Help! My hair doesn't want to stay up!

[rags]

I've been wearing my hair up for all but about 10 -15 days the last year, since it was just below shoulder (it's now only about 1-2 inches short of BSL). Being a i, I could do several styles at a shorter length (one advantage of thinner hair!)

Up until the last 6 weeks or so, I could do: an orchid bun, 10second bun, pencil bun, modified Natulius (wrapped around only a couple of fingers), cinnamon bun, lazy wrap, and French, Dutch and English braids. I'm sure there's another bun or two I'm forgetting, but hopefully you get the idea.

Now my hair slithers out of almost anything I put it in! I can't do any kind of braid unless I either heavily oil my hair (not the best idea for a baby finey as it can't absorb it all) or it's been waaaay too long between washings. About the only thing I can do is a cinnamon bun skewered with a three prong fork or a Ficcare, and a lazy wrap the same way.

My hair spits out pins, laughs at sticks (they won't even hold long enough for my hands to get back to my sides!) and slithers out of braids immediately.

I haven't changed any part of my routine. I am cone-free usually (once in a blue moon I'll use a bit of serum on the very ends as they get tangly). If I were to use cones, ha! From previous experience, even the fork and Ficcare wouldn't hold it then!

No trims, same shampoo and conditioner (Biolage and Biolage conditioning balm, well Sally's version of it). I also use some Suave for the first C in CWC and occasionally for a CO.

Anyone have any ideas? I'm at my wit's end with this. There's only so many "stuff it in a snood or bandana" days I'm willing to do! Help!

[manderly]

Sounds like you've got some super silky hair!

Have you thought of trying shampoo bars? One of the benefits for finer hair is it gives a little more texture to your hair and makes updos a little easier :)

[rags]

Thanks, Manderly! I actually have horribly hard water, and poo bars won't work in it. I even braved the CV bars (had to let them sit out for weeks before I could breathe near them - asthma) and they left a waxy buildup even with an ACV rinse. So between the asthma and the water, they're a no go.

What I don't understand is why it was fine in the winter but the moment the weather turns nice it refuses to cooperate!!

[SpinDance]

Does it help to do a higher or lower bun? After my trim in April I've had to change some of my bunning techniques so they will stay in. And I'm still sometimes getting some slippage. Today I'm trying a half-up with an extra small Flexi then taking all of the hair, both from the half-up and the rest, and making a Nautilus bun with a similar, large or medium Flexi, don't remember which size this one is. It seems to be holding securely.

I've been noticing that about every 1/2 inch things stop working, then as it grows past that slipping point they start to work again.

[manderly]

Maybe it has something to do with a change in length?

I'm having an absolutely miserable time with cinnabuns right now because my hair has grown long enough to end on the left side of my head, as opposed to the right side. I had NO problems when it ends on the right. :roll: Stupid change in lengths, always messing me up!

[Pixna]

I also think it might be due to a change in length, Rags. I have a similar problem, except my hair seems to have memory issues almost from day to day. It seems that even a fraction of an inch of growth can make a big difference. One day a certain bun works beautifully, and the next I can't do it at all, even after twenty or so tries.

Perhaps you could try a different bun (one you haven't done yet) and switch around hair toys to those that will hold almost by themselves. If nothing else works, maybe a barrette of some sort will do the trick. Then, perhaps in a few days, everything will return to "normal."

I have found no explanation for my hair's amnesia and/or uncooperativeness. It just seems to get in a snit every now and then and nothing I do can pacify it. Perhaps yours is equally temperamental and only time will soothe it. :shrug:

[rags]

Thanks all!

Spindance - No, higher or lower makes no difference at all.

Manderly and Pixna - Thank you. Perhaps it is the change in length that is messing up the buns. :hmm: I may just be stuck with a lazy wrap for a bit. However, the main problem seems to be that it is just too "slippy" right now. It's always been very, very slippery and I have to anchor it firmly, but this is ridiculous!

This is why I never wore my hair up when I had it long before the Great Chop. After a certain length it just becomes impossible. I really don't know what to do about it! I've tried no conditioner or only Suave but then it tangles so badly that it isn't worth it.

Perhaps I should invest in some four prong forks? :p Stabbing it quite firmly with multiple prongs seems to be the only thing which will make it behave!

[Pixna]

Four prongs are great, Rags. When I feel as though nothing will hold my hair up, a four-pronged fork always does the trick. Maybe you could invest in one or two and then just rely on those until your hair is ready to cooperate.

[spidermom]

I think it's probably a change in length as well.

[Purdy Bear]

Have you thought about using those thin scarves, so you infact tie the scarf up instead of the hair., I pressume that ribbon and lace could be used in the same fashion.

[rags]

I think it's probably a change in length as well.

That seems to be the verdict. I suppose I'll have to tough it out until it decides to behave again!


Have you thought about using those thin scarves, so you infact tie the scarf up instead of the hair., I pressume that ribbon and lace could be used in the same fashion.

I am in fact sometimes tying a scarf over top of whatever bun I have managed to get to halfway stay. But DH isn't fond of the look, and I don't like it for every single day either. I've never had a lot of luck with ribbons, as they just tend to slip right out.

[Tresses]

Add another vote for length. But your products caught my eye, as well. The Biolage Conditioning Balm (Sally's) in particular. This is the stuff that gave Hypnotica teflon hair (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=44165). When I used it in an SMT I couldn't keep my hair up the next day to save my life. Maybe it's the conditioner, and you need to clarify?

[Kristina713]

Others may not agree but I have 2 words for you: styling products. I have lots of what I call "baby hair" on the top and sides of my head -- thin, soft, slippery, and ungrowable. I also have layers that I am growing out. It I want my hair to look tidy and stay in an updo, without it being really greasy, I need styling products. You can get alcohol free products with conditioning ingredients. I use a little light mousse and/or a little flexible/low hold hairspray. It doesn't seem to do my hair any harm and it makes it so much more manageable. I'm not a purist and I figure, even if these styling products are not the best for my hair, they make it so that I can better enjoy having long hair. And isn't that the point?

[rags]

Add another vote for length. But your products caught my eye, as well. The Biolage Conditioning Balm (Sally's) in particular. This is the stuff that gave Hypnotica teflon hair (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=44165). When I used it in an SMT I couldn't keep my hair up the next day to save my life. Maybe it's the conditioner, and you need to clarify?

Yes, I remember that thread now! :hmm: I did clarify about two weeks ago, but I then moisturized with an SMT using (wait for it) Biolage! :doh: Maybe I'll skip it for a day or so.....


Others may not agree but I have 2 words for you: styling products. I have lots of what I call "baby hair" on the top and sides of my head -- thin, soft, slippery, and ungrowable. I also have layers that I am growing out. It I want my hair to look tidy and stay in an updo, without it being really greasy, I need styling products. You can get alcohol free products with conditioning ingredients. I use a little light mousse and/or a little flexible/low hold hairspray. It doesn't seem to do my hair any harm and it makes it so much more manageable. I'm not a purist and I figure, even if these styling products are not the best for my hair, they make it so that I can better enjoy having long hair. And isn't that the point?

I do agree that is the point. If it comes to it, I may very well try a little mousse. I'm hoping that the others are right and it is the length! So I think I'll wait and see if it is any better in a month or so.....

[Lady Mary]

I have super slippery hair as well. I use a bit of oil on the length or some aloe vera gel, it helps keep it all in place.

[goodenough]

I second the styling products. I lightly mist my hair with aussie hairspray and brush it out before putting it up. I used to be able to put it up easily, but now the texture has changed, and the nape and temples and fine and the crown is wiry. Crazy hair:) The little bit of spray doesn't seem to dry my hair out or anything.

[Ksenia]

I have super-slippery hair too. Always have, always will. The only way to avoid it is to either leave it until it's so dirty it looks gross (and then it doesn't lie flat anyway, just looks like a mess, and my scalp is screaming for a wash), or put it up when still damp from washing it. Even just spritzing it with water isn't enough, and styling products create tangles in my superfine hair.

Putting my hair up damp holds most hairdos, but certain ones like buns that are held with only one stick and don't involve a lot of twisting of the hair often need a few extra bobby pins hidden somewhere within them. Other than that, I found some great big hair clips that are big enough to hold everything and also shaped in a way that prevents the hair from falling down, like it does with most clips, and that's what I usually wear on no-wash days, unless I do messy braids or something.

[MsBubbles]

I don't have any constructive tips for this thread but wanted to jump in and say that I SMT'd last night, and now my hair is slipping around and out of updos like one of those old joke snakes that jumps out of a can.

I'm not complaining though. I'd rather have this hair than my not-so-good sticky & crunchy hair that did stay in updos. :D

[jane53]

My hair falls out of updos. It's not a length thing with me. Mine is hip length. It's just slippery, slippery hair. So I can't do all the wonderful loose buns I see on this forum. I can only do a very tightly wound bun. Wish I could do looser styles!

[Gulbahar]

When my hair is like that (happens often enough) I like doing a beer rinse. I mix one part beer and one part water and use it as the last rinse after washing. Gives me a nice grip and great shine. It doesn't smell after it's dried.
I prefer this over mousse or other commercial stuff because with the rinse I really cover ALL the hair which I find a bit difficult using mousse or spray.

[GRU]

Humidity (summer) causes straight hair to get limper and curly hair to get curlier.

My coworker and I joke about it -- she gets flatter and flatter, and I get bigger and bigger!

Would a cassia treatment "beef up" the hair enough to make a difference? Being an almost-iii, almost-coarse, 3b/c curly myself, I have absolutely NO experience with "slippery" or "thin" hair, so I'm sorry I can't offer any specific advice! The only thing I could think of was the cassia, but I'm not sure how that would affect your hair.

[eezepeeze]

I went through the same thing as I got just past BSL. All of a sudden, my hair was crawling out of buns and braids. I would braid it (dutch) but then it would sag at the nape of my neck. I think my hair has gotten heavier and thicker since I am treating it better and it's longer. So, now when I I do braids, I have to use much larger sections of hair. Those little sections just won't stay in anymore.

I got this nifty thing at CVS by Goody. It's a french twist pin. It is metal and looks like a giant bobby pin. It comes with directions for a few different hairdos. It holds my hair in a lazy bun easily. And it works for half-up styles, too. I also want to try the twist pin that Goody just came out iwth. I'm interested to see if it'll hold my hair. My hair is a different texture than yours, though. Mine is very coarse and curly. It sticks to itself. It's not slippery at all. It crawls. On humid days I can feel the individual hairs springing out around my head like I put my finger in a light socket.

Good luck! I'm sure you'll be thorugh this awkward stage soon. :-)

[Jessica Trapp]

What about those little claw clips? Do those slide out as well?

Just tossing out ideas.
jes