Need some tips for my mom - 1a F/ ii

[Francoise1606]

Okay, as you may have guessed, I need some tips for my mother's hair. She has straight, fine hair, the individual strands are thin but she has a lot of hairstrands, so the volume I guess is average-ish.
Here are some of the things she has told me:

When she washes her hair, she tries to be as gentle as possible, but it always manages to tangle.

She doesn't use conditioner, because she says it makes her hair even more flat. I may have gotten her a bit curious regarding coconut oil, because she has seen how much better my hair is and it has only been a year since I began using it.

When she has washed her hair it is a tangled mess, and the she rips a brush through it. She says that if it isn't so tangled, it doesnt have any volume afterwards.

As a result of these she has a lot of split ends; I tried to S&D the other day but because of the breakage it's like she has 1000 layers. It felt like a battle I could never win.

She thought about maybe a type of spray conditioner, but her scalp is sensitive so there limitations, when it comes to which products she can use. Do you guys think that a regular conditioner mixed with water in a spray bottle could be useful?

I know listing all these things makes it kind of a no-brainer to figure out what she is doing wrong, but the problem is I need some good alternatives in order to get her to treat her hair better. She wants to but as most of us know it's so difficult to give up a bad habit if don't have any good alternatives. My own hairtype is so different that I can't give her that much advice.
So I wanted to ask LHC'ers who have a hairtype that is sort of similar: What do you do to make you hair look more voluminous (with or without layers)?

[emsahib]

Definatly don't get layers. I always used to think layers increased volume, but I think it makes fine hair look thinner (I'm regretting my layers, still they look better now they're longer) Has she tried a light conditioner? Maybe try one with protein in? Although some people find too much protein drying. I've got a protein shampoo and that definatly gives me more volume, I don't use the protein conditioner as much though. Maybe some scalp massages with her head tipped upside down? Hope she finds something that works for her :)

[Francoise1606]

Thank you for replying so soon!
How do you know if a product has protein in it? Which ingredients should she look for? She has some layers, but she's afraid that her hair will look flat if she grows them out. I have pointed out that layers will make your hair look thinner because there will be less hair.

[Nini]

Learn to embrace the hair she has. Very easy and very hard, I know:)

When I shampoo I just wash my scalp, the rest of my hair just kind of lays there. I don't brush until it's as dry as I have time to let it become.

I don't usually bother with conditioner, it takes too much time. If I use any kind of oil or leave-in I need to do it on wet/damp hair. I try to do the occational deep treatment.

Changing from a brush to a comb has been good to.

[Angelica]

If she uses a bit of conditioner on her hair, she will find she won't have many tangles and it will be easier to detangle. She shouldn't use a brush until her hair is completely dry and tangle free. Use a wide toothed comb. Layers are debatable. Hairdressers swear they add volume, but I found them a nightmare and it made my hair look too thin. She needs only to use a little conditioner on the length and needs to rinse out thoroughly, if she doesn't hair will look lank.

She could use a spray on leave in hair conditioner. This would help to keep her hair tangle free and also she needs to ensure she is not piling her hair on top of her head whilst washing it as this will cause it to tangle.

Hope this helps :)

[HoneyJubilee]

Does she use 'cone haircare or no-'cone? When I was using 'cones I had to use a huge handful of conditioner if I didn't want a big tangled mess, but then I ended up with flat, stringy, greasy-looking hair. My hair seems to have more volume since I switched to no-'cone and is easier to comb out (the transition period was kind of scary, though). It's also flatter if I use conditioner on my scalp. Conditioning from my ears down keeps it a bit fluffier on top.

My hair loves coconut oil, but it's hard for me to "measure out" the right size glob to use. It's easier for me to use sweet almond oil in a dropper bottle for light oiling. I still try to oil heavily with coconut at least an hour before washing, though.

I detangle with a wide-toothed comb and only use a brush to smooth out comb marks and weird lumps in updos. Brushes seem to either rip tangles out or only go through the top layer of my hair. I haven't found one yet that will detangle well.

[Alvrodul]

Her hair sounds like mine!
My hair is absolutely dependent on conditioner - if I don't use it, my hair ends up a hard-to-manage crow's nest. And it used to be much worse before I started hennaing!
I have actually been experimenting with CO-washing (conditioner only) and CWC (Condition-Wash-Condition), and I have been moving away from using shampoo for every wash, but my hair won't let me give up the shampoo entirely.

One thing my hair loves, is ending my wash with a vinegar rinse. Some people use apple cider vinegar or lemon juice - the intent is to end the wash with a slightly acidic rinse.

Also regular SMTs and oils - my hair looooves coconut oil, jojoba oil and argan oil. Also Nightblooming's Panacea on the ends after every wash, and I can certainly recommend her Triple Moon oil as well!

[sugarpixie10988]

She may want to try the oil shampoo method listed here:
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=57025

I've been trying it for the past few weeks and I have a lot more volume, my hair is softer and less tangly too. My hair was always SUPER tangly, even after I get the splits cut off and clarify. With this method though, my tangling is minimal. Amazing! :) I'm still trying to get it right for me, my main issue is static, but with the right ratios that shouldn't be a problem anymore.

[heidihug]

Learn to embrace the hair she has.
I second Nini's suggestion, it's really the way to go - perhaps she will ease into it? It's so hard when you are bombarded every day with messages that non-voluminious hair=bad hair.


I second trying the no-cone conditioner - from the ears down. That'll help with the tangling for sure.

For damage control, I oil when damp from the ears down.

For volume, lately I've had luck with pulling small sections of my damp hair back from my face, then pushing them back towards my face so they are a bit "poufed" and clipping the sections with mini-clips until dry.


Hope that was of some help to you.

[Panth]

Another vote for the oil shampoo! I'm a 1b/F/ii and blonde. I use Pantene Clarifying shampoo approx. 1:1 with generic Indian grocery store coconut oil and follow up with 1 tsp apple cider vinegar in 1 pint lukewarm water as a leave-in.

It is FANTASTIC. Basically, like doing S&C with really coney conditioner but quicker, cheaper (for me, at least, seeing as it's grocery store oil), shinier and less tangley. Also, provided I get the ratio right, I stay nicely undulled blonde for at least 3-4 days, without getting a darkened scalp due to grease.

[rose.grace]

Learn to embrace the hair she has. Very easy and very hard, I know:)

When I shampoo I just wash my scalp, the rest of my hair just kind of lays there. I don't brush until it's as dry as I have time to let it become.

I don't usually bother with conditioner, it takes too much time. If I use any kind of oil or leave-in I need to do it on wet/damp hair. I try to do the occational deep treatment.

Changing from a brush to a comb has been good to.

Thanks, I've been looking for someone to say how to oil hair (wet or dry?). My hair doesn't like conditioner but I've been wanting to start oiling it, just the ends. I like the smells, etc.of the essence oils and want to do something beautifying to it. I love your "embrace what you have" philosophy. This is good advice :)

[Francoise1606]

She uses cone products. I have some cone free conditioners and a conefree shampoo. maybe they would help. The amount of conefree products that can be found here is very limited. She wants to try my coconut oil, and maybe a light leave in conditioner. I have also told her about only washing the scalp, but she will not give up on the layers. I hope the other tips will be enough to give her good results :) Thanks guys, it's great to have so many cool and helpful people on LHC

[emsahib]

Thank you for replying so soon!
How do you know if a product has protein in it? Which ingredients should she look for? She has some layers, but she's afraid that her hair will look flat if she grows them out. I have pointed out that layers will make your hair look thinner because there will be less hair.

And now I'm replying really late lol, anyway hope your Mum got some good tips. I only know my shampoo has protein in it cos it says so (if it was called something else in the list of ingredience I'd probably miss it) I've been using this one from the body shop

http://www.thebodyshop.co.uk/_en/_gb/catalog/product.aspx?ParentCatCode=C_Hair&CatCode=C_Hair_Shampoo&prdcode=34888m

[Francoise1606]

And now I'm replying really late lol, anyway hope your Mum got some good tips. I only know my shampoo has protein in it cos it says so (if it was called something else in the list of ingredience I'd probably miss it) I've been using this one from the body shop

http://www.thebodyshop.co.uk/_en/_gb/catalog/product.aspx?ParentCatCode=C_Hair&CatCode=C_Hair_Shampoo&prdcode=34888m

thanks for the link, maybe I should advice her to try that one. Her hair is already much better now, thanks to all the answers, but she is still irritated about her hair being a bit flat (although honestly I think it looks good, I have seen a lot worse). she is definitely trying to be gentler when she shampoos and brushes (I don't think I can get her to use a comb).

[walterSCAN]

She uses cone products. I have some cone free conditioners and a conefree shampoo. maybe they would help. The amount of conefree products that can be found here is very limited. She wants to try my coconut oil, and maybe a light leave in conditioner. I have also told her about only washing the scalp, but she will not give up on the layers. I hope the other tips will be enough to give her good results :) Thanks guys, it's great to have so many cool and helpful people on LHC

'Cones were terrible for my hair-- especially with regard to weighing it down. I actually don't use conditioner anymore either, I use a mix of coconut oil and aloe vera after washing in the shower as a leave-in. Check out my thread if you're interested--> http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=63794

Also, when I shampoo I have to be extremely careful to keep my hair detangled as I wash and afterward while still in the shower-- to the point of combing directly before I get in, making sure that the water hits my head at as close to a 90 degree angle as possible, only using downward strokes as I lather the shampoo in my hair (never any sideways or upward motion), and making sure that all of the strands flow straight downward as I rinse. I also bun my hair carefully after washing to keep it from getting tangled/ in the way while I take care of the rest of my shower. Obviously, I don't know what she does, but it definitely sounds like her hair has the same tangling properties that mine does, so she might consider changing the way she washes a bit to cut down on the tangles.

And of course, I would also suggest switching to combing damp or dry instead of brushing wet. I had to cut brushing out almost altogether because it was breaking my hair so badly, even when it was dry. :shrug: Tell her I said 'good luck!'-- it sounds like we are hair-twins!


Oh, and regarding the volume issue, I would suggest combing it upside down. That helps mine quite a bit, as well as moving my part slightly every time I wash it.

[CarpeDM]

No layers! I can totally relate to all of her issues, I have the same ones. When you have fine limp hair everything weighs it down, and it tangles like nobody's business. I found a good detangler that actually creates body, it is by Aubrey Organics and is called NuStyle detangler and shine booster. It detangles but it doesn't weigh your hair down. It also helps make it slightly thicker. She can use it without conditioner and it should detangle, condition and give her some body. I also have a super sensitive scalp and this should not bother her at all since it is all natural and it doesn't bother me at all. And she really needs a good wide toothed comb and a bbb!

[spidermom]

I find the best way to minimize tangles in my hair is to comb/brush it out really well before I get into the shower and then leave my hair hanging down, wet it, apply conditioner to the length, mix my shampoo with water so that I can squirt the solution all over my scalp, run my fingers or a shower comb in only one direction across my scalp (from face area toward nape), then rinse. I apply more conditioner at this point but in your mother's case - she should not.

If she doesn't have a shower, she can sit upright and use a pitcher to pour water over her head.

The key to avoiding tangles is don't mess her hair around after washing it - don't wrap it in a towel, for example. I put doubled flannel pillowcases on, dropping the length inside, twisting and securing the opening with a claw clip, until I feel my hair is no longer drippy. Then I leave it alone to dry most of the time, just letting it hang there while I sit at the computer, for example.

I hope something I've suggested helps. In particular, she should try applying the conditioner to her length before the shampoo, shampoo scalp only, rinse, and she's done.

[Caldonia Sun]

Layers would only make it worse. It's going to be a bit flat because that's the type she has and should just accept it. Unless she uses hot rollers every day. If her scalp is sensitive, cones may irritate it. She would be better with a very gentle shampoo and a light conditioner from the ears down. No brushes, only wide tooth comb. And regular trims to get the split ends off.

Someone on here once said to treat your hair like antique lace - IOW, handle very gently. Maybe you could convince her that is what she needs to do.

[LaurelSpring]

I have really cut back on using conditioner and just use my own leave in concoction in my mister spray bottle. I put in distilled water and a few drops of oil and a small squirt of conditioner (right now I am using a leave in but otherwise just regular conditioner). Sometimes I add lavender or sandelwood essential oils.

I am very gentle with my hair when washing as Spidermom said and then when I get out I spray my leave in mix on and gently comb through. This doesnt weigh my hair down but allows me to comb it without tangling. I do put my cocoa butter shea butter mix on the ends to protect them while it is still damp.

[Intransigentia]

Not sure what all your mom has tried, but I can third or fourth the oil-shampoo suggestion, especially followed with some kind of mildly acidic rinse.

One thing I do to avoid tangles is, as Spidermom said, comb before washing and then handle very gently. When I wash my length, I really don't do what I would think of as "shampooing". It's more like I squish the suds through it gently, very much like washing fine lingerie by hand in the sink.

Also, loosely bunning or braiding the hair right at the top of your head while it dries can make your roots want to point up a bit, and that can help with volume.