ahhh!! the evil SMT curds!

[Patrycja]

I just did a SMT using the 4 parts of the new VO5 Pomegrante(sp??)and Grape Seed Strengthing scent,1 part fote aloe,and 1/2 part honey.Oh and a few drops of Lavender EO,just to see what would happen.It washed nice,felt clean,and when I got out to the shower I put my usual jojoba oil on the ends and dab of aloe throughout the hair.The only thing I did different with the after shower routine is add a drop of Sweet Orange EO to the jojoba.I didn't notice the curds until I combed with a wide tooth comb.They are all over my hair,looks like the bad case of dandruff.

My questions are:I am going out tomorrow night,do not want to wash my hair again-will the curds go away when my hair dries???
and-What in the world did I do wrong?
I know that cones are not good with SMT but I didn't notice any cones in that particular scent.Was there one that I didn't reconize?

:confused::confused::confused:TIA

[FrannyG]

I don't know about cones in that particular VO5 conditioner, because it's not available where I live. However, I have seen the dread curds in action, and they don't just go away, I'm afraid. They do need to be washed out.

Maybe someone else will know about the Pomegranate conditioner.

[GlassEyes]

You're probably going to have to wash, though a CO might work instead of a shampoo.

Whether or not VO5 has cones depends on whether you live in the US or europe apparently. VO5 in Europe has cones for the most part by my understanding and the bottles are different.

VO5 doesn't work for my SMT's either though, and I think it's the protien in the ones I usem, but that may or may not be the problem.

[Patrycja]

oh man.I was soo afraid you all were going to say that.Crap.

[Shermie Girl]

I deal with the dreaded curds by whisking and heating my SMT. I mix my conditioner and honey together thoroughly, nuke till it is as warm as I want it, whisk it until it is nice and smooth, add aloe gel and whisk again. When I do this, I don't get any curds. :D

HTH. :)

[Stagecoach]

I deal with the dreaded curds by whisking and heating my SMT. I mix my conditioner and honey together thoroughly, nuke till it is as warm as I want it, whisk it until it is nice and smooth, add aloe gel and whisk again. When I do this, I don't get any curds. :D

HTH. :)

Good idea! My first batch was the only SMT I ever made without curds... so I completely gave it up after trying like 6 more times with 6 different conditioners!

[justgreen]

I guess I'm the only weird one, but then it might be due to blonde hair. The curds seem to just melt as my hair dries. It's just conditioner folks, try 'popping' them with your fingers and smoothing them through your hair.

[Patrycja]

oh no.They didn't melt.They stayed and made my hair look like DD3.It's horribly greasy.I'm going to do my poo bar tonight since it's "clarifying".basically my regular routine.what conditioners would be recommended if I ever gather up enough nerve to try it again?cones seem to work well with my hair but only in moderation.Meaning I use a cone condish about once a month now.

[Shermie Girl]

I use VO5 Champagne Kiss for my SMT. Works very well, especially with whisking, and it smells yummy when mixed with honey. :D

[awesometruffle]

Could you comb them out?

[wimsey]

Since I started using freeze-dried aloe (http://www.bestdeal.org/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=ALOE-F-1&Category_Code=&Store_Code=Essential) I haven't had problems with curds at all.

[Saldana]

Aggghhhhh.....I've actually stopped SMTs because the last three times, I've gotten curds, no matter what I use or if I heat it, don't heat it, whatever.

The good news, at least for my 1a/b,M,ii hair is that after my hair is completely dry, I can easily comb/BBB/pick the curds out, no need to rewash. YMMV. Good luck. :)

[chloeishere]

I get curds when I heat SMTs, though I can't remember if I get them every time. It's not a treatment I use often because it generally doesn't make my hair feel particularly great, and it's messy.
I checked the ingredients list (again) for VO5 pomegranate grapeseed, and I don't see any protein (it's also cone-free, for sure), so I don't know why it did that. I do think the aloe is generally the reason for curds, or at least the aloe reacting with something in the conditioner.

[Patrycja]

I tried a wide tooth comb and then a smaller comb to try to get rid of the nasty curds.They never went away,that's why my hair was so terribly greasy the next day.thank god,that shampooing I did got rid of the darn things.I didn't think the conditioner had any cones in it,so the next time I am going to try that Champange Kiss scent.I've used that in a CO and it was heavenly.Maybe cones is the way I need to go when I' doing a AMT.That and I'll whisk it more throughly.

[kwaniesiam]

I noticed curds depending on the order I mixed the ingrediants in. First I put honey in a bowl, then slowly add aloe while mixing it to a liquid-like consistency. Then I squirt in the conditioner, typically I used Burt's Bees raspberry and brasil nut conditioner. I always got curds when using VO5, no matter what I did. It could have been an excess of protien or cones I wasn't aware of though. I never warmed mine either. Maybe try mixing them in a different order and having them fully mixed before adding the next one?

[Patrycja]

oh thanks kwaniesiam I never thought it might have been VO5.I have Sauve Strawberry but I heard that can cause waxyness??

I have Burts Bees Sugar Beet and Grapefruit but I am worried about all those oils thats in that particular scent.I so want to make the SMT work for me.

[spidermom]

I have never gotten curds. I mix my potion in a bowl floating in hot water, usually honey, then aloe vera gel, then conditioner (I think). Now that I've declared myself, I'll probably get curds next time.

[Shorty89]

You're probably going to have to wash, though a CO might work instead of a shampoo.

Whether or not VO5 has cones depends on whether you live in the US or europe apparently. VO5 in Europe has cones for the most part by my understanding and the bottles are different.

VO5 doesn't work for my SMT's either though, and I think it's the protien in the ones I usem, but that may or may not be the problem.
Hm, do you know if VO5 in Canada has cones or not? I remember hearing that the Oasis line had cones, but the others?

[Anlbe]

I was making my SMT mix this evening, and when I added a bit more conditioner the mixture curdled! Very odd, I have no idea why this happened. I hope it doesn't have a bad effect on my hair - it's in it at the moment. Has anyone else had this happen?

[jojo]

did you use a cone condish? this happened to me when i used cones, try it without and i think you will see a difference! if you didnt use a one condish then i really dont know!

[Anlbe]

Nope, not a cone in sight. It's a cheap Boots conditioner and has always worked in the past.

[jojo]

mmm..mystery for sure, hopefully somebody will chip in!!

[kimki]

Have a look at this thread: http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=773

I have found that if I heat the honey for 10secs in the mirowave first add conditioner a little of a time, then aloe a little it seems to stop it curdling. :)

[Elizabeth]

Some brands of aloe are more likely to cause this as well. There used to be a list that identified which ones had a tendency to do this. I’m not sure where it is now. It shouldn’t affect your hair. Some aloe I had used to do this, and the worse that happened is that it was a bit harder to wash out and left some flakes of SMT in my hair.

[Jeni]

So if you use a cone conditioner it causes curds? Is that it? I did my first ever SMT with a cone free conditioner and it didn't go well. I mixed everything well, heated it and then left it on my head for something like 2 hours. When I rinsed it my hair felt dry. So dry I had to add conditioner. When I got out of the shower my hair was very tangled and "grabby". I gave up combing and then I noticed the curds, so at that point I gave up and just got back in and CWC with my normal stuff.

On another thread someone mentioned my hair my of not liked the honey so I thought I would cut that out and use EVOO or coconut oil instead. If that doesn't work would cone conditioner work? Besides curds are there any other issues? My hair loves cones, and I mean loves them, everything I use has cones, even the poo.

So anyone have hair that loves cones and does a successful SMT?

Jeni

[Patrycja]

I haven't tried it again yet.Too scared...and after what the Caramel Treatment did to me,I'm staying far away from DT's for awhile.

I'll stick to my oilings :)

[Jeni]

Um, what did the Carmel treatment do to you??

Jeni

[ColoradoDreamer]

It happened to me the first time I did an SMT because I forgot about heating the mixture. It didn't hurt my hair at all, and it didn't change the effects of the SMT.

[Katze]

My SMT curdles every time. I use Lavera deep conditioner, no 'cones, and I just thought this was "normal". It never seems to affect the SMT at all.

[Anlbe]

Thanks for the tips, I accidentally slept in the SMT treatment last night but the curdling doesn't seem to have done any harm. I let my head soak this morning and most of the bits came out then, and alot of rinsing latter the last of the lumps seem to have departed. Had to wash the bath but other than that no problems, I will make sure I heat the honey enough next time. Thanks you again!

[Anlbe]

p.s. The only difference from normal SMT is that the highlighted section of my hair has become substantially lighter, which reading the honey thread I realise is entirely expected as I didn't heat the mixture that much - a bit unfortunate as it makes my roots much more noticeable than they were before.

[Raederle]

Sometimes protein in a conditioner will make my SMT curdle.

[Patrycja]

the coconut oil and the rest of the mixture didn't combine and my hair was unbeleivably greasy when I washed it out.Even after shampoo.I posted my experience on the Caramel Treatment Thread

[Miss Murphy]

Alright, I have something to add too:
I used
Holland and Garret AVG
Redken Super Fuel treatment - that one has both cones and protein in it
NO honey

mixed it, heated it up, put it in, let it sit, and presto: curds in my hair. I had to shampoo them out in the end, because my hair was very sticky, not at all what I'm used to after a deep treatment.
So it can either be the cones or the protein, but definitely not the honey.

[Patrycja]

The last time I even tried to do another,I was actually out of honey.So,I loaded my Sauve Humectant condish(loaded with cones)with a bunch of FOTE aloe gel.I lathered it on my head,covered with plastic bag,and let it sit for about a hour.It felt really nice afterwards,no clumps!

So-I'm guessing the honey really isn't for me :shrug: Thanks for the advice Miss Murphy:flower:

[Miss Murphy]

The last time I even tried to do another,I was actually out of honey.So,I loaded my Sauve Humectant condish(loaded with cones)with a bunch of FOTE aloe gel.I lathered it on my head,covered with plastic bag,and let it sit for about a hour.It felt really nice afterwards,no clumps!

So-I'm guessing the honey really isn't for me :shrug: Thanks for the advice Miss Murphy:flower:

Hmm, so this time you used cones, but no honey (that part is just like my SMT yesterday), but also no proteins, and did not get curds.

So the protein's gotta be to blame! :rant:

[missy60]

The only time I got white flakes when doing and SMT is when I used Nexxus Emergencee treatment first. Silly me didnt read the directions about putting it on then washing it out. I washed first then used the Emergencee rinsed and applied SMT. My hair had white stuff all in it so Im thinking it was the protein. It was stuck to the hair shaft there was no way it was going to comb out.

It does say in the direction to use a moisturizing conditioner so I thought that meant one with no protein. I always mix mine in random order but always with the conditioner first. I sometimes heat it or sometimes I put it in a bowl with hot water, but heating it usually makes it more runny. I am not concerned about lightning right now though so the last few times I didnt heat it at all.

[Patrycja]

So the protein's gotta be to blame! :rant:


My hair really is picky about protein.Sometimes it feels like straw from using protein but then I do wash with poo bar and it loves :inlove: my Sauve Humectant.


ETA-that particular conditioner has protein.One of the last ingrediants(amino acids) but its there .

[RavennaNight]

I use VO5 Champagne Kiss for my SMT. Works very well, especially with whisking, and it smells yummy when mixed with honey. :D

I just used that one in SMT last nite! Love the smell, but I had CURDS GALORE! I just used 4 parts that, with 1 part clear AVG & 1 part honey! They CO'd out, but eew!

[manderly]

Hmmm, I've never had curds before.

I zap honey for about 10-15 seconds.
Take the bowl to the bathroom.
Fill with Suave Coconut and/or Suave Humectant
Fill with FOTE Aloe
Add a couple of drops of coconut oil


Tonight I was running a bath, and I actually didn't mix all that together until I got into the bath, used my fingers. Maybe that helps? Letting the honey cool a bit?

[Miss Murphy]

Hmmm, I've never had curds before.

I zap honey for about 10-15 seconds.
Take the bowl to the bathroom.
Fill with Suave Coconut and/or Suave Humectant
Fill with FOTE Aloe
Add a couple of drops of coconut oil


Tonight I was running a bath, and I actually didn't mix all that together until I got into the bath, used my fingers. Maybe that helps? Letting the honey cool a bit?

Manderly, I didn't use any honey, and still got curds. So I don't think it's the honey....

[yogachic]

I got curds, after I used FOTE aloe vera.

I did the same mix the time before, but the only difference was I used the edible aloe vera supplement, and did not get curds.

[Siava]

Just a quick update:

I've been using Suave's Aloe and Waterlily for my SMTs. I figured I'd try Suave's Coconut just for a change. The Coconut had tiny curds in the mixture so I dumped it. I remade it using the Aloe and Waterlily like usual...no curds. Hmph!

[happymommy]

I used VO5 Tangerine Tickle, Hawaiian Tropic Soothing aloe vera and generic grocery store brand honey. Added a couple of squirts of Organix Coconut Oil self-warming pre-shampoo treatment and heated for 20 seconds.

No curds here! However, it may have been pure beginner's luck.

Then again, I CO'd afterwards, so if I had curds I may not have seen them?

Perhaps I am not as think as I lucky I am...darn.

[nostalgic]

has anyone tried this with the VO5 Tea Therapy (chamomile)? I'd been planning on doing an SMT tomorrow but now i'm really paranoid about these impossible to wash out curds! we're going out to dinner tomorrow and i'd planned on doing this for both of us....feedback?

[serenitygal]

I read this thread prior to today's SMT and WOW--what a difference!
First of all, I actually MEASURED rather than guestimated. Heh.
I used:

1/8 C honey
1/8 C FOTE aloe gel
1/2 C Naturelle fragrance-free conditioner. This has 'cones (cyclomethicone) listed fourth on the ingredient list, but seems to work well for my wiry wurly hair. I get it at Sally's.
5 drops TTO (I've been a bit scaley/flaky lately)
1/2 TS jojoba oil.

Per someone's suggestion (kwaniesam, perhaps?) I heated the honey in a bowl by itself first, and then added the aloe bit by bit while whisking madly. Then (still whisking) I added the oils. Finally, I added a little conditioner at a time while whisking.

This correctly-proportioned treatment was much thicker than I have usually gotten; I think that I added more honey that I usually do. I did not heat it again; I had just heated the honey to much warmer than I would want the results to be. When I finished, it was warm but not hot. It did not curdle.

I glopped it onto wet hair and left it under a shower cap and towel for about three hours. After I rinsed it out, I did my usual leave-in routine of a small amount of diluted conditioner, a dab of a jojoba oil/shea butter mix that I make, and some aloe gel. I then wrapped the hair back up in a towel for an hour or so before putting it into my usual french twist.

From what little I see of it, I have excellent curl formation sans frizz, and the crown is very smooth and shiny without feeling product-y or greasy or wiry.

YAY! From now on, I shall do this at least once a week.

[Patrycja]

Thanks for that recipe serenitygal :flowers: That seems like it would workfor my type of hair as well. I'll cut down the honey but I never thought of TTO.I've been having the itchies bit lately as well.

[nostalgic]

serentiygal, that sounds like a good recipe for curlies who want to cut down on the honey to reduce frizz!
i did try mine with the VO5 and i didn't have any issues :D

[Patrycja]

I think I finally got it right :rockerdud: :happydance:

I mixed(eye balled is more like it)Tea Therapy,FOTE aloe,a few drops of TTO and honey.Warmed the honey for 10 seconds and cooled down before adding the other ingrediants.I finger mixed it and glopped on dry hair.I covered and let it sit for about an hour and rinsed.I did put a little bit of Burts Bees Sugar Beet and Grapefruit(no cone)condish on my ends and rinsed again.

No curds!!! I'm so glad it worked for me :) I have it in a bun right now to keep it off my back since it's supposed to get 105 degrees here today.I'm inside but I still get very hot easily.I think I have found my weekly DT ;)

[plainjanegirl]

Maybe I am dumb but what is TTO?

[Siava]

TTO is Tea Tree Oil (you're not dumb!).