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View Full Version : SO tired of looking for a frizzy/tangly hair cure



violeteyes
April 20th, 2010, 07:17 PM
I've posted several times about my frizzy/ dry/ tangly hair. I've tried smt, oils, coney conditioners, no cone conditioners, leave in sprays/gels/creams/serums, rinsing with cold water, combing when dry,combing when wet, deep treatments, and pretty much everything in between since I turned twelve years old. I used to straighten every single day, until I fried my hair and had to cut six whole inches off. Now, I've been heat free for the most part and my hair still looks awful. Split ends everywhere, constant tangles, and the frizz and flyaways, and oily scalp. Its really hard to hear from people and my friends, 'your hair always looks so frizzy, its just everywhere', especially when I thought the same thing the second my hair had begun to air dry. I feel really self-concious, because I know my hair would look amazing if I straightened it, but I know that this causes damage in the long run. I used to get compliments all the time, now people just tell me how messy it looks. Why can't I have natural hair that looks good? I am really down lately because of my hair : (. Thanks for tolerating this long post, everyone. Can Someone PLEASE give me a rountine or product that might actually work for me? I've tried everything I can think of...

Capybara
April 20th, 2010, 07:20 PM
Awh, I'm sure your hair isn't all that bad :flower:

Maybe you're really a wavy head, and not a straight one? I know that my hair needs moisture because I have a bit of wave. If I don't give it moisture, I just get frizz :p

HTH!!

violeteyes
April 20th, 2010, 07:25 PM
I use a pretty big dollop of conditioner before a shampoo and as a leave in, but I tend to switch what I use from day to day because nothing ever really helps as much as I want it to

manderly
April 20th, 2010, 07:33 PM
Can I see a photo of your hair?

You have it labeled as a 1b, but you probably have a bit more curl than that, which just looks like frizz when you don't account for them (mine does).

Did you ever get your hair typed?

violeteyes
April 20th, 2010, 07:33 PM
And on the wavy hair matter: I do have wavy hair, but the wave it never consistent. Sometimes it comes out quite 'beachy", with loose waves, other times it looks pretty straight on its own

Nocturnal
April 20th, 2010, 07:33 PM
Most likely your hair is not straight, but wavy-curly. Have you tried to style it as a curly hair by scrunching some mousse/ foam and letting it air dry?
There are a few members on the board that were surprised to learn how curly their hair actually is.

manderly
April 20th, 2010, 07:35 PM
You have to work with wavy hair to get it to look "right", but you have to also accept that there will be days it just isn't going to make you happy.

I'd suggest you check into the wavy/wurly or even the curly threads and try some of the techniques there to see what you get.

I spent over a year here thinking I was mostly a wavy girl, only to discover that with a little extra help I have some serious curls.

manderly
April 20th, 2010, 07:38 PM
Oh, it also has to do with length. I don't know what 26" looks like, is that around BSL?

Curls and waves don't look right until you get around APL and longer.

So, here's what my hair looked like back when I thought I was a frizzy wavy AND my hair was still too short to wave properly:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y50/astrauser/PreLovingCare.jpg

And here's what I've discovered I had been hiding all along:
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y50/astrauser/CIMG2209.jpg

violeteyes
April 20th, 2010, 07:39 PM
The problem with this is that I have "combination hair". My length is very dry, but my roots are so oily- we're talking six hours till it looks greasy. Curly hair remedies might be too..heavy?

Carolyn
April 20th, 2010, 07:41 PM
I use a pretty big dollop of conditioner before a shampoo and as a leave in, but I tend to switch what I use from day to day because nothing ever really helps as much as I want it toThis really jumped out at me. You probably need to condition after you use shampoo too. You could try CWC which is Condition Wash Condition. You apply conditioner to all or some of your hair, wash the scalp area with shampoo or diluted shampoo and then condition again. I second the thought that you need to add moisture. Biolage Conditioning Balm is a great heavy moisturizing conditioner. There are others but that's one that comes to mind. I also agree that you might need to reassess your hair type. You might be wavier than you think. In that case you could try encourage your waves.

violeteyes
April 20th, 2010, 07:43 PM
Manderly: thank you for your imput- seriously. Your hair looks so pretty, especially in your signature picture. What do you do to bring out your curls?

manderly
April 20th, 2010, 07:51 PM
Thanks violeteyes.

My siggy pic is actually a wet set with magnetic (smooth plastic) rollers and dried with a bonnet dryer. It gives me uniform big bouncy curls when I'm in the mood.

To bring out my curls like in the photo above, I've had to change my mindset to a curly girl.

Something you may want to try is to not condition your scalp, just your ears down since you have an oily scalp but dry ends.

Give this a go and see what happens. I think it will at least give you a better idea of what your hair is capable of if coaxed, and if you do find out you are more curly than you thought, then treating your hair as curly hair will help you with your problems much better than thinking otherwise.

Wash and condition as you please, leave a large dollop of condish in your ends (from the ears down) and do not rinse. Get some gel and scrunch that into your hair. You can either hold your head to one side, scrunching (soaking wet), then the other, then forward, or do it all at once in the forward position (don't whip your hair, let it fall from the side). Use lots of gel. I use probably close to 4 tbsps or more. After you've scrunched, does your hair look all curly? Good. Use a microfiber towel and gently scrunch the curls again, trying not to break them up, only squeezing out the excess water.

Leave them to dry DO NOT TOUCH AT ALL UNTIL THEY ARE 100% DRY. If you've got curls, congrats, you're a curly girl. Now you can look for the method that works for you (plopping, clipping, etc) to give you the look you want.




ETA: I think oily scalp/dry length is common for curlies because we can't brush the sebum down without ruining our curls. Since the sebum can't travel very well, we end up with dry hair that we have to help out by being crazy heavy-handed with the leave ins and stuff.

violeteyes
April 20th, 2010, 07:52 PM
*clarification: I do use conditioner after shampoo, as well as before, and I use some as a leave in as well. I just didn't specify this in my post : P sorry. But thank you for the advice!

violeteyes
April 20th, 2010, 07:55 PM
I never put conditioner at my scalp unless it is a special deep treatmennt every once in a while, for fear of it becoming greasy. I bought the "curly girl" book for my cousin, but maybe I should have kept it for myself!

manderly
April 20th, 2010, 07:57 PM
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=369

Here's the wurly and curly thread link. Give it a try, the only thing you have to lose is a day of over-moisturized hair if it doesn't work out for you :) But it's something you haven't tried yet. :flower:

violeteyes
April 20th, 2010, 08:00 PM
Thanks : ) I will admit that I know I am "fighting" my wave by constant combing while my hair is wet. Just one question manderly: when are you supposed to comb with this scrunching method?

manderly
April 20th, 2010, 08:08 PM
I use my denman in the shower when my hair is full of conditioner. That's the last time it'll see a comb or brush until I'm ready to shower again :) That's why you don't want to whip your hair around as you're scrunching. The tons of conditioner in it and gentle handling should keep it mostly tangle free, but for curlies we know it'll be all tangly by the time we get back in the shower with lots of conditioner.


ETA: I did that too. This is what I used to get when combing repeatedly while drying http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y50/astrauser/flashlamp-2.jpghttp://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y50/astrauser/CIMG1230.jpg

It stopped working when it got a bit longer. I could get it really straight and smooth. Now I get fluffiness if I try. :)

phistash
April 20th, 2010, 08:10 PM
Thanks : ) I will admit that I know I am "fighting" my wave by constant combing while my hair is wet. Just one question manderly: when are you supposed to comb with this scrunching method?


Ooooh. I have similar hair to you, wurly, but with a greasy scalp. DO NOT comb your hair when wet! Try the CWC method of washing (put conditioner on your length, then shampoo on your roots, rinse, then put more conditioner on your length). Don't pat or scrub your hair with your towel, just carefully squeeze out excess water, and wrap in a turban style for a few minutes to soak up the water. When you take off the towel, your can use your fingers to carefully arrange your hair in place, and scrunch your curls, but once you've done that, do not touch it until it is dry! Once dry, you can detangle with a pick or a wide-toothed comb, and maybe add some coconut oil to your ends.

violeteyes
April 20th, 2010, 08:14 PM
fluffiness- exactly the word I was looking for. Its funny how you mentioned "it worked when it was shorter but stopped as it got longer". When I first cut it just above bsl, it worked amazingly, but now its a mess! Makes sense

manderly
April 20th, 2010, 08:20 PM
Yeah, I think it has something to do with the length. Like when it was shorter, the curls didn't have enough to work with, so they were more submissive. Now that there's enough length for them to curl, they aren't going down without a fight, and I either need to resort to a flat iron or submit to them :)


ETA: And I think that's why SOOOO many women have such a hard time with their hair as it gets longer. They thought they had straight-ish or slightly wavy hair which is suddenly longer than normal and it gets all uncooperative and frizzy, so they give up and cut it short again and it obeys. The problem is they don't recognize that their hairtype has changed (or come out of hiding) so they keep treating it how they're used to instead of accepting the new. :) Something like 67% of the world is curly ;)

violeteyes
April 20th, 2010, 08:24 PM
And now I remember why I started straightening in the first place- its gotten to be about the same as it was a few years ago, when a girl asked if I ever brushed my hair. And that just set me off.

manderly
April 20th, 2010, 08:29 PM
And now I remember why I started straightening in the first place- its gotten to be about the same as it was a few years ago, when a girl asked if I ever brushed my hair. And that just set me off.


Ahhh, memories. I so recall being asked that many a time. Yes, one day I'll have to scan in my old highschool photos of my big frizzy mop (yay hairbrushes!). I wish I knew then what I know now.

violeteyes
April 20th, 2010, 08:36 PM
well, im still in highschool, so hopefully I learn my lesson based on everyone elses experience! I just want healthy, and beautiful hair. Can the two coexist? Hopefully....

manderly
April 20th, 2010, 08:38 PM
Lucky for you curls are in again ;)

Pin straight was coming into style again when I was in highschool :) Lucky for me I was too much of a dork to get a straightener, so I just left it fluffy.

Yozhik
April 20th, 2010, 08:41 PM
I feel your pain -- you sound like you might be a little curlier than me, but I, too, was pretty confused when my hair started getting longer and seemed to grow outward in volume rather than downward in length.

Try leave-in coconut oil right after you get out of the shower on your ends, then put it up into a towel turban to allow of the water to absorb. This will give your hair a chance to stay scrunched (and unpulled by gravity) until it's a little drier. That's what I do when I want to bring out my curls -- hope it helps :)

ETA: high school was a pain for me, too. I was extremely floofy, and so I cut it off to above my shoulders to cope -- don't go my route!

violeteyes
April 20th, 2010, 08:58 PM
Thanks for the support everybody. I am definitely going to try scrunching with gel tomorrow and NOT combing or touching while it dries. If it doesn't turn out the way I like it, maybe I can just put it in a braid until I figure out what to do.

violeteyes
April 20th, 2010, 09:26 PM
And I have another question! I've heard that combing and brushing the scalp can make it look more oily, but others say it helps it not look so oily. What's you opinion on that?

kittensoupnrice
April 21st, 2010, 08:35 AM
And I have another question! I've heard that combing and brushing the scalp can make it look more oily, but others say it helps it not look so oily. What's you opinion on that?

Typically, when brushing out with a fine brush, like a BBB, the brush will help move sebum down the length of the hair. This isn't recommended for curly/wurly's though, because it disrupts the curls. Some people also find that the extra scalp stimulation causes the hair follicles to produce more oil.


On another note, my hair isn't nearly as curly as yours, probably, but I have excellent results getting my hair to not be frizzy by using buns or braids. Leave in overnight or for a few hours during the day, carefully take down, and then gently finger comb or separate, and then no more touching! I find it leaves very nice non-frizzy waves when I do that. :)

Trixie
April 21st, 2010, 07:26 PM
I'm also a member of the "I was fluffy/floofy once" club. My hair was crazy in high school...so scary haha! I also thought I had mostly straight hair that was puffy, but I was wrong. My hair is a mix of waves and spirals now! Out of all the things I have tried for my hair, the gel+scrunch+no brush method has worked the best for me. Now my hair looks SO much better. Good luck on your curly journey!

x0h_bother
April 21st, 2010, 07:54 PM
You and I seem to have similar woes, Violeteyes. Every single thing you said happens to me. I also have tried a lot of methods to tame the frizz and grow natural nice hair. One thing I have found is I need coney conditioners and I also can only put serums in when my hair is completely dry and completely frizzy. It really works then for me. I'm no hair idol, but I attribute the condition to having straightened literally every day. People I worked with for years would tell me that they "didn't know" I had naturally "curly" hair until i began to embrace it and leave it wavy. GL with taming your frizz!

x0h_bother
April 21st, 2010, 07:56 PM
PS I'm thinking of trying this and thought you might like it..http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=37395
:-)

spidermom
April 21st, 2010, 08:20 PM
I think I know what you're talking about! My curls are the loose kind, so at shoulder length it looked like I had very fluffy/bushy hair, but at about 24-25 inches long I began to see the curls. Was I surprised! I think you might have the same thing.

At your length, I would comb conditioner through in the shower and then bring a flannel pillowcase up around my hair as it hung straight down around my shoulders and squeeze gently to get the excess water out. Then I'd massage a dab for leave-in conditioner or a drop or 2 of oil to ends only AND finger-comb a little aloe vera gel (or styling gel) through the length, then allow my hair to air dry.

Unlike Manderly, I only used 1/2 tablespoon of gel. Even now, I only use 1 tablespoon, give or take a little. It helps to define my curls, but I don't like to get crunch, so I use it sparingly.

Good luck! I hope the suggestions in this thread help you achieve hair that you love.

violeteyes
April 21st, 2010, 08:56 PM
I scrunched today! One girl asked if I had curled it, another said it looked cute, althought it didn't really look all that curly, or even wavy to me. I've heard that it can take some time for your hair to fully embrace its natural curl, however, meaning that it will get wavier over a period of time. Have any of you found this to be true?

Beesweet
April 21st, 2010, 09:51 PM
I was a super frizz (I think one of my nicknames was "bush head" in high school) until I stopped combing or brushing my hair at all. Well, maybe once a month, with a wide pick, when covered in conditioner.

Yes, it tangles. Yes, I can't really run my fingers through it -- but I have never had hair that you can run your fingers through. I can feel defined waves though and that feels nice.

Combing messes up my wave pattern, even after it is dry later. It also adds to frizz.

Just adding my .02 in here.

spidermom
April 21st, 2010, 10:44 PM
I scrunched today! One girl asked if I had curled it, another said it looked cute, althought it didn't really look all that curly, or even wavy to me. I've heard that it can take some time for your hair to fully embrace its natural curl, however, meaning that it will get wavier over a period of time. Have any of you found this to be true?

True for me. As a teenager, my hair was rarely longer than shoulder length because it would get weird and bushy as it grew, and I'd get it cut short again. It was frizzy, mostly straight, oily, with cowlicks. Those cowlicks are spiral curls in my long hair. I didn't see that until my hair was 25 or 26 inches long and I was in my mid-40s. Don't wait as long as I did to grow yours out!

manderly
April 22nd, 2010, 03:00 AM
I scrunched today! One girl asked if I had curled it, another said it looked cute, althought it didn't really look all that curly, or even wavy to me. I've heard that it can take some time for your hair to fully embrace its natural curl, however, meaning that it will get wavier over a period of time. Have any of you found this to be true?

I think it has more to do with you learning what works with your hair, and feeding it all the extra moisture it's been craving rather than it actually getting curlier. Though the added moisture definitely will make it curlier.

As for the gel (as spidermom mentioned) I don't often use a lot of it, that's just for days I want really defined curls. Yes, your hair will be nice and crispy when it dries, but you "scrunch out the crunch" just scrunch your perfectly dry curls and the crunch will go away and your curls will fluff a bit and they'll just be soft and defined :)

Glad to hear your first day was a success. Here's to embracing your new curls :toast:

share801
April 22nd, 2010, 04:02 AM
Manderly, thanks for your tips. I knew my hair was wavy but never thought of it in quite the way u presented it here. I can learn so much on this forum!

lilalong
April 22nd, 2010, 04:59 AM
Congratulations to your new curls!

kimannabella
April 22nd, 2010, 04:57 PM
before i started taking care of my hair i was a straightener addict, too. what i do now, when i want my hair straight is to use a conditioner with a bit of protein in it- loreal elvive nutri gloss mask in the pink tub, smooth some camellia oil on and comb it a bit while it's drying.

violeteyes
April 22nd, 2010, 05:03 PM
oh yeah! I have a question on oils! My hair is oily, and I know for a fact that I CANNOT oil dry hair. Advice on how much oil and the teqniques for putting it on wet hair? I want to see what my hair looks like with a bit of oil init without it looking greasy

spidermom
April 22nd, 2010, 05:35 PM
My advice about oil is start with 1 drop only, distribute among several fingers, and pinch-apply to ends. If you like the result, use 2 drops next time. That way, it's easy to recognize when you've achieved optimum results and when you've over-done it.

I'm up to using about 1 teaspoon of oil applied to hair from neck to ends, but I very slowly worked my way up to that amount.

violeteyes
April 22nd, 2010, 06:35 PM
What oil do you use? I have some pure jojoba, olive, and coconut oil I don't know which one to try

spidermom
April 22nd, 2010, 07:05 PM
Try them all, one at a time. Wash the last one out before you put the next one in. I like both olive and coconut oil for results, but the coconut oil smells better, so that's the one I use. I've never tried jojoba.

bumblebums
April 22nd, 2010, 07:17 PM
I don't think plopping has been mentioned by name yet. Here's the link with pictorial instructions:

http://www.naturallycurly.com/curlreading/its-a-curly-world/to-plop-or-not-to-plop

Congrats on discovering that you're a wavy head! It took me way too long to learn that about my hair...

Trixie
April 22nd, 2010, 07:28 PM
I scrunched today! One girl asked if I had curled it, another said it looked cute, althought it didn't really look all that curly, or even wavy to me. I've heard that it can take some time for your hair to fully embrace its natural curl, however, meaning that it will get wavier over a period of time. Have any of you found this to be true?

I definitely found this to be true. My curl has definitely increased the longer I've been taking care of it. I really think that lots of moisture and proper care have helped! I'm sure that you'll notice a difference in how your hair behaves after a couple weeks of embracing your curls! :joy:

manderly
April 22nd, 2010, 07:38 PM
Glad to help share801.

Violeteyes, I put coconut oil in my soaking wet hair before I add my gel or frizz serum (I like CHI silk infusion). I basically stick a finger into the jar up to the first or second knuckle, rub it into my hands, and squoosh it into my hair. Stick below the ears if oiliness is a problem.

pelicano
April 23rd, 2010, 04:15 AM
It's totally a case of trying things out to figure out what works best for you. My hair is very fine, dry and frizzy (although not dry at the roots). I tried putting loads of conditioner on, and discovered that my hair became over-conditioned. However, true to form, I didn't actually realise it was over-moisturised, because over-conditioned hair actually looks like dry straw (but feels very soft).

Also, try the plopping mentioned earlier. Plopping doesn't work for me, as it gives me undefined frizz., but it does seem to work for lots of people. My best method is to brush my hair when wet with my Tangle Teezer, then leave to drip dry. The big clumpy curls then form, rather than too much frizz.

Katze
April 23rd, 2010, 05:14 AM
Coming late to this thread but it sounds a LOT like my hair you are describing.


The problem with this is that I have "combination hair". My length is very dry, but my roots are so oily- we're talking six hours till it looks greasy. Curly hair remedies might be too..heavy?

Are you a fineie? Then you have to be careful - as others have mentioned, you probably should not condition your scalp. My hair used to be exactly as you describe, and is now MUCH better.

It is not so much an issue of 'combination hair' as that your sebum is not getting to your length and your scalp may be overproducing.



Something you may want to try is to not condition your scalp, just your ears down since you have an oily scalp but dry ends.

Leave them to dry DO NOT TOUCH AT ALL UNTIL THEY ARE 100% DRY. If you've got curls, congrats, you're a curly girl. Now you can look for the method that works for you (plopping, clipping, etc) to give you the look you want.

ETA: I think oily scalp/dry length is common for curlies because we can't brush the sebum down without ruining our curls. Since the sebum can't travel very well, we end up with dry hair that we have to help out by being crazy heavy-handed with the leave ins and stuff.

Seconding everything Manderly said. Also, fine haired wavies seem to need more moisture on the LENGTH. Because our hair is fine it gets weighed down and greasy very easily on the scalp, but needs extra protection on the length. A very difficult balance to achieve!




ETA: And I think that's why SOOOO many women have such a hard time with their hair as it gets longer. They thought they had straight-ish or slightly wavy hair which is suddenly longer than normal and it gets all uncooperative and frizzy, so they give up and cut it short again and it obeys. The problem is they don't recognize that their hairtype has changed (or come out of hiding) so they keep treating it how they're used to instead of accepting the new. :) Something like 67% of the world is curly ;)

Yes, and there is also very little professional help that really works (apart from here of course!) For years I was told my hair was too 'thin' to grow long (when it is a solid ii, but fine) and encouraged to blow it straight. All that heat, like your straightening, damaged my length, making it never able to grow long.


And now I remember why I started straightening in the first place- its gotten to be about the same as it was a few years ago, when a girl asked if I ever brushed my hair. And that just set me off.

I ask myself this every day when I look in the mirror. Mixing leave-in with hair gel works really well for me, and, to be honest now that I have horrendous amounts of new growth, I mostly wash with 'cones now too. (Dove)


And I have another question! I've heard that combing and brushing the scalp can make it look more oily, but others say it helps it not look so oily. What's you opinion on that?

I can't brush my scalp very much. If I want to wear my hair up, I have to brush it to slick down the baby hairs as much as possible. I usually brush the day before a wash, then keep my hair slicked back. Otherwise, I wear it in 'messy' updos - that is about all that works with my hair at the moment. I do comb a couple times a day.


My advice about oil is start with 1 drop only, distribute among several fingers, and pinch-apply to ends. If you like the result, use 2 drops next time. That way, it's easy to recognize when you've achieved optimum results and when you've over-done it.

I'm up to using about 1 teaspoon of oil applied to hair from neck to ends, but I very slowly worked my way up to that amount.

Spidermom! Your hair looks terrific!

I use about three drops and apply it to DAMP hair just after washing. I use coconut, wheat germ, and castor oils (the same i use for washing my face).

Hope this helps - wavy hair is not easy but you will be surprised, once you get your scalp and length in balance you WILL have good hair days, I promise. :) Without the iron, too. :)