HAIR MESS ..please help [Archive] - The Long Hair Community Discussion Boards

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Danniekitten

November 14th, 2009, 05:07 PM

hi there

so im white girl with long fine thing hair,
Im30 years old and threw the years of coloring andblowdrying, my hair has gone more frizzing
i have wavy hair but thebreakage parts actually curl...
i was a stylist which i did in 2002...before i started that, i had nice long fuller hair
Threw the years i went on birth control..acutane for acne..coloring my hair dark brown sometimes black for the greys..and i did use extentions which didmake my hair more fine..
so now its so fine that even blowdrying it, it feels like straw and if i use products, it goes soft but to soft and flat...I have broken parts of my hair threw my head more so around the side burns area so its fuller around my neck and the long part down my back is thin..i dont want to cut it as it takes soooooo long to grow..and i try not to blow dry but the breakage frizzes and curls while the long parts dont..its a mess..i dont understand why the thin parts and broken parts wont grow..itsbeen like this for so long while the rest of my hair grows..
i tried using better shamppoos and conditioners which is hard to find that work for frizz and colored hair to keep color.
and styling products i use to many ..i want stuff for heat protector, serums,as it tangles when its wet i need a leave in conditioner and evne hairspray on the frizz to keep it tammed doesnt work..:(
i just need something to grow those parts fast..ireally want to keep my long hair as i do get alot of compliments believe it or not..i model on the side so long hair is good for shoots...
please help
for pics click myspace page
Page contains NSFW images. Please post hair pictures within the guidelines. Thanks. :flower:

thank u so muchfor any help

Dannie

jojo

November 14th, 2009, 05:18 PM

The one word which jumps out in your post is heat, this is what is causing your hair to break, you are literally frying your hair to the point of no return. Try SMT's , oils, deep conditionings, try going without shampoos, but if you must try sulphate free ones. You may also beefit from some protein treatments, if you truely want hair longer than say BSL you need to start treating your fine hair like you would delicate lace or your hair is going to suffer, it may mean starting to cut damaged bits off, little by little, this is the only true way of getting rid of damage. Try and keep your hair up too this will help! Let your hairs character show by also letting it dry naturally too.

You have found us phew! Welcome, read around and ask questions, its a fun and friendly place to be! x

Just looked at your hair photo, it looks lovely but dye and heat as in blow drying and straightening will disguise damage and hide your hairs true condition, its ok to do this once in a while, i do it about 3 times a year, i also highlight and have no damage but if i was to use heat all the time my hair which is also very fine would snap and break too. good luck x

Fractalsofhair

November 14th, 2009, 09:23 PM

Other than heat, extensions can cause permanent baldness, and SEVERE hair damage, so if you still have them STOP!!!! Please! They are bad for your hair!

Hair spray can damage fine hair,as can dying. I once used a 10 volume peroxide dye(Very mild dye) and blew my hair dry on cool/warm for 1 month. It started breaking off 1 inch from my scalp, and I had to get a pixie to save it.

Under ideal conditions, hair only grows 1/2 inch per month, sadly. However, you may be lucky! My hair grows a good inch per month, and I think a few board members here have gotten up to two inches on non damaged hair.

".i dont understand why the thin parts and broken parts wont grow..itsbeen like this for so long while the rest of my hair grows.." That to me speaks that you're having breakage. Trim those parts only, and baby them. NO FLATIRONING!!! No blowdrying. No hairspray. Use only a wide toothed comb. Avoid putting dye on it. (Also, just a friendly reminder, do try to use proper spelling and grammar. If you have a disability or something, it's fine! We understand. Yours is able to be read, and I know I can't spell tons of words. Just, proper capitalization goes a long way towards being able to understand what you're saying.)

Look into a deposit only dye, manic panic makes a black hair dye, and henna will give you a lovely red tint if you want to cover grays.(Be warned. Henna lasts forever. No amount of bleaching can get it out. You can't dye over it really that well either.)

In terms of getting an even curl, I'd suggest pin curls, or wrapping your hair. Are the longer parts your natural hair or extensions? If the longer parts are extensions, then that would explain why they're not acting like your real hair. I have very fine hair myself, and a ton of it, and it doesn't curl evenly. Some days my hair corkscrews, the next day it's pin straight. Sometimes it poofs up and looks to be in the 4 range, or a very brushed out 3. Nothing I do really changes it. And it breaks easily as well! XD Tis not fun. But, I'm working on growing my hair long, and it will grow! I had very long hair as a child, and my brother was able to get his hair to his knees without wearing it up, and he was balding at the time. So, as long as I stay away from bleach and stuff, I'm good.

Now, after berating you for your hair practices, let's get into the fun advice zone!

A leave in conditioner is GOOD!!! How often are you washing your hair? Try washing it every other day or less, and instead of using colorant protective shampoos, look for very gentle ones. Burt's Bees is a good SLS free shampoo, though a little drying. Use with a good conditioner(Or lots of VO5). Shampoo bars are my personal choice, but when my hair was very damaged, I loved Alaffia at Whole Foods(I still love it, but it's pricey. And it made my hair darker. My hair is a light natural blonde though.), it smells amazing, and is full of shea butter and oils in the conditioner. A lot of people only use conditioner on their hair, a cheap conditioner like VO5 or Suave (Naturals only. The rest have something called "Silicones" which require shampooing to remove occasionally), and only wash their hair once a week to once a month.

I'd also suggest applying oil to your hair before washing, and a VERY small amount if you want your hair to shine.

If your hair is on the longer side, you might want to wear it in a bun most of the time(Middle of your back or longer) to avoid it rubbing on seats and such, causing damage. A good way to ease into this is to braid it before bed.(If you do this when it's wet, it will give you lovely waves in the morning when you take the braid out.)

A simple deep conditioner treatment is to take your regular conditioner(I love Whole Foods 365 unscented for this. I used to have a severe fragrance allergy, and it was nice. And even now, VO5 is just too runny for what I need it for) and leave it on your dry hair for a couple of hours. I'd suggest misting your hair and putting it up in a sort of bun, and keeping tons of conditioner on it. Then, rinse it out. Do not shampoo it out.

I would suggest getting a trim every 3-6months at the most to cut off damage, unless when you touch your hair it is breaking(I got a pixie for this reason, and am growing from there). Stop the blowdrying ASAP. I understand for a modeling shoot, you might need to flat iron. But, you can always let your hair dry, and then flat iron it and curl it and such at the shoot with your hair being totally dry. Try to avoid those if they're not absolutely needed for the shoot as well. If you want more volume in your hair, you can brush curly and wavy hair. This may give you much more volume than you like, and look bad depending on your hair type. I'd suggest just combing with a widetoothed comb given that you have wavy hair. If you stop blowdrying, you might discover you have curly hair! :)

Good luck!

Elenna

November 14th, 2009, 11:19 PM

You have fine and wavy hair. Fine hair can be fragile.

It seems that your hair is breaking because of heat, handling, brushing, chemical dyes, etc.

Jojo and Fractalsofhair have given you good advice. Your hair won't be better overnight, it takes a while before your hair improves. Then you will see how well these hair techniques work.

For straighter hair, can you try gently cold-blow drying? That helps a bit with the wavies.

jera

November 15th, 2009, 01:21 AM

Gypsy

November 15th, 2009, 02:01 AM

Wait, you said you were a stylist for a year??
Can't see your pic now (hee hee) can you put pics on your profile page, maybe?

Danniekitten

November 15th, 2009, 07:23 AM

thank u all for your replies..i cant thank u enough\
i posted a pic from my last shoot.. i did curl it there..but u can see how its thin and stringy at the ends..and thesideburns part r suppose to be as long as the rest of my hair nad its likebroken just to my neck..andit frizzes sooo much..
its hard to nowblowdry or use hair spray..if i dont it puffs and the very long ends r straighter and my bangs r so long as well they hang over..i just wanted that long one length look...
i try to now blow dry and just braid it but i have to use spray gel and spray gel on the broken parts to tame it or it curls like
ringlets and puffs out end of the day.
i also have oneside of my hair line of my bangs that has a cowlick and the other part is flat..it sucks lol..so i always have to blow dry my bangspart to makesure its not flat or else oneside is puffed more..what a mess..

right now i bought aveda shampure shampoo and conditioner...i used towork with it when i was stylist..

the drug store sellls so much and i triedd so many i dunno what to use anymore..iwas going to try color conserve to save my color..i dont use black black..i use a dark brown/soft black color...i do get many greys so i haveto color no matter what...
i dont like the idea of henna..im not sure about it
so its best to try semi per colors? sorry if i seem a lil out of loop, but i didnt do alot of coloring at the salon, more cuts and styling. lol and its been a while.

for treatments i bought a few and they dont help at all..i herd coconaut oil is good.dont know where u get that..
i just dont want to make my hair flatter LOL

as for styling products..i have hundreds i bought that suck..i dunno what to use
i have to shampoo ever 3 days or i get itchy...i didnt know shampooing was that drying ...
if i showed u a pic of when iwas 21,, u would beshocked how nice my hair was...i cant seem to get it back:(

thanks again!!!

Dvips

November 15th, 2009, 08:17 AM

If your hair is extremely damaged, and the things that you are using to make it look nice and continuing to damage your hair, you may just have to choose between hair that looks good now or hair that looks good later. :shrug:

Still, if your hair is damaged (and fine) then you most likely do need to avoid using heat for the time being.

Some people have success using Aloe Vera gel (pure aloe, with no drying ingredients added) as a sort of hair styling tool to help tame flyaway hairs.

Remember, everyone's hair is different, so take the advice given here as just advice. Try to make only one or two changes at a time, so you can see what works and what doesn't... but be sure to give something a week or two before deciding that it doesn't work (unless it creates immediate disaster, of course ;) ).
A good place to start (beside avoiding heat - including hot water - and styling products that are drying) is to find a very gentle shampoo, washing gently with it after diluting it with a bit of water, followed by a nourishing conditioner, no scrubbing with a towel, and very gentle detangling with a seamless comb.
Many people benefit from "damp bunning", if your hair is long enough for it. Damp bunning just helps to keep the moisture in the hair for longer, as the hair dries more slowing in a bun (and the ends - which tend to be the driest part - are tucked inside and so get the most moisture).

In any case, good luck with your hair!

Anje

November 15th, 2009, 12:17 PM

As others have said, your use of heat and extensions jump out at me as likely culprits. I have fine, slightly wavy hair too, and if I used heat every day, I'd have to chop it off short because the heat is just way too damaging.

Chances are that if you're having lots of breakage, your hair is going to need moisture. More deep conditioning, and perhaps protein treatments, are going to help with that. Leave-in conditioners are often good, and if they leave your hair a little flat, don't apply them near the scalp. Wear your hair up more so that it doesn't matter if it's flat, and you'll also protect the ends so they won't get broken off mechanically.

As others have said, semi-permanent dyes are better for hair, particularly deposit-only dyes. The peroxide and ammonia found in more permanent colors will make your hair more fragile. Meanwhile, forget everything anyone taught you about henna in beauty school. It may not be your thing, and that's fine. However, real henna is a wonderful permanent red that does not fade, it strengthens hair. The only bad things are that it has potential to be slightly drying for some people and it's not for someone who's going to decide they don't want the color any longer.

Danniekitten

November 15th, 2009, 12:41 PM

wow... henna does sound good but the grays will always come back

i think its the shampoos i had a hard time finding..i was going to try aveda again

can someone recommend a good leave in conditioner for detangling?
i tried pantene, and all sorts of others that felt drying to me...

i once tried to just wear my hair back in a low ponytail for almost a year and it didnt do a thing..iwas trying to avoid heat..
i know i need a good cut but im just to scared..i always stuck to trimming my own hair,.
maybe i could use the blow drying holding the cool button? it would be nice if they had blowdryers that had a cool air setting lol
what products make a good treamtent for fine brittle hair?

i cant thank u all enough for all the tips..
thank u!

Fractalsofhair

November 15th, 2009, 12:53 PM

Semi perm are less dangerous than standard hairdyes, but only if you only do them as often as you would a regular hairdye. Deposit only(wash out, supposedly) hairdyes are the least damaging. You look to have very fine hair in your photo, which is similar to what I have. Dying does cause damage. Manic panic does make browns, though I haven't got a clue how good they are, and if you wanted them to be darker, mixing them with a black could be a good idea.(DO NOT BLEACH BEFORE APPLYING MANIC PANIC! That defeats the whole purpose of it being nondamaging. Leave on the manic panic for upwards of 3 hours if you want it to color hair vividly. Otherwise, it will just be a sad rinse.) BAQ(Body art quality. Ie, you can put it on your skin) henna is very good for damaged hair, esp if you're not planning on switching to your gray hair anytime soon, and if you mix it with indigo or other herbs, you could easily get a dark brown. The application is a bit strange from what I understand, you sorta apply a mud to your hair. But, it has saved many people's hair.

You can get coconut oil at whole foods, or any other grocery store for that matter. It's generally around the olive oils and other oils. It may weigh down your hair a little bit, so you might want to only apply it before you wash your hair, or on days when you're not washing your hair. As far as adding body, I know I'm going to get totally dissed here, but teasing is a good way IMO. It's less damaging than a flat iron or a curling iron. Just do be VERY careful removing it, and be careful in the amount of brushing you do over it. Use tons of conditioner(Handfuls. And I am not joking about that!) and be very slow removing it. Or, you can look into wet setting your hair with rollers. It looks pretty darn silly, but it does work. Also, braiding your hair when it's wet can give you lovely neat waves, which you might like better than other things.

In terms of the cowlick, you may just need to embrace it for when you're not modeling. Try to modify where you part your hair to avoid it from looking weird. A cowlick can give your hair more volume. Or it might just be part of your waves.

Sideburn hair(on the face side of our ears) never grows as long as the rest of our hair. The front of our hair, it appears to grow slower than the back as it has longer to grow.

Now, with your shampoo and conditioner. Try limiting shampooing to twice a week or so. That will preserve your color far more than a shampoo will. If your hair feels very dry and not at all oily after the first day or so, you can wet it and use conditioner(otherwise, avoid getting your hair wet) and only conditioner.

How long are you leaving the treatments on for? Leaving them on for 5 minutes doesn't help much. Leaving them on for 2 hours can.

To me, looking at your photo, your hair does look a little limp, like it has build up on it, but not terribly damaged. Try using a clarifying shampoo followed by a light "Cone" free conditioner(like Aveda Rosemary Mint, or VO5, or Suave Naturals. http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=2216 is a list of ones that we know of), and leave the conditioner on for a bit of extra time.

If your hair curls like ringlets and then puffs up, it means you don't have wavy hair, but curly hair! I envy curly hair! You may want to try applying a light hold hair gel(not hairspray) or something like aloe vera gel to "hold" the curl. Apply it when your hair is wet, and avoid combing/brushing your hair otherwise. Braid at the end of the day to get waves the next day, and braid again before washing.

If you have to shampoo every 3 days, only shampoo every 3 days. You might want to try only shampooing your scalp and to your neck every 3 days, and shampoo only the length if it "needs" to be shampooed to avoid it looking greasy. If you're growing out bangs, there's not much you can do except to wait.

Fractalsofhair

November 15th, 2009, 01:00 PM

Yep, grays come back, but you can always do just the roots of your hair!

Aveda isn't a horrible brand of products. I've used them and they made my hair break off. But my hair likes real soap, and conditioner. It loathes most other types of products, and I had a severe fragrance allergy for a while, so aveda made me break out in hives.

Your hair might need something called a protein treatment. I don't know of any amazing ones off the top of my head, but a protein treatment combined with a few deep moisturizing treatments might help your hair a lot.

Danniekitten

November 15th, 2009, 07:56 PM

thank u so much for the reply

well somtimes u just dont have the time for long treatments..
so i guess iwas looking for a strong kind that will help in 10 min

for shampoos, i just figured aveda did the job..i dont want to buy something im not sure of as alot of good brands cost between 15-30$
i just dont know what to try

the sideburns r broken uneven..and they used to be thicker and longer...but now its like short and since its broken in different lengths. it frizzes...the rest of my hair doesnt curl..thats why it looks awful..just the side parts curl..its so ugly like that..and if is traighten it, it puffs and eventually waves making my bangs hang as they r as long as the back of my hair..and sides puff out..omg its awful
lol

i just didnt want to cut my length off cuz i tried that before and it still grew out the same..i dunno...

thank u so much

Loviatar

November 16th, 2009, 09:08 AM

There is a protein treatment called Redken CAT spray. You put it on after shampooing, leave in for 3-5 mins and rinse off then condition. I have had good results with this. Or you could try MOP extreme protein mask which is made with black beans and avocado. Wash, leave on for 5-10 min, rinse, condition if you need to. There's also an extreme moisture version which you use the same way (but I never needed conditioner after that one). These are the only treatments I've found that work in a short time. Most things I normally leave on for an hour. Oh, Redken also makes Deep Fuel sachets for badly damaged hair, too. That's another leave-in-for-5-mins thing. Not as good as MOP for me, but not bad.

Stop using heat and extensions, as it's been said. Damaged hair does 'puff' out sometimes; my boyfriend has curly hair and using flat irons makes his neck curls puff more. He switched to using John Frieda straight ahead shampoo and conditioner and he hasnt bothered ironing his hair since.

Coconut oil will prevent protein loss and will moisturise your hair at the same time. I add a little (maybe a little fingernail full) to my wet hair after washing.

If you use products like Pantene a lot, you may have silicone build up, but don't wreck your hair further trying to get it all out in a panic - some people like silicone, others don't. Personally, I dont mind, I go back and forth between the two. If you do decide to try and get rid of build up, my clarifying routine is to use a teaspoon of baking soda and a teaspoon of clarifying shampoo (I use Tresemme deep cleansing, but anything with sulphates in should do it) mixed into about 500ml of water to dilute it. I always follow a clarifying session with a moisture treatment, something like the MOP for 10 mins or regular conditioner for about 30-60 mins.

How do you wash your hair?
Never pile your hair up on your head and scrub it with shampoo. Try putting conditioner on the length and then using shampoo only on the scalp. The suds should be strong enough to run down the length and cleanse it.

How do you brush your hair?
Never brush wet hair. Wait til it's dry. Use a decent comb, preferably one without seams, (or sand one til the seams are smooth). If you have a plastic ball-tipped brush, one with little balls on the pins, throw it out. Invest in something like a Denman brush (the handbag size D5s are about £5 here ($10ish).

also, when you dry your hair never rub it with a towel. You can wrap the towel round and leave it for a while though. I tend to wrap for about 10 mins then let my hair down to be air dried.

Dye
Manic Panic makes a dark brown dye called Nefertiti. You could mix it with their Raven Black so long as you used the same ratio every time. Or you could look into switching to something like Herbatint or Robert Craig gentle dyes. There is a member here who uses Robert Craig black with no ill effects. If you know you want to stay black, permanently, I'd advise something like the black henna & indigo mixes from Mehandi.com or Rainbow Henna in black.

Hope that helps.

Danniekitten

November 16th, 2009, 05:59 PM

thanks alot!!!

i found a shampoo that has natural oils likecoconunt, avacado,,, im hoping it wont be to moisturizing for me..
im going to try to not blow dry at all..and just braid my hair..and maybe tie it in a low pony for a while..i just worry that will damage my hair tooo

i have alot of babyhairs i need to slick back..i hear hairspray damages..
i could try gel on dry hair...
i hate to use it, but the hairs puff out lol
i brush my hair from bottom to top as i was tought in school and i never rub my hair in the shower
it gets tangled as soonas it gets wet..so i have to be carful..
iguess ill try a semi dye next time...

thank u again very much!

missy60

November 16th, 2009, 08:40 PM

You have got a lot of good advice! I would definately get a protein treatment and use it. When I had alot of breakage I got Aphoghee and it really helped with the breakage. I also applied coconut oil pretty heavy before every wash. I didnt get it on the roots I just applied it on my length. You need to make sure anything you tie your hair up with doesnt have metal or any sharp things on them. Check your combs and brushes also for rough edges, because these could been shredding your hair.

Anje

November 16th, 2009, 08:56 PM

Gel is often helpful, and often fairly hair safe. Avoid stuff with alcohol (ethanol, isopropanol, SD Alcohol, etc), since it can be drying. Lots of folks here like aloe vera gel (go for the clear stuff that says it's pure/100% aloe gel, since you don't need the sunburn pain killers), and it gives a nice light hold.

One thing I'll recommend for moisture is a treatment called an "SMT", which was invented by an LHCer. Mix 4 parts conditioner (even something like Suave) with 1 part honey and 1 part aloe gel. Mix it up and heat it up a bit in the microwave. Apply to the hair, put on a shower cap and maybe a heat cap or warm hat, and leave it on for something like an hour. Keep a towel handy, because it's known to drip a bit. Rinse it out really well, and your hair should feel a lot more moisturized.

Danniekitten

November 17th, 2009, 07:25 AM

thanks so much
i need to stop with the hairsprey

i get addicted since i know it really hold those baby hairs that stick out when i tie it back..