Needing more advice please for hair. Split ends and tangles

[Horsetuna]

So a few months ago I started using Hair Food and coconut oil from african Gold, and i do love the effects! I also switched to a (it was on sale) salon brand called Olive OIl. It did not smell like chemicals and for the longest time it looked like it was working. But now once again I have split ends. And not just any - the hair is splitting ABOVE The end sometimes two inches from the ends, meaning I have to cut 2+ inches off to remove the split! ANy ideas on what to do? I'm tired of buying shampoo/conditioners and using only a portion to toss the rest. I am pondering since they seem to work best when I haven't used them before, begin to 'cycle' through various brands, but that is expensive and time consuming. Any ideas?

[aenflex]

I don't think it's really due to the shampoos and conditioners. Breakage further up the shaft is normally due to damage of some sort, mechanical, brushing when wet, teasing, raking combs throuhg it, or chemical, perms and colorings, heat damage, lack of protein. Those are the areas I would look at 1st, before pinning the breakage on shampoo.

You really can't fix em, I guess you know that. No conditioner will fix those breaks, gonna have to trim there.

[Octave]

Do you wear your hair down a lot? That can cause the hair to split due to friction

[spidermom]

I agree with aenflex; it's not the shampoo/conditioner. I'm not sure what it is because I have the same problem, and I'm as careful with my hair as I can be without putting it under glass in a darkened room. I can find split ends every time I look, sometimes 2-3-4+ inches above the ends. What the heck? Drives me crazy, but my hair has to go where I go and do what I do, and though I wear hats to protect it from the sun and up-dos to protect it from friction and use coconut oil on the length to replace essential fatty acids, it still falls apart near the ends.

[maxzeen]

You could be getting breakage from your hair rubbing on things. If you wear hair ties in the same exact spot for a long time that can also cause breakage. I don't think it would be from your shampoos and conditioners. Do you brush your hair when it is wet because that can cause a lot of breakage as well.

As far as the splits go the best thing to do is to cut them off. The only thing conditioner, serum, or a leave in conditioner does is to cover it up. So in my opinion I would just trim them off and start out fresh.

[little_cherry]

How is your deep treatment/moisture routine? It sounds like either your hair is getting rubbed on something (do you use a sleep cap or satin pillow cases? What updos do you usually do?) or it is lacking a great deal of moisture and protein.

[Horsetuna]

I wear it down at home/in bed (I haven't found a way to braid it that makes it comfortable for me) and I usually wear a tail at work. I usually gently comb it with anti-tangle spray when its still a little damp (I find my scalp hurts if I try to straighten my part when its dry)

I hate putting it up but I work in a restaurant and it keeps it out of my face.

Instead of an elastic, what else could I use perhaps? A large assortment of hair clips to hold it back? I did pigtails the other day so that would've moved the elastics from the main damage area.

I dont use hairspray, dyes or anything.

I will try to perhaps braid it more often or perhaps a bun. I have a few hair clamps but they're either too small or not the right kind. I have this nice 'deep' one with curved clamps but it holds the scalp part of the hair but the rest of the hair falls out!

ETA for Cherry: no sleep cap. all I could find was lacy ones that didnt look very effective. And I have cotton pillowcase. Usually its a ponytail. I usually shampoo, and let the conditioner sit in my hair while I wash the rest of me - about ten minutes. then I wash with warm water, towel dry, then when its almost dry I comb (see above comment about scalp hurting) and then rub in the hair food or coconut oil.

[SpinDance]

I highly recommend sleeping on silk. I found inexpensive plain silk pillow covers here: http://www.dharmatrading.com/ (couldn't get link thingy to work, sorry). A large silk scarf tucked around a pillow also works well for me.

Breaks and splits higher up the hair shaft are pretty common for me, I just cut above them whenever I find them. I attribute them mainly to mechanical damage. I try to minimize rubbing and breakage as much as I can. I used to braid most days, and I'm sure that is part of the damage I've been slowly S&D'ing away. Using a Flexi or stick instead is helping, as well as switching from combs with mold seams to horn, wood or bone/Bakelite.

Using a couple of different products in random rotation was the best way for me for years. Using the same thing for more than a week usually did not continue to give the good results I'd get when I first tried it, so switching around nearly every wash kept things fresh. These days I'm getting better results by doing a heavy oiling the night before washing, CWC or CO with no-cones, and then lightly oiling or using Panacea on damp ends.

[mali]

I agree with aenflex; it's not the shampoo/conditioner. I'm not sure what it is because I have the same problem, and I'm as careful with my hair as I can be without putting it under glass in a darkened room. I can find split ends every time I look, sometimes 2-3-4+ inches above the ends. What the heck? Drives me crazy, but my hair has to go where I go and do what I do, and though I wear hats to protect it from the sun and up-dos to protect it from friction and use coconut oil on the length to replace essential fatty acids, it still falls apart near the ends.

Yup,this is how hair goes!

[Night_Kitten]

If the splits are closer to the ends of the hair it is possible that the ends of the ponytail rub on your back or get caught between your back and the chair and that creates the splits and breakage, but if the splits are really high up the shaft and all at the same length, it's probably the elastic doing the damage...
As far as elastics - softer thicker elastics or soft scrunchies are much better than the thinner rough ones. I also discovered that an elastic at the end of a braid is less damaging than the same elastic holding a ponytail, I think it's because at the end of a braid the elastic is usually worn less tight than when holding a ponytail...
I don't know how long your hair is, but if you can do buns held with forks or sticks, those styles are great for protecting hair from damage and preventing breakage. Flexi-8 are also great for holding ponytails and updoes... :)

[Horsetuna]

ok, so silk cover for pillow case, bone no-mold comb and possibly sleep cap or braids at night?

Too bad silk-poly blend wouldnt work. Its a rather thick weave anyways.

I'll try to find some of these. I think I know a bone comb merchant.

[Artsy]

Just as a note, African Gold coconut oil is mostly petroleum products. This can be sealing moisture out from your length and causing splits. Try clarifying your length and try to find some pure coconut oil in the grocery section. Also a good idea to look at your brushes.
________
Volcano Vaporizer (http://www.vaporshop.com/volcano-vaporizer.html)

[Horsetuna]

I dont have any brushes actually. I haven't found any that really do any good. I used to use a boars bristle cause I'm told it helps with shine and oils, but it was hard to keep clean and really only rubbed the outside layer of hairs.

And it is? Dang, and that was expensive too. I suppose the same for their 'hair food'?

I'll look for the coconut oil in the grocery store friday.

[Malibu Barbie]

I'm sure this is a friction issue, I had a friend that wore her hair down a lot. One day she noticed the side she wore her seatbelt on, was starting to thin. She told me to be cafeful of baseball hats and other everyday things you do that can cause breakage.

[aenflex]

I don't know how long your hair is, Horsetuna (love the name BTW), but length might have something to do with it. If your hair is uber long like Spidermom's, the breakage is probalby just normal and to be expected, as the hair is years old. I guess my post is redundant but I also wanted to second the satin or silk sleep cap. Made a world of difference to me :)

[kittensoupnrice]

I try treating my hair very very well, and I still get the dreaded split ends and breakage a good 2 inches above the tips. I agree with the others that it's extremely unlikely that your shampoo or conditioner is causing the issue.


ok, so silk cover for pillow case, bone no-mold comb and possibly sleep cap or braids at night?

Too bad silk-poly blend wouldnt work. Its a rather thick weave anyways.

I'll try to find some of these. I think I know a bone comb merchant.

It doesn't have to be SILK. Any slippery satin-like material will work. You're aiming to reduce the friction on the ends of your hair. A sleep cap would definitely help if your hair is longer than your pillow.
A warning on braids & ponytails! Braids and ponytails are probably my first suspect for splits on my own hair. The first because I need a band at the end of my hair which probably is causing some sort of mechanical damage at that magic 2" mark; ponytails because the loose ends of my hair rub on my clothes and on chairs.

No-mold combs also include smooth wooden combs, horn combs, and celluloid combs. So long as it doesn't have seams and has fairly widely spaced teeth, you should be good. Some members here have even taken plastic molded combs and sanded off the seams between the teeth making them more hair friendly.

[Horsetuna]

will keep that in mind. Though what would you reccomend though for putting my hairup? Hair clamps and pins? I do need to keep it up Somehow at work. Or what if I change updos enough that the elastics wont be in one place that often?

[sibiryachka]

I'd recommend varying your styles; wearing it in a ponytail every day, in (I'm guessing) more or less the same spot, is the devil, especially if you're securing it with abrasive elastics or doing that slide-the-elastic-toward-the-scalp-to-tighten-it move. I'm still struggling to break myself of that habit!
Try varying it with buns or braids, if feasible. I have good luck with Goody Good Hair Days hairpins and also their Ouchless barrettes, at the less expensive end of the hairtoy spectrum, also love Flexi-8s and my Quattro fork. Or maybe a snood for work?
I also heartily second the satin pillowcase idea; it made a huge difference for me, and mine aren't even silk. If you regularly sleep with your hair down, it's a must.

[BeautifulBella]

try jamaican castor oil on your ends every other day, it makes a HUGE difference on split ends

[Vermelha]

will keep that in mind. Though what would you reccomend though for putting my hairup? Hair clamps and pins? I do need to keep it up Somehow at work. Or what if I change updos enough that the elastics wont be in one place that often?


I would suggest French braids or a Gibson tuck or anything that can be done loosely but allow the hair to be out of the way. I also would avoid elastics, but that's just my opinion.

Make sure when you do get hair clamps that they are large enough to hold your hair, but snug enough to do so securely. If they are too tight, the hair will thin and weaken.

And do change it up every day or so. Don't wear the same hair style and never sleep in it.

Also, like someone else suggested, the coconut oil you're using is petroleum-based, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't use it, it means you may be using it incorrectly. Petroleum/Petrolatum/Mineral Oil is highly refined and are excellent sealants. If you decide to use it, use it on WET hair only and only on the ends/length to seal in moisture. It does the same as natural oils, actually better, but only that petrolatum-based products must be removed with shampoo to be adequately removed.

Oh, and like BeautifulBella said, try Jamaican Black Castor Oil. I fell in love with this...but it's too expensive for me. I just use regular Castor Oil, but I think they both are great for soft hair.

[Horsetuna]

How do I secure the hair without elastics? I typically use the 'ouchless' brand of cloth covered ones, not bare ones (They cling to my hair like I put crazy glue on them!). my only problem is to get it snug I 'twist' my hand in it to pull the elastic tighter, which moves sideways across the hairs and causing part of the problem.

I guess I have been using it correctly heh, if it goes on wet hair!

On the topic of bobby pins and combs I have NEVER figured out how to get those things to stay in right! I can use hair clamps because they're relatively easy, and i love hair pins even if it takes me a few tries to get it in ( I get a 'milky way galaxy' type effect with hair pins , with a whole lot of ends sticking out. What I wouldnt give for a 'smooth' bun)

I will see about a satin or silk pillowcase. To be honest I dislike the feel of either of them so mayb e a sleep cap will better suit me- it also means when I feel like it I can toss the pillow (which I sometimes do, or the cat steals it).

Where can I find a good sleep cap? As I said, I can only find the lacy ones full of holes that dont seem very practical.

[Horsetuna]

Update: Got the coconut oil. PURE. Its rather hard and looks like wax. Hopefully it'll soften. Also doesnt smell like coconut.

No luck finding sleep caps or bone combs or even hairpins downtown. I guess knitting needles and online.

I did find some lovely hand made water buffallo combs online, but I can't find the link at this time, sigh.

And sleep caps here:
http://www.nwscents.com/satin-and-silk-sleep-caps.html

Although I am not too sure how it will easily hold up long hair? and wouldnt hte hair get all tangled and scrunched up inside?

Also Looking into making my own cow bone hair sticks.

ETA: found the link to the combs: http://www.mehandi.com/shop/combsblack/index.html

[aenflex]

I look in the 'ethnic' as they call it section of Walmart or Kmart. They have some decent, cheap satin-esque sleep caps that have always worked just fine for me :)

[SpinDance]

Horsetuna, coconut oil melts at body temp, so just scrape some off with your fingernail and rub it between your palms. You only need a tiny amount, just enough to cause a shine to your hands, unless you plan on doing a deep treatment. Then you can use more.

I personally didn't like sleeping with a cap, so instead I have been using a silk pillowcase or scarf tucked around my pillow. Anything smooth and slippery will work, doesn't have to be silk, and not all silk is smooth (such as silk noil). I also switched from sleeping in a braid to sleeping in a bun held with a Flexi.

For a comb I usually use this: http://www.etsy.com/listing/60694635/exquisite-handmade-organic-horn-hairpin?ref=sr_list_10&ga_search_query=horn+fork&ga_search_type=handmade&ga_page=&order=&includes[0]=tags&includes[1]=title&filter[0]=handmade

Thank you for the link to the combs you found. They look great! I'll call you "Enabler" if I find myself getting a new comb! ;)

[Horsetuna]

I'll see what I cn find for pillowcases. If anything I can use a pillowcase as a nightcap with a little adjustments.

I dont know if a pillowcase will wor as I tend to toss and turn and sometimes tossthe pillow right off, not to mention the cat likes to steal it too.

Also in the past I found I dont LIKE the feel of silk or satin that much, at least not on my hands/body. At least on the head it will be minimal contact. Thanks for the etsy link. I'll check it out.

I also have friends who work in bone. Maybe I can find one to make me some or make some myself. I have cow bones available...

[Horsetuna]

I'll see what I cn find for pillowcases. If anything I can use a pillowcase as a nightcap with a little adjustments.

I dont know if a pillowcase will wor as I tend to toss and turn and sometimes tossthe pillow right off, not to mention the cat likes to steal it too.

Also in the past I found I dont LIKE the feel of silk or satin that much, at least not on my hands/body. At least on the head it will be minimal contact. Thanks for the etsy link. I'll check it out.

I also have friends who work in bone. Maybe I can find one to make me some or make some myself. I have cow bones available...

[spidermom]

It's hard to suggest up-dos for you when I don't know your hair length. If you go back to the User CP (to the left of the bar at the top) and fill in the rest of your profile, we can be more helpful.

I find hair forks to be the best for securing up-styles. But your hair has to be long enough. Claw-clips are good, too, unless your hair is too long and heavy (like mine).

One thing to try for sleeping if your hair is long enough is a top of head ponytail or braid. I lay with my head right at the edge of the side of the bed, then start a braid at the top back of my head. After I get it going a few turns, I sit up and finish with the hair hanging in front of my face. I find that if I try to braid it while bending forward, it ends up in the wrong place and pulls when I lay down, which is why I start with my head at the edge of the bed. Then I can direct the braid over the top of my pillow. If you hair isn't long enough for a braid, you could do a top ponytail (not too tight).

[Horsetuna]

Its about BSL right now, give or take. Its quite uneven and i'm overdue for a cut.

Hmm. I'll try that. I've braided before bed before and found it uncomfortable to sleep on. I usually lay down and pull my hair to fall off the top of the bed, but I tend to toss and turn a lot (plus the cat tries to lay on it. Eesh!)

I do use claw clips, but finding one of the right size/shape is tricky. The straight ones sometimes wont hold. I have this curved one but it holds the hair good BACK, but it has open space above the teeth and so any bun falls out. Hrm. I wonder if a simple stick would secure it further in place.

I will try the top ponytail loosely.

I have been doing double braids for work, and I get a very 'wheat' look with lots of ends coming out of every bump.

[spidermom]

Lots of ends come out of my braids, too.

One easy style with a claw clip is to gather hair low as though making a ponytail, twist hair and lift it up to the back of the head, then put the clip over the twist, grasping scalp hair as well to hold. You can leave the ends spilling out or you can tuck them in - whichever you prefer.

[torrilin]

On the topic of bobby pins and combs I have NEVER figured out how to get those things to stay in right! I can use hair clamps because they're relatively easy, and i love hair pins even if it takes me a few tries to get it in ( I get a 'milky way galaxy' type effect with hair pins , with a whole lot of ends sticking out. What I wouldnt give for a 'smooth' bun)

Sounds like your hair is heavily layered and (possibly) wavy or curly. If you have layers or sections where some locks of your hair are more corkscrewed than other locks, it's important to remember that hair is only as long as the shortest locks. My hair is pretty straight, and my ponytail circumference is medium, so I can get a smooth bun at not even APL. Because of the texture, it's crazy for me to have layers.

For hair pins, the trick is to weave the pin through both scalp hair and the hair you're trying to hold up. The end result is your hair is held up via tension and any twist energy you put into it. They're excellent even for very slippery hair, but a lot of the time people will say that finer or thinner hair should use smaller pins. Nothing could be further from the truth. If you have very slippery hair, you'll likely need pins that seem enormous, even if your hair is very fine and thin. Someone with rougher hair might hold their cinnabun up with just their hair.

Side combs are pretty straightforward to use, but I don't think they are a good method for securing an updo. My hair is very slippery, and I use side combs in place of barrettes and headbands. Barrettes and headbands fall out easily, side combs don't. Side combs are pretty small tho, so it would be hard to get enough tension to really lock things in place on my hair. (someone with rougher hair might use it, but I don't see a lot of mention of side combs)

I'm presuming by clamps you mean stuff like claw clips? If you can use those, your hair is definitely a rougher texture than mine! If that's the case, a hair fork or hair stick might be a good option. Those are tricky for me to use at shorter lengths because my hair is so slippery and straight.

As far as sleep styles go... have you tried things like twin braids, a ponytail on the very top of your head, or a loose bun on the very top of your head?

[Horsetuna]

Torrilin:
No waves or curls, although its been a little more wavy than usual since I braided it last week. Its a little 'fuller' now. I definitely need a trim.

I find a lot of the time, I get strands of hair caught in the arms of my glasses and they snap off. I seem to have a constant 'fuzz' due to the different lenghts. Frustrating and hard to grow out TBH!

I just put the claw clips (little ones) up and real close to the scalp and the tension holds them in. A large one at the back only holds if I again get scalp hair in it as well.

I remember using my mom's side combs and them always sliding out. I dont know if I Was using them right.

Gonna try top head ponytail or lose bun up top. I think I know where bobby pins are for the bun (unless a hair clamp will work).

[Horsetuna]

Got the coconut oil. It doesnt smell like my other coconut oil, but it feels ok. Doesnt taste like anything though!

My friend is gonna check at Wallyworld for a hair cover for me. No luck in town.

Also pondering hair sticks and other things. Using a clamp for now

[Horsetuna]

Double post, sorry

[Horsetuna]

Sorry for the update, heh. So the coconut oil has already started some changes - my hair clips wont hold it up anymore!! I tried bunning it, twisting it... It just wouldnt stay up, doh!

Gonna try to use my little hairpin-through-leather-peice thing next I suppose. I can't wear it down while at work. Worse comes to worse I'll use an elastic until a better idea is found.

[SpinDance]

I have been doing double braids for work, and I get a very 'wheat' look with lots of ends coming out of every bump.
I used to do a lot of braids, before I learned to use sticks/forks. I never had good luck with braids the day I washed my hair. It just escaped all over the place. The 2nd or more days it was fine, the oils helped it to stay in place. Now that I use oils I've been known to put a bit of oil on my hair before braiding to help it stay smooth and keep the individual hairs from popping out all over.

Today I am wearing a braided bun. Put Panacea on my ends and length last night and today I braided then bunned the braid.

[Deelight]

Regarding the pillowcase slipping off, frequently silk / satin pillow covers come with a zip close for that very reason. Too bad the Dharma Trading ones don't - they look like good quality at a good price.

[Horsetuna]

mostly its the pillow slipping off the bed, but I will keep that in mind. no doubt a zipper could easily be installed though.

[Debra83]

Be careful with ponytail holders - try to get the knitted ones, or the silky smooth covered ones. I wore regular ponytail holders, and had severe breakage from them. (pre-LHC). I never realized because it was at the back of my head near the top. When it was pointed out to me by a stylist, I couldn't believe it...it had looked like someone had cut it almost, except it wasn't even like scissors would make it.

[Sanyia]

I work in a restaurant too, and I use the African butterfly combs. It holds like a rock, and my split ends are getting better with time.

https://www.africanbutterfly.com/abshop/pc/viewcategories.asp

In alternative, I like wearing these hair pins, I use 3 or 4 at a time to hold a braided bun. They won't fall off.

http://www.sallybeauty.com/Magic-Grip-Hairpins/GOODHR1,default,pd.html?cm_vc=SEARCH

[Horsetuna]

Update: reviving old thread if that's the way to do it.

The braiding isnt helping. i'm getting severe tangles at the nape of my neck. I have no way to order a silk sleeping cap online. Is it hard to make one's own? How do they work exactly? The hairs are tangled in circular knots, like they were curled up and then forced in and around each other in loops.

:(

[SpinDance]

Horsetuna, if you sew, making a sleep cap out of some slippery material should be easy. If not, it should be a pretty easy learning project. Alternatively, I have had good luck with silk pillow cases that I got from Dharma Trading Company (http://www.dharmatrading.com/). They are inexpensive, if boring white. :)

I also switched from braiding to a bun held by a Flexi for sleeping and that has reduced mechanical damage for me, too. For regular day-to-day I use a stick, fork or Flexi instead of braiding, since I was getting damage at the ends from the ties. Basically, I'm almost never braiding any more these days. I'm not sure if I'll be able to braid a lot again in the future after the damage caused by braiding and coloring is gone. Gotta wait and see!

[Horsetuna]

During the day a bun is awkward as I'm in/out of the outdoors a lot and its regularly -20C every day meaning that I couldnt wear my toque over the bun easily with a stick in it.

Is there instructions for making a sleep cap?

[Anje]

I haven't made a sleep cap, but it should be easy if you can sew. Just make a big (maybe 18 inches in diameter?) circle of slippery fabric, like satin. Sew a tube around the edge (could fold it down or make a separate tube or use bias tape), leaving the ends open. Put in a drawstring or elastic and scrunch it enough to make it head-size. If you use elastic, I'd suggest just tying the ends and leaving them accessible. That way, if it gets a bit stretched, you can adjust. Plus, it seems like these things need some fiddling with to find the right tension.

Don't be discouraged if the sleep bonnet comes off. It took me a week or so before I could get through the night without finding it across the room, like I had to learn to sleep with it. Now it stays on.

[Kherome]

I'm confused. I thought braiding was considered a protective updo. I also am having trouble seeing how a flexi 8 with all those beads and metal is not damaging to hair? And how could you sleep and roll around on a metal hair clip?

[Horsetuna]

How does the sleep cap work? does it hold the hair in place or does it just keep the hairs from being worked around each other? How tight should it be over my scalp? Does it go over or behind the ears?

As for the bun/metal thing, I have been told that you put the bun way up on top of your head, where your head wont be pressing against it.

[Darkhorse1]

Sadly, nothing can cure split ends but cutting. Many products can lay cuticles flat to prevent further splitting up the hair shaft, but nothing can stop it once you see a split. I'm finding that more trims are helping get rid of my splits.

Good luck!!

[Horsetuna]

I want to PREVENT though, not just snip. I'm going to have no hair left and its getting tangled all the time.

[Horsetuna]

Gonna try twin braids. Another thread mentiond this as a possible solution.

My main concern is ending up with waves. waves are pretty, but I find my waves 'desync' and make me look frizzy...

[SpinDance]

I'm confused. I thought braiding was considered a protective updo. I also am having trouble seeing how a flexi 8 with all those beads and metal is not damaging to hair? And how could you sleep and roll around on a metal hair clip?

Braiding is more protective than letting it be loose and get caught on stuff, but there is still mechanical damage possible, especially if the ties at the ends have to be tight or end up in the same place all the time.

It may seem counter-intuitive, but the Flexi's don't move once they are in my hair. It is essentially a hair stick in function the way I use it. The loop part just hooks onto the end.

The beads don't roll, they just lay there next to the hair, and there isn't room to catch hairs between the beads. I use a Medium or Large to catch the inside of a wrapped bun of some sort, just like a stick, so it only has to keep it from coming loose. I am a side sleeper, so I've found that a normal bun location on the middle of the back of my head works fine. I can do a really high bun, and I did at first, but it tends to be against the grain, and ends up hurting because the hairs don't want to go that way. If you sleep on your back my method wouldn't work, of course.

For comfort I don't catch scalp hair when I make my sleeping bun, so it will sort of slowly unwind, so the Flexi that was inserted and latched horizontally will end up tilted at a bit of an angle by morning. If I toss and turn it might loosen enough that I may want to redo it if I happen to wake up in the middle of the night, but that just takes a second, so is not a problem.

[haibane]

I want to PREVENT though, not just snip. I'm going to have no hair left and its getting tangled all the time.
I made a post on another thread about how changing my routine has minimized splits, maybe it could help a bit:
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showpost.php?p=1440973&postcount=6