Cones can be removed without sulfates

[Velouria]

I recently started using cones judiciously and am VERY pleased with the results. So, I've been reading up on the subject in order to incorporate them into my routine wisely. I came upon this:

http://www.naturallycurly.com/curlreading/curly-q-a/whats-the-scoop-on-silicones

Scroll down to the chart, and you'll see that, according to at least one study, all of the listed cones can be removed with cocamidopropyl betaine or coco betaine. Most of the ones listed aren't water-soluble, either, but they can still be removed without sulfates. The coco-surfactants are in practically all sulfate-free shampoos.

Also, I'm sure that Dow Corning didn't run tests on true-soap based shampoos, or saponin-containing herbs (soapnuts, shikakai, soapwort, yucca, etc) but I'd bet that they at least partially remove cones. I think I'll be fine with just an occasional sulfate-free shampoo between herb washes. Hooray!

[dorothea-brooke]

Thanks, Velouria! Very interesting info. I've been using Avalon Organics poo and condish, and while the condish does have dimethicone, I haven't been experiencing any build-up. The poo does have a coco-surfactant it in -- I wonder if this is why....

Anyone else have insights on this question? :flower:

ETA: I know Avalon has taken a hit lately cause they reformulated their condish with cones, but I actually appreciate that! I want a coney conditioner, and as far as I can tell it's the only brand that uses natural ingredients and also includes a cone.... :twocents:

[ktani]

Avalon was hit recently for more than that, by the State of California, http://www.prlog.org/10079593-california-lawsuit-whole-foods-avalon-and-others-with-products-containing-carcinogenic-1-4-dioxane.html but cones can be easily removed in some cases without sulfates.

I was surprised to find that my silicone based sunblock could be removed from my skin with catnip tea.

[Shermie Girl]

Avalon was hit recently for more than that, by the State of California, http://www.prlog.org/10079593-california-lawsuit-whole-foods-avalon-and-others-with-products-containing-carcinogenic-1-4-dioxane.html


That probably explains the re formulation. I used Avalon Products for a while. I don't remember if those ingredients were in them or not.

[Velouria]

You're welcome.

Alba Botanica, Shikai, and Jason brands are other natural (well, semi-natural, really) brands that contain cones (to varying degrees.) I had a 2 yr. old bottle of Shikai conditioner that I had put into the product graveyard when I went cone-free, and after one experimental re-use of it I decided to go back to cones. Then I did some bottle-reading at the health food store and discovered that Alba and Jason had them.

I really didn't want to have to start using drugstore products; among other things, most of the m have fragrance (and usually a scent I can't stand) as one of the top 10 ingredients....so overpowering.

[dorothea-brooke]

Avalon was hit recently for more than that, by the State of California, http://www.prlog.org/10079593-california-lawsuit-whole-foods-avalon-and-others-with-products-containing-carcinogenic-1-4-dioxane.html but cones can be easily removed in some cases without sulfates.

I was surprised to find that my silicone based sunblock could be removed from my skin with catnip tea.

Yes, I remember your links to this, ktani -- thanks. It looks like none of the Avalon Organics shampoos or conditioners had the problematic ingredient, since if I understand correctly they're the by-product of manufacturing sulfates, and none of their poos have sulfates?

[dorothea-brooke]

Alba Botanica, Shikai, and Jason brands are other natural (well, semi-natural, really) brands that contain cones (to varying degrees.) I had a 2 yr. old bottle of Shikai conditioner that I had put into the product graveyard when I went cone-free, and after one experimental re-use of it I decided to go back to cones. Then I did some bottle-reading at the health food store and discovered that Alba and Jason had them.

Oops, missed this, thanks! I just went to look at the Alba Botanicals site, and they must be owned by the same co. as Avalon, cause their layout is exactly the same and all their products seem to contain the same ingredients in the same order....

It's nice to have other options, though, so thanks for the heads-up. I agree about wanting to avoid drugstore brands because of fragrance. Pew. ;)

[ktani]

Yes, I remember your links to this, ktani -- thanks. It looks like none of the Avalon Organics shampoos or conditioners had the problematic ingredient, since if I understand correctly they're the by-product of manufacturing sulfates, and none of their poos have sulfates?

It is not as simple as that. I will get the original links. It is not only about sulfates with this.

Here you go, http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showpost.php?p=351829&postcount=3

Here are the follow up results. Not every product is listed for a brand but Avalon looks good here, http://www.organicconsumers.org/bodycare/DioxaneResults09.pdf

[dorothea-brooke]

It is not as simple as that. I will get the original links. It is not only about sulfates with this.

Here you go, http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showpost.php?p=351829&postcount=3

Here are the follow up results. Not every product is listed for a brand but Avalon looks good here, http://www.organicconsumers.org/bodycare/DioxaneResults09.pdf

Great, thanks, ktani -- I had missed that follow-up. The PDF is very helpful. :)

[ktani]

Great, thanks, ktani -- I had missed that follow-up. The PDF is very helpful. :)

No worries, I did too, lol. And you are most welcome!

[BlackfootHair]

WOOT! I don't have to worry about cone buildup now! :D