View Full Version : Question for the waist++ fine-hairs

December 4th, 2009, 06:40 PM
I have reached the point where I usually cut my hair. I'm at BSL and the last 2-3 inches of hair are breaking on the canopy and underneath every strand is bent and tangly. I believe this is old dye damage that will just have to come off but I'm concerned it is getting worse by the amount I have to rinse/CO/CWC my hair.

I've tried stretching washes two separate times for about six month stints and my scalp gets so funky and my ends even more dry (I even damp bun which only helps a little). Almost every wash I follow with a leave-in (either oil or conditioner), let air dry, comb when almost dry with a wooden comb and wear it in a protective updo 99% of the time. I've almost completely given up my BBB except for brushing my bangs and on heavily oiled hair.

How many of you fine-haired people have made it past waist and up to classic (or beyond) with daily washing - whether that be CO, WO, or CWC? If so, do you use cones? Do you think they help?

If not, is there something I can try that will keep my scalp from getting gunky and my ends from getting so dry? My hair isn't quite long enough to justify scalp only washing. It all just ends up wet.

I'd really like to get at least to hip, but right now I don't think my ends are going to make it that far. The last time my hair was long it was at waist but I cut it back for mostly the same reason - my ends just got so bad.

Any advice anyone has will be greatly appreciated. :flower:

Oh, and yes I've clarified and deep conditioned which makes it marginally better.

December 4th, 2009, 08:01 PM
Great questions! Sorry I'm not a qualified responder. I will be watching for answers too.

Since I have the same issues as you, I went with the scalp washes. I have to wrap my length in two shower caps with several big scrunchies. I'd say probably 2/3 of my hair gets wet, but the ends are dry and more importantly, I don't have to detangle them (i.e. rip them!!) when wet. I think that's what caused most of my damage/thin-hairedness.

:drama: watching this thread :)

December 4th, 2009, 08:31 PM
I wash daily using chemical free products (Giovanni and Kiss My Face). I am attempting to shampoo less now so I CWC every Mon and Thurs and CO on the other days. It seems that my hair gets really dry and unhappy if I go a day without washing it. I do not use cones at all but I use a leave in conditioner and lightly oil while my hair is damp. I use a wide tooth "bone" comb to detangle when I get out of the shower and then wrap the hair in a microfiber towel for about 15 minutes and then I use the leave in and comb with a normal comb, apply oil, and then comb again.

On work days, my hair is braided while still damp and let out after work to finish drying. At home it gets bunned multiple times (it won't stay up) and I braid for sleep. On days off I leave it loose.

I also trim any split ends I can find when I am bored as well as knotted strands.

I chemically dye my hair and it is tailbone length but the strands are of varied thickness. The front and undersides are fine but the top of the back is normal.

I have found to keep my ends happy that when I do a heavy overnight oiling my hair has to be damp. Otherwise all the oils I have tried dry out my hair. Also, if I keep my hair bunned at the ends while it is still damp, that seems to help. I still have some problems sometimes though, probably because of the dye.

When washing my hair, I leave it hanging down my back as much as possible. When I scrub my scalp with either the shampoo or the conditioner, I try not to move the hair too much. The same goes for rinsing. I lean backwards to get the top of my head clean and lift the hair near the scalp up with my fingers while moving my head around. I let the product run down my hair and to rinse out the bottom half, I step forwards slightly and lift my hair slightly behind me. By doing it this way, I find I do not have much detangling to do afterwards. I also comb before my shower.

Hopefully some of this will help.

December 4th, 2009, 10:55 PM
I'm at classic, and over the years I've been growing out, I've found I get along best with shampooing my scalp with dilute shampoo, conditioning my length (but NOT my scalp) with a moisturizing conditioner, then using a detangling/creme rinse type conditioner on my length.

I seem to need the shampoo at my scalp, to get it clean enough, and seem to need the extra moisture and detangling at my length.

I tried a lot of other stuff, but this seems to be what works best for me.

Shampooing just my scalp is easier now that my hair's so long. I don't obsess about possibly getting shampoo on my length once in a while, just try not to over cleanse.

I also get along best if I put my damp hair up in a microfiber towel for a bit, then let it down to finish drying, without making any effort to detangle while wet. Once it's dry, I finger detangle as gently as possible, and then finger comb.

I do use an actual comb once in a while, but only after I've thoroughly finger detangled. (make sure your hands are clean and DRY)

Not sure if this is useful for anyone else, but it seems to be working for me.

ETA: I do use SLS shampoos, they help get my scalp clean enough. Diluting seems to be a good thing for me.
As I was growing out, I also did micro trims on a fairly regular basis (3-4 times a year). I seem to have been trimming less this year (only twice so far), and everything seems fine, so far, so good.

December 4th, 2009, 11:14 PM
I'm almost to waist so I'm watching this thread :) I made it from shoulder-length hair a few years ago..to hair that is actually starting to feel long....doing what I've learned here ;)

This thread has some great inspiration in it: http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=19980

I think my hair would have disintegrated into dust and blown away in a strong wind if it weren't for:
1. Avoiding SLS shampoo
2. Virgin coconut oil
3. Henna glosses/Lush caca (albeit infrequent--still added strength!)
4. Not owning a hairbrush
5. Curling iron once a week tops
6. Avoid the hairdryer--maybe once a month tops

December 5th, 2009, 05:56 AM
I am at waist length, and I chemically dye. I haven't noticed a lot of damage at my crown but my ends do need to come off from time to time. I find that my hair gets a long better with regular deep treatments, CO'ing, cone-free, and shampoo bars. On the occasions that I do use cones, I lose a bit of curl, gain a lot of slip, and since I henna gloss it make it super shiny and I oil religiously!

If you're concerned about breakage, I would trim regularly, even micro trimming & S&D's help my hair, and the henna/cassia gloss helps a lot.

Kris Dove
December 5th, 2009, 06:05 AM
I know I've done it before (see signature pic!) so I'm hoping to do it again.

I never used to wash every day until it was permed and my mother insisted I washed it every day as it looked greasy, then I washed it every day ever since, so I'm now trying to cut back to every other day in the hope it'll improve it a bit.

December 5th, 2009, 09:01 AM
Well, I don't wash every day, but my hair is quite a bit past waist ;), so hopefully my routine can be helpful.

I do WO, with an ACV rinse, 1-2x a week, but I can go indefinitely without a full wash if I want to. I did have to go through a 6 week transition period before my scalp and hair got used to it, but it has been worth it. I have two small kids, and not a lot of time to mess with my hair. Plus, my hair is healthier this way than it ever was before. So it's a win-win =). I haven't found water itself to dry out my ends excessively, but CO washes can (so I don't do them often). Even if all your hair gets wet, scalp washes might be worthwhile just to keep cleansing agents of it.

I put olive oil (or possibly coconut oil - I just bought some to try) on my hair before I detangle it if it looks at all dry. This seems to do a good job keeping damage down. Otherwise, I don't use anything else, product-wise. Cones caused more damage than they prevented, so I avoid them like the plague. I use a seamless Denman brush for everything (lost my seamless comb and haven't replaced it yet), and it works well. I wear my hair up all the time (held with Ficcares), and only in styles where my ends are completely protected. At night, I fold my hair up from the ends to about bsl, and use a homemade hair hosiery holder (how's that for alliteration ;)) to hold it.

Here is what helps my scalp stay clean-feeling b/w washes:
*Scalp massages. Ideally I try to do them 2x/day, morning and night, but once a day usually suffices.
*Lavender spray (3-5 drops lavender EO in ~24oz/water). If my scalp feels like it needs cleaning, I saturate it with the lavender spray, and then do a scalp massage for a few minutes, till it feels clean.

Some things that help my ends:
*Wash in cold water (or the coldest you can stand - no warmer than room temp) My ends dry out horribly if I wash them in warm/hot water. And, of course, no blow drying or curling iron or anything like that.
*Always, always, always put oil on them if they feel dry at all, and especially never comb or brush them when they are at all dry - it's just asking for damage. I sometimes have to put oil on them several times in one detangling session.
*Keeping the ends protected - ideally, by keeping them completely out of the elements, tucked under other hair.

HTH - good luck with growing =).

December 5th, 2009, 09:49 AM
I have fine hip length hair (longer when wet, probably on my thigh). Everyday washing would dry me out; I have to do every second day. I don't use the huge gobs of shampoo I used to use, either. A small amount, diluted, and applied to the scalp area alone does it.

Product -wise, I'm cone-free. I use coconut oil on my ends. When I bun, I make sure the ends are tucked under the bun and protected.

I also s&d regularly.

December 5th, 2009, 09:49 AM
Thank you all so much for the advice!

One of the things that I realized I haven't been doing in the last six weeks or so (after reading these responses) is heavy oiling before washing. Thank you for reminding me how well this works!

December 5th, 2009, 10:23 AM
Finding the right combination has been a work in progress for me. I think if you are having trouble growing because of the ends there are several things to help. There is alot of good advice here already. My 2 cents are:

Henna - henna has really helped the strength of my hair. Experiement to find the right mix from Cassia or gloss to full strength. I think a little henna can help with breakage.

I would say really baby the ends. Keep doing regular microtrims and keep something on the ends. I LOVE Nightshades NightBlooming Panacea Hair Salve and use it every day. It smells heavenly! Check it out on etsy. This has kept my ends very moisturized. Shea works nicely also.

December 5th, 2009, 12:33 PM
I haven't cut my hair since last January and I've only done a few S&D missions (I don't have the patience). I plan to cut my hair in the coming weeks (probably 1-2 inches) then start doing microtrims every 3-4 months as I creep to waist.

I used to henna, but I want to let my natural color come back. I could start back up on the cassia treatments, though.

Thanks again for the advice!

December 6th, 2009, 12:22 PM
Bumping to see if there are any other fine hairs out there that might have some other secret I can try. :smile:

December 6th, 2009, 12:34 PM
I have fine hair and I am struggling to reach waist but oiling each day on the ends helps me, also I use a cone-free condish but put a little coney condish on the very ends as a leave in. time will tell I suppose but i feel your frustrations.

December 6th, 2009, 03:36 PM
I do the heavy oiling (coconut) on my ends before washing too, and it helps a lot. I've also recently started using aloe vera juice (thick juice, but not gel) as a leave-in after washing and it gives my hair much more body and seems to help the ends too.

December 7th, 2009, 02:51 PM
I have tailbone length fine hair. I wash about once a week (forced to, we live on the road) and I wash only the scalp and use shampoo with cones. I then use a conditioner on the length only. I leave my hair to dry without touching it, then as it is almost dry, finger comb and damp bun it or braid it. I wear my hair up all the time. I haven't used oil in a long time, but I did in the past when I had access to a shower at will, just in case I overdid it. lol

I love the feeling of a boar bristle brush, but I did see damage after a few months that I never see with a horn comb.

December 7th, 2009, 02:58 PM
I wash my hair about every 3rd day -- CWC with diluted, gentle shampoo used at my scalp but not my length (except once every couple of weeks for clarifying). Plus extra conditioner as a leave in (same kind as rinse out) along with a small scrape of coconut oil. I also like to top this off with CHI Silk Infusion (coney) about once per week. I believe it seals the moisture in, and the smooth effect seems to last through the next two washings.

This is the longest my hair has ever been. I don't color/bleach/highlight my hair at all, I do blow-dry on warm and cool occasionally, and I wear it bunned at least half the time. Oh - and I get the ends trimmed once every 3 months plus S&D occasionally to snip out the most obvious damage (split ends and white dots). I almost always use a comb but will occasionally give it a good brushing with a paddle brush before washing it. The bristles are soft and rubbery.

December 7th, 2009, 03:47 PM
I have fine hair, but not (I think) especially delicate. I always used to wash it every other day, and it got to a bit past waist that way -- but I was only wearing it back in a ponytail, not up, and wasn't especially invested in the length beyond wanting to be able to put it back. So the first time it started catching in my waistband regularly, I got it chopped back to shoulder so I wouldn't have to worry about it for a while.

I never used to be able to "stretch" washes more than an extra day or two, because it would start looking really grungy at the scalp. I've either gotten it calmed down or gotten used to the look, though, and I've found I only really need to wash it with shampoo once a week if I douse it in water mid-week sometime. (I've never gone entirely water-only, but it works pretty well in alternation.)

December 7th, 2009, 08:30 PM
I'm doing almost everything I've been told to care for fine hair, except for extending washes. I'm trying again, however. Today is the first day without and my scalp is already driving me crazy! It itches like mad! Both times I tried before it was pretty much the same thing - the itching and greasies never subsided. :shrug: Maybe it'll get better this time. I don't want to sacrifice length and health, but if my scalp doesn't calm down I might have to.

I also reintroduced cones into my routine (a conditioner and a leave-in to use as needed) and so far my ends are already feeling better. I've been cone-free for the last two years and I want to see how my ends do with that extra slip.

Thanks again for all the advice and support everyone. I really love this forum. :flowers:

December 7th, 2009, 08:35 PM
Plus extra conditioner as a leave in (same kind as rinse out) along with a small scrape of coconut oil. I also like to top this off with CHI Silk Infusion (coney) about once per week.
This is what I did yesterday. After CO I added a little cone-free conditioner, coconut oil, then potion #9 (generic). My ends aren't bent and tangly as they have been for the last month. Wish I could find that balance where my ends felt good and my scalp didn't itch.

Someday soon I hope. :)

December 7th, 2009, 09:32 PM
I wash every day. I usually put some oil (jojoba or camelia) before I shampoo, then I use conditioner(Green Apple Suave), rinse and dry with towell. I put some jojoba oil on wet hair and let it dry. I don't wear my hair down, except some special occasions, I braid it or put it up.
My hair is longer now than on my picture, it is one or two inches longer than tailbone.