Fine hair washing problem

[Chiara]

Hi all,
This has been a perennial problem for me when I grow my hair past my ears (it's now at about shoulder length). I'm hoping I can tap the great mind of LHC and get some suggestions!
I have fine, straight fair hair, and not a great deal of it. The way its distributed, the thickest growth is at the back, below my crown and around to my ears (cause I have a high forehead). The problem is that after I've washed it's like the top layer (canopy?) of my hair and the bottom layer (ie the layer that lies against my neck) is clean. But the 'sandwich', the hair below the canopy, is not getting properly cleaned for about 10 cm from the scalp. So I can see that its pretty lank and greasy in there, compared to the top and bottom.
So, any suggestions for gentle ways to get in and get that layer clean? This has always been a problem for me, with shampoo or CO washing. I do make the effort to really get into that area with my fingers, and I have also tried washing with my head upside down, but neither seemed to make much difference. Lately I've been experimenting with WO (I'm at week 8 now) and that has worked surprising well, but the lank sandwich remains... What am I doing wrong??

[lara grace]

Maybe when you're using shampoo, you first put it on the crown of your head and the underneath without realising, and then there's not enough to cleanse the "sandwich layer"? I'll be interested to hear other peoples opinions too!

[littlenvy]

Hi all,
This has been a perennial problem for me when I grow my hair past my ears (it's now at about shoulder length). I'm hoping I can tap the great mind of LHC and get some suggestions!
I have fine, straight fair hair, and not a great deal of it. The way its distributed, the thickest growth is at the back, below my crown and around to my ears (cause I have a high forehead). The problem is that after I've washed it's like the top layer (canopy?) of my hair and the bottom layer (ie the layer that lies against my neck) is clean. But the 'sandwich', the hair below the canopy, is not getting properly cleaned for about 10 cm from the scalp. So I can see that its pretty lank and greasy in there, compared to the top and bottom.
So, any suggestions for gentle ways to get in and get that layer clean? This has always been a problem for me, with shampoo or CO washing. I do make the effort to really get into that area with my fingers, and I have also tried washing with my head upside down, but neither seemed to make much difference. Lately I've been experimenting with WO (I'm at week 8 now) and that has worked surprising well, but the lank sandwich remains... What am I doing wrong??
*^5 to another F/i girl*

Funny, but I seem to have this problem too.
Its an on going problem so I don't have a solution for you :(

I seems to be MUCH worse when I try to do any oil treatment.

Last week I tried Amla poweder on my hair and it got all the oil out nicely.
Now I'm going to try CO or ACV rince on my ends and scalp only. I will let you know if that helps.
I also not oil ONLY my ends and maybe just a bit of the scalp but not the length.

Good luck! :)
Hope someone knows the solution to this.

[Chiara]

Yay! I am not alone! :)

lara grace, could be. I think I tend to put shampoo on the top sides actually. I suppose I'll need to work out whether its a washing problem (ie the cleansing agent just doesn't get in there) or a rinsing problem (or both, mama mia!). But would love to hear from people who've experienced this and found a fix.

littlenvy- oil treatments. oh yes, that's why they're conditioning on our kinda hair, they stay in FOREVER....

[lara grace]

You also might have conditioner or oil treatment build up in those areas because they're not getting reached by the shampoo and just keep building up. A clarifying shampoo ought to help. Just another thought :) Hope you find a solution soon!

[misstwist]

Have you tried putting the amount of shampoo you would use into a separate bottle then diluting it?

I find I get better penetration if I dilute the shampoo, shake it up, then use the bottle to squirt the suds into my hair.

[triumphator!]

I would say, if you're using WO (did I misread?) that you divide your hair into those three sections and wash with water / massage them independently. I would pay special attention to massaging your scalp in the "sandwich length" to get the oils to travel down the shaft.

Also, would clarifying help...?

[OperaTeacherMom]

Have you tried starting with your shampoo in that spot? Like taking your hair as if you are going to put it half up, and scrubbing the shampoo in where the part is first, then working your way around the rest of the scalp. I have to do this when I co wash to get conditioner onto that part of my scalp!

[Fractalsofhair]

Take a comb into the shower and be sure to apply shampoo to each layer.

[MissManda]

I used to have very oily hair and I solved this problem by stretching washes. My hair was a greaseball at first, but after a couple of weeks, my scalp adjusted and now I don't have any oil problems. I am aware that this might not work for everyone, but I thought it was worth suggesting.

I also do much better with no cones because they make my hair stringy and very, very flat and my hair got oily very quickly.

I definitely agree that you should also try diluting your shampoo, as it is easier to get down to your scalp.

Hope that helps. :)

[Chiara]

Hmmm.... ok, thanks everyone. Keep the suggestions coming, and I'll have to report back!

[Mariebeth]

Argh, this is my situation exactly, and I have come here for the same advice. Today I tried a clarifying shampoo and made darn sure that I reached all the greasy spots. Somehow, however, it dried and I still have greasy clumpy hair in the "sandwichy" spots that I cleaned. It is true that I haven't been washing more than once a week, however, but the oil on top seams to wash away easily enough....

[Chiara]

That's exactly what stumps me, Mariebeth, the grease on the top and bottom layers can apparently be dealt with by water. What gives with that middle bit?!?

[moominhapa]

This happens to me too sometimes. I would part your hair in that spot in the shower in order to get to it better. Just lift up the crown hair and put some extra shampoo in the middle and work it in (or do WO if that's what you want to do).

[dropinthebucket]

A superfine here (though i'm getting up to fine/medium with care!) - one thing that's worked for me is to wash my hair upside down. I switched to distilled water because it's much gentler on my fine hair, and i wash it upside down over the tub. Easy to get everything wet and washed that way. HTH

[Anje]

Have you tried putting a vinegar rinse into your water-only routine? (I suppose that makes it water and vinegar only....) When I did the WO thing, I found that if I poured dilute vinegar over my scalp, massaged it a bit, then rinsed, I'd get more greasiness out than water alone accomplished.

[suncica]

I used to have very oily hair and I solved this problem by stretching washes. My hair was a greaseball at first, but after a couple of weeks, my scalp adjusted and now I don't have any oil problems. I am aware that this might not work for everyone, but I thought it was worth suggesting.

I also do much better with no cones because they make my hair stringy and very, very flat and my hair got oily very quickly.

I definitely agree that you should also try diluting your shampoo, as it is easier to get down to your scalp.

Hope that helps. :)

I agree with MissManda on the cones comment, the same thing happens to my hair when I use shampoo or conditioner with them. Right now I'm using Live Clean Clarifying shampoo which has apple cider vinegar in it, and some conditioner which also has it, and although my hair is sorta dry while wet, it's not greasy or dry once it's dried. I used to have the same problem as you, and I'd get really itchy in the area you're talking about, but this stuff seems to be working. Maybe you could try it and see if it'll help.

[fair isle]

I often have this issue, the two things that keep that grease layer at bay for me is washing every two to three days, and doing an ACV rinse. That rinse really makes all the difference for me :)

Let us know what works I could use some more tips myself!

[lilapeck]

I had a problem with overly oily hair and tried a baking soda and water paste. I apply it, work it through and let is set for about 2 minutes before rinsing it out. It seems to work well and the shampoos with sodium lauryl sulfate and sodium laureth sulfate (two dangerous detergents also used in engine degreasers) only seem to make the oil problem worse. I have been looking for more natural things for my hair.

[Chiara]

Hi all,
Just wanting to say thanks for the suggestions.
After a bit more reading, last night I bought a bottle that you use to apply hair dye; plastic, with a screw-on lid with a long thin nozzle (others on LHC have used old plastic sauce bottles).
This morning I wet my hair in the shower, put straight conditioner on from below the ears. Then I put warm water into the bottle and topped it off with about a tablespoon of conditioner, and shook it up. I then tried to make a vertical part in my hair, but couldn’t because it had already matted up. So combed the length out very gently- that would not have been possible without the conditioner on the length. Then I was able to separate a vertical section from crown to neck, using my fingers, and, with the nozzle, applied the dilute conditioner to my scalp, down the vertical part. I probably made between 5-10 vertical sections, using about 2 bottles of diluted conditioner. Once I felt my scalp was pretty soaked with the stuff, I did a quick, gentle finger-pad scalp massage and then left it and did other shower things. Then rinsed it all off at the end of my shower. I tried to be very thorough with my rinsing.
The result is a big improvement on before. Just one greasy bit (behind one ear) that I think could be a rinsing issue. And a lot less tangling then washing my hair head down. Next time I am going to try this with my usual vinegar routine (having to use conditioner at the moment because DH broke the teapot, and my hair rinse jug is being used to brew tea!). I'm only washing twice a week at the moment, and haven't used a cone conditioner for a long time, so I think for me the issue is getting into that layer.

[misstwist]

Hooray! :D

[littlenvy]

:) Happy to hear that Chiara!!

I'm trying Catnip rinse now. LOL. We will see how that works.