Unhappy hair again!

[Chanteuse87]

Dear LHC,
I lurk quite a bit on the boards, and have been using many of the tips and tricks here for over a year. But I have never been fully satisfied with my hair, and as of late it's gotten even worse.

I do not blowfry, I do not color, I rarely brush and most often finger comb, do deep conditioning treatments on a semi-regular basis, and oil frequently (almond, coconut, or Fox's shea butter). For washing I switch between CO, shampoo bars, and the occasional clarifying 'poo. I do need to wash daily -- I've tried multiple times to stretch my washes out, and I literally look drenched by the evening of day 2. It's not cute. As I have pretty hard water, I follow shampoo bars with conditioner and then an acid rinse (usually citric acid). And still my hair is filled with splits (despite frequent S&Ds) the ends are CRUNCHY and never feel moisturized, and the majority is straight with corkscrew flyaways.

Today I tried a shampoo bar without using conditioner (J.R. Liggett's damaged hair formula) and followed with a citric acid rinse. It feels HORRIBLE. Top is greasy, ends are dry and coated and make a "dry leaves" noise when touched. I'm at wits' end.

Mostly I'm irritated with the splits and the crunchy ends -- I wear my hair up probably 70% of the time, and am always careful when it's down. I just don't understand what I'm doing wrong. Any advice?

[marikamt]

My very first guess would be build up... try clarifying and see what happens....

ETA- Second guess, based on what you describe as crunchiness may be protein overload.....

[Chanteuse87]

I know that my hair is definitely sensitive to protein, and I've triple checked ingredients and stopped using coconut oil for the time being -- I'd say it's been at least a month and a half since protein has touched my hair, and the first thing I did after I cut it out was to clarify and follow with an SMT. My hair definitely felt better, but not what I'd call "nice", you know?

[julliams]

Well your hair looks beautiful.

I have been doing "all the right things" and ended up with loads of splits after 6 months of no SLS, no cones, no heat, I don't dye, SMT's twice a week and oiling every day.

I have since added cones back in my conditioner and I have to say that my hair does feel much nicer to the touch which I know is the silicone. I'm thinking that with extra defense (the silicone coating) my hair might stand up better to further splits. I had a trim to take care of the ones that I had and now I'll be watching closely to see how my progress goes.

[Chanteuse87]

You know, I've been considering putting some cones back in, too, just to see what happens. And thanks for the compliment! It's an old pic, my hair is much closer to waist now -- if I can get the remnants of this shampoo bar out of it, I'll post something newer :)

[nycstar]

My very first guess would be build up... try clarifying and see what happens....

ETA- Second guess, based on what you describe as crunchiness may be protein overload.....

When you say protein overload, do you mean taking too many vitamins, diet?

[Juliannaissance]

IT'S THE CITRIC ACID!! This is bad for the hair. It WILL fry and damage it leading to MANY split-ends! Please don't do it!

[Chanteuse87]

Yikes, really?! I thought citric acid rinses were supposed to be an alternative to vinegar rinses? The smell of vinegar really hangs on to my hair even after I rinse it out and let it dry... What exactly does the citric acid do, and why has it been recommended by some?

[kabelaced]

I've tried apple cider vinegar rinses and have left the stuff in my hair before. When it was wet, it smelled a little, but the smell went away by the time my hair was dry and nobody made comments about any vinegar smell...

If you were to try vinegar rinses again, would you be willing to if the concentration of vinegar was not so high?

Since I don't use any coney things anymore, I've stopped ACVing - I didn't really see much difference anyway. Maybe stopping the rinses altogether for a while will improve your hair?

[kittensoupnrice]

Out of curiosity, is this the first time you tried a shampoo bar? New shampoo bar users often go through a "funky" phase for about a week before the shampoo bars actually start working properly. Both CV and PLH talk about this syndrome.

http://www.chagrinvalleysoapandcraft.com/shampfaq.htm - Check out the residue section
http://www.prairielandherbs.com/funkyhair.htm

[marikamt]

When you say protein overload, do you mean taking too many vitamins, diet?

No- to many proteins in the product. There is an article that explains it.... I don't know all the ins and outs, I just know some peoples hair is sensitive to it and can react in odd ways. Although from what I understand, it is 'fixable'.

[Juliannaissance]

Yikes, really?! I thought citric acid rinses were supposed to be an alternative to vinegar rinses? The smell of vinegar really hangs on to my hair even after I rinse it out and let it dry... What exactly does the citric acid do, and why has it been recommended by some?Supposedly it's very damaging to the cuticle since it opens it up and penetrates deep into the hair shaft. I guess it must be due to the acidity content of the citrus. I heard this from a friend, also I used to use garnier fructis shampoo, conditioner, and a leave-in, which was REALLY bad because it crisped my hair.

It was pretty annoying, so I just stay away from the citrus hair products, except for eating citrus, because citrus fruits are actually my favorite type of fruit..hahaha:p

[Chanteuse87]

Out of curiosity, is this the first time you tried a shampoo bar? New shampoo bar users often go through a "funky" phase for about a week before the shampoo bars actually start working properly. Both CV and PLH talk about this syndrome.

http://www.chagrinvalleysoapandcraft.com/shampfaq.htm - Check out the residue section
http://www.prairielandherbs.com/funkyhair.htm

Nope, I've tried shampoo bars on and off again (usually for at least a few weeks at a time) for about six months. My scalp is always nice with them, but my hair feels dry, crunchy, and coated, no matter how "moisturizing" the bar is supposed to be.

[Chanteuse87]

I've tried apple cider vinegar rinses and have left the stuff in my hair before. When it was wet, it smelled a little, but the smell went away by the time my hair was dry and nobody made comments about any vinegar smell...

If you were to try vinegar rinses again, would you be willing to if the concentration of vinegar was not so high?

Since I don't use any coney things anymore, I've stopped ACVing - I didn't really see much difference anyway. Maybe stopping the rinses altogether for a while will improve your hair?

I've tried a whole bunch of different concentrations with the vinegar, and no matter what my hair always seems to hold on to the smell -- it's not overpowering, but I ask my fiancee if he can detect it, and he always can :(

[julliams]

I always had great results with garnier fructis. It was one of the only supermarket brands that didn't make my scalp itchy.

[Dreams_in_Pink]

Could that be old damage? I mean, pre-LHC length? I ask because i have those and they NEVER feel good, even an overnight SMT didn't make them nice and smooth.

[jera]

You know, I've been considering putting some cones back in, too, just to see what happens. And thanks for the compliment! It's an old pic, my hair is much closer to waist now -- if I can get the remnants of this shampoo bar out of it, I'll post something newer :)

Perhaps Cones just on the ends might help. I do this occassionally when suffering from protein overload.

The hair in your pic looks beautiful. So soft and shiny. Whatever you were doing then seemed to be working just fine. :)

[ninelifewriter5]

I have similar type hair to you, I think, and I've found that I have to constantly change my routine to have nice hair. My hair also tends to alter a lot depending on temperature.

Most recently I've found cutting out shampoos and conditioners entirely (hardcore no 'poo stuff, I guess) has worked. Perhaps try that for a little while? I used to live in an area with hard water and my hair was pretty okay then. I also put a lot of coconut oil on my ends to make them nice and soft. You'd have to not wash your hair everyday if you cut out shampoos and conditioners however, because some of the stuff used in traditional no 'poo methods can be kind of harsh. Just power through it, maybe?

Sorry I couldn't be of more help, but I hope my limited advice might help a little.

[Chanteuse87]

Could that be old damage? I mean, pre-LHC length? I ask because i have those and they NEVER feel good, even an overnight SMT didn't make them nice and smooth.

I thought about that, but I don't think my hair has been really damaged -- I cut it to my chin a few years ago, and since it behaved itself well when short, I never used a blow dryer. Started learning updos as soon as it was long enough to bug me, and stopped using a brush because I didn't need to. And then I found LHC :)

I notice that the ends are especially bad around the front of the hair (sides closest to the face), which is also where my hair is the waviest. I try to always super moisturize it, but I don't really get anywhere.

[Sunny_side_up]

Supposedly it's very damaging to the cuticle since it opens it up and penetrates deep into the hair shaft. I guess it must be due to the acidity content of the citrus. I heard this from a friend, also I used to use garnier fructis shampoo, conditioner, and a leave-in, which was REALLY bad because it crisped my hair.

It was pretty annoying, so I just stay away from the citrus hair products, except for eating citrus, because citrus fruits are actually my favorite type of fruit..hahaha:p
Mmm yummy Citrus, better in than out i say:laugh:
Wouldn't consider doing a citric acid rinse on my hair, few months back tried the bicarb sodium clarifing rinse, hair didn't feel too good, it got smothered in coconut oil after that, then next day felt i wanted to wash again, but before i did left olive oil on all over my head for half an hour. My hair loves oils, wont use them too often/ use sparingly, because im trying to wash my hair less. Adore avocado!
Happy growing:)

[nycstar]

No- to many proteins in the product. There is an article that explains it.... I don't know all the ins and outs, I just know some peoples hair is sensitive to it and can react in odd ways. Although from what I understand, it is 'fixable'.

oh ok. Thanks! I never heard of this.

[ratgirldjh]

I love J. R. Liggett's but I hated that bar... It made my hair the same way - coated and dry at ends.

The herbal formula one works best in hard water IMO.

[LaurelSpring]

I have to say that your hair looks beautiful in the picture. I absolutely have to stay away from vinegar and citric acid. It makes me itch like crazy and then I shed like crazy.

Have you given any thought to switching to catnip for your rinses? It is slightly acidic and may do the trick. I did it for awhile and you do have to leave it on for awhile to get the full effect but it worked pretty good when I did.

Mostly I found that a bit of diluted ph balanced condition does the trick just fine and doesnt weight my hair down too much.