Curly Hair Myths Exposed with The Curl Ninja

[desisparkles]

So I just found her on youtube and have been basically binge watching her vids.

Since watching, I've discovered I have naturally healthy high porosity hair which since I've learned about porosity a little over a year ago - have always been told my high po hair must somehow be damaged.

I was confused about this because I haven't permed, heat damaged, chemically treated or box dyed or bleached. I also took a mirror in the shower and noticed my undyed top half of my hair took in water as high po as well and that fine wavy hair is most commonly naturally high porosity.

Was curious if anyone else found her channel useful. Also just wanted to put her info out there if you want to see someone else's take on curly hair that seems to really differ from any other hair tuber I've seen yet.

[hinabelle]

Thanks for bringing her up!! She speaks with so much sense, it's refreshing! Given what she's saying, I'm low porosity (opposite of you, I thought I was high) and I can't wait to keep watching her videos and try to fix my hair.
In general, professionals (i.e. getting paid for a task) seem to have a much better handle on speaking to a general audience than hobbyists (i.e. doing a task for fun).
She really knows how to convey information!

[desisparkles]

Thanks for bringing her up!! She speaks with so much sense, it's refreshing! Given what she's saying, I'm low porosity (opposite of you, I thought I was high) and I can't wait to keep watching her videos and try to fix my hair.
In general, professionals (i.e. getting paid for a task) seem to have a much better handle on speaking to a general audience than hobbyists (i.e. doing a task for fun).
She really knows how to convey information!

you are so welcome! I agree she is def a wealth of knowledge and is changing how I look at products completely.

[lapushka]

I'm not much into porosity, I don't think it's the one determining factor for everything.

I think the curl ninja has got a lot to learn about the various methods - her channel is not that old yet. I have noticed that much. I see a lot more expertise with the regular natural channels I watch. And I have caught her talking total nonsense on things; sorry. That's just my 2cts. She is a hair dresser and kind of looks at things more from that perspective, I find.

[hinabelle]

I agree lapushka, certainly having watched more of her videos I don't think everything she says is gospel nor is porosity everything.
But I do understand porosity a -lot- more now! I for the life of me couldn't wrap my head around it until watching some of her videos.
She also only talks about DevaCurl products which is big points removed -- I can't afford that stuff!

[desisparkles]

Was hoping you'd chime in Lapushka!

I have tweeked some things since finding her channel, not applying product to sopping wet hair (tried that long ago but stopped, not sure why) by mf scrunching well before adding product (simplified to just 1 or 2) and just understanding that my porosity may never well change and i'm getting good definition and volume with very minimal effort. Also I was using leave ins and I think that was weighing my fine hair down - probably why I'm getting such volume now.

She also made a video about ingredients that end with "ate" and how even if it's Not a sulphate it may dry your hair out and had clients experience that. But, she also said she had a high porosity fine hair come in where the devacurl low poo delight was drying her hair out and that she believed she needed the "ate's" to get her hair in the best state. Things I def will be paying attention to in the future as I looked at my curly girl approved shampoos (low poos) and they pretty much all have "ate" words in the first 5 ingredients.

[Ylva]

Regarding porosity, I think it makes somewhat of a difference in what the hair can handle. This is just my theory and I haven't actually tested this in any way, but I suspect that my virgin hair is very low porosity. Conditioners do nothing much to it, and I can basically just roll with shampoo only even at great lengths. That's what I always did as a child longhair. And I think that's the reason why my hair, although fine, can take a remarkable amount of chemical processing - because after, let's say, a round of bleach that turns it almost white, it'll still return to normal porosity state, and it'll resemble virgin hair a lot in terms of the condition it's in.

[desisparkles]

Interesting, Yylva.

The Curl Ninja has been doing an experiment of going conditioner free on her hair for 2 months and said the only parts of her hair that got dry was her tightly curled part in front which is low porosity. Her looser curls which are high porosity in back weren't dry at all so she just recently stated just putting conditioner on her tight curls.

She only uses DevaCurl Low poo delight & Build up Buster and One Condition Delight and continually states that her experiment is only with these products.

I was very hesitant to try DevaCurl as yes, they are pricey and I am not one to over spend - on Anything.

But a few months ago DevaCurl had a special for their wavy kit - half off - so I bought it and honest truth the first time I used the Low Poo Delight shampoo my hair was so soft I finger detangled it and that was before I used condish. I was in shock. I have never been able to do that before and that was before finding curl ninja and hearing her talk about doing the same.

That is the shampoo she uses and is currently going conditioner free with so I get how it's a possibility.

[nycelle]

I've seen her videos. Personally, I think there's some thing she's very confused on when it comes to porosity... but whatever.

What I don't appreciate is how she comes down on certain methods like Squish to Condish. Girl, if it doesn't work for you, move on. But it works for plenty of people (including me) so no need to poo poo on it.

[desisparkles]

I've seen her videos. Personally, I think there's some thing she's very confused on when it comes to porosity... but whatever.

What I don't appreciate is how she comes down on certain methods like Squish to Condish. Girl, if it doesn't work for you, move on. But it works for plenty of people (including me) so no need to poo poo on it.

I still STC, I do it gently so I don't see the harm.

I pulled out my curly girl handbook and I don't see anything about porosity in it (also googled to see if I missed it) - granted I didn't reread the entire book yet but find that interesting if Lorraine Massey didn't put much importance on it.

My kids have either low or medium/high porosity and all their hair is completely healthy and virgin and I use the same products on us all. 2 are fine haired and one is low po (straight hair) while the other medium po (wavy-botticelli).
(eta: we use the same shampoo and condish - they don't need stylers on their perfect manes)

I did see under the wavy section she states a lot of fine hairs without flyaways may not always need conditioning after cleansing and may skip it completely if hair feels soft enough after cleansing.

[ynne]

I've seen her videos. Personally, I think there's some thing she's very confused on when it comes to porosity... but whatever.

What I don't appreciate is how she comes down on certain methods like Squish to Condish. Girl, if it doesn't work for you, move on. But it works for plenty of people (including me) so no need to poo poo on it.

I was surprised about her Squish to Condish video! It seems to work for so many people, and then there's the article showing how well it coats the hair (http://science-yhairblog.blogspot.com/2018/08/conditioning-technique-squish-to.html), but she just dismissed it as useless. :/
Plus, she recommends only products out of my price range, so I guess I'm not the target audience.
But it's great if someone still finds useful information in it. :)

[Joules]

Regarding porosity, I think it makes somewhat of a difference in what the hair can handle. This is just my theory and I haven't actually tested this in any way, but I suspect that my virgin hair is very low porosity. Conditioners do nothing much to it, and I can basically just roll with shampoo only even at great lengths. That's what I always did as a child longhair. And I think that's the reason why my hair, although fine, can take a remarkable amount of chemical processing - because after, let's say, a round of bleach that turns it almost white, it'll still return to normal porosity state, and it'll resemble virgin hair a lot in terms of the condition it's in.

I agree. Porosity determines the overall approach to hair. I've never been able to just roll with shampoo, ever. You don't want to know what my hair was like until I turned 12 and discovered that conditioner existed. I'll try to describe: once in 5th grade I was late for school because I couldn't brush my barely shoulder length hair for so long. I need lots of conditioning with lots of protein regularly, that's just how my hair is, otherwise it's gonna look and behave like something that's been fried with bleach repeatedly and then dyed back to light brown. There's also that notion that lower porosity hair can take more heat than higher porosity hair (again, I used a flat iron on my hair only once, 2 inches of my ends fell off and I never used it since) So yeah, I'd say porosity is everything.

[lapushka]

When my hair was bleached beyond its life (to get henna out), it was high porosity aka damaged (in my case). For my hair that meant I needed to use different products.

I think normal hair is pretty medium porosity. People tend to classify themselves as either low (which is rare) or high. And normal or medium porosity doesn't even seem to exist. This is odd and isn't normal, IMMHO.

I just classify myself normal porosity and don't blame everything on that. There could be many culprits for products not working for your hair, it doesn't mean it's the porosity level. Just my 2cts.

[Panthera]

I'm always a bit skeptical when professionals recommend or criticize something. Of course they will praise and recommend their products and services.
She seems to believe the prize tag of the product is what determines whether it is good or bad. Cheap drugstore products must be bad and have bad ingredients. Where does her opinion come from? Has she tried different kinds of drugstore products for a long time or did she share articles where cheap products were scientifically tested and proved to be bad? English is my second language so I didn't understand everything and I didn't watch all of her videos. I get the point about synthetic vs. natural ingredients though. But you can find natural ingredients in drugstore products too and I do believe the non-synthetic is probably better.

The more expensive products often have like a mile long list of useless ingredients, it looks good but you just pay more for something you don't even need or something which does nothing to your hair. For example, if a fancy ingredient with amazing healing powers is 23rd in the ingredient list, I highly doubt it will help with anything... I saw that fancy healing ingredient in a Redken shampoo so I didn't just make it up. :D Of course there are good "professional" products and bad drugstore products but the price is not everything. It doesn't necessarily mean the product or method is bad if it gives bad results, it really depends on the hair type and also personal preference.

It was very interesting listening to the raving about shampoo, how good shampoo will fix your hair and change your porosity. I've always thought shampoo is something I use just to remove dirt and oils etc from my scalp, I've never been very picky about shampoo and I also fix bad shampoos with conditioner. I've never thought about it as something important. That's just my personal opinion, not based in any real knowledge or anything. I'm not sure if I believe better shampoo would fix my low porosity hair but it would be interesting to try.

[desisparkles]

When my hair was bleached beyond its life (to get henna out), it was high porosity aka damaged (in my case). For my hair that meant I needed to use different products.

I think normal hair is pretty medium porosity. People tend to classify themselves as either low (which is rare) or high. And normal or medium porosity doesn't even seem to exist. This is odd and isn't normal, IMMHO.

I just classify myself normal porosity and don't blame everything on that. There could be many culprits for products not working for your hair, it doesn't mean it's the porosity level. Just my 2cts.

true.

for all I know I am medium/normal porosity and am assuming it's high because it takes in water effortlessly and dries fairly quickly.

[desisparkles]

I'm always a bit skeptical when professionals recommend or criticize something. Of course they will praise and recommend their products and services.
She seems to believe the prize tag of the product is what determines whether it is good or bad. Cheap drugstore products must be bad and have bad ingredients. Where does her opinion come from? Has she tried different kinds of drugstore products for a long time or did she share articles where cheap products were scientifically tested and proved to be bad? English is my second language so I didn't understand everything and I didn't watch all of her videos. I get the point about synthetic vs. natural ingredients though. But you can find natural ingredients in drugstore products too and I do believe the non-synthetic is probably better.

The more expensive products often have like a mile long list of useless ingredients, it looks good but you just pay more for something you don't even need or something which does nothing to your hair. For example, if a fancy ingredient with amazing healing powers is 23rd in the ingredient list, I highly doubt it will help with anything... I saw that fancy healing ingredient in a Redken shampoo so I didn't just make it up. :D Of course there are good "professional" products and bad drugstore products but the price is not everything. It doesn't necessarily mean the product or method is bad if it gives bad results, it really depends on the hair type and also personal preference.

It was very interesting listening to the raving about shampoo, how good shampoo will fix your hair and change your porosity. I've always thought shampoo is something I use just to remove dirt and oils etc from my scalp, I've never been very picky about shampoo and I also fix bad shampoos with conditioner. I've never thought about it as something important. That's just my personal opinion, not based in any real knowledge or anything. I'm not sure if I believe better shampoo would fix my low porosity hair but it would be interesting to try.

I had never been picky with shampoo either. I grew to hip from only using suave shampoo and condish.
It was only when my then 3 year old babe told me the suave burned him while I was applying it that I did some research and went down the "healthy hair products" rabbit hole and never going back. My hair has improved tremendously in appearance alone and growing like a weed.

[Ylva]

The more expensive products often have like a mile long list of useless ingredients, it looks good but you just pay more for something you don't even need or something which does nothing to your hair. For example, if a fancy ingredient with amazing healing powers is 23rd in the ingredient list, I highly doubt it will help with anything... I saw that fancy healing ingredient in a Redken shampoo so I didn't just make it up. :D Of course there are good "professional" products and bad drugstore products but the price is not everything. It doesn't necessarily mean the product or method is bad if it gives bad results, it really depends on the hair type and also personal preference.

It was very interesting listening to the raving about shampoo, how good shampoo will fix your hair and change your porosity. I've always thought shampoo is something I use just to remove dirt and oils etc from my scalp, I've never been very picky about shampoo and I also fix bad shampoos with conditioner. I've never thought about it as something important. That's just my personal opinion, not based in any real knowledge or anything. I'm not sure if I believe better shampoo would fix my low porosity hair but it would be interesting to try.

I don't speak for any particular product here, but just thought to say that depending on the ingredient, you don't need a lot of it in order for it to work well. In some cases, it will only work well at low concentrations, or in combination with other ingredients, in which case there can't be very much of it.

Regarding the shampoo matter, I used to think that way, too, and didn't pay much attention to shampoo, but I've definitely noticed that "good" shampoo (whatever that means to each individual), or rather, FITTING shampoo for my hair in particular, makes a big difference for me. Of course, its main purpose is to cleanse, but I feel that it also sort of prepares a surface for the conditioners to work on. Anyway, it makes a difference for me, that's all I can say in the end. :)

[ynne]

She seems to believe the prize tag of the product is what determines whether it is good or bad. Cheap drugstore products must be bad and have bad ingredients. Where does her opinion come from? Has she tried different kinds of drugstore products for a long time or did she share articles where cheap products were scientifically tested and proved to be bad? English is my second language so I didn't understand everything and I didn't watch all of her videos. I get the point about synthetic vs. natural ingredients though. But you can find natural ingredients in drugstore products too and I do believe the non-synthetic is probably better.

I also did not watch all of her videos (& I'm also not a native speaker), but all I caught from her reasoning was that she already loves this line of products so she never felt the need to try different things. That was a bit concerning to me, even though it makes sense from the point of view of a hairdresser (to provide her clients with a well-known, top quality brand), it's not quite as useful review when you can't compare it to anything. But that's just my opinion anyways! And maybe she elaborates more elsewhere. :)

[lapushka]

I just watched a video where she basically said that after a consultation she urges her clients to use the products she recommends (of course they probably have to buy them from her), before she will even touch their hair. Something along those lines!

[Ylva]

I just watched a video where she basically said that after a consultation she urges her clients to use the products she recommends (of course they probably have to buy them from her), before she will even touch their hair. Something along those lines!

:shake: This kind of stuff just depresses me.

[nycelle]

I think she's looking for a Devacurl sponsorship.

[lapushka]

I think she's looking for a Devacurl sponsorship.

I got that vibe too.

She's only been on YT a short time, came up with a smart title for herself, but to me she is *far* less of an expert than all the naturally curly women I watch on YT. :)

[Reservechic]

I came across her channel a while ago. I also subscribed to "ManesByMell" (if I have it wtong then somebody please correct me) as well. I predominantly watch both of them because of their personalities. I feel that they provide more entertainment than anything to me. I don't go by their product recommendations, and some of the things I feel that they say does make sense, while some of the stuff I do take with a grain of salt.

I feel that a lot of what is being done is self-promotion, because at the end of the day, their jobs are to gain as many clients as they can. So, the best way to do that for a lot of stylists is through them getting YouTube channels and/or or being on social media. I'm really not all into plenty of things that they have talked about on their channels, but I feel that I'm so over all of the harping that has been towards addressing the Curly Girl Method, and de-bunking stuff that Lorraine Massey has said in regards to certain ingredients that they feels individuals with textured hair should avoid. I also feel that he Curl Ninja even though she is not Deva affiliated, brings up DevaCurl products way too Judy, yet, she signed up for Deva certified training, but then later changed her mind, but still she acts like she wants to have so,etching going with DevaCurl, nonetheless. Plus, You don't have to be a hair stylist to know that silicones, sulfates, mineral oil, and other non-CG friendly ingredients aren't evil, and if a person chooses to use such and if it doesn't negatively harm their hair or scalp, then they have every right to continue using such. It's not like someone has committed some great hair sin, if they choose to use products that contain these ingredients in them. Just like it's not some type of hair sin, if a person doesn't choose to only use natural based hair care products either.

When I first decided that I was going to start wearing my hair in its naturally curly state, and I came upon my very first hair care forum (which starts with the letter N), all I was being bombarded with was the CG Method. So, I followed that path, because I kept being told that it was the best route to go, but, then I eventually came to realize, that there was nothing wrong with venturing out, trying products that interested me, whether they were considered CG friendly or not, and just sticking with what I find happens to work best for my individual curls through trial and error.

There is no one size fits all method when it comes to taking care of anyone's hair, whether naturally textured or not. Which is why, whatever regimen a person goes by, it has to be specifically suited to fully meet their hair and scalp's own individual needs best. Also, even though they are professional hair stylists, anyone that watches them should be well are of the facts that neither one of them can see their viewers hair and scalps up close in order to see what's currently going on with such, plus, they can't provide their viewers with individualized hair regimens, without seeing them face-to-face either. They can put out suggestions on camera, but they can't go a whole lot deeper with helping someone with hair and scalp issues without an actual face-to-face salon consultation and visit. And, in the salons they work in, they're definitely not using cheap drugstore products on their clients hair and scalps. They're using high-end, expensive products in the salons where they work in and on their own hair as well. It is okay if people find these products happen to work best for their hair and have the money to continuously invest in such. But, is something that's surely not practical for everyone.

[desisparkles]

I came across her channel a while ago. I also subscribed to "ManesByMell" (if I have it wtong then somebody please correct me) as well. I predominantly watch both of them because of their personalities. I feel that they provide more entertainment than anything to me. I don't go by their product recommendations, and some of the things I feel that they say does make sense, while some of the stuff I do take with a grain of salt.

I feel that a lot of what is being done is self-promotion, because at the end of the day, their jobs are to gain as many clients as they can. So, the best way to do that for a lot of stylists is through them getting YouTube channels and/or or being on social media. I'm really not all into plenty of things that they have talked about on their channels, but I feel that I'm so over all of the harping that has been towards addressing the Curly Girl Method, and de-bunking stuff that Lorraine Massey has said in regards to certain ingredients that they feels individuals with textured hair should avoid. I also feel that he Curl Ninja even though she is not Deva affiliated, brings up DevaCurl products way too Judy, yet, she signed up for Deva certified training, but then later changed her mind, but still she acts like she wants to have so,etching going with DevaCurl, nonetheless. Plus, You don't have to be a hair stylist to know that silicones, sulfates, mineral oil, and other non-CG friendly ingredients aren't evil, and if a person chooses to use such and if it doesn't negatively harm their hair or scalp, then they have every right to continue using such. It's not like someone has committed some great hair sin, if they choose to use products that contain these ingredients in them. Just like it's not some type of hair sin, if a person doesn't choose to only use natural based hair care products either.

When I first decided that I was going to start wearing my hair in its naturally curly state, and I came upon my very first hair care forum (which starts with the letter N), all I was being bombarded with was the CG Method. So, I followed that path, because I kept being told that it was the best route to go, but, then I eventually came to realize, that there was nothing wrong with venturing out, trying products that interested me, whether they were considered CG friendly or not, and just sticking with what I find happens to work best for my individual curls through trial and error.

There is no one size fits all method when it comes to taking care of anyone's hair, whether naturally textured or not. Which is why, whatever regimen a person goes by, it has to be specifically suited to fully meet their hair and scalp's own individual needs best. Also, even though they are professional hair stylists, anyone that watches them should be well are of the facts that neither one of them can see their viewers hair and scalps up close in order to see what's currently going on with such, plus, they can't provide their viewers with individualized hair regimens, without seeing them face-to-face either. They can put out suggestions on camera, but they can't go a whole lot deeper with helping someone with hair and scalp issues without an actual face-to-face salon consultation and visit. And, in the salons they work in, they're definitely not using cheap drugstore products on their clients hair and scalps. They're using high-end, expensive products in the salons where they work in and on their own hair as well. It is okay if people find these products happen to work best for their hair and have the money to continuously invest in such. But, is something that's surely not practical for everyone.

well said!!


I like manes by mell too.

I truly didn't realise her channel would come off in such a harsh way when I posted about it.

I like that she says not to buy products based on what curl type the product claims it's for and her insight on product ingredients and porosities. Plus hearing about how we are trained to buy buy buy and never stick to one product def rings true to me. Sure she's not the only one saying that but still.

I have had better volume and better refresh days since following her tips and I do enjoy using devacurl as well. I change my products up so often (soo soo many in my closet) that I always rotate but am going to give each it's own run time from now on to really see the results - that is unless I notice my hair changing for the worse - then I'll discontinue it's use.

I am new to actually putting effort and education into my hair and I'm a sponge right now. I take what helps me and my strands and roll with it. If it doesn't work for me, so be it - as long as I'm hopefully being gentle with my hair and not hurting it in the long run, I'm good.