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View Full Version : Frizzy Roots! Please help.



Talma
August 27th, 2010, 05:35 PM
Hi everyone.

I have natural (not chemically alterted) 3c/4a hair that is now at APL. I've been using the Terri LaFresh method of styling my hair for a year now. My curls shrink up so much that I usually have about two inches of frizz at the roots even with conditioner but the rest of my hair length is perfectly spiraled.

No matter how much I deep condition my hair, it's ALWAYS as stiff as a board and dry. The shrinkage makes my hair go from APL to TWA (teeny weeny afro) that rests about ear length.

My hair literally refuses to budge unless I wet it a bit with water and it will frizz again unless I smooth over some more conditioner. This week I tried co washing and added some lemon juice to it to clarify any buildup. I used a heavier combing conditioner afterwards and detangled and styled my hair as usual. The result was worse than usual "Side Show Bob" hair. I had a dry afro for the first half of the length of my hair and cork screws the rest of the way down. This of course made my hair stick out in all directions at the roots and droop down in tiny "poopey doodles" at the very ends.

My hair looks so unhealthy but I don't use chemicals, gel, mousse, or heat. I'm at my wits end because I can't wear my hair out, only pulled up into a ponytail. If I can't fix the problem then I'm going to buy a straightening iron and kill my hair slowly with heat..but at least it will look better. :rolleyes:

clichepithet
August 27th, 2010, 05:38 PM
I don't know anything useful about curlies and such, but could your scalp frizz be from regrowth? Baby hairs sprouting?

FWIW, if those are your curls in your avatar, they are very pretty.

Talma
August 27th, 2010, 05:49 PM
Thanks for reply. It can't be due to regrowth because there aren't any chemicals in my hair to grow out. So my new growth would be the same texture as the rest of the length. My hair also isn't broken off at the roots that can sometimes cause little frizzies or "baby hair" around the hairline. The frizz is happening on pretty much every strand of hair on my head.

Thanks for the compliment. The pic is of freshly washed, wet hair.

morecowbell
August 28th, 2010, 10:32 AM
I'm sorry to hear about your difficulties ((hug))
I've been having a major frizz issue lately, too! I hate the high humidity of summer here!
As for suggestions.... have you tried using a super heavy conditioner to CO? Like maybe just at the roots?
Also, I know you probably don't want to use anything un-natural, but before you start using heat, maybe consider conditioners with mineral oil or a lotion... I've had hit and miss success with Pink hair lotion. It's heavy, but my hair does like it on occasion (but then, my length is horribly damaged, so that's a factor)
And last, have you tried using a bit of oil just at the frizzy parts while your hair is still wet? Oiling while wet has reduced my amazingly bad (I'm talking witch-like) frizz by about 70%.

Here's hoping you find a solution! Keep us informed if something works for you! :)

Sister13
August 28th, 2010, 04:12 PM
Have you tried SMT as a leave-in? And a light polish of olive oil or coconut? My curls clam down a lot with moisture and oil.


I'm glad you are on here looking for healthy answers for your naturally beautiful hair.

lost_hope
August 28th, 2010, 04:17 PM
Have you tried SMT as a leave-in? And a light polish of olive oil or coconut? My curls clam down a lot with moisture and oil.


I'm glad you are on here looking for healthy answers for your naturally beautiful hair.

Sorry what is SMT? (I'm a newbie :D)
Sorry for the thread hijack OP

Talma
August 29th, 2010, 12:37 AM
morecowbell Thanks for all of your suggestions. This week was the first time I CO washed. I used Suave's coconut conditioner which as you probably know is very light. I didn't think I could use a heavier conditioner because it might add scalp build-up but I will definately try it next time.

I did alot of research last night and I am planning on trying a new routine: a pre-poo conditioning treatment followed by a co-wash or poo-wash if I have too. Then a deep conditioner. Afterward I plan on leaving in my detangling conditioner, which I do anyway and add a light layer of gel on top of that. Then I'll use monoi oil on the ends. If there is still frizz I can try all of the above plus put the oil on the roots too like you suggested. If that doesn't work I'll try styling putty on the roots. lol yeah, I know that's alot but I am desperate and someone on YouTube tried something similar with good results. The only thing I'm worried about is crunchy hair but it should soften up if I scruch my curls after my hair has dried and braid my hair up at night.

Apparently the frizz is caused by dry hair. Which makes sense because my hair is a virtual desert. It's so dry it gets incredibly stiff. Words can't describe the stiffness of it. Leave-in conditioners that you get at drug stores are WAY too light. I can't even tell I have anything in my hair with those. Moisturizing lotions like Pink Lotion do nothing but sit on top of the strands and make an oil slick. Don't even get me started on the scalp build up it creates. My hair hates them all for some reason and it doesn't take in any moisture from them. The best thing so far is leaving in my combing conditioner which is usually a thick and slippery type like Herbal Essence. My hair LOVED when I left in my Hair Mayonaise but when I tried it the second and third time it looked really dull and not so springy. I think it was product build up. So maybe I should try it again but clarify my hair first? :confused: I think I'll try it next shampoo day.

Sister 13 What's SMT. I don't think I've heard of that one before. I googled it and found "Snowymoon's Moisture Treatment". Here is the link: http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=128

Is that the same thing? Tell me more!!! Has it worked well for you?

lost_hope No worries. You didn't hijack it :D I was wondering too.


BTW, My hair looks like this but shorter...and not as fabulous and healthy: http://www.naturallycurly.com/curly-hairstyles-pictures/view/beautiful-length-5905

*Sigh* Someday I'm gonna marry that man in the picture *drool* :crush:

morecowbell
August 29th, 2010, 07:55 AM
morecowbell Thanks for all of your suggestions. This week was the first time I CO washed. I used Suave's coconut conditioner which as you probably know is very light. I didn't think I could use a heavier conditioner because it might add scalp build-up but I will definately try it next time.

I did alot of research last night and I am planning on trying a new routine: a pre-poo conditioning treatment followed by a co-wash or poo-wash if I have too. Then a deep conditioner. Afterward I plan on leaving in my detangling conditioner, which I do anyway and add a light layer of gel on top of that. Then I'll use monoi oil on the ends. If there is still frizz I can try all of the above plus put the oil on the roots too like you suggested. If that doesn't work I'll try styling putty on the roots. lol yeah, I know that's alot but I am desperate and someone on YouTube tried something similar with good results. The only thing I'm worried about is crunchy hair but it should soften up if I scruch my curls after my hair has dried and braid my hair up at night.

Apparently the frizz is caused by dry hair. Which makes sense because my hair is a virtual desert. It's so dry it gets incredibly stiff. Words can't describe the stiffness of it. Leave-in conditioners that you get at drug stores are WAY too light. I can't even tell I have anything in my hair with those. Moisturizing lotions like Pink Lotion do nothing but sit on top of the strands and make an oil slick. Don't even get me started on the scalp build up it creates. My hair hates them all for some reason and it doesn't take in any moisture from them. The best thing so far is leaving in my combing conditioner which is usually a thick and slippery type like Herbal Essence. My hair LOVED when I left in my Hair Mayonaise but when I tried it the second and third time it looked really dull and not so springy. I think it was product build up. So maybe I should try it again but clarify my hair first? :confused: I think I'll try it next shampoo day.

Sister 13 What's SMT. I don't think I've heard of that one before. I googled it and found "Snowymoon's Moisture Treatment". Here is the link: http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=128

Is that the same thing? Tell me more!!! Has it worked well for you?

lost_hope No worries. You didn't hijack it :D I was wondering too.


BTW, My hair looks like this but shorter...and not as fabulous and healthy: http://www.naturallycurly.com/curly-hairstyles-pictures/view/beautiful-length-5905

*Sigh* Someday I'm gonna marry that man in the picture *drool* :crush:

Yw :) I know what it's like to be at wit's end with super dry hair. :(
Pink lotion does the same thing for me sometimes, others it's fine... I bet it's the mineral oil and silicones to blame.
It seems like you've got a handle on where to start, some very good ideas here :)
Let us know how it goes!

ktani
August 29th, 2010, 10:01 AM
Hi everyone.

I have natural (not chemically alterted) 3c/4a hair that is now at APL. I've been using the Terri LaFresh method of styling my hair for a year now. My curls shrink up so much that I usually have about two inches of frizz at the roots even with conditioner but the rest of my hair length is perfectly spiraled.

No matter how much I deep condition my hair, it's ALWAYS as stiff as a board and dry. The shrinkage makes my hair go from APL to TWA (teeny weeny afro) that rests about ear length.

My hair literally refuses to budge unless I wet it a bit with water and it will frizz again unless I smooth over some more conditioner. This week I tried co washing and added some lemon juice to it to clarify any buildup. I used a heavier combing conditioner afterwards and detangled and styled my hair as usual. The result was worse than usual "Side Show Bob" hair. I had a dry afro for the first half of the length of my hair and cork screws the rest of the way down. This of course made my hair stick out in all directions at the roots and droop down in tiny "poopey doodles" at the very ends.

My hair looks so unhealthy but I don't use chemicals, gel, mousse, or heat. I'm at my wits end because I can't wear my hair out, only pulled up into a ponytail. If I can't fix the problem then I'm going to buy a straightening iron and kill my hair slowly with heat..but at least it will look better. :rolleyes:

Try mariika's recipe (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=53745). The reports on it are great. The frizz fighting results last more than one day. It does not build-up on hair (it is easily removed with shampoo), or cause dryness. The keys to its success are the natural constituents of lemon juice and the dilution (the amount of lemon juice to water).

Dryness can result from over conditioning build-up from conventional or natural waxes, natural oils, butters, silicone, and other products as well as anti-humectant pomades.

Talma
August 29th, 2010, 10:38 AM
Yw :) I know what it's like to be at wit's end with super dry hair. :(
Pink lotion does the same thing for me sometimes, others it's fine... I bet it's the mineral oil and silicones to blame.
It seems like you've got a handle on where to start, some very good ideas here :)
Let us know how it goes!

morecowbell Thanks! It must be the mineral oil for me. I never did a test to see if mineral oil makes my hair angry or not. I know that my hair loves cones though. The only conditioners that I have that are cone free and Talma hair friendly are Hair Mayonnaise and Lustrasilk Shea Butter Cholesteral. The Lustrasilk doesn't let my comb gluide over the hair as nicely as the HM but it's still nice. My hair laughs at other cone free products that I've tried.

I re-read the HM label and it has a lot of protein in it. So I think my hair might need more protein as well as moisture. Maybe that is also the problem. If do a pre-poo condition treatment, deep condition and leave in the HM and apply oil to the ends and maybe the roots...it may give the balance I need. I got my fingers crossed! lol If leaving in the HM gives build up over time I'll try Garnier Fructis' Triple Nutrition conditioner. This also has protein but is lighter so I can compare the two.



Try mariika's recipe (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=53745). The reports on it are great. The frizz fighting results last more than one day. It does not build-up on hair (it is easily removed with shampoo), or cause dryness. The keys to its success are the natural constituents of the lemon juice and the dilution, the amount of lemon juice to water.

Dryness can result from over conditioning build-up from conventional or natural waxes, natural oils, butters, silicone, and other products as well as anti-humectant pomades.

ktani Thanks! I did see this thread the other day but I skipped it because I thought the lemon juice I used in my co wash might have added to the frizz factor. I'll definately have to try this now though! I'll try both the lemon juice and the apple cider vinegar version. I used to use the vinegar solution to regulate my dry itchy scalp but forgot about that trick. I have about a month of experimentation scheduled now lol.

I hadn't realized build up can occure from over- conditioning. Luckily I bought the Garnier Fructis today so I can compare it to my other conditioners. Hopefully that one will be a happy medium. I don't use most styling product but I've added alcohol free gel to my list of trial products as it gave good result years ago but my hair still felt REALLY dry.

ktani
August 29th, 2010, 11:14 AM
ktani Thanks! I did see this thread the other day but I skipped it because I thought the lemon juice I used in my co wash might have added to the frizz factor. I'll definately have to try this now though! I'll try both the lemon juice and the apple cider vinegar version. I used to use the vinegar solution to regulate my dry itchy scalp but forgot about that trick. I have about a month of experimentation scheduled now lol.

I hadn't realized build up can occure from over- conditioning. Luckily I bought the Garnier Fructis today so I can compare it to my other conditioners. Hopefully that one will be a happy medium. I don't use most styling product but I've added alcohol free gel to my list of trial products as it gave good result years ago but my hair still felt REALLY dry.

You are most welcome!

I do not believe apple cider vinegar can do the same, or even close to it. Here is a post (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showpost.php?p=1232027&postcount=173) I did with more information on acv, which can also add a red tint to hair, based on reports.

ETA: White vinegar is just acetic acid and water and also needs to be diluted further for use on the hair. Most if not all styling gels can build-up on hair too, resulting in the dryness you had and one needs to be clarify the hair every so often because of that. Mariika's recipe is very cost effective as well as excellent. You just need to buy lemons or reconstituted lemon juice.

SpinDance
August 29th, 2010, 01:34 PM
Talma, while I don't have your curls (I wish!) I completely relate to frizz and dryness. I have always had to use lots and lots of conditioners. When I found out about CWC & CO, those have helped, too. However I think what has helped me most are 2 basic things. 1) Using the right tools, no molded plastic with seams to strip the scales off. 2) Oil is My Friend!

Since I've begun my record keeping after finding LHC I've decided that I need protein sometimes, but not all the time. I also continue to need lots and lots of conditioning and moisture to keep from having a huge mass of frizz. My hair has everything in it, from baby fine to thick as horse hair, and completely straight to kinky curly. On average it's very wavy, but none of my hairs seem to want to wave the same way, so I get volume and frizz, without the benefits of waves or curls either one.

I've learned that there are 2 ways that oils are good for my hair. In tiny amounts as a leave in. Too much and it will not lay nicely but instead get too much of a good thing and end up in strings. With your texture and curls I expect your hair would take a lot more than mine. In much larger amounts as a deep treatment, with stringy locks, left in for a while, or a day, or even more, when I'm lazy on weekends. For me coconut and shea butter work well, as do several other oils and blends. Some people get good results with olive oil, but I don't. It just sits on the surface of each strand of my hair and looks greasy and nasty. Everyone is different and only experience will let you know what works well for you. And from what I've found over the last 9 or so months, the experiments need to be over more than just a day or so. Something that didn't seem to go so well before a wash can turn out to be amazing once washed/CO'd out.

It has taken months for me, but I've been slow about experimenting with different oils, different applications. Your experiences, of course, may vary.

I've been having good luck with Beldaran's Oil (etsy) which is similar to Africa's Best Hair Oil, but without the added scent. I've recently been using Nightblooming's Panacea with great effect, and am just starting to try her Triple Moon Anointing Oil today. So far so good.

I suggest getting some coconut oil (grocery section of a health food store, or maybe a regular store), shea butter (lots of online places) or some of the various hair oils avaiable at drug and health food stores, and starting to experiment. Keep records, go slowly. I don't find coconut oil to work very well for me alone as a leave in. It does fine in a blend with shea butter and other oils as a leave in, or as a deep treatment before washing, though. Leaves my hair nice and soft.

Be prepared to apply enough oil that your hair seems to just soak in it a few times and see if that makes any difference. What I found was that it soaked into the top of my hair well, but the old, extremely dry, porous and fragile ends it has taken months to get enough oil worked into them to make them shiny and supple. Long term project. Hopefully you'll have faster results. I took a long time to really slather oils onto my hair because I was afraid it wouldn't come out. It does, and if I use diluted SLS shampoo in my CWC I get the benefits of heavy oiling without long term build up problems.

Oh, I guess I should mention that I frequently and very randomly change what shampoo/conditioner I use. I don't know if that makes a long term difference in results, as I've always done this.

Good luck on your journey. It is such a relief and joy when you finally figure out what 'works' for you and your hair!

lost_hope
August 29th, 2010, 04:59 PM
Sister 13 What's SMT. I don't think I've heard of that one before. I googled it and found "Snowymoon's Moisture Treatment". Here is the link: http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=128

Is that the same thing? Tell me more!!! Has it worked well for you?

lost_hope No worries. You didn't hijack it :D I was wondering too.


BTW, My hair looks like this but shorter...and not as fabulous and healthy: http://www.naturallycurly.com/curly-hairstyles-pictures/view/beautiful-length-5905

*Sigh* Someday I'm gonna marry that man in the picture *drool* :crush:

Ahh right okay :D
Thanks for the link it made it a lot clearer.
Hope you find a solution for your hair :D x

Talma
August 29th, 2010, 09:53 PM
ktani Ok thank you. I never noticed a red tint with ACV but my hair has red tint/highlights naturally so I don't know how it acts on everyone else's hair. I'll try the lemon first. The last time I used ACV rinses was when my hair was relaxed and frizz wasn't much of an issue just itchy scalp.

I'll keep you posted on how it goes. :)

SpinDance WOW! Thank you so much for your reply. This really helps. I do have some shea butter and coconut oil burried in my stash somewhere. I think I'll experiment with those again. One oil that I absolutely love is avocado butter that I special ordered for lotion making. It works well on my hair when I braid it in the winter but I haven't figured out a way to use it when I wear my hair down. Because I just leave my detangling conditioner in my hair, shake and go it hinders the slip of the comb if I apply it before the conditioner and seems to not soak into my hair if I try and apply it after the conditioner. I think I'll try what you mentioned and apply it to my hair for a day or the night before I wash as a pre-poo conditioner. I've had good results when I wet my hair, apply the oil and baggy the ends for a couple of days. I think that was the softest my hair has ever been but I completely forgot about it until reading your post! lol

I'll also have to check etsy for those other oils you mentioned. Thank you!!!!

lost_hope Thanks! :D if you try the SMT let me know how it works!!

ktani
August 29th, 2010, 10:53 PM
ktani Ok thank you. I never noticed a red tint with ACV but my hair has red tint/highlights naturally so I don't know how it acts on everyone else's hair. I'll try the lemon first. The last time I used ACV rinses was when my hair was relaxed and frizz wasn't much of an issue just itchy scalp.

I'll keep you posted on how it goes. :)

You are most welcome!