, so I'd rule out cutting until you go to the doctor.

ETA: If you are deficient in Iron, a trick I learned when I was pregnant is to eat dark leefy veggies with lemon. The vitamin c helps your body absorb Iron better. It works like a charm, I eat all my dark green veggies with lemon.

wooliswonderful
October 23rd, 2011, 06:55 PM
I don't think your hair looks bad, I think it's pretty!
I know you're not liking it right now I'm sure once you figure out what's going on with your health it'll get better. :blossom:

spidermom
October 23rd, 2011, 07:01 PM
Write down all the symptoms that you can think of because if you're anything like me, once you get into the doctor's office, you won't remember half of what you remember right now.

tinti
October 23rd, 2011, 07:08 PM
I can't see much improvement either. I would vote for trimming your hair up to BSL or so, and then keep trimming 1/2 off every month or every 2/3 months. Also, as people have said, get some blood tests. And if you don't already maybe it would be an idea to start castor oiling, applying monistat or rooibos tea etc?

I don't mean to be rude or to honest, I DO think your hair is gorgeus, but if you feel awful and humiliated about it, that's not how it should be.

Annibelle
October 23rd, 2011, 07:12 PM
I can't see much improvement either. I would vote for trimming your hair up to BSL or so, and then keep trimming 1/2 off every month or every 2/3 months. Also, as people have said, get some blood tests. And if you don't already maybe it would be an idea to start castor oiling, applying monistat or rooibos tea etc?

I don't mean to be rude or to honest, I DO think your hair is gorgeus, but if you feel awful and humiliated about it, that's not how it should be.

Thanks for the advice. :) My scalp doesn't like oiling. (I learned the hard way.) And I'm hesitant about Monistat... but I think I'll look into the tea! :) Thanks so much!

Maktub
October 23rd, 2011, 07:35 PM
Considering the side effects some people had with monistat, I agree that it might be a good idea to err on the safe side of healthy stuff and go towards the tea, good food, lots of water, sleep, relaxing and breathing deeply ... and seeking professional medical analysis :)

Sending good thoughts Annibelle !

fairystar32
October 23rd, 2011, 09:42 PM
I agree with this
HUGS xxx



Hi Annibelle, I would definitely cut it, not because it looks terrible, but because you say that you feel "humiliated" wearing it down. Hair should never make you feel like that. If you really don't like the ends, I'd say cut bask to BSL. Your ends will be nice and thick, and hopefully you'll feel proud of your hair. Good luck with your decision.

Eolan
October 24th, 2011, 01:46 AM
I was in your position, and I did have it cut. It was not an easy choice, but I never regretted it. My hair looks so much better now, and I grew out all the lenght I cut off in no time.

But to each their own. I couldn't stand those tapered ends, but I know alot of people who do. In the end, it's your choice.

I hope you get happy with your hair again.

ssjhotau2
October 24th, 2011, 02:45 AM
I didn't read all the responses, but I've chopped my hair several times to even up the hemline or because I was tired of trying to baby the ends... and it's been worth it nearly every time.
Your hair looks like its thickening up around BSL- if I were in your shoes I would cut back to that length and start growing again.

alyanna
October 24th, 2011, 03:01 AM
I think your hair is improving, but only very slightly. Mind you, you've only been around since May, so I believe that that's just not long enough to see any significant improvements. In my mind, it would take a couple of years of maintaining at waist to get the kind of hemline that you could potentially have (judging by the thickness of the higher sections of hair).

If I were you, I'd cut back some, I'd say BSL but no shorter, just so you feel better about your hair, and then try to maintain as you've been doing for at least another year. Healthy long hair doesn't happen overnight!

Good luck and I'll be watching you ;):p (from one thinnie to another)

Jomo
October 24th, 2011, 03:15 AM
Yeah it looks more to me like your hair fibres are getting healthier and shinier, and thus forming locks more easily and looking smoother, rather than there actually being much more hair thickness. I would definitely go see the doctor about those problems you're having. You could be severely anemic from those symptoms which would be a massive block to growing thicker hair. Good luck with it and I hope you feel healthier soon!

tgagurl27
October 24th, 2011, 04:11 AM
I think just carry on doing the maintainance cutting. It looks alot better than that first photo. You could also do the benign neglect thing and tie it up for a few months and see how your hair is after a 2 or 3, or as many months as you can handle. You might be quite surprised

CarpeDM
October 24th, 2011, 07:22 AM
If it were me, I would cut back to BSL. It looks as though most of your hair stops there, so that would give you much nicer and thicker ends. Good luck with whatever you decide to do. :)


I would second this...

summergreen
October 24th, 2011, 12:10 PM
I agree with all those who said see your doctor - just in case youve got iron or thyroid problems, or something like. And it definitely sounds like your scalp prefers shampoo to whatever method you were using.

I think theres definitely improvement between the August picture and the last two! I would try just trimming one inch, sometimes that can make more difference than youd expect, can always trim more later if you dont like it. And I think your hair looks beautiful, its so healthy

summergreen
October 24th, 2011, 12:11 PM
....and shiny! (last post got cut off!)

lesbia
October 26th, 2011, 10:50 AM
Oh wow! The last pic is lovely! You are having a good grow! If I were you i would trim a little bit every mounth until you have thicker ends :)

Nightshade
October 26th, 2011, 10:56 AM
Agreeing with everyone that said to trim it to BSL and then go from there. I think you'll be much happier with it. :)

busnutmedic
October 26th, 2011, 07:11 PM
Hi Annibelle, I would definitely cut it, not because it looks terrible, but because you say that you feel "humiliated" wearing it down. Hair should never make you feel like that. If you really don't like the ends, I'd say cut bask to BSL. Your ends will be nice and thick, and hopefully you'll feel proud of your hair. Good luck with your decision.

I haven't read the rest of the posts, but this is what I feel, too.

Granted, I chopped off a LOT of hair when I decided to cut it, and as you can see in my picture I'm not even back to APL or anything (my hair was about tailbone, and then went to a short bob, and now I haven't cut my hair all summer and it's about shoulder length).

I felt so bad about my hair for a long time. I hated it and loved it. I loved that it was long, and I could get it to look OK in pictures sometime, but I hated wearing it down in public.

Now I'm growing it out with the full understanding to myself that I will not hate my hair again!It may end up only being waist length, but that'll be OK by me :)

allmixedup88
October 26th, 2011, 07:42 PM
It is def getting thicker. Try clip in hair extensions for thickness.
You can make your own pretty easy w/ clips & a hot glue gun.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vr3ENNw1VB4


ignore the color part, lol

btw i'm kind of going through the same thing.
I got a choppy rockerish hair cut, which I now loathe.
My longest layer is MBL while my shortest later are bang length
and a whole bunch of random lengths between that.

GlennaGirl
October 26th, 2011, 08:09 PM
You know, I don't know...am I crazy to think your hair is just gorgeous???? It's got that little bit of a wave and yes, it does get wispy near the ends, which is natural to many, many people.

I think your hair is absolutely gorgeous and you can try maintenance trims to see if you'll get more thickness, but even if you don't, you have a fabulous head of hair.



When I joined in May, I asked if I should chop my WL hair. Most said yes-- to anywhere from APL to just a couple of inches. I decided to trim an inch or so, stop cones, and everyone agreed that it looked MUCH better. Well, since then, I've gone to CO washing, and my hair does look better than it has in years... but it still has a lot of taper. I've been maintaining at WL since I joined, and my hemline doesn't seem to be getting any thicker. :o See for yourself:

Upon joining LHC:

http://i1188.photobucket.com/albums/z414/4nnibelle/P5143627.jpg

After that first trim:

http://i1188.photobucket.com/albums/z414/4nnibelle/P5163643.jpg

One month later... looking worse...:

http://i1188.photobucket.com/albums/z414/4nnibelle/Image06272011202741-1.jpg

I missed a photo in July, so here's August, two months later:

http://i1188.photobucket.com/albums/z414/4nnibelle/Image08062011222406.jpg

Not only is there a lot of taper, but it's lop-sided. :(

I accidentally skipped another monthly photo, so here's two months after the last one. At this point, I began using shampoo weekly because I had a huge shed all summer, and shampoo stopped that:

http://i1188.photobucket.com/albums/z414/4nnibelle/Image10122011093456-1.jpg

It still looks bad... I'm trimming it about 1/2 inch monthly (my entire monthly growth), but there's still so much taper. It doesn't look quite so bad when I wear black, though. Here's an image taken that same morning:

http://i1188.photobucket.com/albums/z414/4nnibelle/Image10122011100221-2-1.jpg

But I'm at a loss. Unless I'm wearing black, which I don't do often, I feel humiliated to have my hair down, even if I'm the only one around. Would you chop it? If so, how much? Do I really have an alternative? And do you actually see much of a difference in my hair over the months? I don't... it seems like the same hairs are growing every month, and they're getting trimmed, but the rest are staying the same length. I need advice! :flower: Thank you all in advance for being so helpful.

Also, please don't be afraid to hurt my feelings... I would rather hear the truth from my LHC friends than walk around with embarrassing taper, having everyone think of how badly my hair needs a cut. :o

invisiblebabe
October 26th, 2011, 10:06 PM
You're not being harsh at all; you're being honest, which is exactly what I wanted. :flower: And thank you for your compliment. :)

My nutrition has improved over the last couple of months, I'd say. I'm still trying to make it better, though. I'm going to look into getting a blood test this week. Now that other people have suspected health issues, I feel a little bit better. Health problems are terrible, of course, but I've suspected that I might have iron deficiency for some time... DH thought I was overreacting to symptoms (heart pain, hair loss, brittle nails [though they grow VERY fast], fatique) because these have been issues for at least the last five years... I thought these were all just normal signs of aging, but maybe it's something I can fix. :cheese: This will be the first time I'm looking FORWARD to a call to the doctor. ;)

Aging?? At 22??? Definitely not! I agree about seeing a doctor ASAP, getting some blood work done, and stopping the vegan diet (get a lot more protein in you!). That all should help the hair. If you had hip length hair at age 14 and it was thicker, and you haven't been coloring it, and you aren't on any different medications now than you were then (some meds do cause hair thinning as side effects), then my guess is it's probably medical in some way.

Maktub
October 26th, 2011, 10:33 PM
I hadn't seen that you were doing a vegan diet...
This might be a major cause. If that is possible for you, maybe try a more flexible vegetarian diet for a while, rich in good fats, iron and proteins (nuts, fatty fish, eggs, whole yogourt, colorful raw veggies, etc.) ?

I am vegetarian, and even if I eat really well in general, I sometimes really need to be carefull to eat enough iron and a good variety in order not to be missing any amino acids and other nutrients.

being vegan can lead to hair loss, fatigue, etc. etc. it is not unusual because it can be tricky to eat enough nutrients with a restrictive vegan diet. You should talk to your doctor about it.

:grouphug:

justgreen
October 26th, 2011, 11:04 PM
I haven't read the whole thread. I wouldn't cut/trim unless you were having tangle problems. So what if the ends aren't thick. Not everyone can have a thick hemline. I've learned to embrace my thin ends. :flower:

Annibelle
October 26th, 2011, 11:16 PM
You know, I don't know...am I crazy to think your hair is just gorgeous???? It's got that little bit of a wave and yes, it does get wispy near the ends, which is natural to many, many people.

I think your hair is absolutely gorgeous and you can try maintenance trims to see if you'll get more thickness, but even if you don't, you have a fabulous head of hair.

:flower: :flower: :flower: Thank you so much! :)


Aging?? At 22??? Definitely not! I agree about seeing a doctor ASAP, getting some blood work done, and stopping the vegan diet (get a lot more protein in you!). That all should help the hair. If you had hip length hair at age 14 and it was thicker, and you haven't been coloring it, and you aren't on any different medications now than you were then (some meds do cause hair thinning as side effects), then my guess is it's probably medical in some way.


I hadn't seen that you were doing a vegan diet...
This might be a major cause. If that is possible for you, maybe try a more flexible vegetarian diet for a while, rich in good fats, iron and proteins (nuts, fatty fish, eggs, whole yogourt, colorful raw veggies, etc.) ?

I am vegetarian, and even if I eat really well in general, I sometimes really need to be carefull to eat enough iron and a good variety in order not to be missing any amino acids and other nutrients.

being vegan can lead to hair loss, fatigue, etc. etc. it is not unusual because it can be tricky to eat enough nutrients with a restrictive vegan diet. You should talk to your doctor about it.

:grouphug:

I'm actually vegetarian (didn't specify-- sorry!). I've been getting a lot of plant protein for the last few months, though. Over the years, I didn't eat a balanced diet... and now I see that I wasn't getting enough protein, and probably not enough iron, either. I think the protein is helping already, because I used to need at least one nap each day to even function (sometimes as many as three... :blushing: ) but now I don't need any! :) I think that might be why there is any improvement at all in my hemline... because I had the same wispy WL hair for years before consuming more protein. :blushing: I did dye my hair as a teen, but all of that dye has long been chopped... not sure if it could have damaged my scalp, though? (And nope, never been on any medication.)

leslissocool
November 2nd, 2011, 03:31 AM
I'm actually vegetarian (didn't specify-- sorry!). I've been getting a lot of plant protein for the last few months, though. Over the years, I didn't eat a balanced diet... and now I see that I wasn't getting enough protein, and probably not enough iron, either. I think the protein is helping already, because I used to need at least one nap each day to even function (sometimes as many as three... :blushing: ) but now I don't need any! :) I think that might be why there is any improvement at all in my hemline... because I had the same wispy WL hair for years before consuming more protein. :blushing: I did dye my hair as a teen, but all of that dye has long been chopped... not sure if it could have damaged my scalp, though? (And nope, never been on any medication.)

Alright, I am not trying to be pushy, but you should REALLY try some kind of liquid protein drink. You'll see the difference in energy right away.

I was vegetarian for 5 years, and I was already a bit anemic to begin with (I didn't know that though) and ate really poorly and was diagnose with severe anemia and had to be put in a bunch of Iv's and my hair started to fall, and after I started to eat better my hair barely grew for almost 3 years.

It's been almost 8 years since I have been vegetarian, and although I am still anemic my diet has improved it so much I am not yellow (I looked like a Simpson character, it was bad) nor lethargic and my blood is finally red (not orange) and I am almost off all my crazy iron vitamins (except for slow release ones). It was a huge battle, and although I chose to eat meat again I wish someone would have told me sooner that I really needed to get a lot of protein.

I also suggest eating veggie patties (I buy a huge stack of them at costco, it's like 15 bucks for like 16 and each have 10g of protein in them. Also try switching your vitamins for prenatal, my doctor has me on them because of the extra iron.

Annibelle
November 2nd, 2011, 08:32 AM
For the last month or so, I've been eating protein bars and getting plant protein-- about 50/60 grams per day. I feel much more energized. :) I've tried the liquid ones but that weird sour taste makes me sick. :( I'm a wimp when it comes to weird flavors.

We eat veggie patties sometimes, but a lot of them are so packed with chemicals that we try to avoid them and eat regular veggies instead... but I'll keep looking. I'll definitely stay on the vegetarian diet (it's been 8 years and DH has been veg for 20-- our lifestyles just wouldn't be compatible otherwise, plus our objection to meat is moral), but I'm going for a healthier one. :)

When I can get in to see the doc, I'll ask about prenatal vitamins.

Thanks for your advice! :flower:


Alright, I am not trying to be pushy, but you should REALLY try some kind of liquid protein drink. You'll see the difference in energy right away.

I was vegetarian for 5 years, and I was already a bit anemic to begin with (I didn't know that though) and ate really poorly and was diagnose with severe anemia and had to be put in a bunch of Iv's and my hair started to fall, and after I started to eat better my hair barely grew for almost 3 years.

It's been almost 8 years since I have been vegetarian, and although I am still anemic my diet has improved it so much I am not yellow (I looked like a Simpson character, it was bad) nor lethargic and my blood is finally red (not orange) and I am almost off all my crazy iron vitamins (except for slow release ones). It was a huge battle, and although I chose to eat meat again I wish someone would have told me sooner that I really needed to get a lot of protein.

I also suggest eating veggie patties (I buy a huge stack of them at costco, it's like 15 bucks for like 16 and each have 10g of protein in them. Also try switching your vitamins for prenatal, my doctor has me on them because of the extra iron.

haibane
November 2nd, 2011, 10:14 AM
You're right about my hair looking different in each photo... I'm really not sure why that is. Each is the morning after a wash, and hasn't been bunned, braided, or anything like that. But it's weird how some months, there seems to be a regression in thickness length. :(
I think it might be in part because of different moisture levels. I have noticed in my own tapered hair when I use curly hair methods and it's more moisturized it clumps together more, similar to how curly hair forms defined curls. And with more strands clumping together tapered ends can look more substantial.

How you take the photo also matters a lot, the light and how the hair just happens to fall. And blurry pictures can also make the hair look thicker. Some people with tapered hair push the hair together at the ends to form a V for pictures. Maybe experiment a bit taking a bunch of different pictures moving your hair around, different angles etc just to see how much that can affect how hair pictures look. Images show so much besides just actual growth.

Rybe
November 2nd, 2011, 12:15 PM
I'd put money on your diet being a huge factor, though I'd still go to the doctor just to be safe. I know dozens of vegetarians who've made themselves miserable doing it wrong. Truthfully the only reason I'm NOT fully a vegetarian (still eat poultry and fish on occasion) is I know how hard it is to do correctly, and am way too lazy :p I hate cooking. Hate it. But I do feel bad eating the chickens :( even if they're JERKS who peck my ankles...:mad: (birds hate me)

I'd recommend (in addition to talking to a doctor) finding some good vegetarian cookbooks that focus on balanced meals. My husband and I have been loving The Art of Indian Vegitarian Cooking (http://www.amazon.com/Lord-Krishnas-Cuisine-Vegetarian-Cooking/dp/0525245642) because it's loaded with excellent legume recipes and tends to have suggestions on how to put together for complete meals. But that kinda hinges on whether or not you like Indian food...

Leafy greens, nuts and legumes are your friend!! As are many other things. And supplements right now! You really sound like you need more iron and protein. But it also sounds like you're on the right track :) But I'd still see a doctor!

heidi w.
November 2nd, 2011, 01:48 PM
Shedding, are you losing clumps of hair or large volumes of hair, or more like drizzles of sorts? ETA: If the former, seek a doctor's counsel immediately. If you're losing in droves, then you might have an undiagnosed thyroid condition. It's under-diagnosed in most women, and occurs in younger women more often than generally understood. END ETA

Has your hair been growing long for around 4 years at this point? If yes, you may be due for a sort of replacement of a kind. And then all this will sort itself out in time.

A couple of other double checks.
You're not using anything on your head that you're allergic to, right?
You're detangling from the bottom up with a wide tooth comb, and using conditioner, right?
You're sleeping on a smooth-fabric'd pillowcase, right, so hair can slide during the night?

You have ruled out thyroid concerns via a blood test through your doctor?
You are not on a diet that is fat-free entirely, right?
You are not anemic, right? as in low iron in the blood?

I doubt you have thyroid, but there are two forms of thyroid conditions, and they each behave a bit differently as it concerns hair symptoms. And you have no other health conditions or medications that could adversely affect hair growth, right?

Nutritionally speaking, hair is derived of keratin, a form of protein. And we need a good protein intake in our diet, daily. Further, vitamins and minerals are delivered to the internal body systems via available fat. No fat intake whatsoever, this is a form of nutritional starvation. You need some "good" fat to deliver the nutrients. No fat; no delivery.

If you are vegetarian, there's a possibility that you need to up your protein and be on the lookout for anemia. It's well-known that anemic conditions create a kind of chronic increase in hair shedding, and once the problem is fixed, a couple of months later, the hair will cease all that excess shedding.

It's normal to lose up to 100 hair strands each day.

I would not chop your hair off. I would stick it out. Most sheds eventually resolve themselves in time. Long hair is a game of patience. Nothing happens speedily in growing longer hair.

AND it IS normal to have some thinning on the very ends for just about everyone. That's the truth.

I think you might need to adjust a few of your understandings about hair and how it grows. But I can see and understand why you're frustrated, and a bit upset. It looks as though it's improving in steps. Just be patient, and rule out the above.

heidi w.

heidi w.
November 2nd, 2011, 01:55 PM
I'd put money on your diet being a huge factor, though I'd still go to the doctor just to be safe. I know dozens of vegetarians who've made themselves miserable doing it wrong. Truthfully the only reason I'm NOT fully a vegetarian (still eat poultry and fish on occasion) is I know how hard it is to do correctly, and am way too lazy :p I hate cooking. Hate it. But I do feel bad eating the chickens :( even if they're JERKS who peck my ankles...:mad: (birds hate me)

I'd recommend (in addition to talking to a doctor) finding some good vegetarian cookbooks that focus on balanced meals. My husband and I have been loving The Art of Indian Vegitarian Cooking (http://www.amazon.com/Lord-Krishnas-Cuisine-Vegetarian-Cooking/dp/0525245642) because it's loaded with excellent legume recipes and tends to have suggestions on how to put together for complete meals. But that kinda hinges on whether or not you like Indian food...

Leafy greens, nuts and legumes are your friend!! As are many other things. And supplements right now! You really sound like you need more iron and protein. But it also sounds like you're on the right track :) But I'd still see a doctor!

If you are vegetarian, eat more tofu, and eat more rice and beans combined. Make one meal a day include rice and beans.

We need 8 amino acids taken through our food daily. These 8 amino acids comprise a "complete protein" source. Beans and rice each miss one amino acid that the other makes up for. A percentage of the world lives on rice and beans, so it's a reliable source of protein. Naturally, the soy bean has all 8 amino acids. The remaining 27 or so amino acids are made internally by the body, so you don't need to worry so much about those.

For the uptake of iron, it IS in Spinach, but eating raw spinach is the least effective way to deliver that iron to the body, so the body can break it down and uptake ALL or MORE of the available iron. It's best to steam it. You can also consider stir frying it very rapidly and put in a small pinch of sugar at the end of stir frying any greens (spinach, kale, collard greens) as this pinch of sugar at the end of cooking helps to remove the bitter aftertaste in greens, and they are thereby delicious. I stir fry in little halved cherry tomatoes, too. Yummy.

The other thing to know is that strips of red beef, the enzymes of red meat help with the body's uptake of iron within spinach that has been stir fried with the meat. Just FYI.

heidi w.

lolot
November 2nd, 2011, 02:04 PM
I think you should cut it to bsl or apl, the up part looks very pretty i think if you take care it will grow even

Bonkers57
November 2nd, 2011, 02:19 PM
What longhairedwolf says. If you feel that bad about your hair then you should take action.

Looking at the pics, I can see that your hemline is S-L-O-W-L-Y getting longer. If it were my hair, I'd cut it back to BSL and do mini-microtrims so the hemline will stay even and get longer at it's own pace.


Hi Annibelle, I would definitely cut it, not because it looks terrible, but because you say that you feel "humiliated" wearing it down. Hair should never make you feel like that. If you really don't like the ends, I'd say cut bask to BSL. Your ends will be nice and thick, and hopefully you'll feel proud of your hair. Good luck with your decision.

invisiblebabe
November 2nd, 2011, 02:30 PM
I'm actually vegetarian (didn't specify-- sorry!). I've been getting a lot of plant protein for the last few months, though. Over the years, I didn't eat a balanced diet... and now I see that I wasn't getting enough protein, and probably not enough iron, either. I think the protein is helping already, because I used to need at least one nap each day to even function (sometimes as many as three... :blushing: ) but now I don't need any! :) I think that might be why there is any improvement at all in my hemline... because I had the same wispy WL hair for years before consuming more protein. :blushing: I did dye my hair as a teen, but all of that dye has long been chopped... not sure if it could have damaged my scalp, though? (And nope, never been on any medication.)

Yah, diet is probably a significant contributor to the hair thinness, then. Glad that your energy level is improving already! Soon your hair should too.

Still, I'd get some blood work done just to be safe (and I hate blood tests, so I sympathize if you don't want to do it, haha... but it would be a good thing to get done).

Since you said you are embarrassed to wear your hair down, I'd chop it to about BSL if I were you.

Annibelle
November 2nd, 2011, 05:13 PM
So much amazing, helpful advice! Thank you all!


I'd recommend (in addition to talking to a doctor) finding some good vegetarian cookbooks that focus on balanced meals. My husband and I have been loving The Art of Indian Vegitarian Cooking (http://www.amazon.com/Lord-Krishnas-Cuisine-Vegetarian-Cooking/dp/0525245642) because it's loaded with excellent legume recipes and tends to have suggestions on how to put together for complete meals. But that kinda hinges on whether or not you like Indian food...

Leafy greens, nuts and legumes are your friend!! As are many other things. And supplements right now! You really sound like you need more iron and protein. But it also sounds like you're on the right track :) But I'd still see a doctor!

I don't know if I like Indian food. :o I've always wanted to try it, but whenever I smell it being cooked in a restaurant, I think it smells kinda gross and then I'm afraid I won't like it... plus, I can't eat super-spicy food... and the spices they use in those sorts of cookbooks seem so exotic, so I'm afraid I won't be able to find them! But I will look into something like that! :)


Shedding, are you losing clumps of hair or large volumes of hair, or more like drizzles of sorts? ETA: If the former, seek a doctor's counsel immediately. If you're losing in droves, then you might have an undiagnosed thyroid condition. It's under-diagnosed in most women, and occurs in younger women more often than generally understood. END ETA

Has your hair been growing long for around 4 years at this point? If yes, you may be due for a sort of replacement of a kind. And then all this will sort itself out in time.

A couple of other double checks.
You're not using anything on your head that you're allergic to, right?
You're detangling from the bottom up with a wide tooth comb, and using conditioner, right?
You're sleeping on a smooth-fabric'd pillowcase, right, so hair can slide during the night?

You have ruled out thyroid concerns via a blood test through your doctor?
You are not on a diet that is fat-free entirely, right?
You are not anemic, right? as in low iron in the blood?

I doubt you have thyroid, but there are two forms of thyroid conditions, and they each behave a bit differently as it concerns hair symptoms. And you have no other health conditions or medications that could adversely affect hair growth, right?

Nutritionally speaking, hair is derived of keratin, a form of protein. And we need a good protein intake in our diet, daily. Further, vitamins and minerals are delivered to the internal body systems via available fat. No fat intake whatsoever, this is a form of nutritional starvation. You need some "good" fat to deliver the nutrients. No fat; no delivery.

If you are vegetarian, there's a possibility that you need to up your protein and be on the lookout for anemia. It's well-known that anemic conditions create a kind of chronic increase in hair shedding, and once the problem is fixed, a couple of months later, the hair will cease all that excess shedding.

It's normal to lose up to 100 hair strands each day.

I would not chop your hair off. I would stick it out. Most sheds eventually resolve themselves in time. Long hair is a game of patience. Nothing happens speedily in growing longer hair.

AND it IS normal to have some thinning on the very ends for just about everyone. That's the truth.

I think you might need to adjust a few of your understandings about hair and how it grows. But I can see and understand why you're frustrated, and a bit upset. It looks as though it's improving in steps. Just be patient, and rule out the above.

heidi w.

Heidi, you can always be counted on for great advice and info! ;) I'm not losing clumps of hair, and it's really not noticeably thinner, like on a month-to-month basis or anything. When I went WO, I lost a lot of hair, but that was unrelated. But I've lost a lot of hair in the last five years. My ponytail circumference was 5 in. and now it's 3. That's why I thought it MIGHT just be normal aging-- because I've been gradually getting to a smaller circumference in addition to my growth rate slowing down A LOT.

I've been growing from pixie to WL for the last seven years. What do you mean, "due for a replacement"? :o

I don't have breakage or splits or anything. My hair also seems to be pretty balanced, protein and moisture wise.

I eat plenty of healthy fats-- lots of coconut, avocado, and olives. I'm not on any medications.


If you are vegetarian, eat more tofu, and eat more rice and beans combined. Make one meal a day include rice and beans.

We need 8 amino acids taken through our food daily. These 8 amino acids comprise a "complete protein" source. Beans and rice each miss one amino acid that the other makes up for. A percentage of the world lives on rice and beans, so it's a reliable source of protein. Naturally, the soy bean has all 8 amino acids. The remaining 27 or so amino acids are made internally by the body, so you don't need to worry so much about those.

For the uptake of iron, it IS in Spinach, but eating raw spinach is the least effective way to deliver that iron to the body, so the body can break it down and uptake ALL or MORE of the available iron. It's best to steam it. You can also consider stir frying it very rapidly and put in a small pinch of sugar at the end of stir frying any greens (spinach, kale, collard greens) as this pinch of sugar at the end of cooking helps to remove the bitter aftertaste in greens, and they are thereby delicious. I stir fry in little halved cherry tomatoes, too. Yummy.

The other thing to know is that strips of red beef, the enzymes of red meat help with the body's uptake of iron within spinach that has been stir fried with the meat. Just FYI.

heidi w.

I love the dietary info! I made rice and beans for dinner tonight! :) And I'm going to buy some spinach this weekend. I always thought that raw was always best-- so glad you clarified that for me! I'm going to try stir-frying some. :heart:

Annibelle
November 6th, 2011, 08:13 AM
UPDATE UPDATE UPDATE

I'm still waiting to get in to see the doctor (insurance issues and such). However, I have done a trim. It's really not apparent in the photos, I think, but I cut off two inches last night.

The first two photos do not show my true hair color; I simply used this camera setting so my hair would be easier to see. :) In the third photo, the hair color is true and I'm wearing pale green so you can see that my ends are still thin, but not as bad as they were before. (That weird bump in my hair is always there... I really don't know why. It's like a wave, but the rest of my hair is relatively straight. Sooo weird.)

http://i1188.photobucket.com/albums/z414/4nnibelle/PB054088.jpg http://i1188.photobucket.com/albums/z414/4nnibelle/PB054087.jpg http://i1188.photobucket.com/albums/z414/4nnibelle/PB054091.jpg

(SIDE NOTE: I've been trying to lose weight for months and finally feel like I have after seeing these photos. ;) I guess that's something else that's good about length shots! :) )

*Seraphina*
November 6th, 2011, 08:17 AM
Your hair looks better now :) Congratulations with your weight loss!

Thalia
November 6th, 2011, 09:34 AM
Your hair looks great! And congrats for your weight loss!

Bonkers57
November 6th, 2011, 11:57 AM
Your hair looks great - and congrats on the weight loss! Now maybe I'll get off my butt and start eating the way I'm supposed to! :cheese:

Annibelle
November 6th, 2011, 12:04 PM
Thanks, guys! :) And Bonkers, if you're looking for inspiration, check the Health/Body Beautiful forum for related threads! :) It inspired me!

Bonkers57
November 6th, 2011, 12:13 PM
Thanks, Annibelle - I give that one a look because I NEED inspiration!


Thanks, guys! :) And Bonkers, if you're looking for inspiration, check the Health/Body Beautiful forum for related threads! :) It inspired me!

summergreen
November 6th, 2011, 01:32 PM
Your hair looks really good!

BlazingHeart
November 6th, 2011, 04:28 PM
Um, losing that much hair at your age is not normal aging. That points towards either a chronic health issue or chronic nutritional deficits. I would definitely talk to a doctor about that. I think it may be wise to talk to your doctor about losing weight safely, as it is very very easy to mess up your diet and not give your body what it needs when you are concerned about weight.

Annibelle
November 6th, 2011, 04:35 PM
Um, losing that much hair at your age is not normal aging. That points towards either a chronic health issue or chronic nutritional deficits. I would definitely talk to a doctor about that. I think it may be wise to talk to your doctor about losing weight safely, as it is very very easy to mess up your diet and not give your body what it needs when you are concerned about weight.

Thank you for your concern. :flower: I'm still planning on talking to a doc, but I've gotta wait until I find out what's going on with my insurance. :) I've been very careful about my weight loss (it's taken me a full year to lose ten pounds, so I'm definitely not losing weight too quickly). Since I've been on a weight-loss diet, I've been paying much more attention to creating balanced meals. Before my diet, I was consuming 2500-3000 calories each day (yikes!) and now I'm consuming around 1400. (I'm 5'3" and 126 pounds.) I really don't know how I didn't gain MORE weight on my high-calorie diet before, but I've always had a hard time gaining and losing weight. Maybe that's a thyroid issue, which might also explain hair loss... hmmm. Your comment has made me think of another thing to tell the doc! Thank you! :cheese:

rach
November 6th, 2011, 04:40 PM
Decisions like this is really dependant of what you want out of your hair and how you like to wear it.

My case i like having a deep V shape as i find it easier for buns which i wear probably up to 80&#37; of the time. Micro trims are a must have just to keep the tangles at bay :)
If you like wearing it down most of the time, shape on the ends may be more important.
As long as your happy and enjoy it that's all that counts.

Fairytale
November 6th, 2011, 04:43 PM
The last pic looks better I dont think its the black shirt because to me there is less spaces between each few strands compared to the previous pics.

You are not using any heating tools are you , that can cause that type of upper breakage?
If not I would suggest maybe castor oil treatments i heard so many great things about it here on TLHC.
I wish you luck on whatever you decide IMHO I would work with the lenght and give it another try around with diff. methods.:D

Annibelle
November 6th, 2011, 04:47 PM
The last pic looks better I dont think its the black shirt because to me there is less spaces between each few strands compared to the previous pics.

You are not using any heating tools are you , that can cause that type of upper breakage?
If not I would suggest maybe castor oil treatments i heard so many great things about it here on TLHC.
I wish you luck on whatever you decide IMHO I would work with the lenght and give it another try around with diff. methods.:D

Nope, no heat-- I've really never had any problem with breakage. :( I very rarely get splits or breaks at all. My hair is just growing reaaaally slowly (where it's growing at all). I've considered castor oil, but whenever I do any sort of oil (that I've tried) on my scalp, I lose A LOT of hair. :(

Kome
November 6th, 2011, 05:36 PM
I have this same problem... with having to wear black. Last year I was doing really good and didn't have to do that, but... I still love my hair and am finding that I'm being too critical of it. I have trimmed A LOT this year because of it thinning out on the ends, but it's slowly getting better. I was doing the same as you, trimming often while trying to thickin' it up. If you think it'll make you feel better... then go for it, otherwise I'd just keep doing as you're doing. Good luck. :)

Peter
November 6th, 2011, 05:45 PM
You know, based on your pictures, I feel like you might be near terminal length. It's not common to have such a short terminal length but it can happen. I say this because your ends are thin, but they look to be in good condition. I don't think damage or breakage explains the way your hair is. Your hair looks very much like someone who is nearing terminal.

I would stick with it for a few more months, but if you're eating healthy and treating your hair well and still do not see improvement, my guess would be that you simply have a short terminal length.

Annibelle
November 6th, 2011, 05:59 PM
You know, based on your pictures, I feel like you might be near terminal length. It's not common to have such a short terminal length but it can happen. I say this because your ends are thin, but they look to be in good condition. I don't think damage or breakage explains the way your hair is. Your hair looks very much like someone who is nearing terminal.

I would stick with it for a few more months, but if you're eating healthy and treating your hair well and still do not see improvement, my guess would be that you simply have a short terminal length.

You know... I was JUST thinking that today. :( I surely hope it's not so, but that's a whole lot better than having a medical condition. My ends are honestly in just as good shape as my roots, though it's hard to tell in photos, and I very rarely get splits... all of my shorter hairs taper at the ends, so they're not broken. My hair has always seemed to have a perfect balance between protein and moisture, based on strand tests. Aside from the change from iii to ii over the years, I think me hitting terminal makes perfect sense. How embarrassing. :o If that's true, I'll definitely be the only person at LHC with such a short terminal length! I really just want to reach hip (but with a healthy hemline)! :pray:

JuliaDancer
November 6th, 2011, 06:02 PM
Yes, the thickness doesn't really seem to be moving down to me. Maybe try changing your diet or routine? BSL seems to be where you'd have a thick hemline.

invisiblebabe
November 6th, 2011, 07:10 PM
You know... I was JUST thinking that today. :( I surely hope it's not so, but that's a whole lot better than having a medical condition. My ends are honestly in just as good shape as my roots, though it's hard to tell in photos, and I very rarely get splits... all of my shorter hairs taper at the ends, so they're not broken. My hair has always seemed to have a perfect balance between protein and moisture, based on strand tests. Aside from the change from iii to ii over the years, I think me hitting terminal makes perfect sense. How embarrassing. :o If that's true, I'll definitely be the only person at LHC with such a short terminal length! I really just want to reach hip (but with a healthy hemline)! :pray:

Hmmmmm. When your hair was at hip before, was it thicker than it is now, on the ends? That's the only reason that terminal length wouldn't make sense to me (unless you have grown at least several inches in height since then).

Annibelle
November 6th, 2011, 07:38 PM
Hmmmmm. When your hair was at hip before, was it thicker than it is now, on the ends? That's the only reason that terminal length wouldn't make sense to me (unless you have grown at least several inches in height since then).

I did have a blunt hemline at hip before (actually, I think my hair may have been about an inch short of hip length), BUT I think I've grown since then. I cut my hair from hip when I was 14. Unfortunately, I don't know how tall I was then...

invisiblebabe
November 6th, 2011, 07:41 PM
I did have a blunt hemline at hip before (actually, I think my hair may have been about an inch short of hip length), BUT I think I've grown since then. I cut my hair from hip when I was 14. Unfortunately, I don't know how tall I was then...

I have not grown since age 12 (at 5'7"). That was fairly unusual to stop growing so early, though.... most of the girls who were in my class didn't stop growing until they were 15 or 16. Maybe you have pictures of you with your parents at that age, so you can compare heights relative to them? That might work :)

Annibelle
November 6th, 2011, 07:43 PM
I have not grown since age 12 (at 5'7"). That was fairly unusual to stop growing so early, though.... most of the girls who were in my class didn't stop growing until they were 15 or 16. Maybe you have pictures of you with your parents at that age, so you can compare heights relative to them? That might work :)

Ahhh, the picture thing is a good idea! I don't have pics with my parents, but I do have pics with a friend... and if she hasn't grown since then, I'll be able to figure out if I have! I wouldn't be surprised if I did growing after that, since (may be TMI) I didn't even start my period until I was 14, while the rest of my peers started years before. I also didn't start "developing" anywhere else until high school... so maybe that's when I had a growth spurt!

invisiblebabe
November 6th, 2011, 07:48 PM
Ahhh, the picture thing is a good idea! I don't have pics with my parents, but I do have pics with a friend... and if she hasn't grown since then, I'll be able to figure out if I have! I wouldn't be surprised if I did growing after that, since (may be TMI) I didn't even start my period until I was 14, while the rest of my peers started years before. I also didn't start "developing" anywhere else until high school... so maybe that's when I had a growth spurt!

Chances are you probably did grow since then, given that info. I had a chest (a small one, but it's not much bigger now :lol:) at age 10, and I started my period at age 11!

Annibelle
November 25th, 2011, 10:04 AM
Well, I'm here to update... :) I've been trimming just a bit each month. The last photos I posted in this thread were from three weeks ago. I decided to trim again last night spontaneously... I should've waited until next weekend so it would be a full month, but I have no self-control. ;) I trimmed only a half inch this time, anyway-- I'll probably trim more next weekend.

End of November:

http://i1188.photobucket.com/albums/z414/4nnibelle/PB244216-1.jpg

I don't feel like the thickness is really traveling down... I might just make the chop to BSL next weekend, but we'll see if I chicken out! I do think my hair QUALITY is improving, though, even if the length isn't. :) I think my hair looks thicker, particularly higher up... I have a lot of new growth (a lot of hairs that are about 2 inches long). Maybe I should just chop to BSL and wait a year or so for some of the rest of the hairs to catch up before moving on to work my way back to waist.