Looking for advice - Fairly new to maintaining long hair

[Jasonlh]

Hello all. I'm new to the forum, and fairly new to trying to take better care of my hair and am seeking advice on things to try. My current length is near APL, though I've had it waist length before and am working my way back in that direction. Currently I have few split ends and have been having it trimmed 2-3x per year. When it was last near waist length it was full of split ends and fraying, but it's better, albeit much shorter, now. Hair type is 2a/M/ii.

My current routine is twice or so weekly shampoo and condition, using a probably way to hard on my hair dandruff shampoo (Dove dermacare scalp coconut and hydration anti dandruff shampoo) and keratin conditioner (Tresemme keratin smooth color with Moroccan oil, applied to length and washed out). I suffer from greasy streaky look at the roots after a day after washing and also suffer from flaking (hence the dandruff shampoo attempt that doesn't seem to work too well). My brushing routine was brushing after showering while wet. I recently switched to brushing when dry in the morning because I saw a recommendation towards that. Though I've since seen it both ways, so I'm a bit confused there. I sleep with a silk pillowcase already. My hair is flat at the top and has some volume in the lower portions.

I've started perusing through the acronym (thank you to whoever wrote that) and other guides so I can follow along with the conversation or at least know where to go read to learn more. My normal hairstyles are in a ponytail, but I'm progressing back to wearing in a bun with hairsticks (looking to learn more styles here) and I'd like to wear it down occasionally as well. I do suffer from frequent tension headaches so I am looking to change it up from a near constant ponytail which I think might be contributing to my headaches. I'm wondering if anyone has any comments or critiques or even just pointing to other links I've overlooked on my routine or other information. In looking up info, there seems to be a lot of contradictory advice and the conclusion I've drawn is "everyone is different, do what works for you." Problem is, I'm not even sure what different things might make sense to try and there seems to be a near infinite supply of products, styles, hair accessories, etc... My exposure to products outside those explained above could be considered near zero. Thanks all for the help, and I look forward to contributing in this community.

P.S. If it matters, I'm a guy, but I'm not bothered by using products traditionally marketed towards women.

[Sarahlabyrinth]

Welcome to the forum! :D

[Untressed]

Welcome.

Not sure I have any solutions here as my hair is very different than yours. So I asked my brother since he has long hair. He uses reddit regularly as an IT guy and he looked one day for hair tips. He's at about mid back now. He said he searched long hair and they had a sub reddit specifically for guys with long(ish) hair.

[Jasonlh]

Thank you both for the welcome.

I'm familiar with the subreddit you are referencing I think. FierceFlow is the name of that one, though it seems mostly centered around photos and less on information. The other subreddit I know of is more women then men (no issue at all) and is similarly named to this forum, longhair. On a post there is one of the main places I came across this site as it was referenced as a good source people were referred to.

[Zesty]

Tbh it sounds like you're on the right track with pretty much everything. The scalp thing you might want to look into if the shampoo isn't helping enough, BUT there's nothing inherently wrong with using a harsh shampoo. I certainly do. We seem to have similar scalp concerns and a very similar hair type. :) If you have any more specific questions I would be happy to talk about them for that reason, whether now or in future, because we might could use similar routines.

Anyway, if your hair seems happy and you're not seeing lots of splits or other negative signs, I wouldn't worry too much. You are ABSOLUTELY doing the right thing reading around the forums and absorbing information, even though I know it's a ton at first.

Welcome, I look forward to seeing you around. :o

[Zesty]

Oh, and re brushing wet or dry, the tendency I've seen is for curlies to brush wet so as not to disturb their pattern in between washing. I would say you are right to brush dry in your case. Hair is fragile when wet.

[goneJackal]

Hairsticks will help reduce breakage. They were game changers for me!

Try to remember when the dandruff started.
Harsh products have their place, but they may be the cause of the condition.
Scalp is skin, it reacts to very harsh products, many times compensating by producing even more oil.

[Laurab]

Welcome!
Nice to see a guy around here. The only guy I know who's kept long hair most of his life is my older brother's best friend. It really suits him, and I'm sure it suits you too.
The longest I've ever been is like APL, waist is really impressive, even with split ends!
There's lots of great tips and suggestions on here, just float around the threads and you'll learn a lot.
Most of it is pretty individual though. Some people avoid sulfates, others use them reguarly, some avoid silicones, others love what they do for their hair, there's a million different oils out there that can have a lot of different results, it's a lot to sort through!
It's a lot of trial and error, but it can be a lot of fun.

[akurah]

Regarding dandruff shampoo... per my dermatologist, you're supposed to let it sit on the scalp for 10 minutes (be it dove dandruff, head and shoulders, whatever). Ideally there's minimal suds on the length but it's also not a big deal if there are suds.

This is not what I would consider common knowledge. I certainly didn't know this. I don't have dandruff myself, but I suffer from chronic itchy skin (including scalp), so dandruff shampoo is good for that too. At least the pyrithione zinc kind is anyway.

[Entangled]

^^seconding that. You have to let dandruff shampoo sit for a bit. Think of it like medicine—you can’t just rub it on and off of your skin and have it work effectively. That made the difference for me.

[Ylva]

Regarding brushing wet vs. dry... I'm also a 2a and choose to brush my hair dry rather than wet because I have chemically damaged lengths which are just super fragile when wet. I still don't want to disturb my clumps and waves because they prevent my hair from tangling, so I only brush my hair right before washing it. However, if you're not concerned about keeping your waves intact for the duration of your wash cycle, it doesn't matter too much, in my opinion, whether you brush dry or wet as long as you do it gently.

Welcome to the forum!

[TatsuOni]

Welcome! You seem to be on the right track already :)

[ZoeZ]

Welcome!

I've found that this method protects my hair ends from splitting quite a bit: I wet my hair in the shower, then apply conditioner to the ends and length up to my ear lobes. I then wash my scalp with a fairly harsh shampoo (I don't have dandruff, just like the feel of a squeaky-clean scalp). The shampoo does flow down to the conditioned area, but I don't scrub or manipulate that. Then I rinse thoroughly and apply conditioner all over, avoiding working it into my scalp, just putting it lightly on the top hair but thickly on the length, and then rinse again after leaving it in for a few minutes (I usually wash the rest of my body and that seems to work time-wise). Then I put a dime-sized pat of conditioner on the lengths as a leave-in.

After the wash, I use an oil serum on the length and ends (not scalp) and comb out and dry. I also apply oil on the ends every day.

YMMV of course, but I've found this method has really reduced my splits. I do a clarifying wash on the length every 5 or 6 shampoos using the same method. I have medium fine slightly wavy hair just below APL.

Cheers, hope this gives you some ideas.

[EdG]

Welcome! :waving:

Here are two things you may want to try.

Get a wide-tooth wooden comb and comb while the hair is slightly damp. This will be gentler than brushing wet hair.

Try diluting the shampoo (by ~50x) before applying it. I found that applying full-strength shampoo was causing my scalp to flake.
Ed

[Jasonlh]

To start with, thank you all for the kind words and help.

Some general comments before more specific replies.

I used a clarifying shampoo last night for the first time (never even heard of it before yesterday). Neutrogena anti-residue shampoo. I also used way less conditioner than I was using (a quarter size amount instead of >2x that). This morning my hair was wildly poofy, but after wearing it in a bun all day has calmed down some. It feels much more silky and smooth than it did before, so I suspect the clarifying shampoo worked well. It still has a ton of volume and is very full though, which as my wife says, some people apparently pay good money to have, but I'm the opposite and would prefer it to look less full. Thoughts on things to try?

I don't think the forum sends a notification if I quote someone instead of just typing their name in a reply, so I'll use the simpler method unless I'm mistaken.

Zesty, glad to hear from someone with similar hair. Thanks to you and the others who commented that dandruff shampoo is not necessarily bad by itself. Since you have similar hair, my question would be, how do you know what products/routines to try when narrowing down to something new, and what signs tell you it is working properly before you have to go into a longer term recovery from using something that badly disagreed with your hair? Thanks for the info on wet vs dry brushing. It's nice to have a logical thought behind it.

goneJackal, Any thoughts on an alternative to try to the dandruff shampoo after I try out akurah's advice if that doesn't work? Perhaps that is the case, and I'll have to give it some more thought now that I'm taking better care than I used to.

Akurah and Entangled, thanks for the 10 minute information. I'd heard a few minutes before, but was admittedly not great at it. Hearing 10 minutes makes me realize the importance. I'll give that a shot the next few time and focus more on scalp than the length as well.

ZoeZ, thank you for your routine to prevent split ends that works for you. I'd like to grow it longer without the major split ends I dealt with last time I let it grow longer. Any more specific advice on the oils?

EdG, the wide tooth comb I have, though mine is plastic. Think the material makes a difference? Interesting thought to diluting the shampoo. Reminds me a bit of the cowashing I'm seeing posts on, except instead of not using shampoo its using much diluted shampoo. I appreciate the idea to try.

[ZoeZ]

I use argan oil personally, but everyone's hair is so different, you may have to try a few different ones to find the one that makes your hair happy. I have tried olive oil, which worked very well, but it did tend to build up on the ends and leave them crunchy after a few applications. Also tried mineral oil but that did nothing for my hair. These are the cheapest options and many people have success with them, and they don't cost the earth to try. They may be perfect for your hair type.

Also I'd suggest a spray bottle to dampen the hair before you do a daily oiling.

Do a search on the forum - you'll find lots of information from people far more knowleadgeable than I that will help you decide what to use. Cheers.

[EdG]

If the plastic comb has a seam, throw it out. You want a seamless comb such as one made from wood.
Ed

[Laurab]

My hair also has more volume than I'd like. So much poof, especially on wash day.

For me the things that help are:
1. My hair stylist thinning it out (she goes through with a razor to take out the bulk). Not everyone likes this, even with thick hair, because it can start to make the ends look thin, but for me it's worth it.
2. Keeping hair moisturized. I'm not sure what will work for you since your scalp is being fussy, but I really like the garnier treats one minute mask, I've noticed my hair behaving a lot better since I've started usuing it. It tangles less, lays calmer, generally it's just in better condition. I use the avocado one.
3. Braiding it out of my face. I only recently learned how to braid, but it's been great. My favorite braid tutorial person on youtube is Silvousplaits, and she has a whole series of braids for men that are inspired by vikings and lord of the rings and stuff.

I'm also experimenting with blow-drying my hair and using a leave in conditioner, but that's been less than a month so I can't swear by it yet. The blow drying may actually be adding more poof. Oh well.

[paulownia]

Welcome to the forum :D
I would also recommend switching the brush to wooden comb. Give a try to oiling, see how your hair reacts. Personally I can say that since I started oiling on a regular basis I don't get any split ends. But hey, my hair is pretty short so...:p
I warmly recommend reading Ursulas Standard Newbie Advice
http://web.archive.org/web/20120307010120/http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/vbjournal.php?do=article&articleid=39
It's a really good guide to getting started.

[lapushka]

Welcome to the forum.

Leave the dandruff shampoo in for a couple minutes, let it sit for a bit, the active ingredient needs *time* to work on the head, then rinse out. See if that helps. If that does not help, you might need something stronger and it might not be "just" dandruff but something called SD, which I suffer from, seborrheic dermatitis. Only a dermatologist will be able to prescribe you a medicated shampoo (Nizoral 2% / aka ketakonazole). I do believe Nizoral 1% (less strength) is available OTC (over the counter) in the US.

You do need to let the Nizoral sit for 5-10 minutes.

Hence my recommendation to let the current shampoo sit. I have had this tip from a dermatologist. It helps!

[Zesty]

Zesty, glad to hear from someone with similar hair. Thanks to you and the others who commented that dandruff shampoo is not necessarily bad by itself. Since you have similar hair, my question would be, how do you know what products/routines to try when narrowing down to something new, and what signs tell you it is working properly before you have to go into a longer term recovery from using something that badly disagreed with your hair? Thanks for the info on wet vs dry brushing. It's nice to have a logical thought behind it.


I think experimenting slowly, methodically, and only one new thing at a time helps a lot with avoiding disasters. So many people find the forum and immediately want to try All the Things but you want to pick one thing and give it a little bit of time to see how it goes (unless it is an immediate and total dud, like if it makes your scalp issue flare up etc). When choosing things to try, looking for advice on a specific issue you're having should help come up with a few ideas. E.g. if your hair tends to be dry and poofy, try WCC (wash-condition-condition). Then try it out, notice what you're doing and the results it gives, and decide what to keep. Taking notes helps the process if you're game for that. Also having a baseline routine that you can return to if something new doesn't pan out is helpful. :)

As to whether something is working, it's all about tangible results. If a technique or product makes your hair feel soft/supple/moisturized or makes it shiny or whatever, it's working. If it makes it feel tangly and rough, or really weighed down and lank, probably not. Just examples. After experimenting a while you'll get to know how your hair behaves and be able to give it what it needs.

And don't get overwhelmed. :) Just read a lot and try one thing at a time.

[Jasonlh]

Thank you all again for the information. I'll read through the guide and take the advice of one thing at a time to heart. Makes sense to make sure you react at least acceptably, if not near perfectly, to one item before introducing the entire spectrum of products at once.

My comb does have a seam. Didn't realize that was a problem, but looking it up it seems like the seam has the ability to slowly scape away at the hair since it is not a smooth continuous surface. I hadn't thought of that, but it makes perfect sense.

Something like this? https://www.thebodyshop.com/en-us/hair/brushes-and-combs/detangling-comb/p/p000789
(https://www.thebodyshop.com/en-us/hair/brushes-and-combs/detangling-comb/p/p000789)Or from Ric the Combmaker?
http://www.combmaker.com/
I came across both from searching here. I was thinking TBS for travel and quicker turnaround and Ric's for home use.

Or, is there a generally accepted one to use?

I'd never really thought of it till now, but is there any issue in sharing combs?

Thanks again!

[EdG]

Yes, the Body Shop Wooden comb is very popular among LHC'ers. I have been using one for years.
Ed

[Jasonlh]

Yes, the Body Shop Wooden comb is very popular among LHC'ers. I have been using one for years.
Ed

Thanks! Well for $5.35 (on sale) including shipping, that sounds like a steal. One's on its way to me now then (no store locally).

[The Lizard Wife]

Regarding tension headaches, when your hair is getting long enough to bun: for me, center-held buns are key! Anything that requires "catching scalp hair" to secure it pulls and gives me an awful tension headache. For reference, the first center-held bun I could manage was the Disc bun (since you divide the ponytail into two thinner sections for wrapping, you can do it at a shorter length than a bun that wraps the whole ponytail in one go). Also, play around with where you place the bun. I thought the only good spot for me was at the nape of my neck, but after I got an undercut to take some of the weight out of my hair, I've found that I have another good spot high on the back of my head, almost where it rounds to the top of my head (even though that spot is uncomfortable for the weight of a ponytail or a braid hanging down from there).

I also found a low English braid easier on my scalp than a higher-than-nape ponytail, before I could bun. And, when I want to wear my hair down around the house but don't want it getting tangled, I like an English braid on each side of my head. For some reason, two are more comfy than one.

[Jasonlh]

The Lizard Wife, thank you for the advice on the tension headache hair styles that worked for you. Even a scalp bun is working better than a ponytail, though definitely not perfect (thankfully, I spend most of my day in an office, so even if my hair isn't long enough for a bun that holds through running, I can get it to hold well enough for my needs with just two sticks (forks on their way to try that out as well)). Looking forward to it being long enough again to try a center held bun. I need to learn how to braid still. Always wanted to, never have learned.