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manderly
April 14th, 2009, 03:49 PM
I've been meaning to do a new hairtyping photo now that I'm longer and I may get a better idea, but my recent decision to try the curly girl method for a bit has me questioning the hairtyping guide.

I know when I moisturize, scrunch and don't touch my hair is quite curly (I'll post a photo in this thread later when my hair dries).* see below I know it's even curlier if I come out of the water and let my hair completely drip dry with no aid (anyone surprised at the curls when you go swimming and ignore your hair?).

I know my hair is straighter and frizzier when I wash, condition, and air dry without product. It's also straighter if I comb it out after I towel dry.

So my question is: which is my real hairtype? Curlies rarely look good when not given the moisture and leave-ins they require. But isn't that manipulation? So is my real hairtype less curly, and I'm provoking more curls out of it?

Do you see my confusion? I suppose for the very straight or the very curly this doesn't really matter either way for them, but for us "in betweenies" who skirt the edge from wavy to curly......how do we know what is our "real" hairtype?

Should a hairtyping photo consist of rinsing hair (or WO of some sort) and allowing it to COMPLETELY drip dry with no touching (that would take hours!!)? That would remove the elements of stripping shampoos or coating conditioners, two things that I believe alter our hair's appearance.

Your thoughts?

ETA: I know this isn't "our" method, as I've seen it on other sites.....just "ours" in that it's the one we follow :)

ETA2: Here is my hair on the CG method, which involved CO, followed by scrunching my usual Giovanni direct and coconut oil in my hair. No touching until it dried. The scrunching and no touching gave me big, loose curls. This is still slightly damp.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y50/astrauser/CIMG2139.jpg

This is my original hairtyping photo from over a year ago. I believe it's just S&C, towel dried and left alone.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y50/astrauser/0819.07summersunshinevo5naturalairdrynooil.jpg

Sooooo, this is where my question lies......is the dryness of the old photo my real hair, or is the moisturized and scrunched version my real hair? Wavies are tricky :p

heatherainsley
April 14th, 2009, 03:53 PM
i have wondered that too. My hair is really curly after certain treatment or when i dont do any thing to it. Cant wait to hear the answers.

Euphony
April 14th, 2009, 04:07 PM
My best guess has always been how my hair is most of the time. Most of the time my hair is in the beginnings of the 2 range. Though I can get my hair into the 1 range and close to the 3 range without heat styling, just product and manual manipulation. Especially when my hair was shorter (no more than bsl) I would have big boingy ringlets, the longer it gets the straighter it gets.

plainjanegirl
April 14th, 2009, 04:09 PM
I think you are on to something here.
I've also wondered about the conditioners you use. Someone with inbetween hair could probably do a hairtyping using a non cone and get one type of hair but a coney conditioner and be completely different. Maybe we place too much emphasis on our hair type or not?

GlassEyes
April 14th, 2009, 04:15 PM
You're probably right.

It should probably be the way it dries normally, or the way that it dries normally without manipulation in the way you most desire...if that makes sense. That doesn't take heat styling into account because it can change the look of hair more dramatically than most products, so... :shrug:

Elphie
April 14th, 2009, 04:16 PM
That happens to me, plainjanegirl. With cones, I'm more of a 1b or 1c, without cones (which is most of the time) I'm a 2a, so that's what I went with.

rags
April 14th, 2009, 05:49 PM
The cone thing is what happened to me. I typed myself as a 1a when I came here and I was - on cones. After being cone-free for a while, I put a hairtyping photo up and got mostly 1c/2a responses! I went with 1b/1c as a compromise.

frodolaughs
April 14th, 2009, 06:03 PM
It would be interesting to come up with a hairtyping method that showed the full range of a person's hair. So little in life fits into perfect boxes--my hair is definitely no exception.

Anje
April 14th, 2009, 06:14 PM
It could definitely be that our hairtyping is a bit flawed... but by the same token, you can always re-assess if/when your routine changes.

It doesn't help that many of us have different textures. My hair tends to semi-straight, semi-wavy most of the time. However, I have 1-inch diameter curls in my nape hair, which practically spiral back on themselves to make it look like I have little circles sticking out from my neck.

Paliele
April 14th, 2009, 06:22 PM
I think that the hairtyping guide works fine for what it's for--a guideline to quickly show similarities and differences between different people's hair. I agree with Euphony that to hairtype yourself you should use what your hair is like most of the time, with the understanding that you could go either way with a little effort. (and letting it drip dry without touching it definitely counts as "effort"!)

paper
April 14th, 2009, 06:30 PM
I know my hair type confuses me. I've had it from 1a-2a. Straight some days, wavy other days and sometimes I have spirals. :hmm: I was planning on doing a hair type thread when my hair reaches APL>

Kyamo
April 14th, 2009, 06:30 PM
Well, I have my type listed as 2a because when I did a "dry-without-touching" type photo, (that's how the types are defined) I got a bunch of waves. Even weirder, if my hair gets damp in the rain then dries on its own in the wind, there are sometimes a few almost-ringlets at my temples and neck. But my sig pic is a better representation of what my hair looks like every day, because in real life I comb my hair instead of not touching it. I guess based on that pic I'd be a 1b or 1c. So I totally see your point. I don't think 2a accurately represents how many waves I really have on a daily basis.

Tornerose
April 14th, 2009, 06:41 PM
Water Only, Drip dry and No Touching would definately produce the most accurate results for everyone, and it would be probably be less confusion.

And then there probably woudln't be as much change for people either, when they change their rotine.

chickpea
April 14th, 2009, 06:58 PM
manderly, what you describe sounds perfectly normal for wavy hair. I do not think it is necessary for hair to be stripped of all product to determine hair type, because that is not the normal routine for most people.

My own hair can range from barely a wave to frizzy, or defined waves with the odd spiral curl. I get more waves/curls with product and scrunching, but if my hair was naturally straight I think it would require a lot more manipulation to be wavy or curly.

PhillyGirl1978@
April 14th, 2009, 08:07 PM
I will definitely be watching this thread. I have been trying to find my true hair type for a while. It's weird, I do remember when I was a kid, even a teen with relaxer in my hair, when I came out of swimming and didn't bother my hair I was amazed at the calm waves and ringlets I got. I have been typed as a 3a, lately I've been paying attention to my under layer (the top layers are shorter) that part is like soft, loose, floppy curls and waves. I am hoping to get it all like that when I grow in my layers. I may have to dry "that let it get soaking wet and then drip dry" thing...it'll take a while, But I think I should try it.

Rohele
April 14th, 2009, 08:15 PM
My hair is very similar to chickpea's. Quite curly with scrunching, to kind of straight and fuzzy if I comb it and add no product.

Your hair looks lovely in the CG method hair pic - I know you mentioned in your other thread that you don't like the look of waves in your hair but they are really pretty!

manderly
April 14th, 2009, 08:53 PM
Thank you Rohele. :flower: Don't get me wrong, I think curls are gorgeous--from behind. From the front they don't go well with my face IMHO. I wish they did, because I think they're very pretty. It may just be something I need to get used to though :shrug:

Teacherbear
April 14th, 2009, 10:57 PM
Our hair typing system was developed as a way to start conversations between people with similar hair types. It grew out of Andre Walkers basic hair typing system. We (various people and discussions) here at LHC have developed the system even more.

I don't think it is a hard and fast system. Just like there is no law that says you have to measure your hair wet OR dry.

manderly
April 14th, 2009, 11:00 PM
Don't get me wrong Teacherbear, I don't mean to knock it or change it. I just notice how different my hair is depending on HOW I let it dry and how much moisture it is given. It just makes me wonder what my "real" hairtype is. :shrug:

If you read my latest blog post, you can see my confused hair :D

:flower:

Teacherbear
April 15th, 2009, 08:00 PM
Ah, I see. I didn't feel like you were knocking it. I just think the hair typing system is as "accurate" as measuring length. After we use the tool (the system or the tape measure) we have to go with what is right for "us."

There use to be such heated discussions about the "right" way to measure hair length. During that discussion I decided it didn't matter if you measured from the forehead, the base of your skull, using the stripes on your favorite tshirt, or a mole/tattoo. Be true to yourself.

That's how I feel about the typing system. My hair, daily, is significantly less curly than my hair is when I let it air dry (untouched). I feel I am a 2c, so that's what I claim. When I brush out my air-dried hair it is much more 2b-ish (like my siggy). I like the wavier/curlier extent of my hair . . . so that is my choice.

So, all of that so say go with what makes you feel good about your hair and seems "true." I don't know that there will ever be a "real" hairtype. :twocents:

It is an interesting journey, this growing of hair, isn't it?! I could never mention this type of a conversation with my real-life/non-hair-board friends! They'd think I was bonkers! :crazyq: Then again, I might be! hahahaha ;)

:cheese:

Furiana
April 25th, 2009, 11:52 AM
Water Only, Drip dry and No Touching would definately produce the most accurate results for everyone, and it would be probably be less confusion.

Yep, that's what I'd go by, too.


My best guess has always been how my hair is most of the time. Most of the time my hair is in the beginnings of the 2 range. Though I can get my hair into the 1 range and close to the 3 range without heat styling, just product and manual manipulation. Especially when my hair was shorter (no more than bsl) I would have big boingy ringlets, the longer it gets the straighter it gets.

That's interesting, Euphony. Mine ranges from 2a (even 1c!) to 2c/3a depending on climate and routine.


My guess is that the hairtyping situation works like this:

The "real" or best or closest hairtype is the one based hair which is wetted completely with water only, allowed to drip dry, with absolutely no touching - not even to squeeze out excess water!

Hairtype might change, but you'd have to do the hairtyping process all over again to find out. Meaning: if you switch from WC to CO, you can wet/drip dry/leave alone all over again to see if your hairtype changed. If your hair is wavier when wet with water and left completely alone, then your hairtype changed. But if you still need plopping/scrunching/whatever to get those extra curls, it did not! In that case, the plopping (or combing etc. in other cases) would be making your hair look like a different hairtype. Though you may prefer it and even identify more with it, it's not your actual hairtype.

So, I'm 2b. That's how my hair is when I wet it, drip dry it, leave it completely alone. If I do the same thing in a more humid climate, I get curls! I become a 2c/3a! And if I do the same thing when I routinely WC, the waves are almost gone. I become a 1c.

But the extra curl I get from plopping doesn't change my hairtype like switching to CO does. That's because I lose the curls again if I wet/drip dry/etc my hair again.

And if CO gave me more wave -- say it changed me from a 2b to a 2c -- but my hair was still 2b if I wetted/air dryed/etc? Then I'd still be a 2b, even though I usually looked like a 2c.

With all of that said, there's a range of hairtypes that my hair can look like depending on how I handle it. Combing will make my hair straighter. Plopping will make it curlier. I can look like anything from a 1c to a 2c at the moment, but my hairtype is still 2b.

Does that make any sense?

Tigerdawn
April 26th, 2009, 11:35 AM
Here's a thought: water only doesn't remove cones. So should coneheads do a shampooing first? My hair is 1a no matter what I do to it, but wavies have different results with cones and no cones, right?

All this is interesting to me but doesn't apply at all. My hair refuses to have any wave whatsoever.

Just_Isabel
April 26th, 2009, 12:50 PM
I also get confused about my hair type, though to a lesser degree than Manderly because my hair doesn't "leave" the lower 3 range, but the way it looks depends very strongly on what I do to it before / while it dries.

I don't think that we should have to wash our hair with water only and then let it drip dry without even squeezing excess water if that's not what you usually do. We (people in general, but especially LHC members) have such different routines, I don't think that someone who uses cones regularly would get the same results after WO as someone who already uses only water on their hair. I really don't think that there is one method that will work for everyone.

IMO, the two best options would be:

1) wash as usual (be it with herbs, S&C, WO or whatever), let hair air dry with as little manipulation as possible (if you have to squeeze or remove excess water with a towel, I don't think that's too harmful); or

2) go by what your hair usually looks like when you wear it down IF it hasn't been manipulated in a way to change its pattern.
Ex: scrunching would be ok because it enhances waves and curls, but it won't make 1-type straight hair into 3-type curly. Combing and brushing should also be ok. Bunning or braiding while the hair is dry would disqualify you because you'll get waves no matter what your hair type is.

Option 1 would be closer to the "truth" (if there is such a thing), option 2 could maybe be more useful (and it would be easier :o).

But I really don't think that there is any "one size fits all" method for treating hair before hair typing, people will do what they think is best and that's perfectly fine. Hair typing isn't an exact science, after all, it's just a guide.

Silverlox
April 26th, 2009, 01:20 PM
To me, my "true" hairtype is the one I get with my usual routine, including leave-in conditioners/oils, but without gel, mousse or other special "pattern enhancers". Also it needs to dry without manipulation.

My hair is very dry and without conditioner and leave-ins, it just dries in a big fuzz ball with every hair insisting on it's own pattern, not matching any other hair's pattern. Basically each strand strived to be as far from any other strand as possible. :silly:
Thus, it's quite impossible to type as anything other than "poofy" without leave-in condish or oils. :p

In order to correctly hairtype it, no scrunching, plopping or combing/brushing while damp. To detangle it sopping wet is okay, as it doesn't change the patterns it dries in.

Squeezing out excess water by hand or with a towel/turbie twist etc, to cut down on drying time is also okay, as long as it doesn't remain in the towel/turban more than a few minutes.

Being an ever versatile wavy/wurly, my hair can be completely straight if I comb it repeatedly during air drying, or it can be full of lovely spiral curls if I plop. Especially if I use "pattern enhancers" like gel (Aloe Vera or other) or special curl enhancing leave-ins, like Jessicurl products.

I have no idea what effect cones have on my hair, as I've never been without. Cones work well for me and it's such a pain trying to find cone free poos and conditioners here that I gave up on that long ago. :shrug:
Even the ever popular VO5 is very cone ladened. :rolleyes:

This is my very personal view and how I do it. However, I do not by any means intend this to be a rule that everybody else must live by. Merely informing you nice people what works for me. :D