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EverydayMiracle
October 17th, 2010, 08:33 PM
I have been a member for a while here, but I haven't posted very much. I think that I was scared to start a topic or something like that, and I couldn't always think of things to say in other peoples' topics.

Anyway, I decided to start growing my hair about nine months ago. In the past I've gone through a spurt every few years where I just don't cut my hair for quite some time, but I wasn't really caring for it. I was just going through the normal routine of wash, condition, blow dry, repeat, with the occasional coloring. This time, however, I found this place and decide to change my routine. I tried a CWC and then switched to CO. The CO didn't work for me since my hair was almost always flat. I didn't like the look, though the texture was remarkable. I also tried baking soda and vinegar, though that seemed to strip my hair of all oil. I have *not* been oiling my hair regularly, though I plan to start this week. I just need to get something to cover my hair with when I'm in bed.

Anyway, I've been discussing some of my progress on Facebook, and generally with friends. Over the course of the last year my hair has gone from right at my shoulders to just an inch shy of waist length. I'm "plateaued" right now, and the growth has gotten slower. I am going to start taking boitin again, though I am completely frustrated.

What has begun to happen for me is that friends who are either in cosmetology school or who work in hair design/care/etc feel a need to criticize my hair care. My first thought is that they are trying to sell me salon products when they tell me that "your hair needs shampoo! It's very good for your scalp!" or "eww! Don't put oil on your hair, use this expensive salon treatment!" Then I realized that they are likely being told these lies by their teachers. That being said, this has left me in tears several times in the past. I am so frustrated and fed up with being told "cut your hair so it will grow faster!" that I want to scream.

So far I've been very polite to people, but I was wondering what you all say to the naysayers when they get started? My plan right now is to stop cutting my hair altogether except for standard trims. I need a pep talk here, folks. I'm really getting fed up.

manderly
October 17th, 2010, 08:37 PM
You will find that many of us do not talk about our hair routines to "outsiders" because of the general negative reactions. There is so much misinformation out there that it does best for us to just keep it a secret :)

Demetrue
October 17th, 2010, 08:45 PM
Well, it sounds like you've had some amazing hair growth this year! Maybe your shampoo, conditioner routine was working well for you (just cut back on the blow-drying and coloring). The problem with being part of LHC is that you gain a great deal of information that counteracts some of the hair myths circulating out there (like cutting your hair will make it grow longer) and people outside the LHC circle often don't understand or support your hair choices. I don't talk about hair much to people outside LHC unless they seem really open and interested.

Carolyn
October 17th, 2010, 09:09 PM
It's simple really. You don't talk to your friends and family about your hair and what you are doing to your hair. Unless they are actively growing their hair and are interested in finding good long hair care methods they aren't going to be interested or understand LHC type hair care. You don't have to tell anyone you oil your hair. If you are doing CO you can use the word "wash" instead of "shampoo" if you are asked. We are here for you to talk about hair to.

punkcatknitter
October 17th, 2010, 09:16 PM
I've always been a fan of the 'information overload' method. Since most people who offer helpful little 'tips' don't really want to know all the details, I like to give them way more information than they ever wanted about how their hair care, shampoo, whatever is destroying their hair and the grand conspiracies of the hair care industry. I can get really passionate about subjects like that. :)

It either shuts them up and/or they think I'm insane. Either way I don't have to listen to them anymore.

meowmeow
October 17th, 2010, 09:29 PM
I'm sorry your friends aren't being very kind about your hair routine. You can either share it or keep it to yourself.

Since you've already shared some of the stuff you're doing, your friends might ask if you've taken their advice once you stop posting (if you decide to stop posting about your progress) or they will continue to criticize if you continue to post.

I think the best way to deal with this is to ignore them or respond accordingly. If I were you, I'd respond. Here are some examples from your post:

They say: "cut your hair so it will grow faster!"

You say: "Explain how" or "The roots have no way of knowing when the ends have been cut since there are no nerve endings down there. The hair will continue to grow at its current rate regardless if the hair has been cut or not."

They say: "eww! Don't put oil on your hair, use this expensive salon treatment!"

You say: "Why?" or "It's not your place to tell me what to do to my hair" or point them to scientific studies that show the effects of different kinds of oils on hair (this blog post has an example -> http://thebeautybrains.com/2007/05/14/two-natural-oils-that-make-your-hair-shiny-and-strong/).

I consider myself very science minded so if someone tells you that you should or should not do something, my first instinct would to ask why. If people make claims, it's their responsibility to back it up.

"Do you have any double blind studies to back up your claims?" Anecdote is not the plural of data (or whatever that phrase is).

At the end of the day, it's not their place to tell you what to do with your hair, and if they don't know that then you should let them know. Don't worry, it's not rude to set boundaries. :)

I hope this post was helpful.

trolleypup
October 17th, 2010, 09:53 PM
So far I've been very polite to people, but I was wondering what you all say to the naysayers when they get started? My plan right now is to stop cutting my hair altogether except for standard trims. I need a pep talk here, folks. I'm really getting fed up.
"Uhhh, thanks!" and move on.

Athena's Owl
October 17th, 2010, 09:54 PM
What has begun to happen for me is that friends who are either in cosmetology school or who work in hair design/care/etc feel a need to criticize my hair care. *snip*

So far I've been very polite to people, but I was wondering what you all say to the naysayers when they get started? My plan right now is to stop cutting my hair altogether except for standard trims. I need a pep talk here, folks. I'm really getting fed up.

it's simple - I don't tell them.

the fact is most people are completely ignorant about hair care for long hair, curly hair, and black hair - and I have all three. I cannot explain to people outside of this board and the board i'm on that is populated almost exclusively by black women the techniques i use to care for my hair. they can see my hair, they can see how long it is, how nice it looks, they can ask me what that wonderful smell is (nightblooming's panacea, in fact!) but if i actually answer them when they ask me what i have to do to get my hair like that, it's like they lose all ability to reason.

I mean, they're telling me that my hair is amazing, that it's beautiful, that they can't believe that it's real, that they wish they could have nice hair like mine --

And then they go EW! when i tell them I almost never use shampoo, choosing to wash with conditioner instead. and then howl in outrage when i tell them that I just use Suave and not some crazy expensive salon treatments. and lose their timy minds when I tell them the reason why my updos look so sleek is because i've brushed through the length of my hair with various oils, and turn their noses up when i say that I do not and have never owned a blowdryer. Seriously, there's no explaining to a closed mind, so don't bother.

jeanniet
October 17th, 2010, 10:01 PM
I'd say you must be doing something right to get that kind of growth. Personally, I'd either ignore the comments or just say "Thanks for the advice!" and then ignore it. :D You really don't have to defend yourself to anyone. If the comments really bother you, then just stop posting about your hair on Facebook--you can post here instead! :p

McFearless
October 17th, 2010, 10:14 PM
Aw don't cry over their comments. I don't think there is malice in their words but only lack of knowledge about hair care. You too believed that shampoo was completely necessary before joining these boards right? I know I did. Just enjoy your hair growth and let the negative comments slide. A week later they don't really seem like a big deal right?

Cheer up :)

Melisande
October 17th, 2010, 11:26 PM
First of all, if your routine works for you, that's wonderful, and you don't have to try every method mentioned here. You must be doing it right because you have had wonderful growth until now and even if you experience a little stall right now, it will continue to grow. Don't fret.

There is no reason to talk with others about your hair care. Really. So what if your friends are at cosmetology school? They learn there to treat hair as raw material for styling, what i call the short term approach. I have a good friend who is a hair stylist and she sees hair totally different from the way i see it. She sees it as something to be cut into stylish cuts, colored to suit the fall colors, to be blowfried, teased, flatironed or held with hair spray for effect. I see hair as part of myself, and i want to grow it long a la LHC. I call it the long term approach.

There is no way i can talk with her about it. When she says HAIR and I say HAIR, we are simply not talking about the same thing. I accept that. For her, putting oil on hair is gross. For me, it's a logical outcome of what i know about hair, sebum and traditional hair care. (Although of course commercial hair creams and balms do contain mineral oil, a cheap replacement of vegetable oils).

So what? I don't discuss my hair with her.

Stop justifying yourself. Does your hair look good? I think it does. Your friends may feel provoked at your success in taking care of your hair differently from what they believe to be proper. How dare you grow lovely long hair against all the principles of cosmetology school? ;-) How did generations of women get along without shampoo or cones? Well they did and so do you.

If you want to talk hair, we are here for you. Facebook is not a good place to discuss it; I see Facebook as a very gossipy place. maybe i'm wrong. But for every question, crisis, boasting session, just come here and you will get good advice, much understanding and honest feedback. There is really no better place to talk hair than here. So many approaches, so much understanding for choices. The complete opposite of the one-dogma-ponies that your friends seem to be... at least considering hair care.

And don't feel shy to post here. i did so at first because English is not my native language and i felt embarrassed by my clumsy sentences. But people here are really nice and thoughtful and very very knowledgeable. I have learned so much here! My hair has changed completely, it has become what it always wanted to be.

I'd like to see a picture of your hair, btw....

I think: if one of your friends is really interested, just give her the URL of this site to augment what she is learning. If not, just talk about other things.

UltraBella
October 18th, 2010, 12:05 AM
You know, I just do not care what other people think ! Not many have the nerve to say anything to me anyway because I am a *tad* opinionated ant not afraid to tell them to take their mediocre hair and go harp on someone else. Your hair is lovely and why someone would try to tell you what you should or should not do to it is beyond me.
I break all the rules. I own two professional salons and I use $4.96 conditioner that I buy at Walmart. The only thing I put in my hair is aloe vera gel and I just put box color all over my head two hours ago even though I have six stylists who could do it for me with professional products. None of my stylists would ever say anything to me though, and not because I am the owner. It is because I know what I am doing when it comes to my hair and there is nothing for anyone to correct. Own your hair, your routine and your knowledge. You have grown it well and they should either compliment you or zip their lips !

UltraBella
October 18th, 2010, 12:06 AM
Darn double posts :(

ChatNoir
October 18th, 2010, 02:23 AM
I can sense that you are a bit of a sensitive person, like myself. Often we take comments like that a bit harder than it is meant.

Your friends are probably trying to help you. I must admit I hate critizism too, but do what is right for you, and then you might want to ask them why your hair is so long and beautiful when you don't use hair products like that at all. :) Just a thought.

alwayssmiling
October 18th, 2010, 02:52 AM
Firstly - all that growth in a YEAR, you must be doing something right :eek: Secondly I don't tell people about my hair care routine anymore, I got tired of explaining myself to people who clearly know better than me about my hair :rolleyes:. Although there are people on here who have wonderful hairdressers who give them great advice about haircare and *understand* long hair or curly hair for example, I have been given some rotten advice from "experts" which is why I am here now trying to get my hair back into condition so it will grow again. Here are some of the things that my hairdresser told me and I believed

Wash hair everyday its good for it
Flat ironing is good for hair as it seals in moisture
When flat ironing leave hair slightly damp to make it easier
Trim every six weeks or it won't grow :rolleyes:
Bleached highlights done at the salon have 'special' conditioners in hair that will improve its condition



I followed this advice for 2 whole years and watched my hair get shorter and shorter, until it was at chin length, like straw and breaking by the handful. Now I COwash, I use sulfate free shampoos, cone free shampoos, I henna (which some of my friends think is BAD for my hair).

The thing is we have the internet to find things out for ourselves and don't need the approval of other people anymore :).

You could either ignore them and do your own thing with confidence (I wonder if they are a teensie bit jealous of your waist length hair) or just not discuss it with them, because its non of their business. Either way keep doing what is clearly agreeing with your hair. Good luck.;)

Dreams_in_Pink
October 18th, 2010, 03:07 AM
They say: "eww! Don't put oil on your hair, use this expensive salon treatment!"


OR better yet, just grab the closest shampoo/conditioner/hair serum thing and show them the jojoba, castor and olive oils listed in the ingredients :D

jojo
October 18th, 2010, 03:19 AM
Well you are obviously doing something right, it took me 3 years to get the same amount of growth so kudos for you!

as for my routine, if people ask I tell them but the reaction is usually very negative so nowadays I like to keep a bit of mystery going. I only know one other person who is long haired obsessed in real life, so we will have a chat and talk routines but other than that I keep my thoughts and ideas for LHC!

Dont take it to heart, they dont fully understand because there heads are filled with advertisements and gobbledy gook they have read in magazines!

podo
October 18th, 2010, 07:11 AM
I call it the long term approach.

I just burst out laughing when I saw this!! "long term" hahahahaha

Ok, now that's over with..

I know just how you feel - it seems that so many females around the world seem to take exception with anyone that does anything outside of what "society" says is the proper thing to do (which is often what various industry marketers want to sell you) be it makeup, clothing, shoes, cars, vacations, mates.... or hair care. I don't know why this is, but it's true. Perhaps it's just easier to not think for yourself? I think Melisande has very good advice - just don't talk hair with them. If you feel that you want to, post a new style mastered, or a new length achieved, but don't discuss how you got there. You already know how they'll respond, so don't torture yourself.

That amount of growth in 9 months is really amazing, and we are all wondering what you did to get it!

We will sit at your feet in rapt amazement while you tell us about your growth. We will welcome you at our feet while we help you to take your amazing growth and friendlier hair care methods to build strong, healthy, shiny, long hair....while accepting that different methods work differently for different people. We will help you create your own routine so that it's maximized for your hair, not ours.

Welcome to the LHC and know that we definitely want you to post. I only asked questions for a very long time, but now I'm in a better place because of it!

Angeletti
October 18th, 2010, 07:50 AM
I would just tell them to stop talking negatively about your hair because it upsets you and if they are true friends they will listen. As for the "cut your hair and it grows faster" question, when my family members try telling me that I like to throw it back in their face and ask them to explain the meaning behind it because often than not they have no idea and just say it because others do even though that won't work on your friends because you said they are studying hair so should know. I'm not sure if your ends are healthy or not because I don't know anything about your hair but maybe try telling them that your hair is not breaking off more than it's growing so to stop with that stupid cut your hair and it grows faster phrase. Good luck with this.

LaurelSpring
October 18th, 2010, 08:02 AM
I think many members here experience this. I have attempted to talk to others about my routine occasionally and it doesnt work unless they truly have a sincere interest. For the most part it just doesnt go over very well. I have learned to just rely on the dear LHC community for support and encouragement.

Stay strong to your own hair goals and practices. Its your hair, not theirs and you are the one that has to be happy with it. If you do something because someone else thinks you should and it doesnt go well then you will be sad and probably regret it.

My usual response is basically to say... that sounds interesting, I'll think about it (consider it, check it out...whatever) and then drop or change the subject. If someone mentions cutting my hair..I say, maybe one day but not today. Yes, I avoid confrontation through vagueness.....lol

spidermom
October 18th, 2010, 08:46 AM
As far as I'm concerned, there are no absolutes in this world, so when people tell me things that I don't agree with, I concede that they have a point and let them talk. Then I do what I want.

aenflex
October 18th, 2010, 08:54 AM
I think the best defence is to be educated. This was you can respond politely but surely with fact rather than hurt or agression.

bumblebums
October 18th, 2010, 09:03 AM
Ya know, I have never had this problem. I have always assumed that the crazy stuff I do to my hair is of no interest to anyone, and that most people would not react well to it if I told them that I put egg yolk, vinegar, and oil in my hair and never shampoo it. People don't ask me how I care for my hair, and I don't ask them. And we get along great. I figure that I'll have the last word some day when my hair is three times as long as theirs put together :)

CrisDee
October 18th, 2010, 10:49 AM
Asking people in cosmetology school about hair care is like asking a doctor, nurse or pharmacist about health care. Cosmetologists get 95% of their education either directly or indirectly from the companies that make hair care products - just as doctors, nurses and pharmacists get 90% of their education (maybe more) from drug companies. And that's all they know.

Remember - it's all about money for these companies, not necessarily what actually works. And each of these industries will completely pooh-pooh a natural treatment, something they can't patent and make money on. Sounds cynical, probably is - but the longer I live, the more true I'm finding it. :shrug:

YesitsReal
October 18th, 2010, 11:08 AM
You can refer them to this website:

thebeautybrains.com

These ladies are actual cosmetic scientists, and their mission is to debunk all of those beauty myths, like "salon products are better than drug-store," "trimming makes your hair grow faster," etc.

And the best part...the LHC is one of their favorite hair-care websites!!

EverydayMiracle
October 18th, 2010, 01:17 PM
Thank you so much everybody. Hopefully I will be able to stick around this time without feeling guilty or weird about doing so. I just felt in the past as though I had nothing to contribute, and then got so frustrated with the CO routine that I gave up for a few weeks and stopped coming (altogether).

She continued with the aggression today, referring to herself as an "expert" and essentially saying that I am stupid in how I am caring for my hair. Publicly. I am just normally not the type of person to behave that way with a friend, and this is somebody I really respect. That being said, I do *not* respect the people who are teaching her.

I need to get some more info on the CO routine and will probably ask some questions around. If anybody can point me to the official CO thread so I don't have to hunt it up, that would be good. I'm trying to get through a last bottle of shampoo before buying some sulphate-free stuff, but I use about a bottle in nine months. I suspect that it is the bubbles adding the lift to my hair, and there has *got* to be another way to get some volume, right? I was thinking baking soda and vinegar, but that just makes my hair dry. This is unusual, right?

BTW, I remembered last night that I had a BBB. That helped some with distributing what (little) sebum I have. My hair was a lot shinier this morning, and I'm going to oil it tonight with coconut oil. I'm using a coconut conditioner right now so that should be nice! My hubby says I'll smell like the beach. lol


I've always been a fan of the 'information overload' method. Since most people who offer helpful little 'tips' don't really want to know all the details, I like to give them way more information than they ever wanted about how their hair care, shampoo, whatever is destroying their hair and the grand conspiracies of the hair care industry. I can get really passionate about subjects like that. :)

It either shuts them up and/or they think I'm insane. Either way I don't have to listen to them anymore.

This is kind of what I was thinking of doing actually. I make some money with web 2.0 writing and I am considering doing an article about the chemicals in hair care products and the damage that they do to hair. It would not only be therapeutic for me, but it would help to give me something to show people who question my decisions, especially if everything is cited appropriately. AND articles about hair tend to do very, very well in terms of cash income.

On the other hand, some people just won't listen to common sense. One person told me that Henna is terrible for hair and that it is better to use chemical dyes. Now I am graying naturally (I only have a few whites, but it's beginning to happen), so this isn't an issue for me, but I was shocked by the claim. It just was entirely illogical. If chemical dye fries your hair, why would henna be worse? Not to mention the effects that the chemicals have on your overall health!

Right now I am also trying to lose weight and am adopting a relatively holistic view of wellness (including my hair of course). Any kind of chemical on my hair makes me unhappy. If I could do WO without having an issue with my hair going completely limp, I would!


"Uhhh, thanks!" and move on.

That's what Hubby says lol




I'd like to see a picture of your hair, btw....


Your English is beautiful :) And I will get that picture in the next few days. It might be as late as Thursday since I need to have my husband snap a picture and he's doing a lot of working. I don't have a full length mirror anywhere in the house to get a shot.


OR better yet, just grab the closest shampoo/conditioner/hair serum thing and show them the jojoba, castor and olive oils listed in the ingredients :D

Haha! Great point!


As far as I'm concerned, there are no absolutes in this world, so when people tell me things that I don't agree with, I concede that they have a point and let them talk. Then I do what I want.

I have such a difficult time doing this. I know that you are right, but it is difficult for me to just shut up lol

BTW, is that a RTB or a Burm in your picture? Beautiful snake, either way! I wish we could still keep them but we have sugar gliders and gliders and large snakes would not make a good mix.


Asking people in cosmetology school about hair care is like asking a doctor, nurse or pharmacist about health care. Cosmetologists get 95% of their education either directly or indirectly from the companies that make hair care products - just as doctors, nurses and pharmacists get 90% of their education (maybe more) from drug companies. And that's all they know.



I could go on for days about vaccines. I guess that it is my personal "issue" since I have seen more than one child affected by adverse reactions to vaccines. I have friends in health care who try to sell me on vaccines, and become very angry when I say that we don't vaccinate our daughter. It drives them right up the wall. On the other hand, I have made an informed religious and ethical decision (I'm a Torah Observant Christian and there are pork and fetal stem cells in a lot of vaccines, not to mention simian cells and heavy metals) to not vaccinate. On the other hand, this is an issue I will *not* be silent about because it affects so many people, and I think that everyone should make their own decision.

I think most people think that worst case scenario, you cut off all your hair and start over again. But let's not forget that there can be damage to the scalp, and that some of the chemicals in these treatments have been linked to various illnesses including cancer.

As I said, I'm doing everything I can now to begin working on a holistic wellness program for me and my family. Next time my daughter gets an ear infection (which have been rare) I'm going for the garlic oil before the antibiotics. I've changed my diet, I'm getting more exercise, building muscle, getting my heart rate up, and beginning to finally love my life.

Anyway, my point is that people within the medical community might have recommended weight loss surgery. I'm surprised that many of them expect me to weigh less than 120 lbs (I would be a twig!). I have some friends and family pushing me toward drugs to aid in the process and others who are pushing me in the opposite direction.

Regardless of what the training is, the "agenda" is what winds up hurting people. Everybody seems to have one these days!

EverydayMiracle
October 18th, 2010, 03:04 PM
Oh for heaven's sake! Now she's going on about how I'm "making mistakes" with my hair! I just pointed out that I am making the same mistakes that many people with beautiful, long, long, long hair make. I think I'll stick with making their mistakes as I grow out the dye and layers. Thanks. UGH!

spidermom
October 18th, 2010, 03:11 PM
Thank you; he's a Burmese python. The snake is in a secure enclosure most of the time and we make sure the cat is closed into a room when we want to get the snake out; that's the only animal I'd be worried about, though the dog did get too close once, and the snake bit her. Now the dog keeps her distance.

spidermom
October 18th, 2010, 03:12 PM
Oh for heaven's sake! Now she's going on about how I'm "making mistakes" with my hair! I just pointed out that I am making the same mistakes that many people with beautiful, long, long, long hair make. I think I'll stick with making their mistakes as I grow out the dye and layers. Thanks. UGH!

I think my only response would be "thanks for sharing." Then tune her out. Disagreeing invites argument (which I hate).

Demetrue
October 18th, 2010, 06:49 PM
Can you simply tell your friend that you would like her to just drop the issue, that you do not want to continue to discuss it with her?

Hana212
October 18th, 2010, 08:55 PM
I'm lucky that my boyfriend is interested in my new hair care routine and obsession.. I think this is mainly because he has felt and noticed the difference since CWC, oiling and vinegar rinses etc.
I've had a few issues with my best friend though.. "You should tease (back comb) your hair because it will look better" I replied with "and it will break my hair!" and she told me I was in idiot...
I don't tell her how to do her hair and she doesn't tell me how to do mine these days... Works best.. :)

Immera
October 18th, 2010, 09:20 PM
Ignore them. Not worth your energy. Obviously you have had pretty good results so far, and even if growth does slow, be happy with the length you have.
Unfortunately, losing things that you once had in common with friends is a part of life. People grow apart, develop different interests, but you can remain friends. Just note where they are coming from and leave it at that.

EverydayMiracle
October 18th, 2010, 09:28 PM
Believe it or not, I think that we resolved the issue peaceably. I was surprised as I've gotten defensive over the past year. It's especially difficult since the first routine didn't work out well for me at all. Hopefully this just won't come up again!


Thank you; he's a Burmese python. The snake is in a secure enclosure most of the time and we make sure the cat is closed into a room when we want to get the snake out; that's the only animal I'd be worried about, though the dog did get too close once, and the snake bit her. Now the dog keeps her distance.

Because of the lighting, it is difficult to see the markings. He would be a bit RTB but not a full sized burm, at least from the look of it. We used to have two, but when I got pregnant we thought it was best to rehome them. We also had two BCI, two Royals and a corn. I had to make the choice between the gliders and another large snake and I chose the gliders since they are so interactive. But goodness the NOISE!