Calling all fine hair people...

[wahmof9]

I have been a member now for almost 1 1/2 year and I think I have spent the GNP of a small country trying to find what works and every time I think I do...someone mentions something new....and...well....hum....I got to try it.

For years I have been cone free BUT recently some poeple have mentioned that it may not be so bad especially for fine hair.

You know what? My hair loves a tiny amount of coney serum after it has been washed. I have no damaged ends, but the slip helps me handle my fragile fine hair much better and gentler.

But I want to learn from other fine haired people. What are you favorite products and what is your routine?

[exile2600]

My texture is fine or thin. I have frizz in my DNA so I must cone but with lightweight product. Anything heavy weighs my hair down. Garnier Fructise leave in conditioner and Mane and Tail detangler are my cones of choice. I tried Paul Mitchell gloss drops, but found it too heavy. I stay away from oils because my hair is oily enough. If I add heavy weight oils (even just a few drops) to my clean hair, then it looks like I haven't washed it in a week! I have to shampoo daily. I've experimented with various washing options after lurking this site, but anything too radical left me with less than stellar results.

I find that the texture of my hair makes most styling options too difficult. It doesn't hold anything. It just limps its way out of style. I also have odd thin spots on my temples. That's the most annoying part of all! It looks like bald patches if I pull it back too severely.

[teela1978]

I'm starting to think I'm more on the fine side of medium... my hairs aren't as fine as my Dad's, but I've noticed recently that my individual hairs are thinner than just about everyone else I run into. I find that coney serum is great for me. It makes detangling a snap. I also like a low-cone conditioner (hello hydration from herbal essences has dimethicone halfway down the ingredients list, I like it a lot) after shampoo. Too much coney conditioner and I get greasy and flat... so I generally keep a coney and non-cone conditioner in my shower and swap between them somewhat regularly (like every other wash). I like CHI serum. It lasts a long time. I don't use it every wash, but at least weekly and any time I want my hair to look its best. For me, most of my damage seems to come from detangling and overhandling my hair. Anything that lowers the amount of manipulation my hair requires helps!

[GypsyGoddess]

I have very fine (think Scandinavian) strands, wavy/curly, but a lot of them... Before I chopped my hair off, I did all kinds of bad stuff to give it volume, blowdrying, mousse, but it left me really dry and damaged.

After I cut it, I started using Aloe Vera gel (the clear kind, not the kind with painkillers for sunburns) right after I came out of the shower and it give me a very soft gel-like hold, but is very moisturizing and doesn't leave me greasy as long as I don't overdo it. My husband has silky thick, spiral-curly hair and he was using the aloe as well to shape his curls. It might be worth a try, the gel isn't expensive and it's usually with the lotions and cocoa butter products in the grocery store if you take a look.

My mom loves the CHI serum teela mentioned, my mom has a similar texture to mine but her strands are super coarse. When I've borrowed her serum, it's always left me super-soft and silky, it's just a bit expensive for me right now.

[LouLaLa]

You know what? My hair loves a tiny amount of coney serum after it has been washed. I have no damaged ends, but the slip helps me handle my fragile fine hair much better and gentler

My hair loves this too wahamof9! I only use literally 2 drops of serum which I use after a head massage, leave in then wash out the next morning. I thought this would make my hair greasy but it works so well and my hair feels pretty nice.

I CO (LHC converted me :p) and I use a childrens detangler spray as my hair seems to like it alot.

I have been through so many products in my time but since starting the "use up your stash challenge" ive realized that a conditioner, my little bottle of serum and the detangler is all my hair really needs.

[Elenna]

Fine hair but different products.

I heavily oil hair with coconut oil, etc before a wash, but don't put any oil in afterwards. It's too easy to over oil and end up with greasy hair.

I must hasten to add that my hair is in much better condition than previously. I've been growing out chemical dye damage and now have natural hair color, but it is easily damaged.

Maybe, I try the cone products again.

[pepperminttea]

I tried the coney CHI serum, but no luck for me. It dried out my ends something awful, I had to S&D a lot more right after I used it. My favourite thing at the moment is probably Nightblooming's Triple Moon oil - it's quite light, lovely smell, and does the job. I do use coconut oil too, but only as a pre-wash treatment, it's too heavy for anything else for me.

[teela1978]

I use coconut oil as a pre-wash treatment as well. I also find that it weighs down my hair if I try to use it to reduce frizz or gloss up my length. Its far too easy to use too much!

[Squeak toy]

I have fine hair and now that I know that and understand it's limits and benefits I am much happier. My hair likes moisture and I do not mind a bit of weight, I like my hair sleek and straight and I think weight controls tangles and frizz. I made a shampoo with a teaspoon of oil in it and that provides great slip to my hair for detangling. I use coconut oil on the ends and it feels better the second day, not so oilly but soft. I am opposed to any unnatural products and cones. I only oiled properly after reading about how to do it here. I can not do much with my hair as nothing holds. I have learned that fine hair is slippery. Elastics slide out. Shorter hairs become loose and stick out of pulled back hair and braids. I can not fix that so I accept that.

[RachelRain]

I have fine hair and now that I know that and understand it's limits and benefits I am much happier. My hair likes moisture and I do not mind a bit of weight, I like my hair sleek and straight and I think weight controls tangles and frizz. I made a shampoo with a teaspoon of oil in it and that provides great slip to my hair for detangling. I use coconut oil on the ends and it feels better the second day, not so oilly but soft. I am opposed to any unnatural products and cones. I only oiled properly after reading about how to do it here. I can not do much with my hair as nothing holds. I have learned that fine hair is slippery. Elastics slide out. Shorter hairs become loose and stick out of pulled back hair and braids. I can not fix that so I accept that.

This. and it's not really frizz (the shorter bits) but it can be just as annoying.

I should try the oil in the shampoo trick - sounds nifty. I've been using aloe instead of the coconut oil on my ends and it seems to work a little better on smoothing those random not-so-soft bits (thanks to constantly sitting on it and being one of those no-trim types.)

Honestly my hair seems to be happy to let me do pretty much whatever I want as long as I wash it out after. It rarely stays in any style for long, and I'm pretty content to wear it down, so after a couple of failed attempts I usually give up and let it do what it wants.

[Deborah]

My hair is extremely fine in texture, but I have a lot of it. I don't use any cones or leave in the hair products ever. I wash once a week with either CO + citric acid or Indian herbs, and follow either with a citric acid or vinegar rinse. My hair turns out quite nicely with both of these options.

[Yamainu]

Just starting out here, but so far I use coney shampoo and conditioner and a tiny bit of coconut oil on my ends before I sleep (or sometimes if I'm gonna do an updo that day). My current conditioner is pretty coney (Garnier Long and Strong) but I'm planning on moving to some lighter stuff when these bottles are done.


I haven't tried the Alo Vera gel before - gel has always made my hard piecey and chunky, would the alo vera do the same?

[RachelRain]

Just starting out here, but so far I use coney shampoo and conditioner and a tiny bit of coconut oil on my ends before I sleep (or sometimes if I'm gonna do an updo that day). My current conditioner is pretty coney (Garnier Long and Strong) but I'm planning on moving to some lighter stuff when these bottles are done.


I haven't tried the Alo Vera gel before - gel has always made my hard piecey and chunky, would the alo vera do the same?

I don't think so. It doesn't feel like regular gel, although it says you can use it for styling. If you rub it in your palms like you do the coconut oil, it's sort of like putting water in your hair, or regular leave in.

Granted, I dunno about the piecey bit, because I haven't cut my ends in a year so mine naturally piece themselves, but I wouldn't think it would make it do anything it wouldn't already be inclined to do.

[MissManda]

If your hair likes cones and it doesn't seem to bother your hair, I see no harm in using them.

My hair appears to be on the fine side of medium, but I'm not actually sure...

I personally strongly dislike using cones because they make my hair tangly, stringy, flat, greasy... I could never wear my hair down when I had between tailbone and classic length hair because my hair would get so tangled. I have no idea how SLS affects my hair and I am currently experimenting with going SLS-free. I think my scalp may be a little less itchy, but that's it.

I find oils and aloe vera gel help me with frizz and poofiness issues. AVG helps me tame my halo of baby hairs along my hairline, while coconut oil gives my length the perfect amount of weight and protection without dragging my hair down. I currently have dry ends (I plan on trimming soon) and coconut oil really helps keep them manageable. When I wear my hair down, I can lightly oil my hair two or three times over the course of the day without any stringiness. My hair absolutely loves coconut oil and can't seem to get enough of it. :D

My hair also loves CO, but I have that washing method on hold until I can get a nice, cheap conditioner that does not kill my or DBF's noses.

So I CWC or C-COW-C. I have one shampoo from Desert Essence that I kind of like and I also have a Nature's Gate Aloe Vera Moisturizing Shampoo that is also pretty nice. For conditioner, I use Nature's Gate Daily Herbal Conditioner and Aubrey Organics Honeysuckle Rose Conditioner (<-- this stuff = LOVE!). I have to dilute the AO condish, but that makes it last longer and rinse more easily. I've observed that my hair likes products targeted at curly or "unruly" hair and dry hair, which is the exact opposite of what "They" tell people with finely-textured hair to do. My hair is always very thirsty and feels so much softer and happier when well-moisturized.

Um, that's all i can think of for now...

[RachelRain]

If your hair likes cones and it doesn't seem to bother your hair, I see no harm in using them.

My hair appears to be on the fine side of medium, but I'm not actually sure...

I personally strongly dislike using cones because they make my hair tangly, stringy, flat, greasy... I could never wear my hair down when I had between tailbone and classic length hair because my hair would get so tangled. I have no idea how SLS affects my hair and I am currently experimenting with going SLS-free. I think my scalp may be a little less itchy, but that's it.

I find oils and aloe vera gel help me with frizz and poofiness issues. AVG helps me tame my halo of baby hairs along my hairline, while coconut oil gives my length the perfect amount of weight and protection without dragging my hair down. I currently have dry ends (I plan on trimming soon) and coconut oil really helps keep them manageable. When I wear my hair down, I can lightly oil my hair two or three times over the course of the day without any stringiness. My hair absolutely loves coconut oil and can't seem to get enough of it. :D

My hair also loves CO, but I have that washing method on hold until I can get a nice, cheap conditioner that does not kill my or DBF's noses.

So I CWC or C-COW-C. I have one shampoo from Desert Essence that I kind of like and I also have a Nature's Gate Aloe Vera Moisturizing Shampoo that is also pretty nice. For conditioner, I use Nature's Gate Daily Herbal Conditioner and Aubrey Organics Honeysuckle Rose Conditioner (<-- this stuff = LOVE!). I have to dilute the AO condish, but that makes it last longer and rinse more easily. I've observed that my hair likes products targeted at curly or "unruly" hair and dry hair, which is the exact opposite of what "They" tell people with finely-textured hair to do. My hair is always very thirsty and feels so much softer and happier when well-moisturized.

Um, that's all i can think of for now...

Slightly off topic, but the chamomile conditioner from vo5, while very watery, smells REALLY good. not strong at all like most chamomile scented hair stuff. It's a dollar at Family Dollar, but it's the little bottle - maybe 12oz? I've never seen the larger bottles there.

[MissManda]

Slightly off topic, but the chamomile conditioner from vo5, while very watery, smells REALLY good. not strong at all like most chamomile scented hair stuff. It's a dollar at Family Dollar, but it's the little bottle - maybe 12oz? I've never seen the larger bottles there.

I know they sell V05 at my local Dollar Tree and at Market of Choice, but I don't remember seeing a chamomile one. Thanks for the recommendation! Now I'll have to go see if they have it so I can give it the sniff test. :)

[RachelRain]

I know they sell V05 at my local Dollar Tree and at Market of Choice, but I don't remember seeing a chamomile one. Thanks for the recommendation! Now I'll have to go see if they have it so I can give it the sniff test. :)

Be careful - I didn't think it was as watery as it is, so it went right up my nose when I went to squeeze it slightly to force some scent out of the bottle. My boyfriend almost fell over laughing - the look on my face must've been special.

Let me check what the actual name of it is, I'll be right back.

edit - okay, the shampoo is healthful green tea, and the conditioner is calming chamomile tea. I would assume if the place has the shampoo, it'd probably carry the conditioner, but I could be wrong :)

[MissManda]

Be careful - I didn't think it was as watery as it is, so it went right up my nose when I went to squeeze it slightly to force some scent out of the bottle. My boyfriend almost fell over laughing - the look on my face must've been special.

Let me check what the actual name of it is, I'll be right back.

edit - okay, the shampoo is healthful green tea, and the conditioner is calming chamomile tea. I would assume if the place has the shampoo, it'd probably carry the conditioner, but I could be wrong :)

LOL! I'm always so paranoid that will happen to me when I check the smells on hair products and hand lotions. I'll probably go condish-hunting latr this week. ^.^

[dropinthebucket]

My fine, limp hair was just horrid until I radically changed my haircare - I just wanted to go all natural and stop the gunk, and oh my gosh! found out it was the gunk that was making my fine hair so limp and ugly! 'cones weighed it down and loosened my wave, even the light ones (i know many fine-haireds like 'cones, dunno, maybe my hair's just weird in not liking them!); sulphates were too harsh for my fragile hair; coconut oil made it greasy and never seemed to absorb properly; hard water was the worst, made my hair difficult, limp, and lifeless looking.

What I do now:

-no 'cones, no sulphates - just my Mehandi shampoo bars
-no conditioner - just castor oil - dunno why, but my hair just soaks it up without greasiness or weight, and gives me shine and encourages waviness
-basin wash with distilled water (can't put a filter or softener in, i rent)

That's it - pretty simple routine, really! :)

[HuggyBear]

Just starting out here, but so far I use coney shampoo and conditioner and a tiny bit of coconut oil on my ends before I sleep (or sometimes if I'm gonna do an updo that day). My current conditioner is pretty coney (Garnier Long and Strong) but I'm planning on moving to some lighter stuff when these bottles are done.


I haven't tried the Alo Vera gel before - gel has always made my hard piecey and chunky, would the alo vera do the same?


I love to use aloe vera gel and it doesn't make my hair hard or piecy at all. I don't use any conventional styling gels because they do make my hair hard & crunchy.

[MissManda]

I personally love aloe vera gel because it doesn't make my hair look gunky or piece-y. And it definitely doesn't make your hair hard and stiff. I cannot stand most conventional gels because they make my hair so... untouchable (not to mention un-smellable, yuck)! I'd rather have hair that was soft and silky than have it uber-styled with those nasty gels. AVG is also great for keeping the fuzzies down.

[CailinNua]

My fine, limp hair was just horrid until I radically changed my haircare - I just wanted to go all natural and stop the gunk, and oh my gosh! found out it was the gunk that was making my fine hair so limp and ugly! 'cones weighed it down and loosened my wave, even the light ones (i know many fine-haireds like 'cones, dunno, maybe my hair's just weird in not liking them!); sulphates were too harsh for my fragile hair; coconut oil made it greasy and never seemed to absorb properly; hard water was the worst, made my hair difficult, limp, and lifeless looking.

What I do now:

-no 'cones, no sulphates - just my Mehandi shampoo bars
-no conditioner - just castor oil - dunno why, but my hair just soaks it up without greasiness or weight, and gives me shine and encourages waviness
-basin wash with distilled water (can't put a filter or softener in, i rent)

That's it - pretty simple routine, really! :)
Ooh, I'm interested in the castor oil. Coconut hasn't been working very well for me. Could you tell me how much you use and how you apply it - to wet or dry hair, all over? I must look into shampoo bars too.

[Chiara]

Aloe Vera gel works well for me too, just smooths any flyaways down without overloading. Not like hair gel at all, which typically led to stiff, gelled clumps that I had to brush out.

[LaurelSpring]

No cones for me. I hate it when I have too much slip. I cant do anything with my hair. Conditioner can make it too slippery and weigh it down also but I need some on the end part to detangle. No leave ins. I was using a gentle sls shampoo but that is just making me a grease ball so I have to get another plan. Maybe I will go back to baking soda again. One thing I have learned about my fine hair is NO OIL! Oil=greasy and stringy. I do put Nightbloomings panacea on the ends. That soaks in well without weighing it down.

Wearing it braided up on my head at night gives me good volume. When I tried to stretch my washes and distribute sebum and oils it seemed to give me more volume and then I would just do light scalp washes. I think that routine was working the best for me. Too much washing and conditioning just makes it flat and stringy again.

[wahmof9]

My fine, limp hair was just horrid until I radically changed my haircare - I just wanted to go all natural and stop the gunk, and oh my gosh! found out it was the gunk that was making my fine hair so limp and ugly! 'cones weighed it down and loosened my wave, even the light ones (i know many fine-haireds like 'cones, dunno, maybe my hair's just weird in not liking them!); sulphates were too harsh for my fragile hair; coconut oil made it greasy and never seemed to absorb properly; hard water was the worst, made my hair difficult, limp, and lifeless looking.

What I do now:

-no 'cones, no sulphates - just my Mehandi shampoo bars
-no conditioner - just castor oil - dunno why, but my hair just soaks it up without greasiness or weight, and gives me shine and encourages waviness
-basin wash with distilled water (can't put a filter or softener in, i rent)

That's it - pretty simple routine, really! :)

How do you use the castor oil?

[Centaur]

How do you use the castor oil?

I am interested too. Also, is the castor oil helping to thicken your new hair growth and promote more re-growth? Did it do anything to lessen shedding?

Thanks:)

[Annalouise]

Yeah! A thread for fine hairs!:)

I've had a heck of a time finding the right routine. I shampooed and conditioned my hair with conventional coney products for years and was never able to get my hair to waist (and looking good) due to damaged ends.

I recently cut back almost to bsl (its between bsl and waist) and now I am doing a mild diluted shampoo (sulphate free and cone free) every 3-4 days and thats it!

Everytime I have put oil on my hair I end up having to use so much shampoo to get it out and that just defeats the purpose for me.

So we'll see if I can reach waist with this method. Time will tell.:)

ETA:

Also, I thought it might be helpful to add what DIDN'T work for me:

regular conditioner (the kind with cones) (due to build up)
water only (massive shedding and oiliness)
Herbs alone - too drying without oil, and oil was too heavy
CO - too much build up
CWC- too much build up
Brushing - split ends
Vinegar rinses - too stinky for me
baking soda - too drying
dr bronners - too drying
leave in's - too stinky and chemically

So as you can see I'm narrowing my options. My hope is that diluted shampoo not more than 2x a week will gently clean my hair and not dry it out. And only using fingers or a comb to detangle on day 2 after washing.:)

[heidihug]

I have fine and floaty hair, so some 'cones and light oils are a must, especially if I wear my hair in a down braid. Plus they help hide any damage.

I use diluted shampoo 3x/wk. I also use coney conditioner on the bottom 15 inches of my hair, non-coney on the middle 25 inches, and none on the top 10 inches. Then apply carnation or other light oil mixed with one of several coney leave-ins on the bottom 25 inches or so while damp. That's pretty much it.

[HeathenHexe]

What I do now:

-no 'cones, no sulphates - just my Mehandi shampoo bars
-no conditioner - just castor oil - dunno why, but my hair just soaks it up without greasiness or weight, and gives me shine and encourages waviness
-basin wash with distilled water (can't put a filter or softener in, i rent)

That's it - pretty simple routine, really! :)

i do the same, except i mainly use LUSH bars. the coconut one is my favorite.

i was scared the first time i used castor oil because it was so thick, but the difference it made in my hair was AMAZING! i love it! i oil heavily one night a week then wash in the morning.

that plus henna has led me to accepting my fate as terribly fine haired.

[dropinthebucket]

:cheese: Centaur, you reached your goal! congrats!!

Sorry all who asked, I've taken a bit to respond - trying to break myself of LHC addiction and only check in once every coupla weeks. Alas, I have failed! :D

I use the castor oil as my post-shampoo leave-in, no condish. When hair is half dry, I put two or three drops on fingertips. Smear the oil all over the fingertips, then gently pat into hair. I work from the tips up to about the ears. It seems like it's nowhere near enough when you put it on, but when the hair is dry, the oil seems to have spread itself out really well.

Sometimes, if I've put a bit too much, it takes a couple of hours for my hair to soak it up. But soak it up it does, no greasy look. I read about castor oil enhancing wave and shine here on LHC, but unfortunately, forgot to bookmark the thread! I'm also finding the castor oil really protects my poor, thin ends.

Yeah, true, some people use it for scalp massage to promote hair growth. Dunno if it works - tried it a couple of times, but my hair is a bit greasy at the scalp. I found I could never get it all out properly if I put any on above the ears. I suspect that the lighter oils, like coconut, are a bit of a problem for me *because* they're lighter - they climb up the hair onto the scalp, making it greasy and hard to get out, even using the conditioner rinse method other LHCers have posted for getting oil out. My theory is the castor oil stays put on the dry ends, without migrating up, because it's heavy ... ? Anyway, hope this is of help!

[goldenoak]

pepperminttea and teela1978 - how do you use the coconut oil as a pre-wash? Do you apply it just before washing or leave in overnight? How much do you generally use, and does it wash out easily? My DBF is mildly allergic to coconut, so I've avoided coconut oil as a leave-in or overnight oil, but maybe it could work if I put it in just before washing?

Annalouise, were you using the Dr Bronner's straight from the bottle, or diluted? I find that a very diluted Dr Bronner's is a great wash for me, followed with very diluted lemon juice as an acid rinse (much nicer than vinegar!). I use about 1 squirt of Dr B's in an 8-oz bottle of warm water, and about 3 squirts of lemon juice in a second 8-oz bottle of water. I do use a home-made conditioner afterwards but that's more for slip and styling than because the wash combo is drying.

[CailinNua]

Thanks dropinthebucket! :blossom: I'm going to try it next time I wash. My poor ends seem to have got worse lately. BTW I too am trying (unsuccessfully) to stay away from LHC!

Got to find myself a new shampoo too, am thinking of Giovanni - anyone know if that is sulphate-free?

[Centaur]

:cheese: Centaur, you reached your goal! congrats!!

:?: My current goal is BSL, and while I have had some growth, I ain't quite there yet. I will measure my hair in a couple days (after I finish my tubes of MN) and see just where I am in length. What I REALLY want is waist length, but not at my current level of thinness - I just don't think it would look good, but I shall see how it goes.:undecided

One thing I can speak for is I have learned a lot about keeping my hair happier and looking better. I have also reached the conclusion that there will be no more blowfryer for my hair (I was getting it blown out with my trims once every 6 wks). Uh, uh. :shake: I just realized there has been mechanical damage - probably from those rare blow outs. I am still battling hair loss and trying to thicken up my hair back to where it was on the low end of a "ii" thickness.

O.K., I really haven't hijacked this thread, y'all. Fellow finie haired person here. The aloe vera and light oil application with either coconut or sweet almond oil has helped moisturize and protect my delicate hair. Regular small trims are keeping the ends in shape. When they aren't in shape, they tear up my hair easily. And I am going to consider (after finishing my MN experiment) either castor oil or some other treatment to help my hair grow in a little thicker. HTH other finies. My hair is on the fine side of medium.

[Annalouise]

Goldenoak-
I was using it full strength. Diluted might be ok. And I haven't tried lemon juice for a rinse and I should because I always have lemons in the house. Thanks for the suggestion.:)

[Sunsailing]

I use all L'Anza conditioners. Use L'Anza Healing Moisture Kukui Nut conditioner in the shower, L'Anza "leave-in" protector as a detangler, and usually some L'Anza "Magic Bullet" before it completely dries.

I have a cabinet full of unused hair stuff. It takes a lot of trials to determine what works best for your particular hair. I'm sure the best stuff for my hair is still waiting to be discovered, but I'm happy with what I'm currently using.

[teela1978]

pepperminttea and teela1978 - how do you use the coconut oil as a pre-wash? Do you apply it just before washing or leave in overnight? How much do you generally use, and does it wash out easily? My DBF is mildly allergic to coconut, so I've avoided coconut oil as a leave-in or overnight oil, but maybe it could work if I put it in just before washing?
Sometimes I sleep in it. Usually its only in for an hour or so before I wash though. I put it on a little at a time until my hair look damp with oil, so its a pretty heavy oiling. Then I'll go exercise or do some cleaning, and then shower. It tends to make my ends happy.

[oceanwoman111]

This is a great thread. Thank you for posting. :) I have fine/medium hair and encounter many of the issues mentioned above. I've tried CO, CWC, no-cone, no sulphates, cones, sulphates, oiling etc. I'd like to share some of my experiences.

CO - Yucky build up = Dull lifeless Hair
CWC - (same as CO)
No Cone - Better softer feel, but no body
Cone - Plasticky feel
No Sulfates - Grease Fest on scalp
Sulfates Diluted - Much more body, less oily.
Oiling - Hydrates Hair fabulously, Before bed I do Castor on scalp and coconut on the length and wash it out in the morning.

I haven't found the magic combo yet. It might look something like this:

Alternate btw Non Sulphate and Sulphate shampoo diluted
Cone free Conditioner
Rosemary scalp massage over night
Castor Oil on Scalp - Coconut oil in length

Fine hair is beautiful and it has its challenges. The days when it's oily and flat on top and dry and a bit frizzy at the ends are frustrating. I'm growing out some damage ,but newest hair feels very silky and manageable. I hope I find the best routine soon. Thank you for all of the great information.

[Drarra]

I love oiling for a deep conditioning treatment, but with how much oil my body produces, I can't do it more than once a week. I put it on my hair the night before a shampoo and let it "soak" until the next day. I've tried olive and coconut oil. I'm not sold on the coconut oil, although a big part of if is probably that I hate the smell, so after reading some of the comments here, I'm curious to see how my hair reacts with the castor oil. To weigh in on cones: I've found that my hair acts best if it has them after it's been towel-dried. Not too much, or I have no hope of ever bunning. Ironically, the conditioner my hair likes best is cone-free. I've gone through so many hair products in the past, searching for those which make my hair nice. It's awesome to have others with fine hair give details about their experiences!

[mellie89]

I am still debating... my damaged ends hate cones, but they work fabulously on my virgin hair. I think when I finally trim the last of the damage away, I'll go back to using cones. I enjoy wearing my hair down a lot and my hair really needs the weight and slip.

I always use sulfate shampoos and I always S&C every 2-3 days.

CO killed my hair's volume, no matter which conditioner I tried. I know a lot of fine-haired people make it work, but it's not for me.

[Annalouise]

Sinse I've been doing shampoo only (diluted) my hair has so much more body. It gives my hair the appearance of being thicker than it is because it is fluffier. (I have fine and thin hair).

I don't know this for a fact, but I think that cones are what may be causing damage to your ends. What I experienced with cones was that it seemed to work great, but when my hair reached apl the ends were very dry and damaged.
I know that fine hair is more prone to damage from chemicals.

I think its possible that the chemicals in conditioner (which are hard to wash out) end up depriving the hair of the moisture it needs.

[CailinNua]

Sinse I've been doing shampoo only (diluted) my hair has so much more body. It gives my hair the appearance of being thicker than it is because it is fluffier. (I have fine and thin hair).

I don't know this for a fact, but I think that cones are what may be causing damage to your ends. What I experienced with cones was that it seemed to work great, but when my hair reached apl the ends were very dry and damaged.
I know that fine hair is more prone to damage from chemicals.

I think its possible that the chemicals in conditioner (which are hard to wash out) end up depriving the hair of the moisture it needs.
I find this interesting as I'm fine-haired with damaged ends. I gave up cones several months ago and rarely use sulphates. I've been contemplating going shampoo only and I think most of my hair would get on well with it. But how to manage the damaged ends? That's where I get my worst tangles and they feel so dry compared to the rest of my hair. They are gradually getting trimmed away though. I just hope that I am being gentle enough with the rest of my hair so eventually I will have healthy ends!

Edit: I forgot to say I tried oiling with a tiny bit of castor oil after washing today. It was very hard to get onto the hair, in fact I'm not sure I successfully transferred it from my fingers to the ends of my hair. But we will see. I also tried Lush Trichomania solid shampoo for the first time today (pity it has sulphates in it) and it's smelling gorgeous!

[Dolly]

My hair is so fine that it is like cat hair (that is what one of my stylists used to call it). It is naturally straight, as in my avatar, and I wear it down most of the time.

I use shampoo bars, followed by a coney condish and a vinegar rinse. I also occasionally use a coney leave-in such as Aussie Hair Insurance or Dove Sheer Moisture. I clarify as needed with Suave Clarifying Shampoo. Oh, and I do a heavy oiling with coconut oil 1-2 times a week.

It is true, cones are not evil. Some people need them. I ran a very thorough experiment to prove this to myself. I clarified, got a very thorough trim, checked for damage and dryness, and all was good. The only thing in my routine that was varied was that my conditioner was cone free. I tried all different types of cone free condish.....high priced to mid priced.....within a few months, my ends were TRASHED. Split and broken. White dots everywhere.

So, I went back to cones. My hair is much happier that way. Some people can go cone free, some can't. To each his own.


ETA.....sometimes I DO use non-cone condish but only as a CO......that is the easiest way to get coconut oil out after a deep oiling......if I do a CO though, I always follow with a coney leave-in.....

[Angeletti]

So far I've found that my hair does best with small amounts of cones. I tried going the oil route and found that the oils are too hard to get out of my hair leaving it greasy (and not to mention taking out my color) so I stopped those and thought I would switch to soaking my hair in cone free conditioner. The conditioners made my hair feel dry and horrible so I switched back to cones.

I usually wash my hair once a week and will soak it in the It's a 10 miracle mask for five minutes, wash then spray on the It's a 10 leave in conditioner and then I have silky soft hair.

[Annalouise]

Hi CailinNua:) I've been getting rid of dry damaged ends for years and I am making progress. My hair is 2 inches shy of my waist and its the first time my hair as been this long and the ends have been good.

I am not really the person to ask about what to do with damaged ends because I always cut mine off.

I don't know how to explain my persistant dry crunchy ends past bsl except that I blamed it on conventional shampoo and conditioner regime because that was all I did with my hair. (wash and cond every 2nd day).

I stopped using cones about a year ago, and did a couple big trims and now my hair is healthier.



Hi Dolly,
Your hair is "happier" with cones, does that mean that you don't get any damaged ends and you don't have to trim your hair anymore?

Hi Angeletti, do you have to trim your hair or does it stay damage free at the ends using cone conditioners?

Also, when the non-cone conditioners wrecked your hair, did you ever try no conditioner?

(I don't like oils much either because of my fine hair it overwhelms the strands making them look greasy and horrible).

[CailinNua]

Wow! That's great progress Annalouise! I'll be delighted if I could even reach BSL with healthy ends. But it'll be a while I think. I also used to shampoo and condition every day But most of my damage is from dye I think - it swelled the shafts making my hair more "normal" but also liable to breaking and splitting. I think I will experiment with shampoo only, or at least only condition sometimes when my hair needs it.

It does seem better today - feels very silky and is not dull looking (I think) after washing with trichomania and a tiny dab of castor oil. :)

[.:Alma:.]

Fine hair and living better without cones.

My hair changed completely, from heavy and greasy to light and softy.

My current routine is:

- Jamila Henna (just washing it out without shampoo) + mango butter as leave in
- Indian Herbs wash + jojoba leave in
- pre-shampoo linseed oil conesfree conditioner+lavera shampoo+lavera conditioner+jojoba leave in
- Co-wash with conefree conditioner + no rinse conefree leave in conditioner (with argan oil)

I think my hair works better with some filming conditioner (but without cones)

[Dolly]

Hi Dolly,
Your hair is "happier" with cones, does that mean that you don't get any damaged ends and you don't have to trim your hair anymore?


I trim my hair about every 4-6 months, usually to straighten up my hemline (I prefer a soft "U" shape to the deep "V" that my hair naturally grows into.....the last big trim I had was due to a hair dye disaster, but that is another story.

Because I do use chemical color, and my hair is fragile, I cannot escape damage altogether. And, by wearing it down 90% of the time, it is even more susceptible. However, the amount of damage is greatly reduced by using cones. I examine my ends carefully every time I clarify (which is usually every 4-5 weeks lately). I remove all the cones to make sure they are not just "hiding" damage. Most of my damage is kept in check by my infrequent trims and S&D sessions for split ends.

So, to answer your question more directly.....with cones, my hair is soft and silky, doesn't get tangles as easily, and is less prone to environmental and mechanical damage. Without cones, my ends get dry, rough, crunchy, and splits galore.

[goldenoak]

So... fellow fine-haireds - do you consider gaining volume in a rolled sock-bun to be "cheating"? And if yes, is that bad?

I passed by some synthetic hair used for extensions the other day and found myself wondering whether I could make an old fashioned "hair switch" with it to boost volume in updos. I know in the old days it was a bit scandalous for a lady to use a hair switch to create false volume, but ... I'm not Victorian.

What do you think?

[teela1978]

My mom has a couple of hair pieces that she uses around ponytails and buns to make them look more interesting. They do look pretty good. Although they sometimes shock me when sitting alone around her house, my aunt has taken to calling them hamsters because the first impression is that a small animal is sitting on the couch!

[goldenoak]

My mom has a couple of hair pieces that she uses around ponytails and buns to make them look more interesting. They do look pretty good. Although they sometimes shock me when sitting alone around her house, my aunt has taken to calling them hamsters because the first impression is that a small animal is sitting on the couch!

Especially problematic for cat-owners, I'd think! ;) Do you know if your mom made them or bought them?

I have a "scrunchie" made with synthetic hair that makes a regular bun look like a larger, loose, messy bun if I put it around the outside. It's kind of a scraggly informal look, though. I'm hankering after something with length that I could ponytail in and either braid or wrap with my own for more robust 'elegant' updos. I don't want to be limited to the sock bun for volume.

I've seen switches like these made with human hair, but they're really expensive and also ook me out a bit. I haven't seen anything like this ready-made out of synthetic, though. It might be time to get crafty with hair-extension hair!

[dropinthebucket]

'Cones really weighed my fine hair down, too. I have a lot of breakage, but I think that's from the chemical dye I'm growing out - I notice it starts just where the demarcation line is, between virgin and processed hair. Only thing is, my processed hair is thicker (because the cuticle got blown up from the bleach!) and now my virgin hair looks thinner, and greasier, in comparison. :( Still gonna grow it out, but I think the texture difference really exacerbates the thin hair problem. Sigh ...

[MandyBeth]

My hair has crazy more volume with Mariika's lemon rinse. Plus my hair is more agreeable with the lemon.

[dropinthebucket]

Mandybeth, I wonder if it's volume from the acidity of the lemons? Amla does this for me, and gives me more curl, too. (Plus, I figure if amla is supposed to help hair grow faster, it can't hurt! :) )

[MandyBeth]

My guess is that with no wax or cones, it's not weighed down. Alma does nothing for me. Also, the ruffled scales from damage are much better. I've got crazy epic post on page 13 of the thread.

[Charlotte:)]

'Cones really weighed my fine hair down, too.

Really? Cones are the only thing that won't weigh down my hair. It's interesting how the same ingredients can effect people's hair so differently.

[redkdawg]

I know in the old days it was a bit scandalous for a lady to use a hair switch to create false volume, but ... I'm not Victorian.

What do you think?

Actually in the 1860s through at least the 1890s, it was normal to have all kinds of switches to get those hairstyles.

I have no problem using a sock bun to get the volume. As long as my hair is, it's still fine and not long enough to do some of the styles that I want to do.

(egads, did I just say "not long enough")

[teela1978]

Especially problematic for cat-owners, I'd think! ;) Do you know if your mom made them or bought them?

I have a "scrunchie" made with synthetic hair that makes a regular bun look like a larger, loose, messy bun if I put it around the outside. It's kind of a scraggly informal look, though. I'm hankering after something with length that I could ponytail in and either braid or wrap with my own for more robust 'elegant' updos. I don't want to be limited to the sock bun for volume.

I've seen switches like these made with human hair, but they're really expensive and also ook me out a bit. I haven't seen anything like this ready-made out of synthetic, though. It might be time to get crafty with hair-extension hair!

My mom's hamsters are exactly what you describe, synthetic hair wrapped around an elastic to make a messy bun. I think she bought them at the swapmeet or the dollar store :) At around shoulder length with layers she'd shove her hair up in a ponytail with one and it'd look amazing.

[rags]

I don't consider a sock bun to be "cheating" at all, and if I could find synthetic hair to match my salt and pepper coloring, I'd try it! I'm considering saving my own hair to make a rat to make my buns look bigger. That's a very odd sentence.......:suspect: :p

[MandyBeth]

Rags, you can buy a rat or hamster or a guinea pig for extra at most pet stores. However my rats prefer to increase my bra size. You could train yours to ride in your underwear I guess, then you'd have to be very careful when sitting. :p :D

[dropinthebucket]

which thread, mandybeth? want to go check it out! (pg. 13, that is!) :)

[rags]

Rags, you can buy a rat or hamster or a guinea pig for extra at most pet stores. However my rats prefer to increase my bra size. You could train yours to ride in your underwear I guess, then you'd have to be very careful when sitting. :p :D

:spitting: I'm SO glad I wasn't drinking or eating when I read this! :rollin:

[melikai]

I've tried a lot of different routines, and so far the one I do now works well.

I CWC, then about 7 days later I do a WO wash and condition my ends. I usually do another WO wash a couple of days after the first one (again, conditioning my ends after). About 12 days since my first actual shampoo, I do another CWC. This sounds more complicated than it is!

Basically, I do a mix of WO and CWC. ;)

I discovered early on in my LHC days that silicones are awful for my hair. My damaged ends are a bit more delicate and tangly without them, but they make my hair limp, flat, dull, greasy-looking, and all around yuk.

I use a SLS/SLeS free shampoo, currently a baby shampoo by Earth Friendly Baby.

I use oil very occasionally - Camellia and Avocado are my favourites. I only use 1-2 drops on dry hair. I've tried heavier oilings and they've always been a disaster - requiring many conditionings and shampooings to get them out.

[CricketSong]

Rags, you can buy a rat or hamster or a guinea pig for extra at most pet stores. However my rats prefer to increase my bra size. You could train yours to ride in your underwear I guess, then you'd have to be very careful when sitting. :p :D

:bigeyes:

Very thin/fine here, and my hair gets oily really easily.. I was using a shampoo with SLES and SLS which seemed to do the job (herbal essences I think). Gave me quite a bit of volume, but it was starting to dry out my nice texture and my scalp was giving me problems =/ Now I'm using organic 'poo, and every day my hair gets oilier and limper, even if I wash it. :sick: The work is never done, right? Think I'll go back to my old 'poo and use organic once a week.

-cone conditioners didn't seem to do much to me. I could never use it on my scalp because my roots became an oily grease ball, just on the length. Hair feels a bit rougher now that I've stopped using it, but not terribly.

[MandyBeth]

Oh sorry! The lemon rinse thread in herbal hair care. I also have a master's thesis over there on my attempts success and fails. But shikakai is bad for my hair.

[MandyBeth]

Glad to provide the fun Rags! It was hard to type for the giggles. But you said your comment sounded wrong and I do love those openings :D

[goldenoak]

I don't consider a sock bun to be "cheating" at all, and if I could find synthetic hair to match my salt and pepper coloring, I'd try it! I'm considering saving my own hair to make a rat to make my buns look bigger. That's a very odd sentence.......:suspect: :p

*laugh*

The funny thing is that it didn't seem like an odd sentence at all until you mentioned it! :D

[Arianwen]

I have the finest hair on the planet (or so I think) but I have a LOT of it and due to my curly/wavy hair, it's the furthest thing from flat - my hair is ANNOYING.

[dropinthebucket]

thanks mandybeth! :runs to check it out:

[pookatrina]

Pre-LHC I was using SLS Poo, cone condish & washing every single day. Once I found LHC & read a bunch I did Poo bars, cone-free condish & washed every 5 days or so. Now after a few years I've got a pretty good routine going for my hair. I do no-SLS poo (winter I do a Poo bar every other wash), cone-free condish, a few drops of cone on the ends after my washing & I wash every 3 days.

My hair is either thick fine or scrawny medium. I did get better volume with SLS-poo, but it turns out that's what made my head itch so back I'd scratch til it bled, so no SLS for me.

[tullu]

do anyone use saw palmetto to thicken their hair :confused:

[Fingolphin]

I take Saw Palmetto as a daily supplement, but not topically on hair.

[Centaur]

do anyone use saw palmetto to thicken their hair :confused:


Saw palmetto is an ingredient in one of my shampoos, but I don't think it really helps. The theory behind saw palmetto is that it is a beta-sisterol and helps inhibit DHT production, a culprit in androgenic alopecia. But, if you don't have that problem, saw palmetto shouldn't have an affect on you anyway.

[Meli1980]

I have been getting good results without cones. I have fine hair but lots of it. and cones make it feel fake. One time i used the Aussie 3 minute miracle moisture by recommendation UGH! My hair felt horrible when dry. You would have sworn I had fishing line growing from my scalp! Plus on top of that it kept getting snarly! I immediately washed it out and went cone free from there. have had good results since.

[cubedcoley]

Hmm, I have a lot to learn because I thought Aussie 3 minute miracle WAS cone-free. Anyway, the best thing I have done, other than switch to CO, is using dilute ACV about every 3-4 washes with CO. Seems to help soften everything up from top to tip. Also, last weekend, I did an SMT, and YOWSER! my hair felt so good when done, shiny and VERY soft but not too oily. Since I have let go of SLS poos and gone cone free for the past week my hair has so much more volume as well.

[chelseamichelle]

I've been cone free for about two months, at first i didn't notice much of a difference and so i thought I was doing something good for my hair. But in the last few weeks i've noticed a LARGE amount of split ends and my hair was just frizzy and dull no matter how much oil i drowned it in, and it felt horrible!

So today i decided to be bad and went and slathered my hair with some super coney Pantene conditioner :) I left it on for about two hours, and voila! My hair looks and feels amazing :cheese: It's super shiny and way less fluffy, it was a complete transformation!

I'm back to loving my hair :)

My fine hair definiteltly likes Cones :yumm:

[rupunzlemom]

Can someone tell me the best con free conditioner? Thanks

[CricketSong]

Can someone tell me the best con free conditioner? Thanks

Have you tried -cone conditioner before and not had good results? Seems like a lot of us like -cones :shrug:

[MissManda]

Can someone tell me the best con free conditioner? Thanks

There are all kinds of cone-free conditioners and it really depends on what you want (cheap, natural, mild scent, etc.) and what you want to use it for (CO, CWC, deep treatment, etc.) You can find a list of cone-free conditioners here (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=2216).

Hope that helps. :flower:

[MandyBeth]

You are welcome! For the lemon and the rat giggles. Oh, new toy. 5x butterfly combs. They actually stay! Welcome Arianwen, another member of the too much fine hair club. I want i hair so I can keep the toys in instead of spat out.

[dropinthebucket]

Centaur is right! Saw palmetto's effects as an adrogen agonist (promoting production of androgens, to block DHT, as Centaur noted) could cause hormonal imbalance overall. If it were me, I would be a little bit leery of saw palmetto unless I knew for sure I had a thinning problem due to DHT. Hope this helps a little! If you google it, the wikipedia entry that comes up, first hit, is very good (for a change!) :)

[rupunzlemom]

You are welcome! For the lemon and the rat giggles. Oh, new toy. 5x butterfly combs. They actually stay! Welcome Arianwen, another member of the too much fine hair club. I want i hair so I can keep the toys in instead of spat out.
MandyBeth.........can you tell me what the 5x butterfly combs are? Maybe you could post a picture. I use combs a lot but have trouble with them staying in my hair. Thanks.

[MandyBeth]

Ebay, I found them searching butterfly combs. 5x is a brand, like Upzing or EZ Combs. I can wear the original African version but that's from the iii hair.

[MClass]

I have theeeee finest hair ever. Every hair dresser who has ever touched my mane has commented on it. I cut my hair short two years ago and a boyfriend was touching my hair and asked if there was something wrong w me lol.

Now that I am growing it out it "appears" thicker. I could never dream of wearing my hair in its natural state. It must be curled or manipulated in some way. Currently I am growing out the light blond I was coloring it, going natural. I am hoping between that and taking hair vitamins it will get slightly thicker.

I have also been reading through the heatless hair thread and have some motivation to try the hair pin and curl rag techniques. I wonder though if I will ever be able to grow my hair as long as some of you. :mad:

And hi, btw I'm the new kid! :D

[Arianwen]

You are welcome! For the lemon and the rat giggles. Oh, new toy. 5x butterfly combs. They actually stay! Welcome Arianwen, another member of the too much fine hair club. I want i hair so I can keep the toys in instead of spat out.

Now I am unsure if I am F or M! :o

[Centaur]

Now I am unsure if I am F or M! :o

Maybe you are on the fine side of medium like me.

[goldenoak]

I have theeeee finest hair ever. Every hair dresser who has ever touched my mane has commented on it. I cut my hair short two years ago and a boyfriend was touching my hair and asked if there was something wrong w me lol.

Now that I am growing it out it "appears" thicker. I could never dream of wearing my hair in its natural state. It must be curled or manipulated in some way. Currently I am growing out the light blond I was coloring it, going natural. I am hoping between that and taking hair vitamins it will get slightly thicker.

I have also been reading through the heatless hair thread and have some motivation to try the hair pin and curl rag techniques. I wonder though if I will ever be able to grow my hair as long as some of you. :mad:

And hi, btw I'm the new kid! :D

Hi MClass! Welcome to the club! :flower:

It sounds like you're on a good track with the vitamins and the going heatless to prevent breakage. If your hair is superfine you may also want to consider something like cassia obovata as a topical treatment that boosts hair body and strength.

Best of luck in your growing! :sun:

[goldenoak]

Ebay, I found them searching butterfly combs. 5x is a brand, like Upzing or EZ Combs. I can wear the original African version but that's from the iii hair.

I just tried some EZ Combs for the first time last week, and am embarassed at how much I like them. I can't believe I actually bought something that said "as seen on TV" on the box, and that I love them so much.

I've been poking around on Etsy and Artfire trying to find people who make them and have been having no luck at all. And on ebay it looks like you can't choose what color you get...? These things are so awesome - why are they so hard to find? :confused:

[dropinthebucket]

Welcome, Mclass! :)

You'll find lots of great advice for fine hair here, not just in this thread, but on LHC in general - I've been amazed at how much thicker and fuller my fine hair looks, just by taking better, more gentle care of it, all of which I've learned in just the six short months I've been hanging here! :)

[MandyBeth]

http://cgi.ebay.com/African-Butterfly-Hair-Clip-Comb-Beada-Wire-Black-ND07-/110567573556?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0 Ok, those are the original (or originalish) African Butterfly Combs. Mine are "heavy" feeling, very sturdy and solid. This may be a thin hair model which I have some of and some of their heavier type. Both work, and take equal fussing. Too much for thin, not enough for bulky.

Ok, and durh. Me stoopid. 5x is how many were in a group. The EZ stretch are the good brand for me.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Wholesale-10-Ez-Stretch-Wooden-Double-Clip-hair-combs-/250615770342?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0 These are the knockoffs of the real African Butterfly combs as far as I know. I need the heavier combs for my hair to stay in place with if there isn't the chain stitching.

http://cgi.ebay.com/EZ-Stretchy-Bead-Double-Baby-Hair-Comb-1psc-/380262564416?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0 This baby clip is EXCELLENT in a half up for me. As I've made people cry before that my halfup is bigger than their full styles, I think for ANYONE with fine hair under an iii would do well with these. The stupid last i in my hair drives me batty!

http://cgi.ebay.com/EZ-Wooden-Stretch-Bead-Double-Magic-Hair-Clips-Combs-/110575969250?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0 These are my first choice for the metal clips. The straight weave design holds up better.

http://cgi.ebay.com/EZ-Stretch-Beaded-Double-Hair-Clips-magic-Combs-Black-/170529856953?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0 This type is usually ok if I add a pin or two for support. But I need that chain type weave.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Ez-Stretch-Beaded-Double-Clip-Hair-Combs-Free-Shipping-/250685732707?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0 This is where I can't use them to my standard, however I think they are ok with less than iii hair. Cursed hair of mine. I have a few of these and they are used ONLY as decoration. I get the twist all up and held in place, then tuck the combs in.

Most if not all of the EZ combs have some chained stitching. Which holds together better and doesn't allow the middle to slack, which leads to hair toy spitage.

The store brands...

UPZing or HairZing - the general hair toy section. I forget who makes them, but they are sold on a card. For me, half up or decoration. They don't have any major chain stitching, so that's my problem.

EZ on TV ones - *snicker* Yeah, no way, no how. Even with major support, those suckers fall out. The TWO I tried to use in a half up without support, ROTFLMAO. Sorry about that. The elastics snapped. And the combs don't stay in. *ptttuuu* says my hair as it spits those out.

I hate my hair some days.

[goldenoak]

http://cgi.ebay.com/African-Butterfly-Hair-Clip-Comb-Beada-Wire-Black-ND07-/110567573556?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0 Ok, those are the original (or originalish) African Butterfly Combs. Mine are "heavy" feeling, very sturdy and solid. This may be a thin hair model which I have some of and some of their heavier type. Both work, and take equal fussing. Too much for thin, not enough for bulky.

Ok, and durh. Me stoopid. 5x is how many were in a group. The EZ stretch are the good brand for me.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Wholesale-10-Ez-Stretch-Wooden-Double-Clip-hair-combs-/250615770342?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0 These are the knockoffs of the real African Butterfly combs as far as I know. I need the heavier combs for my hair to stay in place with if there isn't the chain stitching.

http://cgi.ebay.com/EZ-Stretchy-Bead-Double-Baby-Hair-Comb-1psc-/380262564416?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0 This baby clip is EXCELLENT in a half up for me. As I've made people cry before that my halfup is bigger than their full styles, I think for ANYONE with fine hair under an iii would do well with these. The stupid last i in my hair drives me batty!

http://cgi.ebay.com/EZ-Wooden-Stretch-Bead-Double-Magic-Hair-Clips-Combs-/110575969250?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0 These are my first choice for the metal clips. The straight weave design holds up better.

http://cgi.ebay.com/EZ-Stretch-Beaded-Double-Hair-Clips-magic-Combs-Black-/170529856953?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0 This type is usually ok if I add a pin or two for support. But I need that chain type weave.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Ez-Stretch-Beaded-Double-Clip-Hair-Combs-Free-Shipping-/250685732707?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0 This is where I can't use them to my standard, however I think they are ok with less than iii hair. Cursed hair of mine. I have a few of these and they are used ONLY as decoration. I get the twist all up and held in place, then tuck the combs in.

Most if not all of the EZ combs have some chained stitching. Which holds together better and doesn't allow the middle to slack, which leads to hair toy spitage.

The store brands...

UPZing or HairZing - the general hair toy section. I forget who makes them, but they are sold on a card. For me, half up or decoration. They don't have any major chain stitching, so that's my problem.

EZ on TV ones - *snicker* Yeah, no way, no how. Even with major support, those suckers fall out. The TWO I tried to use in a half up without support, ROTFLMAO. Sorry about that. The elastics snapped. And the combs don't stay in. *ptttuuu* says my hair as it spits those out.

I hate my hair some days.

Thank you so much for the rundown!! :cheese: Now I know how I'm going to be spending my next "play" money! (Also, FWIW, I have total envy of your third 'i'. ;))

The EZ-TV ones I picked up at BB&B aren't very sturdy, but they do stay in my hair quite well. I adore how they work, but I can tell they're cheaply made and will probably only last a few months, which is why I started looking for "real" versions. I don't regret the impulse buy of the cheesy ones, though; I'm having a lot of fun with them. :)

[MandyBeth]

Yeah got to impulse buy the cheap first! Why buy a new style expensive only to find out you hate it? 25 for great is more if it only lives in the bottom of a drawer.