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View Full Version : Why Is Coney Build Up Damaging?



lexiflowers
January 20th, 2010, 02:11 PM
Hello people.

This question must have been answered so many times on the forums, but my searches aren't getting me anywhere because "cones" and "damage" and "build up" and "clarifying" are all mentioned so often on here!

I understand that letting cones build up on your hair causes damage (in fact I've known this for many years after my lovely ex hairdresser told me) but I don't understand how. It confuses me because of course cones give the illusion of less damage for a while because they smooth everything over - it seems like that should help protect your hair, though I realise that this isn't the case.

I ask because I switch between two Body Shop shampoos - one with SLS and one without (though neither with cones), and two Body Shop conditioners - both coney. I don't have any immediate intention of giving up the cones because my hair doesn't seem happy without them, but I would like to know exactly what cones actually do to my hair. Of course I know what they do on a shine/manageability/appearance level, but what are they actually DOING?

I hope this question makes sense,

Thanks guys. :)

Lexi :flower:

PorcelainHorror
January 20th, 2010, 02:22 PM
I wonder this too... /lurks/

SimplyViki
January 20th, 2010, 02:26 PM
Well, I'm no expert, but on me, when I think I've got buildup, the symptoms are:
-Tangles
-"Velcro ends"
-Little knots all over the place
-I start to hate my hair

I'm not sure the buildup itself is the problem, but the mechanical damage caused when I get impatient and frustrated by the abundance of tangling and am not as careful with the brush as I should be. It gets to the point where I can't even comb it without breaking or popping, even if I'm going slow.

Madame J
January 20th, 2010, 02:33 PM
'Cones will seal moisture out of your hair since they are hydrophobic. This would lead to drier hair, and potentially more tangles/breakage. 'Cones also can make hair look lank and greasy. This isn't damage, but it's not pleasant either.

MandyBeth
January 20th, 2010, 03:10 PM
Is part of it also that to remove cones, at least some hair will require SLS which is a very harsh and drying detergent?

My scalp is starting to feel better now at 2 weeks with no SLS or cones, my hair isn't quite as slippery, but it's learning.

Sweetness
January 20th, 2010, 03:59 PM
'Cones will seal moisture out of your hair since they are hydrophobic.


This makes sense, I was wondering too !

But why is it that oil is good, as it "seal moisture in" (but can build up too). If something seals moisture in, doesn't it also seal (more) moisture from coming in


Do cones actually take the moisture inside the hair and bring it out ?


Said in another way, what difference between oil and cones regarding moisture / buildup / sealing the hair ?


(do I make any sense ?)

MandyBeth
January 20th, 2010, 04:10 PM
From what I understand - your hair naturally has oil - your scalp produces it. It's just that with longer hair, the ends are more damaged with time and wear, then they are also further from your scalp and they don't get the natural oil on them. So in turn, you replace that sebum from your scalp with oil on the ends - I think most people oil from about ears down?

But also - most of the oils used are able to be washed off - and fairly easily if you don't over do it. Cones like to "stick" to the hair and take more to break those bonds down.

Not really sure myself - I notice a difference when I apply them. I give my problem areas (nape, behind my left ear) all the oil they want - literally a good palmful - with my short hair (jaw almost chin length) and those areas may be lank for the first day, but they are covered and then the next day, it's happy. If I put a palmful of coney product in my hair, I'd have to just start entirely over and it'd be a week probably before I could get all of that out.

teela1978
January 20th, 2010, 04:17 PM
This makes sense, I was wondering too !

But why is it that oil is good, as it "seal moisture in" (but can build up too). If something seals moisture in, doesn't it also seal (more) moisture from coming in


Do cones actually take the moisture inside the hair and bring it out ?


Said in another way, what difference between oil and cones regarding moisture / buildup / sealing the hair ?


(do I make any sense ?)
Oils can also seal out moisture. there are plenty of examples of people who have experienced 'crunchy' ends after oiling too much. Cones are really just synthetic oils. I don't find that my hair gets damaged from cones, for me they keep my hair from tangling and therefore prevent damage. Everyone's hair is different. If something works for you you should use it.

Buddaphlyy
January 20th, 2010, 08:21 PM
Cones aren't the only thing that can build up in your hair and depending on your hair, won't even build up the fastest. It only takes a few hours for my hair to have a build up if I use an oil, but it takes several days to get the same level of build up using cones.

And I also don't believe you only need a sulfate based shampoo to remove cones. For one thing, they aren't permanent and also not all cones "stick" to every hair type in the same way.

Tovah
January 20th, 2010, 09:00 PM
I think I'm more confused now than I was before. :?

spidermom
January 20th, 2010, 09:51 PM
Like most things you read about here, what works for one person won't work for everybody. Personally, I feel that oil buildup is the worst. It attracts dust and fiber fluff to my hair and makes it feel dry and snarly and just plain awful. I've never had buildup or damage from cone usage, but I do shampoo my hair, which removes cones.

Really good oils, like coconut and olive oil, do not merely "seal in moisture". They are moisturizing in and of themselves because hair needs essential fatty acids to be strong and flexible (as does skin), and vegetable/nut/fruit oils provide them.

I feel I get the best of both worlds by adding a little oil to my damp, clean hair, and then sealing all that good stuff in with a small application of coney serum.

plainjanegirl
January 20th, 2010, 09:55 PM
I think I'm more confused now than I was before. :?


Don't worry about all the whys. Alot of people would be confused if they started picking apart as to why and how and etc. Just slowly experiment and see what works for your hair and what doesn't.

Darkhorse1
January 20th, 2010, 09:58 PM
dimethicone isn't bad for hair. But, the product does lay, coat the hair to lay the cuticle flat. That would keep it from tearing/getting damaged. The problem would lay in that if it should build up, which I really don't think it can unless you don't wash your hair/ends, then you are locking out moisture etc.

Dry ends, tangles--those are also symptoms of dry ends. For me, cones help my ends stay healthy as I work in the elements and my hair is exposed to them. I use Pantene conditioner and some leave in conditioners, all have dimethicone.

What I found helped my ends? Instead of NOT using products with dimethicones, I started using oils to moisture/strengthen my ends. The results were amazing! So, I would play around with products. What may work for me may not work for you. Don't eliminate a product because many here don't use it. If it works for you, that's great! Some people here have allergies and don't use products for that reason, or for the fact that it just doesn't work for their hair. :)

Doesn't mean it's not good for you.

Torrin Paige
January 20th, 2010, 10:14 PM
My experience coincides with both Darkhorse and Teela...I use both cones and oil. My hair is so old at the ends that damage in inevitable, so I oil it up the night before a wash (the ends soak up all of that oil...lol) and then I use coney shampoo & conditioner & a coney serum for detangling after I get out of the shower. Using both really improved the shine, manageability, and general healthy look of my hair. I think it's just trial and error as to what works best for your particular head of hair. Good luck in finding what works best for you.

jera
January 21st, 2010, 01:41 AM
Is part of it also that to remove cones, at least some hair will require SLS which is a very harsh and drying detergent?

My scalp is starting to feel better now at 2 weeks with no SLS or cones, my hair isn't quite as slippery, but it's learning.


My hair doesn't like cones either though I'm still clueless as to the actual chemical changes, if any, to the hair shaft caused by cone usage. :confused:

Dreams_in_Pink
January 21st, 2010, 02:03 AM
i don't think cones leave permanent damage on hair. just like what everyone else said, cones and "coating" oils (like jojoba oil) do pretty much the same. They both act as a "barrier" for moisture; whatever is in the hair gets trapped in. "penetrating" oils (like coconut) work different though, they enter the hair shaft and make hair more flexible and strong.

I had a very coney leave-in. to find out if my hair liked it or not, i sprayed my hair with it and french braided for the night. next morning, my hair was far from slippery and shiny :( it was more like dryer, frizzier and almost tangled up! That's when i totally switched to no-cone products and oils. my hair didn't improve greatly (due to old damage) but it didn't react badly either. I'm still transitioning.

YesitsReal
January 21st, 2010, 02:08 AM
Cones are not as horrible as people think they are. Check this out:

http://thebeautybrains.com/2009/03/31/how-do-i-get-silicone-off-my-hair/

http://thebeautybrains.com/2007/01/29/are-silicones-bad-for-your-hair/

These ladies are actual cosmetic scientists, and they write a lot of articles about stuff like this. I encourage you to look around the website. I learned a lot! Plus, they say that LHC is one of their favorite websites for good info on hair!

lexiflowers
January 21st, 2010, 08:23 AM
Thanks for all the answers guys. :)

Still a bit of a puzzle then.

It sounds like actually they're totally fine - for all they may not suit everyone's hair, they don't damage everyone's hair either... :shrug:

To the people who have recommended I do what's best for my hair, whatever that is, that was always my intention. :) Cones really don't seem to do me any harm the way I use them, and my hair seems much happier with them. I wasn't thinking of giving them up, I was just curious about the science behind them being "damaging" (rather than too heavy, or greasy-looking) if one lets them build up.

I respect everyone's individual hair choices, your hair isn't my hair and my hair isn't yours. :)

If anyone does have any more science-y stuff regarding cones please do share it. Thanks. :)

Darkhorse1
January 21st, 2010, 10:35 AM
lexiflowers--I think that some people just noticed products with dimethicone didn't work for them, and then people felt that dimethicone, which is used to seal out moisture as a sealent on shoes etc was the same as in the hair products we use. While it is similar, it's not the same percent. I think that's why some people felt it was harmful to hair. There's no way the FDA would pass something you'd use to keep water out of your shoes, in a beauty product ;) :D

So, I'd say play around with certain products and chart it over weeks or such to see if you notice a difference. I know at different seasons, I can get cone overload and then I just don't use it for a few days or oil.

Oiling saved me from cutting my ends more frequently :)

Torrin--what do you use serum wise? Those I found never worked for me/left my hair very flat.

xoxophelia
January 21st, 2010, 12:00 PM
In my case, for whatever reason with oil I retain a decent amount of wave where as it seems silicone really makes my hair go limp.

But, my hair has a natural degree of slip. It hardly ever tangles. If I don't need one more added chemical not found in nature sticking on my head then I would just rather go without. I mean, why not?

I'm currently trying out no cones totally but I usually don't use them. I started using a glaze that has dimethicone in it recently. By the way, the bottle says the more time you use it, the better the shine. The more times I used it, my hair definitely got flatter. And, I use a shampoo with three surfacants (Water, sodium laureth sulfate, sodium lauryl sulfate, coocamidopropyl betanine) listed in the top 4.

My plan is to not use them and just save them for special occasions followed by ACV rinse or something.

Madame J
January 21st, 2010, 12:33 PM
I think the thing to remember with anything you learn on this forum is that virtually everything is personal. Some people's hair hates 'cones -- they get dry, breaking, straw-like hair. Some people's hair hates sulfates, or oil, or whatever. The only way to find out how your hair will react to something is to try it. 'Cones are not damaging to the hair. The worst thing they can do is build up, and even that won't really damage your hair, unless you ignore it. If you use 'cones, and your hair is being awful, try clarifying with a sulfate shampoo, especially if your hair normally looks fine.

If you're currently using a 'coney product, and you like what it does to your hair, go ahead and keep using it. Just remember, that if it suddenly seems like it's stopped working, try clarifying before you assume that what you're using is no longer good.

But then, this is true of any product. Like people said, other ingredients can build up.

Anje
January 21st, 2010, 01:09 PM
One other possible source of damage... For some people (like me), silicones seem to increase the number of fairy knots that show up in our hair. I haven't figured out why, but I've noticed the correlation, and since I have to cut out the knots I consider them a form of damage.