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View Full Version : no product challenge - enough is enough!



goldenbrunette
December 29th, 2008, 04:02 PM
after reading this article;

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-394226/Could-survive-shampoo.html

i have decided, and this is big for me, to see how long i can go without using any product. i washed my hair a couple of hours ago and thought thatd id leave off the leave in conditioner and was then upset by how dry it looked in its natural state. i confess i am a product junkie i use that many serums, conditioners and thought they may be expensive i must be using too much because i am now heavily relying on them and i dont want to. after reading tha article and looking at the after pictures(click square underneath to enlarge) i think that all of these girls hair looks so much better at the end of the experiment! so today i am going to see how far i can go without washing and i really want to do this :( anyone care to join me??

plainjanegirl
December 29th, 2008, 04:20 PM
I just don't think I could do that. But let us know how it goes for you.

darkwaves
December 29th, 2008, 04:23 PM
That's the idea behind the Water Only thread here -- a number of people have successfully tried variations on this.

Copasetic
December 29th, 2008, 04:24 PM
Since joining the LHC I have cut down on how much I wash my hair, and I have toyed with the idea of giving up shampoo all together. I think I am going to continue to space out my washes, and maybe ween my hair off shampoo.

Best of luck with your new plan! There is a really good "water only" hair care thread if you haven't checked it out already.

Darkhorse1
December 29th, 2008, 04:28 PM
I need shampoo. I think everyone is different. Also, not to be a pessimist, but I don't always believe articles like this. Sure, she may have done this, but it doesn't mean she won't go back to shampooing.

For me, if I go past three days of not washing, I scratch my scalp until it bleeds it's SO itchy. Working with horses--my hair will stink. Sorry I can't participate, but let me know how your hair goes!

Keep in mind, shampoo is not a bad thing----it's milder than soap. It's what you do to it after--all the products. Our environment isn't as pure as many years ago--with exhausts, chemicals and other things that affect our lives today, we get more impurities we need to remove from our hair. That's just my theory :D

ReddishRocks
December 29th, 2008, 04:30 PM
I'm confused... that article doesn't talk about no-products. It's a poor attempt at the no-poo method, and it doesn't go into any detail about the products or ingredients those girls WERE using the whole time. Unless I'm missing something?? :/ I'm personally a modified no-poo gal, and I LOVE it, but it takes a lot of ingredient reading and some understanding of chemistry that article certainly didn't provide. I would bet the girls with bad results go buildup from silicones or other ingredients in their other products... but it's tough to say since that article was extremely non-specific.

If I were to imagine using no leave-in products or stylers, then I'd be very careful about what I was using in the shower. If you're trying to keep your hair long and healthy, it'll need a certain amount of moisture, and I'm not sure you could get that with just a rinse-out. I'm SURE I couldn't achieve that in Colorado right now. :D

ETA - I'm not familiar with the water-only method, but it sounds like the OP is only interested in eliminating leave-in products? I'd just be watching my hair like a hawk with an experiment like that, LOL! If it works, it works I suppose. :D

I'd just hate to see you really damage your hair! Be careful - but good luck, friend! :)

ReddishRocks
December 29th, 2008, 04:37 PM
I need shampoo. I think everyone is different. Also, not to be a pessimist, but I don't always believe articles like this. Sure, she may have done this, but it doesn't mean she won't go back to shampooing.

For me, if I go past three days of not washing, I scratch my scalp until it bleeds it's SO itchy. Working with horses--my hair will stink. Sorry I can't participate, but let me know how your hair goes!

Keep in mind, shampoo is not a bad thing----it's milder than soap. It's what you do to it after--all the products. Our environment isn't as pure as many years ago--with exhausts, chemicals and other things that affect our lives today, we get more impurities we need to remove from our hair. That's just my theory :D

A balanced response indeed. :) I was in news media for several years before becoming a teacher, and I honestly thought that was a very pop-vanity sort of article. It was going more for shock value instead of the hows and whys of the no-poo method. There's a lot of chemistry involved in successful no-poo - and that just doesn't make for easy reading. ;)

wintersun99
December 29th, 2008, 04:52 PM
..............

ReddishRocks
December 29th, 2008, 04:58 PM
Thanks for those links! It's interesting to see the processes others go though. :)

Bene
December 29th, 2008, 05:06 PM
2 of the 5 ppl really really hated it.


At that point I stopped looking in a mirror, and I have not worn eye make-up for the past six weeks. There seems no sense in bothering if my hair looks so horrid. My confidence is rock-bottom and I feel really depressed.

^^^^^^^^^^
this one chick seems on the verge of a meltdown




i wonder if they should have eased into it? or maybe washed out all of the products they used before?

spidermom
December 29th, 2008, 05:08 PM
Not a chance. I've gone 8 days without washing and the smell of sebum is awful and terrible and horrible and all kinds of bad things. Bleh! CWC suits me.

Anje
December 29th, 2008, 05:11 PM
I did a mostly water washing method for almost 9 months, and I will report that it works well, with some limitations. (I did rinse with diluted vinegar to cut the hard water buildup, and I used oils.) My main complaint was that my ends would get dry without conditioner and didn't get sufficient moisture from water and oil. (I also have slightly stinky sebum, but not everyone does.)

You should be aware that there is a 2 to 8 week transition period, before you get less greasy.

FWIW, you can also shower without soap, so long as you use something scrubby on your body. I'm not a convert yet, but it seems to work for a lot of people, with a better success rate than WO on the hair.

RocketDog
December 29th, 2008, 05:28 PM
I haven't used a gel, spray, leave-in mist or mousse in well over 6months. I *do* use conditioner, honey and oil on my hair, and now that I've banished the shampoo for the most part... that's it! I can tell you that my hair is happier now than it was back when I was using umpteen products, that's for sure, but I don't think I could give up my conditioners!

salamander
December 29th, 2008, 05:31 PM
Keep in mind, shampoo is not a bad thing----it's milder than soap.

That seems like a rather broad statement. There are so many different shampoos out there! I've always found shampoo to be harsher than soap, even salon brands. This is partially because I'm sensitive to sulfates, so I may have a skewed view, but I seem to recall hearing that the switch from soap to sulfates was because sulfates deal with hard water better, not because they're gentler.

Anyway, I suppose I'm saying that everyone has to try out all the options, because we react differently. We can't assume shampoo works!

Heidi_234
December 29th, 2008, 05:36 PM
I did it. For 10 weeks actually.
I described it here (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showpost.php?p=306476&postcount=211).
It was a nice experience. :)

RocketDog
December 29th, 2008, 05:37 PM
I did a mostly water washing method for almost 9 months, and I will report that it works well, with some limitations. (I did rinse with diluted vinegar to cut the hard water buildup, and I used oils.) My main complaint was that my ends would get dry without conditioner and didn't get sufficient moisture from water and oil. (I also have slightly stinky sebum, but not everyone does.)

You should be aware that there is a 2 to 8 week transition period, before you get less greasy.

FWIW, you can also shower without soap, so long as you use something scrubby on your body. I'm not a convert yet, but it seems to work for a lot of people, with a better success rate than WO on the hair.

I've been WO-washing on my body for the last three years, minus one month-long stint with a bar of DrBronner's mint soap. I was WO off and on for a good decade before that, if I really think about it. My skin dries out in just plain water, and using any type of soap or body wash left me PAINFULLY dry and just plain miserable. Now that I've been WO for so long, I rarely ever need lotion or oil for my skin unless I've been swimming in a chlorinated pool, or cleaning with chemicals.

eaglefeather71
December 29th, 2008, 05:43 PM
I'm getting pretty close to no products. So far, I have been water only on my body for only a week (we'll see how that goes long term). Before the WO I was using CV Soap Bars only for the past year or so. I don't use any styling products on my hair at all. The only thing I ever leave in my hair is AVG, Or homemade things like Fox's Shea Cream, SMT, or Oils. I am currently using very diluted Dr Bronners to wash my hair and I'm trying to wean myself off of that slowly. I color my hair with Henna so I have about 3-4" of commercial dye free hair. Some of my homemade concoctions do contain Conditioner and I am using an organic condtitioner when called for but I have realized that my hair doesn't need much in the way of conditioning but I don't think it can go without completely, we'll see.

eaglefeather71
December 29th, 2008, 05:50 PM
I want to do WO with my hair but I have a few concerns. It seems to me that your hair needs a lot more attention to keep it healthy with WO, and I would not want to get any more obsessed with my hair than I already am. The scritching, preening, etc??? Is this the experience of others that do WO, NW or SO?

maskedrose
December 29th, 2008, 05:53 PM
If you read the whole article, the WO (or whatever they were doing) only worked on about half of the girls. It works for some people, but definitely not others. Personally, I'm pretty happy with CO and only using coconut oil and a bit of shea as a leave in. My hair is waaay happier than it was when I coated in with silicones and stuff. I don't think that you have to give up products completely, but taking a more natural and hair friendly approach usually gives good results.

Anje
December 29th, 2008, 05:58 PM
I didn't get sebum to move enough with preening or Snowy's massage or BBBing -- sebum moves best with water for me, and sticking my head under the shower caused less breakage for me than those other methods.

There's a part of me that misses WO, and I'd have stuck with it if it weren't for the dry ends. I'm still tempted to go back to it regularly.

freznow
December 29th, 2008, 06:12 PM
There are so many things unsaid in that article, but what can you expect? Many LHC experiments go better because we have more information and know what to expect and what to perhaps try to avoid.

I went NW/SO for 7 months, it wasn't too much of a hassle. It didn't look all that great, but it didn't look bad.

Before that I was WO for a number of months. WO was a breeze for me, it took less work than NW. (eaglefeather71, I only scritched/preened much when I was NW. When I was WO it was basically the occasional massage. Depends on each person, but WO was simple for me.)

I'm thinking of going back to it, my scalp has been giving me issues with using shampoo bars. And my hair is just always so dry... Why did I ever leave WO? Ah, I remember, that was when I switched to NW because a rinse tended to make it worse... Hmmm...

/rambling

Kirin
December 29th, 2008, 06:32 PM
There are a lot of sweeping consensus made, even here on LHC which have actually been a pet peeve of mine for some time. Sorry if that offends anyone, but it's been on my mind. There is this general theory that stretching washing will make everyone stop magically producing oil..... and oiliness is just because of a reaction to using shampoo. While this may be true for some, there are a LOT of greasy headed persons like me, who wholeheartedly disagree. Not only disagree, but get dishearted and actually, angry when asking for help, the only consensus is to stop shampooing.

I have to shampoo, not just for oiliness, but its touched, exposed to smoke, I run my hands in it which are not pristinely hygenic 24 hours a day, and even sneezed on by children or nuzzled by the dog. I have a hard time considering not washing it would be hygenic by any standard.

boomygrrl
December 29th, 2008, 07:12 PM
Are you talking about not using "leave-in" stylers like leave-in conditioners and styling products? or are you talking about not shampooing/conditioning, as well?

I think depending on your hair type, your hair needs, your level of activity (hygiene issues), etc. you could get away with cutting back from washing significantly...and definitely doing away from sulfates by using alternative methods.

I have to wash my hair ever so often, in order for it to be clean. I could stop doing the "leave-in" products but I just love using a leave-in conditioner, it doubles as a curl cream for me.

Good luck on whatever you decide to do.

Darkhorse1
December 29th, 2008, 11:26 PM
Kirin--I'm with you there. My scalp has always been greasy. It's gotten better as I've aged, but it's still horrid. Even if I try to go 3 days, I just can't handle it. I work with horses, so I get sweat from wearing a helmet whilst riding (And trust me, I sweat!), and I wear hats when teaching, and I have oily scalp to begin with. By day 3, my scalp is so greasy, I scratch until it bleeds and it STINKS! I mean, some days, I catch a whiff of it and I just go 'oh, I HAVE to wash it right now!".

Shampoo is milder than soap as it's diluted. I mean, what makes soap is a harsher detergant than shampoo. At least, last time I saw some science show. It's the basic compounds/fats involved. Such as, if you wash your hair with soap vs shampoo, you will get a residue from soap as there is something in there that makes it heavier (probably fat).

I saw a cool show about why we need soap---how it works. Since oil and water just slide past each other, soap creates are bond----it uses water to slide and the stuff in soap attaches to the oils and removes them. I thought it was pretty cool!!! :D

So, while I appreciate the Water only thread, I could never, ever do that. In fact, just using water on my scalp makes my hair so grossly greasy. If it gets rained on or snowed on, it'll be an oil slick. No idea why. :D

~GypsyCurls~
December 30th, 2008, 08:47 PM
I wish my hair liked this-no products I mean. I've tried, but my hair needs additional products to look/feel nice. I try to use the bare minimum, which is conditioner (shampoo occasionally to clarify), leave-in and mousse or gel.

GlassEyes
December 30th, 2008, 08:50 PM
The link's 'natural wave' photo makes me laugh. xD

Darkhorse1
December 30th, 2008, 09:26 PM
I lose my natural wave when my hair is dirty. That's why I wash at night now, so it's somewhat normal the next day.

jivete
December 31st, 2008, 08:40 AM
My experience with WO was like Anje's. I couldn't quite get enough moisture to the ends without conditioner. I can "wash" with water, but I still need a conditioner. So now I'm CO. It was a great start though, but I did have a transition.

Actually I was inspired by the idea of "no poo" because of my crappy, non growing hair and started there. After a few months I found this site. I will say, my head used to itch like crazy when I used shampoo and I had to wash every day because it'd itch so bad. My head never itches anymore.

Darkhorse1
December 31st, 2008, 11:19 AM
jivete--really??? I'm the exact opposite. If I don't wash, my hair will itch so badly I go bonkers. Do you have dryer hair/scalp? I've always had an oily scalp, so that could be why for me. I also know some people have skin conditions/sensitivities.

Bottom line? It's grea to try experiements to see what works for you :)

goldenbrunette
December 31st, 2008, 11:45 AM
okay well i havent washed my hair since i started this post which believe me is good for me!
ill see how far i can go..haha..

heidihug
December 31st, 2008, 12:29 PM
I am with Kirin and Darkhorse1 on this one. My greasiness problems (entire body, not just skin and scalp) are almost overwhelmingly hormonal based, and no type of water-only or conditioner-only routine has ever helped. I must shampoo when I shower, though I do use less poo than I used to. And if I have to be at work or in another public arena, I shower at least every three days, but I've found two is best, especially in the summer. Otherwise my hair is greasy and piecy, and, as a whole, I'm an itchy, slimy nasty-smelling mess. Ugh.

No-wash works for lots of people, but I've accepted the fact that I'm not one of them.

wintersun99
December 31st, 2008, 12:30 PM
okay well i havent washed my hair since i started this post which believe me is good for me!
ill see how far i can go..haha..

Are you brushing your scalp with a BBB, or scritching with a comb? Are you massaging your scalp to move sebum down your length? How are you going about this? Just curious, really.

jivete
December 31st, 2008, 01:13 PM
jivete--really??? I'm the exact opposite. If I don't wash, my hair will itch so badly I go bonkers. Do you have dryer hair/scalp? I've always had an oily scalp, so that could be why for me. I also know some people have skin conditions/sensitivities.

Bottom line? It's grea to try experiements to see what works for you :)

You know, I always thought I had greasy hair because my hair looks greasy 24 hours after washing it. But I think that's more because the hair is fine/thin. Although I have oily skin, I have dry hair. I don't think of my skin as sensitive, but it might be SLS sensitive. No matter what though, I'm not one of these people who can stretch their washings way out. I barely make two days and the second day I sometimes need cornstarch on my roots. I may COwash now, but it was actually worse with shampoo.

Anje
December 31st, 2008, 01:28 PM
I've come to the conclusion that there are people who have greasy hair because that's simply how their body is, and there are people who are greasy because their scalp gets overdried by shampoo, and the sebum production is a reaction to this. One benefits from stretching washings and getting away from harsher products, the other does not. Similarly, some people get itchy scalps when their scalp gets sebum-y, some people get itchy when their scalp is over-cleaned and dry. (I only get an itchy scalp when I write about it, apparently.)

It doesn't just apply to hair, either. When I was in high school, I noticed that the same areas of my face that got greasy all the time also got dry, peely skin. When I ditched the oily skin products and started moisturizing, the oiliness went away. Of course, now I'm still stuck with dry skin, but at least it isn't greasy dry skin.

squiggyflop
December 31st, 2008, 06:02 PM
well ive gone a month without washing my hair before.. come to think of it ive probably gone 2 months before.. and my hair just got greasier and greasier.. soon it was all the way from root to tips.. i had to wear it up all the time.. im just greasy.. good luck to everyone trying this.. it wont work for me.. i know that my grease production has nothing to do with the products i use.. my back, shoulders and chest are also greasy (oh yeah and my face) i hardly ever use anything on my back, shoulders or chest but they are still greasy.. and because these areas are always greasy no matter what products (or lack of product) i use i figure my scalp is the same.. oh well good luck

spidermom
January 1st, 2009, 09:28 PM
Maybe some people have less tacky sebum that moves more freely down the hair shaft. Mine gunks up right around the scalp. I'm sure I could move it on down to some degree, but I expect there would still be a lot right at the scalp, smothering my head.

Gothic Lolita
January 2nd, 2009, 03:22 AM
I'm with Kirin, Darkhorse and Heidihug. My scalp is just oily and no cutting bakc on shampoo, sulfates, etc will change that. I've tried many things, and just now succeeded in only washing every second day, I can't go longer thab that, because my scalp would itch so badly I'd scratch myself to bleeding. The healing rashes then will give me dandruff. :(

No product on hair isn't for me. But I'm trying somethig similiar on my face. I've combo skin with dry spots, oily spots and also a few zits. I used to use at least once a day a cleanser. It would clean the skin but make it really dry. I've come to believe that I was overcleaning my face. I haven't used any product on my skin for 3 weeks and my skin looks nice and is soft. It isn't entirely clean yet, but a lot better than before.
Yesterday I used make-up for a party and didn't think that I could get the mascara off with just water, so I used my old cleanser. Bad mistake, my skin was horribly dry!

rchorr
January 3rd, 2009, 04:38 PM
Thanks so much for sharing this! Since I have VERY dry hair and skin, I'm going to have to give this a try, too.

Out of curiosity, are you going to use water at all? Conditioner?

RCHORR'


after reading this article;

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-394226/Could-survive-shampoo.html

i have decided, and this is big for me, to see how long i can go without using any product. i washed my hair a couple of hours ago and thought thatd id leave off the leave in conditioner and was then upset by how dry it looked in its natural state. i confess i am a product junkie i use that many serums, conditioners and thought they may be expensive i must be using too much because i am now heavily relying on them and i dont want to. after reading tha article and looking at the after pictures(click square underneath to enlarge) i think that all of these girls hair looks so much better at the end of the experiment! so today i am going to see how far i can go without washing and i really want to do this :( anyone care to join me??

eaglefeather71
January 3rd, 2009, 05:14 PM
I must say, the WO on the body has made for some very soft skin so far. And even the "private" areas are doing well as far as keeping clean. I actually smell less now than I did when I was using soap. It's not just me not smelling myself either, I have teenage kids that would have NO PROBLEM telling me I stink, and my hubby would definetly let me know in the nicest way possible.

bex487
January 3rd, 2009, 06:02 PM
I use hair product, so there's no way I could go without shampooing-I need to get the hair wax out. I do believe that some people wash their hair way too often-one of my friends is notorious for washing her hair (with shampoo) as often as twice a day. Her hair is really dry, but that's also because every wash is followed by a blowdry and straightening session.

I could probably stretch my hair washes out more, to maybe only twice a week or so. I don't think I could give up shampoo entirely, though! My skin errs to the greasy side.

As a side note, I have done WO on my body very successfully off and on in the past few years. It's a great idea for people who have very sensitive skin like myself, because I'm often allergic to products. The only reason I'm not WO right now is I found an exfoliating body wash that is helping me slough off dead skin better than a scrubby alone.

goldenwaves
January 3rd, 2009, 07:19 PM
Wow it's very tempting. I haven't washed my hair for about 4 days now (I normally wash every 2 or 3) and it's looking nice on the length but feeling oily on the top!! I've been brushing with a BBB and massaging, and I think I'll see if I can stretch it out for a couple more days, but I am going to a funeral sometime this week and want it to look nice, not that that's the most important thing of course. I suppose these women still used water, and I haven't been using water either. At any rate, it has inspired me to try and wash less often!! Thanks for sharing :)

ktani
January 3rd, 2009, 07:27 PM
I have stretched out hair washing but what that article recommends, to me is unhealthy and unhygenic and far from natural. To me it is an open invitation to bacteria, funguses and scalp problems. It is unrealistic and severe, IMO.

florenonite
January 4th, 2009, 10:55 AM
I've done six weeks WO when canoe-tripping, and although there was a rough transition period, by day 25 my hair was quite nice (and I hadn't just gotten used to it, I have photographic evidence XP).

I've been mostly WO on my body for as long as I can remember, though for about a year I was using soap on my face, chest and shoulders/back to deal with pimples. I stopped about a month ago and my face has cleared up and a couple weeks ago my BF commented that I smelled nice, so it must be working :D