Gender and Hair from the Back

[davidvs]

Periwinkle's two photographs on this post (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=20061) made me curious about how my hair looks from the back.

The photographs show her with her hair down (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/picture.php?albumid=1990&pictureid=31338) or in a ponytail (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/picture.php?albumid=1004&pictureid=31339). To me, she appears much more feminine in the second photograph because gathering her hair into a ponytail reveals the cut of her shirt sleeves and the size and shape of her shoulders.

Every now and then, because of my long hair, a stranger who only sees me from the back calls me "ma'am". I wondered if the ponytail I normally wear also makes my gender more distinct.

Here are two photographs for comparison:

http://lh6.ggpht.com/_hy6XaUkclAs/SZzrKoDPIEI/AAAAAAAABe8/-3DOURcnosE/s144/david-hair-down.jpg (http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/L6nSodg83t_rM2jYI3cDqA?feat=embedwebsite)

http://lh3.ggpht.com/_hy6XaUkclAs/SZzrLJguP1I/AAAAAAAABfE/a_qOQp9RukE/s144/david-hair-ponytail.jpg (http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/Q5aeaqpMRWjvsDwC34iFRA?feat=embedwebsite)

It might just be my perception, but I think the same thing happens with my ponytail: the shape of my shoulders and shirt is emphasized and thus my appearance from the back is more recognizably masculine.

And, no, I'm not going to put my hair up in a bun for a third comparison photograph.

(This is cross-posted to by blog, here (http://davidvs.blogspot.com/2009/02/hair-from-back.html), without Periwinkle's name.)

[Jessaka]

...lol. The bun comment made me laugh. The ponytail makes you look more masculine to me, yes. But, I could kind of tell you were a dude from the other photo too. One of my friends has hair like yours, well his hair is long and I can tell he's a dude from behind so maybe I just have an eye for that.

[DragonLady]

It might just be my perception, but I think the same thing happens with my ponytail: the shape of my shoulders and shirt is emphasized and thus my appearance from the back is more recognizably masculine.

I agree it does. The back muscles and broader shoulders are far more apparent.

[Sunshine69]

I think you're right. Your back looks definitely male with your hair in the ponytail, but your shiny black hair looks so good left loose.

[Bene]

And, no, I'm not going to put my hair up in a bun for a third comparison photograph.




oh.... ok



http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y244/bene25/smilies/sadwalk.gif

[SimplyLonghair]

My problem is that I look like a guy from the back, because I have very square broad shoulders and a um wider waist.:p
No mistakes from the front though.:D
Thats okay I have accidentally called a guy ma'am to his face, not even a long hair :silly: But I am always around girls and women and got into the habit of saying it. :o:rolleyes:

[LadyEliza]

I think it's more obvious you are a bloke from the pony tail picture. But hey, I guess from the front it's obvious no matter how your hair is!

Of course, if it was plaited with ribbons across the top of your head.... well, it's all a matter of choice, of course!!!

:puppy:

[RancheroTheBee]

In The Wrestler, Mickey Rourke wears his hair in a bun for like, half of the film. I kept thinking, "Who is that lady wit - Oh, it's him. Damn it."

[Silverlox]

But you do realise, seriously, that a bun would even further accentuate the masculine lines of your manly neck, shoulders and back, don't you? :eyebrows:

Runs off quickly to hide and explode in giggles.. :run::couch: :rollin:

[davidvs]

But you do realise, seriously, that a bun would even further accentuate

Well, one of my favorite computer game characters is an old man with a bun. Unfortunately I cannot find a picture online of his back.
http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii177/Jeffx40/MasterLi.jpg

If either my wife or I knew how to do a nice bun I'd be tempted to do so once, just as a Kodak moment. All I know is that before a shower to keep my hair dry I can smush my ponytail on the very top of my head and use one of those clips with teeth to hold it there. (Those probably have a name, huh?) But that look is less "samurai" and more "brain sucker choking". Definitely not a Kodak moment.


if it was plaited with ribbons across the top of your head...

I'm afraid that would be neither "masculine" nor "feminine" but instead "gymkhana".

[DelynofRhondda]

I'm afraid that would be neither "masculine" nor "feminine" but instead "gymkhana".

I'm still laughing over this!

But seriously, looking at the two perspective pix, the bound hair does appear more masculine drawing attention to the shoulders and arms.

[JamieLeigh]

I'm with everyone else. I can tell more of your gender specifics when your hair is away from your shoulders. I also think your hair looks gorgeous, and am of the camp who thinks you should bun it.....at least once! ;)

[nessthing]

I actually kinda can't tell either way from the back. I usually can in pictures.

*is the only one*

[Taliesin]

Hahahaha, when my hair was long, there was no avoiding this problem!

I'm a shorter, slender guy so I don't have the bulky male body. If you check my album you can see why I got CONSTANTLY referred to as "miss" or "ma'am" in public with it down. Stick straight, long blond hair on my body type made "mistaken identity" an all too common occurrence. It got to the point where people would be stumbling over themselves apologetically and I be more embarassed for THEM hahaha The ponytail helped only marginally.

Anyways, I'm re-growing it and it's not quite chin length and I've already got my first "hello, ladies" (when with a female acquaintance) hahaha Better get used to it again ;)

[rusika1]

You're correct, it is easier to tell you're male when your hair is tied back. And you should try a bun, even if you aren't confident of your skills. Remember, practice makes perfect! (I've seen Jason Mewes--of Jay and Silent Bob--wear both buns and half-up buns. With hairsticks.)

Erika

[Jeni]

I agree that the ponytail draws attention to your broad shoulders and does make you look more male from the back (says the girl with linebacker shoulders)

Your hair is v. v. nice btw!

[MadPirateBippy]

I can throw a telephone pole for distance and I get called sir from behind due to beefy girly shoulders (which is amusing because to say I have womanly hips is an understatement- I have a big ol ghetto booty).

Just realize that some people are morons and move along. Your gender is between your legs and in your lower abdomen, possibly in your chromosones, not on the back of your head.

[Chromis]

oh.... ok



http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y244/bene25/smilies/sadwalk.gif

Oh goodness, this smiley needs repeating!

[Katze]

I can throw a telephone pole for distance and I get called sir from behind due to beefy girly shoulders (which is amusing because to say I have womanly hips is an understatement- I have a big ol ghetto booty).

Just realize that some people are morons and move along. Your gender is between your legs and in your lower abdomen, possibly in your chromosones, not on the back of your head.

Correction - gender is a social construct. That's the problem this thread is addressing - that, for example, long hair gets 'read' as female. Biological sex is probably in your lower abdomen and between your legs, maybe elsewhere. Gender is in the mind of the beholder, depending on his or her socializaion. :)

I used to get called 'sir' too (sometimes 'bro' or 'man') when I was a bike racer, and at that weight was even curvier than I am now. But I had short hair. So, despite C cup boobs, short hair plus wide shoulders and muscular legs meant masculine for some people.

My BF always wears a ponytail. His hair is beautiful, and there is something feminine, or at least not-of-our-era, when he takes it down. (He looks like a blond Jesus!) But even in braids he is 'read' as male, probably because of his very masculine figure (broad shoulders narrow hips), his height, and his BEARD. :D But his dad still thinks his long hair is somehow not masculine...

[davidvs]

That's the problem this thread is addressing

No, no problem here. I was not complaining, merely observing.

But I can change that due to popular request. Let's see...

Shirt sleeves! In Periwinkle's ponytail picture her shirt sleeves were high and had an angled hem. That is a feminine cut. I do not know of any specifically masculine cut of t-shirt short sleeve! This bias clearly needs to be fixed. We should adopt a crenelated hem as the new officially masculine sleeve designation. With a little embroidered football or firetruck on each merlin, to distinguish it from a failed attempt at a home-made jester outfit.

[freznow]

If either my wife or I knew how to do a nice bun I'd be tempted to do so once, just as a Kodak moment.

You do know that practice makes perfect, right? ;)

Ha the crenelated hem would be awesome. I'd wear it, and so would so many females that it would not then be a masculine t-shirt cut anymore! Mwahaha!

Maybe you should just take to wearing feminine cut tees so that they're all unisex!

[Samikha]

I agree with the others, the second photo makes it far clearer that you're a guy. Mostly because we get to see more of you. Your hair is looking lovely in either style, by the way. I'm also glad to see I'm not the only one here who's played Jade Empire:)

[Alun]

You know, it really doesn't matter all that much. People who make such a mistake are usually the ones that are embarrassed.

The only time I get concerned is when a security guard or cop, i.e. someone armed with a gun, says ma'am and I keep on walking. I assume they won't shoot me, and will just think I'm hard of hearing! It worries me a little, though.

[Islandgrrl]

And, no, I'm not going to put my hair up in a bun for a third comparison photograph.

And exactly how is that fair??? :D

I think your shoulders look quite manly in both photos. But I do agree, the ponytail makes the width of your shoulders more readily apparent.

Very excellent hair, in both!

[Angellen]

I tend to see lower ponytails as more masculine, too. I know that I personally look significantly more masculine from behind with a ponytail at the nape of the neck rather than at the crown (or anywhere in between, really), and I think that can make a difference, figure aside.

As for the bun thing, I had an English teacher who always wore his hair in a bun, and everyone thought he was ridiculously good looking (and definitely not feminine), so I think it goes both ways. It's more related to attitude, I think.