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Konstifik
July 19th, 2009, 02:21 PM
Hello everyone!
First, let me apologise for eventual grammatical errors. English is not my main language, and I consider the grammar to be very weird. :P

Now, my hair is smooth and shiny. Almost too smooth, making it hard to do some up-do's. However, this is not my main problem;
my hair is also very thin and fragile. One evil stare and it breaks. The ends are almost always split, even after trimming. And, no matter how long I gently comb it, it always "sticks together" with the rest of the hair. I can't lift one strand of hair without having half of the hair clinging to it. Which confuses me, since as I said, my hair is too smooth for some up-do's.
It's like it has no body or weight. I never wear it down because it doesn't fall neatly on my back, but flies around like leaves in a storm.

The hair has just passed my shoulder. I started growing my hair when it was cut to just below my ears. And this was almost 10 years ago, so not only is my hair acting weird, it also grow extremely slow.

Even my scalp has problems. I currently got something itchy at the back of my head that doesn't want to stop itching. I get dandruff very easy too.

I try to wash it as gently as possible, no more than 3 times a week. I use Urtekram's schampoo with rosemarine, and Urtekram's aloe vera conditioner. I do treatments sometimes with honey and jojoba-oil, and various other ingedients. Never chemicals, never spray, never mousse or anything like that.
I do dye my hair with henna, which has helped a little with the hair-problems, but not much.

I eat Silicea (http://www.silicea.com/se/index.php?locale=en), vitamins and omega 3 everyday, do work-outs at the gym (okay, been slacking a bit this summer :P) and consider myself healthy. My nails are growing superfast and looks great, and my skin is doing fine too, and I can't for the life of me understand why my hair is acting like this.
It saddens me alot, since I've always dreamt of a loooong beautiful hair. :(

So, what on earth should I do with my hair? Am I lacking something important? Any tips on what kind of treatments I should be looking at? Any tips at all would be very appreciated. :D

Sorry if I've made myself unclear on any part of the text. It's kind of hard to tell what I mean...

Toadstool
July 19th, 2009, 02:48 PM
I would just like to say your English is amazing! You express yourself beautifully.

theshadowpuppet
July 19th, 2009, 02:57 PM
Your English is just about flawless, no need to worry. Even as a native speaker, I agree, the grammar is strange.

Some people just have very slippery hair that is also fine.. This is how mine, and a lot of scandinavian hair, is. Do you ever leave a bit of oil in your hair? Even a small amount will provide protection for your ends and help against splits.

You may also want to search for the thread on 'catnip for split ends'.

LZYJO
July 19th, 2009, 04:29 PM
Your English is perfect! I was always terrible at foreign languages, I know becuase people never understood what I was saying. :).

It seems like your hair may need protein. It could be responsible for the hairs "sticking" to each other. Try adding more protein to your diet, beans and legumes are great for that. You also can do a stretch test, take one stand of hair from your comb or somewhere, grab it securely (I usually wrap my fingers around the ends) and stretch it until it breaks. Healthy hair should stretch a little and then break. Dry hair snaps without breaking, and hair lacking protein stretches. Eggs, or mayo may also help, as deep treatments.

Konstifik
July 20th, 2009, 03:25 AM
Your English is just about flawless, no need to worry. Even as a native speaker, I agree, the grammar is strange.

Some people just have very slippery hair that is also fine.. This is how mine, and a lot of scandinavian hair, is. Do you ever leave a bit of oil in your hair? Even a small amount will provide protection for your ends and help against splits.

You may also want to search for the thread on 'catnip for split ends'.

Thanks! :)

Yes, I leave in jojoba-oil about 3 times a week, usually when the hair is semi-dry (seems like it's most oil-absorbant then). I did see that thread, and I got very inspired. I went to the town yesterday to find catnip, but... No petstore was to be found. Anywhere. :confused:
This town is so incredibly weird.

Konstifik
July 20th, 2009, 03:32 AM
Your English is perfect! I was always terrible at foreign languages, I know becuase people never understood what I was saying. :).

It seems like your hair may need protein. It could be responsible for the hairs "sticking" to each other. Try adding more protein to your diet, beans and legumes are great for that. You also can do a stretch test, take one stand of hair from your comb or somewhere, grab it securely (I usually wrap my fingers around the ends) and stretch it until it breaks. Healthy hair should stretch a little and then break. Dry hair snaps without breaking, and hair lacking protein stretches. Eggs, or mayo may also help, as deep treatments.

Thanks! ^^

Tried to do the hair-test, but it was very hard to draw any conclusions. My hair is so thin that I can barely see the hairstrand, and so weak that it snaps by just thinking of stretching it. Seriously, I just held the two ends in my hands, held them stretched to a straight line, but not stretching them further, and it snapped. >.<
So maybe I got very dry hair then...

Teazel
July 20th, 2009, 04:36 AM
The first thing I thought of was, have you used a clarifying shampoo? I would recommend you strip away any buildup or product on your hair before you try to identify its problems.

Are there any silicones in your shampoo or conditioner?

Konstifik
July 20th, 2009, 04:52 AM
The first thing I thought of was, have you used a clarifying shampoo? I would recommend you strip away any buildup or product on your hair before you try to identify its problems.

Are there any silicones in your shampoo or conditioner?

I am not entirely sure if my hairproducts are clarifying or contain silicones. I'll write the ingredients list;

Urtekrams rosemary shampoo:

water, aloe vera, coconut and corn sugar soap, vegetable glycerine, citric acid, essential rosemary oil, herbal extract.

Urtekrams sage shampoo:

water, aloe vera, coconut and corn sugar soap, vegetable glycerine, citric acid, essential sage oil, herbal extract.

Urtekrams aloe vera conditioner:

water, aloe vera, coconut oil products, vegetable glycerine, apricot kernel oil, shea butter, citric acid, guar polysaccharide, citrus seed extract, orange and lemongrass oil.

The treatment I use sometimes a few minutes in my hair is Lush's Retread:

Agar seaweed infusion, soya milk, ppropylene glycol, cantaloupe melon, yogurt, cetearyl alcohol & sodium lauryl sulfate, olive oil, avocado oil, perfume, lanolin, cetrimonium bromide, cetearyl alcohol, jojoba oil, musk, violet leaf absolute, orange blossom absolute, neroli oil.


None of them contain acetic acid, so I don't think they're clarifying... I don't know if the leave anything in the hair either.

Teazel
July 20th, 2009, 05:32 AM
Well, those sound harmless - why can't I get them in New Zealand?! :wink:

Okay, you probably don't need to use a clarifying shampoo (which strips away all products from hair); unless someone else can spot something in your ingredients list that can leave a residue.

It sounds to me like your hair needs more moisture. I'll be watching this thread with interest, because my hair tends to be dry and flyaway, too. :)

Konstifik
July 20th, 2009, 06:06 AM
Well, those sound harmless - why can't I get them in New Zealand?! :wink:

Okay, you probably don't need to use a clarifying shampoo (which strips away all products from hair); unless someone else can spot something in your ingredients list that can leave a residue.

It sounds to me like your hair needs more moisture. I'll be watching this thread with interest, because my hair tends to be dry and flyaway, too. :)

Hehe, maybe you can order them on the web. I know that at least Lush has a webshop. :)

Yeah, maybe that is the problem. Though I don't know any good moisture treatments. I'll wait some more for an answer to all lifes problems... hairproblems at least. :D

Fethenwen
July 20th, 2009, 07:59 AM
Oh oh! Have you tried CO:ing? Your hair sounds quite like mine before I discovered LHC and shampooed my hair a lot.
At least in my case, not using shampoo doubles the size of my head :D Is good for the scalp, and does wonders for my hair quality in overall.
Urtekram products are really good :) I love the aloe vera conditioner, I usually use it just on my ends for extra moisture.

Curlsgirl
July 20th, 2009, 08:50 AM
I would also suggest a good oil leave-in to help seal moisture in. Coconut oil is my favorite. I would use it while your hair is still damp, just a pinch, you can always use more if you need it. Have you heard of an SMT? That is short for "Snowy's moisture treatment". It involves a cone-free conditioner mixed with some honey and clear aloe vera gel. I leave the honey out because it dries my hair out but you would have to experiement. You just mix it up and heat it up (not TOO hot) and slather it all over your hair and leave it for at least an hour prefereable under a heat cap of some kind. It is incredibly moisturizing. Other than that you could also try a moisturizing leave-in conditioner of some kind like Biolage conditioning balm or Beauty Without Cruelty leave-in. Your hair should NOT break that easily when stretched. That definitely signals a lack of moisture.

Other than that, some people just have "floating" hair. Spidermom who is a long-time member here has that and it's not for lack of healthy hair for sure! You might just have to deal with some of those qualities about your hair. We all have SOME kind of issue we would rather not have I think!

GoddesJourney
July 20th, 2009, 09:22 AM
My fine-haired friends have often complained about similar problems. If you're really that healthy and your hair "isn't growing" you may want to consider your damage factors. Fine hair damages very easily. My house-mate (who looks just like your avatar) complained that her hair never passes APL. She is very healthy, eats almost exclusively organic food, excercises daily, uses only organic shampoos and conditioners, etc. I started watching her hair care routine and it's no wonder her hair doesn't get long. As it turns out, her hair actually does grow at an average rate. However, it get's dry/damaged and breaks off before too long. She wears a ponytail in the same spot with an elastic that is definately not smooth enough for her fine hair. She washes daily and uses a fine-toothed plastic comb that rips her hair.

My point is, you should check into what you're doing that's damaging. You're doing everything right to make it grow from what I can see. First, take a look at your elastics. You may need to make some silk ones if you really want your hair to grow. You may also look into a silk pillowcase. I used one for about a month and had beautiful results (especially with the little fine hairs at my temples and around my face). I stopped using it to see what would happen and I noticed a lot of breakage again. Also, I feel my hair doesn't get dry at night with a silk pillowcase. Next, take a look at your comb. Is it a wide-toothed comb? Is it seemless? You might want to take some really fine sand paper to the seem on your comb if you have one. It could be adding friction and therefore damage and flyaway to your delicate hair. As it gets longer, you may want to braid it at night to keep it from tangling. I usually do this and it keeps me pretty happy.

Konstifik
July 20th, 2009, 10:06 AM
My fine-haired friends have often complained about similar problems. If you're really that healthy and your hair "isn't growing" you may want to consider your damage factors. Fine hair damages very easily. My house-mate (who looks just like your avatar) complained that her hair never passes APL. She is very healthy, eats almost exclusively organic food, excercises daily, uses only organic shampoos and conditioners, etc. I started watching her hair care routine and it's no wonder her hair doesn't get long. As it turns out, her hair actually does grow at an average rate. However, it get's dry/damaged and breaks off before too long. She wears a ponytail in the same spot with an elastic that is definately not smooth enough for her fine hair. She washes daily and uses a fine-toothed plastic comb that rips her hair.

My point is, you should check into what you're doing that's damaging. You're doing everything right to make it grow from what I can see. First, take a look at your elastics. You may need to make some silk ones if you really want your hair to grow. You may also look into a silk pillowcase. I used one for about a month and had beautiful results (especially with the little fine hairs at my temples and around my face). I stopped using it to see what would happen and I noticed a lot of breakage again. Also, I feel my hair doesn't get dry at night with a silk pillowcase. Next, take a look at your comb. Is it a wide-toothed comb? Is it seemless? You might want to take some really fine sand paper to the seem on your comb if you have one. It could be adding friction and therefore damage and flyaway to your delicate hair. As it gets longer, you may want to braid it at night to keep it from tangling. I usually do this and it keeps me pretty happy.

Yes, gentle elastics are important. However, finding good-quality elastics here is like finding a spaceship in your refigerator. :P The best one I've found is kind of soft and with no metal.
As for the pillowcase, it's about the same. I didn't found any pillowcase made of silk, but with carefully treated cotton that's much smoother than ordinary cotton-pillowcases.
I used to wear my hair in a braid during sleep, but I move alot in my sleep, which resultet in a braid ripped apart. Now I wear my hair in a half-ponytail at the very top of my head, as close to the forehead as possible, with better results.
Regarding the comb, it's a wooden comb made of one piece and wide-toothed, I don't think it's that damaged yet, since it's fairly new. But I will check it often in case it has started to damage my hair. :)

I don't think there's much damage done to my hair, but it do grow slow. Both me and my boyfriend dyes our hair with henna, and by the time he has so much new, undyed hair (several centimeters) that he has to henna it again, my hair has grown at most 1 centimeter.

Thank you very much for all your tips. Do you by any chance know where to get soft and silky elastics and pillowcases, that aren't too expensive, on the web? If so, please share! :D

Konstifik
July 20th, 2009, 10:10 AM
I would also suggest a good oil leave-in to help seal moisture in. Coconut oil is my favorite. I would use it while your hair is still damp, just a pinch, you can always use more if you need it. Have you heard of an SMT? That is short for "Snowy's moisture treatment". It involves a cone-free conditioner mixed with some honey and clear aloe vera gel. I leave the honey out because it dries my hair out but you would have to experiement. You just mix it up and heat it up (not TOO hot) and slather it all over your hair and leave it for at least an hour prefereable under a heat cap of some kind. It is incredibly moisturizing. Other than that you could also try a moisturizing leave-in conditioner of some kind like Biolage conditioning balm or Beauty Without Cruelty leave-in. Your hair should NOT break that easily when stretched. That definitely signals a lack of moisture.

Other than that, some people just have "floating" hair. Spidermom who is a long-time member here has that and it's not for lack of healthy hair for sure! You might just have to deal with some of those qualities about your hair. We all have SOME kind of issue we would rather not have I think!

That treatment sounds very nice! I'll definatly try it out sometime. :)
Is it possible to heat it up in a microwave?

Yeah, I can deal with my floating hair, it's nice sometimes. I just wish it weren't to fragile and clingy, like it's made out of frozen spiderweb or something, heh. ^^

Thanks for the tip!

Fethenwen
July 20th, 2009, 10:11 AM
I think the smoother cotton pillowcase should do just fine, it's called satin right? I'm concidering buying one myself.

Konstifik
July 20th, 2009, 10:17 AM
Oh oh! Have you tried CO:ing? Your hair sounds quite like mine before I discovered LHC and shampooed my hair a lot.
At least in my case, not using shampoo doubles the size of my head :D Is good for the scalp, and does wonders for my hair quality in overall.
Urtekram products are really good :) I love the aloe vera conditioner, I usually use it just on my ends for extra moisture.

Yeah, I tried CO:ing a while, but it didn't work well in my case. The scalp turned out to be the biggest party-place ever for dandruff. :P
Or maybe I should try it with different conditioners, in case that was the problem.
How long did you try CO:ing until you got a result? First time? After a week? A year? A millenia? :D

Konstifik
July 20th, 2009, 10:20 AM
I think the smoother cotton pillowcase should do just fine, it's called satin right? I'm concidering buying one myself.

It was even smoother than satin (but not a lot). I haven't used it alot yet, so I can't write a review. But I don't think it could be worse than ordinary cotton. :)

Renbirde
July 20th, 2009, 11:10 AM
I am not entirely sure if my hairproducts are clarifying or contain silicones. I'll write the ingredients list;

<snip>

The treatment I use sometimes a few minutes in my hair is Lush's Retread:

Agar seaweed infusion, soya milk, ppropylene glycol, cantaloupe melon, yogurt, cetearyl alcohol & sodium lauryl sulfate, olive oil, avocado oil, perfume, lanolin, cetrimonium bromide, cetearyl alcohol, jojoba oil, musk, violet leaf absolute, orange blossom absolute, neroli oil.

None of them contain acetic acid, so I don't think they're clarifying... I don't know if the leave anything in the hair either.

Sodium Laureth Sulfate, Sodium Laurel Sulfate, and Ammonium Laurel Sulfate are all fairly harsh soaps. The SLS is far enough down the ingredients list here, however, that it may not have a strong clarifying effect.

All of these shampoos and conditioners are cone-free. :D

For future reference, you can spot cones by the endings –cone, -conol, and –xane. Some common ones are Dimethicone, Dimethiconol, Phenyl Trimethicone, Amodimethicone, Cyclomethicone, and Cyclopentasiloxane. These all leave buildup. However if you see a cone with PEG- or PPG- in front of it, don't worry. It's been modified so it's water soluble and will wash right out. :p


ETA: Are you sure you have dandruff?

Dandruff is greasy, stinky, and yellow, not dry, flaky, and white. If you have flakies, you might have dry scalp. You could also be leaving in some of your conditioner. I didn't know how long conditioner takes to wash out for years, and I always had major flakies. I now take a few extra minutes to wash, and the flakies are gone. *Parties*

Konstifik
July 20th, 2009, 11:26 AM
Sodium Laureth Sulfate, Sodium Laurel Sulfate, and Ammonium Laurel Sulfate are all fairly harsh soaps. The SLS is far enough down the ingredients list here, however, that it may not have a strong clarifying effect.

All of these shampoos and conditioners are cone-free. :D

For future reference, you can spot cones by the endings –cone, -conol, and –xane. Some common ones are Dimethicone, Dimethiconol, Phenyl Trimethicone, Amodimethicone, Cyclomethicone, and Cyclopentasiloxane. These all leave buildup. However if you see a cone with PEG- or PPG- in front of it, don't worry. It's been modified so it's water soluble and will wash right out. :p


ETA: Are you sure you have dandruff?

Dandruff is greasy, stinky, and yellow, not dry, flaky, and white. If you have flakies, you might have dry scalp. You could also be leaving in some of your conditioner. I didn't know how long conditioner takes to wash out for years, and I always had major flakies. I now take a few extra minutes to wash, and the flakies are gone. *Parties*

Aah, thank you for the cone-help! Didn't knew that :)
Yes, I'm trying my best to avoid sulfates, but they're so common, making it a bit of a challenge. But as you said, it's not at the top 3 ingredients as it usually is, and it's nothin I use every wash, so I thought I could give it a try.

So that's the dandruff? Oh... Then I have both dandruff and dry scalp. >.<
ut lately not much of a dandruff, though very dry scalp.
So it's time to increase the moisturizing then! Good, now I got something to go at, instead of guessing wildly what the solution could be.

Niphredil
July 20th, 2009, 11:52 AM
Yeah, I tried CO:ing a while, but it didn't work well in my case. The scalp turned out to be the biggest party-place ever for dandruff. :P
Or maybe I should try it with different conditioners, in case that was the problem.
How long did you try CO:ing until you got a result? First time? After a week? A year? A millenia? :D

I'm not Fethenwen though, but I can tell you about my CO experience.
I'm not ultra fine haired like you, but my hair does seem to resemble a spiders web and needs be treated carefully. I really need to moisturize my hair, and add in a protein treatment every now and then so the moisture actually has something to cling to.

Well, onto the CO experience. I have tried CO when I became a member here about 6 years ago. And it didn't work. I couldn't get my hair clean, it became a bigger mess than it was before and my scalp acted up with flakes, itches and even pimples !
But, there are a few different approaches to CO washing out there.

HTH (hope that helps) and judging by your avatar, your hair looks great !

- The LHC-style involving a lot of conditioner and keeping it on your hair for a long time.
- The Curly Girl style involving just a teaspoon (!) of conditioner

to name a few. As a wurly/curly I tried the Curly Girl method a few years later and again I couldn't get my hair clean, I lost handfuls of hair during washing and my hair generally felt just yuck.

Then recently I have been giving CO another try. Meanwhile I have cut my hair several times and my hair is really healthy and almost virgin now but I had been using silicones when it was still shorter and I wanted to stop using them and needed something else to tame my hair.

What I do now is: I pour some (coneless) conditioner in my palm and distribute it with the fingertips of my other hand onto my scalp. I usually have enough to cover my scalp but I just get some more if I need to. I then massage the conditioner into my scalp really well but try to be careful to not mess up my hair too much. I leave it there for a minute or two (no more than 5), add some more water, massage again and then rinse thoroughly. This is what I now consider my washing step. If my hair still feels greasy, I just repeat, although that isn't necessary most of the time. I might or might not continue with a conditioning step, which I usually do by putting more conditioner on the length and let that sit while washing my body and then rinse. After washing, I apply some oil to the length, and add to that between washings.

Finally I get my scalp and hair clean with CO, my hair has calmed down a lot which I think is because it is much better moisturized now and I have considerably less tangles too! So, it took me 6 years to try and tweak my own method.

I guess what I want to say with all this is: CO will do wonders for moisturizing hair so really worth a try, but you might need to tweak your method if it doesn't work right away. I use cheap conditioner only (local brands) that are not too heavy and just wash when I feel like it, every day even sometimes (I don't feel the CO washing does damage in itself and my hair is easy to handle when wet, it might even add more moisture).

Oh, and doing CO my style has even reduced the amount of time I need to wash my hair!

Konstifik
July 20th, 2009, 12:05 PM
I'm not Fethenwen though, but I can tell you about my CO experience.
I'm not ultra fine haired like you, but my hair does seem to resemble a spiders web and needs be treated carefully. I really need to moisturize my hair, and add in a protein treatment every now and then so the moisture actually has something to cling to.

Well, onto the CO experience. I have tried CO when I became a member here about 6 years ago. And it didn't work. I couldn't get my hair clean, it became a bigger mess than it was before and my scalp acted up with flakes, itches and even pimples !
But, there are a few different approaches to CO washing out there.

HTH (hope that helps) and judging by your avatar, your hair looks great !

- The LHC-style involving a lot of conditioner and keeping it on your hair for a long time.
- The Curly Girl style involving just a teaspoon (!) of conditioner

to name a few. As a wurly/curly I tried the Curly Girl method a few years later and again I couldn't get my hair clean, I lost handfuls of hair during washing and my hair generally felt just yuck.

Then recently I have been giving CO another try. Meanwhile I have cut my hair several times and my hair is really healthy and almost virgin now but I had been using silicones when it was still shorter and I wanted to stop using them and needed something else to tame my hair.

What I do now is: I pour some (coneless) conditioner in my palm and distribute it with the fingertips of my other hand onto my scalp. I usually have enough to cover my scalp but I just get some more if I need to. I then massage the conditioner into my scalp really well but try to be careful to not mess up my hair too much. I leave it there for a minute or two (no more than 5), add some more water, massage again and then rinse thoroughly. This is what I now consider my washing step. If my hair still feels greasy, I just repeat, although that isn't necessary most of the time. I might or might not continue with a conditioning step, which I usually do by putting more conditioner on the length and let that sit while washing my body and then rinse. After washing, I apply some oil to the length, and add to that between washings.

Finally I get my scalp and hair clean with CO, my hair has calmed down a lot which I think is because it is much better moisturized now and I have considerably less tangles too! So, it took me 6 years to try and tweak my own method.

I guess what I want to say with all this is: CO will do wonders for moisturizing hair so really worth a try, but you might need to tweak your method if it doesn't work right away. I use cheap conditioner only (local brands) that are not too heavy and just wash when I feel like it, every day even sometimes (I don't feel the CO washing does damage in itself and my hair is easy to handle when wet, it might even add more moisture).

Oh, and doing CO my style has even reduced the amount of time I need to wash my hair!

Thank you for replying! I'm glad your hair turned out well and moisturized :D
Seems like a nice method. Maybe I should give it another shot and tweak it myself. I'm very fond of the aloe vera conditioner by Urtekram, so I wouldn't mind using more of it. :)
Do you have any recommendation for protein treatment?

Curlsgirl
July 20th, 2009, 01:01 PM
That treatment sounds very nice! I'll definatly try it out sometime. :)
Is it possible to heat it up in a microwave?

Thanks for the tip!Oh yeah that is what I do but only for a few seconds and then check because if it is too hot it will burn scalp and you and sometimes make the mixture weird!

Also, if your hair is breaking that easily when you try to stretch it it is a problem with lack of elasticity so I would not try extra protein but extra moisture. Moisture is usually the problem unless you have chemically treated hair, not always but usually.

Niphredil
July 20th, 2009, 01:38 PM
Yeah, I tried CO:ing a while, but it didn't work well in my case. The scalp turned out to be the biggest party-place ever for dandruff. :P
Or maybe I should try it with different conditioners, in case that was the problem.
How long did you try CO:ing until you got a result? First time? After a week? A year? A millenia? :D


Thank you for replying! I'm glad your hair turned out well and moisturized :D
Seems like a nice method. Maybe I should give it another shot and tweak it myself. I'm very fond of the aloe vera conditioner by Urtekram, so I wouldn't mind using more of it. :)
Do you have any recommendation for protein treatment?
I had a bottle of protein conditioner (Nivea brand) that I used for it but I just finished it. I'm looking to try cassia as a protein shot now. I used to use henna (pure and glosses) but I don't want the red anymore.
I know my hair likes some protein now and then because it always looked wonderful after a wash with an egg-shampoo (local brand Andrelon) but not if I used it a few times in a row. Really trial and error, same as with CO washings.

I tend to think that method matters more than product, although a wrong product can obviously also lead to inferior results.

I'm curious what will happen if you give CO another try ;) I just couldn't rinse it all out if I used too much, making my hair sticky and yucky. For me, it has to feel coated but not soaked.

Konstifik
July 20th, 2009, 01:39 PM
Oh yeah that is what I do but only for a few seconds and then check because if it is too hot it will burn scalp and you and sometimes make the mixture weird!

Also, if your hair is breaking that easily when you try to stretch it it is a problem with lack of elasticity so I would not try extra protein but extra moisture. Moisture is usually the problem unless you have chemically treated hair, not always but usually.

Neat! I'll buy some ingredients next time I visit the town. :)

I'm going to look into extra-mosturizing products then. Thanks for all your help!

Konstifik
July 20th, 2009, 01:54 PM
I had a bottle of protein conditioner (Nivea brand) that I used for it but I just finished it. I'm looking to try cassia as a protein shot now. I used to use henna (pure and glosses) but I don't want the red anymore.
I know my hair likes some protein now and then because it always looked wonderful after a wash with an egg-shampoo (local brand Andrelon) but not if I used it a few times in a row. Really trial and error, same as with CO washings.

I tend to think that method matters more than product, although a wrong product can obviously also lead to inferior results.

I'm curious what will happen if you give CO another try ;) I just couldn't rinse it all out if I used too much, making my hair sticky and yucky. For me, it has to feel coated but not soaked.

I'm going to try CO:ing tomorrow morning. Maybe try adding some honey in the conditioner? I've heard people getting shiny, soft hair by doing that.
Will report how it all went. :D

Teazel
July 20th, 2009, 08:07 PM
Oh yes, definitely try adding honey to your conditioner - it's made an enormous difference to my hair. :bowtome:

I find the easiest method is to just massage in a tablespoon of runny honey after I've applied conditioner to the length. (I also then apply a teaspoon of aloe vera gel, which makes it an SMT treatment, but I only leave it on for 5 to 10 minutes. I get no extra benefit from leaving it on longer.)

Konstifik
July 21st, 2009, 12:40 AM
Oh yes, definitely try adding honey to your conditioner - it's made an enormous difference to my hair. :bowtome:

I find the easiest method is to just massage in a tablespoon of runny honey after I've applied conditioner to the length. (I also then apply a teaspoon of aloe vera gel, which makes it an SMT treatment, but I only leave it on for 5 to 10 minutes. I get no extra benefit from leaving it on longer.)

Honey it is then! Now I'm off to do the first CO-wash. :)

Charlize
July 21st, 2009, 02:13 AM
Well, those sound harmless - why can't I get them in New Zealand?! :wink:

Okay, you probably don't need to use a clarifying shampoo (which strips away all products from hair); unless someone else can spot something in your ingredients list that can leave a residue.

It sounds to me like your hair needs more moisture. I'll be watching this thread with interest, because my hair tends to be dry and flyaway, too. :)

Teazel,

Urtekram are Danish products, but I found a Danish site with international shipping and you can chose 'English' instead of the page being in Danish :-)

The first link displays Urtekram's products and the second a webshop and the third links to shipping info, i.e. charges and so on.

http://www.urtekram.dk/english/
http://www.naturoghelse.dk/shop/urtekram-154c1.html
http://www.naturoghelse.dk/shop/cms-3.html

Teazel
July 21st, 2009, 02:36 AM
Thanks for that, Charlize! I'll check it out. :)

Charlize
July 21st, 2009, 02:57 AM
Thanks for that, Charlize! I'll check it out. :)

Your welcome

Konstifik
July 23rd, 2009, 11:30 AM
Status report of the CO-washings:
I'm not sure of this method... I've had two showers with CO now, last one today, and my hair feels a bit greasy. The method is a mixed technique of three CO-users: First two minute scalp-massage with conditioner, rinse, then an hour of conditioner and honey, rinse.
I've tried to rinse as well as possible so no condition is left, and the hair feels soft and smooth the first couple of hours after the wash, but quickly gets greasy all over the hair and scalp. Not very greasy, but still.
Should I edit my CO-method in some way, keep on doingit as it is now in case better results are on the way, or discontinue?

Charlize
July 23rd, 2009, 02:27 PM
Status report of the CO-washings:
I'm not sure of this method... I've had two showers with CO now, last one today, and my hair feels a bit greasy. The method is a mixed technique of three CO-users: First two minute scalp-massage with conditioner, rinse, then an hour of conditioner and honey, rinse.
I've tried to rinse as well as possible so no condition is left, and the hair feels soft and smooth the first couple of hours after the wash, but quickly gets greasy all over the hair and scalp. Not very greasy, but still.
Should I edit my CO-method in some way, keep on doingit as it is now in case better results are on the way, or discontinue?

Hi Konstifik :-)

When I first started CO-ing I was using a very moisturizing conditioner on both my scalp and ends. Then I searched the 'CO only' thread and found that some people have positive results when using a lighter conditioner (perhaps a volumizing conditioner) on their scalp and then a more heavy conditioner on the ends. It has worked out for me that way....

BTW - Love the Urtekram products!!!

Konstifik
July 23rd, 2009, 11:46 PM
Hi Konstifik :-)

When I first started CO-ing I was using a very moisturizing conditioner on both my scalp and ends. Then I searched the 'CO only' thread and found that some people have positive results when using a lighter conditioner (perhaps a volumizing conditioner) on their scalp and then a more heavy conditioner on the ends. It has worked out for me that way....

BTW - Love the Urtekram products!!!

Urtekram rocks! :D

I tried to use Urtekram's aloe vera conditioner on the scalp, and Lush Retread + honey on the length (and scalp) after the first rinse.
Is that too heavy for the scalp? And the hair? Because it's not just my scalp that get greasy, but the hair itself too.

Niphredil
July 24th, 2009, 04:43 AM
I'm not sure about the Urtekram conditioner for CO washing as I have never used it.
I found that while my hair needs moisture, it doesn't need endless conditioning treatments. For me, just a quick CO wash followed with a few minutes of conditioner will do better than letting it sit for hours.

I had some greasies too lately and did a vinegar rinse last wash which seemed to have cleared it up again. When I first started CO again, it was also a lot harder to get it clean. I did the massaging twice (just like the commercial slogan 'rinse and repeat' ) and that really helped getting it clean. I know how my roots feel when they are clean while washing, and if that's not yet the case after rinsing, I apply conditioner for a second round. One's scalp does need some time to adjust and this helped me through that period.

I think, unless you have horrible results, that it is best to try a given method for about a month. If it won't work, return to your best alternative to give your hair and scalp a break. See also Ursula's Article 'Standard Newbie Advice' which has a wonderful paragraph about experimenting with changing your routine.

Charlize
July 24th, 2009, 04:44 AM
Urtekram rocks! :D

I tried to use Urtekram's aloe vera conditioner on the scalp, and Lush Retread + honey on the length (and scalp) after the first rinse.
Is that too heavy for the scalp? And the hair? Because it's not just my scalp that get greasy, but the hair itself too.

From what I've gathered, Urtekram's aloe vera shamp. and cond. are the most moisturizing of the whole line. So maybe the other one (Rose) that you use could be good? But there's also the Hawthorn Shampoo + conditioner for oily hair, the Nettle Shampoo and conditioner for dandruff as well as the brown sugar line, which adds volume to your hair. Depending on your hair + scalp problems one of these might be worth trying:-)
For Co-ing I use the brown sugar conditioner as it's not that heavy and doesn't weigh my hair down. But I use the aloe vera line for my length as well as when I shampoo my hair :-)

Konstifik
July 24th, 2009, 11:18 AM
I'm not sure about the Urtekram conditioner for CO washing as I have never used it.
I found that while my hair needs moisture, it doesn't need endless conditioning treatments. For me, just a quick CO wash followed with a few minutes of conditioner will do better than letting it sit for hours.

I had some greasies too lately and did a vinegar rinse last wash which seemed to have cleared it up again. When I first started CO again, it was also a lot harder to get it clean. I did the massaging twice (just like the commercial slogan 'rinse and repeat' ) and that really helped getting it clean. I know how my roots feel when they are clean while washing, and if that's not yet the case after rinsing, I apply conditioner for a second round. One's scalp does need some time to adjust and this helped me through that period.

I think, unless you have horrible results, that it is best to try a given method for about a month. If it won't work, return to your best alternative to give your hair and scalp a break. See also Ursula's Article 'Standard Newbie Advice' which has a wonderful paragraph about experimenting with changing your routine.

Thanks for the tip! Will check it out. :)

Konstifik
July 24th, 2009, 11:20 AM
From what I've gathered, Urtekram's aloe vera shamp. and cond. are the most moisturizing of the whole line. So maybe the other one (Rose) that you use could be good? But there's also the Hawthorn Shampoo + conditioner for oily hair, the Nettle Shampoo and conditioner for dandruff as well as the brown sugar line, which adds volume to your hair. Depending on your hair + scalp problems one of these might be worth trying:-)
For Co-ing I use the brown sugar conditioner as it's not that heavy and doesn't weigh my hair down. But I use the aloe vera line for my length as well as when I shampoo my hair :-)

The Urtekram products are more limited here, at least the conditioners. I'll look for it! :)