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View Full Version : What do sulfates do to hair?



Talula
January 16th, 2010, 05:09 PM
Hi,

So I've read that most shampoos have sulfates (which I guess is what makes the lather?) and many here avoid them. What do sulfates do to your hair?

Thanks!

Tangles
January 16th, 2010, 05:13 PM
You know the scratchy, velcro-y feeling you get after using an especially stripping shampoo? Many SLS (or ALS, ammonium lauryl sulfate) shampoos are thought to be harsh and overly cleanse the hair to the point where it is drying and breaks down the hair so to speak. In addition, many prefer not to use cones, which most SLS shampoos are meant to be used with. So, switching to a gentler shampoo and using a non-coney conditioner results in more moisturized, better balanced hair for some.

duckish
January 16th, 2010, 05:14 PM
I avoid SLS because it's used as a control substance against possible irritants because it is guaranteed to be irritating to skin.

I just can't fathom why companies think I would like to put a known irritant on my skin or hair when I don't have to. Madness!

They aren't all bad, of course. Few things clean like a sulfate shampoo! Many people aren't sensitive to them, either, so very little downsides to using them. People who are sensitive to them can get nasty rashes or sores on their scalp, though.

Akiko
January 16th, 2010, 05:21 PM
Just like cones, there are people who like SLS as well as those who don't. I have to use SLS. Otherwise I end up being a grease ball.

Talula
January 16th, 2010, 05:22 PM
I avoid SLS because it's used as a control substance against possible irritants because it is guaranteed to be irritating to skin.

I just can't fathom why companies think I would like to put a known irritant on my skin or hair when I don't have to. Madness!

They aren't all bad, of course. Few things clean like a sulfate shampoo! Many people aren't sensitive to them, either, so very little downsides to using them. People who are sensitive to them can get nasty rashes or sores on their scalp, though.

Interesting.... I recently did a Cassia treatment on my sister & noticed her scalp to be very pink (before the cassia). Her husband says it's always like that, but it looked a little raw to me. Also she has irritated spots on her scalp near her neck that she picks at a lot & they aren't healing..... maybe I need to get her off sulfates! Not sure if she'll go for that, tho.... But I've been trying soapnut foam on myself, I'll try to hook her. :eyebrows:

Gumball
January 16th, 2010, 05:37 PM
Some people can wash their hands quite often with a tough brand of soap and be no worse for wear. Others do that and their hands will dry out and get very uncomfortable. That can relate to why some people don't like sulfates while others use them regularly. It's ultimately how the hair and scalp of the individual reacts to the level of cleaning (or the reaction to the chemicals) that sulfates provide. Will it be more boon than burden or the other way around? That is one of the big reasons a lot of members will do lots of trial routines to see what ends up working.

duckish
January 16th, 2010, 05:46 PM
Interesting.... I recently did a Cassia treatment on my sister & noticed her scalp to be very pink. Her husband says it's always like that, but it looked a little raw to me. Also she has irritated spots on her scalp near her neck that she picks at a lot & they aren't healing..... maybe I need to get her off sulfates! Not sure if she'll go for that, tho.... But I've been trying soapnut foam on myself, I'll try to hook her. :eyebrows:


It's definitely possible. Doesn't hurt much to avoid it temporarily. :)

AmericanWoman
January 16th, 2010, 06:36 PM
One other thing to consider about sulphates/detergents are the harmful impact on the environment, especially the waterways.

Pear Martini
January 16th, 2010, 08:23 PM
they strip the hair of oil and product but sometimes they strip the hair too much and it becomes damaging

jojo
January 16th, 2010, 08:31 PM
I use my shampoo diluted and have various kinds some with sulphates and some without but 80% are sulphate free, like I said I dilute say 20% shampoo with 80% water.

ravenreed
January 16th, 2010, 11:10 PM
I am sensitive to sulfates. They irritate my hands and make them raw in soaps, they make my scalp itchy, flaky and I get rebound oiliness. When I use an SLS shampoo, my hair looks greasy again within 24 hours. Without, I can go 2 - 3 days. However, I just tried soapnuts, and I had a terrible reaction to those too. I even have to be careful what conditioner I use. I guess I will CO and stick to the things that don't make me break out on my scalp...

teela1978
January 16th, 2010, 11:20 PM
They clean my scalp and they clean it well. For me, non-sulfate shampoos (and pretty much every washing method I've tried, including no-poo/CO) don't clean my scalp enough. Without sulfates I get little pimples on my scalp that eventually pop and get scabby. There's not a lot of them but enough to annoy me. I also have to wash a lot more often without sulfates.

With sulfates I usually wash my hair every other day. Without I have to wash daily. I dilute my sulfate shampoo down a lot, and generally go through a bottle or two a year.

They work for some people and not for others... and that's okay. Use what works for you.

danacc
January 17th, 2010, 12:09 AM
Sulfates are detergents. They clean.

Detergents are different than soap. Some shampoos like Aubrey Organics use soap instead of detergent as the cleansing agent. Most soaps come in bars; in the case of hair, they are referred to as shampoo bars. (But Lush makes shampoo bars with detergents in them, so you have to do your homework either way.) Some folks prefer soap, others prefer detergents. If you use a soap-based cleaner on hair, the pH will be alkaline which opens the cuticle. Make sure you do an ACV rinse (which is acidic) afterwards to counter the alkalinity and close the cuticle. Shampoos that use detergents can be--and usually are--formulated to have the slightly acidic pH that your hair and skin love. It is not possible to do this with soap.

Sulfates are among the harshest detergents used in shampoos. Often, if your scalp is sensitive to them, switching to a milder detergent will work. This has the advantage of being able to use a product with the appropriate pH so that the cuticle is not opened each time you wash. As others have mentioned, diluting the shampoo can also prevent it from stripping too much oil from the hair. I have found that I need much, much less shampoo than the bottle leads me to believe.

There are other ways to clean the hair as well, including using soapnuts or other local or Indian herbs.

Talula
January 17th, 2010, 12:15 AM
For those of you who use sulfate shampoo but dilute it.... what is your method of diluting? Do you put a little shampoo in a separate bottle & shake it up w/ warm water right before you wash? Is it diluted to the point of being watery, or just a little bit thin?

RocketDog
January 17th, 2010, 12:16 AM
I have a sensitive scalp and always assumed that having it be a little tender after a wash was normal, which is a big part of why I used to put off washing my hair as long as possible when I was a teen. Since switching to gentler shampoos I have not had any scalp tenderness, and my hair doesn't feel as stripped after washing so it behaves better - more moisture for me means less frizziness!

teela1978
January 17th, 2010, 12:26 AM
For those of you who use sulfate shampoo but dilute it.... what is your method of diluting? Do you put a little shampoo in a separate bottle & shake it up w/ warm water right before you wash? Is it diluted to the point of being watery, or just a little bit thin?
I dilute mine down quite a bit. Its completely liquid. I dilute each time I wash in a separate container (fill with water (1-2 cups... maybe 300mL), add a small squirt of shampoo, stir with finger).

When I use shampoo (any shampoo) full strength, I have to use a lot of it to get any of the detergent to the underlayers of my hair. If the shampoo is diluted down that much, I can pour it slowly onto my scalp and it seems to get all of my head clean. This saves product, sends less product down the drain to the fishes, and does a good job of cleaning my hair.

jesamyn
January 17th, 2010, 12:27 AM
For those of you who use sulfate shampoo but dilute it.... what is your method of diluting? Do you put a little shampoo in a separate bottle & shake it up w/ warm water right before you wash? Is it diluted to the point of being watery, or just a little bit thin?

I buy shampoo by the gallon (every few years) and dilute it into an 18oz re-purposed shampoo bottle with water. I use enough water to make it thin, but not watery. I like putting my shampoo from my hand to my head, not directly on my head, which is what I have to do if it's too watery. I wind up wasting it if I get it too watery, because I miss and it just runs down my hair instead of staying up where I can clean my scalp. Once I have it mixed up pretty well, I don't need to shake it each time. It doesn't seem to separate.

danacc
January 17th, 2010, 12:27 AM
For those of you who use sulfate shampoo but dilute it.... what is your method of diluting? Do you put a little shampoo in a separate bottle & shake it up w/ warm water right before you wash? Is it diluted to the point of being watery, or just a little bit thin?

I dilute it in a separate bottle. It is definitely watery. For most shampoos, a tiny drop is all it takes. I add enough water to make it easy to distribute the mixture and foam onto my scalp. (For me, a light conditioner alone keeps the length clean. I don't apply shampoo directly to the length.)

It's trial and error; I eventually got used to what my hair needed to feel like while washing and rinsing to get good results.

Katze
January 17th, 2010, 03:24 AM
Washing with sulfate shampoos gets the chlorine out of my hair after swimming (I do wear a cap but it is not watertight) and regular sulfate use (1x a week or less) keeps my scalp from getting buildup, causing sebhorreic dermatitis.

When I first came here I went no sulfates, then even no poo, for a year or more. (To me this meant NO shampoo AT ALL, so no clarifying with sulfates...probably a mistake). Then I was at my in-laws and forgot conditioner, and washed with a sulfate shampoo, without conditioning, and got GREAT hair, huge and wavy and shiny for the first time in months. Since then I feel like my hair and scalp need occasional sulfates.

pepperminttea
January 17th, 2010, 06:59 AM
I just can't fathom why companies think I would like to put a known irritant on my skin or hair when I don't have to. Madness!

Unfortunately it's cheap, and most companies prioritise their profits over their customers. :(

I avoid SLS/SLES/ALS, sulphates, and cones. I have psoriasis on my scalp; it's basically dry, irritable skin that itches like mad, is initially caused by stress, and once you've got it, it's incurable. I treat my scalp carefully so as to not upset the psoriasis, really, and it's been a lot happier since I switched to products without the above ingredients. It itches a lot less, and that's good all round really.

Nypsy
January 17th, 2010, 07:10 AM
This video would probably be helpful to you: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQggSIxU8lw

Othala
January 17th, 2010, 07:18 AM
One other thing to consider about sulphates/detergents are the harmful impact on the environment, especially the waterways.

As an aside, it is worth noting that Shikakai, an Indian fruit used to clean the hair and scalp, is a marine toxin. It kills fish and amphibians. Natural is not always benign.

teela1978
January 17th, 2010, 08:51 AM
As an aside, it is worth noting that Shikakai, an Indian fruit used to clean the hair and scalp, is a marine toxin. It kills fish and amphibians. Natural is not always benign.

There's also the point that many natural cleansing methods require ingredients that must be shipped from quite far away, and large amounts of those ingredients.

Which is really worse? A 300mL bottle of US-made shampoo in a year, or a few pounds of soapnuts from india?

Talula
January 17th, 2010, 12:03 PM
Washing with sulfate shampoos gets the chlorine out of my hair after swimming (I do wear a cap but it is not watertight) and regular sulfate use (1x a week or less) keeps my scalp from getting buildup, causing sebhorreic dermatitis.
What are the symptoms of "sebhorreic dermatitis" that you get from your buildup?

danacc
January 17th, 2010, 05:23 PM
Seborrheic dermatitis causes scaling (flakes), redness, and often itchiness. It can be treated and managed, but not cured. Cradle cap in infants is one form of it that usually clears without medical treatment. For adults, it tends to occur in oily areas of the skin. For us who have it, common locations are scalp, side of the nose, eyebrows, eyelids and the skin behind the ears. It can occur in other areas, too.

There are various triggers that can exacerbate the condition. Keeping the scalp clean is one of the ways to help manage it.

If you are experiencing scaling (flakes) accompanied by redness and itching or crusting of the scalp skin, see a doctor.

Talula
January 23rd, 2010, 06:21 AM
I dilute it in a separate bottle. It is definitely watery. For most shampoos, a tiny drop is all it takes. I add enough water to make it easy to distribute the mixture and foam onto my scalp. (For me, a light conditioner alone keeps the length clean. I don't apply shampoo directly to the length.)

It's trial and error; I eventually got used to what my hair needed to feel like while washing and rinsing to get good results.

So, I was inspired by this comment about just a tiny drop needed to clean hair..... and I tried ... I'd say ... a small blob, in a travel sized empty shampoo bottle, and shook it up w/ water. My hair was slightly cleaner that day, but by the next day it was really greasy again, and I had to do my regular wash. I normally never wash 2 days in a row.... but the diluted thing didn't work for me. But I'm not giving up.... maybe next time I'll try TWO small blobs, and shake it up w/ water. That would still be less than I normally use. I'm having fun experimenting with less SLS shampooing overall. Thanks for all the advice I get here.... I love it. My goal is to one day get rid of my frizz halo.

Katze
January 24th, 2010, 07:12 AM
What are the symptoms of "sebhorreic dermatitis" that you get from your buildup?

Buildup seems to make my scalp worse: I get crusty spots, lots of flaking, itching, and even bloody spots. Too much sulfate shampooing is bad, but not enough is just as bad.

I also have eczema on the sides of my nose and on my hands. Trying to moisturize enough, but gently, as well as wash deeply enough, is a very delicate balance for me for both skin and hair (and it doesn't help that I am relatively lazy and low maintenance - I would rather find one thing that works than have to do three things in its place!). Sulfate shampoos work well on my scalp, and a gentle face wash, alternating with honey masks and OCM, work OK for my skin (I am still not super happy with my skin).

Sulfates work well for my hair and scalp. My fine hair gets weighed down easily, and sulfates seem to help stop this from getting out of control.