PDA

View Full Version : "if you cut it, it will grow longer"



x0h_bother
May 19th, 2010, 11:37 AM
Or, like the Field of Dreams, "If you cut them, they will grow"! I heard my mom try to tell me the other day as I was driving that she heard this was a possiblity. I smiled and said nothing :).

I had been complaining to her that my hair has gotten fine, and I asked her if she developed finer hair as she got older. She said no, but my dad has fine hair (thanks dad ;)). Anyways, she suggested a trim to "thicken" up my hair, and then made the comment about it growing more.

In understanding her ignorance of all things hair, it reminded me that this was a question of my own when I began my hair journey, and I'm sure there is a thread on the concept. IMHO from my own experience and research:
1-cutting hair makes hair appear blunt which may help visually (thicker appearance, healthier appearance)
2-cutting hair cuts off split ends/damage (possibly preventing splitting up the shaft and/or future breakage, thereby allowing hair to be longer for longer and not always breaking off at the ends.)
3-hair grows from the root, and cutting hair does not stimulate the growth cycle
4-hair is dead (despite popular opinion!) and cutting it does not make it alive

Opinions? :eyebrows:

spidermom
May 19th, 2010, 11:43 AM
Same old beliefs everybody keeps repeating; where's the proof?

My hair has a root and it's growing. It's alive.

dropinthebucket
May 19th, 2010, 11:54 AM
The "terminal length" thread turned into a partial thread on just this issue.

x0h_bother
May 19th, 2010, 12:28 PM
Same old beliefs everybody keeps repeating; where's the proof?

My hair has a root and it's growing. It's alive.
The follicle is alive, the hair is not.
"But once the hair is at the skin's surface, the cells within the strand of hair aren't alive anymore. The hair you see on every part of your body contains dead cells. That's why it doesn't cause pain when someone cuts your hair with scissors!"
http://kidshealth.org/kid/htbw/hair.html

Loreley
May 19th, 2010, 12:39 PM
I think that if you do S&D regulary you won't have breakage so your hair will grow and not break down. But it can make the ends thin and that way your hair doesn't appear as long as it would with thick ends. :confused:

halo_tightens
May 19th, 2010, 12:40 PM
I think your four points are pretty much dead on. Hair is dead, though the follicle is alive. The follicle doesn't know what the ends are doing, or how far away they are, so trims have no impact on growth. Trims CAN affect the health and strength of those ends, so there is a benefit.

Basically, I think we agree. :agree:

Cailie
May 19th, 2010, 12:42 PM
We first need to make a distinction between pain and alive.

Pain is caused by the presence of nerves. A living thing or a living part of a living being can have no pain, it doesn't mean the cells are "dead".

Second, we would need to define "dead". Are the cells composing the hair shaft "active" in any way ? We know hair "reacts" to many things (water, moisture, oil, heat, cold, acidity, alkalinity, etc.). How does this happen ?


Honestly, I have no idea if I think hair is alive or not (from my definition of...) but I don't believe in the "no pain no life" argument... Remember everyone use to think that animals did not feel pain and where just mere mechanics (thanks Descartes...). Anyways, it feels more alive to me than the end of nails. Nails don't react much to anything... they just seem to get dirty. :D Who knows what they'll say in 50 years from now about the biology of hair.

On the cellular level, did we find any activity within hair cells ? Nothing at all ? How does the cuticle open and close (cellular level, still) ?

MsBubbles
May 19th, 2010, 12:48 PM
Interesting point, Cailie! Also, are we really even sure the follicle is incapable of reacting to hair weight, or how it falls?

Uinda
May 19th, 2010, 12:48 PM
that's what my mum told me when she let the hairdresser cut my hair into a pixie :(

Cailie
May 19th, 2010, 12:50 PM
we really even sure the follicle is incapable of reacting to hair weight, or how it falls?

True too !

I think it's a shame most research done on hair is by the cosmetic industry... it's such a huge focus of humans, for such a long time, but still so mysterious !!


Well, I do like the mysteries of hair too, makes it even more special :)

fishwich
May 19th, 2010, 01:03 PM
On the cellular level, did we find any activity within hair cells ? Nothing at all ? How does the cuticle open and close (cellular level, still) ?

Hair cells, once grown, have no cellular activity and react to their environment only in mechanical terms (i.e. friction, static, humidity). I dislike using the word "dead" for hair, because it's got all sort of un-fun connotations that don't really apply: hair cells are best described as inert. What you see is inert protein.

The cuticle opens and closes in response to things that cause protein to expand (moisture), contract (dehydration), or to soften (moisture, again, and various hair-processing chemicals).

teela1978
May 19th, 2010, 01:11 PM
I think the power of cutting off of splits/damage is underestimated. If your ends are breaking off as fast as your hair is growing you'll have no apparent growth at all (your hair won't get longer even though the follicle is producing more hair). My ends feel a lot better after a small trim... and tangle less. So it seems plausible to me that a trim will help reduce breakage from the ends and allow for better/faster apparent growth.

Occasional small trims can do wonders.

On the other hand if you start going in for 1/2 inch trims once a month you probably won't get anywhere unless you have an extremely fast growth rate :)

UltraBella
May 19th, 2010, 01:15 PM
The biology of hair is something that has been so explored, I don't think there is anything left to discover. Much research has been done in my particular field, I am a Licensed Electrologist.
The derma papilla of the hair is the only portion that would fall under the category of being "alive". It has blood flow, living cells and chemical responses, produces a hair, and then when the time is right, it shrinks up, detaches and sheds. We call it the life cycle of the hair for that reason.
The actual hair length is not alive. It has no blood supply, no living cells. Cutting it does not stimulate growth in the scalp or have any effect on your rate of growth.
Unfortunately for someone in my job field, there is no mystery left. I remember when I was little being so in awe of hair, like it was a whole different creature living on someone's head :) I kind of miss that sometimes.

Das Siechtum
May 19th, 2010, 01:20 PM
I was reading these question...and I could answer them myself rather easily:

1. "defining 'something being alive': The best definition (and most fitting) I can come up with is: "What replicates - lives." You could say: "What eats/drinks/breathes - lives" but some lifeforms dont eat or drink ir even breath. viruses do nothing of the three. But virus are alive. They reproduce. In my knowledge, viruses are the most primitve lifeforms on earth (regarding the definition).

2. not everything which looks dead is dead. Take the skin for example: the outer layer is just dead skincells. But the skin is a living organ of the human body (the largest infact). The same goes for the hair. The hair itself is dead. But the hairfollicle is not.

3. living beings and pain: I think its prooved that life started without pain. Just as the evolution progressed, living being developed simple nervous systems (just compare the nervous system of a worm, a snail and the homo sapiens sapiens) which got more and more complex. So pain became a factor for surviving. Not every lifeform needs a nervous system, and some nervous system aren't for feeling pain at all (they are for transmitting optical signals...ect). So pain is just a part of what the nervous system is capapble of.

4. I doubt, that hair follicles notice how hair falls (just strong forces like pulling). How the hair falls depends on the hairstructure, the strength of the gravity (earth>moon) and enviromental changes (wind, rain, ect.)

Sorry for the long read. I just felt the need to explain some things.

PS: I got some sleep deprivation, so bare my weak english. :-)

FrannyG
May 19th, 2010, 01:21 PM
I agree with all of your points. With my hair type, my hair looks significantly better and thicker with regular small trims than it did the first time around when I grew it without any trims. It is much thicker at the ends, and much neater, which as a 1a is important to me. That is where points 1 and 2 come in.

There is another point that I think it important:

5. All hairs do not grow at the same rate.

Having 1a hair makes this really easy for me to observe. It doesn't show up immediately, but even a few months down the line, there is a big gap between the fastest growing hairs and the slowest. It is another thing that makes the hair look thinner and uneven at the ends without trims.

This is another reason why I trim regularly. It may mean not getting to my goal length as quickly, but I'm much happier with the thicker ends that I have due to trimming and of course other good LHC hair care.

Das Siechtum
May 19th, 2010, 01:23 PM
Ultrabella: thanks for that great posting. I enjoyed the detail very much. :-)

UltraBella
May 19th, 2010, 01:32 PM
I fully support regular trimming, split ends are just so unappealing to me, but it's funny some if the "old wives tales" that people still believe. Many older women will tell you to cut your hair to make it grow. They will also tell you not to shave your legs because that makes it grow in dark, thick and coarse. All of these have been disproven years ago, but the difference in the generations when it comes to hair is very interesting to me and I love hearing them.

teela1978
May 19th, 2010, 02:28 PM
1. "defining 'something being alive': The best definition (and most fitting) I can come up with is: "What replicates - lives." You could say: "What eats/drinks/breathes - lives" but some lifeforms dont eat or drink ir even breath. viruses do nothing of the three. But virus are alive. They reproduce. In my knowledge, viruses are the most primitve lifeforms on earth (regarding the definition).


Actually, viruses are generally not considered to be alive... because they cannot replicate on their own, they require a separate living cell and use the host cell's own proteins and enzymes to replicate.

In regards to hair being alive/dead, I think we can say that hair is dead. The cells that were used to make it have filled with protein, dried out, are no longer using any energy, and have no capability to replicate. There is no DNA left, no normal cellular particulate, pretty much just keratin. Opening and closing of the scales on hairs is from basic protein interaction with the environment. In an acidic environment, the protein is in a lower energy state when collapsed towards itself. In a basic/alkaline environment, the opposite is true. Same with heat effects. Materials having different properties/conformations in different environments is a pretty common thing.

cm006j
May 19th, 2010, 02:36 PM
Pain is caused by the presence of nerves. A living thing or a living part of a living being can have no pain, it doesn't mean the cells are "dead".

This is way off topic, but you make a great point. I feel the need to mention that it is possible for nerves to stop functioning in human beings. There are people who cannot feel pain but are still alive.

I don't think hair is alive, but the arguments for why are not always accurate.

Cailie
May 19th, 2010, 02:38 PM
All of this is very interesting !

cm006j
May 19th, 2010, 02:39 PM
Oh, and my best friend's mom said this "If you cut it, it will grow longer" thing to me recently. It makes me mad, but I don't really know what to say to it. This thread is helpful for having a reply to that!

zenobia
May 19th, 2010, 02:40 PM
I fully support regular trimming, split ends are just so unappealing to me, but it's funny some if the "old wives tales" that people still believe. Many older women will tell you to cut your hair to make it grow. They will also tell you not to shave your legs because that makes it grow in dark, thick and coarse. All of these have been disproven years ago, but the difference in the generations when it comes to hair is very interesting to me and I love hearing them.

I've heard the same old wive's tale about shaving your legs too. A friend once told me that she didn't shave her underarms because her mom told her the hair would grow back thicker.

Cailie
May 19th, 2010, 02:52 PM
I've heard the same old wive's tale about shaving your legs too. A friend once told me that she didn't shave her underarms because her mom told her the hair would grow back thicker.


What about facial hair ? lets say I shaved my face or arm duvet, it wouldn't grow any different ? (sorry, I've always been curious about this...)

naereid
May 19th, 2010, 03:40 PM
What about facial hair ? lets say I shaved my face or arm duvet, it wouldn't grow any different ? (sorry, I've always been curious about this...)
The majority of the people I've spoken to about shaving believe that tale. It's bizzare. Mostly it pertains to women's legs, but once I saw one man say to another that his (the other guy's) razor must have slipped too far up one fateful day, and that's the reason why he has hair growing further up towards his cheekbone. :rolleyes:

Stormcast
May 19th, 2010, 05:00 PM
I have heard the "if you cut it, it will grow faster" and I am ashamed to say i actually believed it and got a chop...but that was quite some time ago.

proo
May 19th, 2010, 06:08 PM
everything is always seeking organic balance
for me that means hair around my face likes to be shorter and hair at the back is balanced at a much longer length
it splits when it wants to be trimmed

ArienEllariel
May 19th, 2010, 06:19 PM
My best friend said the same thing to me not too long ago. I politely nodded but inwardly I thought the idea was rediculous. :/

UltraBella
May 19th, 2010, 07:14 PM
What about facial hair ? lets say I shaved my face or arm duvet, it wouldn't grow any different ? (sorry, I've always been curious about this...)

Facial hair, now that is where it gets interesting !!! Shaving hair anywhere on your body, including your face, does nothing to stimulate hair growth. Hair can seem different, when you cut off the naturally tapered end of a hair and make it blunt it will feel stiff in comparison. Women worry that if they shave their mustache, chin hair, etc.... they will get coarse dark hairs. Not possible.
But here's the issue : many women wax or tweeze their facial hair. That's okay on the brows ( unless you over pluck and sometimes they dont come back ! ) but on hormonally driven areas that are effected by testosterone - upper lip, chin, even chest - waxing and tweezing can become a nightmare. Any time you rip a hair from it's follicle, blood rushes to the area. Blood supply is what nourishes the derma papilla of a hair to grow. So you are encouraging a stronger, healthier hair to return in place of the one you just removed. Also, the blood effects surrounding tissue as well so it can stimulate nearby follicles to grow hairs too. Many women start out tweezing just a few hairs and as time goes by they have more and more...... Waxing removes all the hairs, not just the ones bothering you but all the little fine lanugo hairs as well. Stimulate their growth and you have the makings of a beard for some unfortunate women.
Sorry for the rant !!

x0h_bother
May 19th, 2010, 07:31 PM
We first need to make a distinction between pain and alive.

Pain is caused by the presence of nerves. A living thing or a living part of a living being can have no pain, it doesn't mean the cells are "dead".

Second, we would need to define "dead". Are the cells composing the hair shaft "active" in any way ? We know hair "reacts" to many things (water, moisture, oil, heat, cold, acidity, alkalinity, etc.). How does this happen ?


Honestly, I have no idea if I think hair is alive or not (from my definition of...) but I don't believe in the "no pain no life" argument... Remember everyone use to think that animals did not feel pain and where just mere mechanics (thanks Descartes...). Anyways, it feels more alive to me than the end of nails. Nails don't react much to anything... they just seem to get dirty. :D Who knows what they'll say in 50 years from now about the biology of hair.

On the cellular level, did we find any activity within hair cells ? Nothing at all ? How does the cuticle open and close (cellular level, still) ?
The article wasn't really making that argument about pain itself, they were talking about the composition of the hair follicle that makes it alive. For example, can you tell the difference between a dead skin cell and a live one? They were distinguishing the properties of something living from the body and something shed. I hope this helps :)

x0h_bother
May 19th, 2010, 07:33 PM
it splits when it wants to be trimmed
I hear you here, proo. ;)

x0h_bother
May 19th, 2010, 07:35 PM
Facial hair, now that is where it gets interesting !!! Shaving hair anywhere on your body, including your face, does nothing to stimulate hair growth. Hair can seem different, when you cut off the naturally tapered end of a hair and make it blunt it will feel stiff in comparison. Women worry that if they shave their mustache, chin hair, etc.... they will get coarse dark hairs. Not possible.
But here's the issue : many women wax or tweeze their facial hair. That's okay on the brows ( unless you over pluck and sometimes they dont come back ! ) but on hormonally driven areas that are effected by testosterone - upper lip, chin, even chest - waxing and tweezing can become a nightmare. Any time you rip a hair from it's follicle, blood rushes to the area. Blood supply is what nourishes the derma papilla of a hair to grow. So you are encouraging a stronger, healthier hair to return in place of the one you just removed. Also, the blood effects surrounding tissue as well so it can stimulate nearby follicles to grow hairs too. Many women start out tweezing just a few hairs and as time goes by they have more and more...... Waxing removes all the hairs, not just the ones bothering you but all the little fine lanugo hairs as well. Stimulate their growth and you have the makings of a beard for some unfortunate women.
Sorry for the rant !!
Right, factors other than merely cutting promote growth :)

Sorry for the seperate comments in this thread, I forgot to do the multiquote thing.

Yozhik
May 19th, 2010, 07:45 PM
Very interesting! I had no idea that plucking the upper lip stimulates hair growth! Eek -- I'll try not to do that anymore!

I was recently told by my friend with gorgeous long curly hair to cut it if I wanted it to grow longer :( I thanked her for her advice, but inwardly I was horrified by the idea of chopping to "gain length."

Athena's Owl
May 19th, 2010, 09:47 PM
The follicle is alive, the hair is not.
"But once the hair is at the skin's surface, the cells within the strand of hair aren't alive anymore. The hair you see on every part of your body contains dead cells. That's why it doesn't cause pain when someone cuts your hair with scissors!"
http://kidshealth.org/kid/htbw/hair.html

...I thought it was because hairs don't have nerves.

Cailie
May 19th, 2010, 09:48 PM
Facial hair, now that is where it gets interesting !!! Shaving hair anywhere on your body, including your face, does nothing to stimulate hair growth. Hair can seem different, when you cut off the naturally tapered end of a hair and make it blunt it will feel stiff in comparison. Women worry that if they shave their mustache, chin hair, etc.... they will get coarse dark hairs. Not possible.
But here's the issue : many women wax or tweeze their facial hair. That's okay on the brows ( unless you over pluck and sometimes they dont come back ! ) but on hormonally driven areas that are effected by testosterone - upper lip, chin, even chest - waxing and tweezing can become a nightmare. Any time you rip a hair from it's follicle, blood rushes to the area. Blood supply is what nourishes the derma papilla of a hair to grow. So you are encouraging a stronger, healthier hair to return in place of the one you just removed. Also, the blood effects surrounding tissue as well so it can stimulate nearby follicles to grow hairs too. Many women start out tweezing just a few hairs and as time goes by they have more and more...... Waxing removes all the hairs, not just the ones bothering you but all the little fine lanugo hairs as well. Stimulate their growth and you have the makings of a beard for some unfortunate women.
Sorry for the rant !!

this is so interesting !

hmmm, what is the best to get rid of those evil hair that shouldn't be tweezed ? Laser ?

Tweeze but apply ice long enough to reduce the blood flow to the area ?

sorry, I'm a little of topic :oops:

UltraBella
May 19th, 2010, 10:25 PM
No ice, it won't work. The surface coldness will not go deep enough into the skin layer.
Laser is still in it's infancy and is not yet approved for permanent hair removal, it IS approved for permanent hair reduction, which can be misleading.
The only method of permanent hair removal that is currently recognized by the FDA and The American Medical Association is Electrolysis. It requires a series of treatments tailored to your specific skin and hair type. I have had my entire chin and lip treated, about 16 years ago. I am now a Licensed Electrologist.
Trimming is an exceptable option, whether you use a razor, personal trimmer, cuticle scissors, etc. And depilatories are an option, but they can be harsh on the skin so they are not recommended for long term use.
I believe that someday we will have a quick fix for unwanted hair :)

JaclynBailey
May 19th, 2010, 11:13 PM
I was told to cut my daughters hair to make it grow faster. Her hair had barely grown since birth, which I found strange since both her fathers hair and mine grow very quickly. I was about to give up and cut it like people were telling me to. Then I was sent to this site and we decided to try vitamins instead. Her hair has grown almost 2 inches! When you are a small three year old that is HUGE! She went from just barely shoulder to BSL!

lelaelena
May 19th, 2010, 11:30 PM
Wow, love this thread. A lot of you ladies make excellent points.

x0h_bother
May 20th, 2010, 10:42 AM
...I thought it was because hairs don't have nerves.
You're very right, I guess that part is meant for children and is oversimplistic? But a valid point.

zenobia
May 20th, 2010, 11:01 AM
I think the most important point to this discussion is that there is no signalling mechanism available to the hair follicle to enable it to "sense" that the end of the hair has been cut. The hair strand is made of dead materials (keratin, etc.) and does not have the ability to send any kind of signal or message to the follicle.

When a hair is plucked, tweezed, or waxed, the hair follicle does indeed "know" that something has changed because the hair is no longer present.

jane53
May 20th, 2010, 12:01 PM
Well, my hair started looking longer when I started trimming it. I let it get long with thin ends. Then I blunt cut it and let it grow, keeping the blunt cut trimmed. The blunt cut long hair looks longer than the thin ends long hair.

But someone has already said that in this thread!

Capybara
May 20th, 2010, 02:12 PM
I personally don't see any difference in growth rate of my length whether I am trimming regularly or not. However, I will admit that my bangs seem to grow much more quickly than my length, and they do get trimmed regularly all the time.

If we were looking at whether or not hair is alive of dead from a scientific point of view, we may consider the characteristics of living things:

1. Respiration
2. Movement
3. Excretion
4. Reproduction
5. Growth
6. Reaction to stimulus
7. Comprised of cells

And a bit of a tangent ...

It is said that if an organism does not have all of these characteristics, it is considered to not living. However, this definition becomes fuzzy when you talk about viruses - they do not have all the characteristics of living things, but are they alive? The link below explores whether or not viruses are alive, if anyone is interested :flower: http://serc.carleton.edu/microbelife/yellowstone/viruslive.html

Sorry about that hijack! *hides*

x0h_bother
May 20th, 2010, 07:58 PM
Dr. Oz says, "If you look at the surface of the hair that's above the skin its actually dead". Here is the video, he talks a bit about the follicle as it relates to hair loss.
http://www.oprah.com/health/Dr-Oz-on-How-to-Prevent-Hair-Loss-Video

julliams
May 20th, 2010, 08:24 PM
I think this statement of "cutting your hair makes it grow longer" is actually a big picture thing. I do not agree with it as a literal statement because I don't think what happens at the bottom has anything to do with the top.

Growing hair makes it grow longer - not cutting it, and I agree that hairs grow at different rates because my hair seems to grow in a V shape with the sides taking forever and not seeming to be catching up.

In regards to the big picture, if you do trims every so often, your hair will be healthy right to the tip, rather than needing 3 inches trimmed off because it's so split etc. I see some people with long hair that I think could use a trim because in my opinion, it looks beautiful up to a point and then you can see damaged ends which I think spoils the overall look. This of course is only my opinion and I respect "each to their own".

I think that if I took my hairdresser's advice and got a trim every 6 weeks, my hair would continue to grow of course as normal, but my overall length would maintain rather than actually get any longer. It would look great, the hemline would be thick and blunt but I can't see how I would gain any length worth mentioning.

My own plan is to so a small trim every 6 months. I'm hoping this will keep splits at bay and give me plenty of length between each trim.

Once I get to goal length (waist for me), maintaining will be another thing and I think I will use Feye's method every so often and just go to a hairdresser if I feel I need to.

julliams
May 20th, 2010, 08:33 PM
Facial hair, now that is where it gets interesting !!! Shaving hair anywhere on your body, including your face, does nothing to stimulate hair growth. Hair can seem different, when you cut off the naturally tapered end of a hair and make it blunt it will feel stiff in comparison. Women worry that if they shave their mustache, chin hair, etc.... they will get coarse dark hairs. Not possible.
But here's the issue : many women wax or tweeze their facial hair. That's okay on the brows ( unless you over pluck and sometimes they dont come back ! ) but on hormonally driven areas that are effected by testosterone - upper lip, chin, even chest - waxing and tweezing can become a nightmare. Any time you rip a hair from it's follicle, blood rushes to the area. Blood supply is what nourishes the derma papilla of a hair to grow. So you are encouraging a stronger, healthier hair to return in place of the one you just removed. Also, the blood effects surrounding tissue as well so it can stimulate nearby follicles to grow hairs too. Many women start out tweezing just a few hairs and as time goes by they have more and more...... Waxing removes all the hairs, not just the ones bothering you but all the little fine lanugo hairs as well. Stimulate their growth and you have the makings of a beard for some unfortunate women.
Sorry for the rant !!

I've been waxing my upper lip for years and I find that when I let it "grow in" it doesn't look anywhere near as full as before I waxed in the first place. Being a teacher I often had children tell me I had a moustache which I found very embarassing and upsetting. The comments started when I was 12 and when I was around 30 I'd had enough and started waxing. I'm blonde and my upper lip hair seemed to catch the light and really stand out.

Now it's blonde chin hairs. If I left them, I would find it super embarrassing so I pluck them out or even epilate them. There is no way my epilator catches the finer hairs they are still there. Even waxing always leaves me with a fine layer of hairs that are always there. I think I must have a double coat or something.

I love the fact that my head hair is so nice, but I hate all the other hair that I really want banished. It would cost me a fortune if I lasered and I'm not convinced that it is permanent anyway.

UltraBella
May 20th, 2010, 09:15 PM
You are right, laser is not considered to be permanent hair removal by the FDA and the American Medical Association.. But electrolysis is.

lelaelena
May 20th, 2010, 10:33 PM
I second Ultrabella's comment. I got laser removal and my hair grew in, but it did take a few years. I am seriously considering electrolysis now.

As for trimming, for those of us who have truly severe damage it makes a huge difference. I think those with less coarse, damaged hair, trimming may not be as important. As for how often, it's incredibly important how quickly your hair grows, if you trim more often than you get new growth it's futile.

julliams
May 21st, 2010, 12:36 AM
Just be careful with who is doing your Electrolysis. When I was in my late teens I had some done that left me with sores that turned into scarring and the hair just grew back. I had treatment after treatment for about 2 years but in the end I had to stop because it was just costing me too much and I wasn't seeing any improvement. I never considered that it might be the person rather than the treatment itself and I never considered going anywhere else - I wasn't assertive enough as a consumer when I was younger. I'm sure things have changed in 20 years though, but just make sure your techincian (is that the right word) is fully trained and has had good success.

UltraBella
May 21st, 2010, 01:21 AM
As a Licensed Electrologist, I have found a huge difference in skill between different providers, different machines, and different state regulations. Some states, like mine, have strict schooling requirements, state board exams, and continuing education. Other states require next to nothing, therefor you have poorly trained, inexperienced technicians. Never be afraid to ask about their extent of training, and you can even ask for references. A good technician will have a plethora of satisfied clients for you to talk to. I had all my upper lip and chin hair removed so long ago, but I remember it taking me 12 treatments in all to finish. I started with my lip first and then decided to add the chin. I have been hair free ever since and was so thrilled with the results I became an electrologist five years ago :) Your treatments are only as good as your technician, so chose wisely.

FrannyG
May 21st, 2010, 05:36 AM
I think this statement of "cutting your hair makes it grow longer" is actually a big picture thing. I do not agree with it as a literal statement because I don't think what happens at the bottom has anything to do with the top.


I completely agree with everything you've said. I didn't quote your whole post just to save space.

If I didn't have my little trims every 3 to 4 months, my ends would be thin and scraggly after just a year. I have a very rapid growth rate and not trimming is what held me back for so many years, because by the time I'd grow from just above APL to BSL without a trim, I would look in horror at the bottom few inches and chop.

Now I can still grow a good 6 inches a year even with 3 or 4 trims, and I have ends that I can live with.

It's like the old saying, "A stitch in time saves nine". That is so true for me.

julliams
May 21st, 2010, 06:29 AM
UltraBella - if you worked here in Sydney, Australia I'd most definitely set up an appointment with you. :)

Cailie
May 21st, 2010, 04:11 PM
In regards to hair being alive/dead, I think we can say that hair is dead. The cells that were used to make it have filled with protein, dried out, are no longer using any energy, and have no capability to replicate. There is no DNA left, no normal cellular particulate, pretty much just keratin.

Visibly, there is DNA in hair though

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=90960697

May
May 21st, 2010, 04:12 PM
Hair cells, once grown, have no cellular activity and react to their environment only in mechanical terms (i.e. friction, static, humidity). I dislike using the word "dead" for hair, because it's got all sort of un-fun connotations that don't really apply: hair cells are best described as inert. What you see is inert protein.

The cuticle opens and closes in response to things that cause protein to expand (moisture), contract (dehydration), or to soften (moisture, again, and various hair-processing chemicals).

I think you hit the nail on the head fishwich. I love your succinct explanation :)

teela1978
May 21st, 2010, 11:24 PM
Visibly, there is DNA in hair though

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=90960697

Not in the length. There is DNA at the root of the hair, so in collecting shed hairs you can often find one with a root bulb (collection of cells) attached. The material that makes up what we generally refer to as "hair" does not have any DNA. It would be practically impossible for example to identify a person from their hair trimmings at a salon (unless there was a shed hair or 2 with a root bulb present), but it would be possible to identify a person from hair that was yanked out of their head.

UltraBella
May 21st, 2010, 11:40 PM
True, only DNA in the derma papilla, not in the length. That would be the same as extracting DNA from someone's toenail clipping.......

teela1978
May 22nd, 2010, 01:00 AM
True, only DNA in the derma papilla, not in the length. That would be the same as extracting DNA from someone's toenail clipping.......
I think its an easy thing to misunderstand. DNA is often collected from hair in the media. Several jobs ago I worked for an organization that was genotyping endangered species from shed hairs, something they often liked to brag about to the news and such. No one ever specifies in news blurbs that it only comes from the root.

Toenail clippings... I think you might actually be more likely to get a bit of shed skin (which often still has some DNA left) in those, and possibly a match :)