regrets and ponderings

[Toadstool]

Okay now I have regrets. Not that I dyed out the blonde but that i dyed it blonde in the first place. I just didn't have the confidence to go grey. I felt people would think i was older than my age and no one would find me attractive any more. (not that they're queuing up now!)I also felt un-alternative.I think if my hair had been longer this would have been less of an issue. I liked whoever said Grow it to to your ankles- that will be different!
The condition doesn't feel so bad cos I slept in conditioner last night but obviously it's damaged. Now of course when the roots grow I'll have a line though less than when it's bleached as I am naturally dark (with white).
I've been wondering about henna. Can you get henna that dyes it brown rather than red or black? Also where does everyone buy this BAQ henna?We can only get one here called Spiritual Sky or something that is mixed with something else. Could I buy it online? It would need to be mixed with the right colour cos I would be clueless on doing that myself.
I'm finding that washing with very mild children's or baby shampoo makes my hair feel so much better than all the expensive salon brands I have tried. However I still need cones in my conditioner because of all the damage. I tried no-cones and it feels like straw.

[Katze]

I also grew out bleach (almost gone) and someone here told me to do SMTs with every wash, which was a BIG help to my fragile hair. If you look at my album you can see how much of a demarcation line I have almost three years after my last dye job. It took a while, but it did get less noticeable over time.

I'm not a henna head but am a henna artist and can recommend www.renaissancehenna.com in the UK for henna and other natural hair colors. Henna only 'comes in' one color - everything else is some other plant or dye mixed with henna - but Sabrina also sells cassia, indigo, and other herbal hair dyes. 'Body art Quality' simply means that the henna would be fresh enough to use on the skin - nothing more. And you can use older, not-so-fresh henna (like from your natural foods or ethnic grocery store) on hair too, provided it is pure henna - there is a lot of crap, some of it dangerous, being marketed as henna.

Here's a basic link for henna information to get you started: http://hennatribe.com/henna101.htm

Good luck, and I hope your hair keeps feeling better! :flower:

[Toadstool]

Thank you Katze. I looked up some henna sites including the ones you mentioned. The following puzzled me:

"Indigo and Henna are 100% natural hair dyes. You should note that as it contains no chemicals the colour does not last as long. How long the colour will remain in your hair depends on what you get up to, how many times you wash your hair and so on. Therefore it is impossible for us to state will last xxx amount of weeks! "
http://www.henna-boy.co.uk/shop/natural-red-light-brown-brown-dark-brown-henna-hair-dye/300g-brunette-natural-henna-hair-dye/prod_66.php
I'm confused - I thought henna WAS permanent??

[Unofficial_Rose]

Just echoing Katze, in a way.

I've been where you are in that I had bleached highlights over darkish brown (with grey) hair. This was last October. A mix of henna and indigo will give you brown and blend in the colours so well you won't see the demarcation between the blonde and the regrowth.

It'll also help the condition considerably. I'd made several failed attempts to go back to brown before I found henndigo to ease the transition! However, you cannot subsequently bleach over indigo if you want a few highlights - it'll go green. (As I know from personal experience, sigh. :rolleyes:)

And henna is very, very hard to get out of your hair as a number of threads on here will confirm, so I'm not sure why Hennaboy is saying that. Especially as he sells BAQ, which is as permanent as it gets.

[Toadstool]

So if I put henna without indigo onto my hair which is dyed dark brown over bleach, would it come out orange or just give it reddish overtones? And if I continued to henna it when the grey grows in, would the grey turn orange??
How does henna improve the condition of your hair? How long should I wait after chemical dye?
I am just so fed up with my hair at the moment. I have never managed to get chemical dye to look either healthy or natural. It is too short to put up and forget about it!!

[Calista]

Toadstool, whatever you do, do a strand test first! You can harvest shed hairs from your brush for this purpose.

[SimplyLonghair]

I am sure that hennaboy put that on the website, because for some henna either doesn't take or fades. I have a friend that had the henna fade. However the normal is that henna is very permenant. Indigo however isn't. It tends to fade at a different rate for each user as well, but it always seems to fade.

I echo the strand test. I did many before I covered my damaged hair the first time years ago. It did help my hair and it great for many, but some hair seems to hate it. So strand tests help you find out. I would do a condition treatment of some kind before I put anything else on my hair, especially after a color treatment.

Good luck in finding something that works for you, Toadstool. :grouphug:

[Toadstool]

Thank you all. Thank you for not just saying I'm stupid.

[Stevy]

You are not stupid at all! I dyed my hair black for years, and whilst I don't regret the happy times I had with black hair - it went better with my wardrobe then than my natural brown would - I do sometimes wish the dyed ends would hurry up and grow out.

I'm not sure I'd use Spiritual Sky over bleached hair. A friend of mine did once and he ended up with a weird brassy green shade, like something out of Anne of Green Gables. He could have got a bad batch or something, but I wouldn't chance it.

[Toadstool]

Thank you Stevy. I am having a really rough week. Can't stop crying. I cried in my Japanese class last night which was embarrassing!(not about my hair, I hasten to add).

[Unofficial_Rose]

So if I put henna without indigo onto my hair which is dyed dark brown over bleach, would it come out orange or just give it reddish overtones? And if I continued to henna it when the grey grows in, would the grey turn orange??
How does henna improve the condition of your hair? How long should I wait after chemical dye?
I am just so fed up with my hair at the moment. I have never managed to get chemical dye to look either healthy or natural. It is too short to put up and forget about it!!

If you henna over dark brown dye you'll get dark reddish brown. It's probably worth waiting for the dye to fade a little and adding some indigo. Then you can leave it on longer and get more conditioning without it ending up overly dark. This will make your growing in greys golden brown rather than the orange-red you will get from straight henna.

Of course if you really, really HAVE to do something to your hair now (and I know what this is like, believe me!), you could try a henna gloss, i.e. a spoonful of henna + water, diluted with some conditioner, just leave it for an hour for some strawberry highlights and a bit of conditioning.

Henna's dyeing ingredient, lawsone, bonds with the keratin in hair. This makes hair stronger and a little thicker. I know what you mean re dark chemical dyes not looking quite right, especially over bleach (yep, done that too - poor hair! :rolleyes:).

[Toadstool]

Okay I am now sitting (bravely?impulsively?) with henna on my head/. It says the only ingredient is lawsone. It also says only to leave it for up to 2 hours so I guess they must have done something to it to release the dye?
Wish me luck!

[wintersun99]

What did you buy?

[Toadstool]

It says Henne Natur (Copper).It appears to be French!

[Toadstool]

Well. Gosh.
The four strands I'd left blonde are now orange.
The black is still black.

[Unofficial_Rose]

You didn't say any of it was black before! :confused: You said dark brown, right?

The orange bits should oxidise to auburn in a few days. Does it feel healthier?

Hope you are happier with it!

[Toadstool]

yes I said dark brown because that's what the packet said but it looks black to me.
Auburn would be good as at the moment it's a bit luminous!!
I may have top do something about those four strands but yes it does feel nice.

[Calista]

Is it this (http://sumawholesale.com/index.php/non-foods/henne-natur-henna-natural-copper-10-x-90g-dy480.html) product? I don´t know this particular brand, but similar brands are sold at the Turkish grocery store here in Germany. I used to use them, but I don´t trust them anymore. I don´t think they´d declare ingredients like metallic salts.

If you like the results you might want to look into BAQ henna in the long run.

[Toadstool]

yes Calista that's the one. Oh no! Have I ruined my hair??

[Calista]

No, you haven´t. Not with one application. And hey, your hair is short, so now is the time to do all the haircolour experiments. :)

I used a similar-looking henna product for years and years, but never grew my hair below bra strap length. Now, at hip, I have some "inexplicable" damage on the ends which I think might be attributed to that henna years ago. But I´m not sure. :shrug:

[Toadstool]

Oh boy. I just believed what it said on the packet.
How does this one look to you?
http://www.henna-boy.co.uk/shop/natural-red-light-brown-brown-dark-brown-henna-hair-dye/300g-brunette-natural-henna-hair-dye/prod_66.php

[Calista]

Phew, I´m really no expert when it comes to henna. I think Nightshade (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/member.php?u=5944) is the one you really want to talk to. And have you checked out the henna board (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/forumdisplay.php?f=21)?

[wintersun99]

................

[Nightshade]

I am just so fed up with my hair at the moment. I have never managed to get chemical dye to look either healthy or natural. It is too short to put up and forget about it!!

Woah, slow down hun :) I know you're freaking out a bit, and it's understandable. Big breath in, big breath out.

Please take your time, I've seen frantic efforts to "fix"things cause a lot more damage in the long run!


So if I put henna without indigo onto my hair which is dyed dark brown over bleach, would it come out orange or just give it reddish overtones?

You'll probably get something in the deep red to auburn shade once it's oxidized, freshly hennaed hair tends to be brighter and tones down over about three days.


And if I continued to henna it when the grey grows in, would the grey turn orange??

It's very possible that your grays will be lighter and more vibrant than the rest of your hair. Henna colors by adding a translucent color, so it blends with whatever the base color is. Blondes/white hairs go bright orange, light to medium brunettes get a copperish color, brunettes get red to auburn, and those with dark to black hair get red sheen in the sunlight.


How does henna improve the condition of your hair?

Sniped from the henna article (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/vbjournal.php?do=article&articleid=7):

Pros, Cons & Other Effects of Henna
Henna has some undeniable benefits for hair, which is why so many people use it and love it. Some of these pros include:
Stronger Hair - The lawsone (dye) molecule goes into the hair it penetrates the hair shaft some, binding with the keratin in the hair. This makes hair stronger, but also is one of the qualities that makes henna removal near impossible. Henna also coats the hair and fills in rough spots on a frayed cuticle. This adds a second layer of strength, but it DOES NOT lock out moisture.
Smoother, Shinier Hair - Henna, as stated above, does coat the hair, but it is a permeable coating that does not lock moisture out. The henna helps fill in rough spots on the cuticle. With the cuticle rough edges smoothed over the hair feels smoother and the cuticle takes a lot less damage during combing and manipulation. It takes several days for Henna to stabilize. It becomes more flexible and durable as it oxidizes and cures--it is in fact a plant resin that is flexible and solvent enough to penetrate the hair at the cuticle, carrying pigment with it.


How long should I wait after chemical dye?

If you are using 100% pure henna and indigo you don't have to wait, there should be no reaction at all. However if you are not SURE you are using pure henna, and even if you are, I recommend strand testing before you do anything to your entire head.

From the henna article:

Can I Henna over My Dyed/Permed/Straightened/Chemically Treated Hair? What about Chemical Treatments After Henna?
Yes, IF you get the right henna, and you’re careful. If you use Body Art Quality (meaning 100% pure henna) you SHOULD be okay. The rule of thumb is to wait 3 months after your last chemical treatment before hennaing. Some have done it sooner without poor results. Assuming you use good henna (see below for a discussion on buying quality henna) you always, always, ALWAYS want to strand test. Poor quality henna can react with chemical treatments to produce green or black hair. Before hennaing, or before applying any sort of treatment over hennaed hair, strand test. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. Relevant Threads: Do I need to wait before using henna (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=5571)?,


To address your baby shampoo, that's actually very harsh on hair. Baby shampoo is "no tears" because it is the same alkaline PH as your eyes, rather than the PH of your skin and hair. I would dilute a normal shampoo and try that instead, and perhaps follow with an ACV rinse (there's lots of threads on those to read).

There's two articles in my siggy that you may find helpful, the first focuses on henna and hair, and will answer a lot of your questions. The second is on rehabilitating damaged hair, which also may have some tricks for you to put to use :)

You're not stupid, just be sure to take it slow and research before you do anything else!

[Toadstool]

No I didn't take pics, I feel too ugly. I bumped into an autistic guy I know who said it looked "nice, like a tiger."LOL
So can I do the Hennaboy one in a couple of days?
I did check out the henna board but I found it all really complicated and confusing. Brain not working too well at the moment :-)

[Toadstool]

Thank you Nightshade, just saw your post. Will read the articles now.

[Nightshade]

No I didn't take pics, I feel too ugly. I bumped into an autistic guy I know who said it looked "nice, like a tiger."LOL
So can I do the Hennaboy one in a couple of days?
I did check out the henna board but I found it all really complicated and confusing. Brain not working too well at the moment :-)


Thank you Nightshade, just saw your post. Will read the articles now.

You're welcome! The henna article attempts to break things down into easy-to-understand terms, and I'd be happy to clarify anything that is still muddy :)

I think you can try the hennaboy in a few days, but I would really, really recommend you strand test first :flowers:

[Calista]

And we want pictures! Now I´m really really curious about the tiger look! ;)

Thank you for chiming in, Nightshade! :flowers:

[Toadstool]

To address your baby shampoo, that's actually very harsh on hair. Baby shampoo is "no tears" because it is the same alkaline PH as your eyes, rather than the PH of your skin and hair. I would dilute a normal shampoo and try that instead, and perhaps follow with an ACV rinse (there's lots of threads on those to read).

What would you refer to as a normal shampoo then?
Thank you so much for all your help. I just ordered reddish-brown henna from hennaboy.
Am unsure about strand testing as don't have any shed hair to test and don't want to cut any off! Maybe I could test on a bit on my head? At least this next henna will be the right quality so shouldn't damage my hair, right?

[Nightshade]

To address your baby shampoo, that's actually very harsh on hair. Baby shampoo is "no tears" because it is the same alkaline PH as your eyes, rather than the PH of your skin and hair. I would dilute a normal shampoo and try that instead, and perhaps follow with an ACV rinse (there's lots of threads on those to read).

What would you refer to as a normal shampoo then?
Thank you so much for all your help. I just ordered reddish-brown henna from hennaboy.
Am unsure about strand testing as don't have any shed hair to test and don't want to cut any off! Maybe I could test on a bit on my head? At least this next henna will be the right quality so shouldn't damage my hair, right?

I guess to me a "normal" shampoo would be something that's geared to be PH balanced for your hair and scalp, which is pretty much anything other than baby shampoo :)

Yay to ordering henna!

No cutting required! Try testing on a piece of hair that you normally don't see, something that if things go awry will be mostly hidden by the rest of your hair.

Just remember- whatever you plan on doing for your full-head application, do EXACTLY that to your strand test. That includes the mix, dye release time, time on your head, making sure it's wrapped so it doesn't dry out, etc :)

I also think it'd be wise to wait for it to oxidize for a few days before making a final judgment on your strand test results :)