LHC ruined "normal" hair for me - discuss

[whitestiletto]

Now that I know the reasons, it makes me so sad to see women with fried short hair. I know it could look different if they changed their routine but most never will. Sometimes I see an older woman with extra crispy fried hair and frankly its just sad to me. (There's been some doozies at the airport today.) They want it to look good and obviously spend a lot of time on it, but they're so misled, in my opinion.

This is more personal preference, but when I see older women with an eternal pixie or bob I wish she would grow it out so she could be proud of how pretty it is. Wasted potential?

I have always instinctively tended towards standard lhc practices, I was stretching washes as early as sixteen so maybe I am predispositioned to think this is right.

[EmiliaF]

*snip*




Really don't like the direction in which this discussion is going!

[Jing]

I don't know, I loved having short hair and always admired women who rocked their pixies. Long hair doesn't suit everyone (aesthetically/personalitywise). And if people want to fry their hair, fine, that's their choice. If that's the look they want, live and let live. What's sad is when someone is styling/treating their hair in accordance with the preferences of other people instead of their own, but you can't tell from the outside if that's the case.

Hair is just like clothing; it's personal and there are general rules for what works for your colours and hair/body type. The former is the most important. I see a lot of outfits every day that make me go "but WHY, with her body type?" and I sometimes get an urge to go over and suggest they download a couple of seasons of a Trinny & Susannah show or something along those lines, but my aesthetic preferences are not the be-all, end-all of anything. I just wonder if they're aware of how unflattering their clothes are and whether they've just resigned themselves to the maladjusted cookie cutter nature of retail. My deepest wish is really that everyone would sit their backsides down, ask themselves what they want for themselves, and go forth accordingly.

I do notice people's hair more since I joined LHC. More specifically, I notice people's long hair more. Well-suited short styles always got my attention. Mostly I find it fascinating, whether it looks well cared for or is bleached to pieces. Food for ponderings.

[Lilli]

If someone has a short hair cut but their hair is healthy, that doesn't bug me. What LHC has ruined for me is that hairstyle where it's 2 inch layers all over, frosted, poofy and so dated. I think, "Why are you torturing your hair to look that bad???"

[Sundial]

I've always noticed state of hair, ie if it's healthy or has split ends. But LHC warped my perception of what is the 'normal' length for 'long'. I used to think APL or BSL is very long and that shoulder to APL was "normal", but now I go around think "that's not long enough" if I see anything above waist

[MsBubbles]

It's really ok with me if others want to have short hair, fried or not. It saddens me that some women believe they HAVE to get the poodle perm because that's what everybody does who is no longer trying to procreate. The pressures of society (and mind-rotting daytime talk shows, no less).

But LHC has improved my interpretation of fairy-tale ends. I used to think they looked unhealthy and thin but now I think they are attractive.

I don't know why, but the word 'discuss' on the thread title bugs me to death. :-)

[Vani1902]

I have always instinctively tended towards standard lhc practices, I was stretching washes as early as sixteen so maybe I am predispositioned to think this is right.
I also have always leaned towards LHC stuff in my routine. I have been wearing my hair up practically everyday since I was five. It is actually my trademark. At 18, I started co-washing. I figured out that I could just use conditioner to wash my hair. At 12, I was putting mayo and olive oil in my hair. At 13, I discovered hair sticks and wore them until one broke... It was all so natural to me. This was all before I knew that there were websites aimed at proper hair care.
And yes, I know exactly what you mean. When I see people, the first thing I notice is their hair. I cringe when I see that it has been overly processed. I can always tell when a person has put their hair through too much.

[ilovelonghair]

I have always noticed fried hair, long before LHC, but I don't often think about it. Only if it's a real bad hairdo, color, hair cut, then I wonder what their real hair is like. I do however often think what people's hair would look like if they grow short hair out.

[AlexiaBlue]

Now that I know the reasons, it makes me so sad to see women with fried short hair. I know it could look different if they changed their routine but most never will. Sometimes I see an older woman with extra crispy fried hair and frankly its just sad to me. (There's been some doozies at the airport today.) They want it to look good and obviously spend a lot of time on it, but they're so misled, in my opinion.


YES! LHC has completely changed the way I look at hair. I live in a large city in the Southeastern US where *THE* popular style for females my age is *long, flat-ironed, layered and bleached/highlighted blonde hair. (*BTW - when I say "long", I mean APL or BSL. It is not, by any means, LHC standard long hair) Before LHC, I, sadly, was a slave to this look as well. :o Now, post- LHC, I look at all the damaged tresses, and I just cringe. :p I want to preach to them about proper hair care, but I know nobody wants to hear it. I'm just happy that I found the truth. :)

So, to answer your question, LHC has absolutely, positively ruined "normal" hair for me.

[nellreno]

It has definitely changed my view of what counts as "long" hair. My hair is just starting to brush hip and I still think of it as short (classic seems to be the length where it switches to long for me). On other sites I'll see posts from women saying how much they love their long hair but it's only APL length.

I've also noticed a much stronger preference for long hair on other women now. Thankfully I'm not yet at the point where I start telling everyone to grow their hair out because I know how much I'd dislike that.

[wvgemini]

I definately notice poor condition more now. I also think a little differently about hair care in general. Like others have said, it is their business if they want to have fried, lank, bleached on top, black on bottom (I saw a girl getting that done at the salon the other day and it looked very very ... bizarre), or whatever hair, that is their right. But I do notice hair more now, lol.

[LaFlor]

This happened to me as well. It's really kind of scary how muchy damage is in the world. I especially noticed how the hair models on infomercials (even the "afters") really don't look that great. Hollywood Stars as well, their hair just doesn't look so desirable anymore. And they are supposed to be beauty role models. Atleast we learned that money does not buy great hair... it ruins it.

[florenonite]

I prefer healthy-looking hair because that's my preference in terms of aesthetics, but I don't really feel sad for others who have, say, bleached and teased hair. It's no secret that those things damage hair, so I just presume that they're happy with their hair and are willing to sacrifice health for appearance.

[Avienda]

this might sound kinda bad, but I guess I don't mind that so many other people have fried/ruined hair because it makes mine and other LHCers locks even lovelier!
That being said, It kinda drives me crazy too, because everywhere I go now, I notice every ones hair! I can't stop looking at it! >.<

[Lollipop]

Even though I lean towards long, healthy hair, I still appreciate short (and even bleached!) hair on others. However, what makes me really sad are people who are misguided. When I see people flat iron their hair and agonize over the damage, when they don't understand why their hair is unruly, when people don't know that there are alternatives. It makes me sad that some people resign to doing stuff that is damaging, such as straighteneing, because they are trying to make the best of a bad situation. When they agonize over frizz and humidity and their uncontrollable hair, without realizing it is actually wavy, not straight, and it will never look a certain way. It makes me sad to see African-American girls with straight hair because now that I live in a predominantely black neighborhood, I realize how much they fight their hair to make it look so different from what it really is. It makes me sad that relaxers/perms/straightening are a necessity for black girls, and that natural hair is looked down upon as "nappy".

It makes me sad when people don't understand what their hair is naturally, rather they beat it into what it's "supposed" to be.:(

[bushy]

I agree with the misguided thing. Sad how many stylist convince people that their hair looks cute. Whenever I go to the salon, my husband comments how ugly most of the styles are that are promoted. There are a funny really attractive people out there that can pull it off.

[islandboo]

I don't like to see fried hair but short hair doesn't bother me - to each their own

[spidermom]

I've always noticed hair and felt perfectly comfortable about telling people when they needed a trim or whatever. What I've learned from LHC is that people think it's rude when somebody else tells them what they should do with their hair, so now I keep my lips together and explode on the inside. I'm not sure it's better, but that's what LHC has done for me.

[HairFaerie]

This is more personal preference, but when I see older women with an eternal pixie or bob I wish she would grow it out so she could be proud of how pretty it is. Wasted potential?

I agree with everything except this. ^ ^ ^

Some people really love short hair. It's might be easier for them. They might look really good with it. Short hair can be really sexy.

Not everyone likes/wants long hair. It's not wasted potential in my opinion. It is personal preference.

[Lollipop]

I agree with the misguided thing. Sad how many stylist convince people that their hair looks cute. Whenever I go to the salon, my husband comments how ugly most of the styles are that are promoted. There are a funny really attractive people out there that can pull it off.


It's not even that people think something unnattractive is gorgeous. If someone wants a hot pink mowhawk, cool. What's really sad is that people think there are no options and that they just have "bad" hair. Before I knew about caring for my hair, I was miserable. I shampooed daily and tore at my hair with a brush. I hated it so much. I remember staring at the shampoo in a store trying to decide what to buy for so long because I wanted to find something to make my hair pretty, without realizing it is more or less the same stuff. That breaks my heart. My friends tell me how my hair is pretty, and shiny, and perfect all the time (which btw, it isn't), but if I suggest something it is usually met with "Oh, I can't do that, my hair is different. I have to shampoo, blowdry, and flatiron daily or it will look like a mess. You're lucky you have pretty hair." They never realize the reason it "misbehaves" is because they try to tame it!


I'm all for variety, and the world would be pretty boring if everyone had classic length, blunt hair. It is sad when people don't like their hair and don't know what to do about it-or that they even CAN do anything about it.

[Mirsha]

meh.. I don't know, I don't really notice the state of the hair I just think "That's nice" or "Longer hair would suit you better" etc.

MY standards for long hair are rarely met in real life, but basically anything longer than my hair is long :p

[JuliaDancer]

This happened to me as well. It's really kind of scary how muchy damage is in the world. I especially noticed how the hair models on infomercials (even the "afters") really don't look that great. Hollywood Stars as well, their hair just doesn't look so desirable anymore. And they are supposed to be beauty role models. Atleast we learned that money does not buy great hair... it ruins it.

My sister is an actress and she was on an infomercial for a hair product (I think a curling iron of some sort?) that was supposed to tame your hair and give volume. She's not as obsessive as me about hair, but she takes decent care of it. Not much blow drying, and keeps it up a lot. Anyway, the stylists kept trying to mess up her hair for the "before" and they just couldn't, because it was slippery and shiny and just looked fabulously wild if they could get it to stay messy. Then they decided to flat iron it to make it look lifeless. After doing it, they said "omg it still looks great!" While the other models had the "it makes your hair go from drab to fab" pitch, they had to change the idea for her segment to "or you can change the style of your hair from straight and silky to voluminous!" Her hair's not as healthy as mine, but even just a little care can go a long way! The stylists must have been used to every model just having bad hair to start.

As for the OP, I agree that LHC has definitely ruined normal hair for me. I find myself paying attention to hair much more, and feeling sad for women who aren't taking proper care of theirs. Not even the bleached blondes, who obviously think they look good, but particularly women who I KNOW are naturally curly, but brush their hair into a frizzy mess because they think "everyone is supposed to brush their hair in the morning, right?"

[agoddess2die4]

I've never been a fan of bleached hair. Not because of the damage (because I'm often oblivious to everything around me :p) but because it just doesn't flatter a majority of skin tones. So many women try to conform to the "beach beauty" look of white blond hair and tan skin but I think that combination looks awful! I generally think that hair shouldn't be lighter than skin tone, or at least not by much. The only ones who look good with that light of hair are the ones who have a similar tone naturally (think the stereotype of the pale, blond hair, blue eyed Swede). I think maybe it's just that most people look best with a color similar to their natural color. For years I tried to be a redhead and everything but brunette, but I've finally discovered I look sooo much better with my natural brown color and finally stopped dying it. My skin looked so sallow with the red because it brought out all the yellow tone in my skin because I'm part Native American but tried to pretend I was pale and white. I think so many women would be happier with how they look if they embrace their natural color and texture because it's usually the most complimentary to their appearance.

However, I can often like a pixie cut. My mother started growing her hair out and it just wasn't flattering on her at all. Dragged her face down and made her look blah and actually aged her (though the hair itself was pretty). Once she went back to a short pixie with long bangs she looked all smart and tidy again. Me on the other hand, I look like a perpetual 12-year-old if I cut my hair above my shoulders. :shrug:

[Katurday]

I really do not care about other people's hair, on here or IRL. *shrugs* I always thought the wish to help oh ye disadvantaged fried heads was smugly superior. Its like... Shut it. Their hair is ugly and fried if yours is boring and archaic. Most people dont even notice their hair outside the daily routine, so I'd rather be a bleached beach bunny than most guilt ridden LHCers who are crying over being seduced by brushing, shampoo, cones, the "blowfrier" or any other "hair sins".

The assumption that one's hair is *better* is ignorant. There is no better! ITS DEAD. Primp it how you will!

[PinkyCat]

I have always noticed fried, dull, cotton hair. It seems like a TON of women have that shineless cotton look. I just wish I could help them without seeming like a jerk.

[Unofficial_Rose]

I could change the thread title to "LHC ruined normal haircare methods for me".

I still like the highlighted look - but on other people. My hair may be short (I cut off henndigo that went black) but I CANNOT go back to highlighting, blowdrying and occasionally straightening in the carefree manner that I used to. I used to love my highlighted blonde, too.

No, it's lightly hennaed and occasionally blowdried now. I basically cannot stand damaged hair on ME anymore. I did use L'Or&#233;al Preference Light Brown when I stopped henndigoing but after 6 months it became too dry and a little brassy so I put Lush Caca Brun on top of it. Much better. :) Just need to do it less frequently and stick to roots only.

Everyone else can do as they please, it's their hair. Plus I often think dyed and styled hair looks good on other people. I don't necessarily think long hair looks better, though. Depends on the individual. But I do hate that lavatory brush look.

[Tabitha]

I don't know why, but the word 'discuss' on the thread title bugs me to death. :-)
It gets my hackles up because it takes me back to those hated exam questions!

[PinkyCat]

I really do not care about other people's hair, on here or IRL. *shrugs* I always thought the wish to help oh ye disadvantaged fried heads was smugly superior. Its like... Shut it. Their hair is ugly and fried if yours is boring and archaic. Most people dont even notice their hair outside the daily routine, so I'd rather be a bleached beach bunny than most guilt ridden LHCers who are crying over being seduced by brushing, shampoo, cones, the "blowfrier" or any other "hair sins".

The assumption that one's hair is *better* is ignorant. There is no better! ITS DEAD. Primp it how you will!

Well I'm ignorant then. And a hair snob at that. That doesn't change my disdain for ruined hair. And because "it's dead" is all the more reason to take good care of it. I doubt the people who know their hair looks like crap because they beat the daylights out of it are utterly estatic with the way it looks either.

I know beautiful hair when i see it - and I calls it how I sees it.

[princessp]

I've been an "LHCer" virtually my whole life too. My hair has always been long (around waist) except once. I've always extended washes, knew about oils, henna, and some of the rinses (though I am always learning more here) and basically a lot about natural hair care in general.

What LHC has done for me is introduced me to how other long hair people (especially those with hair like mine) care for/deal with their hair, inspired me to try more obscure updos, and allowed me to connect with a whole lot of amazing people. But most notably LHC (and certain enabling members-enablers you know who you are!) has made me a bona fide hair toy addict!

ETA: Lol, I just realized I think I missed the whole point of this thread. I don't actually care about what other people choose to do with their hair/body whatever. I do notice if someone is wearing a gorgeous hairtoy though (and might even covet it)!

ETA II:
Primp it how you will! I read this as: pimp your hair and the visual was priceless! :D

[Mirsha]

I really do not care about other people's hair, on here or IRL. *shrugs* I always thought the wish to help oh ye disadvantaged fried heads was smugly superior. Its like... Shut it. Their hair is ugly and fried if yours is boring and archaic. Most people dont even notice their hair outside the daily routine, so I'd rather be a bleached beach bunny than most guilt ridden LHCers who are crying over being seduced by brushing, shampoo, cones, the "blowfrier" or any other "hair sins".

The assumption that one's hair is *better* is ignorant. There is no better! ITS DEAD. Primp it how you will!
I want to give you a thumbs up or a 'like' for this post.

oh wait, found it. :thumbsup:

[Naava]

I have to say that I really only care about my hair. I know how to treat it for it to be able to grow long and healthy, but I don't really mind if someone wants to do something else with their hair.

I hate it if people give me well meaning advice about my hair and I don't want to do that to anyone either (of course it's totally different if someone asks for advice).

Hair is still only hair, it's not a living thing. If I see damaged hair, I don't get all teary because it is "suffering". I think bleached hair can look good too, it's just different and it might not be possible to grow it to long length, but not everyone wants to.

[Jing]

I've never been a fan of bleached hair. Not because of the damage (because I'm often oblivious to everything around me :p) but because it just doesn't flatter a majority of skin tones. So many women try to conform to the "beach beauty" look of white blond hair and tan skin but I think that combination looks awful! I generally think that hair shouldn't be lighter than skin tone, or at least not by much. The only ones who look good with that light of hair are the ones who have a similar tone naturally (think the stereotype of the pale, blond hair, blue eyed Swede). I think maybe it's just that most people look best with a color similar to their natural color. For years I tried to be a redhead and everything but brunette, but I've finally discovered I look sooo much better with my natural brown color and finally stopped dying it. My skin looked so sallow with the red because it brought out all the yellow tone in my skin because I'm part Native American but tried to pretend I was pale and white. I think so many women would be happier with how they look if they embrace their natural color and texture because it's usually the most complimentary to their appearance.

Reminds me of something I heard on TV once. It was a styling show of some kind, and one of the women being styled was sent off to get her hair dyed because her natural hair colour "clashed with her skin tone." I was so taken aback by that. Is that even possible?

[long gone]

I have heard over and over about hair being 'dead'. And while scientifically that may be true, it's a thought that negates the whole. Since my hair has been at waist length, some interesting things have happened. My scalp no longer flakes, ever. If this is a byproduct of the weight stimulating the hair follicles, or the hair itself being a vehicle for moving sebum away from the scalp, which would make sense because the dead whole cannot interact in any other way-then wouldn't it follow that hair is a tool for overall health? While Dr.'s happily removed appendixes because they said they had no useful function, it's known now that they do. Our bodies grow hair whether we like it or not, or more importantly, whether we understand it or not. I think what LHC has done for me is to see the connection of the care we take with our hair, ie, not fighting it, frying it, or hating it-pays off in dividends. The same can be said of 'dead' soil as opposed to 'live' soil, 'dead' relationships, 'dead' jobs, anything animate or inanimate can be dead, or it can flourish. LHC seems to embrace the 'live' side, which is why I keep coming back. And shamefully, I must admit, I see a line between those that have found the 'life' in their hair, and those that obviously haven't. I am housebroken enough to never mention my thoughts out in public.

[Mairéad]

I write articles on my personal blog occasionally about alternative hair care. If someone takes something from it that's great! But otherwise, I'm not particularly mournful of other people's split ends.

The only thing that does get me time to time is when people fight so hard against their natural hair texture.

[CaityBear]

My perception of what is normally considered long is skewed now...waist is short to me now. lol

I've always thought that fried hair looked bad anyway....and same with backcombing...I have seen hair so back combed that it looks like they put a rat's nest in their hair! o_O Yeah...that's...pretty??

[Alvrodul]

Well, yes and no.
Even before discovering LHC I was not particularly fond of bleached-too-death hair - it probably have someting to do with my own adventures with bleaching when i was young. :p And I unfortunately see too many people with peroxided, cottony hair - I notice them more, now, though. And I also notice damage by flat-iron and well-BRUSHED-out curls, too - and I can't help commenting to myself on how this or that person would have looked better if she knew a few things of what I have picked up here.
On the other hand, it is their hair, hopefully they are happy with it.

One thing LHC has done, though, is making me truly appreciate beautiful hair.:)

[Mrspuddinhead]

I will say I've noticed other peoples hair more since joining LHC. Though I've always admired extremely long hair the only thing that has really changed is my idea of what is considered long.

I was watching a show the other day on WE-W called Bridezillas, anyway this young lady had raccoon hair ( I think that is the correct term)where it is dark brown on the bottom layers and bleached blonde on top. I would say it was about mid back length and she paid $130.00 dollars to have it done that way quite often. She also blow dried it and straight ironed it every day. Her hair was completely fried, extremely damaged and she referred to it as her baby. I don't think she knows how much harm she is causing her "baby." Even though I've stopped doing such things to my own hair doesn't mean someone else is and that is their personal choice. I will do what I think looks good, at the moment that is natural virgin hair.

[EmiliaF]

*snip*




Really don't like the direction in which this discussion is going!

[Slinks]

I know exactly what you mean !!! I never, I mean never (unless it was greasy and nitty and very obvious at that) checked out peoples hairs .. and now it's my life !! I even have my future DIL looking out for long hairs with me .. she used to have classic length and chopped to BSL - she's growing again because of me but she only wants to grow till she's comfy with it she says that her classic just was not comfy .. man, her hair was WL when she was 2 .. lol .. her hair grows really fast !! :-)

[Shypii90]

It's not even that people think something unnattractive is gorgeous. If someone wants a hot pink mowhawk, cool. What's really sad is that people think there are no options and that they just have "bad" hair. Before I knew about caring for my hair, I was miserable. I shampooed daily and tore at my hair with a brush. I hated it so much. I remember staring at the shampoo in a store trying to decide what to buy for so long because I wanted to find something to make my hair pretty, without realizing it is more or less the same stuff. That breaks my heart. My friends tell me how my hair is pretty, and shiny, and perfect all the time (which btw, it isn't), but if I suggest something it is usually met with "Oh, I can't do that, my hair is different. I have to shampoo, blowdry, and flatiron daily or it will look like a mess. You're lucky you have pretty hair." They never realize the reason it "misbehaves" is because they try to tame it!


I'm all for variety, and the world would be pretty boring if everyone had classic length, blunt hair. It is sad when people don't like their hair and don't know what to do about it-or that they even CAN do anything about it.


I agree with this very much. In recent years I had friends first critisising my hair because it was against the norm (flat-ironed, asymettrical, dyed, etc) and as time wore on they started giving me compliments about my hair looked as it got longer. I know a few guys with my hair and they say they have to keep it short/straightened because their hair is ugly and different and I'm just lucky. Very frustrating!

On others I relaxed on whether their hair bothered me or not. For example my younger sister had beautiful thick wavy BSL dark-blonde hair and decided to chop it off into a pixie and dye it different wacky colours every 3 weeks for a good 2 years. However she's grown out of it now, her hair has grown long again and she's really eager to grow out her natural hair colour. She still flat-irons it, but it is in much better condition than it was; she just needed time to appreciate her hair. It's the same case with many people too.

LHC did change the way I looked at hair a lot, I appreciate it a lot more now, even on strangers. Dyed hair doesn't bother me as much as it used to; when it's done well, it looks great. Seeing inches of split-ends up close on teenage girls with flat-ironed hair still bugs me a lot though. Once I saw a girl with 4-inch long hair and it was all split, I couldn't believe how damaged it was. Also now I constantly question myself when I see many redheads, as to whether their colour is natural, chemically dyed or henna. It's very difficult to tell! I haven't met one person who's had hennaed hair in person yet.

[oktobergoud]

I don't know, I loved having short hair and always admired women who rocked their pixies. Long hair doesn't suit everyone (aesthetically/personalitywise). And if people want to fry their hair, fine, that's their choice. If that's the look they want, live and let live. What's sad is when someone is styling/treating their hair in accordance with the preferences of other people instead of their own, but you can't tell from the outside if that's the case.

I do notice people's hair more since I joined LHC. More specifically, I notice people's long hair more. Well-suited short styles always got my attention. Mostly I find it fascinating, whether it looks well cared for or is bleached to pieces. Food for ponderings.

This! I do notice people's hair more now, absolutely, but I don't think everyone has to have long hair or that long hair is more pretty than short. It all depends on the person! I've had a pixie for years and loved it very much :)

[xovictoryxo]

My co worker ripped a brush thru her hair and I winced, she has fluffy frizzy long hair and I really want to steer her here because her hair makes me sad it does have potential to be GLORIOUS.

[Madora]

Well, I can't say LHC "ruined normal hair for me" because I've been noticing hair for many years before I joined.

It seems to me that not many people truly know how to care for their hair properly. Or they opt for what is "IN"..or what so and so star is wearing. Most of the time the hair suffers because the owner doesn't have either the hair type or the $$$ it takes to recreate the style successfully.

Short hair can be beautiful...but so many short hairs butcher their locks and it looks like their hair was combed by an egg beater. It's dyed, permed, shagged or whatever and fried to a frazzle.

Long hair looks even worse when its not properly cared for.

Then, too, aside from not knowing how to properly care for their hair, people may not have the time it takes to do so. Still, one wishes you could invisibly zap them with a magic wand so that the proper hair care knowledge would be instantly instilled in their mind! Think of all the damaged hair that would save!

[archel]

I noticed this phenomena just today! I never notice it when I'm not reading LHC regularly, but today I noticed that EVERY woman at the bank had dehydrated, fried hair. And it's so hot, they were all wearing it up, but I could still see how fried it was. I also noticed a very pretty older woman who had the frumpiest "old lady hair cut" ever - why do they do that? It is not a requisite for getting older to get a frumpy hair cut, even if you want it short there are pretty short hair cuts!

Ok, rant over...

[archel]

I have noticed one thing, though! It seems that teenagers and college students with long hair usually have it in pretty good condition because of the benign neglect thing! I guess if you're too busy to F with it, it's going to stay pretty healthy.

[elbow chic]

I definitely notice hair a lot more than I used to, as well. Not sure if that's a good thing, though. Used to never pay conscious attention to people's hair.

But it IS interesting now, the way people's hair, like their clothes, tends to paint a picture of who they are in society, and as individuals. I mean, for instance, my in-laws are almost the same age but I tend to think of FIL as so much older and more frail... because MIL dyes her hair religiously. I have NEVER seen a grey hair on her. She'd rather miss a couple of meals than stop going to the salon, and the color they do on her is truly flattering.

Would I have tended to think of her as "an old lady" if she had silver hair? I think I would. Not consciously paying attention doesn't mean you are free of being influenced, so it's actually nice to break down what exactly I'm seeing out there that creates the "Total Picture."

[mrs_coffee]

The women with short hair probably don't care that you think they're wasting their potential or otherwise depriving themselves. I never did. I loved my short hair.

I like my hair longer as well, but I don't see my hair as better than anyone else's. Not everyone looks good with long hair (especially if it's not taken care of) and not everyone looks terrible or old with short hair.

[invisiblebabe]

Reminds me of something I heard on TV once. It was a styling show of some kind, and one of the women being styled was sent off to get her hair dyed because her natural hair colour "clashed with her skin tone." I was so taken aback by that. Is that even possible?

Yes it's possible. I have a pale, slightly warm skin tone and VERY ASHY, cool toned dark blonde hair naturally. It looks so much better when I warm it up a bit. I don't lighten it too much, just enough to bring some golden into it.

I was born with light to medium blonde hair that darkened as I got older. So, my natural color isn't what I was born with, either ;)

[Avital88]

For me its more about the health than lenght when i see it.
Like 70% of all women have fried or overstyled/dyed hair.
so sad

[MrsGuther]

I now have a different opinion on what "long" hair is since finding LHC. I have waist length hair and it seems short to me! Most of the girls that I know have about shoulder length or APL hair, but somehow my hair still doesn't feel "long" to me. I think when my hair get to tailbone length it will feel long.

[NotInPortland]

I've started noticing damaged hair a lot more and I've also started noticing long hair on the street too! My idea of long is also ruined, I thought a few years ago my BSL hair was long but now it is short for me. A little OT but I think I've also become more sensitive to what people say about my hair as in if someone says something about changing it, before I'd just shrug it off but now I tend to get more annoyed about it :p Like the other night I was out with friends and they were ALL nagging me saying ooo you should cut your hair short, or get really short layers, I'll actually pay for it if you cut it!! :rolleyes: And also comments like "a persons hair really makes them", and then giving my hair a disapproving look bla bla, basically screaming they don't like my hair. Before LHC I probably jsut would have been like whatever, but now I get annoyed and tend to give them a piece of my mind haha(my friends or family that is, I wouldn't waste my time with strangers or acquaintances). I think LHC has made me more defensive about my choice to grow my hair and as it's been getting longer I've been getting more comments from my friends. I would never dream of saying anything like that to my friends about their hair (damaged to death by the way!!), why do longer haired people seem to be targeted?!

[americanjan1]

Agreed. When I see fried bleached out hair that's screaming for help, I sometimes mention how COwashing helped me. Then--every time so far--I hear the following phrase, "I HAVE to shampoo my hair or it will look terrible." Some just can't get their heads wrapped around the notion that it just might help. Might not, but something has to be better than that.

[Aurielle]

It's not even that people think something unnattractive is gorgeous. If someone wants a hot pink mowhawk, cool. What's really sad is that people think there are no options and that they just have "bad" hair. Before I knew about caring for my hair, I was miserable. I shampooed daily and tore at my hair with a brush. I hated it so much. I remember staring at the shampoo in a store trying to decide what to buy for so long because I wanted to find something to make my hair pretty, without realizing it is more or less the same stuff. That breaks my heart. My friends tell me how my hair is pretty, and shiny, and perfect all the time (which btw, it isn't), but if I suggest something it is usually met with "Oh, I can't do that, my hair is different. I have to shampoo, blowdry, and flatiron daily or it will look like a mess. You're lucky you have pretty hair." They never realize the reason it "misbehaves" is because they try to tame it!


I'm all for variety, and the world would be pretty boring if everyone had classic length, blunt hair. It is sad when people don't like their hair and don't know what to do about it-or that they even CAN do anything about it.
I completely agree with the lack of awareness. When I was in elementary school and junior high, I would shampoo and condition my hair, which used to be a lot curlier, with products promising pin-straight hair. I'd fry my hair with a blowdrier each night. I'd then brush with the most horrible, painful brushes because I saw them in a child's hair care book full of pictures of Barbies. I hated my hair because it only got poofy when I tried. In eighth grade, I discovered hair dye and flat irons. I really damaged my hair. Eventually I figured it out, but I'd spent years wondering why I couldn't force it to be straight and blonde.

[Arctic_Mama]

I agree! I am hyperaware of people's hair now, and the condition it is in. I don't mindif they like the way it looks, but I have an eternal preference for healthy hair at any length, and long hair in particular.

I also concur with whoever mentioned short, healthy hair looking a little like 'wasted potential'. I see some shorter heads of lush, gorgeous hair and wonder how jaw-dropping it would be if it were longer.

In the end, though, I'll respect whatever they do with their head if they lend me the same courtesy :)

[EmiliaF]

*snip*




Really don't like the direction in which this discussion is going!

[Kristamommyx3]

Since joining LHC, I've learned a LOT of things about hair, and also, surprisingly, myself. I obviously learned more about proper haircare, but, I realized that I have been, am, and will probably always be a "hair person"...and that's OK! I enjoy not just my hair, but anyone else's that would let me get close enough to theirs. ;). So, I am growing my hair long for ME, and now that I'm consciously aware of this as my hobby, I enjoy the process so much more! Oh, and my idea of long has forever changed, too. I only notice hair waist length and longer, or really short and wild, now. Lol. The rest of the hair world is basically invisible to me. :D

[UltraBella]

I look at hair constantly because I own two salons, so LHC has nothing to do with it for me personally. I notice really damaged short hair/really damaged long hair daily. I see unattractive short hair/unattractive long hair daily. I see gorgeous short hair/gorgeous long hair daily.

I believe the majority of people enjoy doing "stuff" to their hair and except that it is damaging. I also think that the majority of people IRL find very long hair to be boring. It's all a matter of perception. I am okay with anyone doing absolutely anything to their hair. Who am I to judge ? I color, bleach, highlight, lowlight and use a curling iron. My hair looks great in my opinion and that's the only opinion that matters.

[mallorykay13]

this might sound kinda bad, but I guess I don't mind that so many other people have fried/ruined hair because it makes mine and other LHCers locks even lovelier!
That being said, It kinda drives me crazy too, because everywhere I go now, I notice every ones hair! I can't stop looking at it! >.<

Im feeling ya.

[Sooze]

I think it's easy to sound smug about hair when in possession of smooth, bouncy, silky, shiny, healthy hair and do everything "right." Easy to assume everyone who doesn't have it fries their hair.

Not everyone who has damaged dry poofy hair mistreats it. Sometimes it's a health thing, or a genetic tendency.

I used to go to school with a girl who had short thick wiry hair the texture and appearance of a teased out brillo pad (wire wool). In her twenties she had it chemically straightened and colured. She ended up with longer, smooth shiny hair that she loved and hardly any of us could credit.

This thread reminds me of the Yeats poem:

Never shall a young man,
Thrown into despair
By those great honey-coloured
Ramparts at your ear
Love you for yourself alone
And not your yellow hair .

[MonaLisa]

Oh yeah!
When I am on my way somewhere - in a bus, or walking or shopping, i tend to notice hair much more, and mourn it...so much hair wasted, bleached, thinned out, same 'trendy' cuts..
sigh, hurts me even more when it has amazing potential...and imagine it long...
Also I'm much more strict with my hair, it does look better than ever but noticing details that are wrong make me unhappy with it too often.
I fell in love with leaving it all natural, texture and color! and learned to appreciate nice updos, when i learned how challenging it is to make them!

[winona]

This thread is very interesting because I too have noticed since frequenting hair boards that I am very aware of damaged hair surrounding me. Sometimes I want to run up to little girls and women alike to tell them how they can fix their situation but I dont want to offend.

[redcelticcurls]

The women with short hair probably don't care that you think they're wasting their potential or otherwise depriving themselves. I never did. I loved my short hair.

I like my hair longer as well, but I don't see my hair as better than anyone else's. Not everyone looks good with long hair (especially if it's not taken care of) and not everyone looks terrible or old with short hair.

Ditto.
It's smugness bordering on arrogance to think that short hair is wasted potential, and I doubt that many who choose to wear short hair cares that someone wants it longer to meet some imaginary potential or limited idea of femininity.

[Of the Fae]

I know people who look great with short hair, but I see many many women that seem to wear it that way because it's more convenient, not because it looks better.
I see a lot of fried hair around me as well, and it makes me sad that the people that wear it don't seem to be aware of what causes this and how badly their hair is damaged!

One can, I guess only set a good example by taking care of your hair yourself, so you can give advice to people that ask you when they see your beautiful hair :P

[Raiscake]

Frequenting hair forums has definitely made me more aware of damaged hair around me, but it hasn't really changed my views much on hair itself. I loved my short hair and I don't regret chopping it off at all 2 years ago. If some women want to keep their hair short, that's fine with me. Whatever makes them happy. Long hair doesn't always equate as more beautiful.

[Grejs]

I really do not care about other people's hair, on here or IRL. *shrugs* I always thought the wish to help oh ye disadvantaged fried heads was smugly superior. Its like... Shut it. Their hair is ugly and fried if yours is boring and archaic. Most people dont even notice their hair outside the daily routine, so I'd rather be a bleached beach bunny than most guilt ridden LHCers who are crying over being seduced by brushing, shampoo, cones, the "blowfrier" or any other "hair sins".

The assumption that one's hair is *better* is ignorant. There is no better! ITS DEAD. Primp it how you will!

This, couldn't have said it better myself.

[nobeltonya]

I'm fixated on ends.. particularly splits and unhealthy ones. :P I was in the bank yesterday, and the girl helping me had the prettiest, shiniest hair.. on her scalp. But, her ends were dull and frizzy. I would have never noticed that before.

[Revontuletar]

I've never been a fan of bleached hair. Not because of the damage (because I'm often oblivious to everything around me :p) but because it just doesn't flatter a majority of skin tones. So many women try to conform to the "beach beauty" look of white blond hair and tan skin but I think that combination looks awful! I generally think that hair shouldn't be lighter than skin tone, or at least not by much. The only ones who look good with that light of hair are the ones who have a similar tone naturally (think the stereotype of the pale, blond hair, blue eyed Swede).
I totally agree! Tan + bleached hair = ugly, in my opinion.
I have never liked short hair, and I have never understood the whole obsession with ultra short hair, especially on guys, when I think that so many would look a lot better if they just grew some hair! I have not always had long hair, and have even gone pixie length a couple of times in my life, but that was mainly because I thought my hair was too stringy, ratty and unmanageable and would never grow past BSL anyway (now I know differently, since I have actually started trying to look after it.) When I had long hair previously, I never knew anything about looking after it, and had to get haircuts purely for the reason that it was out of control.

[virgo75]

It's really ok with me if others want to have short hair, fried or not. It saddens me that some women believe they HAVE to get the poodle perm because that's what everybody does who is no longer trying to procreate. The pressures of society (and mind-rotting daytime talk shows, no less).

But LHC has improved my interpretation of fairy-tale ends. I used to think they looked unhealthy and thin but now I think they are attractive.

I don't know why, but the word 'discuss' on the thread title bugs me to death. :-)


2nd all of this especially the bolded. :lol:

Another pet peeve is the word "DIVINE!!!" used to describe the scent of everything. :rolleyes: You might like the way something smells, but what the heck does it smell like? And is it really "divine?" Do people really know what that word means? Because they use it like they don't. >_<

/threadjack

[Tuna]

I notice it a LOT... but i don't really care. Anyone do what makes them happy. My schoolmate had her black hair bleched to platinum blonde, and indeed, they look like WOOL! But if she likes it then fine...
One thing i hate is when i tell people with hair in much worse condition than mine how to take care of it, how i do it (when they ask me for tips)... and they just look at me, and say that my methots are bad. Well what, are you blind? Look at my hair, and look at yours. This really annoys me.
And my perception for lenght has changed too. I used to think that BSL hair is very long. But now I have hip lenght, and it doesn't feel long enough. I think that when i reach tail bone, or at least butt... then i could call my hair long. =)

[curlymarcia]

I came to the forum with the goal of having long hair. BSL was pretty long for me at that time. Now, I only consider waist and beyond as long hair.

[redcelticcurls]

I really do not care about other people's hair, on here or IRL. *shrugs* I always thought the wish to help oh ye disadvantaged fried heads was smugly superior. Its like... Shut it. Their hair is ugly and fried if yours is boring and archaic. Most people dont even notice their hair outside the daily routine, so I'd rather be a bleached beach bunny than most guilt ridden LHCers who are crying over being seduced by brushing, shampoo, cones, the "blowfrier" or any other "hair sins".

The assumption that one's hair is *better* is ignorant. There is no better! ITS DEAD. Primp it how you will!

This is one of the best posts ever.

[whitestiletto]

Well I guess healthy pixies don't bother me so much, as fried pixies or abandoned short hair.

[whitestiletto]

I don't know why, but the word 'discuss' on the thread title bugs me to death. :-)

Is it KNIT? :-(

[Cassie 123]

I'm not too focused on other people's hair, even post-LHC, but I am much more likely to notice nice braids and updos now. The only thing for me that is really relevant to this thread is that my brain is now easily confused when I see haircuts with lots of layering. I look at the person's comparatively thin ends and my brain automatically says, "where did all of her hair go?" :confused:

[pixiedust]

I really do not care about other people's hair, on here or IRL. *shrugs* I always thought the wish to help oh ye disadvantaged fried heads was smugly superior. Its like... Shut it. Their hair is ugly and fried if yours is boring and archaic. Most people dont even notice their hair outside the daily routine, so I'd rather be a bleached beach bunny than most guilt ridden LHCers who are crying over being seduced by brushing, shampoo, cones, the "blowfrier" or any other "hair sins".

The assumption that one's hair is *better* is ignorant. There is no better! ITS DEAD. Primp it how you will!

Thank you.

It makes me really sad to hear somebody say that they feel bad/pose judgement for those with fried, broken or otherwise 'unhealthy' hair. Most people who've made a transition from coloured/damaged hair to long healthy hair probably know better than those of you who have always taken good care of your hair; It is very, very different. I'm just going to share my story because maybe it'll shed some light here.

a little background: My mom was a hair dresser for the majority of the 80's, and my mom's mom was, too (in the 50's and 60's).They both have straight/wavy fine/med textured hair. I've always had very curly, extremely fine hair that I get from my dad.

My mom always cared for my hair when I was younger. She would blowdry it, scrunch it, comb it etc. When I was 7 my parents got divorced, and she struggled with a very deep depression. We moved, she got a job, and spent all her time there or locked in her bedroom. Basically i spent 5 years of my life eating take out pizza/chinese and not detangling/conditioning my hair. Kids in school would always make fun of me because I had a rats nest on my head. It sounds stupid but it severely affected my sense of self. I constantly felt alienated from my peers and I had no friends.

I got a flat iron in 6th grade for my birthday and It seriously saved my self esteem. I used it every day up until I started growing out natural (with henna), and I still have the damn thing because It's like a teddy bear to me, haha. I never knew that you had to comb/brush/detangle/scrunch hair. Nobody taught me. Growing my hair to APL a few years ago (straight) made me so happy I cried.

I dont want to ramble with my sob story hear, but that's what inspired me to become a hair dresser myself. I recently came across a girl with 'fried' hair who lived with a single mom (white, stick straight fine hair) and never new her (black) father. She made me so sad when she told me her story because it was so similar to mine.

The point being is that you don't always know the people you're judging. Sorry to go off topic, I just get really offended by this type of thing. :o

[Lianna]

I think it's easy to sound smug about hair when in possession of smooth, bouncy, silky, shiny, healthy hair and do everything "right." Easy to assume everyone who doesn't have it fries their hair.

Not everyone who has damaged dry poofy hair mistreats it. Sometimes it's a health thing, or a genetic tendency.

I wish more people understood this. Coarse hair will be naturally less soft, and curly/wavy will have some degree of frizz naturally.

Being a wurly, I don't like to define every wave/curl with gel, it may look nice but doesn't feel nice. I like to run my fingers through my hair. My hair won't be as defined because of all that, but that doesn't mean I don't take good care of my hair, or that isn't healthy.

And please don't assume someone with short hair doesn't know how to take care of it/can't grow it. They might just like short hair, or had an accident and are growing/taking care of it, results (health and length) take time to show.

Don't give me that "look at my long hair and look at your short hair" comparison. The person with long hair probably was growing it for over four years, the person with short might just have started his/her journey, and might have already read about how to care of hair, or it was just their option to have it short and knew hair care all along.

(I'm not talking specifically with anyone in the thread)

ETA: And stretching washes isn't all that good for everybody. It gives me fungal infections, how do you like that? <.<

[RoseRed27]

Being on hair forums has definitely spoiled me in regards to what I think is attractive hair. Like others have said, hair can be attractive at any length, texture, color etc. as long as it is healthy.(not breaking too much, smooth, bouncy, fluffy, shiny, sheeny--whatever is a marker for health for that particular texture.)

So many have said, it doesn't matter if a person wants to have fried hair. But I remember what it was like on the "other side". I didn't know that my hair was damaged. :shrug:I thought it was normal to have broken pieces of hair all over the bathroom sink. My mother had that; my friends did too. It wasn't until I wanted to grow out my hair, that I learned it's not the best thing to iron double processed hair with a smoking straightener that has the ceramic chipping off. :p

I don't think I'm being arrogant, but I could see how it might come across that way if the intention is to make yourself feel better about your own hair. I don't feel like a guru who has been given a divine secret and now I must share it with the ignorant masses. I wish someone with nice hair tapped me on the shoulder at the drugstore and gave me a bottle of olive oil and told me to put down the Vaseline. But, then again I might have gotten offended and left.:lala:

[ilovelonghair]

You know what is weird? I seem to be nearly the only one around with healthy hair here. I find that weird.
I had lots of compliments on my hair yesterday and referred my friends to this site. They have good hair and I am sure they can get way nicer hair than me! Just a matter of changing their routines a bit I think. They dye their hair as well, but it doesn't seem too damaged, so that's good.

They said that my hair was 'crazy long', I mentioned it was short haha!

[TrudieCat]

I love seeing natural hair textures of all types. It's easy to tell which textures have been manipulated and which are natural, and I just love all the variation that's part of natural textures. :) I don't think I appreciated that so much before I got into this site and NC.com.

[dulce]

Another very interesting thread!Katurday was a little blunt in how she phrased things in my opinion but 1 do agree overall with what she said.Though 1 much much prefer the look of long natural hair, many don't.What bugs me is the pressure our society/beauty industry puts on us women to look a certain way.Women are so brainwashed to how they must look like that anyone outside the norm can be looked on with hostility.This becomes much more apparent with age.Try being a gray haired lil old lady wearing long loose flowing hair.1 have never told another woman her hair is inappropriate or ugly even if 1 disliked the look of it.It is her hair and her choice of how to wear it.It is not my place to tell her my opinions.She must like it or she'd change it,people aren't stupid. I also heartily dislike the short overly processed permed dyed hair seen especially in my older ladies age group and it is not my choice of hair do but it is theirs.They are happy with it.1 have been told by strangers[ older females] who's opinions 1 never asked for or wanted, that 1 am trying to look like a teenager or ,that all long hair makes older women look like witches.1 found that last comment to be especially offensive and 1 said so at the time to the person.1f our society would be a little more open in the perceptions of how women[especially older ones,you younger ones still have more leeway 1 think] should look, then 1 think more women of all ages would feel freer in their own choices of they should/could look and less judgemental of others who choose differently.1 never watch those tv makeover shows for that reason.Because of past criticism 1 don't wear my hair down as much but hide it in a bun and use my hair toys.It annoys me no end that that 1 feel 1 need to hide my hair length[as if there's something wrong] to conform as an oldster and sometimes 1 get fed up and just wear it loose anyway.1 like the free loose feeling of it just down with no pulling and restrictions.Hopefully if enough of us oldsters grow our hair longer and let the natural sparklies show,over time our societie's perceptions will broaden a bit.1 wonder if the older men or even younger men here on this forum with long hair face the same problem .Guys? would love to hear your comments.This topic is an especially painful one for me and 1 just hope 1 never have to enter a nursing home in the future and be the only one there with long gray hair.1 plan to die with a long white braid down past my waist.1 feel at home in my long hair.1 am grateful to have found this forum with it's wealth of info and support for all ages.

[dulce]

1 don't think The long hair forum ruined normal hair for me ,it showed me more choices and tons of info.It just gave me support.It did increase my wish for much longer hair than 1'd originally planned for though.And 1 do notice all the different hair choices/styles on people more than before.

[Sunshineliz]

It's "ruined" it for me in that I notice damage more and find fried hair a little sad. I understand though that few people understand healthy haircare and some couldn't care less if even if they did. I also understand no one wants unsolicited advice--so I wouldn't dream of telling them what I think of their hair if I didn't like it.

LHC and NC have also made me appreciate different hair textures more. In my ignorance I believed frizz of any kind a sign of damage.:o Only sleek straight, wavy, or ringlets looked healthy to me. Now I understand most frizz just to be wayward baby hairs and not a sign of damage. I wonder now just how damaged my hair was when I chopped it off pre-LHC. I'm sure there was some, but I'd also gotten curlier and had a lot of baby hairs from post-baby shed. Perhaps I would have appreciated it more.

Anyway, I'd been a long-hair (between waist and tailbone) for about 20 years when I cut it off so I'd been very used to the idea that I generally liked long hair and that most people didn't want hair that long and found my hair unusual. I find LHC hair longer than tailbone beautiful, but I still don't want mine that long. I find hair of any length beautiful as long as it is cared for well. Incidentally, I can find someone's hair very beautiful, but look strange on them. IRL I've seen short hair that just didn't suit someone and they'd probably look better long. I've seen a woman with gorgeous hip-length hair in excellent shape but I just don't think it looks great on her.:shrug: But of course that is my opinion and they can do whatever they want.

I agree with you too dulce that many people are brainwashed into thinking "magazine" hair is the only beautiful there is. If we continue to wear our hair the way we want perhaps people's perceptions will change. I hope I don't end up the person everyone accuses of trying to be a teenager--just because I don't like the negative attention. Hopefully I'll have the courage to wear it how I like despite criticism. I've already had plenty of people tell me after my cut how they prefer it short. Well, I and DH prefer it long and I'd rather please us anyday.

[whitestiletto]

In response to the several comments accusing members of being arrogant judgemental etc for valuing healthy hair -- hold your tongue if you have nothing positive to contribute.

In response to the decidedly catty remarks about my use of the word 'discuss' in the title -- it is very unecessary to announce your distaste for a word and I don't understand at all the attacks. For those interested in Positive Mental Attitude, I modeled the thread title after a Saturday Night Live quote, "The thighmaster is neither a thigh nor a master. Discuss." You can read a bunch more on the SNL Coffee Talk Wikipedia page, if it doesn't "bug you to death" ms bubbles. Why have a fluffy name and an antagonistic attitude. I'm disturbed people are trolling over semantics and others are seconding!

I'm upset about the attacks to character on this thread. I come to LHC for civil discussion.

[whitestiletto]

I started this thread and I don't even want to read it anymore because its nasty.

[Sunshineliz]

Just as an aside--I don't mind the word "discuss" at all. I've actually seen it on several threads here. Perhaps people are having horrifying flashbacks to exams?:p

And I don't find people thinking damaged hair is sad or short hair isn't living up to potential as arrogant. Everyone is entitled to their opinion--as long as they're not voicing them on anyone's hair in particular, especially in public.

[halo_tightens]

I used to go to school with a girl who had short thick wiry hair the texture and appearance of a teased out brillo pad (wire wool). In her twenties she had it chemically straightened and colured. She ended up with longer, smooth shiny hair that she loved and hardly any of us could credit.

This actually reminded me of a girl I knew when I was in school. Her hair was truly impossible to work with because of its texture, which was neither straight nor wavy nor curly nor kinky. It really was like steel wool, only in a bright neon orange color. She was unhappy with it, of course, and usually ended up pulling it back skin-tight to her head in a very unattractive style just to completely eradicate its texture.

I saw her later, as a young adult, and she had also had her hair straightened and colored. Her hair was worn completely down for the first time that I'd ever seen, and she looked happy. To me, that's what matters.

The point, though, is that it looked better than it had before. It's only sad to me when I see people doing things that damage their hair, then are truly upset about the state of their damaged hair, then try doing something different to "fix" it, which damages it even more... and so on. A woman I know bleaches her brown hair to platinum because it's "too oily" and the constant bleaching fixes that, but always complains about how fragile and breakable her hair is and how she can't grow it any longer. :confused:

A little education and understanding here could change people's lives, but it's just not welcomed for some reason. I try not to give a crap, but it's frustrating when you do know better.

[boomtownrat]

I definitely notice hair a lot more than I used to, as well. Not sure if that's a good thing, though. Used to never pay conscious attention to people's hair.

But it IS interesting now, the way people's hair, like their clothes, tends to paint a picture of who they are in society, and as individuals. I mean, for instance, my in-laws are almost the same age but I tend to think of FIL as so much older and more frail... because MIL dyes her hair religiously. I have NEVER seen a grey hair on her. She'd rather miss a couple of meals than stop going to the salon, and the color they do on her is truly flattering.

Would I have tended to think of her as "an old lady" if she had silver hair? I think I would. Not consciously paying attention doesn't mean you are free of being influenced, so it's actually nice to break down what exactly I'm seeing out there that creates the "Total Picture."

Well, I'm not really sure how to interpret what you mean by this, so I'll just assume positive intent. :D I can only use myself as an example of why I think this kind of thinking is not really accurate: people tell me all the time that I look ten or more years younger than I am, yet my hair is completely silver. If I had a lot of wrinkles, then sure, I'd look old, but in some cultures age is valued. Silver is only another hair colour -- and it happens to be the hair colour that sparkles like diamonds. :cool:

In fact, I can say that LHC has made me notice silver (white, grey, salt & pepper, cinnamon sugar, etc.) hair more than I did before I joined. It has not made me pay a lot of attention to other people's hair health or lack thereof, though. People can do what they want with their hair as I do what I want with mine. I used to dye it black and rat it out like Robert Smith, I've had it shaved underneath and dyed burgundy, etc. I liked it then, I like the way it is now, and that's all that matters to me. :shrug:

[Lollipop]

I try not to give a crap, but it's frustrating when you do know better.

This. I assume people are happy, but when they present their frusutrations, I want to help. Remembering how unhappy I was, it makes it difficult to hold my tongue even though most people don't appreciate having their haircare methods undermined. I really wish that I had an awesome, LHC best friend there to help me.

Don't all of you remember finding out about CO, CWC, SO, WO, oiling, BBBs, and SMTs and how crazy some of it sounded? Most of us luckily discovered LHC and got to do enough research to make things sound reasonable, and see the proof. If one aquaintance told you to try one of these things, it would be much more difficult to accept than when you browse through one of the mega-threads. So, when people complain, I try to compliment them on something about their hair. Sometimes I gently suggest tips or tell them about what I do if they are my friends, and do my best to comfort them. Most people don't care, and that's fine, but I have convinced one friend that her hair is not straight, but that doesn't mean it is not beautiful. She is currently also trying to grow her hair out.

While I do think I have healthier hair than many of those around me, I honestly do not feel smug, or arrogant about the fact. Others have some way cooler hairstyles and colors, and if that makes them happy, so be it. Most people probably don't understand that I am happy doing updos and doing things like brushing with a BBB. I don't think somebody having split ends or dry hair is some crime against humanity, and I really don't care unless they are truly unhappy with what they are currently doing. I just try to make myself available for advice for the unhappy ones, and admire all the cool things people are doing to their hair (whether it is damaging or not).

[Grejs]

In response to the several comments accusing members of being arrogant judgemental etc for valuing healthy hair -- hold your tongue if you have nothing positive to contribute.

So, the only right answer is that LHC-hair is the superior one? Because that IS arrogant, and I don't really see how that is considered positive either.

And also, just because people don't agree with you, you don't want to read the thread anymore....? Didn't you write "discuss"?

[MsBubbles]

2nd all of this especially the bolded. :lol:

Another pet peeve is the word "DIVINE!!!" used to describe the scent of everything. :rolleyes: You might like the way something smells, but what the heck does it smell like? And is it really "divine?" Do people really know what that word means? Because they use it like they don't. >_<

/threadjack

LOL! Just noticed this! I have a similar peeve about the word 'delicious' used to describe people. Ew! Yuck!

Sorry for the thread rejack.

[elbow chic]

For those interested in Positive Mental Attitude, I modeled the thread title after a Saturday Night Live quote, "The thighmaster is neither a thigh nor a master. Discuss." You can read a bunch more on the SNL Coffee Talk Wikipedia page

haha, I remember those. I knew where you were going with it. Maybe the 'youngies' don't-- Coffee Talk was a long time ago!

[MsBubbles]

In response to the decidedly catty remarks about my use of the word 'discuss' in the title -- it is very unecessary to announce your distaste for a word and I don't understand at all the attacks. For those interested in Positive Mental Attitude, I modeled the thread title after a Saturday Night Live quote, "The thighmaster is neither a thigh nor a master. Discuss." You can read a bunch more on the SNL Coffee Talk Wikipedia page, if it doesn't "bug you to death" ms bubbles. Why have a fluffy name and an antagonistic attitude. I'm disturbed people are trolling over semantics and others are seconding!

I'm upset about the attacks to character on this thread. I come to LHC for civil discussion.


Holy Cow!!! I just said it bugged me to death! That's my opinion just like yours is about other people's hair. How is my opinion about a word 'antagonistic'? That's ugly.

Catty? Good grief.

Yeah it's a real Positive Mental Attitude to flounce, too.

I could bore you with the meaning behind my 'fluffy' username, and it has nothing to do with fluff, I assure you. So my username went right over your head like your 'discuss' went right over mine.

Sorry - I don't watch SNL. So your joke fell on my deaf ears.

[Copasetic]

Ditto.
It's smugness bordering on arrogance to think that short hair is wasted potential, and I doubt that many who choose to wear short hair cares that someone wants it longer to meet some imaginary potential or limited idea of femininity.


I really do not care about other people's hair, on here or IRL. *shrugs* I always thought the wish to help oh ye disadvantaged fried heads was smugly superior. Its like... Shut it. Their hair is ugly and fried if yours is boring and archaic. Most people dont even notice their hair outside the daily routine, so I'd rather be a bleached beach bunny than most guilt ridden LHCers who are crying over being seduced by brushing, shampoo, cones, the "blowfrier" or any other "hair sins".

The assumption that one's hair is *better* is ignorant. There is no better! ITS DEAD. Primp it how you will!

Both of these posts rock so much.

These kinds of threads pop up every once in a while, and I find them pretty frustrating. Let's just stick to growing our own hair and not worry about those who choose not to.

[Darkhorse1]

I think I know what the OP was hoping to start---just a discussion about noticing hair more than before after being here.

I've always noticed hair, but I love all types of hair--I LOVE short cuts because I find them fascinating--I can't do short --don't have the neck or face, but I admire those who can. I love my long hair and hope to have it for ages.

I'm a person who believes that hair is about expression. What I would do I wouldn't expect my friends to do. Not everyone has hair that will grow long--many of my friends have short hair due to the fact that it won't grow out nicely. I always admired their lovely short styles.

[elbow chic]

Well, I'm not really sure how to interpret what you mean by this, so I'll just assume positive intent. :D I can only use myself as an example of why I think this kind of thinking is not really accurate: people tell me all the time that I look ten or more years younger than I am, yet my hair is completely silver. If I had a lot of wrinkles, then sure, I'd look old, but in some cultures age is valued. Silver is only another hair colour -- and it happens to be the hair colour that sparkles like diamonds. :cool:


I'm not a grey hair hater; I fully intend to be a Renegrey myself when the time comes. Because, yes, I am much too lazy to keep up a dye regimen. :laugh: Also, too much of a cheapskate.

I just had no real idea how common hair coloring among women-of-a-certain age is, till I started hanging around LHC. I just never thought about it at all, so unless it was REALLY obvious, I would tend to let people's hair guide my assumptions about their age, which is obviously stupid in a world of cheap boxed dye at Wal-Mart.

My mother-in-law, for instance, would even straight up TELL me she colors hers, but I really didn't quite comprehend that under the shiny auburn, she's probably every bit as grey as FIL is.

She does it to convey a certain image-- of vigor and energy-- and it works! You can be rightfully angry about the way our culture overvalues youth, but for years I thought of her as ten years younger than FIL. (she's two years younger, not a decade.) If she had silver hair, I don't think I'd have been quite as quick to have her babysit my crowd of rambunctious kids. :laugh: Let the poor sweet old lady retire!

Part of it is her attitude and energy, and part of it is the way she presents herself physically. Part of that self-presentation is her dyed hair. Everyone says those kinds of shallow material things are beneath their notice. At at conscious level they probably are. But... I think most of our judgments about other people are not really made at a conscious level.

[Roseate]

Everyone says those kinds of shallow material things are beneath their notice. At at conscious level they probably are. But... I think most of our judgments about other people are not really made at a conscious level.

My mother would back you up on this! She looked quite lovely with the silver hair she sported for about a year, no-one including me would have said she looked older... but people stopped mistaking her for my sister, and seats were offered on public transportation that have never been offered before or since!

She started dying it because she was tired of getting treated like a little old lady. She liked the perks of greater perceived age a little bit, but prefers the alternative.

[snakewitch]

For most normal people who buy into whatever stupid thing they're told("bleach is healthy" is one I heard) and don't really care what it actually does for hair, I kinda feel sorry for their hair, no matter how good it may look. :p Yes, I feel emotions towards something dead that grows out of people's heads. I'm weird.

[Roseate]

What's really sad is that people think there are no options and that they just have "bad" hair.

And as to the OP, I agree with the above! My life is greatly improved now that I know how to care for my wurly hair, and now that I've ended my ugly sulfate-caused scalp problems. I used to think my hair was just frizzy straightish, and that my scabby scalp was just like that, nothing to be done. I feel bad for people like my former self, just clueless. But I don't give advice unless asked.

Short hair, though, is fun! I've had it, I liked it, I'd do it again. In general, I also agree with the below:


Their hair is ugly and fried if yours is boring and archaic.

Long natural hair is not to everyone's taste any more than bleached hipster-mullets are.

[SusanSt]

Long hair can be so beautiful IF it's healthy! Though I love seeing women with longer hair, I can certainly also appreciate shorter hair that is healthy and shiny. I guess I do value "quality over quantity" (or length?!). I vote for both long and healthy!

[neko_kawaii]

After reading so many laments here on LHC about the lack of long hair and prejudices against long hairs I have been on the look out for such things as well as hair toys and interesting updos. I can't remember particularly noticing other people's hair prior to LHC except for styles that people were rocking, regardless of length.

I've never been one to read style mags or watch celebrity news shows so I'm clueless as to what the current trends are, maybe with my new interest in observing hair I will start to pick up on these trends in the wild so to speak. I have always assumed that people wore their hair in a manner that pleased them or suited their tasks for the day. I find it very sad to think that there are people who battle what their hair to achieve some sort of nebulous idea they have been sold of what it should be.

I have been considering getting a copy of Curly Girls for my mama who has stunning long curly rust/copper red hair but knowing my mama, though she likes her curls, she has zero interest in spending any time on her hair, so I think I'll be passing along the new easy updos I'm learning instead.

[dragonchickx]

I don't understand why this threads is so offensive? I get what youre saying about some peoples potential, but on the other hand some people like my mom don't want to have to start all over again you know? Like growing out bleach and hair dye is hard for some people that have to be presentable on a daily basis.. : ) no hard feelings here..

[pixi_stix]

The thing that bugs me is when people style thier hair in the latest trend, even if it doesn't suit them. It's worse when this 'fashionable' style is ruining thier hair. The style that bugs me the most is when women get to a certain age (Over 50 usually) and think they must chop off thier hair and have it permed. I've sat on buses that were full of pensioners. Looking at the rows of cropped permed hair was like looking at a feild of white/silver cabbages.

The other thing that bugs me is when I see someone with loads of split damaged ends. It just makes me want to get a pair of scissors and chop the mess off.

My friends sister thinks her hair is better than mine and loves to pass comment on how my hair is thin and I should cut it short. I always tell her I'd rather have long thin hair than the messy mop she has. I know that sounds mean, but we do love each other to bits, we just have the kind of relationship that involves a lot of good natured insults. Though my insults must have hit home because the last time I saw her she had chopped about 6 inches off her hair and it looked far healthier and I told her so.

[racrane]

I don't understand why people are upset about this thread, either. She pointed out what I agree with - when you start learning more about hair, you notice other's hair, too, for good or bad. And yes, I think some girls could look so pretty if they stopped damage, but it doesn't really matter to me unless they ask my opinion. It's their hair. I think the girl who started this meant simply that people notice hair more now that they joined here. That's all.

[cheetahfast]

The thing that bugs me is when people style thier hair in the latest trend, even if it doesn't suit them. It's worse when this 'fashionable' style is ruining thier hair.

This reminds me of a story my father tells about getting a trendy "Beatles" haircut many many years ago. He went and had layers cut into his hair after growing it out a bit. The person who did his hair straightened it after cutting it, which made it look exactly like the in-style cut. A few hours later his hair curled up tightly, since he had naturally curly hair. My father swears it was the best thing he ever did since the trendy haircut gave him the best afro anyone else had ever seen. The cut inspired him to become a long-hair...or I guess a tall hair! His afro was huge!! I must look for a picture and post it!

Sorry for the off topic hijack!

[pixi_stix]

Just goes to show that trying to be fashionable can make you a trend setter :D

[Rini]

Well, I'm not really sure how to interpret what you mean by this, so I'll just assume positive intent. :D I can only use myself as an example of why I think this kind of thinking is not really accurate: people tell me all the time that I look ten or more years younger than I am, yet my hair is completely silver. If I had a lot of wrinkles, then sure, I'd look old, but in some cultures age is valued. Silver is only another hair colour -- and it happens to be the hair colour that sparkles like diamonds. :cool:

In fact, I can say that LHC has made me notice silver (white, grey, salt & pepper, cinnamon sugar, etc.) hair more than I did before I joined. It has not made me pay a lot of attention to other people's hair health or lack thereof, though. People can do what they want with their hair as I do what I want with mine. I used to dye it black and rat it out like Robert Smith, I've had it shaved underneath and dyed burgundy, etc. I liked it then, I like the way it is now, and that's all that matters to me. :shrug:

Absolutely!! Nobody is offering ME their bus seats :D

[florenonite]

In response to the several comments accusing members of being arrogant judgemental etc for valuing healthy hair -- hold your tongue if you have nothing positive to contribute.


I haven't seen a single person on this thread accuse people of being arrogant or judgemental for 'valuing healthy hair'. What I have seen is people saying it's arrogant to make the presumption that healthy hair is intrinsically better than, say, a bleached, teased pixie cut. It is arrogant, because preferences on hair are just that: preferences. It's not arrogant to express a preference for healthy hair, it's arrogant to presume that that preference holds more weight than a preference for unhealthy hair.

[prosperina]

Only two things make me sad about other people's hair:

1. If it's thinning or falling out. Not that they need my pity, but I mean my heart goes out to them. That must be tough.

2. If they think they don't have "good hair," and there's something that's inherently wrong with their hair as it is. All hair is good hair, but not all styling methods are going to work with all hair. You can only fight your natural hair so much and still have it look good.

As for people who constantly abuse their hair then complain when it doesn't look good, or when they need hours to make it look good, I don't feel sorry for them. Before I got to LHC I had figured out a lot of the LHC ethos. It's not hard. Leave your hair the hell alone. Ever look at kid's hair? Or remember the hair you had when you were little? It looked good, didn't it? Why becuase you weren't doing a bunch of crap to it!

I think most women realize that if they want to maintain a high-maintenance look, then they will have to deal with some damage and upkeep. It's just the people who keep mistreating their hair then wonder why they don't have healthy luxorious locks that frustrate me. A sign of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. If you wanted healthy, long natural fingernails you wouldn't keep getting acrylics, same with hair.

[alyanna]

I have always instinctively tended towards standard lhc practices, I was stretching washes as early as sixteen so maybe I am predispositioned to think this is right.

Me too!

That's why when I have had short hair, I was never in awe of glossy long hair. I've had that too. I think both looks can be AMAZING. I still secretly covet a cute, little short blonde bob. I can trim every 6 weeks and I always look polished and done. Mind you, I also have very good reasons for growing long.

I also quite dislike the cotton-candy hair that lots of older ladies have and I do think that they are often misled or uninformed. I don't usually express my opinion unless asked so I'd never say anything. But in my mind I'm like, "please alyanna remember never to do that to your hair" ;)

[prosperina]

I haven't seen a single person on this thread accuse people of being arrogant or judgemental for 'valuing healthy hair'. What I have seen is people saying it's arrogant to make the presumption that healthy hair is intrinsically better than, say, a bleached, teased pixie cut. It is arrogant, because preferences on hair are just that: preferences. It's not arrogant to express a preference for healthy hair, it's arrogant to presume that that preference holds more weight than a preference for unhealthy hair.

Hmmm. Maybe. But I think people have been too harsh on the OP. Isn't it arrogant or at least judgemental to call another person (a community member of whom we are supposed to be tolerant!) arrogant? Shouldn't we take her post in the spirit it was obviously intended? Did she set out to offend? I don't think so. Could she have worded her opinion better? Probably.

What's so wrong with thinking that healthy hair is better than unhealthy hair? I mean I don't go around thinking "haha! I'm better than she is, my hair is healthy; hers isn't," but as a general rule of thumb, on principle, yes, I do think healthy hair is better than unhealthy. So what. :shrug: That doesn't mean I think my preference is better, and that I walk around judging people. I don't, but still the ideal of healthy hair remains. And does anyone really have a preference for unhealthy hair?

One can still make judgments and be tolerant. The OP, was in my opinion, tolerant. Making judgments doesn't automatically equal mean and intolerant.

[boomtownrat]

I'm not a grey hair hater; I fully intend to be a Renegrey myself when the time comes. Because, yes, I am much too lazy to keep up a dye regimen. :laugh: Also, too much of a cheapskate.

I just had no real idea how common hair coloring among women-of-a-certain age is, till I started hanging around LHC. I just never thought about it at all, so unless it was REALLY obvious, I would tend to let people's hair guide my assumptions about their age, which is obviously stupid in a world of cheap boxed dye at Wal-Mart.

My mother-in-law, for instance, would even straight up TELL me she colors hers, but I really didn't quite comprehend that under the shiny auburn, she's probably every bit as grey as FIL is.

She does it to convey a certain image-- of vigor and energy-- and it works! You can be rightfully angry about the way our culture overvalues youth, but for years I thought of her as ten years younger than FIL. (she's two years younger, not a decade.) If she had silver hair, I don't think I'd have been quite as quick to have her babysit my crowd of rambunctious kids. :laugh: Let the poor sweet old lady retire!

Part of it is her attitude and energy, and part of it is the way she presents herself physically. Part of that self-presentation is her dyed hair. Everyone says those kinds of shallow material things are beneath their notice. At at conscious level they probably are. But... I think most of our judgments about other people are not really made at a conscious level.

Oh, I see what you mean. I guess dye doesn't affect my perception of age because I had two examples when I was only little. As a child I knew two elderly sisters who both wore their hair like helmets, and one dyed hers coal black while the other preferred new-penny copper. This was in the '70s and early '80s, and admittedly hair dyes weren't as good then, but the effect of the dye was not to restore a youthful appearance. Even at age five I thought the hardness of the look drew attention to the fact that they were old. The elderly women I knew who sported bright white hair were most beautiful to me, even if it was done in the typical short and curly style that old southern women have worn for as long as I've known. All of them were doing as they pleased with their hair, so good for them, of course. It didn't matter to me.

Admittedly, if it were hair in bad condition, it would have made them look older, whether natural or dyed. That's probably because the only old people I ever saw with hair in bad condition were ill in some way.

I want to be an example that people can be fully silver and still vibrant. OK, so my version of "vibrant" is more Wednesday Addams than Pollyanna. I don't even look 38. Like Rimi, no one is treating me like a little old lady. No one is offering me the senior discount. Barring one time when I was wearing a cardigan, had the hideous "growing out a pixie" shag straight out of the '70s, and the person saw me in a room that was too dark to see my face, no one has thought I was older than I am. I don't wear cardigans anymore. ;)

[AnnaJamila]

I have heard over and over about hair being 'dead'. And while scientifically that may be true, it's a thought that negates the whole. Since my hair has been at waist length, some interesting things have happened. My scalp no longer flakes, ever. If this is a byproduct of the weight stimulating the hair follicles, or the hair itself being a vehicle for moving sebum away from the scalp, which would make sense because the dead whole cannot interact in any other way-then wouldn't it follow that hair is a tool for overall health? While Dr.'s happily removed appendixes because they said they had no useful function, it's known now that they do. Our bodies grow hair whether we like it or not, or more importantly, whether we understand it or not. I think what LHC has done for me is to see the connection of the care we take with our hair, ie, not fighting it, frying it, or hating it-pays off in dividends. The same can be said of 'dead' soil as opposed to 'live' soil, 'dead' relationships, 'dead' jobs, anything animate or inanimate can be dead, or it can flourish. LHC seems to embrace the 'live' side, which is why I keep coming back. And shamefully, I must admit, I see a line between those that have found the 'life' in their hair, and those that obviously haven't. I am housebroken enough to never mention my thoughts out in public.

Bravo! :applause

[redcelticcurls]

I haven't seen a single person on this thread accuse people of being arrogant or judgemental for 'valuing healthy hair'. What I have seen is people saying it's arrogant to make the presumption that healthy hair is intrinsically better than, say, a bleached, teased pixie cut. It is arrogant, because preferences on hair are just that: preferences. It's not arrogant to express a preference for healthy hair, it's arrogant to presume that that preference holds more weight than a preference for unhealthy hair.

Precisely. I can see coming here to start a thread saying that she appreciates how tips here have helped. But, it can be seen childish and insecure to promote your own hair at the expense of other hair. I don't have to put down straight hair to appreciate my curls. I don't have to disparage hip length hair because I prefer BSL on myself. And I don't have to put down poorly maintained dyed hair because I've learned to work with my own dyed hair. I can enjoy what I have for its own sake.

Women, in general, can be really bad about this. You (general you) don't need to disparage (or show fake, cloying, pity) to appreciate what you have.

[ktani]

I have alwys noticed and admired different hair styles and lengths.

What I have been aware of for quite some time, due to taking public transit to and from work which can force one to be more up close and and in another's personal space is there is a lot more great looking hair these days than years ago, in general.

I have and continue to see great styles, long and short, and shiny hair, coloured and natural.

I attribute the shiny hair to better hair products. Shampoos are less harsh these days than years ago.

Long, short, coloured, or natural, I think everyone should wear their hair in the way that pleases them most.

[ktani]

Re the grey hair and ageing viewpoint which is much discussed these days, I have seen women with pure white hair look stunning and with silver grey hair too.

To me it is about what suits a person. That has more to do with skin tone and shade. The "wrong" colour for a person can be any colour that for their skin tone makes them appear "washed out" and that can come naturally or from a bottle and be easily remedied.

[Rosetta]

I haven't seen a single person on this thread accuse people of being arrogant or judgemental for 'valuing healthy hair'.
Well, imo Katurday's post (for reference below) was saying just that, more or less, and what's more it's very bluntly, even a bit aggressively put ("shut it", "yours is boring and archaic", etc.), and I was actually wondering why no one seemed to take offence and some even called it "one of the best posts ever", although it goes against many things most LHC'ers believe in... I do agree about this needless "guilt-riddenness" though, which I must admit sometimes puzzles me here.


I really do not care about other people's hair, on here or IRL. *shrugs* I always thought the wish to help oh ye disadvantaged fried heads was smugly superior. Its like... Shut it. Their hair is ugly and fried if yours is boring and archaic. Most people dont even notice their hair outside the daily routine, so I'd rather be a bleached beach bunny than most guilt ridden LHCers who are crying over being seduced by brushing, shampoo, cones, the "blowfrier" or any other "hair sins".

The assumption that one's hair is *better* is ignorant. There is no better! ITS DEAD. Primp it how you will!

[prosperina]

Yeah, I thought Katurday's post was offensive too. Not at all in keeping with the spirit of the thread, an atom bomb in the comparision to the mildly objectionable language in the OP. I also think redcelticcurls, although correct in what she says, is being too blunt and not very understanding. Let's call other people childish! Way to be nice! In my opinion, if you're truly more mature, you'll let the so-called "childish" posts pass and you do not feel the need to point it out. Rubbing someone's nose in their immaturity is not very mature.

[UltraBella]

I haven't seen a single person on this thread accuse people of being arrogant or judgemental for 'valuing healthy hair'. What I have seen is people saying it's arrogant to make the presumption that healthy hair is intrinsically better than, say, a bleached, teased pixie cut. It is arrogant, because preferences on hair are just that: preferences. It's not arrogant to express a preference for healthy hair, it's arrogant to presume that that preference holds more weight than a preference for unhealthy hair.

I so wish we had a "LIKE" button, I would absolutely use it for this post !

[TrudieCat]

Well, some people thought the OP's original post was offensive and they are allowed to say so. :shrug: I'm not sure that I would have used some of Katurday's phrasing, but her sentiment I agree with. People use that kind of language (ex. "shut it") all the time on these boards when they are referring to people acting superior about donating long hair, for example, and I thought Kat was expressing that she found the OP's tone to be a little superior and patronizing - and I'll agree with that. She was comparing, as I understood it, the idea that many people IRL have that long hair is boring and archaic with the idea that many people here have that heat-styled hair is ugly and fried - that is, she was pointing out that we are talking about matters of opinion on fashion only.

I don't think the OP's patronizing tone was KNIT - so why isn't someone else allowed to point that out? There was no need to get so defensive - a simple explanation about how the point was not to be superior or patronizing but rather to mention how she has begun to notice hair more thanks to what she's learned here would have sufficed.

Many people on this thread did mention that they are more *aware* of differences in hair and appreciative of things they might not have appreciated before coming here, which I thought was lovely - but some people did mention what amounted to a certain level of pity for those who don't "understand" how to have "healthy" hair and that's patronizing IMO.

ETA: I would also "like" florenonite's post if I could. :)

[Sunshineliz]

if you're truly more mature, you'll let the so-called "childish" posts pass and you do not feel the need to point it out.

Perhaps that's why no one called katurday and the others on it before?;)

[florenonite]

Hmmm. Maybe. But I think people have been too harsh on the OP. Isn't it arrogant or at least judgemental to call another person (a community member of whom we are supposed to be tolerant!) arrogant? Shouldn't we take her post in the spirit it was obviously intended? Did she set out to offend? I don't think so. Could she have worded her opinion better? Probably.

What's so wrong with thinking that healthy hair is better than unhealthy hair? I mean I don't go around thinking "haha! I'm better than she is, my hair is healthy; hers isn't," but as a general rule of thumb, on principle, yes, I do think healthy hair is better than unhealthy. So what. :shrug: That doesn't mean I think my preference is better, and that I walk around judging people. I don't, but still the ideal of healthy hair remains. And does anyone really have a preference for unhealthy hair?

One can still make judgments and be tolerant. The OP, was in my opinion, tolerant. Making judgments doesn't automatically equal mean and intolerant.

You have a point. I did, however, feel while reading this thread a cumulative sense of superiority, not from the OP alone, but from multiple posts from different members who suggested feeling pity for people whose hair didn't live up to their standards. I don't think they were trying to offend, but I do think that what they said could come across as offensive.

There's nothing wrong with having a preference for healthy hair, nor for stating a preference; what I object to is the implication that someone's hair is somehow inferior or they deserve pity because it does not conform to someone else's ideals. There's nothing wrong with saying something like 'I really think so-and-so would look great if she grew her hair' or even 'I think so-and-so's hair suits her better long. I don't really like it short'. Both of those are, IMO, different from saying 'So-and-so shouldn't have cut her hair. It looks horrible short!' The last takes one's own ideas of beauty and implies they're universal or somehow authoritative, and that, in a more general sense, was the vibe I got from quite a few posts on this thread, the OP included.

Oh, and as far as 'And does anyone really have a preference for unhealthy hair?' I'd have to say, no, probably not, but for a lot of people health isn't as big a deal as colour or texture and they might prefer their hair bleached blonde, flatironed, and relatively short than long, natural and healthy :shrug:


Well, imo Katurday's post (for reference below) was saying just that, more or less, and what's more it's very bluntly, even a bit aggressively put ("shut it", "yours is boring and archaic", etc.), and I was actually wondering why no one seemed to take offence and some even called it "one of the best posts ever", although it goes against many things most LHC'ers believe in... I do agree about this needless "guilt-riddenness" though, which I must admit sometimes puzzles me here.

I agree that Katurday's post is blunt and some might take offence at it. That said, I got the impression from that that she was criticising the 'long/healthy hair is better' attitude rather than the 'I like healthy hair' attitude.

[lapushka]

Only two things make me sad about other people's hair:

1. If it's thinning or falling out. Not that they need my pity, but I mean my heart goes out to them. That must be tough.

2. If they think they don't have "good hair," and there's something that's inherently wrong with their hair as it is. All hair is good hair, but not all styling methods are going to work with all hair. You can only fight your natural hair so much and still have it look good.

:agree:

You can't help but notice people's clothes, hair, but it's how you deal with it that matters.

Why judge people? What about old ladies with typical old lady cuts (what is an old lady cut anyway)! So what! You don't know them. It comes down to that one single thing every time: you don't know this person. When I read things like this, I tend to roll my eyes and think well, yeah... wait until you get to be her or his age, or wait until you experience what they experienced in life, then we'll see where those high and mighty words have gone.


As for people who constantly abuse their hair then complain when it doesn't look good, or when they need hours to make it look good, I don't feel sorry for them. Before I got to LHC I had figured out a lot of the LHC ethos. It's not hard. Leave your hair the hell alone. Ever look at kid's hair? Or remember the hair you had when you were little? It looked good, didn't it? Why becuase you weren't doing a bunch of crap to it!

I think most women realize that if they want to maintain a high-maintenance look, then they will have to deal with some damage and upkeep. It's just the people who keep mistreating their hair then wonder why they don't have healthy luxorious locks that frustrate me. A sign of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. If you wanted healthy, long natural fingernails you wouldn't keep getting acrylics, same with hair.

:agree:

Yep, some people's attitude... I've come across women who think that everything just has to come to them without any effort whatsoever, and it persists in any area of life. Concerning hair, regardless of how they abuse their own hair, if they see someone with gorgeous hair, then they have to have hair like that, and they aren't prepared to look at their own destructive habits or their lack of patience. And when it goes wrong, then it's someone else's fault... of course. :roll:

I've abused my hair in the past, big time. I've done horrible things to it when I was younger. Dye, bleach, shaving it, ... the list goes on. I'd hate to think what people thought of me just because of this. :(

[Unofficial_Rose]

Sometimes the dreadful haircut/fried bleach head that people sport was unintentional also. Speaking as someone who has gone in for some subtle highlights and come out with a headful of bleached straw in the past. And asked for layers and ended up with a quasi-mullet. :eek: People aren't necessarily walking around with something they chose to have on their head.

[ilovelonghair]

Looking at the rows of cropped permed hair was like looking at a feild of white/silver cabbages.
.


:D:D:D That sounds so funny! You don't see it much anymore nowadays I have noticed.


Only two things make me sad about other people's hair:

1. If it's thinning or falling out. Not that they need my pity, but I mean my heart goes out to them. That must be tough.

That is so sad, I see it a lot and they must feel insecure :(




Admittedly, if it were hair in bad condition, it would have made them look older, whether natural or dyed. That's probably because the only old people I ever saw with hair in bad condition were ill in some way.

Yes it does make people older, maybe because it makes someone look unhealthy? Healthy hair suggest heath, hair without shine suggests someone being ill.

Btw my mother wanted gray hair for so long and it still doesn't look gray (nearly 70) but blonde, she gets heaps of compliments and people think it's done in a salon. Not! It looks super healthy too.

Btw bleaching for treating oily scalp: guilty here... I used to do that. It works but hair doesn't agree!

[embee]

Hm. I do notice hair more now, that's for sure. And I particularly notice long hair. :)

What makes me sad is that people are so often convinced they *must have* whatever the latest trend is, no matter what it does to their hair or their appearance or they are failures. And the "old lady" amazing dye jobs, helmet hair, or straightened/fried arrrgh! I see these often, and frequently not attractive. There's no effort to work with the hair they have, it must be the hair in a magazine or the hair the stylist wants.

I've been there, and it was accompanied by a feeling of "not good enough" - because my hair wasn't blonde and did not curl. Sigh. Perms. Lightenings. My mom said repeatedly my hair was "ugly". Thanks mom, that really made me feel good. Not.

Going my own way has been very empowering for me.

[LouLaLa]

Cool Thread :)

I havent been to LCH in yonks and doodles! Glad to see so many familiar faces/backs of heads :p

I dont think it ruined normal hair, it just made me see that id rather have the hair that grows out my head than feel I have to conform to fashion/fad ideas of normal hair.

I guess LHC made me appreciate my hair more and made me stop pouring chemicals on my scalp. However I love it when I see a crazy 'do. I can appreciate the artistry.

I dont really look at other peoples hair unless its something amazing. Its sort of odd but a LHC ironically made me care about my hair less (i think im a minority!) and made me feel confident enough to just "let it be", I wash it and thats it really and it couldnt be happier, its shiny, very long and I discovered to my delight its naturally dark blonde (boy do I regret those years of dying it for nothing!) :)

Each to their own, thats what makes the world fun.

[Fairy tale]

I am pretty new to lhc and what I find sad is that because there are so many out there with ruined hair I feel awkward because mine is shiny...I feel like everyone is looking at me like im dirty or my hair is greasy... I like the new things i've incorporated since joining lhc ( coing, bbb, coconut oil) but feel a little strange still... maybe it is just the transition phase still...who knows.

[Tabitha]

Sometimes the dreadful haircut/fried bleach head that people sport was unintentional also. Speaking as someone who has gone in for some subtle highlights and come out with a headful of bleached straw in the past. And asked for layers and ended up with a quasi-mullet. :eek: People aren't necessarily walking around with something they chose to have on their head.
Amen, sister! hence my 25-year boycott of Vidal Sassoon.

[rusika1]

What makes me sad is that people think anyone else's hair is their business. Honestly, people on here are offended if someone expresses a dislike for long hair; and are quick to assume the other person must be jealous. No. sometimes people just. don't. like. long. hair. Plenty of people out there are happy treating their hair like an accessory which can be changed frequently. Know what? That's their right, and it's none of my business.

That saying some of the LHC members have adopted as their mantra--"I'm not here to decorate your world." works the other way round, too: "No one else is here to decorate my world."

[pepperminttea]

Not really, no. Hair forums have definitely made me more aware of hair generally, and when I see someone with really beautiful healthy hair it can stop me in my tracks. When I see someone with hair in a less healthy state, it mostly makes me wish LHC knowledge was more mainstream. Can you imagine if the recipe for an SMT or Feye's self trim method was printed in Cosmopolitan? Or if the instructions for CWC or CO were printed on the back of conditioner bottles, alongside the SC instructions?

Until I found long hair communities I was never happy with my hair. I didn't choose how awful it looked, I just had no idea what to do with it. Things which seem common sense now, like using less harsh shampoo and more conditioner, simply didn't strike me before. For years I had no idea what I was doing wrong and thought I'd just been given a bad lot genetically; I had "problem hair" and that was the end of it (I hate that phrase; there's beauty in every single hair type). I just needed to learn to look after it. If LHC know-how was more widespread, maybe I would've started loving my hair a little earlier.

[dulce]

1 have no problem with someone not liking long hair[in general or mine specifically] but 1 ask please keep those sentiments to yourself.1 find unwanted negative comments to me directly criticising my personal life choices[hair ,clothes,weight etc] to be truly offensive and not their business. The world would be such a nicer place if everyone kept their opinions to themselves on other people's business.1 thought as 1 aged, people would stop doing that but have found it occures even within older age groups.1 guess it's universal.

[nellreno]

1 have no problem with someone not liking long hair[in general or mine specifically] but 1 ask please keep those sentiments to yourself.1 find unwanted negative comments to me directly criticising my personal life choices[hair ,clothes,weight etc] to be truly offensive and not their business. The world would be such a nicer place if everyone kept their opinions to themselves on other people's business.1 thought as 1 aged, people would stop doing that but have found it occures even within older age groups.1 guess it's universal.

So, comments about not liking long hair should be left unsaid, but whole threads about how sad short hair is are ok?

[fluffybunny]

Having unprocessed gently-treated hair supports an entirely different goal. We're generally going for the longest thickest hair that's humanly possible. Someone who's heat styling and getting salon cuts & color is pursuing a different goal related to fashion, or some aesthetic about how the shape & color of the hair interacts with your face shape and skin tone. We tend to not give a darn about that here. Well, at least give it much less importance! Notice how folks rarely even post a face shot. It's all about the hair itself.

Those ladies with the salon cuts may be looking at an LHC style woman and think it's sad how all that long hair does nothing for her face, or how dated the long hair look is on her.

So there's really no need to feel sad for others or superior or inferior about it.

I do cringe a bit when I see old lady permed hair, but keep in mind their hair might be very very thin if it were long. Changing the color to blond & perming is a way to camouflage the thinning.

[allycat]

I find it amusing that people feel sad about other people's hair (unless for illness, or out of one's control hair loss, for example.)

If you looked at me 10 years ago, I had permed curls, loved to tease up the crown, a little bit 60s bouffant, a little bit rock star... I freaking LOVED it! (Sometimes I miss it now.) I loved the trashed look to it. My friends all had similar crazy hair and we loved it. If I thought someone "felt sad" for me I would have fell over laughing.

Then there's my old granny with the classic, fluffy "little old lady" haircut that she goes to get at her weekly salon appointment with her girlfriends to chat and catch up under the dryer. Don't you dare feel sorry for her! She loves it and would keel over before she would wear long uncut hair. I want to have long gray hair, but I think it's lovely the longstanding tradition she has, and she's my granny with her hair just the way it is!

People don't always "not know better." People most often are making active choices. They mostly wear their hair like they choose. Or not, but so what? They might be on their way towards an ideal (just like most LHC members). Or they copy a celebrity. Or they get an idea from a magazine or their best friend or their stylist. They're choosing their Look just like you do. Why would you feel sorry for them anymore than they would feel sorry for you? I know people could just as easily look at me now and think "Girl, get out of the 70's! Get a style!"

I adore long hair. But I can't imagine feeling sorry for people without it. I don't need everyone to look like me or value what I value. I just LOVE hair in general and looking at all the variations on hairstyles humans manage to come up with! Long, short, bleached, teased, dyed, dreadlocks, shaved...I just think it's funny and a little condescending to feel sorry for people who probably would be shocked about being pitied.

[Valorie]

The only thing that LHC has personally re-defined for me is the definition of long hair on myself! I thought I had long hair before at shoulder-ish length but I "see" it differently now when I look back. Ha, that's it and what others consider "long hair" could be different lengths, still. I think everyone should have whatever their personal preference.

[Copasetic]

The only thing that LHC has personally re-defined for me is the definition of long hair on myself! I thought I had long hair before at shoulder-ish length but I "see" it differently now when I look back. Ha, that's it and what others consider "long hair" could be different lengths, still. I think everyone should have whatever their personal preference.

Right? When I joined LHC my hair was shoulder length and I thought it was SO long. Now my hair reaches my butt when it is straight and I hate that it just doesn't feel long.

[ravenreed]

Not all of us are going for longest/thickest possible. Quite a few of us just want longer and/or healthier, without giving up all the damage culprits. I have no desire to find out what my terminal is. I still dye my hair as do quite a few members. Some still heat style.

*I* care about my hair aesthetic, as do some others, otherwise we wouldn't have people posting about how to make their hair look less severe when it is pulled back because it doesn't flatter their face, or how to deal with hair cleavage, or any of the other odd things that we post about on the forums that don't specifically relate to how to get more length or thickness. A lot of posts I see are along the lines of, "I grew my hair longer, now how do I cope with..." I have made a few myself.



Having unprocessed gently-treated hair supports an entirely different goal. We're generally going for the longest thickest hair that's humanly possible. Someone who's heat styling and getting salon cuts & color is pursuing a different goal related to fashion, or some aesthetic about how the shape & color of the hair interacts with your face shape and skin tone. We tend to not give a darn about that here. Well, at least give it much less importance! Notice how folks rarely even post a face shot. It's all about the hair itself.

Those ladies with the salon cuts may be looking at an LHC style woman and think it's sad how all that long hair does nothing for her face, or how dated the long hair look is on her.

So there's really no need to feel sad for others or superior or inferior about it.

I do cringe a bit when I see old lady permed hair, but keep in mind their hair might be very very thin if it were long. Changing the color to blond & perming is a way to camouflage the thinning.

[Katurday]

Well, some people thought the OP's original post was offensive and they are allowed to say so. :shrug: I'm not sure that I would have used some of Katurday's phrasing, but her sentiment I agree with. People use that kind of language (ex. "shut it") all the time on these boards when they are referring to people acting superior about donating long hair, for example, and I thought Kat was expressing that she found the OP's tone to be a little superior and patronizing - and I'll agree with that. She was comparing, as I understood it, the idea that many people IRL have that long hair is boring and archaic with the idea that many people here have that heat-styled hair is ugly and fried - that is, she was pointing out that we are talking about matters of opinion on fashion only.

I don't think the OP's patronizing tone was KNIT - so why isn't someone else allowed to point that out? There was no need to get so defensive - a simple explanation about how the point was not to be superior or patronizing but rather to mention how she has begun to notice hair more thanks to what she's learned here would have sufficed.

Many people on this thread did mention that they are more *aware* of differences in hair and appreciative of things they might not have appreciated before coming here, which I thought was lovely - but some people did mention what amounted to a certain level of pity for those who don't "understand" how to have "healthy" hair and that's patronizing IMO.

ETA: I would also "like" florenonite's post if I could. :)
Thank you. :)

Many people have interpreted my response as an attack on a person. It was an attack on the ATTITUDE that one's preference is superior, one's looks are superior, and the masses are "lost". It is an attack on the mental practice of raising yourself (the educated) up by knocking the damaged haired uneducated down. I use language to strengthen my point, and the mods are free to pull me aside to discuss it at any point.

All these years of being offensive and not so much as a warning. Could it be less being offensive, and more being offended?

[AnqeIicDemise]

I've always been a people watcher so I have taken notice of people's hair. I suppose it is more so now than before, just by a smidge. I will also admit that at times I do feel bad for someone's state of neglect as that is part of human nature. I cannot help but feel sometimes. Its in my nature. I CAN, however, control my impulse and keep my opinions to myself.

The few times I have actively said *anything* at all is when I see a woman standing in the shampoo/dye/hair accessory aisle, fretting over some sort of unattainable, fashionable ideal and she is full of conflicting emotions. We've all seen them... they stand there, staring at rows-and-rows of product with a glazed look in her eyes, a grim line upon her lips and her hands somewhat fidgeting with her hair. Every now and then she'll look up, then around, and back at the item in front of her. Some even mutter on how much they HATE their hair... others just stare at the reflection a nearby mirror has to offer in sheer pity.

And that's when I swoop in, with a huge smile on my face and say something nice. "I love your hair color!" or "I envy your curls, they're so beautiful." and if their hair is really trashed and I can't bring myself to lie, I'll pick a particular article of clothing or accessory. Usually they only blush and grin from ear to ear. Sometimes I'll be looked at like I have four heads, at times I get ignored. As long as I feel as if at least one of them has regained a bit of self confidence, I'm happy.

Every woman deserves to feel beautiful.

[Rosetta]

if you're truly more mature, you'll let the so-called "childish" posts pass and you do not feel the need to point it out.

Perhaps that's why no one called katurday and the others on it before? ;)
In case that was meant for me, that's exactly why I stayed out of this thread for so long, but I guess I wasn't mature enough to stay out completely ;) It's just that imho people were starting to be a bit too harsh on the OP, and (again imho) she wasn't the one who had been insulting anyone... But I also agree with the person who said that people do have the right (even duty?) to say it if they feel someone is being offensive/crossing the line. But I will stay out of this thread from now on :)

Btw, I didn't say I personally would have been offended by Katurday's original post (because I wasn't), but that I wondered that no one seemed to take offence (I think I used exactly those words), as the sentiments expressed in it were quite against the general LHC spirit (even if I myself agreed with some of them). But that's cleared now :)

[wvgemini]

What makes me sad is that people think anyone else's hair is their business. Honestly, people on here are offended if someone expresses a dislike for long hair; and are quick to assume the other person must be jealous. No. sometimes people just. don't. like. long. hair. Plenty of people out there are happy treating their hair like an accessory which can be changed frequently. Know what? That's their right, and it's none of my business.


Thank you. It always gets me to see thread after thread of people whining and crying over someone saying something "mean" about their hair. "Oh they MUST be jealous!" Pffft. But then it's okay to lambast some hairdresser and call out her "teased, flat-ironed, bleached whatever" hair as fried and lank. And that's okay?:rolleyes:

eta: Not directed at anyone, just a general impression sometimes.

[lapushka]

I find it amusing that people feel sad about other people's hair (unless for illness, or out of one's control hair loss, for example.)

If you looked at me 10 years ago, I had permed curls, loved to tease up the crown, a little bit 60s bouffant, a little bit rock star... I freaking LOVED it! (Sometimes I miss it now.) I loved the trashed look to it. My friends all had similar crazy hair and we loved it. If I thought someone "felt sad" for me I would have fell over laughing.

Then there's my old granny with the classic, fluffy "little old lady" haircut that she goes to get at her weekly salon appointment with her girlfriends to chat and catch up under the dryer. Don't you dare feel sorry for her! She loves it and would keel over before she would wear long uncut hair. I want to have long gray hair, but I think it's lovely the longstanding tradition she has, and she's my granny with her hair just the way it is!

People don't always "not know better." People most often are making active choices. They mostly wear their hair like they choose. Or not, but so what? They might be on their way towards an ideal (just like most LHC members). Or they copy a celebrity. Or they get an idea from a magazine or their best friend or their stylist. They're choosing their Look just like you do. Why would you feel sorry for them anymore than they would feel sorry for you? I know people could just as easily look at me now and think "Girl, get out of the 70's! Get a style!"

I adore long hair. But I can't imagine feeling sorry for people without it. I don't need everyone to look like me or value what I value. I just LOVE hair in general and looking at all the variations on hairstyles humans manage to come up with! Long, short, bleached, teased, dyed, dreadlocks, shaved...I just think it's funny and a little condescending to feel sorry for people who probably would be shocked about being pitied.

Giving this post the thumbs up. :thumbsup:

My grandma used to have her weekly hairdresser appointment too, and wow no, you'd never... you wouldn't dare pity her. It wasn't just a hair thing, it was part of her social life, a place where she met friends, acquaintances, where she'd catch up on the latest news or gossip. That's why I don't like people saying old lady cuts. What if people said long, dirty hippy hair to every person with long hair?

[Sunshineliz]

What if people said long, dirty hippy hair to every person with long hair?

You mean you've never heard anyone say that?;) (I don't say it, but I've heard it plenty.)

I don't plan on having a so-called "old lady haircut" but I think, along with any other hairstyle out there, some people look great with them and some don't. I just don't want it to be expected that everyone HAS to do it when they get old so they can be "age-appropriate."

[redcelticcurls]

Thank you. It always gets me to see thread after thread of people whining and crying over someone saying something "mean" about their hair. "Oh they MUST be jealous!" Pffft. But then it's okay to lambast some hairdresser and call out her "teased, flat-ironed, bleached whatever" hair as fried and lank. And that's okay?:rolleyes:

eta: Not directed at anyone, just a general impression sometimes.

Good point. The double standard does seem to be acceptable.

[dulce]

NELLRENO-1f you read my post properly, 1 was not talking talking about posts on threads,1 am/was talking about strangers[older women] having coming up to me directly at the gym when 1 am working out, or in the street/in a store and telling me to my face,comments such as 1 was trying to look like a teen or that all older women with long hair look like witches.That is unacceptable and rude,1 would never tell someone 1 disliked their hair to their face! Everyone is entitled to their opinion but people don't have the right to tell me to my face how to look especially when 1 am out in public.It is none of their business,and unfortunately it has happened a lot to me so 1 am angry about this phenonema.1 thought as people aged they got politer but 1 guess not.All my comments on that post were directed about the general public and my frustration with how some people behave on the street, not this forum.1 have had support from this forum so am grateful for that. If people on the street feel it is ok to put down my hair choice to my face out in public ,as 1 said 1 sure am not looking to going to a nursing home in 20 years or so!1 don't feel 1 would be accepted there by a lot of the other women as 1 look different.

[dulce]

It's much easier to have long hair when you're young,society can be hard on you making that choice when you are older,that's what 1 am finding out.

[lapushka]

You mean you've never heard anyone say that?;) (I don't say it, but I've heard it plenty.)

Oh, I've heard it said behind my back, well... within ear shot, so I guess that still counts as being to my face. :lol:

[HairFaerie]

all older women with long hair look like witches

This is exactly why I am growing my hair long and I hope it is at my waist and silver/white when I am 60! :twisted::pumpkin::stirpot:

[dulce]

1'll be 60 next january, yet 1 only have white/silver around my temples and bangs,my back hair and braid is my normal light brown colour colour.Hope you have better luck than me getting that white hair!1 love the all silver look,1 think it's so elegant.

[Amoretti]

This thread gives new meaning to "a storm in a teacup". :ponder:

Just think; all those people who have long, healthy hair and who are thinking that short, bleached, frizzy hair is nasty are probably being targeted by the bleached, short haired crowd as being boring, old-fashioned, matronly, stuck in the 60s, dull, prim and proper, etc, etc, etc. :lol:

It's quite amusing. Live and let live. :flower:

[Amber_Maiden]

I actually envy people with short hair. So simple. I wish I could pull it off. My hair takes forever to untangle!!!

[embee]

There's a big difference between *noticing* hair in poor condition and *saying something* to somebody about how ugly their hair is.

I never really paid much attention to other folks hair but now I do look and am much more aware.

... except there was a girl in grade school with me who had the most lovely brown curls and I was *so* envious! Her hair seemed to just naturally look *great*, no setting, no curlers, no perms, no work, nothing but a washing when it was dirty, comb it out and go - and now that she's an old lady it *still* looks great! Sigh.... ;)

[brunette]

Wasn't it the OP who started the Official Neon, Shaved chunks, Punk/goth hair thread? A lot of people pity and look down upon people with hair of those varieties but of course it's up to the individual how they choose to care for their hair. Coloured or heat processed hair doesn't always mean fried. Many people are very knowledgeable about hair protection when processing hair, long or short. We all have the occasional bad hair day!

I agree with Amoretti, why can't people live and let live?

[Alaia]

I find this image (http://twenty-somethingtravel.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/haters_gonna_hate.gif) strangely appropriate.

It doesn't bug me, to be honest. It's their hair.

[oktobergoud]

Pfft, what a thread this is!

Like others have said, live and let live. I honestly don't feel too good about backstabbing someone I've seen, just because they have awful hair. If they love it, why not? Why should I care? It's THEIR hair and they are willing to do with it whatever they want. I'm just glad I don't have that hair, but that's it :)

To sort of reply to the original meaning of this thread: LHC did not ruin normal hair for me. Only when I ruined my own hair a few years back, made me realize that I needed to take better care of my hair. Only THEN I saw split ends, fried hair and all that jazz and recognized it. After that I saw it on other people as well, only because I saw every single split/fluff/destroyed hair on my own head, which I hadn't seen before.

That being said, I've had a short platinum pixie for a few times and LOVED it every time! I even shaved half of my head a few times and loved that as well.. I was more the kind of 'whatever if I ruin it, I just chop it off and it will grow back anyway, it's just hair!' kinda person.

[pink.sara]

Wasn't it the OP who started the Official Neon, Shaved chunks, Punk/goth hair thread? A lot of people pity and look down upon people with hair of those varieties but of course it's up to the individual how they choose to care for their hair. Coloured or heat processed hair doesn't always mean fried. Many people are very knowledgeable about hair protection when processing hair, long or short. We all have the occasional bad hair day!

I agree with Amoretti, why can't people live and let live?

This ^ just because your hair is long, it's original colour and you "treat it like antique lace" doesn't mean it's any better in any way than mine.
Yes mine is only APL and it is bleached and dyed, but it's hugely thick, shiny and healthy and even after a year of no trims and me straightening and blow drying you'd have been very hard pressed to find a split end.
I care for my hair with specific treatments to cater for the one bleaching it gets in it's lifetime and I have had classic blunt ends with it White (I'm naturally very dark auburn/black)
Don't pity me! I love my hair!

[Rosetta]

What makes me sad is that people think anyone else's hair is their business. Honestly, people on here are offended if someone expresses a dislike for long hair; and are quick to assume the other person must be jealous. No. sometimes people just. don't. like. long. hair. Plenty of people out there are happy treating their hair like an accessory which can be changed frequently. Know what? That's their right, and it's none of my business.
Thank you. It always gets me to see thread after thread of people whining and crying over someone saying something "mean" about their hair. "Oh they MUST be jealous!" Pffft. But then it's okay to lambast some hairdresser and call out her "teased, flat-ironed, bleached whatever" hair as fried and lank. And that's okay?:rolleyes:
This is something I completely agree with!
I think I've even tried to say so sometimes, but it was just lost among the usual "she's just jealous" stuff...


(I know I said I'd keep away from this thread, but... ;))

[ilovelonghair]

BTW isn't it us who have normal hair? Processed hair is after all unnatural :D

[xoxophelia]

oktobergoud is an example of somebody who looks great with a short, bleached pixie. I have thought about this thread and really.. from a perspective of aesthetics alone there are heads of hair that look better to me with conventional styling. For one, longer hair really can make some people look dragged down and not everybody is a fan of fairytale ends which many of us can't avoid at longer lengths due to genetics and taper. Sometimes layers can make the look more intentional or styling can help to make hair look well cared for on some textures (mine included although I avoid heat).

My hair would most likely look better right now if I went to a salon, had the length slightly color corrected which involves bleach in my case, got a cut that gave me a blunter hemline, and had it heat styled. But, I view my hair as a work in progress and that would be counterproductive for my personal desires. Others might judge me for letting my old dye fade and grow out but it isn't their business. I would find them to be close minded when the subject is as unimportant as the hair on my head. So, I wouldn't judge them either. And like I said before, I've seen many people with highly styled hair that I really like. Thats my take on it.

[ravenreed]

Normal and unnatural are not the same. "Normal" is culturally defined. Within LHC, long hair is normal. Without LHC, it is not. I have processed hair as do quite a few others on the board so I wouldn't consider processed hair abnormal for LHC. Uncommon perhaps.



BTW isn't it us who have normal hair? Processed hair is after all unnatural :D

[alliekat]

It's much easier to have long hair when you're young,society can be hard on you making that choice when you are older,that's what 1 am finding out.

This.

My mom had the most beautiful, straight, shiny, long hair. Then when she was in her 40s she chopped it all off because she was "too old" for long hair.

I mean, as long as she's happy with it, that's fine... but I didn't realize that long hair had an age limit, you know? :p

[AnqeIicDemise]

This.

My mom had the most beautiful, straight, shiny, long hair. Then when she was in her 40s she chopped it all off because she was "too old" for long hair.

I mean, as long as she's happy with it, that's fine... but I didn't realize that long hair had an age limit, you know? :p

My mother, now in her 60s, has earned the "I don't give a [beep]" badge. She just started growing out her hair about six months ago. Its down to her shoulders, in a very pretty, wavy, shiny, salt and pepper glory. My father can't be happier.

[dulce]

I like that"beep" badge!!!Hair doesn't/shouldn't have an age limit.1t's only some members of society that think that way.

[jeanniet]

I have that "beep" badge, and it's a pretty darn nice thing, too. :D

[whitestiletto]

I always thought the wish to help oh ye disadvantaged fried heads was smugly superior. Its like... Shut it. Their hair is ugly and fried if yours is boring and archaic.


Ditto.
It's smugness bordering on arrogance to think that short hair is wasted potential, and I doubt that many who choose to wear short hair cares that someone wants it longer to meet some imaginary potential or limited idea of femininity.


Wasn't it the OP who started the Official Neon, Shaved chunks, Punk/goth hair thread? A lot of people pity and look down upon people with hair of those varieties but of course it's up to the individual how they choose to care for their hair. Coloured or heat processed hair doesn't always mean fried.

Yes it was me who started both threads. I think it's ironic people are calling me names (smug, arrogant, boring, archaic, superior, catty, high horse, "comparing hair to drug abuse," "bugs me to death") for appreciating healthy hair when I'm also a huge fan of creative hair. People got p***ed off about the punk hair thread too, because they said LHC was supposed to be only a support place for people growing long virgin hair. Irony as a iron.

[ktani]

I and others here did not see your initial post that way. I think that LHC has given you a different perspective on hair and I get that. I do not see that as being judgmental.

[lapushka]

Yes it was me who started both threads. I think it's ironic people are calling me names (smug, arrogant, boring, archaic, superior, catty, high horse, "comparing hair to drug abuse," "bugs me to death") for appreciating healthy hair when I'm also a huge fan of creative hair. People got p***ed off about the punk hair thread too, because they said LHC was supposed to be only a support place for people growing long virgin hair. Irony as a iron.

I didn't take offense, but I think lots of people might have responded better if the OP was worded... differently. The OP did come across as being kind of harsh, and I'm used to quite a bit. Just my :twocents:

[ravenreed]

I am sorry you are feeling picked on for starting two very different threads, but I can see why you are feeling that way.

I will say that I often don't pay attention to who is the OP in a thread (I have a horrible memory and won't remember anyway), and I had no idea that you had started both. TBH, I never even read the other thread until it was mentioned that you started that one too. Perhaps others are in the same boat? Not everyone is going to approve of any one technique discussed on LHC. Some folks are just more vocal about the disapproval.




Yes it was me who started both threads. I think it's ironic people are calling me names (smug, arrogant, boring, archaic, superior, catty, high horse, "comparing hair to drug abuse," "bugs me to death") for appreciating healthy hair when I'm also a huge fan of creative hair. People got p***ed off about the punk hair thread too, because they said LHC was supposed to be only a support place for people growing long virgin hair. Irony as a iron.

[manderly]

OP, I wasn't really offended by your first post - we've seen many of the same ilk, and I've probably participated in a few without really thinking about it. But in order to help you to understand why some may have taken this a little seriously and have been a little offended by your tone, he're your OP, with some minor edits. Please read it again and see how it sounds when it's not referencing hair:


Now that I know the reasons, it makes me so sad to see women with fat guts. I know it could look different if they changed their routine but most never will. Sometimes I see an older woman with extra fat around her belly and frankly its just sad to me. (There's been some doozies at the airport today.) They want it to look good and obviously spend a lot of time on it, but they're so misled, in my opinion.

This is more personal preference, but when I see older women with a big, squishy belly I wish she would work it out so she could be proud of how pretty she is. Wasted potential?

I have always instinctively tended towards standard exercising practices, I was stretching and jogging as early as sixteen so maybe I am predispositioned to think this is right.

Surprising, isn't it?

I just hope that shed some light on the reactions of some of the members here and help you understand what the fuss was all about.

[UltraBella]

MANDERLY, you hit the nail on the head. I had thought several times that if the same post was about weight we would have a complete disaster and people would be BEYOND upset.

[redcelticcurls]

MANDERLY, you hit the nail on the head. I had thought several times that if the same post was about weight we would have a complete disaster and people would be BEYOND upset.

I had the weight analogy in my head at the beginning of the thread. I'm glad I'm not the only one.

[Sooze]

Whether it's because of your "fried" uncared for hair, little old lady cut or expressing an opinion in an unguarded fashion - it's never very pleasant being the subject of sniper fire.

[clarinette]

I was reading the previous page and cannot for the life of me understand why you would decide a post about hair is offensive WHEN you change it to make it about weight or....what? It's about hair, hair styles are purely something that the wearer decided based on their personal preferences... Plus expressing one's feelings shouldn't be seen as "offensive", IMO. Feelings cannot be controled :D
Like my husband's. LHC ruined normal hair for him, too. Yesterday I tried the fake bob thing, just for fun, and he almost had a heart attack. Once he had recovered and I explained the trick, he said "If you ever cut your hair, I'll divorce you!!!" see, feelings can't be controlled :D

[manderly]

I was reading the previous page and cannot for the life of me understand why you would decide a post about hair is offensive WHEN you change it to make it about weight or....what? It's about hair, hair styles are purely something that the wearer decided based on their personal preferences... Plus expressing one's feelings shouldn't be seen as "offensive", IMO. Feelings cannot be controled :D
Like my husband's. LHC ruined normal hair for him, too. Yesterday I tried the fake bob thing, just for fun, and he almost had a heart attack. Once he had recovered and I explained the trick, he said "If you ever cut your hair, I'll divorce you!!!" see, feelings can't be controlled :D

Did you really not gather that it was the tone and condescension of the OP? That "I know better and have gorgeous hair because of it - if only the other women of the world were as smart as me to do the right things and try a little harder to strive to have "good" hair"? I used the weight analogy to make it more obvious to those who may not have picked up on it (hence the confusion over those who were offended).

And yes, expressing a feeling can very much be offensive.

[ktani]

Now that I know the reasons, it makes me so sad to see women with fried short hair. I know it could look different if they changed their routine but most never will. Sometimes I see an older woman with extra crispy fried hair and frankly its just sad to me. (There's been some doozies at the airport today.) They want it to look good and obviously spend a lot of time on it, but they're so misled, in my opinion.

This is more personal preference, but when I see older women with an eternal pixie or bob I wish she would grow it out so she could be proud of how pretty it is. Wasted potential?

I have always instinctively tended towards standard lhc practices, I was stretching washes as early as sixteen so maybe I am predispositioned to think this is right.

For me it was a question of interpretation, based on my own experiences as to how I saw this post.

I saw it as an LHC member being grateful for all she had learned here in addition to how she is naturally inclined to treat her hair.

My own stylist for many years had no interest in hair products or how they worked.

Many cosmetic companies highly exaggerate claims.

Many people I have no doubt think that their hair looking the way it does, long, short, coloured or not is the inevitable result for them from chemical services, product use or aging.

They may or may not have another reference to compare their hair to except magazines and television ads which are not accurate depictions of results for everyone to say the least.

Do most women want long hair? Probably not. However, many may have unsuccesdfuly tried to grow their hair long and failed because they did not have the help available here for example, for the asking.

What I put in red is a question and along with discuss in the title to me was an invitation for dialoge.

[ktani]

I just realized I left something out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by whitestiletto http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.longhaircommunity.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1720340#post1720340)
Now that I know the reasons, it makes me so sad to see women with fried short hair. I know it could look different if they changed their routine but most never will. Sometimes I see an older woman with extra crispy fried hair and frankly its just sad to me. (There's been some doozies at the airport today.) They want it to look good and obviously spend a lot of time on it, but they're so misled, in my opinion.

This is more personal preference, but when I see older women with an eternal pixie or bob I wish she would grow it out so she could be proud of how pretty it is. Wasted potential?

I have always instinctively tended towards standard lhc practices, I was stretching washes as early as sixteen so maybe I am predispositioned to think this is right."


Personal preference is just that. I have often looked at someone's hair and imagined it differently. I never acted on that and offered unsolicited advice and neither did the OP.

[Lianna]

I just realized I left something out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by whitestiletto http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.longhaircommunity.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1720340#post1720340)
Now that I know the reasons, it makes me so sad to see women with fried short hair. I know it could look different if they changed their routine but most never will. Sometimes I see an older woman with extra crispy fried hair and frankly its just sad to me. (There's been some doozies at the airport today.) They want it to look good and obviously spend a lot of time on it, but they're so misled, in my opinion.

This is more personal preference, but when I see older women with an eternal pixie or bob I wish she would grow it out so she could be proud of how pretty it is. Wasted potential?

I have always instinctively tended towards standard lhc practices, I was stretching washes as early as sixteen so maybe I am predispositioned to think this is right."


Personal preference is just that. I have often looked at someone's hair and imagined it differently. I never acted on that and offered unsolicited advice and neither did the OP.

She did say a pixie or bob isn't pretty. And that hurts the feelings of the members here with short hair.

[ktani]

She did say a pixie or bob isn't pretty. And that hurts the feelings of the members here with short hair.

As a personal preference, the OP prefers longer hair. There are many people here who have expressed preferences for certain lengths or that they are not fond of certain styles that others admire. I see nothing wrong with that.

Example, http://www.longhaircommunity.com/forums/showthread.php?t=66874

[alyanna]

I just realized I left something out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by whitestiletto http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.longhaircommunity.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1720340#post1720340)
Now that I know the reasons, it makes me so sad to see women with fried short hair. I know it could look different if they changed their routine but most never will. Sometimes I see an older woman with extra crispy fried hair and frankly its just sad to me. (There's been some doozies at the airport today.) They want it to look good and obviously spend a lot of time on it, but they're so misled, in my opinion.

This is more personal preference, but when I see older women with an eternal pixie or bob I wish she would grow it out so she could be proud of how pretty it is. Wasted potential?

I have always instinctively tended towards standard lhc practices, I was stretching washes as early as sixteen so maybe I am predispositioned to think this is right."


Personal preference is just that. I have often looked at someone's hair and imagined it differently. I never acted on that and offered unsolicited advice and neither did the OP.


She did say a pixie or bob isn't pretty. And that hurts the feelings of the members here with short hair.

I'd have to agree with ktani on this one.

The OP did not say that a pixie or bob isn't pretty. She said she wishes some women would grow their how out so that they could be proud of how pretty it is. This statement means that the OP thinks long hair is a source of pride and beauty. It does not mean that she thinks short hair is not pretty.

The OP expressed her opinion. I didn't think she did it offensively. It's not expected that everyone on these boards think that everything is pretty and gorgeous and just because I say I like the color blue and hate the color red doesn't mean that everyone that loves red has to be offended. Jeesh.

[Lianna]

As a personal preference, the OP prefers longer hair. There are many people here who have expressed preferences for certain lengths or that they are not fond of certain styles that others admire. I see nothing wrong with that.

Example, http://www.longhaircommunity.com/forums/showthread.php?t=66874

I'm very aware of that, there was even a whole thread dedicated to people say what style/cut they find ugly. I still find it offensive. Nobody needs to like short hair, but since this is a forum dedicated to be "extra polite" and friendly, we don't need to be saying things like that.

ETA: One thing this forum does well is offend short haired people "without realizing". I've read this over and over here. And I'm not the only short haired member to notice. And yes, alyanna, she did say that. The person must grow out the hair so it becomes pretty, and then something to be proud of.

[ktani]

I'm very aware of that, there was even a whole thread dedicated to people say what style/cut they find ugly. I still find it offensive. Nobody needs to like short hair, but since this is a forum dedicated to be "extra polite" and friendly, we don't need to be saying things like that.

ETA: One thing this forum does well is offend short haired people "without realizing". I've read this over and over here. And I'm not the only short haired member to notice. And yes, alyanna, she did say that. The person must grow out the hair so it becomes pretty, and then something to be proud of.

I am so sorry that you feel this way. A number of members here have cut their hair short and been supported.

I do not see this forum as against short hair at all in spite of differing opinions on styles.

Hair to me can look great no matter what the length if it suits the person wearing the style and some styles are more flattering on some people than others.

That applies to any hair length.

[ktani]

Short hair is a generic term especially here where a half inch trim can be considered a lot of length to lose when one is growing their hair longer.

But let's get down to basics. A "pixie" or "bob" is generic too.

I had a "pixie" cut years ago that I hated. One week later, yes, one week, I had it recut and loved it. What was the difference?

How it was styled to suit my features.

The cuts and styles the OP referred to, to me were styles that did not suit the people wearing them and to her, those people would have looked better with their hair longer.

[dulce]

KTAN1,well said,1 feel it was not the short hair the Op disliked it was certain unflattering styles.Short hair styles can be cute and perky and feminine or it can be unflattering . It all depends on the style and how it was cut and the person's actual features.1 had a pixie for 10 years ,it did not look good on me personally , and when 1 noticed other older long haired women 1 got the courage to grow mine long again.But ,every day 1 see women who look so cute and feminine in that pixie cut but unfortunately 1 didn't. That's what she meant 1 think.In a case of an unflattering short style she felt maybe longer hair might have suited that individual person better.1 don't feel she meant only longer hair was pretty and all short hair ugly.Some people do not suit long hair just as some people do not suit short hair.That's my take on the OP's original post and that's why 1 think she got so angry as it was all misconstrued.

[Rosetta]

ETA: One thing this forum does well is offend short haired people "without realizing". I've read this over and over here. And I'm not the only short haired member to notice.
Well, this forum is called "Long Hair Community", maybe you need to keep that in mind... :rolleyes:

[ravenreed]

What defines long? And it isn't called the "Virgin, Long-as-possible Hair Community."


Well, this forum is called "Long Hair Community", maybe you need to keep that in mind... :rolleyes:

[Rosetta]

^ No (no one has even said that), but why come here if you get offended by preference for long hair over short hair, like Lianna clearly does? Something that is, obviously, inbuilt in a Long Hair Community...

[Bene]

This thread............... :drama:

[florenonite]

Well, this forum is called "Long Hair Community", maybe you need to keep that in mind... :rolleyes:

Yes, and it includes people with short hair who are growing their hair long. It also includes people who had long hair, made friends here, then cut their hair. Just because this forum celebrates and encourages long hair doesn't mean that short hair should be criticised, and while I don't think the OP's intention was to criticise short hair, she did imply that it was inferior and Lianna at least did take it as a criticism, which at least says that the way she worded her post can come off as criticism.

[Sooze]

I still find it presumptive to assume you "know" if someone treated their differently it would look better or prettier, or to assume incontrovertibly they don't look after their hair and have spent lots of misguided time achieving their fried look. "They want it to look good..... but are so misled."

As most on this community forum know, either first hand or from reading, you can try many things on your hair that work brilliantly for others, but don't work on your own hair and which dont amount to abusing your hair. You have to experiment to find what works.

I once cut my hair to bow to peer pressure - those who felt they knew better than me what was best for my hair and "my look". Big mistake.

Turned out those who exhorted me to get it cut didn't like it after all either. They couldn't understand how my curly hair straightened didn't look the same as they'd envisaged. How could it not be shiny and swishy - like theirs? I must have had a duff cut. A rubbish shampoo. The wrong conditioner. Not proper straighteners - gotta get GHD's. No? Just weird hair, then.

At which point they all dissolved away looking puzzled, vaguely disturbed and mildly pitying for their "not-as-we-are" sister.

[ktani]

KTAN1,well said,1 feel it was not the short hair the Op disliked it was certain unflattering styles.Short hair styles can be cute and perky and feminine or it can be unflattering . It all depends on the style and how it was cut and the person's actual features.1 had a pixie for 10 years ,it did not look good on me personally , and when 1 noticed other older long haired women 1 got the courage to grow mine long again.But ,every day 1 see women who look so cute and feminine in that pixie cut but unfortunately 1 didn't. That's what she meant 1 think.In a case of an unflattering short style she felt maybe longer hair might have suited that individual person better.1 don't feel she meant only longer hair was pretty and all short hair ugly.Some people do not suit long hair just as some people do not suit short hair.That's my take on the OP's original post and that's why 1 think she got so angry as it was all misconstrued.

Good for you that you found the courage to grow your hair long again.

I cannot wear many styles either that I admire on others.

I also interpreted the first part of the OP's first post "Now that I know the reasons ..." as a thank you to LHC, not smugness and that she feels bad that others may not have the benefit of what one can learn here about hair care, from the simplest things like handling hair more gently and using seamless combs.

I am sure that many women are taken in at first by claims that a treatment, shampoo or conditioner can "repair damaged hair".

I know years ago, that I wanted to believe marketing claims and I often waited in eager anticipaion to buy that one special hair product that would "magically" transform my hair to look like the ads on TV. Of course that never happened. I learned to love my hair instead for what it is and make the best of it.

While some products can be a temporary fix, nothing can "repair split ends" or hair damage. They can only make the hair appear to look better and if one stops using them the hair reverts back to the state it was in before the use of them.

[PinkyCat]

Hey everybody - what's that over there.......

http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/picture.php?albumid=8306&pictureid=110390

[florenonite]

Is that cheese, PinkyCat? :D

[PinkyCat]

Is that cheese, PinkyCat? :D

Why, not only is it cheese,
It's GRILLED CHEESE!!

[Unofficial_Rose]

Yes, and it includes people with short hair who are growing their hair long. It also includes people who had long hair, made friends here, then cut their hair. Just because this forum celebrates and encourages long hair doesn't mean that short hair should be criticised, and while I don't think the OP's intention was to criticise short hair, she did imply that it was inferior and Lianna at least did take it as a criticism, which at least says that the way she worded her post can come off as criticism.

This x 1000. Oh yeah and the cheese.:yumm:

[Lianna]

Well, this forum is called "Long Hair Community", maybe you need to keep that in mind... :rolleyes:

"Long Hair Community" with a KNIT rule. I only wished people wouldn't say (or imply) that short hair is less pretty, less feminine or whatever. You (general you) can think whatever, but don't need say it because it hurts the shorties' feelings too.

[princessp]

We've had like a million of these types of threads. I can't believe this particular one is still going! :horse: Thank you PinkyCat lol. :cheese: :)