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RebeccaG
June 1st, 2011, 03:35 PM
I'm wondering if anyone has had any success with foregoing conditioner altogether. I have very fine hair which gets weighed down by conditioner very quickly so co washing doesn't work at all for me. My hair does like Argan oil and lemon rinses and catnip works quite well but leaves it a bit fluffy.

So I'm wondering if it would be worth trying heavy oilings before shampooing (sulphate free) and then just lemon rinsing and argan oiling to finish.

All thoughts and experiences would be very welcome!:confused:

Misti
June 1st, 2011, 04:36 PM
I, too, have supremely fine hair. I went conditioner free a couple of years ago -- but the trick is, I also went shampoo free. Without conditioner, even the mildest shampoos made my hair so very dry and fragile. :(

MissManda
June 1st, 2011, 05:03 PM
My hair texture is rather fine, but not what I'd call uber-fine, and going without some kind of conditioner for extended periods of time results in it becoming a ugly, tangle-prone beast. Things get dry and unhappy really fast if I only use shampoo.

However, there is a way to only use shampoo without additional conditioner. Have you checked out the shampoil thread (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=65063)? Many fine-haired folks have had great success with this method. I've tried it before, but I prefer my current routine for reasons that are not relevant to this topic.

You could also look into CO-washing. It sounds very counterintuitive, but many including myself find that with the right routine it does not weigh hair down and gives hair more body.

RebeccaG
June 1st, 2011, 05:04 PM
Hi Misti

Well it certainly looks like you are doing something right from your beautiful signiture picture !

What do you use instead of conventional products?

Thanks for replying :)

RebeccaG
June 1st, 2011, 05:08 PM
My hair texture is rather fine, but not what I'd call uber-fine, and going without some kind of conditioner for extended periods of time results in it becoming a ugly, tangle-prone beast. Things get dry and unhappy really fast if I only use shampoo.

However, there is a way to only use shampoo without additional conditioner. Have you checked out the shampoil thread (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=65063)? Many fine-haired folks have had great success with this method. I've tried it before, but I prefer my current routine for reasons that are not relevant to this topic.

You could also look into CO-washing. It sounds very counterintuitive, but many including myself find that with the right routine it does not weigh hair down and gives hair more body.

I did try the oil shampoo method infact that is how I came across LHC in the first place- researching hair care of the past. I perservered for quite some time but it just didn't work for me. I have tried co washing, I followed the curly girl routine for a while but it was too heavy even with very light conditioners and it made my scalp itch which was horrible! Have you found a conditioner that works for you?

Thank you for replying :)

jojo
June 1st, 2011, 05:09 PM
If you take a look at the Indian hair care thread, theres some members who have had good results. I tried but my hairs too fine, it tangles terribly for me. But lots have been successful, its trial and error. Good luck

RebeccaG
June 1st, 2011, 05:13 PM
If you take a look at the Indian hair care thread, theres some members who have had good results. I tried but my hairs too fine, it tangles terribly for me. But lots have been successful, its trial and error. Good luck


Thanks JoJo I'll have a look at that. :)

Misti
June 1st, 2011, 05:15 PM
Aww, thanks, Rebecca. :p

I mostly use the Baking soda and apple cider vinegar method.

I put a teaspoon or so of BS in an 8 ounce contain of water and pour that over m weat hair. I let it sit while I clean my face, then I rinse it well.

Then I put a very small amount od ACV in a 40 ounce container and fill it the rest of the way with warm water and pour that over my hair and let it sit while I finish my shower. Then I rinse well with warm, and then COLD water (hair only -- it's not comfortable on skin.)

Every few weeks I make up a witches brew of egg yolks, coconut milk, honey, and vegetable glycerine and dunk my braid in it and put it in a braided bun for a few hours -- then I rinse thoroughly with cool water and ACV. Very moisturing, but doesn't coat my my hair.

Leisje
June 1st, 2011, 05:29 PM
I'm using shampoo bars followed by a citric acid rinse, and I have no need for conditioner. A very light oiling on damp hair afterwards leads to super soft hair that still has body.

I think, as others have said, if you are going conventional conditioner free you would probably do well with going conventional shampoo free as well.

sun-kissed
June 1st, 2011, 05:33 PM
I have blonde, fine hair and I've been conditioner free for a few years now. But it wasn't until last year that I realized that I had to be shampoo free as well to make it work. Those where the worst hair years in my LIFE. After I stopped useing shampoo I went on to a CO routine because everyone said I had to condition for healthy hair... But I found conditioner just weighed down my hair and made it feel gross. So I stopped and now that I'm on a WO and BS/ACV-once-a-week method, my hair's happy and healthy. I only use conditioner on my very tips after I swim to help with the dryness and keep splits at bay.

Kristamommyx3
June 1st, 2011, 05:34 PM
I have very fine hair and have always had a tumultuous relationship with conditioners. I think that I have finally found my hair fountain of youth, though! I discovered about two years ago that the brand Organix is great for my hair, and it's sls free. I use whichever of their shampoos looks appealing at the time I need more. I found a deep oiling mixture that has taken my hair to a new level of healthy....so far I've been using this once a week with beautiful results...I mix equal parts extra virgin olive oil, pure organic coconut oil, and about two tablespoons of honey, mix it and microwave it until it's very warm, and bring it into the shower with me. I rinse my hair with water and then I dip as much of my hair as I can into the jar and then pour the rest over the length and let it sit for a few minutes. I then shampoo my hair all over, and that's it! My hair loves this! It comes out full, soft, shiny and not the least bit stringy. I can't promise this will work for you, but it's worth a try!

proo
June 1st, 2011, 05:47 PM
I've been washing with distilled water - required a bit of transitioning, but now it's working great, hair smooth and, no gunk.

hyettf16
June 1st, 2011, 05:51 PM
I'm using baking soda and green tea; no shampoo or conditioner. This is the first method I found that works for me. My hair isn't as dry as before. It's just kind of an experiment and something to hold until I find a good conditioner.

JadeTigress
June 1st, 2011, 05:58 PM
I rarely ever used conditioner. I have the same problem; after I shampoo the conditioner just weighs my fine hair down and makes it look horrible. It does ok with some oils, though. I just can't use too much. I went most of my life without conditioner, to be honest. It wasn't until I came to this site that I started using it again. And my hair still hates it just as much as always, atleast after shampooing. I tried CO for the first time yesterday, just for the heck of it, and for some reason my hair did ok.

jeanniet
June 1st, 2011, 06:15 PM
I use an herbal rinse that's made from rosemary, hibiscus, nettle, horsetail, and lavender. It's not heavy and only has the natural plant oils in it. You could try doing some research on various herbs and playing around with different recipes to see what might work for you.

RebeccaG
June 2nd, 2011, 02:59 AM
That's really interesting guys thank you so much! I had never considered going shampoo free as well, I shall have to give the BS wash a try and go from there I think. I love the idea of using herbs but that looks like it requires more effort so I'll start with the path of least resistance!

Do you think it would be okay to replace the ACV with a lemon rinse? Acv doesn't seem to do much for my hair whereas lemon has been consistently good.

Also those of you who are shampoo and conditioner free- do you pre oil before you wash?

Chiara
June 2nd, 2011, 05:37 AM
I have fine, fair hair too. I shampoo weekly, and do WO or CO in between.

I find that conditioner works if I use it before I shampoo. So I apply lots of conditioner (Alberto Kiwi Lime Squeeze) to my dry hair, work it through gently and put a shower cap on, leaving it for up to 1/2 hour. Then get into shower, quickly add a bit of water and massage the conditioner so that it foams slightly and rinse out. Then I shampoo (SLS free) near the scalp only and rinse. The advantage of this is that, if you've oiled your hair, it deals with that really effectively.

mellie
June 2nd, 2011, 07:44 AM
I don't use conditioner, it weighs down my hair and it looks flat and lank. I also don't use oils or rinses. Just shampoo!

Lilli
June 2nd, 2011, 07:52 AM
I have been considering this. My hair really likes argan oil and shampoo bars and lemon rinses, so I am experimenting with no conditioner and oiling twice a day instead.

RebeccaG
June 2nd, 2011, 10:31 AM
So I took advantage of the beautiful summer weather and experimented today so I could air dry in the sunshine. I had a go at Habioku's method from her webpage, I think she is on here too.

So I applied olive oil lightly massaged into the scalp and more liberally to the length (I'm at BSL aiming for waist), let it soak in for an hour and then washed with dilute mild sulphate free shampoo followed by a lemon rinse.

The results are really quite good. The texture is different, not as curly as usual but it's super silky and I can brush it and meass with it without it turning into a frizz ball. I definitely overdid the oil so I'll try it again but with less oil and maybe try something lighter like sweet almond.

Worth pursuing though, I shall merrily work my way through all your tips :D

curlymarcia
June 2nd, 2011, 01:44 PM
I don't use conditioner any more. I was a conditioner addicted. My hair is curly and was always dry. Now I apply few drops of almond oil and my hair is not dry anymore. My curls are so much better and also I shed less. No more conditioner for me.

Intransigentia
June 2nd, 2011, 02:27 PM
I'm another oil shampooer; I finish up with a lemon or vinegar rinse and no conditioner. But then my hair is not super-fine, just finer than medium.

I haven't tried it myself, but I've read catnip can be another thing to help detangle. There's a massive thread on it somewhere.

Misti
June 2nd, 2011, 03:26 PM
Do you think it would be okay to replace the ACV with a lemon rinse? Acv doesn't seem to do much for my hair whereas lemon has been consistently good.

Absolutely! The acid is the key. It helps to remove any excess oil, and closes the hair cuticle, which was opened by the highly alkiline BS rinse.


Also those of you who are shampoo and conditioner free- do you pre oil before you wash?

I don't. My hair is too fine to handle most oils. (I even tried the oil shampoo method and it left y hair heavy and greasy.)
I just out a little on the ends before I put it up to protect them when it's really cold.

ifthemoonsmiled
June 2nd, 2011, 07:35 PM
This is a really interesting thread. I stopped using conditioner a long while ago because my hair is on the fine side and would get all lank & dull when I conditioned it. (Even with 'cone-free stuff.)

My hair is still short, but I've already been getting nervous about what I'll do when it gets longer and I have to worry more about tangles & damage. You guys have given me some really helpful ideas for alternatives.

RebeccaG
June 3rd, 2011, 03:49 AM
I don't use conditioner any more. I was a conditioner addicted. My hair is curly and was always dry. Now I apply few drops of almond oil and my hair is not dry anymore. My curls are so much better and also I shed less. No more conditioner for me.

That's amazing considering that all the curl advice out there insists on conditioner, your hair is a lot curlier than mine, I'm a 2C but it just goes to show that the 'experts' don't know everything!

RebeccaG
June 3rd, 2011, 03:52 AM
Absolutely! The acid is the key. It helps to remove any excess oil, and closes the hair cuticle, which was opened by the highly alkiline BS rinse.



I don't. My hair is too fine to handle most oils. (I even tried the oil shampoo method and it left y hair heavy and greasy.)
I just out a little on the ends before I put it up to protect them when it's really cold.

Thanks Misti, I'm not sure my hair is ready for no oil at all because it still has some damage from the pre LHC years but I shall definitely try the BS wash but with a pre oil.

-izzi-
June 3rd, 2011, 05:29 AM
So I took advantage of the beautiful summer weather and experimented today so I could air dry in the sunshine. I had a go at Habioku's method from her webpage, I think she is on here too.

So I applied olive oil lightly massaged into the scalp and more liberally to the length (I'm at BSL aiming for waist), let it soak in for an hour and then washed with dilute mild sulphate free shampoo followed by a lemon rinse.

The results are really quite good. The texture is different, not as curly as usual but it's super silky and I can brush it and meass with it without it turning into a frizz ball. I definitely overdid the oil so I'll try it again but with less oil and maybe try something lighter like sweet almond.

Worth pursuing though, I shall merrily work my way through all your tips :D

habioku....!!!!
aL the information which she has given,inspired me alot in growing ma hair long n thick....!! nddddddd just trying 2continue with all her pre wash n post washing methods...!!
butt al these methods, wil they help me thickening ma hair more??:cry:

by e way,, this thread looks so in4mative:heart:
thnkz fa sharing:love:

Firefox7275
June 3rd, 2011, 05:44 AM
I use Inecto coconut oil conditioner for CO-washing and it definitely does not weigh my hair down nor leave a discernible residue, it actually leaves it squeaky (literally) clean but not stripped. No idea if that is available where you are as 'The North' to me means north of England! :p Prior to CO-washing I used Gliss Express Repair spray which is coney but very very light, none of the standard creamy conditioning agents. The mist is very fine which really helps target areas which need protection. TBH it wasn't enough for my damaged hair but it was great for detangling even between washes. Both these products are mentioned in the Reviews section (clicky at top of page).

Roscata
June 3rd, 2011, 11:43 AM
YES! I went for a whole year without conditioner, then a few months ago I started using it again and my hair HATES it. I'm am now conditioner free again.

I use a gentle sulfate free shampoo to make sure my hair doesn't get aggressively cleaned lol, I think baking soda may be too harsh for my hair, it tens to dry easily.

I do condition it in other ways though, mostly through heavy coconut oiling prior to washing and light coconut oiling post washing. I also do an ACV or lemon rinse after shampooing.

I'm thinking about trying Shea butter next or cocoa butter, or a mix of the two for my after washing conditioning. I'm considering tea rinses, maybe catnip tea, I hear it's really good for conditioning. I'm also really considering SMT (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=128) but I just haven't purchased the right ingredients for it yet. :D

RebeccaG
June 3rd, 2011, 02:25 PM
I use Inecto coconut oil conditioner for CO-washing and it definitely does not weigh my hair down nor leave a discernible residue, it actually leaves it squeaky (literally) clean but not stripped. No idea if that is available where you are as 'The North' to me means north of England! :p Prior to CO-washing I used Gliss Express Repair spray which is coney but very very light, none of the standard creamy conditioning agents. The mist is very fine which really helps target areas which need protection. TBH it wasn't enough for my damaged hair but it was great for detangling even between washes. Both these products are mentioned in the Reviews section (clicky at top of page).

The north is in fact Yorkshire! I have tried the inecto conditioner (good old home bargains) but it was a bit heavy for me.

I am quite sold on Habioku's olive oil method at the moment, all the excess oil absorbed over night and I seem to have the best second day hair I have ever had and the best thing is that I can comb it when dry without turning into crystal tips which is quite a revelation to me :D

RebeccaG
June 3rd, 2011, 02:30 PM
YES! I went for a whole year without conditioner, then a few months ago I started using it again and my hair HATES it. I'm am now conditioner free again.

I use a gentle sulfate free shampoo to make sure my hair doesn't get aggressively cleaned lol, I think baking soda may be too harsh for my hair, it tens to dry easily.

I do condition it in other ways though, mostly through heavy coconut oiling prior to washing and light coconut oiling post washing. I also do an ACV or lemon rinse after shampooing.

I'm thinking about trying Shea butter next or cocoa butter, or a mix of the two for my after washing conditioning. I'm considering tea rinses, maybe catnip tea, I hear it's really good for conditioning. I'm also really considering SMT (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=128) but I just haven't purchased the right ingredients for it yet. :D

That's interesting! Your profile picture is gorgeous so it's obviously working for you, I see in your profile that you use castor oil too, I'm tempted to try that but am worried it might be too heavy, what do you think? Also do you use ordinary castor oil or a finer grade carrier oil type?

Roscata
June 3rd, 2011, 04:23 PM
That's interesting! Your profile picture is gorgeous so it's obviously working for you, I see in your profile that you use castor oil too, I'm tempted to try that but am worried it might be too heavy, what do you think? Also do you use ordinary castor oil or a finer grade carrier oil type?

Thank you! :)

I use Castor oil on my roots only to reduce shedding and promote hair growth. I dilute it 50%-50% with Extra Virgin Olive oil because it is really sticky. I only use coconut oil for my length, Castor oil is definitely too sticky for my length. I am a part of this thread about castor oil, that is very interesting to read through Castor oil for hair growth? (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=18265), if you ask a question there you're bound to get an answer from people who use it on a regular. This (http://www.amazon.com/Pure-Organic-Castor-Oil-16/dp/B002RUN39Q/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1307136093&sr=8-1) is the Castor oil I use. :D