Fragile hair

[MadisonMelrose]

My hair is breaking from too over bleaching and coloring. Ive been using castor oil, jojoba oil, and alterna caviar shampoo and conditioner which leaves my hair feeling brittle and crunchy. I just bought mill creek botanicals keratin shampoo and conditioner... Has anyone used this before? My hair is fine and fragile and needs mucho moisture... Any suggestions?

[Maddy_T]

My hair is breaking from too over bleaching and coloring. Ive been using castor oil, jojoba oil, and alterna caviar shampoo and conditioner which leaves my hair feeling brittle and crunchy. I just bought mill creek botanicals keratin shampoo and conditioner... Has anyone used this before? My hair is fine and fragile and needs mucho moisture... Any suggestions?
Oh goshhhhh! not the bleach! I just had to shave my whole head about a month ago from over-bleaching!. You need to give that hair a break! (I guess I can't really talk!! :eyebrows:) but I'd say you need both protein and LOADS of moisture!. Joico's Kpac Reconstructor followed by leaving any brand of thick moisturizing conditioner under a shower cap and blow dryed always worked for me, before i took the bleaching way... too... far and my hair was like mushy jelly!! I'm still having nightmares!.

[Lianna]

I used to do a lot of protein because it was the "right thing" to do for dyed hair, and my hair was crunchy all the time, which made me trim more than I needed. I learned here that protein can make ends crunchy so I clarified and didn't use (much) protein anymore. Result: soft hair.

Coconut oil also makes my hair crunchy. I'd suggest you clarify, do one protein treatment if you haven't after bleaching, than lots of moisture, and watch how you hair handles protein from now on. For me a shampoo that has protein would be too much because I wash too often.

[McFearless]

Keep your hair in protective updos as often as you can. Put down the heat styling tools. Have you heard of the CO wash method? Theres a thread on it in the first few pages. Shampoo will dry your hair out even more.

[torrilin]

Fragile doesn't necessarily mean you need a ton of moisture. It means your hair is fragile. Realistically, most of us have pretty fragile hair... even the strongest and coarsest person can break their hair.

Start by doing a clarifying shampoo, with no protein or silicones in the shampoo. No conditioner, no oil. Let your hair air dry, without fussing at it by combing or trying to brush. See what you end up with. Is your hair curly? Is it straight? Does it feel nice, or does it feel fried? Do you have split ends?

After you've done your best to be realistic about what your hair really is, you can work on figuring out what would be better AND possible. No matter how much I might want bouncy, curly 3a hair... my hair is just barely wavy. I can encourage the waves I have by handling my hair in a curl friendly way, but that isn't gonna magically give me 3a hair. And well, if I want my hair to be all one color, it will laugh at me. It's always going to have natural blonde chunks and reddish bits and light browns and dark browns in a mix.

[Anje]

I'm seeing protein, protein, protein when I read what you're using on your hair. The fact is, yes, beached, chemically processed hair generally needs protein. If you use too much, just like the rest of us, you're going to eventually end up with brittle, crunchy, stiff, and rather rough/grabby hair.

I'd suggest you take a break from the protein, or put it into a rotation with some other products and treatments. Definitely follow up protein-laden treatments with moisturizing ones.

To start off, I'd suggest you do an SMT (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=128). Maybe with a protein-free conditioner to help shift your protein/moisture balance a bit more toward moisture.

Also, take a look at this article on assessing protein/moisture needs (http://blackbeautyblackhair86911.yuku.com/topic/511/t/Hair-Breakage-and-Shedding-101.html). I think that will help you out.

[sunshine80]

wow torilyn i have never done that before I am so curious to see what kind of hair I really have without all the conditioners I put in:)

[ElliesJellies]

I have had the same problem as you in the past. I also bleach my hair into nearly platinum and now the damage is pretty minimal (if I don't use a lot of heat; I tend to only blowdry my hair and avoid straighteners/curling irons).
What has helped me a lot recently is a product called the Aphogee Two Step Protein Treatment. I get it at Sally Beauty supply... and let me tell you, it is a very good product. You can find a ton of great online reviews.
It comes in a 16 oz bottle and costs $20.99. I know that it's not cheap but it may be worth it. I just got it recently and used it on my hair twice so far (in fact I used it last night).
All you do is wash your hair, towel dry, saturate hair with the product and dry hair till it becomes hard and crunchy. I know that sounds bad but the end result is awesome. After it is dry, you wash your hair again (no shampoo) and then apply a thick conditioner and leave it in for about 5-10 minutes.

Last time I was at the store I forgot to get the second step moisturizing lotion by Aphogee, so I just used my regular deep conditioner and it still works wonders. My hair feels very silky, smooth, and shinier then before.

I am suggesting this because it's the only thing that works for me... Like you, I have tried tons of other products, oils, shampoos and conditioners but nothing really worked. Protein is good if used in moderation. You should only use this product about every 6 weeks.
Hope this helps.

[aenflex]

Find the right balance of moisture AND protein. Don't overdo on either end. My suggestion would be to wash with a gentle shampoo that is ph balanced. Look for cocamidopropyl betaine as the main cleansing ingredients. Try to avoid Soduim Lauryl Sulfate and Soduim Chloride on your shampoos. Cones in your shampoo aren't necessary but might help a little. Don't wash every day. Look for a moisturizing conditioner, you dont need to $pend on stuff like Alterna, unless you want to. Also look for a good protein treatment, either a leave treatment or rinse out treatment/conditioner. Alternate between both conditioners and find the right balance. Protective updos and oiling between washes with a good, penetrating oil like coconut or EVOO is also a good idea.
Of course this may not work for you..It is what I would do/have done in the past, in any event. Good luck I hope you get things back to good.

[MadisonMelrose]

Wow, thank you all so much. I am going to do an smt tomorrow night. Will post results.

[little_cherry]

I would actually try a clarifying shampoo to remove the excess protein build up from the hair before the SMT. :)

[MadisonMelrose]

Update: All of the shampoos and conditioners I have been using are loaded with cones and protein... They have been banished to the closet for now. Last night I slept with castor oil& jojoba oil on my scalp and hair and I'm about to wash with Avalon organics clarifying lemon shampoo to remove cone build up, then do an SMT with real aloe, organic honey, and Aubrey organic honeysuckle rose conditioner.
Should I rinse with ACV after?

[luxepiggy]

Update: All of the shampoos and conditioners I have been using are loaded with cones and protein... They have been banished to the closet for now. Last night I slept with castor oil& jojoba oil on my scalp and hair and I'm about to wash with Avalon organics clarifying lemon shampoo to remove cone build up, then do an SMT with real aloe, organic honey, and Aubrey organic honeysuckle rose conditioner.
Should I rinse with ACV after?

I don't think you'll need an ACV rinse - sounds like the shampoo is acidic (lemon) already, so I'd just go straight to the SMT, if I were you (^(oo)^)v

[Annalouise]

I'm seeing protein, protein, protein when I read what you're using on your hair. The fact is, yes, beached, chemically processed hair generally needs protein. If you use too much, just like the rest of us, you're going to eventually end up with brittle, crunchy, stiff, and rather rough/grabby hair.

I'd suggest you take a break from the protein, or put it into a rotation with some other products and treatments. Definitely follow up protein-laden treatments with moisturizing ones.

To start off, I'd suggest you do an SMT (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=128). Maybe with a protein-free conditioner to help shift your protein/moisture balance a bit more toward moisture.

Also, take a look at this article on assessing protein/moisture needs (http://blackbeautyblackhair86911.yuku.com/topic/511/t/Hair-Breakage-and-Shedding-101.html). I think that will help you out.

Thanks for the information.:)
Quick question- for those of us who don't have a microwave, should we heat it on the stove or put it on cold?

[little_cherry]

Thanks for the information.:)
Quick question- for those of us who don't have a microwave, should we heat it on the stove or put it on cold?
You can gently heat the honey on the stove for about 4 minutes.

[1hunky5monkeys]

What are some cone & protein free shampoos & conditioners that can be purchased from places like wal-mart? I only have internet access on my droid x and for some reason I'm unable to use the "search" feature for this forum to try to find info from previous threads.
Maybe someone won't mind linking me? :)

tia!

[Anje]

What are some cone & protein free shampoos & conditioners that can be purchased from places like wal-mart?
Here's the silicone-free list (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=2216) and here's the protein-free list. (http://archive.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=46633) Those should get you started, though there might be some formula revisions that haven't been reflected in the lists yet.

My easy answer is that in the US, Alberto VO5 conditioners are silicone-free. Some are protein-free as well, but you need to read the ingredients, or at least the front of the bottle. They tend to advertise their proteins nicely (proteins that come up a lot are hydrolyzed wheat protein, silk amino acids, soy protein, keratin, and collagen. Anything "amino acids" or "hydrolyzed" or "protein" (duh) is a protein ingredient.)
The entire Suave Naturals conditioner line is silicone-free, and everything except the coconut is also protein-free. Those are what I usually use; my hair has cheap taste and tends to protest at more expensive products.

[1hunky5monkeys]

Here's the silicone-free list (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=2216) and here's the protein-free list. (http://archive.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=46633) Those should get you started, though there might be some formula revisions that haven't been reflected in the lists yet.

My easy answer is that in the US, Alberto VO5 conditioners are silicone-free. Some are protein-free as well, but you need to read the ingredients, or at least the front of the bottle. They tend to advertise their proteins nicely (proteins that come up a lot are hydrolyzed wheat protein, silk amino acids, soy protein, keratin, and collagen. Anything "amino acids" or "hydrolyzed" or "protein" (duh) is a protein ingredient.)
The entire Suave Naturals conditioner line is silicone-free, and everything except the coconut is also protein-free. Those are what I usually use; my hair has cheap taste and tends to protest at more expensive products.


Thank you soooo much! I have been using the suave coconut-I didn't know it has protein. So that explains my problem. Thanks again!! :heartbeat

[MadisonMelrose]

I have to admit, the texture of my hair was scary after clarifying and towel drying. I warmed the smt on the stove and added 2 drops of castor oil and a jojoba oil since my conditioner is on the thin side. It felt great being massaged into my scalp and my hair has a nice slip to it. Rinsing in an hour and excited to see & feel the results.

Btw: castor oil has worked wonders on my face the past few nights... Not one clogged pore, no blackheads, and a beautiful glow that no department store product can match. Love it!

[Anje]

Thank you soooo much! I have been using the suave coconut-I didn't know it has protein. So that explains my problem. Thanks again!! :heartbeat
Honestly, lots of people get the best CO results from the coconut stuff. It's just protein-sensitive folks like me that have issues with it. Rough, velcro-y, crunchy hair!

[1hunky5monkeys]

Honestly, lots of people get the best CO results from the coconut stuff. It's just protein-sensitive folks like me that have issues with it. Rough, velcro-y, crunchy hair!

I'm not positively sure yet, but I think that's why my ends have been crunchy lately. (using the coconut s&c) They are not crunchy when I use the suave clarifying tho.

[MClass]

Anje- I read both links the SMT and the article you cited. Thank you! My question is the SMT post says VO-5 is used.
The article says VO-5 and the "cheapie" conditioners contain protein. The SMT recommends avoiding a protein conditioner. What ingrediants can I look for that have protein besides the obviously stated word and was the article incorrect that VO-5 has protein?
Whew I confused myself.

[Anje]

Some VO5 flavors have protein and some don't. You just need to read the ingredients list to figure it out for sure. I think most of the "Moisture milks" contain protein. Proteins that come up a lot are hydrolyzed wheat protein, silk amino acids, soy protein, keratin, and collagen. Anything "amino acids" or "hydrolyzed" or "protein" (duh) is a protein ingredient. Keratin and collagen are both specific human/animal proteins that you would have to recognize by name.

I believe there's an increased chance of clumpiness with SMTs if you use a protein conditioner, but I'm not certain of that. It's more important that you try to avoid protein in there if you've already got overload happening or if your hair goes into protein overload easily. If your SMT mix doesn't get weird with a given condish and if your hair's OK with the protein levels in that conditioner, I see no reason not to use it.