Scalp care

[Begemot]

I'm not sure if it's okay to post this thread on the Mane forum, mods feel free to move it where it belongs!

It seems that discussion about scalp care is scattered across the board here and I thought to try bring it in one place. Taking care of your scalp is mostly a skin issue but a bit of a hair issue too. Most scalp care products are lumped together with hair care products and the products you use on your scalp should cater both your skin and your hair. Some hairdresser and trichologist likened the scalp to "the flower bed and soil from which your hair grows." Generally speaking, healthy hair grows from healthy scalp. There are already discussions about common things like dandruff and medical conditions like SD here, but this thread can address many more things also: scalp massages, oiling, tonics, serums, product reviews, exfoliating, DIY stuff, shedding, scalp pain, maybe sharing updates about scalp health etc. Just figuring out what are our individual needs and experiences with scalp care.

I don't mean to imply that everyone out there needs to have some kind of special routine and a dozen of products to have healthy scalp, since many people have no trouble what so ever with their scalp and like they say, why try fixing something that ain't broken? I happen to be one of those unlucky people that experiences problems with my scalp time to time and I just like to fuss over it. It makes sense to me to show some special care for my scalp's skin since I care for the skin of my face and body pretty much daily. I believe it benefits my hair in the long run.

So discuss anything related to scalp care here :)

[Ylva]

Great idea for a thread! :)

I don't generally have scalp issues, and my scalp doesn't say this or that about what shampoo I use, as long as I don't go too long without cleansing it properly. I don't really know for sure how long is too long, but if I was using sulfate free shampoos, for example, I should probably wash my scalp with sulfates weekly or every other week (I generally wash 2-3 times a week). I oil my scalp every once in a while and always remove that with a sulfate shampoo.

The most horrible thing I experienced with regards to my scalp was stress hives that started from my arms and over time spread to many locations on my body, including my scalp. :/ Nobody believed it was stress-induced, but so far I have experienced it twice and both times it vanished a week or two after the (long-term) stress eased. While no longer scalp-related, I just wish to mention that those experiences really taught me the importance of controlling stress levels. It showed me just how big of an impact emotional well being has on one's physical health, and since then I have been paying extra attention to it.

[Katsura]

For me at the moment it's scalp first. This autumn and winter was so difficult until I finally found LV's soothing shampoo - no colourings, no perfumes and with piroctone olamine. I was happy to find out that piroctone olamine has beneficial influences on hair too, similar to ketoconatzole. My scalp is so cranky I'm afraid to let anything else touch it, so I rather keep things very simple. I get scalp problems also from consuming too much sugar or gluten. Also stretching washes results to exessive itching and hair loss.

[Begemot]

Great idea for a thread! :)

I don't generally have scalp issues, and my scalp doesn't say this or that about what shampoo I use, as long as I don't go too long without cleansing it properly. I don't really know for sure how long is too long, but if I was using sulfate free shampoos, for example, I should probably wash my scalp with sulfates weekly or every other week (I generally wash 2-3 times a week). I oil my scalp every once in a while and always remove that with a sulfate shampoo.

The most horrible thing I experienced with regards to my scalp was stress hives that started from my arms and over time spread to many locations on my body, including my scalp. :/ Nobody believed it was stress-induced, but so far I have experienced it twice and both times it vanished a week or two after the (long-term) stress eased. While no longer scalp-related, I just wish to mention that those experiences really taught me the importance of controlling stress levels. It showed me just how big of an impact emotional well being has on one's physical health, and since then I have been paying extra attention to it.

Thanks for the encouragement! :o

Oh no, that sounds awful :( It's nice to know the exact thing that triggers the symptoms but controlling stress isn't always a piece of cake... Stress is something that creates so many problems but I probably wouldn't know to blame it if my scalp go upset. So thank you for mentioning it here!


For me at the moment it's scalp first. This autumn and winter was so difficult until I finally found LV's soothing shampoo - no colourings, no perfumes and with piroctone olamine. I was happy to find out that piroctone olamine has beneficial influences on hair too, similar to ketoconatzole. My scalp is so cranky I'm afraid to let anything else touch it, so I rather keep things very simple. I get scalp problems also from consuming too much sugar or gluten. Also stretching washes results to exessive itching and hair loss.

I suspect sugar causes problems for me too but unfortunately I'm a huge sugar-holic. Last year I managed to stay away from added sugars for 1,5 months and then went straight back to cookies. Your message and Ylva's message highlight the importance of life style and diet. Healthy body and head, healthy hair. Everything is connected.

It's interesting how for some stretching washes is beneficial and for some it's not a good idea (I'm in the same boat as you are). LV shampoo sounds great, gonna google piroctone olamine now... ;)

[amiraaah]

I have scalp problems as my scalp is very dry! I oil my scalp every time before taking a shower. I do scalp massages every other day because i love how it feels. Whenever i do it i feel the blood moving in my head. Because i have dandruff i exfoliate once or twice a month using salt and coconut oil.

[lapushka]

I have SD (oily to normal scalp and flaking, itch, redness when it flares) and I have to keep a close eye on my scalp.

Generally, as long as I use a harsh sulfate I'm mostly fine.

Sometimes I use H&S shampoo and leave it on a couple min. (that's new) and sometimes I really can't avoid it and need to bust out the Nizoral 2%, prescription strength in most countries except Belgium. We "only" have the 2% available and it is OTC. It is 14.25 euro lately for 100ml, it's best that I can avoid washing with that (I will clear that bottle in 3 to 4 uses).

I keep conditioner and oils and anything else that is moisturizing off of my scalp. That includes silicones. I prefer a sulfate, silicone-free shampoo but I do have some shampoos that contain a silicone. Sometimes it goes well, other times, I'm quite sensitive to it. No rhyme or reason, that's the difficult part. But conditioner & oils I *have to* avoid!

My mom has dry scalp (no flakes) and she can go months without washing her scalp. Last she washed was December 18. And it is February 20th right now. Goes to show you just how dry. For some odd reason she doesn't produce sebum (not even in summer time), and her hair (apart from the hairspray build up in front) smells as fresh still right now compared to wash day. It's so odd. But it is getting to that time where she needs to wash it (due to hairspray build up).

[nycelle]

I have a sensitive scalp and harsh detergents cause irritation and itching so I'm sulfate free.

Washing 3 times a week has been working best, and keeps my scalp happy right now. If that changes, so will my routine.

[spidergoat]

Good thread idea!

Ylva, I have had stress hives too, but they never spread to my scalp. Doesn't sound fun :(

My DD has had scalp problems, mainly sensitivity and dandruff. We used Head & Shoulders for a while but it never helped much. I don't know if this is common, but what did help with both issues was to switch to a moisturizing shampoo and conditioner. Her dandruff has cleared up and she no longer complains of itchiness or sensitivity.

[GrowlingCupcake]

I have dandruff, and a moderately oily scalp, I guess? Washing twice a week with H&S dandruff shampoo, and conditioner has definitely helped with the dandruff but it isn't completely gone. I think even if I stop using H&S, I will have to wash twice a week at the minimum in order to keep my scalp happy.

[Zesty]

Good idea for a thread!

I've had scalp issues all my life. Mostly flakes and itchiness, sometimes a buildup of gunk. It's only been in the past few years that I've worked out how to control my issues and keep my hair happy at the same time.

Growing up I used H&S, but when I found the LHC I got it into my head that I *had* to use a gentle cleansing method. Cue years and YEARS of experimentation. I thought the best I could do was not disturb the flakes so that they wouldn't show up (which led to more of the gunk -- lovely).

Anyway, now I shampoo (twice) with sulfates twice a week and it's well controlled. My baseline is to use a clarifying shampoo followed by T-Gel coal tar shampoo. I'm experimenting with doing that only once a week, alternating with a "regular" Herbal Essence sulfate shampoo. Like lapushka, I try to minimize using the expensive stuff. I've also got a Siliscrub-style shampoo massager/brush to really exfoliate in the shower. (That's relatively new and I'm monitoring for breakage, but it seems to be going okay so far! I get a few flakes in the winter still and the shampoo massager eliminates them.)

My experimentation with scalp oiling was a spectacular failure, never again. My scalp likes to be squeaky clean.

I compensate for the drying shampoo by using oils and conditioner heavily. If I don't slather my hair in sunflower or coconut oil before a wash, then I use the ROO method in the shower. I condition twice, once with a hair mask, followed by a silicone conditioner. It makes my hair higher maintenance, but it's a small price to pay for a healthy scalp.

That was really long winded... TL;DR it took me forever but now I know that my scalp needs to be super clean to be happy.

[lapushka]

That was really long winded... TL;DR it took me forever but now I know that my scalp needs to be super clean to be happy.

Oh gosh Zesty, that takes me back, you know, because it took me *years* to figure that out. My scalp needs to be squeaky as well; it's a wonder I can go a week without a wash, but I just keep an eye on the greasies. 1 week = the most I can handle!

[Zesty]

Oh gosh Zesty, that takes me back, you know, because it took me *years* to figure that out. My scalp needs to be squeaky as well; it's a wonder I can go a week without a wash, but I just keep an eye on the greasies. 1 week = the most I can handle!

I can stretch to a week on occasion, but not back to back weeks. I think I've found my happy place with twice a week. And now that I've freaking FINALLY got it under control, I'm super hesitant to mess with it!

[lapushka]

I can stretch to a week on occasion, but not back to back weeks. I think I've found my happy place with twice a week. And now that I've freaking FINALLY got it under control, I'm super hesitant to mess with it!

Oh no, don't mess with it! :)

[lithostoic]

Sulfates cause itching, dryness, and bumps. I have been sulfate free for a couple years now. Never has my hair looked this nice even though I have bleach damage. Even sulfate free shampoo can cause these symptoms to a lesser extent, so I only shampoo twice a month and cowash in between. I make sure to massage my scalp at least once but sometimes twice a day. This has allowed me to stretch washes. I oil my scalp once a month the day before shampooing or sometimes I leave it in a couple days.

[poli]

I have been using SLS-free shampoo for about a year and than I started to have scalp issues - gunky buildup, sore spots etc. I went back to harsher sulfates and this absolutely helped. I think I might have allergic reaction to one of the detergents wildly used in SLS-free shampoos and low-poos that's called Cocamidopropyl betaine. Every single product I tried with it, I had to donate to friends, it gave me itchy scalp right away. Recently I discovered other milder options and medium level detergents (Sodium cocoyl isethionate), so far it works but this thread reminded me I need to be careful and clarify regularly.

[Begemot]

I have scalp problems as my scalp is very dry! I oil my scalp every time before taking a shower. I do scalp massages every other day because i love how it feels. Whenever i do it i feel the blood moving in my head. Because i have dandruff i exfoliate once or twice a month using salt and coconut oil.

How have you liked the salt and coconut oil mix for your scalp? I have heard people using sugar too. I don't think it would work too well for me, so I have been looking for a commercial exfoliating product :)



Sometimes I use H&S shampoo and leave it on a couple min. (that's new) and sometimes I really can't avoid it and need to bust out the Nizoral 2%, prescription strength in most countries except Belgium. We "only" have the 2% available and it is OTC. It is 14.25 euro lately for 100ml, it's best that I can avoid washing with that (I will clear that bottle in 3 to 4 uses).


H&S apparently also has the ingredient piroctone olamine that Katsura mentioned, it has the same anti-fungal effect as ketoconazole. Here is some more info about their effect on hair growth if anyone's interested (it's not an entirely unbiased site but the sources seem legit) https://www.hgspecialist.com/ingredients/the-effect-of-ketoconazole-and-piroctone-olamine-on-hair-growth

Your mother's situation sounds very intriguing, lapushka. I wonder what could inhibit scalp from producing sebum.

[Joules]

I used to have totally normal scalp, but then came The Experimental Phase and I decided to try a different approach to hair care. I tried co-washing, stretching washes and sulfate-free for 8 years, and it wrecked my scalp. I could have wrecked it much earlier if it weren't for the fact that some SLS-free shampoos I occasionally used contained sodium coco-sulfate (which is just as harsh as SLS, so it was sorta saving my ass without me knowing). It took me a while to even realise that all the horrendous follicle pain, itching and shedding were actual symptoms of actual scalp conditions and not just "scalp sensitivity". Thanks to all the hair bloggers I followed who opened my eyes.

Now I use sulfate shampoos and a scalp scrub. I really want to try a scalp exfoliation treatment with AHA, some people say acid exfoliators are better than scrubs, but for now a scrub will do. I experiment with scalp lotions, only DIY so far, actual good quality lotions are a bit too expensive for me at the moment, but I'll definitely try some of them in the future. Also I'm looking for an anti-dandruff shampoo with zinc pyrithione that's not H&S, but that's a whole different story :D (I found one in a local pharmacy, and I keep forgetting to find any reviews of it)

I always oil me hair very heavily before using harsh shampoos, and so far my hair has been doing great. If it wasn't, I'd be looking for other ways to keep it happy while using SLS. Scalp health is my top priority, because I know that it can affect hair growth and hair quality tremendously.

[Begemot]

Now I use sulfate shampoos and a scalp scrub. I really want to try a scalp exfoliation treatment with AHA, some people say acid exfoliators are better than scrubs, but for now a scrub will do. I experiment with scalp lotions, only DIY so far, actual good quality lotions are a bit too expensive for me at the moment, but I'll definitely try some of them in the future. Also I'm looking for an anti-dandruff shampoo with zinc pyrithione that's not H&S, but that's a whole different story :D (I found one in a local pharmacy, and I keep forgetting to find any reviews of it)


Same! Acid exfoliators are generally recommended for face these days, so I'd guess it applies to scalp skin too. I wouldn't want to use anything too harsh that could upset my scalp. Report back here if you try new products :)
In the past I have used basic moisturizer meant for face and body (pharmacy stuff) on my scalp and it worked okay. I have been using Sim System 4 Scalp lotion for couple of months now and love it, but it's true it can be expensive... 100 ml for about 10-20 euros.

[Begemot]

I see some talk about scalp brushes here and there. I believe I saw one last week but the spikes were so stiff and hard that I just couldn't imagine using it on any part of my body. Any experiences with scalp brushes? Somehow I imagine they could create tangles but other than that I really like the idea! I already use my TT to brush/massage my scalp gently.

[fluffyshidah]

Hi everyone! I have SD & have lost a lot of hair because of it. In the past I used to oil my scalp in a bid to regulate my scalp's sebum production. As you've probably guessed it made things a whole lot worse! Like Zesty I need my scalp squeaky clean but sulfates make my thin & fine hair break off. Then came the diagnosis that I am allergic to dimethicone! So now I'm experimenting with sulfate/cones free shampoo bars & kombucha vinegar (I can't stand the smell of ACV) scalp rinse. Going to give myself a month or so to see if it helps! Here's to getting overcoming our scalp issues!

[lapushka]

I have been using SLS-free shampoo for about a year and than I started to have scalp issues - gunky buildup, sore spots etc. I went back to harsher sulfates and this absolutely helped. I think I might have allergic reaction to one of the detergents wildly used in SLS-free shampoos and low-poos that's called Cocamidopropyl betaine. Every single product I tried with it, I had to donate to friends, it gave me itchy scalp right away. Recently I discovered other milder options and medium level detergents (Sodium cocoyl isethionate), so far it works but this thread reminded me I need to be careful and clarify regularly.

That's odd because CB is in most sulfate shampoos as well.

[lapushka]

Hi everyone! I have SD & have lost a lot of hair because of it. In the past I used to oil my scalp in a bid to regulate my scalp's sebum production. As you've probably guessed it made things a whole lot worse! Like Zesty I need my scalp squeaky clean but sulfates make my thin & fine hair break off. Then came the diagnosis that I am allergic to dimethicone! So now I'm experimenting with sulfate/cones free shampoo bars & kombucha vinegar (I can't stand the smell of ACV) scalp rinse. Going to give myself a month or so to see if it helps! Here's to getting overcoming our scalp issues!

It's easy enough to pick up a sulfate, silicone-free shampoo. Pantene Aqua Light is one, the Pantene volumizing shampoo is another. To name just a few. If you're in a pinch.

[Joules]

Same! Acid exfoliators are generally recommended for face these days, so I'd guess it applies to scalp skin too. I wouldn't want to use anything too harsh that could upset my scalp. Report back here if you try new products :)
In the past I have used basic moisturizer meant for face and body (pharmacy stuff) on my scalp and it worked okay. I have been using Sim System 4 Scalp lotion for couple of months now and love it, but it's true it can be expensive... 100 ml for about 10-20 euros.

I've heard great things about the Sim System tonic! Also the one from Weleda has great reviews.

Ideally I want to go to a trichologist and get my scalp checked out. If only I could find a genuine doctor and not someone who just diagnoses everyone with AGA, prescribes minoxidil and charges a small fortune for all of it...

[poli]

That's odd because CB is in most sulfate shampoos as well.

The SLS shampoos I have and like are very simple and contain mostly just Sodium Laureth Sulfate. Example ings: "Aqua, Sodium Laureth Sulfate,Sodium Chloride, Cocamide DEA, Polyquaternium -7, Parfum (Hexyl Cinnamal),Citric Acid,Methylchloroisothiazolinone, Methylisothiazolinone"

[Moondancer]

I have dry skin and live in a dry climate, so most of my scalp issues seem to stem from that. I also have fine hair so I have shampoo (sulfate-free) and clarify regularly. I haven't really figured out a balance yet but a few things have at least given me relief from the dry itch. I like the lavender oil and rosemary rinse the best but mostly because it feels nice and relaxing on my scalp.

[TatsuOni]

My scalp's dry. So what keeps it at bay is for me:

-CO-washing. No clarifying at all.
-Washing no more than every other (or rather three) to five weeks.
-Scalp massages and to brush my scalp properly with my BBB, by sectioning the hair. I do this a few times a week.
-Homemade scalp/hair masks.
-I also find that wearing scarves, especially during the winter helps.

[Moondancer]

My scalp's dry. So what keeps it at bay is for me:

-CO-washing. No clarifying at all.
-Washing no more than every other (or rather three) to five weeks.
-Scalp massages and to brush my scalp properly with my BBB, by sectioning the hair. I do this a few times a week.
-Homemade scalp/hair masks.
-I also find that wearing scarves, especially during the winter helps.

Three to five weeks? Or days? :confused:

[Ylva]

Three to five weeks? Or days? :confused:

I think weeks was correct. :) It's quite common (or well, not rare) that people go weeks without washing their hair, especially if they have dry scalps.

[Begemot]

I've heard great things about the Sim System tonic! Also the one from Weleda has great reviews.

Ideally I want to go to a trichologist and get my scalp checked out. If only I could find a genuine doctor and not someone who just diagnoses everyone with AGA, prescribes minoxidil and charges a small fortune for all of it...

If I remember correctly, both Sim System's and Weleda's products main ingredient is rosemary. Many years ago I experimented with making my own scalp tonics and such and actually quite liked mixing rosemary EO in something (oil probably).

Let's hope you find someone who knows their stuff :) somehow it simultaneously intrigues and terrifies me to imagine someone taking a good look at my scalp with a microscope lol.



-Homemade scalp/hair masks.


I would be interested to hear more of said scalp masks!

[Moondancer]

I think weeks was correct. :) It's quite common (or well, not rare) that people go weeks without washing their hair, especially if they have dry scalps.

I have a dry scalp and I don’t go more than 3 days usually but maybe I don’t actually have a dry scalp :confused: Going weeks is pretty impressive to me! I’m pretty new to proper hair care so forgive my ignorance! :)

[Moondancer]

BTW, TatsuOni, your hair is so beautiful :o. I also want to hear about these masks!

[nycelle]

My scalp, much like my skin is also on the dry side. I can't go a week, let alone five. Definitely a YMMV type of thing.

[lapushka]

The SLS shampoos I have and like are very simple and contain mostly just Sodium Laureth Sulfate. Example ings: "Aqua, Sodium Laureth Sulfate,Sodium Chloride, Cocamide DEA, Polyquaternium -7, Parfum (Hexyl Cinnamal),Citric Acid,Methylchloroisothiazolinone, Methylisothiazolinone"

That's great. Just thought I'd warn you. I know that the Garnier Ultra Doux shampoos (whole blends) often do contain CB next to SLES. And I have CB in a lot of my shampoos.

[Ylva]

I have a dry scalp and I don’t go more than 3 days usually but maybe I don’t actually have a dry scalp :confused: Going weeks is pretty impressive to me! I’m pretty new to proper hair care so forgive my ignorance! :)

I wouldn't know, skin is sometimes weird and hard to judge. It took me ages until I settled with having a "sensitive combination scalp", which is the same as the skin on my face and my scalp actually acts the exact same way. My scalp is on the oilier side, and I also can't comfortably go more than 3 days without washing. :) So weird!

ETA: What I mean by "comfortably" is how oily it begins to look. Health-wise, my scalp hardly says anything.

[MusicalSpoons]

I have a dry scalp and I don’t go more than 3 days usually but maybe I don’t actually have a dry scalp :confused: Going weeks is pretty impressive to me! I’m pretty new to proper hair care so forgive my ignorance! :)

For ages I had an oily scalp with flakes of dry skin (not dandruff). It turns out it was dehydrated, not truly dry in the 'doesn't produce oil' meaning of the word.

I wash with a mild, sulphate-free shampoo but I'm experimenting with judicious use of sulphates - the shampoo that keeps my scalp happy contains lots of plant oils so weighs down my hair very easily. I mean, the hair is in pretty great condition but it just doesn't look clean for very long. Blonde, M/F straight hair is absolutely the worst for looking oily quickly anyway!

Right now the method I'm trying is cleanse with mild shampoo, 'clarify' (sort of) the scalp hair with a small amount of volume shampoo (containing sodium-coco-sulphate*) and see if it looks clean for any longer. I used the volume shampoo first for a few washes and it really did give my scalp hair insane volume compared with how it normally is, but my scalp started complaining after a while. So, we'll see if this way round is any help :shrug:

*I know it's no gentler than SLS, really, but I think this particular formulation seems fairly mild and it only foams, doesn't lather. But even harsher sulphate-free shampoos were too much for my scalp so I was getting sort of desperate and willing to try something completely different from my previous search for a scalp-approved product.

[poli]

That's great. Just thought I'd warn you. I know that the Garnier Ultra Doux shampoos (whole blends) often do contain CB next to SLES. And I have CB in a lot of my shampoos.

Thank you lapushka you are right. I never used to read ingredients lists on cosmetics until I got skin or scalp irritation from some.

[fluffyshidah]

Thanks for the suggestions! I love trying out new low-poo options :)

[samanthaa]

I've only recently begun trying to tackle the flakes I've been having on my scalp, which has come as a surprise. I started getting them back in June(?), and it was surprising because I'd been using shampoo bars and stretching my washes for years with zero problems. I tried switching to a "stronger" liquid shampoo for a while (this did nothing), and then I went back to shampoo bars in November simply because I love their simple, clean ingredients. I will be sticking with the shampoo bars followed by an ACV rinse (I do use a rinse-out conditioner, but not on the scalp).

I'm a weekly washer, and the flakes are usually quite prominent the first few days after washing (after that, the hair goes up, so they're probably there but I just don't seem them). It's a patch, mostly, on the front right side right where I part my hair.

I'm two wash cycles in now to "dedicated scalp care," and it's already better. The first week I did a salt scrub the night before my wash, then a coconut oil + tea tree oil soak for about an hour prior to washing. The second week I did just a sugar + tea tree scrub a couple minutes before hopping into the shower (it's probably more beneficial to let the tea tree oil sit for a little?). Tomorrow is wash day and I haven't yet decided what I'll do. Probably another scrub for sure, but maybe another oiling too.

I generally don't understand how to judge if my skin/scalp is "oily" or "dry" or something else. My face generally never gets an oily appearance. Honestly, I don't even wash it, as I've never had trouble with oil or acne. If I'm in the shower, I'll throw some water on it, maybe with a few soap subs, that's about it.

[Moondancer]

I don’t wash my face either. I use coconut oil to take off makeup, otherwise I just spritz my face.

[TatsuOni]

Three to five weeks? Or days? :confused:


I think weeks was correct. :) It's quite common (or well, not rare) that people go weeks without washing their hair, especially if they have dry scalps.


If I remember correctly, both Sim System's and Weleda's products main ingredient is rosemary. Many years ago I experimented with making my own scalp tonics and such and actually quite liked mixing rosemary EO in something (oil probably).

Let's hope you find someone who knows their stuff :) somehow it simultaneously intrigues and terrifies me to imagine someone taking a good look at my scalp with a microscope lol.



I would be interested to hear more of said scalp masks!


I have a dry scalp and I don’t go more than 3 days usually but maybe I don’t actually have a dry scalp :confused: Going weeks is pretty impressive to me! I’m pretty new to proper hair care so forgive my ignorance! :)


BTW, TatsuOni, your hair is so beautiful :o. I also want to hear about these masks!


My scalp, much like my skin is also on the dry side. I can't go a week, let alone five. Definitely a YMMV type of thing.

Everyone's scalps are different and my scalp's happier the less I wash my hair. So yes, five weeks is correct. But it hasn't always been that way even though my scalps' always been dry.

My hair looks freshly washed up until around week two. Then it gets slightly greasy and can easily be hidden in updos. Then it doesn't get any greasier and sometimes my hair even absorbs the sebum, so that it starts to look more clean again :laugh: Though few people even see my scalp hair since I'm mostly wearing head scarves where only my bun shows :p



For my masks. I make them to suit both my scalp and hair. Some ingredients I never switch out while I don't use others every time.

I heat up water and pour over most of the ingredients. Some I add later when it's cooled off and I've strained (is that the correct word) it. I usually do this while making my morning tea and then I strain and use it during the afternoon. I leave it on for around an hour.

And it's important to put on a lid after you've poured on the hot water.

I pour the hot water over:
-Nettle - scalp and hair
-Birch leaves - hair
-Rosemary - scalp and hair
-Green tea - scalp and hair
-Chamomile - scalp
-Lavender - scalp and smell
-Oat (not always) - scalp and hair
-Flax seeds - scalp and hair
-Marigold - scalp
-Fengureek - scalp and hair
-Catnip - hair
-Honey (not always) - scalp and hair

I prepare fermented rice water two days ahead and add it too the mix when it's cooled off. - Scalp and hair

I prepare mehti the day before or take it out from the freezer. I've only been using it for a few months, but my hair really likes it. - Scalp and hair

I also add a little bit of ACV to lower the pH when it's cooled off. - Scalp and hair

I also use this as a detangling spray, but without the honey, mehti, FRV and oat.

So yeah, it's a watery mask, but it really helps my hair and scalp. I do add some more ingredients to get it to smell nicer, but I didn't include them, since the list is long already.

If anyone want to try this, you can chose whatever ingredients you want to or what you have at hand. I started out with just two ingredients years ago and then I've tried lots and lots of stuff to determine what works best for me.

[Moondancer]

Everyone's scalps are different and my scalp's happier the less I wash my hair. So yes, five weeks is correct. But it hasn't always been that way even though my scalps' always been dry.

My hair looks freshly washed up until around week two. Then it gets slightly greasy and can easily be hidden in updos. Then it doesn't get any greasier and sometimes my hair even absorbs the sebum, so that it starts to look more clean again :laugh: Though few people even see my scalp hair since I'm mostly wearing head scarves where only my bun shows :p



For my masks. I make them to suit both my scalp and hair. Some ingredients I never switch out while I don't use others every time.

I heat up water and pour over most of the ingredients. Some I add later when it's cooled off and I've strained (is that the correct word) it. I usually do this while making my morning tea and then I strain and use it during the afternoon. I leave it on for around an hour.

And it's important to put on a lid after you've poured on the hot water.

I pour the hot water over:
-Nettle - scalp and hair
-Birch leaves - hair
-Rosemary - scalp and hair
-Green tea - scalp and hair
-Chamomile - scalp
-Lavender - scalp and smell
-Oat (not always) - scalp and hair
-Flax seeds - scalp and hair
-Marigold - scalp
-Fengureek - scalp and hair
-Catnip - hair
-Honey (not always) - scalp and hair

I prepare fermented rice water two days ahead and add it too the mix when it's cooled off. - Scalp and hair

I prepare mehti the day before or take it out from the freezer. I've only been using it for a few months, but my hair really likes it. - Scalp and hair

I also add a little bit of ACV to lower the pH when it's cooled off. - Scalp and hair

I also use this as a detangling spray, but without the honey, mehti, FRV and oat.

So yeah, it's a watery mask, but it really helps my hair and scalp. I do add some more ingredients to get it to smell nicer, but I didn't include them, since the list is long already.

If anyone want to try this, you can chose whatever ingredients you want to or what you have at hand. I started out with just two ingredients years ago and then I've tried lots and lots of stuff to determine what works best for me.

Yay, I actually have all these herbs, except marigold, but I recently ordered some marigold seeds to plant in March! :joy: I'm going to try this, thank you!

[Begemot]

Thank you for the instructions TatsuOni! :blossom:

I'm thinking about making a scalp tonic from nettle and vinegar. Somewhere it said it should be slightly exfoliating and nettle is supposedly rich in sulfur and silica, which are great for making hair shinier etc.

[Joules]

Update on my peppermint scalp tonic: my hair got oily as usual, but my scalp was weirdly clean. Like, normally when I look closely at my parting I can see if it's oily or not, and with this tonic it wasn't not oily at all. My hair, however, got visibly greasy as usual. I guess it's because of the mixture of alcohol and essential oil: the alcohol dried up my scalp, but the EO made my hair oily and created some buildup at the roots. I'll use it every day for a month (as recommended) to see if it affects anything. If not, I'll probably continue using it, but only once every three days after washing my hair.

I experimented with herbal teas on my scalp a few years back. Nettle was my favorite. I could go for up to a week without washing, somehow those teas made my hair and scalp look cleaner longer. I don't remember if it affected my growth and shedding (which means that it probably didn't), and making fresh tea every day was a pain in the behind.

[MusicalSpoons]

Update on my peppermint scalp tonic: my hair got oily as usual, but my scalp was weirdly clean. Like, normally when I look closely at my parting I can see if it's oily or not, and with this tonic it wasn't not oily at all. My hair, however, got visibly greasy as usual. I guess it's because of the mixture of alcohol and essential oil: the alcohol dried up my scalp, but the EO made my hair oily and created some buildup at the roots. I'll use it every day for a month (as recommended) to see if it affects anything. If not, I'll probably continue using it, but only once every three days after washing my hair.

I experimented with herbal teas on my scalp a few years back. Nettle was my favorite. I could go for up to a week without washing, somehow those teas made my hair and scalp look cleaner longer. I don't remember if it affected my growth and shedding (which means that it probably didn't), and making fresh tea every day was a pain in the behind.

How interesting! How did you prepare and use them? Do you know what your water is like (hard, med, soft)?

[ReptilianFeline]

My scalp is odd. It is a bit on the dry side I think, and will flake and gunk and itch.

So far, my sollution is no-poo mixes. I have found a box of tulsi and that seems to work better than neem. I let the powders become the scrub and scrub my scalp with vigour, and it works pretty well. No apparent breakage or extra hair loss.

I have hard water, and magic water/acid rinses seem to help a little, but I am now trying to wash with urtekram children's shampoo as the second wash. Just quickly to remove most hard water buildup from my hair. It lathers very wuch after the no-poo mix. So far so good. And my scalp is almost a full week now without itching. I wash once a week.

[Joules]

How interesting! How did you prepare and use them? Do you know what your water is like (hard, med, soft)?

Our water is medium to hard, I guess. I've been to places with worse water, but also ours is definitely not soft. I would buy loose dried nettle or peppermint (herbs in bags aren't as good), steep 1 teaspoon of it in about half a cup of boiling water for however long the instructions instruct (usually 20-30min), then filter the tea, put it in a spray bottle, and spray on my scalp. I did it as an alternative for tea rinses: my hair hated herbs, but I still wanted the benefits of it for my scalp. Maybe I should try this again when I'm on a break from the peppermint tonic, being able to comfortably stretch washes is nice :hmm:

[Waveurly]

I usually have scalp issues like many other people and have tried many things.
- Tried co-washing, that was definite no-go.
- Oiling scalp also is not a good idea for me.
- Some sulfate free shampoos seemed to make the itch reasonably manageable.
- Going no-poo with too many moisturizing ingredients did not work out for me either and just made for a lot of time spent and lots of experiments which probably did not help much either. Too organic sometimes makes for a nice growth environment for icky things.
- I have tried so many different sulfate shampoos but I'm just way too sensitive to them, the first day it seems to be ok but then the second day after the wash the horrific itch strikes like never before and dandruff keeps falling off my head so just can't use sulfates.

I also have skin issues on my face and when I started to experiment with shampoo bars this seemed to help a bit and then, for now, the best option is using an anti-bacterial soap bar (Pine tar soap at the moment) for both face and scalp. My face has cleared up and the itch on my scalp is improving. Also it doesn't irritate my scalp as sulfates do.
I always use an acid rinse after as I can't use only soap and luckily enough I found a vinegar and lemonjuice mix in the store. So it doesnt smell that bad as only vinegar is not that great. So far so good.

I remember the only time I was completely free from the bad scalp issues, was when I tried a no-poo experiment for a year, washing my hair with only vinegar. Not having read much at that time, I used pure vinegar from the bottle. It worked very well against the scalp issues even though my hair got greasy at first, but later it actually started to look sort of dry but still greasy on top. In the end I decided it did not work due to the top still being greasy but I have not yet been able to get back to that calm happy scalp feeling of that time and shampoos definitely have not been helping.

Now I want to go back to mostly acid rinses and an anti-bacterial soap to keep the greasies at bay. As honestly I think that most scalp issues are an imbalance and/or fungus issue. But well, as everybody is different I can only speak for myself ;)
There are a few videos on youtube as well from people suffering from severe scalp issues like psoriasis who have been doing well after a while with some kind of soap and vinegar routine.

[MusicalSpoons]

Our water is medium to hard, I guess. I've been to places with worse water, but also ours is definitely not soft. I would buy loose dried nettle or peppermint (herbs in bags aren't as good), steep 1 teaspoon of it in about half a cup of boiling water for however long the instructions instruct (usually 20-30min), then filter the tea, put it in a spray bottle, and spray on my scalp. I did it as an alternative for tea rinses: my hair hated herbs, but I still wanted the benefits of it for my scalp. Maybe I should try this again when I'm on a break from the peppermint tonic, being able to comfortably stretch washes is nice :hmm:

Thank you! That's so interesting - I might try that if I end up with a bit more energy and leave the house (i.e. have to look presentable) more often. My hair is very happy with commercial conditioners and being wet once a week(ish) so rinses just are not something I want to try at this point, so hearing that you used it just on your scalp with such success is encouraging. [I have tried before with rosemary but it made my scalp feel a bit icky, however the spray bottle I own made application a problem so it probably didn't help that I used to end up virtually pouring it on :lol: Actually just *rinsing* my hair doesn't do well, but if I could get a decent spray bottle I could try this and cornflour shampoo - something else I tried unsuccessfully, being hindered by the bottle.]

[fluffyshidah]

I usually have scalp issues like many other people and have tried many things.
- Tried co-washing, that was definite no-go.
- Oiling scalp also is not a good idea for me.
- Some sulfate free shampoos seemed to make the itch reasonably manageable.
- Going no-poo with too many moisturizing ingredients did not work out for me either and just made for a lot of time spent and lots of experiments which probably did not help much either. Too organic sometimes makes for a nice growth environment for icky things.
- I have tried so many different sulfate shampoos but I'm just way too sensitive to them, the first day it seems to be ok but then the second day after the wash the horrific itch strikes like never before and dandruff keeps falling off my head so just can't use sulfates.

I also have skin issues on my face and when I started to experiment with shampoo bars this seemed to help a bit and then, for now, the best option is using an anti-bacterial soap bar (Pine tar soap at the moment) for both face and scalp. My face has cleared up and the itch on my scalp is improving. Also it doesn't irritate my scalp as sulfates do.
I always use an acid rinse after as I can't use only soap and luckily enough I found a vinegar and lemonjuice mix in the store. So it doesnt smell that bad as only vinegar is not that great. So far so good.

I remember the only time I was completely free from the bad scalp issues, was when I tried a no-poo experiment for a year, washing my hair with only vinegar. Not having read much at that time, I used pure vinegar from the bottle. It worked very well against the scalp issues even though my hair got greasy at first, but later it actually started to look sort of dry but still greasy on top. In the end I decided it did not work due to the top still being greasy but I have not yet been able to get back to that calm happy scalp feeling of that time and shampoos definitely have not been helping.

Now I want to go back to mostly acid rinses and an anti-bacterial soap to keep the greasies at bay. As honestly I think that most scalp issues are an imbalance and/or fungus issue. But well, as everybody is different I can only speak for myself ;)
There are a few videos on youtube as well from people suffering from severe scalp issues like psoriasis who have been doing well after a while with some kind of soap and vinegar routine.

Hey Waverly! I'm kinda doing what you're suggesting right now and my flakes are at its lowest. My scalp used to smell sour within 36hrs of wash and now it doesn't (highly likely due to all the gunk stuck on my scalp). I'm using J.R Ligget's Tea Tree & Hemp Oil Shampoo bar with a 20-30ml kombucha vinegar in about 150ml of water mix for the rinse. I sometimes add about 3-6 drops of geranium eo just for some scent. It's only been a week into this experiment and it does look promising. My hair is soft, my scalp isn't flaking as bad and the best part is my scalp is not sourish smelling so soon after a wash.

[blackgothicdoll]

Travelling a lot for work has my scalp feeling disgusting by the end of the week. I get itchy patches, but it's dry. No noticable flaking or soreness, but it just feels bad. Any tips for scalp care while travelling? I tried oiling it last week, and regretted it. Thankfully I got home the day after I had put oil on it and could wash it. If I could wash while I was travelling it wouldn't be an issue, but I just can't.

[lapushka]

Hey Waverly! I'm kinda doing what you're suggesting right now and my flakes are at its lowest. My scalp used to smell sour within 36hrs of wash and now it doesn't (highly likely due to all the gunk stuck on my scalp). I'm using J.R Ligget's Tea Tree & Hemp Oil Shampoo bar with a 20-30ml kombucha vinegar in about 150ml of water mix for the rinse. I sometimes add about 3-6 drops of geranium eo just for some scent. It's only been a week into this experiment and it does look promising. My hair is soft, my scalp isn't flaking as bad and the best part is my scalp is not sourish smelling so soon after a wash.

If it gets sour smelling, I would go see a dermatologist; if you haven't already. That's a good sign to go, right there. Odd smells and flakes that will not subside. You can't keep fighting this on your own, trust me.

[lapushka]

Travelling a lot for work has my scalp feeling disgusting by the end of the week. I get itchy patches, but it's dry. No noticable flaking or soreness, but it just feels bad. Any tips for scalp care while travelling? I tried oiling it last week, and regretted it. Thankfully I got home the day after I had put oil on it and could wash it. If I could wash while I was travelling it wouldn't be an issue, but I just can't.

Is there a hotel you're staying at? Then just simply take your products and wash there.

[blackgothicdoll]

Is there a hotel you're staying at? Then just simply take your products and wash there.

Yes, I stay at a hotel but I'm usually working up to 12 hours, then going back to the hotel to do additional research. I can't figure out a way I could dry my hair for it to be presentable in the morning to go back on the customer site. I usually let my hair dry for 8-12 hours, so at home I stick it in braids or wear a hat. But since I barely have 12 hours, it'd be a lot harder to do.

eta: In warm weather it's easy because I just put a lot of gel on it and pull it back into a bun, but I keep travelling into sub-zero states so I can't go outside with wet hair.

[fluffyshidah]

Hi lapushka I've been seeing a dermatologist for my Seb dermatitis for quite a while. I got prescribed many stuff for the fungal infections caused by my SD flare-ups. One of the worst stuff which was prescribed was some sulphur bar? Dried up my scalp to the point of more dermatitis and apparently the acid mantle of my scalp was severely compromised. That's when I noticed the sour smell not even 2 days post wash. Had steroid jabs into my scalp to calm the inflammation and that's when I decided to try the natural route. So far this new routine seems promising. I will definitely update should it get better or turn out a failure. Heh. Desperate times call for desperate measures. Hehe.

[Begemot]

Yes, I stay at a hotel but I'm usually working up to 12 hours, then going back to the hotel to do additional research. I can't figure out a way I could dry my hair for it to be presentable in the morning to go back on the customer site. I usually let my hair dry for 8-12 hours, so at home I stick it in braids or wear a hat. But since I barely have 12 hours, it'd be a lot harder to do.

eta: In warm weather it's easy because I just put a lot of gel on it and pull it back into a bun, but I keep travelling into sub-zero states so I can't go outside with wet hair.

I can't figure out any other way but to blowdry :hmm: Airdry as long as possible and then finish with a blowdryer? It's definitely way worse to go outside with wet hair when it's cold weather than it is to blowdry.

I don't know if you can get a hold of this product I have liked: ACO Special Care Moisturising Dry Scalp Treatment. It moisturizes and soothes sensitive scalp and can be used daily. It doesn't make your hair look oily/dirty since it's a light gel. The main ingredients are water, propylene glycol, sorbitol, panthenol and hydrogenated castor oil (in case you can't find this product but would like to look for something similar).

[lapushka]

Hi lapushka I've been seeing a dermatologist for my Seb dermatitis for quite a while. I got prescribed many stuff for the fungal infections caused by my SD flare-ups. One of the worst stuff which was prescribed was some sulphur bar? Dried up my scalp to the point of more dermatitis and apparently the acid mantle of my scalp was severely compromised. That's when I noticed the sour smell not even 2 days post wash. Had steroid jabs into my scalp to calm the inflammation and that's when I decided to try the natural route. So far this new routine seems promising. I will definitely update should it get better or turn out a failure. Heh. Desperate times call for desperate measures. Hehe.

I would still keep giving feedback to the derm and going back. If you don't do that, you miss out on the chance of them getting to the root of your problem. Sometimes that is just how it goes: trial and error.

I have never found anything that even remotely naturally calms down my SD.

You could try a shampoo with Aloe Vera as the *FIRST* ingredient, so more than water, so AV, then water. I have had a shampoo like that in the past and it did a world of wonders for the flaking (I had minimal flaking back then, though). But it worked better than H&S, I noticed.

Maybe give that a shot. But off the top of my head I wouldn't know a shampoo that is like that.

Mine was the Novalis shampoo, but it's a EU thing.

[blackgothicdoll]

Hi Begemot, yes I'm thinking maybe packing a dryer and drying on cool, but that's very time consuming too. Thanks for the product suggestion, I'll check to see if it's available in the states. If not I'm sure we have something similar.

[Begemot]

Hi Begemot, yes I'm thinking maybe packing a dryer and drying on cool, but that's very time consuming too. Thanks for the product suggestion, I'll check to see if it's available in the states. If not I'm sure we have something similar.

Hopefully you can figure out something! Give us a product review if you find a similar product :thumbsup:

[blackgothicdoll]

I need to remember to exfoliate my scalp at some point. I think I am having an eczema flare-up - though I can't tell because I can't see my scalp. Does anyone else with eczema also get eczema on their scalp?

[fluffyshidah]

I would still keep giving feedback to the derm and going back. If you don't do that, you miss out on the chance of them getting to the root of your problem. Sometimes that is just how it goes: trial and error.

I have never found anything that even remotely naturally calms down my SD.

You could try a shampoo with Aloe Vera as the *FIRST* ingredient, so more than water, so AV, then water. I have had a shampoo like that in the past and it did a world of wonders for the flaking (I had minimal flaking back then, though). But it worked better than H&S, I noticed.

Maybe give that a shot. But off the top of my head I wouldn't know a shampoo that is like that.

Mine was the Novalis shampoo, but it's a EU thing.

It's been a long 8 financially draining years of dealing with dermatologists here in Singapore. Each visit sets me back at least (equivalent to SGD) 75 Euros usually for consultation only. Once there is medications or lab work involved the costs start rocketing. Insurance doesn't usually cover dermatological treatments as they are considered cosmetics procedures. Derms here also believe steroids are the holy Grail to anything related to skin inflammation. It's ludicrous. Only in recent years with eczema related cases becoming more prevalent that they are starting to pay attention to and believe it is possible to be allergic to things like silicones etc. But the tests to confirm allergies are expensive. Basic allergens start from approx 260 Euros and increases depending on exotic-ness. Heh. I really appreciate your product suggestions and will look out for them to try out one by one until I find something that works in the long run. SD seems to have no cure! It's sad to think the final decision may be having to eliminate sugar.

[fluffyshidah]

I need to remember to exfoliate my scalp at some point. I think I am having an eczema flare-up - though I can't tell because I can't see my scalp. Does anyone else with eczema also get eczema on their scalp?

blackgothicdoll it is highly possible if you're suffering from eczema elsewhere to have it flare up in your scalp.

[fluffyshidah]

Update on my peppermint scalp tonic: my hair got oily as usual, but my scalp was weirdly clean. Like, normally when I look closely at my parting I can see if it's oily or not, and with this tonic it wasn't not oily at all. My hair, however, got visibly greasy as usual. I guess it's because of the mixture of alcohol and essential oil: the alcohol dried up my scalp, but the EO made my hair oily and created some buildup at the roots. I'll use it every day for a month (as recommended) to see if it affects anything. If not, I'll probably continue using it, but only once every three days after washing my hair.

I experimented with herbal teas on my scalp a few years back. Nettle was my favorite. I could go for up to a week without washing, somehow those teas made my hair and scalp look cleaner longer. I don't remember if it affected my growth and shedding (which means that it probably didn't), and making fresh tea every day was a pain in the behind.

I used to do tea rinses too but they made my hair so stringy. But I loved the smell it left in my hair. And I seem to have your problem with dry scalp but greasy looking hair. What's your hairtype? Mine's 1b so I'm thinking the grease has no where else to go.

[Begemot]

Uh-oh, found yet another scalp product I'd like to try... Vichy Dercos Micro peel shampoo. It's described as exfoliating and moisturizing shampoo with salicylic acid and apricot seed powder. Gonna go see if I can find any product reviews.

[Waveurly]

Hey Waverly! I'm kinda doing what you're suggesting right now and my flakes are at its lowest. My scalp used to smell sour within 36hrs of wash and now it doesn't (highly likely due to all the gunk stuck on my scalp). I'm using J.R Ligget's Tea Tree & Hemp Oil Shampoo bar with a 20-30ml kombucha vinegar in about 150ml of water mix for the rinse. I sometimes add about 3-6 drops of geranium eo just for some scent. It's only been a week into this experiment and it does look promising. My hair is soft, my scalp isn't flaking as bad and the best part is my scalp is not sourish smelling so soon after a wash.

Hey fluffyshidah, I'm glad you see some results with it. I do too, it got a bit better for me over time as well but I can not go a lot of day s without washing anyways because the oil on my scalp seems to make the irritations worse as well.


It's been a long 8 financially draining years of dealing with dermatologists here in Singapore. Each visit sets me back at least (equivalent to SGD) 75 Euros usually for consultation only. Once there is medications or lab work involved the costs start rocketing. Insurance doesn't usually cover dermatological treatments as they are considered cosmetics procedures. Derms here also believe steroids are the holy Grail to anything related to skin inflammation. It's ludicrous. Only in recent years with eczema related cases becoming more prevalent that they are starting to pay attention to and believe it is possible to be allergic to things like silicones etc. But the tests to confirm allergies are expensive. Basic allergens start from approx 260 Euros and increases depending on exotic-ness. Heh. I really appreciate your product suggestions and will look out for them to try out one by one until I find something that works in the long run. SD seems to have no cure! It's sad to think the final decision may be having to eliminate sugar.

And then, I do understand the choice to try a natural route as not all things dermatologists prescribe work and especially if it costs a lot of money. I do however think that diet is one of the key issues as well to getting a healthy scalp, and to be honest I'm considering this myself too but its so hard to give up chocolate... ;)

[fluffyshidah]

Uh-oh, found yet another scalp product I'd like to try... Vichy Dercos Micro peel shampoo. It's described as exfoliating and moisturizing shampoo with salicylic acid and apricot seed powder. Gonna go see if I can find any product reviews.

I keep seeing this at my local drugstores. But I'm guessing you would want to alternate this shampoo with another if you shampoo often. I had a shampoo that contained salicylic acid before. It worked the first few washes then I think it irritated my already irritated scalp.

[fluffyshidah]

Waveurly... Chocolates *sigh*

I've kind of resigned myself to having to shampoo my hair often. But the vinegar rinse has finally allowed me stretch wash days. I usually shampoo every other day. It's been full 3 days since my last shampoo and my roots are only starting to grease up. Or it could be also the fact that I'm following the WO method's scritching and preening before the rinse. Preening is the hard part though. I'm not even APL and I find it a challenge to push the sebum to my ends. So I'll still be using conditioner for now. I think for me the scritch and preen is like an exfoliating method of some sort. It's psychologically rewarding to manually get those pesky crusty flakes off. It is time consuming though since I have to do it daily otherwise my dermatitis will flare up since it's not forgiving when scalp gets greasy.

[Begemot]

I keep seeing this at my local drugstores. But I'm guessing you would want to alternate this shampoo with another if you shampoo often. I had a shampoo that contained salicylic acid before. It worked the first few washes then I think it irritated my already irritated scalp.

Oh yeah I imagined I'd use it max. once or twice every month, since I don't have an active problem with my scalp at the moment. I checked the instructions and it says to use the shampoo for 4 weeks, three times a week, and then just once a week after the four weeks. This shampoo also has some other irritants along with salisylic acid, definitely wouldn't recommend it to anyone with a sensitive scalp.

[Begemot]

I have been using Sim Sensitive 4 Moisture Scalp lotion since the beginning of January. Majority of the time I have used it once a week. There's just enough for next week, maybe for two applications. This product cost me 10 euros so I think it's an okay price for me, also considering that that the little bottle of 100 ml lasted about three months. I have been very pleased. I never even realized there's moisturizing products for scalp. This one has many great ingredients (glycerin, castor oil, piroctone olamine, panthenol, aloe vera juice, ceramides, niacinamide) and I believe I'm going to buy more in the future. Right now I have my eyes on another product... Dermosil's Hydro gel 0 % is an "oil-free moisturising gel for dry, sensitive and atopic skin. Can be used all over and also for dry scalp." This gel has glycerin and Pentylene Glycol. I think this product could be nice for the warmer months. It's also very cheap, 100 ml for less than 5 euros. Applying a moisturizing product on my scalp once a week has become a really nice routine for me. My scalp likes it :D

[Natalia_A00]

I feel that I really have to learn about scalp care because I'm a little worried about my scalp. My hair has always been oily but I've never had any major problems with it. But recently my scalp gets very itchy and flaky (it's not dandruff I think because it's barely noticeable, but when I scratch it a lot of skin comes off and it's yucky) and I don't know why. Sometimes it gets better but usually after the second day since I wash my hair, my scalp gets itchy. I hope it's not SD but I might get this checked or something if it doesn't improve.

[lapushka]

I feel that I really have to learn about scalp care because I'm a little worried about my scalp. My hair has always been oily but I've never had any major problems with it. But recently my scalp gets very itchy and flaky (it's not dandruff I think because it's barely noticeable, but when I scratch it a lot of skin comes off and it's yucky) and I don't know why. Sometimes it gets better but usually after the second day since I wash my hair, my scalp gets itchy. I hope it's not SD but I might get this checked or something if it doesn't improve.

I would get this checked now, because if it is SD, the longer it is kept untreated with something medicated, the more hair can fall out. Just FYI.

[Natalia_A00]

I would get this checked now, because if it is SD, the longer it is kept untreated with something medicated, the more hair can fall out. Just FYI.

Yep, I will do it as soon as possible. I hope it's nothing serious :(
It's curious that it is in this forum where I learnt about this, I'm quite thankful

[Begemot]

I hope you can figure this out soon Natalia_A00. Better get checked asap than keep feeling worried about it and wonder what might be bothering your scalp. SD is pretty common condition but it could be many things, like an allergy for certain ingredient in hair products or fungal infection, etc. Luckily most things can be managed.

Years ago I was referred to a specialist because of my scalp. Lucky me got a group of med students that were present during my appointment. Had a big light directed at my head and the whole lot gathered around to inspect lol. They did ask if it was okay for them to be there and it didn't bother me that much.

[lapushka]

I hope you can figure this out soon Natalia_A00. Better get checked asap than keep feeling worried about it and wonder what might be bothering your scalp. SD is pretty common condition but it could be many things, like an allergy for certain ingredient in hair products or fungal infection, etc. Luckily most things can be managed.

Years ago I was referred to a specialist because of my scalp. Lucky me got a group of med students that were present during my appointment. Had a big light directed at my head and the whole lot gathered around to inspect lol. They did ask if it was okay for them to be there and it didn't bother me that much.

Yes it does not have to be SD. I hope it's something that can easily get cleared up, though.

[Begemot]

Yup, better get it checked by a doctor to see what's up :) Then she can receive the correct treatment.

I do think it's best to see a professional if you experience persistent problems with your scalp, but I thought to link this post of Science-y hair blog about products for troubled scalps and the active ingredients and their purpose in treating different problems. Maybe it can help someone here to understand and treat their scalp better http://science-yhairblog.blogspot.com/p/products-for-itchy-scalp.html

[guska]

My scalp is thriving on shampoo! No itchiness at all, though still some visible dry sebum telling me when it is time to wash my hair. I switched to a regular H&S from Nizoral 2% (thanks lapushka for recommending me that shampoo, it saved my scalp!) sometime in February and so far so good :) I wash every fifth or sixth day, depending on if I am busy and if my scalp is feeling gunky or not.

Regarding the scalp itchiness I experienced in December last year, it was not due to SD but rather improper cleaning of the scalp.

[Doreen]

I have scalp problems as my scalp is very dry! I oil my scalp every time before taking a shower. I do scalp massages every other day because i love how it feels. Whenever i do it i feel the blood moving in my head. Because i have dandruff i exfoliate once or twice a month using salt and coconut oil.

This sounds like my exact scalp situation, dry but also dandruff prone if I leave it too long. Which oil do you use pre-shower? Have you ever tried lotion on your scalp? (I haven't used either, but I've been thinking of trying them because my scalp has been pretty bad lately.....)

[Hairkay]

My first concern is always my skin because of eczema. Everything I use must be skin friendly. I've seen and had some suggest using some products but not putting it on my scalp. In my case that does not make sense. My hair is attached to my skin starting at my scalp and brushing against my neck, shoulders and even my back at times. My tight curls and kinks start right at my scalp and they do need to be moisturised to keep my hair at it's best. I currently have most eczema flare-ups on my hands which can't take too much time being stuck in gloves since that causes irritation as well. I care and style my hair with my bare hands keeping things simple and hand friendly. No soaps, shampoos or manufactured conditioners or even styling products. My skin is dry with certain areas of my scalp prone to flaky patches. Water rinses preserve my natural skin mantle and seem to do well with my hair. I will use a little oil then oat water to treat excessive flaky patches. I also use DIY conditioning hair masks. I let my sebum do its thing and only remove an excess. I have found that the more I keep my skin properly moisturised the less I have to use steroid creams for eczema so I keep up my skin care regimen throughout each day.

The worse problem I have had with my scalp is aquagenic pruritus which is a painful stinging reaction to water with no rash. It tends to start at my ears, cover my entire scalp in pain then spread to the rest of my body. Fortunately I know my triggers now and I have minimised this problem. Sudden changes in temperature cause it so even if I managed to avoid all the products in a hair salon the heat used for hair drying and styling could be agony. Oh well I have never known the hair salon life so it isn't a loss for me.

[lapushka]

My scalp is thriving on shampoo! No itchiness at all, though still some visible dry sebum telling me when it is time to wash my hair. I switched to a regular H&S from Nizoral 2% (thanks lapushka for recommending me that shampoo, it saved my scalp!) sometime in February and so far so good :) I wash every fifth or sixth day, depending on if I am busy and if my scalp is feeling gunky or not.

Regarding the scalp itchiness I experienced in December last year, it was not due to SD but rather improper cleaning of the scalp.

I'm glad it helped, guska! That's what's important!

Nizoral is wondrous, for me too. It really changed the way I look at my SD. We have it on hand here constantly. My dad keeps it with him, because he (sadly) needs it more than I do; when I need it, I "borrow" it, since my "bouts" and flare-ups have lessened with good proper cleansing.

[Begemot]

I made an appointment for my hair dresser to have a clay cleanse (not sure if this is the term that's used more broadly, just the direct translation) done on my scalp and hair. It's supposed to "draw out excess dirt and oil" while also moisturizing. It's nice to treat myself with this kind of treatment, now after winter is over and I won't be using beanies and hats so much. You can use rhassoul or bentonite clay to wash your hair at home but I don't trust myself to do it on my own hair.

I'm still lusting after scalp exfoliating products. I got a little obsessed about my scalp feeling fresh after I read couple of reviews of a Natura Siberica product here :grnbiggri

[Joules]

Update on my peppermint scalp tonic: my hair got oily as usual, but my scalp was weirdly clean. Like, normally when I look closely at my parting I can see if it's oily or not, and with this tonic it wasn't not oily at all. My hair, however, got visibly greasy as usual. I guess it's because of the mixture of alcohol and essential oil: the alcohol dried up my scalp, but the EO made my hair oily and created some buildup at the roots. I'll use it every day for a month (as recommended) to see if it affects anything. If not, I'll probably continue using it, but only once every three days after washing my hair.

I experimented with herbal teas on my scalp a few years back. Nettle was my favorite. I could go for up to a week without washing, somehow those teas made my hair and scalp look cleaner longer. I don't remember if it affected my growth and shedding (which means that it probably didn't), and making fresh tea every day was a pain in the behind.

Final update on the peppermint tonic: despite all the crazy tingling, it didn't give me any growth after a month of using it. It did make my scalp less sensitive and a teeny tiny bit less oily (usually I look oily on third day post-wash, now I look more presentable). I'm on a break right now, but I do think to return to using it, maybe only on wash days and not every day. In general it was a nice tonic, especially considering how cheap it was, only 2 dollars for 6 bottles of peppermint infusion (exactly 30 uses).

[FlowerDance]

I recently started using essential oils and WOW they really help! After massaging with rosemary oil, and mixing my shampoo with tea tree oil, my scalp and roots made a big improvement. No more itchiness and my roots felt very soft and moisturized, but NOT oily. I'll definitely add them to my routine before every wash day!

[lapushka]

I recently started using essential oils and WOW they really help! After massaging with rosemary oil, and mixing my shampoo with tea tree oil, my scalp and roots made a big improvement. No more itchiness and my roots felt very soft and moisturized, but NOT oily. I'll definitely add them to my routine before every wash day!

Be careful adding pure EOs onto your scalp, IN a shampoo it should be OK, because it is then diluted into another "product" (preferably a carrier oil), but yeah... not something I would do; but you do you. If it helps, it should be fine. :flower:

[Ophidian]

I started tweaking a scalp-first routine at the beginning of the year and I've been very happy with it.

For background, I never had scalp issues before 2012-ish, when I started bleaching and dyeing my hair repeatedly. I developed fairly bad dandruff, which would disappear right after I dyed my hair but always came back with a vengeance. In 2016 I cut out all the dye and committed to growing out healthy hair. After a few months of my usual sulfate-free shampoo at the time I started doing essential oil massages (diluted in carrier oil ;)) and did WO for about 7 months. I didn't have the large flakes I'd had before, but had a lot of scalp build up. So I tried CO twice but developed a flaky red patch at my hairline so that was a no-go. For the next year-ish I did a combination of sulfate-free shampoo and indian herb washing, settling into almost exclusive use of herbs for about a year. I loved and still love herb washing, but while my scalp was calm, I never stopped getting the powdery build-up and sometimes flaking around my hairline. So I added in scalp washes as needed with Nizoral 1%, eventually rotating it with a dandruff shampoo from Jason that contains salicylic acid and sulfur. This helped my scalp a lot, but if I started longing for a bit more simplicity. Which brings us to the present.

I've discovered a few key things in my experimenting:

1) Salicylic acid keeps the build up completely under control if I use it once a week (it's a chemical exfoliant)
2) If it doesn't, it's time to break out the Nizoral and use that a time or two (antifungal)
3) I need to wash twice a week
4) I can get to my scalp better if I flip my hair forward to wash it
5) It helps to gently massage the cleanser in, let it sit for several minutes, add a little water, and then massage again before rinsing

My current routine:

Wednesday I wash with a sulfate-free 2-in-1 from Jason (it's basically a co-wash) which has zinc as the active ingredient, then rinse it through my hair. I follow with Nightblooming's Alluvial rinse because my water is hard, but that's it.

Sunday I wash my scalp with a shampoo containing salicylic acid. I love the Jason I mentioned, but sulfur stinks! So I've been using a salicylic-acid only shampoo from Avalon, which smells better but is hard to apply because it's so runny. Ah well. Then I rinse the shampoo off my scalp without getting it in my hair, then follow with the 2-in-1 used as above, and end with Alluvial.

This routine is easy to maintain, and while the products are mid-range in cost, I don't use very much so it lasts quite a while. Occasional treatments include very dilute shampoo rinses to clarify or my herbs as a deep conditioning treatment, but these for my length. I oil my ends almost daily, but don't use any on my scalp. My length has actually been doing really well with this routine too thanks to the 2-in-1, which was an unexpected and lucky find.

Anyway, that was long winded, but hope someone might find something useful here.

[Begemot]

Wow, you have experimented a lot Ophidian! Very interesting :)




I've discovered a few key things in my experimenting:

1) Salicylic acid keeps the build up completely under control if I use it once a week (it's a chemical exfoliant)
2) If it doesn't, it's time to break out the Nizoral and use that a time or two (antifungal)
3) I need to wash twice a week
4) I can get to my scalp better if I flip my hair forward to wash it
5) It helps to gently massage the cleanser in, let it sit for several minutes, add a little water, and then massage again before rinsing


This was one of the biggest revelations for me. I need to do "upside down wash day" every couple of weeks (weekly/half the time would probably be even better but often I'm just too lazy) because my scalp gets irritated and flaky if I only wash "the normal way". Somewhere I read a hairdresser say that washing your hair while standing in the shower is like "washing your hair with a hat on" or something like that. I don't completely agree but apparently there's some truth to it in my case. I know I need to flip my hair forward regularly in order to keep my scalp happy. Especially the front and top of my head feel better this way.

Was the Avalon shampoo the medicated anti-dandruff one? I'd really like to try a sulfate free shampoo with salicylic acid.

[lapushka]

5) It helps to gently massage the cleanser in, let it sit for several minutes, add a little water, and then massage again before rinsing

My current routine:

Wednesday I wash with a sulfate-free 2-in-1 from Jason (it's basically a co-wash) which has zinc as the active ingredient, then rinse it through my hair. I follow with Nightblooming's Alluvial rinse because my water is hard, but that's it.

Sunday I wash my scalp with a shampoo containing salicylic acid. I love the Jason I mentioned, but sulfur stinks! So I've been using a salicylic-acid only shampoo from Avalon, which smells better but is hard to apply because it's so runny. Ah well. Then I rinse the shampoo off my scalp without getting it in my hair, then follow with the 2-in-1 used as above, and end with Alluvial.

This routine is easy to maintain, and while the products are mid-range in cost, I don't use very much so it lasts quite a while. Occasional treatments include very dilute shampoo rinses to clarify or my herbs as a deep conditioning treatment, but these for my length. I oil my ends almost daily, but don't use any on my scalp. My length has actually been doing really well with this routine too thanks to the 2-in-1, which was an unexpected and lucky find.

Anyway, that was long winded, but hope someone might find something useful here.

^^ Definitely how I go about using the Nizoral, 2% in my case. I do let it sit for 10 min.

I'm glad your scalp is doing better and that you found a routine that works for you! :flower:

I'm currently undergoing very dry facial skin (temples) and it (the flaky mess) has gotten into my hair a bit. It is my face, though, not my hair, so I'm not tackling my scalp ATM.

[Ophidian]

Yes, it's the Avalon Organics medicated shampoo :). It just smells minty, which is nice. It's very thin and doesn't suds a lot so it's a bit difficult to apply. It is pretty drying, so I only use it on my scalp. The Jason Dandruff Relief shampoo feels a lot milder but has the same concentration of salicylic acid (2%). Really the only downside for me is the sulfur smell... I actually read a study that indicated using it with salicylic acid boosted the sal. acid's effectiveness and my scalp seems to like it, I just find that the match/egg smell really lingers. I still use it sometimes, just try not to get in in my hair ;).

These are the only sulfate-free salicylic acid shampoos I'm aware of, but there may be similar products out there. That ingredient just does so much to keep my scalp clear without any scrubbing/scritching which can irritate my scalp.



Wow, you have experimented a lot Ophidian! Very interesting :)



This was one of the biggest revelations for me. I need to do "upside down wash day" every couple of weeks (weekly/half the time would probably be even better but often I'm just too lazy) because my scalp gets irritated and flaky if I only wash "the normal way". Somewhere I read a hairdresser say that washing your hair while standing in the shower is like "washing your hair with a hat on" or something like that. I don't completely agree but apparently there's some truth to it in my case. I know I need to flip my hair forward regularly in order to keep my scalp happy. Especially the front and top of my head feel better this way.

Was the Avalon shampoo the medicated anti-dandruff one? I'd really like to try a sulfate free shampoo with salicylic acid.

[Begemot]

Thank you for the product recs, Ophidian! :thumbsup:

[mwallingford]

What an interesting read so far! I've been pondering a question for a while and thought I'd give it a shot here before starting a whole other thread; how do you know if you have a dry scalp? I know that sounds like a stupid question (and to be fair, it probably is), but how do you know if you need to hydrate your scalp? And do moisturizing shampoos really work (if any science brains can explain how it can moisturize and still cleanse that would be great!).

I was just wondering, because it seems like my scalp near the hairline can get a bit temperamental at times and I'm not really sure what causes it- it doesn't appear to be weather related, days in between washes, etc. It can get a bit flaky near the temples but it doesn't itch; that may be a little TMI, sorry if I upset anyone

[MusicalSpoons]

For me, my hair gets oily so I know I don't have an actual, not-producing-enough-oil-kind-of-dry scalp, but mine does get dehydrated (like the rest of my oily skin everywhere else!) - that's when the dry flakes of skin happen, and if it's left too long without hydration it will start to feel tight and I will see the 'crazy paving' kind of cracking of the very top-most layer of skin (sounds worse than it is, it's the crack lines between the flakes, no deeper).

I don't know if moisturising shampoos work; I find most shampoos dehydrate my scalp anyway, and I've avoided moisturising ones because anything heavy weighs down my hair and makes it look oily by the next day. To moisturise my scalp, I use a light conditioner that I know rinses out easily and makes my hair fluffy, but I do then use my gentle shampoo afterwards anyway. If I had the energy I would probably be co-washing but I don't, so this is a compromise for when my scalp does need some help.

[mwallingford]

Thanks MusicalSpoons, that's good to know! My hair gets oily if provided the chance but it also gets dry (which makes everything confusing). I suppose it boils down to skin being skin and if the rest of my skin can be dry and oily at the same time it only makes sense that the scalp would be the same way. I bought a hydrating shampoo recently but haven't had the guts to use it yet in case my hair gets weighed down. It definitely had a strong surfactant in and foamed up very well, but that makes me think that it will be quite stripping.

[Begemot]

What an interesting read so far! I've been pondering a question for a while and thought I'd give it a shot here before starting a whole other thread; how do you know if you have a dry scalp? I know that sounds like a stupid question (and to be fair, it probably is), but how do you know if you need to hydrate your scalp? And do moisturizing shampoos really work (if any science brains can explain how it can moisturize and still cleanse that would be great!).

I was just wondering, because it seems like my scalp near the hairline can get a bit temperamental at times and I'm not really sure what causes it- it doesn't appear to be weather related, days in between washes, etc. It can get a bit flaky near the temples but it doesn't itch; that may be a little TMI, sorry if I upset anyone

I would also like to hear opinions on moisturizing shampoos. Cleansing but moisturizing simultaneously... Shampoo products aren't supposed to be left in hair/scalp so how does it moisturize when it's used for such little time. I also thought they are meant to moisturize hair, not scalp so much.

No need to apologize mwallingford, your comment had no TMI in my opinion :) I think everyone here are mature enough to know about flakes, itching and such. Most people experience dandruff at some point in their lives and some have to deal with different conditions and their symptoms all their lives. This is appropriate thread for discussing all things scalp and describing symptoms is important.

[Joules]

I would also like to hear opinions on moisturizing shampoos. Cleansing but moisturizing simultaneously... Shampoo products aren't supposed to be left in hair/scalp so how does it moisturize when it's used for such little time. I also thought they are meant to moisturize hair, not scalp so much.

It's nothing more than marketing. A shampoo can't do anything beside cleansing. A shampoo for dry hair might mean that it's less harsh than a shampoo for oily hair, it contains more conditioning ingredients (maybe even cones), that's it.

[lapushka]

It's nothing more than marketing. A shampoo can't do anything beside cleansing. A shampoo for dry hair might mean that it's less harsh than a shampoo for oily hair, it contains more conditioning ingredients (maybe even cones), that's it.

There are for example shampoos targeted towards dry hair, that have more moisturizing ingredients (like oils, silicones). I for sure, with my oily scalp, don't want to be using those, as my SD will react! I've tried those and yes they are more moisturizing, even though they still cleanse your scalp, which is what they are meant to do. You perhaps can't "go as long" with a shampoo targeted towards dry hair than you can with a shampoo that's targeted towards oily hair.

So, no... it's not all marketing. ;)

[mwallingford]

I would also like to hear opinions on moisturizing shampoos. Cleansing but moisturizing simultaneously... Shampoo products aren't supposed to be left in hair/scalp so how does it moisturize when it's used for such little time. I also thought they are meant to moisturize hair, not scalp so much.

No need to apologize mwallingford, your comment had no TMI in my opinion :) I think everyone here are mature enough to know about flakes, itching and such. Most people experience dandruff at some point in their lives and some have to deal with different conditions and their symptoms all their lives. This is appropriate thread for discussing all things scalp and describing symptoms is important.

Thanks Begemot! I was hoping it was alright to discuss here and I'm so glad you guys are supportive! Moisturizing shampoos are certainly a thought provoking product, and I had some of the same thoughts.

That certainly makes sense about the harshness (or lack thereof) of shampoo for oily or dry scalp Joules, I'll have to look into that. Can cones be conditioning? I'm using a Dove moisturizing dandruff shampoo that says it's pH balanced and has cones in it. It works fairly well, so I thought I'd try to test out shampoos with some of the properties it claims to have; such as moisturizing shampoo, dandruff shampoo, and pH balanced. One of the shampoos I tried claimed to be pH balanced but was still too harsh, the Head and Shoulders was a hit or miss (mostly miss), and then I still haven't tried the "moisturizing" shampoo. I guess that's my longwinded way of asking whether or not canes can be conditioning, and what are conditioning ingredients?

[Begemot]

I'm so glad this thread is useful place for discussion, mwallingford! :)

My approach to this whole issue is to mostly use mild, sulfate-free shampoos and then moisturize and hydrate the skin of my scalp with leave-in products like lotions, gels and creams once or twice a week. Strong shampoos like Head & Shoulders irritate my scalp and even just plain old SLS doesn't work for long before my scalp stops agreeing.
I would assume shampoo being pH balanced would mean it has pH of around 5.5. (like our skin) but I guess you can't really be sure unless you test it yourself. My Sebamed shampoo claims to have the pH of 5.5. ("ideal for healthy skin").

[lapushka]

I'm so glad this thread is useful place for discussion, mwallingford! :)

My approach to this whole issue is to mostly use mild, sulfate-free shampoos and then moisturize and hydrate the skin of my scalp with leave-in products like lotions, gels and creams once or twice a week. Strong shampoos like Head & Shoulders irritate my scalp and even just plain old SLS doesn't work for long before my scalp stops agreeing.
I would assume shampoo being pH balanced would mean it has pH of around 5.5. (like our skin) but I guess you can't really be sure unless you test it yourself. My Sebamed shampoo claims to have the pH of 5.5. ("ideal for healthy skin").

Sebamed isn't a bad product. :)

[Begemot]

Yup, it works well for me! :) and it's pretty affordable, 400 ml for about 10 euros and it lasts long.

[Luna Starsetta]

I have dandruff on my scalp, I always have though from what I've been told. I think it runs in my family. So I really didn't think there was any changes that would fix it. I used to use dandruff shampoos but I stopped cause they didn't seem to help. It was white flaky, build up and itchy. So I went natural and organic with sulfate and silicone free. Since then it hasn't been to bad. I wash once a week. my deep cleaning wash is Baking soda diluted in water and an ACV rinse to follow. Which I normally use once a month just to remove and oil treatment I do. Yes once a month lol. I don't know if anyone has any advice to give or questions to ask... If you do fire away!

[Joules]

There are for example shampoos targeted towards dry hair, that have more moisturizing ingredients (like oils, silicones). I for sure, with my oily scalp, don't want to be using those, as my SD will react! I've tried those and yes they are more moisturizing, even though they still cleanse your scalp, which is what they are meant to do. You perhaps can't "go as long" with a shampoo targeted towards dry hair than you can with a shampoo that's targeted towards oily hair.

So, no... it's not all marketing. ;)

This is exctly what I said :D a "moisturizing" shampoo is just not as stripping as a non-moisturizing one. It doesn't moisturize hair per se, all the oils and cationic surfactants/oils/cones are there to protect from detergents, and that's it :shrug:


Thanks Begemot! I was hoping it was alright to discuss here and I'm so glad you guys are supportive! Moisturizing shampoos are certainly a thought provoking product, and I had some of the same thoughts.

That certainly makes sense about the harshness (or lack thereof) of shampoo for oily or dry scalp Joules, I'll have to look into that. Can cones be conditioning? I'm using a Dove moisturizing dandruff shampoo that says it's pH balanced and has cones in it. It works fairly well, so I thought I'd try to test out shampoos with some of the properties it claims to have; such as moisturizing shampoo, dandruff shampoo, and pH balanced. One of the shampoos I tried claimed to be pH balanced but was still too harsh, the Head and Shoulders was a hit or miss (mostly miss), and then I still haven't tried the "moisturizing" shampoo. I guess that's my longwinded way of asking whether or not canes can be conditioning, and what are conditioning ingredients?

IMO, all shampoos are ph-balanced, unless stated otherwise (chelating shampoo for swimmers for example). It's another marketing tactic some companies use to make their product more appealing to non-chemistry savvy customers. Ph balanced shampoo doesn't equal mild, and vice versa.

Conditioning agents are cationic surfactants. I can name a couple (like polyquaterniums and guar hydroxypropyltrimonium chloride), just because those are the ones I see the most in my products, Science-y Hair Blog can provide more information on this subject :) silicones are a bit different, but in general I guess they can be considered conditioning. Idk.

[lapushka]

This is exctly what I said :D a "moisturizing" shampoo is just not as stripping as a non-moisturizing one. It doesn't moisturize hair per se, all the oils and cationic surfactants/oils/cones are there to protect from detergents, and that's it :shrug:

Ah OK, we somehow must have talked past each other then. Funny how that goes. ;)

[Begemot]

I'll update a little. My bangs were a mess today so I wore a beanie over my hair when I went out for a bit. I came back and noticed that my hairline (front and back) started to itch from sweating. I have no other symptoms (I sometimes have rash, once a dermatologist suspected I might have eczema but who knows) but apparently some parts of my scalp are already irritated and react to sweating. I'm a little worried about this since I'm going to start working out again, so my scalp will sweat more often. And the summer is approaching too. I don't want to wash my hair more often, waaah. Hopefully wiping my hairline and applying scalp gel and cream will keep my head happy.

Yesterday I ordered a new product for my scalp, Yes to Carrots Scalp Relief Conditioner. It was cheap so I'll give it a try! It has different oils, niacinamide and silk amino acids but I was mostly interested in this product because it has salisylic acid. We'll see how it works for my scalp.
I have been looking for a chemical exfoliant for my scalp for a good while now. There's lots of products that have sea salt in them but I don't feel too good about those. Many products are very expensive and often seem gimmicky. Many also have alcohol denat and that ingredient is too drying for me, I wouldn't use any product that has alcohol denat in it and that is supposed to be left on hair for a longer period of time. I'll keep looking for promising scalp products and report back...

[Ylva]

I stacked up on the Natura Siberica scalp scrub today. I should have enough for a couple of years now. That's how much I like it! :D

[lapushka]

I stacked up on the Natura Siberica scalp scrub today. I should have enough for a couple of years now. That's how much I like it! :D

Should they discontinue it, at least you have some left.

I finished the "infamous" peach & nutoil mask by Garnier Ultra Doux (whole blends, ultimate blends, loving blends yada yada yada) these past months and it's been discontinued I think for about 10 years. LOL!

[Ylva]

Should they discontinue it, at least you have some left.

I finished the "infamous" peach & nutoil mask by Garnier Ultra Doux (whole blends, ultimate blends, loving blends yada yada yada) these past months and it's been discontinued I think for about 10 years. LOL!

Indeed! And should I, for some reason, not want to use it anymore at some point, I know my boyfriend loves refreshing stuff like that, so he'll use it up for sure. Or rather, I will use it up on him to pamper him, because he's lazy.

Haha :lol:

[Begemot]

I have been trying to mess with my scalp a little less. Massages and products are great but I don't think it's the best idea to bother my roots every day. I got the Yes to Carrots Scalp Relief conditioner. It's supposed to "calm and soothe dry, itchy scalp". Hopefully my head likes it.

[lapushka]

I have been trying to mess with my scalp a little less. Massages and products are great but I don't think it's the best idea to bother my roots every day. I got the Yes to Carrots Scalp Relief conditioner. It's supposed to "calm and soothe dry, itchy scalp". Hopefully my head likes it.

You use conditioner on your scalp?

I find that with my SD, the less "moisturizing" stuff on my scalp, the better. No oils, no conditioner, and a shampoo for oily hair or a quite stripping one at that.

[Begemot]

No, not usually but will be trying this one :)

[lapushka]

No, not usually but will be trying this one :)

Oh OK! Good; I hope it works out. :) Keep us posted. :D

[Begemot]

Oh OK! Good; I hope it works out. :) Keep us posted. :D

I will! :D

[Begemot]

So, I finally managed to try the Yes to Carrots Scalp Relief conditioner. I don't usually use conditioner on my scalp, nor oils or EOs. I can't remember the last time I applied conditioner from roots to ends which felt kind of wrong but kind of fun :D I let the conditioner sit for couple of minutes, max. 5 minutes. My hair felt nice and smooth when I rinsed conditioner off. Only my bangs have dried so far so can't say much, but my bangs do feel really nice. I thought my hair would feel more weighed down but nope. I noticed two dry flakes in my bangs but other than that my scalp seems fine. So far so good :thumbsup:

[Ylva]

I booked a scalp exfoliation treatment at my usual hair salon. It'll be interesting to see what that entails. :)

[Begemot]

I booked a scalp exfoliation treatment at my usual hair salon. It'll be interesting to see what that entails. :)

Sounds nice! Do you have idea what kind of exfoliating treatment it is? :)

[ChloeDharma]

What a great thread idea!

Ok so a bit of scalp history (I hope this doesn't get too long winded but I feel it might as I'm prone to rambling, and over sharing!).

As a child my scalp wasn't too much of a problem from what I remember but I have always had this odd type of sebum. It tends to be quite dry, kind of like a dusty wax that can build up under fingernails. I did start to notice small flakes forming on my scalp and for years would use head and shoulders when they were noticable, but it didn't really help. Sometimes I'd get obsessive and just keep going back to rewash my hair 5 or 6 times because I'd be so uncomfortable seeing the flakes if I parted my hair.

This carried on for ages until I found some book on natural remedies when I was about 13. It suggested using a rinse on your scalp made from infusing fresh rosemary. Luckily my mother always kept a rosemary bush (and other herbs) for cooking so I made the rinse and tried it. Instantly no flakes AT ALL! I really did search for them in the mirror but my scalp was clear. I did this every now and then but after a few treatments I just didn't see flakes anymore even after lapsing and not using the rinse for months.

I did still continue to have dry sebum though. When I got more into oiling my scalp in my late teens/early twenties this seemed to make the sebum easier to wash away, vinegar rinses also seemed to help here but nothing really fixes it.

I developed scalp acne mainly after developing a long term health problem which meant I stretched my washes for far too long and although that tends to go through phases it still flares up, even very recently it has been present with these intense sore acheing itchy spots on my head that are painful to touch. My first real flare up of this though that I can remember was in around 2012 (I think, might have been 2013). I was using more commercial hair products and not oiling my scalp much at all at the time but also I had started dating a man who I half jokingly decided I was allergic to. The spots developed wherever he touched me and he had kept fiddling with one side of my head, which is where the spots developed. By the by I dumped him quickly for that and other not relevant reasons.
Anyway so in trying to treat this acne/boils breakout I found a bottle of vatika coconut oil and decided to put some of that on. It did give immediate relief to the itchy soreness and then I found the vatika dandruff lemon shampoo which also did a great job and helped the spots go away. I still keep a bottle of this shampoo in my stash and still use it when needed.

The main thing I struggle with now is getting my scalp clean feeling. It's like the waxy dry nature of my sebum is really hard to remove even with strong sulphate shampoos. I do remember there have been times I've managed to get it really clean and remember that I described having washed my hair and got a lovely feeling of my scalp breathing in a post on a thread here years ago but can't find it to work out what I did.

Oh on the acne thing, I've also found making a scalp mist with lemongrass, peppermint and rosemary essential oils does wonders for clearing it up and preventing my scalp from getting spotty (feels AMAZING too!).

Another thing I have found excellent for keeping my scalp healthy, (going back to the rosemary infusion thing from my youth) is using a herb infusion when I wash. I vary the ingredients but try to make green tea, fenugreek seed and rosemary consistent. I also will often add rooibos, nettle, neem leaf and hibiscus, then I add some honey or glycerin plus essential oils to the mix. Pour it through my hair after shampooing then add conditioner on top and marinate under a shower cap.
I don't manage to keep up with this every wash as it requires a bit of planning, making sure the fenugreek seeds soak for at least 8 hours etc but when I do keep up with it my scalp tends to stay happy and my growth is generally better, less shedding etc.

So anyway, now I'm getting back into a scalp focused routine after a recent scalp flare up (which is now fine and happy after I treated it) and a big chop of about 6 inches as my hair neglect had definitely taken it's toll on my length.

[Ylva]

Sounds nice! Do you have idea what kind of exfoliating treatment it is? :)

I have no clue! My appointment is on the 30th, so will find out soon, though. :)

[lapushka]

So anyway, now I'm getting back into a scalp focused routine after a recent scalp flare up (which is now fine and happy after I treated it) and a big chop of about 6 inches as my hair neglect had definitely taken it's toll on my length.

Have you ever gone to a dermatologist for all of this; sounds pretty severe not to. To me at least. YMMV. :flower:

[Begemot]

I have no clue! My appointment is on the 30th, so will find out soon, though. :)

A mystery treatment, I'm intrigued :D I hope your hair and scalp will enjoy it very much.

edit. Thanks for your comment ChloeDharma, I thought it was really interesting! You have found so many effective natural treatments for your scalp but I'm wondering the same as lapushka, if you ever had someone look at your scalp...?

[PatchouliSoleil]

Oh man, this thread came at the perfect time!

I've had flakes for as long as I can remember. When I was around 12 I began reading about sulfate free poo's, all natural hair care, and stretching washes to help clear it up as well as get my hair growing. It wasn't til now, 8 years later, that I found this website and began questioning that advice. My scalp at the time, unfortunately, was as flakey as it's ever been. I've recently started using SLS again and am working up to more washes. After years of only washing once/week, my scalp has stopped producing an adequate amount of sebum.

I've found that using a boar bristle brush on my scalp helps temporarily, but I'd have to do it every day or every other day for consistent results.

Following this thread to see what's been working for others to experiment on myself :bigtongue:

[ChloeDharma]

Have you ever gone to a dermatologist for all of this; sounds pretty severe not to. To me at least. YMMV. :flower:




edit. Thanks for your comment ChloeDharma, I thought it was really interesting! You have found so many effective natural treatments for your scalp but I'm wondering the same as lapushka, if you ever had someone look at your scalp...?

No I'm afraid not. To be honest getting access to medical treatment for many years now has been very hard, even for really quite serious issues. I know trying to get a referal to a dermatologist would be really hard and to be honest not really worth the effort given how easily my scalp is kept happy as long as I don't go silly with the stretching washes etc. Plus maybe my description sounded worse than it is in reality, I'm not sure lol. In any case, I do seem to have worked out a few different ways to keep things calm and happy and in the scheme of things they are neither expensive nor particularly difficult :)

Thank you both for your concern :flower:

[Begemot]

No I'm afraid not. To be honest getting access to medical treatment for many years now has been very hard, even for really quite serious issues. I know trying to get a referal to a dermatologist would be really hard and to be honest not really worth the effort given how easily my scalp is kept happy as long as I don't go silly with the stretching washes etc. Plus maybe my description sounded worse than it is in reality, I'm not sure lol. In any case, I do seem to have worked out a few different ways to keep things calm and happy and in the scheme of things they are neither expensive nor particularly difficult :)

Thank you both for your concern :flower:

That's really unfortunate that getting treatment is so difficult. Maybe some day you can consult someone and hear professional opinion about your scalp condition. What you have been doing must work well, your hair looks so shiny and healthy :thumbsup:

[ChloeDharma]

That's really unfortunate that getting treatment is so difficult. Maybe some day you can consult someone and hear professional opinion about your scalp condition. What you have been doing must work well, your hair looks so shiny and healthy :thumbsup:

Oh bless you, thanks again for your concern and the lovely compliment! That photo is a little old now so I really should update soon. I must gove henna credit for much of the shine, it's amazing for that (and scalp health too...bonus! :) )

[ChloeDharma]

Actually, I do have a question for people on this thread.

What are people's thoughts about dry shampoo and scalp health? I've never tried them but do wonder if they can gunk up the scalp. I've heard they are good for adding volume if you are doing a hair 'do to look a certain way so considered maybe trying some for that, maybe, but I have this gut feeling that I would want to wash them out ASAP for fear of scalp clogging.
Does anyone have any thoughts or information on this? Am I being a little too cautious?

[MusicalSpoons]

No I'm afraid not. To be honest getting access to medical treatment for many years now has been very hard, even for really quite serious issues. I know trying to get a referal to a dermatologist would be really hard and to be honest not really worth the effort given how easily my scalp is kept happy as long as I don't go silly with the stretching washes etc. Plus maybe my description sounded worse than it is in reality, I'm not sure lol. In any case, I do seem to have worked out a few different ways to keep things calm and happy and in the scheme of things they are neither expensive nor particularly difficult :)

Thank you both for your concern :flower:

Here the only reason I've ever seen a dermatologist (who told me it was 'dry skin' - how very uselessly vague) was because she was one of the GPs at my surgery, but either not quite fully-qualified or something because there were restrictions on who/what conditions she could see, so there were appointments available with her on the day I finally phoned up to see someone about my scalp.

Fully agree with the difficulty in getting any kind of treatment or referrals here - I keep seeing (and find myself even saying, now) that seeing a dr for things and asking for blood tests is the first port of call for things going awry ... but to be honest the NHS lack of funding means the guidelines are such that as long as you're alive and not about to keel over, that's good enough; no matter whether you have any quality of life at all :shake: you have to fight for everything!

[Ylva]

I can't answer the scalp health part, but I do know that I hate the feeling of having any kind of "dust" on my scalp and thus stay far away from dry shampoos. I'd just want to wash my hair straight away.

[ChloeDharma]

Here the only reason I've ever seen a dermatologist (who told me it was 'dry skin' - how very uselessly vague) was because she was one of the GPs at my surgery, but either not quite fully-qualified or something because there were restrictions on who/what conditions she could see, so there were appointments available with her on the day I finally phoned up to see someone about my scalp.

Fully agree with the difficulty in getting any kind of treatment or referrals here - I keep seeing (and find myself even saying, now) that seeing a dr for things and asking for blood tests is the first port of call for things going awry ... but to be honest the NHS lack of funding means the guidelines are such that as long as you're alive and not about to keel over, that's good enough; no matter whether you have any quality of life at all :shake: you have to fight for everything!

Exactly! If you go to the doctor at best they will just give you some steroid cream and no reliable dignosis other than maybe "dermatitis" or something equally vague. I've been trying to get a diagnosis for a quite debilitating illness since 2007 and still am struggling, though they have at least recognised that I don't produce enough cortisol. That was established last summer and as yet, still no follow up with it. (Sorry for going off topic). But yeah, when it comes to skin and hair, for myself I do feel more confident DIYing it as I usually manage to sort it out whereas I know if I went to the GP I'd still be going back in 10 years and looking at their blank faces which basically express "why do you expect help from me??".
I think part of the reason we advise people to see their doctors on here is that we don't want to be responsible for someone doing something that might be bad for them. Plus if I'm honest I know it's really hard to get accurate information from people so it's hard to make suggestions.


I can't answer the scalp health part, but I do know that I hate the feeling of having any kind of "dust" on my scalp and thus stay far away from dry shampoos. I'd just want to wash my hair straight away.

Yes, I can imagine I wouldn't like the feel of it on my scalp.

[renia22]

Actually, I do have a question for people on this thread.

What are people's thoughts about dry shampoo and scalp health? I've never tried them but do wonder if they can gunk up the scalp. I've heard they are good for adding volume if you are doing a hair 'do to look a certain way so considered maybe trying some for that, maybe, but I have this gut feeling that I would want to wash them out ASAP for fear ofclogging.
Does anyone have any thoughts or information on this? Am I being a little too cautious?


I went through a dry shampoo phase recently, after trying and liking Oribe’s texturizing spray. I figured dry shampoos might have the same body/ volume effect. My phase was short lived because many of them do feel gunky, and some are too strongly scented. The ones that end up coming out like a fine mist, but aren’t hairspray like, were my favorites (Hask charcoal, which smells citrusy; Pantene dry shampoo, which smells like the old line before they changed the scent to that strawberry-infused scent they have now). They do give hair some “grip”. When I finish those 2, I might just splurge on a large Oribe Texurizing spray though, that’s the one I really liked anyways.

[MusicalSpoons]

Exactly! If you go to the doctor at best they will just give you some steroid cream and no reliable dignosis other than maybe "dermatitis" or something equally vague. I've been trying to get a diagnosis for a quite debilitating illness since 2007 and still am struggling, though they have at least recognised that I don't produce enough cortisol. That was established last summer and as yet, still no follow up with it. (Sorry for going off topic). But yeah, when it comes to skin and hair, for myself I do feel more confident DIYing it as I usually manage to sort it out whereas I know if I went to the GP I'd still be going back in 10 years and looking at their blank faces which basically express "why do you expect help from me??".
I think part of the reason we advise people to see their doctors on here is that we don't want to be responsible for someone doing something that might be bad for them. Plus if I'm honest I know it's really hard to get accurate information from people so it's hard to make suggestions.

Ugh, I'm sorry you've been struggling for so long. My saga has been about the same length overall, but it wasn't debilitating until about 5 years ago, and it's only affected my life to the point of disability for the last 3 years or so. Now that I'm too ill to function (generally), lost almost all independence and mobility and am virtually housebound, I finally have a diagnosis of ME/CFS - a dustbin diagnosis but at least it fits - and of course there's not much they can do to help. But I had to fight to see anyone in secondary care at all, after my GP kept sticking to his (mis)diagnosis and just kept increasing the medication (even though nobody's sure if it's even helpful). The thing that *really* made me laugh was when a different GP requested a load of blood tests for the referral to the Chronic Fatigue Service, and the pathology lab refused some of them due to 'insufficient clinical evidence'!! :rollin: So yes, I absolutely sympathise with getting nowhere despite very clearly not being well, and I hope that you can get the help you need :flowers: If nothing else, I've learned that everything has to be chased up even when you don't have the energy to do so, because mistakes happen, letters don't get read, referrals get messed up, etc. - and I'm not even a complex case!

Back on topic: like you, I found my scalp was happy enough with DIY remedies, in my case specific shampoo and occasional conditioner on the scalp. Recently the conditioner hasn't been quite enough so I'm not really sure what to do, but I also don't have the energy or brainpower to be experimenting again. I have actually used rosemary tea in the past, sprayed on, but it made my hair sticky and also I'm now too weak to use the spray bottle I own enough to thoroughly mist my scalp :lol: [I ought to try to remedy that, really, so I can try other stuff if I have the brainpower.]

Dry shampoo: I don't really like the feel of it but occasionally I'll need to look presentable and just not have the energy to even do a scalp wash, and I'll use cornflour as dry shampoo. Last time I had to use it, I put a little on overnight, combed my hair as usual in the morning and didn't actually feel it until I was scritching my scalp that evening. I don't know about follicle clogging - never even thought about it, but if used infrequently I'd assume it would be fine :shrug: the only 'problem' I had was it making my already dehydration-prone scalp more dehydrated and flaky, plus of course accumulation if I had to use it a few times in a row (oh, those soul-destroying 'baby wipes and dry shampoo' evenings of exhaustion :shake:)

[zmirina]

Actually, I do have a question for people on this thread.

What are people's thoughts about dry shampoo and scalp health? I've never tried them but do wonder if they can gunk up the scalp. I've heard they are good for adding volume if you are doing a hair 'do to look a certain way so considered maybe trying some for that, maybe, but I have this gut feeling that I would want to wash them out ASAP for fear of scalp clogging.
Does anyone have any thoughts or information on this? Am I being a little too cautious?

I find that it only helps with a little bit of grease, the amount that could be hidden by pulling hair into a hairstyle, nothing major. After a certain, rather mild degree of greasiness, it will just make the grease look matte on me, which makes it worse, really

[AshtangiPNW]

No I'm afraid not. To be honest getting access to medical treatment for many years now has been very hard, even for really quite serious issues. I know trying to get a referal to a dermatologist would be really hard and to be honest not really worth the effort given how easily my scalp is kept happy as long as I don't go silly with the stretching washes etc. Plus maybe my description sounded worse than it is in reality, I'm not sure lol. In any case, I do seem to have worked out a few different ways to keep things calm and happy and in the scheme of things they are neither expensive nor particularly difficult :)

Thank you both for your concern :flower:

Hi ChloeDharma! For what it's worth, a lot of the herbal ingredients that you mentioned are included in the shampoo and conditioner that I've been using for the last several months. It definitely has rosemary, lemon tea tree and other herbal infusions. It's the max green alchemy one. I wonder if this might be easier than DIY rinses and such? If nothing else, smells divine :) I hope the scalp issues get sorted out soon!

[Begemot]

Oh bless you, thanks again for your concern and the lovely compliment! That photo is a little old now so I really should update soon. I must gove henna credit for much of the shine, it's amazing for that (and scalp health too...bonus! :) )

I didn't know henna was good for scalp! Cool :D


Actually, I do have a question for people on this thread.

What are people's thoughts about dry shampoo and scalp health? I've never tried them but do wonder if they can gunk up the scalp. I've heard they are good for adding volume if you are doing a hair 'do to look a certain way so considered maybe trying some for that, maybe, but I have this gut feeling that I would want to wash them out ASAP for fear of scalp clogging.
Does anyone have any thoughts or information on this? Am I being a little too cautious?

My scalp does not like dry shampoo very much. I use it sometimes on my bangs (when I don't have the time to wash them) but I try to avoid spraying it on skin and I wash it off as soon as I can. My skin gets flaky if I let the dry shampoo stay on my hair and skin too long. I only get flakiness and no itching so I'm not too worried about using it. My tip is to spray it on hair and then work it up to roots with fingers, then brush and blow dry on cool for a couple of seconds (aiming away from head). That way my hair doesn't feel like it has dry shampoo on it :)

[lapushka]

I have tried dry shampoo, just a spray bottle it was back in the day (no aerosol). And yes it gunked up my scalp and flared up my SD (seborrheic dermatitis). So... I would be careful. Maybe if you just use it as a texturizer, it would be OK.

[Ylva]

I had my "mystery scalp treatment" today. It turned out to consist of an exfoliating shampoo (with small granules), a conditioner with some chemical exfoliants, and a scalp massage. According to my hairdresser, my hair follicles were quite clogged as far as she could see with her bare eyes and that I could benefit from a ~weekly scalp exfoliation, so it seems that I have a hairdresser's prescription for scalp exfoliation products. :smirk: :whistle:

ETA: Not sure if 'blocked' or 'clogged' is the correct term, but anyway, what she meant was that there was a visible sebum "barrier" on my scalp and the hairs had to push through it, kinda.

[MusicalSpoons]

Not sure what's been going on with my scalp. It's so dry and flaky, slightly itchy, and I've tried the conditioner-on-scalp trick with and without EOs, then a scalp scrub last wash - it's far flakier now after the scrub than it was to start. There were a couple of patches of moist/weepy scalp on a couple of days during last week (hence thinking scrub, to give it a good thorough cleanse) and haven't since. I don't know if I need to give it a scrub again to be sure - but I do know that would dry it out even more and I'd need to somehow replace the moisture afterwards and other than conditioning the scalp, I don't know how to do that for it to work on my scalp. Oils, aloe vera, honey/glycerin all do nothing :shrug: Maybe I need to condition it a few times more frequently than once a week, but there's no real hair-friendly way of rinsing it all out properly without having to get the rest wet (and then also having to condition it, because water rinsing does not agree with my hair.) And I don't have the energy to be deviating from my normal routine anyway :( Harrumph.

[LoveHeart33]

I was having alot of flakes and dryness on my scalp and since putting in a shower filter, that has cleared up completely! I've heard the Amalaki Scalp Oil Serum from Blue Beautify is good but I haven't tried it.

[Pajarita]

I had my "mystery scalp treatment" today. It turned out to consist of an exfoliating shampoo (with small granules), a conditioner with some chemical exfoliants, and a scalp massage. According to my hairdresser, my hair follicles were quite clogged as far as she could see with her bare eyes and that I could benefit from a ~weekly scalp exfoliation, so it seems that I have a hairdresser's prescription for scalp exfoliation products. :smirk: :whistle:

ETA: Not sure if 'blocked' or 'clogged' is the correct term, but anyway, what she meant was that there was a visible sebum "barrier" on my scalp and the hairs had to push through it, kinda.

I'll be curious to get your updates in the future if you keep up with this. I keep reading about how much people are benefiting from scalp massages, etc, but I also have fine hair, and worry about avoiding mechanical damage. As a result, I'm not sure how much I should do to my scalp.

[guska]

My scalp has developed some itchy bumps here and there. It doesn't iitch nearly as much as back in December 2018 which is a relief.

[Reservechic]

I have scalp scalp eczema that at times becomes very severe, due to a variety of reasons. However, I also have seborrheic dermatitis on my body (worst on my face though), and even though what I have is largely hereditary, because my father is a psoriasis suffer, however, I can say that a lot of products on the market that I've tried aggravated my scalp, I also believe that have some type of permanent damage to my scalp due to having harsh chemical processes used on it for quite a long number of years, and layering of products or using products that are heavy in nature that end up clogging up my hairs follicles on my scalp, are all things that are major no-nos for my scalp, period. Also, definitely don't believe that because a product is promoted as being all natural that none of the ingredients don't have the potential to cause reactions to ones skin (on the body or scalp). Because there's synthetic ingredients that I have encountered being irritants to my scalp as well as, natural ones too.

Now, I have a scalp that is naturally very dry, flaky, and stays red and irritated (some days are a bit better than others though)., and I do periodically get small bumps on my scalp that will appear that will pop and they have blood come from them as wel. The use of pure natural oils onto my scalp to provide extended relief towards my scalp eczema and scalp dryness hasn't hasn't provided me either any type if major success that i had hoped for. I was even recommended to apply tea tree oil to my scalp at one point, as a recommendation from my dermatologist's office, and that didn't produce any type of major help, plus the snell is very strong, and it's just not that I can consistently tolerate. Also, I have bought a plethora of stuff within stores to help with my scalp, and none of the provided me with any great success at all. Now, my dermatologist has prescribed me in the past all the way to the present so many different things for me to use on my scalp and all of these things are very harsh in nature and do come with side effects of their own. Which is why, right now, I actually went back to using Fruit of The Earth Aloe Vera Gel on my hair to style it with and I do apply it directly into my scalp as well, during my hair styling process. It acts as a really great styling gel plus it is soothing to my scalp as well. No, I don't apply anything along with it, because I want to experience the full potency of the product. Oh, and I have trued Lily of The Desert's Aloe Vera products for use on both my hair scalp (hoping most of all that they would help with my scalp eczema in controlling it fir sure) and didn't end up having much good luck with them at all. Plus, they definitely have strange smells to them, some of the products did flake on me, and were super drying to my hair. Which is why, I don't mess with that brand anymore. I've given it enough chances and it's just not for me, period.

So, honestly other than the styling product that I'm currently using, which I've mentioned as being Fruit of The Earth's Aloe Vera, I don't use anything else outside of this product on my head. I find that taking that less is better approach is best for my hair and especially my scalp overall.

[hinabelle]

My scalp is always bothersome, I just did an anti-itch shampoo, clarified with ACV rinse, and hot oil treatment and I'm still itchy.
Frequent washings are likely the most important thing, but I have to ruminate on how to tackle the itchiness. I'm sure fixing it will make my hair grow faster and healthier.

[lapushka]

Not sure what's been going on with my scalp. It's so dry and flaky, slightly itchy, and I've tried the conditioner-on-scalp trick with and without EOs, then a scalp scrub last wash - it's far flakier now after the scrub than it was to start. There were a couple of patches of moist/weepy scalp on a couple of days during last week (hence thinking scrub, to give it a good thorough cleanse) and haven't since. I don't know if I need to give it a scrub again to be sure - but I do know that would dry it out even more and I'd need to somehow replace the moisture afterwards and other than conditioning the scalp, I don't know how to do that for it to work on my scalp. Oils, aloe vera, honey/glycerin all do nothing :shrug: Maybe I need to condition it a few times more frequently than once a week, but there's no real hair-friendly way of rinsing it all out properly without having to get the rest wet (and then also having to condition it, because water rinsing does not agree with my hair.) And I don't have the energy to be deviating from my normal routine anyway :( Harrumph.

Could you possibly have your GP take a look? You might need prescription strength medicated shampoo. I would stop throwing whatever at it in hopes it is going to go away on its own. If you see a doctor regularly, I'd ask.

[lapushka]

I had my "mystery scalp treatment" today. It turned out to consist of an exfoliating shampoo (with small granules), a conditioner with some chemical exfoliants, and a scalp massage. According to my hairdresser, my hair follicles were quite clogged as far as she could see with her bare eyes and that I could benefit from a ~weekly scalp exfoliation, so it seems that I have a hairdresser's prescription for scalp exfoliation products. :smirk: :whistle:

ETA: Not sure if 'blocked' or 'clogged' is the correct term, but anyway, what she meant was that there was a visible sebum "barrier" on my scalp and the hairs had to push through it, kinda.

LOL; yes of course she was gonna say that, right? I would not go weekly, but I'd consider it a nice treat for a few times a year.

Also, I wouldn't believe the stuff about clogged follicles. :lol: I know you take good care of your hair, so how can that be, right? ;)

[Ylva]

LOL; yes of course she was gonna say that, right? I would not go weekly, but I'd consider it a nice treat for a few times a year.

Also, I wouldn't believe the stuff about clogged follicles. :lol: I know you take good care of your hair, so how can that be, right? ;)

She didn't mean I should go in weekly, but just use an exfoliating product on my own. :D

She's not the type to mess around like that. I've been going to her for over a year now and we're sort of friends. She's very down to earth and knowledgeable about hair stuff, so I don't see any reason to suspect her judgement there. So what I'm going to do is continue using the scalp scrub that I have but a bit more frequently and see what happens.

[lilyawad]

I don’t have problems in my scalp but it acts weird.I produce sebum normally but it takes a while to accumulate because I have curly hair. I oil my hair two times a week, I rinse with only water and conditioner and the second day of oiling I finally shampoo. I never ever use conditioner on my scalp, only oil.

[lapushka]

She didn't mean I should go in weekly, but just use an exfoliating product on my own. :D

She's not the type to mess around like that. I've been going to her for over a year now and we're sort of friends. She's very down to earth and knowledgeable about hair stuff, so I don't see any reason to suspect her judgement there. So what I'm going to do is continue using the scalp scrub that I have but a bit more frequently and see what happens.

Oh OK; little misunderstanding there then. ;) I had no idea you were close to her at all, and I had no idea you owned a scalp scrub either.

[Ylva]

Oh OK; little misunderstanding there then. ;) I had no idea you were close to her at all, and I had no idea you owned a scalp scrub either.

No worries, I guess I could have written it more clearly. :)

[MusicalSpoons]

Could you possibly have your GP take a look? You might need prescription strength medicated shampoo. I would stop throwing whatever at it in hopes it is going to go away on its own. If you see a doctor regularly, I'd ask.

I did, back when it was worse (drier and always itchy) and nothing was helping at all. She had a special interest in dermatology so I had hopes for some useful advice but nope - 'it's just dry skin' :rolleyes: Way back before that, when things were properly bad (itchy, weeping, bleeding, etc - partly because my scalp stayed wet too long and worsened by a particular shampoo) I tried Nizoral without seeing anyone, and it cleared up those symptoms but left me with 'crazy paving' type dry skin which was just pure dehydration (I used to get it elsewhere, before I knew how to properly moisturise skin). The other thing is that now whenever I use a sulphate shampoo I end up with a couple of dry crusty patches anyway, even when the rest of my scalp is fine :doh: :brickwall:

The slightly moist, weepy patches this time are where I've slept for 10+hours every night on the same side and then laid down later in the day too; I could try laying on my back during the day I suppose, and I guess I could try making sure to do a scalp wash between weekly washes. Miracle water might help too, actually; my face LOVES it so I guess I could mix up some to soak before I next wash, or something, maybe even mix up some for a final rinse.

If nothing helps I will have to think about busting out the Nizoral for a 'clean slate' so I know that dehydration is the *only* thing going on (small sulphate reaction spots aside!), thanks for the reminder lapushka. I just really can't face convincing myself it's bad enough to see a doctor - it isn't yet, nowhere near - and all the stress that entails, only to be told 'oh it's dry skin' or even 'it's just dandruff'. There are some things that are worth a wasted appointment because at least the issue goes on my medical records, but to be honest scalp isn't one of them - yes it's vital for hair health, but I'd rather expend that time and energy on trying to consult someone who might be able to *actually* help.

[Ylva]

I have a nearly full, useless bottle of COSRX Blackhead Power Liquid which did nothing for my blackheads (the whitehead one I LOVE, it's one of my rare skincare holy grails!), so I thought I could maybe use that on my scalp as a chemical exfoliant. I mean, it should be okay?! The ingredients are: Salix Alba (Willow) Bark Water, Butylene Glycol, Betaine Salicylate, Niacinamide, 1,2-Hexanediol, Arginine, Panthenol, Sodium Hyaluronate, Xanthan Gum, Ethyl Hexanediol. It's meant for the face and skin is skin, after all, so yeah. My face and scalp act extremely similarly anyway.

[MusicalSpoons]

^ Sounds good - the betaine salicylate should take care of any clogged follicles too ;)

EDIT: Ooh, just seen the pH is 4! That's a bit low for the scalp :-/

(EDIT 2: Damn, off-topic but I'm pretty much sold on trying this for my face!)

[lapushka]

If nothing helps I will have to think about busting out the Nizoral for a 'clean slate' so I know that dehydration is the *only* thing going on (small sulphate reaction spots aside!), thanks for the reminder lapushka. I just really can't face convincing myself it's bad enough to see a doctor - it isn't yet, nowhere near - and all the stress that entails, only to be told 'oh it's dry skin' or even 'it's just dandruff'. There are some things that are worth a wasted appointment because at least the issue goes on my medical records, but to be honest scalp isn't one of them - yes it's vital for hair health, but I'd rather expend that time and energy on trying to consult someone who might be able to *actually* help.

Maybe try oiling or conditioning your scalp first before doing the Nizoral, and then conditioning your scalp after?

[MusicalSpoons]

Maybe try oiling or conditioning your scalp first before doing the Nizoral, and then conditioning your scalp after?

Maybe! Actually, that *is* an idea - I don't usually condition the scalp after shampooing (very mild shampoo) but maybe that's what's missing. Next time I have some spoons I ought to try that with Nizoral for the 'clean slate'. Thanks for the suggestion! :D

[Ylva]

^ Sounds good - the betaine salicylate should take care of any clogged follicles too ;)

EDIT: Ooh, just seen the pH is 4! That's a bit low for the scalp :-/

(EDIT 2: Damn, off-topic but I'm pretty much sold on trying this for my face!)

Yeah, alternating that and the scrub should make me free of such things if there are any.

Why is 4 low for the scalp but not for the face? Can I maybe add something to it, like dilute it with water to make it more suitable?

[MusicalSpoons]

Yeah, alternating that and the scrub should make me free of such things if there are any.

Why is 4 low for the scalp but not for the face? Can I maybe add something to it, like dilute it with water to make it more suitable?

Good question - I wonder if I was thinking of pH for hair, not scalp :hmm:
<goes off to :google:> ... nope, scalp pH is the same as skin, ~5.5. So the question is, why is it suitable for face skin at such a low pH? Could it be because other products are used afterwards? I don't know :confused:

Diluting it should bring the pH up, with water being theoretically neutral but tap water seems generally to be ever so slightly alkaline. Thinking about it, you could probably just wash it off after the BHA has had time to work; if your face skin was happy with it (I assume it was ineffective but otherwise benign?) then I would think your scalp would be okay with it for a while too.

[Ylva]

Good question - I wonder if I was thinking of pH for hair, not scalp :hmm:
<goes off to :google:> ... nope, scalp pH is the same as skin, ~5.5. So the question is, why is it suitable for face skin at such a low pH? Could it be because other products are used afterwards? I don't know :confused:

Diluting it should bring the pH up, with water being theoretically neutral but tap water seems generally to be ever so slightly alkaline. Thinking about it, you could probably just wash it off after the BHA has had time to work; if your face skin was happy with it (I assume it was ineffective but otherwise benign?) then I would think your scalp would be okay with it for a while too.

Thank you for putting in the effort to try and make sense of it! You know what, I’ll take it on a test run once my scalp has settled down from today’s stuff. It’s not going to do anything terrible either way, diluted or washed off soon after. And indeed, my face was totally fine with it, even though my skin is rather sensitive. I hope you can find these products somewhere to give them or just one a shot (proper use). As I said, I do love the whitehead one, so I’m sure they’re both excellent. For some reason I just have stubborn blackheads.

[Begemot]

I have a nearly full, useless bottle of COSRX Blackhead Power Liquid which did nothing for my blackheads (the whitehead one I LOVE, it's one of my rare skincare holy grails!), so I thought I could maybe use that on my scalp as a chemical exfoliant. I mean, it should be okay?! The ingredients are: Salix Alba (Willow) Bark Water, Butylene Glycol, Betaine Salicylate, Niacinamide, 1,2-Hexanediol, Arginine, Panthenol, Sodium Hyaluronate, Xanthan Gum, Ethyl Hexanediol. It's meant for the face and skin is skin, after all, so yeah. My face and scalp act extremely similarly anyway.

I have the same product and just might try it on my scalp too! Should be interesting :D

[Ylva]

I have the same product and just might try it on my scalp too! Should be interesting :D

Off topic, but did it work for your face? :D

[Begemot]

Off topic, but did it work for your face? :D

I'd say it works well enough but blackheads aren't a big issue for me to begin with. I use it once or twice a month for two to three days straight. I'll try the whitehead power liquid next! :)

[Copasetic]

I have had a chronically itchy and dry scalp for a while now. It was too the point where I thought i was going to have to see a dermatologist because it was driving me insane. I tried so many remedies and nothing worked. I have been using the Living Proof scalp treatment for about a month and it seems to be working.

[lapushka]

I have had a chronically itchy and dry scalp for a while now. It was too the point where I thought i was going to have to see a dermatologist because it was driving me insane. I tried so many remedies and nothing worked. I have been using the Living Proof scalp treatment for about a month and it seems to be working.

Well it's great you found something that works!

[Begemot]

I checked the ingredients of Living Proof scalp treatment and it seems quite nice product!

I haven't used hydro gel for a little while so applied that to my scalp and massaged a little. I try to avoid massaging my scalp too much when it has product on it. I noticed that my temples have tiny bit of buildup. My temples are always the first place to act up, ugh.

[Ylva]

I applied the COSRX Blackhead Power Liquid to my scalp today, diluted in water. I applied it to a clean scalp, so it'll stay there until next wash day. So far so good, scalp feels fresh! :D

[Begemot]

So the COSRX experiment has begun :D very interesting to see how your scalp likes it, Ylva!

[Ylva]

Indeed it has!

LMAO, I actually had a dream last night that chunks of hair were coming out as result of using it on my scalp. :rollin:

My scalp is doing just fine, though!

[MusicalSpoons]

Ylva glad that was only a dream!! :bigeyes: Will of course be interested to hear how your hair and scalp actually fare! I have to say, reading about the liquid was helpful - I realised afterwards that my face likes a particular face wash despite containing SLES, so I looked at the ingredients and it also contains benzyl salicylate and salicylic acid, plus I usually let it sit for a couple of minutes anyway. So I think the liquid probably will be worth trying :) Also interesting because it means my scalp may well like salicylic acid, but I don't have enough of the face wash to try it a few times to find out and they've discontinued it :-(

I'm going to try the Nizoral tonight and try to remember to condition my scalp afterwards. I also bought a couple of Faith in Nature shampoos (on special offer, yay!) as the family of ammonium sulphates are the only thing I've not tried yet in my quest for keeping my scalp happy and roots clean! One fragrance free and the other rosemary - I'll try one for my next scalp wash and not after the Nizoral though, to properly assess how it goes.

[Little Lemon]

I have suffered with scalp problems. These things are what helped me the most:

1. Shampooing with a moisturizing shampoo with sulfates.
2. Not stretching washes (I wash every other day).
3. Using a Maxsoft scalp massager shampoo brush as I shampoo.

I was surprised how much adding the scalp brush helped. It solved a lot of problems that I originally thought I would have to address with chemicals. I’m not sure how it helps so much, but it does.

I realize that these three steps go against what many in the LHC do. However, my scalp has felt way better since doing these steps, and I wanted to share in case it can help anyone else. Scalp problems are no fun.

[Begemot]

Horrible dream, Ylva! :couch:

Yay for the special offer from me too, MusicalSpoons! Tell us how your hair and scalp feels after today's wash :thumbsup:

[dagny]

I have suffered with scalp problems. These things are what helped me the most:

1. Shampooing with a moisturizing shampoo with sulfates.
2. Not stretching washes (I wash every other day).
3. Using a Maxsoft scalp massager shampoo brush as I shampoo.

I was surprised how much adding the scalp brush helped. It solved a lot of problems that I originally thought I would have to address with chemicals. I’m not sure how it helps so much, but it does.

I realize that these three steps go against what many in the LHC do. However, my scalp has felt way better since doing these steps, and I wanted to share in case it can help anyone else. Scalp problems are no fun.

Ditto to everything above!!

I have a different brand scalp massager, but it is the same design and "bristles" -- it feels amazing.

I have also used AHA solutions from The Ordinary on my scalp as well as AHA/BHA "peel" solutions. (It would be the same as using them on my face.) .

Exfoliation is important for the skin, whether it be mechanical (brush, scrubs, scritching, fingernails) or chemical (AHA, enzymes, BHA) because the dead skin cells flake off every day and if those flakes are plastered down to the scalp due to sebum, product build up, thick hair then this natural cleansing mechanism of our scalp cannot function properly. Those plastered flakes can hold moisture (water or oil from sebum) and this is when fungus and yeast grows causing SD and other scalp conditions. It is easy to over do it, so be gentle but consistent.

In people with SD, the Nizoral and H&S work to kill fungus/yeast and also have a mild chemical exfoliant; but if the underlying issues are still there (not fully or routinely exfoliation the scalp as well as poor health and diet) then the conditions will return. Many people also have SD on the face (they often mistake this as "dry" skin, but it is usually red with flakes, often greasy flakes), so you can use the Nizoral or H&S shampoo on the face if you suffer from this condition.

A carb and sugar heavy diet, poor quality protein and poor quality fats in the diet also contributes to these issues, so don't overlook diet! By "poor quality" I am talking about grain-fed animal proteins, farmed fish, trans fats, inflammatory oils (especially vegetable oils like canola, corn, hydrogenated, margarine, etc), sugars, chemicals, gluten, and other things that are known to cause cellular inflammation and poor health. Get your leafy greens every day (the more variety, the better!), high-quality animal proteins (pastured and wild), high-quality fats (EVOO, avocados, olives, pastured/wild animal fats including dairy fats, coconut and palm oils), Omega 3 fatty acids (fish, fish oil, chia, etc), and variety of low starch vegetables every day. Go easy on high sugar fruits and try and stick with the lower sugar fruit variety if you suffer from SD (berries, lemons, limes for example). Then use the complex carbohydrates as "accents' for the meal -- not the whole of the meal!-- rice, starchy vegetables, oats, etc.

[MusicalSpoons]

Horrible dream, Ylva! :couch:

Yay for the special offer from me too, MusicalSpoons! Tell us how your hair and scalp feels after today's wash :thumbsup:

So far so good, but the test will be over the next few days :) not entirely a fair test though, as I will need to look presentable over the weekend so will need to do a scalp wash, but usually by the end of day 2 after a wash I'll know if it's going to be a bit flaky or not.

Saying that, this is the first time for a while that I've woken up without any white flakiness anywhere around my hairline - usually it's on the side where I most slept with my hair drying overnight, sometimes more sometimes less but usually always *some*. I cannot afford the time, energy, product or electricity to do what I did last night every time, though. (Will write it up when I have a bit more brainpower :dizzy:)

[Begemot]

Ditto to everything above!!

I have a different brand scalp massager, but it is the same design and "bristles" -- it feels amazing.

I have also used AHA solutions from The Ordinary on my scalp as well as AHA/BHA "peel" solutions. (It would be the same as using them on my face.) .

Exfoliation is important for the skin, whether it be mechanical (brush, scrubs, scritching, fingernails) or chemical (AHA, enzymes, BHA) because the dead skin cells flake off every day and if those flakes are plastered down to the scalp due to sebum, product build up, thick hair then this natural cleansing mechanism of our scalp cannot function properly. Those plastered flakes can hold moisture (water or oil from sebum) and this is when fungus and yeast grows causing SD and other scalp conditions. It is easy to over do it, so be gentle but consistent.

In people with SD, the Nizoral and H&S work to kill fungus/yeast and also have a mild chemical exfoliant; but if the underlying issues are still there (not fully or routinely exfoliation the scalp as well as poor health and diet) then the conditions will return. Many people also have SD on the face (they often mistake this as "dry" skin, but it is usually red with flakes, often greasy flakes), so you can use the Nizoral or H&S shampoo on the face if you suffer from this condition.

A carb and sugar heavy diet, poor quality protein and poor quality fats in the diet also contributes to these issues, so don't overlook diet! By "poor quality" I am talking about grain-fed animal proteins, farmed fish, trans fats, inflammatory oils (especially vegetable oils like canola, corn, hydrogenated, margarine, etc), sugars, chemicals, gluten, and other things that are known to cause cellular inflammation and poor health. Get your leafy greens every day (the more variety, the better!), high-quality animal proteins (pastured and wild), high-quality fats (EVOO, avocados, olives, pastured/wild animal fats including dairy fats, coconut and palm oils), Omega 3 fatty acids (fish, fish oil, chia, etc), and variety of low starch vegetables every day. Go easy on high sugar fruits and try and stick with the lower sugar fruit variety if you suffer from SD (berries, lemons, limes for example). Then use the complex carbohydrates as "accents' for the meal -- not the whole of the meal!-- rice, starchy vegetables, oats, etc.

This is such good comment, great information :)


So far so good, but the test will be over the next few days :) not entirely a fair test though, as I will need to look presentable over the weekend so will need to do a scalp wash, but usually by the end of day 2 after a wash I'll know if it's going to be a bit flaky or not.

Saying that, this is the first time for a while that I've woken up without any white flakiness anywhere around my hairline - usually it's on the side where I most slept with my hair drying overnight, sometimes more sometimes less but usually always *some*. I cannot afford the time, energy, product or electricity to do what I did last night every time, though. (Will write it up when I have a bit more brainpower :dizzy:)

Maybe you can do last night's routine here and there (don't know your wash routine) so you can maintain these results :) no flakiness sounds great after just one wash etc.!

[lapushka]

So far so good, but the test will be over the next few days :) not entirely a fair test though, as I will need to look presentable over the weekend so will need to do a scalp wash, but usually by the end of day 2 after a wash I'll know if it's going to be a bit flaky or not.

Saying that, this is the first time for a while that I've woken up without any white flakiness anywhere around my hairline - usually it's on the side where I most slept with my hair drying overnight, sometimes more sometimes less but usually always *some*. I cannot afford the time, energy, product or electricity to do what I did last night every time, though. (Will write it up when I have a bit more brainpower :dizzy:)

Sounds promising, at least. That's one thing.

I have been "remarkably" totally flake-free for a while now. My last few washes to get totally rid of flakes were 2 consecutive weeks with H&S left on for 2 min. on the scalp. Yes, I thought if I can leave Nizoral on for a few minutes, I can do it with these (and the dermatologist Dr Dray was talking about it in a video that people just wash it off without letting the zinc p. do its thing for a few min.). So I at least dared to do it. LOL!

[Ylva]

After the double exfoliation (physical and chemical), my scalp is visibly cleaner. Now, I can actually see the "dark dots" my hairdresser was talking about at the roots of the hair strands, meaning there's no remarkable sebum buildup there. I will do this ~weekly.

[MusicalSpoons]

Dark dots at the roots? Interesting, I've not heard of that before.


Last night's wash went like so:
- Pre-poo condition with my usual second C (contains PEG-10-dimethicone), including thoroughly condition scalp (hoped the dimethicone would be an extra layer of protection against harsh Nizoral)
- [Left on many hours longer than intended!]
- in shower: Wet scalp, use Nizoral, let sit, rinse, usual shampoo and rinse
- ROO (as usual), rinse
- Conditioner (normally my first C, no cones, also more expensive) including scalp, thoroughly. Let sit [showerly duties], rinse thoroughly. Finished

To condition my scalp thoroughly - whether wet, damp, or dry - extends the amount of time it takes to apply the conditioner to about double, and takes more energy.
Letting Nizoral sit for 5 mins or more takes extra time and electricity to run the shower (no heating, I get cold easily and it makes me more ill, and shampoo runs down if I do much as move my head so no using the time for other shower activities).
Then of course the extra conditioning the second time takes extra time, energy, and I used my more expensive conditioner for that because I don't want cones near my roots after shampooing.

The extra-long pre-conditioning might have had as much to do with it as anything else, tbh - if so, that might be sustainable because it gives me long enough to fully recover between that and the showering/washing hair afterwards. Eh, I guess we'll see :shrug:

[Begemot]

After the double exfoliation (physical and chemical), my scalp is visibly cleaner. Now, I can actually see the "dark dots" my hairdresser was talking about at the roots of the hair strands, meaning there's no remarkable sebum buildup there. I will do this ~weekly.

I'll give the blackhead liquid a try tomorrow!

I went looking for pictures of scalps... It does seem like healthy scalp has dark spots looming under skin (hair that's yet to be surfaced, I think?) https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5243dccde4b08fd9e4fc92ef/t/5c02ba1d6d2a738dea63fc4a/1543870407186/normal+scalp
Here you can see scalps that have flakes and scales (could be SD, psoriasis, etc.), some blocking the follicle
http://www.ijpd.in/articles/2018/19/2/images/IndianJPaediatrDermatol_2018_19_2_93_228345_f4.jpg
http://www.ijtrichology.com/articles/2019/11/1/images/IntJTrichol_2019_11_1_14_252218_f8.jpg

[Joules]

Here you can see scalps that have flakes and scales (could be SD, psoriasis, etc.), some blocking the follicle
http://www.ijpd.in/articles/2018/19/2/images/IndianJPaediatrDermatol_2018_19_2_93_228345_f4.jpg
http://www.ijtrichology.com/articles/2019/11/1/images/IntJTrichol_2019_11_1_14_252218_f8.jpg

It's just a dirty scalp with sebum plugs/clogged follicles and skin cells that need to be washed out, SD looks way more different (just google it). Everyone who stretches washes or doesn't wash at all must see it :puke:

I recently came across a cheaper version of Nizoral shampoos and I wonder if I should try them even though my scalp seems ok right now but has a history of fungal overgrowth. There are 3 options: 1% ketoconazole, 1% zink pyrithione and 1% zink pyrithione + 2% ketoconazole. A milder version with 1% ketoconazole wouldn't hurt me, would it? Does anyone have experience?


Ditto to everything above!!


I have a different brand scalp massager, but it is the same design and "bristles" -- it feels amazing.


I have also used AHA solutions from The Ordinary on my scalp as well as AHA/BHA "peel" solutions. (It would be the same as using them on my face.) .


Exfoliation is important for the skin, whether it be mechanical (brush, scrubs, scritching, fingernails) or chemical (AHA, enzymes, BHA) because the dead skin cells flake off every day and if those flakes are plastered down to the scalp due to sebum, product build up, thick hair then this natural cleansing mechanism of our scalp cannot function properly. Those plastered flakes can hold moisture (water or oil from sebum) and this is when fungus and yeast grows causing SD and other scalp conditions. It is easy to over do it, so be gentle but consistent.


In people with SD, the Nizoral and H&S work to kill fungus/yeast and also have a mild chemical exfoliant; but if the underlying issues are still there (not fully or routinely exfoliation the scalp as well as poor health and diet) then the conditions will return. Many people also have SD on the face (they often mistake this as "dry" skin, but it is usually red with flakes, often greasy flakes), so you can use the Nizoral or H&S shampoo on the face if you suffer from this condition.


A carb and sugar heavy diet, poor quality protein and poor quality fats in the diet also contributes to these issues, so don't overlook diet! By "poor quality" I am talking about grain-fed animal proteins, farmed fish, trans fats, inflammatory oils (especially vegetable oils like canola, corn, hydrogenated, margarine, etc), sugars, chemicals, gluten, and other things that are known to cause cellular inflammation and poor health. Get your leafy greens every day (the more variety, the better!), high-quality animal proteins (pastured and wild), high-quality fats (EVOO, avocados, olives, pastured/wild animal fats including dairy fats, coconut and palm oils), Omega 3 fatty acids (fish, fish oil, chia, etc), and variety of low starch vegetables every day. Go easy on high sugar fruits and try and stick with the lower sugar fruit variety if you suffer from SD (berries, lemons, limes for example). Then use the complex carbohydrates as "accents' for the meal -- not the whole of the meal!-- rice, starchy vegetables, oats, etc.


Great info!


I wonder if "dry" scalp is actually SD/soe fungal thing too. I've heard many trichologists say that dry scalp in adults isn't a norm, but they never elaborate, so I have no idea what it actually is.

[Begemot]

It's just a dirty scalp with sebum plugs/clogged follicles and skin cells that need to be washed out, SD looks way more different (just google it). Everyone who stretches washes or doesn't wash at all must see it :puke:

The image source just said it might be SD or psori, since there's milder and more severe forms but that the scalp in that pic is not normal. Googled and found this pic (not graphic!) https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-c5e00ce3ffb0232947242dbe0e2575d7.webp

[lapushka]

I recently came across a cheaper version of Nizoral shampoos and I wonder if I should try them even though my scalp seems ok right now but has a history of fungal overgrowth. There are 3 options: 1% ketoconazole, 1% zink pyrithione and 1% zink pyrithione + 2% ketoconazole. A milder version with 1% ketoconazole wouldn't hurt me, would it? Does anyone have experience?

In Belgium we can get Nizoral only in 2%. 1% doesn't exist here. And the 2% is OTC, but 14.25 euro for 100ml so quite expensive. I don't use it if I can help it. But I have been known to shampoo with the Nizoral 2%, leave it in for 10 min. then wash with H&S immediately after.

Also if you use H&S, please let it sit a couple to 5 min. - it makes SO much difference, you wouldn't believe it! Just my experience, and I have only left it on 2 min.

[Joules]

In Belgium we can get Nizoral only in 2%. 1% doesn't exist here. And the 2% is OTC, but 14.25 euro for 100ml so quite expensive. I don't use it if I can help it. But I have been known to shampoo with the Nizoral 2%, leave it in for 10 min. then wash with H&S immediately after.

Also if you use H&S, please let it sit a couple to 5 min. - it makes SO much difference, you wouldn't believe it! Just my experience, and I have only left it on 2 min.

I don't use H&S because it contains dimethicone and I've been searching for an alternative for months now. All regular anti-dandruff shampoos from supermarkets with zink pyrithione contain dimethicone, it's ridiculous, why is it even in there? So those shampoos I mentioned seem like the best option for me now, they're a brand of a pharmacy chain so it makes them cheap. I'm just wondering if it's even worth trying at all. I'm obviously not gonna get the strongest one.

[Ylva]

I just checked the price of Nizoral 20 mg (2%) for fun, and it seems that here, 60 (!!) ml costs €14,23 and 100 ml costs €21,84! :spitting: :tmi: Won't be trying it without a real medical need, no!


I'll give the blackhead liquid a try tomorrow!

I went looking for pictures of scalps... It does seem like healthy scalp has dark spots looming under skin (hair that's yet to be surfaced, I think?) https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5243dccde4b08fd9e4fc92ef/t/5c02ba1d6d2a738dea63fc4a/1543870407186/normal+scalp
Here you can see scalps that have flakes and scales (could be SD, psoriasis, etc.), some blocking the follicle
http://www.ijpd.in/articles/2018/19/2/images/IndianJPaediatrDermatol_2018_19_2_93_228345_f4.jpg
http://www.ijtrichology.com/articles/2019/11/1/images/IntJTrichol_2019_11_1_14_252218_f8.jpg

Yep, this is indeed along the lines of what my hairdresser was explaining and showing me.

Let us know how your experiment with the blackhead liquid goes! :) This is very interesting.


I don't use H&S because it contains dimethicone and I've been searching for an alternative for months now. All regular anti-dandruff shampoos from supermarkets with zink pyrithione contain dimethicone, it's ridiculous, why is it even in there? So those shampoos I mentioned seem like the best option for me now, they're a brand of a pharmacy chain so it makes them cheap. I'm just wondering if it's even worth trying at all. I'm obviously not gonna get the strongest one.

I suppose it's to try and mask the harshness of the shampoo, especially considering that most men don't bother with conditioners and the such. :shrug: It sucks, I agree.

[lapushka]

I don't use H&S because it contains dimethicone and I've been searching for an alternative for months now. All regular anti-dandruff shampoos from supermarkets with zink pyrithione contain dimethicone, it's ridiculous, why is it even in there? So those shampoos I mentioned seem like the best option for me now, they're a brand of a pharmacy chain so it makes them cheap. I'm just wondering if it's even worth trying at all. I'm obviously not gonna get the strongest one.

The own brand Aldi one here doesn't have the silicones, which is why I bought it. But in my experience the silicones in the H&S = fine (for me at least). Maybe look there? Even though I know their range differs country to country!!!

[MusicalSpoons]

I'll give the blackhead liquid a try tomorrow!

I went looking for pictures of scalps... It does seem like healthy scalp has dark spots looming under skin (hair that's yet to be surfaced, I think?) https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5243dccde4b08fd9e4fc92ef/t/5c02ba1d6d2a738dea63fc4a/1543870407186/normal+scalp

Oh! That's why my legs look the way they do! :rollin: well that makes sense :grin:

[Begemot]

Oh! That's why my legs look the way they do! :rollin: well that makes sense :grin:

:lol: :lol:

[Begemot]

So, just applied COSRX BHA Blackhead liquid (undiluted) on my scalp. I'm probably going to wash my hair today but I will wait an hour or two at least. I'm bit of a scaredy cat when it comes to leaving something on my scalp and hair for longer periods of time. I'll try this and maybe next time I'll leave it over night.

[Joules]

The own brand Aldi one here doesn't have the silicones, which is why I bought it. But in my experience the silicones in the H&S = fine (for me at least). Maybe look there? Even though I know their range differs country to country!!!

We don't have Aldi in Russia, unfortunately :( I think I'll get one of thise shampoos from the pharmacy, to use once or twice a month as a prophylactic measure.

Guys, I just bought my 4th tube of NS scalp scrub :lol: I'm almost out of my previous one already :lol:

About that COSRX BHA liquid, how much do you need for one application? I just googled it and it is available here, but it's quite expensive. Or I guess I'm gonna have to find an alternative here too :D

[Begemot]

Gah, I need to try that NS scrub... I have been thinking about it for months.

Joules, I feel that little amount went long way with COSRX BHA liquid since it's so watery (just had to be careful when applying, one drop at a time). It's a relatively big bottle too. Next I might try The Ordinary's Peeling Solution with BHA since it's on the cheaper side.

[lapushka]

We don't have Aldi in Russia, unfortunately :( I think I'll get one of thise shampoos from the pharmacy, to use once or twice a month as a prophylactic measure.

Guys, I just bought my 4th tube of NS scalp scrub :lol: I'm almost out of my previous one already :lol:

About that COSRX BHA liquid, how much do you need for one application? I just googled it and it is available here, but it's quite expensive. Or I guess I'm gonna have to find an alternative here too :D

Oh OK. I didn't know that. You learn something new every time!

[MusicalSpoons]

Update: yesterday I had little flakes and looked pretty oily right from waking up. Usually I'm looking presentable for two days after washing but yesterday was not. I guess I could have used a lighter conditioner for the scalp but this happened before without it (just more flakes) so yeah, not very impressed.

Ought to scalp wash tonight so will try Faith in Nature shampoo :)

[Ylva]

Guys, I just bought my 4th tube of NS scalp scrub :lol: I'm almost out of my previous one already :lol:

About that COSRX BHA liquid, how much do you need for one application? I just googled it and it is available here, but it's quite expensive. Or I guess I'm gonna have to find an alternative here too :D

:lol: I'm almost done with my first tube.

I used two pumps and diluted it with water. So not much at all. You can order it off of eBay (that's what I do as well), just make sure it comes from South Korea and not anywhere else in the world, it'll be genuine then.

[Begemot]

My hair is almost completely dry now. My bangs dried already a while ago and I noticed some flakes on them. There's some flakes behind my ears too. Not surprised since those are my problem areas. My skin does not look or feel irritated so I'll assume the BHA liquid just loosened some pesky dandruff? I'll keep experimenting :)

[Ylva]

My hair is almost completely dry now. My bangs dried already a while ago and I noticed some flakes on them. There's some flakes behind my ears too. Not surprised since those are my problem areas. My skin does not look or feel irritated so I'll assume the BHA liquid just loosened some pesky dandruff? I'll keep experimenting :)

That's kinda why I opted to apply it on a clean, physically exfoliated scalp. I find that my facial skin doesn't care about anything if it isn't clean, let alone if I don't physically exfoliate it first. But that's me, at least.

[Begemot]

That's kinda why I opted to apply it on a clean, physically exfoliated scalp. I find that my facial skin doesn't care about anything if it isn't clean, let alone if I don't physically exfoliate it first. But that's me, at least.

You know what works best for you :thumbsup: I'm still feeling kind of apprehensive about physical exfoliants so I'm going to try keep using the BHA liquid regularly and see if it helps on its own. But I'm pretty certain I won't be able to resist that Natura Siberica's scalp scrub forever...

[Ylva]

You know what works best for you :thumbsup: I'm still feeling kind of apprehensive about physical exfoliants so I'm going to try keep using the BHA liquid regularly and see if it helps on its own. But I'm pretty certain I won't be able to resist that Natura Siberica's scalp scrub forever...

Yeah, I hear a lot of people talk about how bad physical exfoliation is and micro cuts and whatnot... But my skin really loves it, so :shrug:

[Begemot]

Yeah, I hear a lot of people talk about how bad physical exfoliation is and micro cuts and whatnot... But my skin really loves it, so :shrug:

I'm not too worried about that kind of thing, I would imagine you'd have to rub pretty darn hard and often to cause some kind of damage. Trust your scalp feel :) My skin is on the dry side and problematic because of my skin condition, so I try to avoid harsher options if I can. I'll try milder stuff and go from there so I won't upset my scalp too much.

[Ylva]

I'm not too worried about that kind of thing, I would imagine you'd have to rub pretty darn hard and often to cause some kind of damage. Trust your scalp feel :) My skin is on the dry side and problematic because of my skin condition, so I try to avoid harsher options if I can. I'll try milder stuff and go from there so I won't upset my scalp too much.

Yep, that's probably a good idea! I have no experience of such things, I'm kind of the opposite.

[Begemot]

Yep, that's probably a good idea! I have no experience of such things, I'm kind of the opposite.

You don't have to worry these kind of things so knock yourself out with the products your scalp and hair likes ;)

[luckydandelion]

I have a finicky, easily angered scalp (almost as reactive as the skin on my body, but my scalp is a little tougher). I need to avoid almost all oils because of fungal issues, so finding ways to keep it hydrated without flaring up my scalp problems is a must. With a buzzcut it's not an issue (the oils in my scalp reach the tips of my hair REALLY easily ;) ) but as I grow longer hair I'll have to insist with herbal rinses that promote slip/softness, colloidal oatmeal to ease any itchiness, and humectants to keep it supple and hydrated.
The cherry on top is that high concentrations of glycerin upset my skin/scalp too, so I have very limited options! I sadly have to use Head and Shoulders at least every three or four days to keep any fungi under control (and avoid the horrible combo of flakiness, sore oily spots in my scalp, and scalp acne) and my ends HATE that. Maybe I can prepoo with mineral oil in the future? I don't like it as a leave-in, but it could work for that purpose and the sulfates would remove it anyways.

[luckydandelion]

I have a finicky, easily angered scalp (almost as reactive as the skin on my body, but my scalp is a little tougher). I need to avoid almost all oils because of fungal issues, so finding ways to keep it hydrated without flaring up my scalp problems is a must. With a buzzcut it's not an issue (the oils in my scalp reach the tips of my hair REALLY easily ;) ) but as I grow longer hair I'll have to insist with herbal rinses that promote slip/softness, colloidal oatmeal to ease any itchiness, and humectants to keep it supple and hydrated.
The cherry on top is that high concentrations of glycerin upset my skin/scalp too, so I have very limited options! I sadly have to use Head and Shoulders at least every three or four days to keep any fungi under control (and avoid the horrible combo of flakiness, sore oily spots in my scalp, and scalp acne) and my ends HATE that. Maybe I can prepoo with mineral oil in the future? I don't like it as a leave-in, but it could work for that purpose and the sulfates would remove it anyways.

Pressed enter too early and I'm too new to edit (oops). I was also thinking about buying a wooden comb and a BBB in the future, so I can take the excess sebum off my scalp and put it in my lengths, where it belongs! I guess I'll embrace the victorian "frizzy wavy" look :p

[Zesty]

Has anyone tried the innate life scalp treatment(s)? https://www.theinnatelife.com/collections/scalp-treatments/products/problematicscalptreatment

I realize that it's probably an awful idea for me to try this, as it contains so many oils and oiling my scalp has been disastrous in the past. I just want to do something special to give my scalp a boost the way I do oil treatments etc on my hair. Probably the best thing I could do for my scalp is leave it tf alone! I just can't shake this idea. :p

[luckydandelion]

Has anyone tried the innate life scalp treatment(s)? https://www.theinnatelife.com/collections/scalp-treatments/products/problematicscalptreatment

I realize that it's probably an awful idea for me to try this, as it contains so many oils and oiling my scalp has been disastrous in the past. I just want to do something special to give my scalp a boost the way I do oil treatments etc on my hair. Probably the best thing I could do for my scalp is leave it tf alone! I just can't shake this idea. :p
Maybe you can do a nice scalp massage? Or look for a treatment that doesn't involve that many oils! Some people here swear by scrubs, but I don't know if that's your thing :)

[Ylva]

Has anyone tried the innate life scalp treatment(s)? https://www.theinnatelife.com/collections/scalp-treatments/products/problematicscalptreatment

I realize that it's probably an awful idea for me to try this, as it contains so many oils and oiling my scalp has been disastrous in the past. I just want to do something special to give my scalp a boost the way I do oil treatments etc on my hair. Probably the best thing I could do for my scalp is leave it tf alone! I just can't shake this idea. :p

You have SD, right? Maybe look into the Natura Siberica scrub. It's cleansing, exfoliating and "boosting" at the same time.

[Begemot]

Has anyone tried the innate life scalp treatment(s)? https://www.theinnatelife.com/collections/scalp-treatments/products/problematicscalptreatment

I realize that it's probably an awful idea for me to try this, as it contains so many oils and oiling my scalp has been disastrous in the past. I just want to do something special to give my scalp a boost the way I do oil treatments etc on my hair. Probably the best thing I could do for my scalp is leave it tf alone! I just can't shake this idea. :p

That treatment does sound nice... but I too try to avoid oils on my scalp. Gallinée has interesting products for scalp (oil-free serum and mask), Grow Gorgeous too but I think most have more or less oils also. Another interesting exfoliating product like Natura Siberica's is Kiehl's Deep Micro-Exfoliating Scalp Treatment (more expensive though). Just some suggestions :D You can do without but let us know if you do try some product!

[lapushka]

I've been there with oils (tried just about everything). It's different when removing cradle cap from the delicate head of a baby with some sweet almond oil (at the time my skull hadn't grown fully shut), but in adults? I would not risk it, personally.

[Zesty]

Thank you everyone for the thoughts!


Maybe you can do a nice scalp massage? Or look for a treatment that doesn't involve that many oils! Some people here swear by scrubs, but I don't know if that's your thing :)

Massage is a good idea -- and probably the safest! I use a shampoo brush to exfoliate my scalp so maybe I'll look into scrubs.


You have SD, right? Maybe look into the Natura Siberica scrub. It's cleansing, exfoliating and "boosting" at the same time.

I've never been diagnosed but my scalp does have a lot of the characteristics for SD. Thank you for the suggestion! Maybe I'll try that.


That treatment does sound nice... but I too try to avoid oils on my scalp. Gallinée has interesting products for scalp (oil-free serum and mask), Grow Gorgeous too but I think most have more or less oils also. Another interesting exfoliating product like Natura Siberica's is Kiehl's Deep Micro-Exfoliating Scalp Treatment (more expensive though). Just some suggestions :D You can do without but let us know if you do try some product!

Thanks for all the suggestions! I'll have to do some research on ingredients. :)


I've been there with oils (tried just about everything). It's different when removing cradle cap from the delicate head of a baby with some sweet almond oil (at the time my skull hadn't grown fully shut), but in adults? I would not risk it, personally.

Yeah tbh I was surprised at all the good reviews people give it all over the internet... Obviously I take those with a grain of salt but oiling one's scalp just seems so problematic to me...

[Ylva]

I repeated the scrub + COSRX treatment last night. The first time my scalp felt a bit tingly after the BHA liquid, but this time, no such sensations, even though I diluted it a bit less.

[MusicalSpoons]

:lol: I'm almost done with my first tube.

I used two pumps and diluted it with water. So not much at all. You can order it off of eBay (that's what I do as well), just make sure it comes from South Korea and not anywhere else in the world, it'll be genuine then.

Ahhhhh awesome tip! Can get it at just over half the price of UK sites :grin: I'm trying to be really sensible with finances right now but that puts it in reach - and I'm fairly sure one or other of my face or scalp will like it.


You know what works best for you :thumbsup: I'm still feeling kind of apprehensive about physical exfoliants so I'm going to try keep using the BHA liquid regularly and see if it helps on its own. But I'm pretty certain I won't be able to resist that Natura Siberica's scalp scrub forever...

Just FYI, it contains sodium-coco-sulphate; I don't know the exact nature of your dry skin but it really dehydrated my scalp both times I tried it (months apart).


I tried the Faith in Nature Rosemary shampoo and it smelled *amazing*. It left my hair very clean and fluffy, and I had insane volume - possibly from how it was bunned, but it is reminiscent of when I was trying the Yes to Cucumbers shampoo - but by day 2 my hair looked fairly greasy again, and the flakes were back. Nothing too bad, certainly, and I'll try it again with a full wash to give it a fairer test. It did leave my hair feeling quite dry as I used it for a scalp wash, so we'll see if using conditioner with it in a full wash helps with that. (I'm actually kinda tempted to use it to do just S&C and see how my hair reacts, if it's still all poofy and what the texture is like. Maybe.)

Edit: it did occur to me that the only thing left, if ALES doesn't work out, is an acid rinse. Citric acid makes my face happy, but didn't always seem to make much difference for my scalp; I guess I'd have to try it consistently as a final rinse (even if only on my scalp) to really see if it has an impact. But not yet, I need to properly trial ALES first.

[Begemot]

Just FYI, it contains sodium-coco-sulphate; I don't know the exact nature of your dry skin but it really dehydrated my scalp both times I tried it (months apart).


My scalp seems to tolerate coco-sulphate (at least in shampoos, for me it's better compared to SLES) but I do remember Ylva or Joules (or both?) commenting that this product dried their skin and/or hair a bit. That worried me a little but I want to experience the cool, breezy scalp sensation they talked about :D But thanks for the heads up! :thumbsup:

[Joules]

My scalp seems to tolerate coco-sulphate (at least in shampoos, for me it's better compared to SLES) but I do remember Ylva or Joules (or both?) commenting that this product dried their skin and/or hair a bit. That worried me a little but I want to experience the cool, breezy scalp sensation they talked about :D But thanks for the heads up! :thumbsup:

Thus scrub does make my roots feel squeaky like after a harsh shampoo. But it's just roots, it's not a big deal. Besides I always condition roots to tips afterwards. I usually scrub my scalp without prior hair oiling, but I do CWC. Or to be more more exact CSWC, conditioner-scrub-shampoo-conditioner. I also make sure to use a milder conditioning shampoo after the scrub just to wash it out and not put my hair through any more torture :) so for me it's not drying at all.

ETA: I think the squeaky feeling is more due to scrubbing and acid (it does contain something acidic if I remember correctly) rather than sodium coco-sulfate. It's a very deep cleansing rather than drying product, in my opinion at least.

Guys, I bought the off-brand anti-dandruff shampoo I was talking about :D 2% ketoconazole + 1% zink pyrithione. I'm gonna try it out this Friday. I wonder if anything is gonna change.

[ChloeDharma]

Ok so I think I may have had a "eureka" moment.

I gave up gluten last August for digestive and other issues and I think in that time my scalp which had previously been very sore and acneic calmed down but I didn;t make the connection.

Just recently I found myself absolutely craving pizza and other gluteny goodies and decided to see what happens if I treated myself. I didn't feel amazing after eating a decent pizza but also not that bad either so I decided to have what I called a "gluten holiday". I went to town on hot cross buns (you might need to be British to get what those are and why I craved them) and other things I've been craving.
Anyway, just recently I got a scalp flare up with painful acne again but worse than that my hair has been falling out in handfulls. It does seem interesting that this came on at just the time when I started eating gluten again (I'm now off it). I'll see how things go over the next few days/weeks but I'm starting to wonder if the scalp issue and shedding are related to eating gluten...the plot thickens!

Another interesting thing, I made an oil treatment yesterday for my scalp with red palm oil (not from Malasia!), mustard oil and Kalonji oil, with essential oils of tea tree, rosemary, lemongrass, spearmint and peppermint. Massaged it in thinking I would only leave it for an hour or two because my scalp was still sore but then soon after applying it my scalp felt calm and normal. I ended up leaving it in overnight and will wash it out today but this seems to have helped immensely. I know it's not just the essential oils as I had already been misting my scalp with them in rosewater with some MSM added, which did help but the additional oils have felt wonderful.
I'll see what my shedding is like when I wash it later.

As for the dry shampoo thing, yeah I'm just not going to bother with that, at least for now.

Anywho, I thought I'd share as maybe the gluten thing might be a factor in others without them realising too. Just so I'm clear, I'm not saying everyone should give up gluten, I know many people are fine with it but on so many levels it seems that for me it's not a good idea.

[Lady Stardust]

ChloeDharma, I totally understand the hot cross buns craving :) The good news is that M&S do a lovely wheat free version :)

[Sarahlabyrinth]

ChloeDharma, I totally understand the hot cross buns craving :) The good news is that M&S do a lovely wheat free version :)

Can't get'em here (France) I guess I'll have to make my own. :(

[ChloeDharma]

ChloeDharma, I totally understand the hot cross buns craving :) The good news is that M&S do a lovely wheat free version :)

Really?? Are they nice? I'm thinking being M&S they will be.

Sorry for derailing the thread, gluten free hot cross buns are big news for me lol.

ETA: You described them as "lovely" so of course that means they are nice! Lol I got carried away with the excitement then and didn't read properly!

[Lady Stardust]

Really?? Are they nice? I'm thinking being M&S they will be.

Sorry for derailing the thread, gluten free hot cross buns are big news for me lol.

ETA: You described them as "lovely" so of course that means they are nice! Lol I got carried away with the excitement then and didn't read properly!

Yes they’re soft and delicious and you wouldn’t know they were wheat free. They’re under the Made Without Wheat section and I can’t remember if they’re properly gluten free or just wheat free, but I expect they’re both. My sensitivity is to wheat and milk and they were free of those. I think they might be seasonal though, I don’t remember seeing any since Easter.

Genius also make some but I don’t know what they’re like.

Sorry to derail :)

[RottenMango]

I massage my scalp daily when I wash it and never put any product on it (besides shampoo while washing) to avoid clogging my hair follicles. I also try to avoid tight hairstyles or anything that will lead to a tender scalp.

[Begemot]

Thus scrub does make my roots feel squeaky like after a harsh shampoo. But it's just roots, it's not a big deal. Besides I always condition roots to tips afterwards. I usually scrub my scalp without prior hair oiling, but I do CWC. Or to be more more exact CSWC, conditioner-scrub-shampoo-conditioner. I also make sure to use a milder conditioning shampoo after the scrub just to wash it out and not put my hair through any more torture :) so for me it's not drying at all.

ETA: I think the squeaky feeling is more due to scrubbing and acid (it does contain something acidic if I remember correctly) rather than sodium coco-sulfate. It's a very deep cleansing rather than drying product, in my opinion at least.

Guys, I bought the off-brand anti-dandruff shampoo I was talking about :D 2% ketoconazole + 1% zink pyrithione. I'm gonna try it out this Friday. I wonder if anything is gonna change.

Great tip, I'll do CSWC if and when I try NS scalp scrub :) Hopefully your scalp and hair will like the new shampoo!


I massage my scalp daily when I wash it and never put any product on it (besides shampoo while washing) to avoid clogging my hair follicles. I also try to avoid tight hairstyles or anything that will lead to a tender scalp.

Too tight hairstyles are something I struggle with. It's difficult to find the sweet spot and in the past I just ended up wearing my hair loose all the time.

[ChloeDharma]

Too tight hairstyles are something I struggle with. It's difficult to find the sweet spot and in the past I just ended up wearing my hair loose all the time.

Have you tried a French Plait? After years of thinking I could only manage them on other people I have recently got the hang of doing them on myself and now am in love. They keep my hair back enough but don't feel at all tight on my scalp so are perfect for when I'm sleeping or lounging around at home. For so long I lived in buns that felt too tight or ponytails that would slip out because having my hair loose all the time just aggrivates me to distraction! Then the sore scalp from the tightness would be an issue.

[ChloeDharma]

Yes they’re soft and delicious and you wouldn’t know they were wheat free. They’re under the Made Without Wheat section and I can’t remember if they’re properly gluten free or just wheat free, but I expect they’re both. My sensitivity is to wheat and milk and they were free of those. I think they might be seasonal though, I don’t remember seeing any since Easter.

Genius also make some but I don’t know what they’re like.

Sorry to derail :)

I'm definately going to keep an eye out for them, thank you!

[Begemot]

Have you tried a French Plait? After years of thinking I could only manage them on other people I have recently got the hang of doing them on myself and now am in love. They keep my hair back enough but don't feel at all tight on my scalp so are perfect for when I'm sleeping or lounging around at home. For so long I lived in buns that felt too tight or ponytails that would slip out because having my hair loose all the time just aggrivates me to distraction! Then the sore scalp from the tightness would be an issue.

I have been practicing my braiding but I'm still not very confident with them (I think my hair might be a little short for braids since my hair just slips/sticks out of them). I need someone to be my personal hair braider :lol: But seriously, I just need to practice more and grow more length. Being able to make a French plait would be a amazing!

[ChloeDharma]

I have been practicing my braiding but I'm still not very confident with them (I think my hair might be a little short for braids since my hair just slips/sticks out of them). I need someone to be my personal hair braider :lol: But seriously, I just need to practice more and grow more length. Being able to make a French plait would be a amazing!

I started doing them in the shower with conditioner on, just to keep my hair back and neatly under the shower cap while my conditioner soaked in for the rest of the shower. Then I started doing them with heavily oiled hair, as that's something I do lol. More recently I have started doing them to my hair after misting with my scalp mist, which does get on the length somewhat too. These make the braiding much easier. My hair is fine and slippery so is usually a nightmare to do anything to if it's at all freshly washed and dried, it just slips out! The misting or oiling makes all the difference but maybe something along these lines might help you?
I know the frustration, for years and years I could do them easily on other people but never on myself, then suddenly it just clicked.

[Begemot]

I started doing them in the shower with conditioner on, just to keep my hair back and neatly under the shower cap while my conditioner soaked in for the rest of the shower. Then I started doing them with heavily oiled hair, as that's something I do lol. More recently I have started doing them to my hair after misting with my scalp mist, which does get on the length somewhat too. These make the braiding much easier. My hair is fine and slippery so is usually a nightmare to do anything to if it's at all freshly washed and dried, it just slips out! The misting or oiling makes all the difference but maybe something along these lines might help you?
I know the frustration, for years and years I could do them easily on other people but never on myself, then suddenly it just clicked.

Thank you so much for the great tip! :heart: I'm definitely going to practice my braiding while conditioning or oiling. I just need to get serious with it and follow your footsteps :)

[hollygolightly]

hey everyone, I'm suffering from a dry flaky scalp and I have two questions: I once did an oat exfoliant for my skin in which I blended the oats until they turned into a powder and then I mixed it with a little bit of water to form a paste and I scrubbed my face and left it a little bit since it hardened and it turned into a mask. The results were amazing since the exfoliant left my face feeling really clean and my question is would this work for my scalp or should I do a normal sugar/salt/coffee and oil scrub? I'm a little bit afraid about the oats clogging my hair follicles but since the powder is much more fine than sugar, salt or coffee I thought it would be easier to distribute it into my scalp since the last time I did an scalp exfoliator I founded hard to distribute it.

The other question is about keeping your scalp moisturized in between washes. I don't know if this is a silly question to ask since sebum it's supposed to moisturize the scalp but I was thinking of spraying rosemary mixed with water in my scalp to keep it extra moisturized, does anyone use an extra something to moisturize your scalp?

[Ylva]

I have personally not tried it yet but maybe consider rye flour instead of oats? I don't know about oats, but rye should at least be the right pH for the scalp and even a little bit cleansing.

[JennGalt]

Oats are actually recommended for eczema, if that is what is causing the dry, flaky scalp trouble. They have also been used as a hair cleanser long before shampoo was invented; their saponin content makes this possible, and some people with dry skin still use oats for hair cleansing. I haven’t personally tried this, but I intend to :) However, I think it would be your fingertips doing most of the exfoliating, perhaps assisted by the saponins, and I wouldn’t expect good results if you use cones anywhere near your scalp unless you wash them off first.

I use oils to help keep my scalp moisturized, and it’s actually quite helpful and necessary for some of us with dryness due to eczema. But many people have trouble with oil on their scalps, and if your flakes are from SD, oil could make the problem worse. Try the rosemary spray if you want, but keeping your scalp wet (not with oil, with water) could cause problems of its own. I spritz my hair up to twice a day if it’s really hit and dry outside, but I avoid my scalp or oil it first since keeping my scalp wet or getting it wet too often will cause itchiness for me.

[luckydandelion]

Hi hollygolightly
Have you considered spacing out your shampoos or diluting them? I suffer from a flaky scalp too, but using my shampoo undiluted only worsens the matter! I understand if that's not an option though, specially if the flakes are due to dandruff.

[hollygolightly]

I have personally not tried it yet but maybe consider rye flour instead of oats? I don't know about oats, but rye should at least be the right pH for the scalp and even a little bit cleansing.

I was thinking about oats because it's easier for me to use it since it's already in my house, but i've seen people use rye flour to wash their hair so if I ever get access to it I would definitely give it a try


Oats are actually recommended for eczema, if that is what is causing the dry, flaky scalp trouble. They have also been used as a hair cleanser long before shampoo was invented; their saponin content makes this possible, and some people with dry skin still use oats for hair cleansing. I haven’t personally tried this, but I intend to :) However, I think it would be your fingertips doing most of the exfoliating, perhaps assisted by the saponins, and I wouldn’t expect good results if you use cones anywhere near your scalp unless you wash them off first.

I use oils to help keep my scalp moisturized, and it’s actually quite helpful and necessary for some of us with dryness due to eczema. But many people have trouble with oil on their scalps, and if your flakes are from SD, oil could make the problem worse. Try the rosemary spray if you want, but keeping your scalp wet (not with oil, with water) could cause problems of its own. I spritz my hair up to twice a day if it’s really hit and dry outside, but I avoid my scalp or oil it first since keeping my scalp wet or getting it wet too often will cause itchiness for me.

hmm I don't think I have eczema, is just that i've been under a lot of stress lately and it's getting cold outside. I don't use silicones near my scalp since they cause a lot of build up and make my scalp hurt. Maybe I should give it a try oats a try, I know they are very beneficial for skin. And my scalp doesn't have any problems with oils, is just that I don't want to have an oily looking scalp before my scalp gets naturally oily looking, but you are right, maybe having my scalp damp might do more harm than good


Hi hollygolightly
Have you considered spacing out your shampoos or diluting them? I suffer from a flaky scalp too, but using my shampoo undiluted only worsens the matter! I understand if that's not an option though, specially if the flakes are due to dandruff.

I haven't really considered since I've never had any problems with shampoo, but it could be an option, now that i'm thinking I think the flakes started to happen around the same time I started to shampoo twice. Although I do apply a little bit of shampoo the first wash (it doesn't even lather) and then I apply a little bit more

btw, luckydandelion greetings from a fellow south american! I was going through this thread and saw you talking about yerba mate and I instantly knew you were argentinian

well I also so it on your bio :hmm:

[luckydandelion]

oh my god, nice! We might swap product recommendations later on then 😁

[hollygolightly]

oh my god, nice! We might swap product recommendations later on then 😁

sure, anytime!

[hollygolightly]

about using oats as an exfoliator she answered my question: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OAhy_6_P9h0

[Begemot]

The other question is about keeping your scalp moisturized in between washes. I don't know if this is a silly question to ask since sebum it's supposed to moisturize the scalp but I was thinking of spraying rosemary mixed with water in my scalp to keep it extra moisturized, does anyone use an extra something to moisturize your scalp?

I use different products to hydrate and moisturize my scalp. My favorite is Sim System 4 Scalp lotion. It has all kinds of great ingredients (like glycerin, castor oil, ceramides, niacinamide, aloe vera juice, panthenol etc.). I have used gels and basic creams too.


about using oats as an exfoliator she answered my question: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OAhy_6_P9h0

Now I feel like putting some oat milk on my head, I actually have some... :grnbiggri Her hair is phenomenal!

[Tinyponies]

Been reading this thread with interest :)

With regard to oats and oat milk, I soak oats in water for my breakfast (with seeds and dried fruit) and they produce a lovely “milk” all on their own. I wonder if using this would be a good way to avoid getting oat bits in hair. (Apologies if this is what’s said in the video^^)

[Begemot]

Been reading this thread with interest :)

With regard to oats and oat milk, I soak oats in water for my breakfast (with seeds and dried fruit) and they produce a lovely “milk” all on their own. I wonder if using this would be a good way to avoid getting oat bits in hair. (Apologies if this is what’s said in the video^^)

I would love to know if you try oat milk :)

I ordered more scalp lotion and a Natura Siberica scalp scrub so hopefully my scalp routine is set for a while (though I do see lots of interesting scalp products all the time...).

[Zesty]

I've been doing scalp massages without oil before washing (so about twice a week). I also have been flipping my hair over and brushing with my wooden brush for my scalp. I don't know if any of it will make a difference but it feels nice and perhaps the placebo effect will give me a little boost in growth? :lol: I do at least think it loosens up the sebum and any shed skin before washing.

[hollygolightly]

I've been doing scalp massages without oil before washing (so about twice a week). I also have been flipping my hair over and brushing with my wooden brush for my scalp. I don't know if any of it will make a difference but it feels nice and perhaps the placebo effect will give me a little boost in growth? :lol: I do at least think it loosens up the sebum and any shed skin before washing.

happy scalp means healthy growth!

[Ylva]

I decided to quit my COSRX scalp experiment. Nothing bad happened but it just seemed to make my scalp slightly too sensitive for my taste, so I simply didn't feel like continuing it.

[Begemot]

I tried Natura Siberica Scalp scrub but was lazy and tired and did it kind of half-assedly... I just really wanted to use it at long last. I tried it mostly on my hairline area. I might have used too much since it took ages to get all the granules out of my hair. Just based on this first trial I feel I like the BHA liquid better. I'll keep experimenting!

[Ylva]

Thanks to a certain shampoo (Garnier Fructis Aloe Quencher), I've come to realise that my scalp isn't quite as tolerant as I thought it was. I mean, I always kind of felt like it wasn't quite at 100% but could never point out what exactly was wrong. But now that I've been using that shampoo for comparison, I can really tell that certain other ones, for example my current main purple shampoo, Fanola No Yellow, causes my scalp to sort of tingle in a way. It's really quite unpleasant and the difference is so clear to me now. The Garnier shampoo contains ammonium lauryl sulfate - I wonder if that's my magic surfactant? I haven't noticed this much discomfort with my other shampoos, though, so this Fanola one must be from the other extreme end of those that I've used recently. I think I will actually get rid of it. I won't toss it because I can't stand waste, but I'll offer it to someone for free on Facebook. No point suffering for something like this.


I tried Natura Siberica Scalp scrub but was lazy and tired and did it kind of half-assedly... I just really wanted to use it at long last. I tried it mostly on my hairline area. I might have used too much since it took ages to get all the granules out of my hair. Just based on this first trial I feel I like the BHA liquid better. I'll keep experimenting!

It's normal to have a hard time with the granules. I still find them while rinsing out my second conditioner!

[Joules]

I don't focus too much on rinsing out all the granules, I just know that by the time I'm done with shampoo and conditioner they'll be gone :shrug: it's never caused any discomfort to me.

[Begemot]

I can be quite fussy about these kind of things. Somehow it bothers me a lot if there is anything "extra" on my hair. I barely tolerate oils and leave-ins :D

[TheDebby]

I'm going to try and keep an eye on this topic!
I have some scalp issues myself, I'm not sure if it is just a dry scalp or maybe something more.

Lately I have some more problems and it might be a buildup.
Because of that I started using L'Oreal botanical lavender pre-shampoo oil and it seems to help.
So my plan is to use a good oil on my scalp let it sit for a bit to try and protect it from the sulphate shampoo.
(I have a big selection of oils to chose from, I think I'm going to use jojoba oil)

Edit: If it does not get better I will go and see my doctor about it.
I've been having this problem for over 15 years (probably way longer).
The last 4 year's I've been experimenting with sulphate free shampoo's.

[Begemot]

Hopefully you will clear your possible buildup, TheDabby! For the past 5+ years I thought small amount of dandruff is just inevitable in my case. That I can't get rid of it completely. Eventually I found what works for me (cream for fungal rash that I get somewhat regularly on parts of my skin that sweats a lot, and lotion for dehydrated scalp that produces dry flakes). Keep searching and visit your doctor if possible :)

[pinkypoo]

I never really had scalp issue so I keep my scalp routine minimal, I just do a oil massage once a week before a shampoo. I've been wanting to try a scalp scrub for the longest time now, I think i'll search through this thread or the hair recipes one to see if anyone's posted a diy one. Something kind of strange I have tried was putting an Essence (it's a product popular in Korean skincare, sort of like a hydrating toner usually with fermented ingredients.) on my scalp following a wash after learning Korean stylists recommended it for keeping a healthy scalp. Unfortunately it just made me itchy and I didn't continue use long enough to see any effect, my scalp seems to be happiest when it's left clean.

[MusicalSpoons]

Recently I've been switching things up a bit, mostly due to lack of energy or trying to rid my scalp of the flakes. Last week I tried the Noughty Detox Dynamo shampoo, hoping it wouldn't dry my hair out too much because it's supposed to be a 2-in-1. It didn't do too badly with my hair but it made my scalp the worst it's been for a long time! :doh: :rolleyes: Itchy, dry, crazy-paving desert flakes right from the next day. Day 2 or 3 I needed to use cornflour dry shampoo and managed to keep it mostly away from my scalp; at that point I didn't dare use water or any other product on my scalp until I could do another full wash. I put up with it all week trying very hard not to scratch too much, and 2 days before washing my hair felt quite dry from the cornflour so I used argan oil sparingly on my lengths to try to make it easier to detangle without attracting lots of lint. I decided to try it on my scalp too, and while it didn't make it better it also didn't get worse in the couple of days before washing again.

Last night I did not have the energy to do my usual full wash but my scalp needed something doing, desperately! So in the shower I wet just my scalp, let the rest of my hair (dry) hang loose, and used Co-op mint & tea tree conditioner instead of shampoo because it's left my hair fluffy when I've tried co-washing with it before. Needed lots of it but it is very runny and I was able to use my shampoo brush, and it took slightly longer to rinse clean than shampoo but not too much longer. I then put a conditioner on the lengths to sit while I washed myself and shaved my legs, and it's turned out okay. I'm not flake-free, but there are fewer of them and so far no itching, plus it just looks less dry anyway. If I can use this multiple times without it causing significantly more shedding (extra manipulation even without product causes more shedding, though I don't know how it averages out) I might be onto something. Maybe!

I was prepared to need to wash my hair properly today if scalp or lengths were unhappy but so far, so good. I'll see how it goes in the week and decide what to do for my next full wash. I don't know whether to attempt conditioner for scalp washing because it's hard to rinse so thoroughly without causing awful tangles :hmm: maybe a mix of conditioner with a tiny bit of shampoo? Dilute it? Not sure. Also depends on how much energy I have when I need to scalp wash! But it's good to have options.

[Forgot to post this before: For a while some weeks ago I was adding in essential oils to conditioner or shampoo going on my scalp and things were getting worse so I stopped that, and things stayed the same. Previously I'd tried neat on my scalp and a similar thing happened, so I may have to give up on the idea of adding EOs myself, and only using what happens to be in a product. A shame, but the idea was to help my scalp, not to make things worse :lol:]

[dancedance]

I finally finished up my last big bulk buy of H&S shampoo, and started using Jason Dandruff Relief Treatment Shampoo instead. Its sulfate and silicone free, containing salicylic acid and sulfur for SD/dandruff control. I was super worried that it wouldn't be strong enough for me, but so far it seems to be working better than H&S. However it has a strong menthol scent and tingle, and I'm not sure how I feel about that. It also doesn't lather at all, but these are aesthetic concerns that shouldn't get in the way of a shampoo that is simultaneously gentle and effective.

I'm just worried it will stop working over time. I've had dandruff shampoos in the past that worked for a while but then no more. I've thought about trying As I Am's Dry & Itchy Scalp Care Co Wash so I can alternate the two.

[Caribbean_girl]

How have you liked the salt and coconut oil mix for your scalp? I have heard people using sugar too. I don't think it would work too well for me, so I have been looking for a commercial exfoliating product :)



H&S apparently also has the ingredient piroctone olamine that Katsura mentioned, it has the same anti-fungal effect as ketoconazole. Here is some more info about their effect on hair growth if anyone's interested (it's not an entirely unbiased site but the sources seem legit) https://www.hgspecialist.com/ingredients/the-effect-of-ketoconazole-and-piroctone-olamine-on-hair-growth

Your mother's situation sounds very intriguing, lapushka. I wonder what could inhibit scalp from producing sebum.


I like to use the leftover sugar from honey bottles, you guys should def try it!

[Begemot]

I like to use the leftover sugar from honey bottles, you guys should def try it!

I would have never thought of that. Isn't it quite sticky...? :D

[Joules]

H&S apparently also has the ingredient piroctone olamine that Katsura mentioned, it has the same anti-fungal effect as ketoconazole. Here is some more info about their effect on hair growth if anyone's interested (it's not an entirely unbiased site but the sources seem legit) https://www.hgspecialist.com/ingredients/the-effect-of-ketoconazole-and-piroctone-olamine-on-hair-growth

I wonder how could I miss this post :D

I've been using shampoo with ketoconazole and zink pyrithione sorta regularly for over a month now, and I think I can see growth boost. I'm not sire at all because I've also been neglecting my hair and not checking the length for quite a while, but still, over the past month my hair has been feeling longer, like it grew an inch overnight.

I should really start using that shampoo more regularly and measuring growth :hmm:

[Begemot]

Report back results to us if you decide to experiment with regular H&S and measuring, Joules :thumbsup:

[ChloeDharma]

Report back results to us if you decide to experiment with regular H&S and measuring, Joules :thumbsup:

I seemed to miss it too until Joules quoted it. I did a quick search to see if the vatika anti-dandruff shampoo has those ingredients but no, it has the zinc version. When I looked at the Head and Shoulders website I noticed that they do a caffeine shampoo that also has piroctone olamine.
Actually I just checked the Alpecin double effect shampoo, my boyfriend always leaves a bottle here, it has both caffeine and piroctone olamine. I might start using that. I have used it before and got on with it reasonably ok from what I remember.

So it seems there are a few with this piroctone olamine, which is interesting, if extra growth is a thing (lets be real, who wouldn't take some extra growth!) then the caffeine versions might be worth trying.

ETA

So a quick search brought up this study on pubmed which confirms the one already linked by Begemot.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18498517


Nudging hair shedding by antidandruff shampoos. A comparison of 1% ketoconazole, 1% piroctone olamine and 1% zinc pyrithione formulations.
Piérard-Franchimont C1, Goffin V, Henry F, Uhoda I, Braham C, Piérard GE.
Author information
Abstract

Hair shedding and hair thinning have been reported to be affected by dandruff and seborrhoeic dermatitis. The present study was conducted in 150 men presenting with telogen effluvium related to androgenic alopecia associated with dandruff. They were randomly allocated to three groups receiving each one of the three shampoos in the market containing either 1% ketoconazole (KTZ), 1% piroctone olamine (PTO) or 1% zinc pyrithione (ZPT). Shampoos had to be used 2-3 times a week for 6 months. Hair shedding during shampoo was evaluated semiquantitatively. Hair density on the vertex was evaluated on photographs using a Dermaphot. Trichograms were used for determining the anagen hair percentage and the mean proximal hair shaft diameter using computerized image analysis. The sebum excretion rate (SER, mug cm(-2) h(-1)) was also measured using a Sebumeter. The three treatments cleared pruritus and dandruff rapidly. At end point, hair density was unchanged, although hair shedding was decreased (KTZ: -17.3%, PTO: -16.5%, ZPT: -10.1%) and the anagen hair percentage was increased (KTZ: 4.9%, PTO: 7.9%, ZPT: 6.8%). The effect on the mean hair shaft diameter was contrasted between the three groups of volunteers (KTZ: 5.4%, PTO: 7.7%, ZPT: -2.2%). In conclusion, telogen effluvium was controlled by KTZ, PTO and ZPT shampoos at 1% concentration. In addition, KTZ and PTO increased the mean hair shaft thickness while discretely decreasing the sebum output at the skin surface.

[MusicalSpoons]

Sounds interesting. I think I'd need a sulphate-free version, but also reasonably cheap in case my scalp decided it hated it :rolleyes:

(You know how people have their unicorn, the hairtoy they've been hunting for? Maybe my unicorn is a shampoo that keeps both my scalp and hair truly happy!)

[lapushka]

I would have never thought of that. Isn't it quite sticky...? :D

That is *very* sticky stuff. I would never put that on my scalp, esp. with a yeast problem.

[Ylva]

I've been using shampoo with ketoconazole and zink pyrithione sorta regularly for over a month now, and I think I can see growth boost. I'm not sire at all because I've also been neglecting my hair and not checking the length for quite a while, but still, over the past month my hair has been feeling longer, like it grew an inch overnight.

I should really start using that shampoo more regularly and measuring growth :hmm:

That's neat! I'm gonna pick up one such shampoo (by Revuele, very affordable brand with decent ingredients) and give it a shot. I was debating whether to get it or not and had already decided against it, but you made me change my mind. :D

[ChloeDharma]

Sounds interesting. I think I'd need a sulphate-free version, but also reasonably cheap in case my scalp decided it hated it :rolleyes:

(You know how people have their unicorn, the hairtoy they've been hunting for? Maybe my unicorn is a shampoo that keeps both my scalp and hair truly happy!)

I know I've seen at least one version with no sulphates, however it seemed to be sold in one place, a trichology place in I think Essex and no price was listed but I doubt it will be cheap. I'll keep on the lookout for you and post the information here if I find one.

[Six Seeds]

H&S apparently also has the ingredient piroctone olamine that Katsura mentioned, it has the same anti-fungal effect as ketoconazole. Here is some more info about their effect on hair growth if anyone's interested (it's not an entirely unbiased site but the sources seem legit) https://www.hgspecialist.com/ingredients/the-effect-of-ketoconazole-and-piroctone-olamine-on-hair-growth

Just an FYI for folks in the US: it looks like H&S does not use piroctone olamine in the products here. :wail: I looked everywhere and could only find mention of it on the UK site.

[Begemot]

Well dammit :( Sucks for those in the US, thanks for letting us know Six Seeds!

[enting]

Sounds interesting. I think I'd need a sulphate-free version, but also reasonably cheap in case my scalp decided it hated it :rolleyes:

(You know how people have their unicorn, the hairtoy they've been hunting for? Maybe my unicorn is a shampoo that keeps both my scalp and hair truly happy!)

That's my unicorn, too!