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jtschoof
November 27th, 2018, 11:45 AM
Hello everyone!
I'm kinda new here, so I'm excusing already if this belongs under an other forum part.
I read somewhere oil isn't a moisturizer at all, that it only locks the conditioning products in.
It makes sense, but then I was wondering, what kind of products do you have to put first on your hair, before you apply the oil?
I guess it's not just water. From LUSH, you have toner waters, some kind of herbal waters, could that be something?
Or Aloe vera water/gel? What kind of stuff do you guys recommend? What works for you??

Thank you already!:)

LittleTea
November 27th, 2018, 11:52 AM
From what I understand, oil -seals in- the moisture from the water. In the past when I oiled my hair, I found it most effective when I would wash my hair and THEN oil; it kept more moisture in.

On the flip side, when you apply oil to dry hair, it's not able to add moisture to your hair, but it does provide a "protective coat" to the hair shaft. I've also read that over-applying oil can dry the hair since it keeps moisture out.

I would try applying aloe vera water/gel or a conditioner leave-in first, and then apply oil to keep the moisture in. :D

jtschoof
November 27th, 2018, 11:54 AM
Thank you for your answer! Do you think you should apply oil on wet hair or on damp hair?

LittleTea
November 27th, 2018, 11:55 AM
Thank you for your answer! Do you think you should apply oil on wet hair or on damp hair?

I would say try both! There's no harm in seeing which method your hair likes better. :flower:

blackgothicdoll
November 27th, 2018, 11:57 AM
In my science, water is a moisturizer. However, if I used just water and sealed with oil, my hair would not look very good at all. So for me, a product with water and additional emollients is a moisturizer, as long as water is first on the list of ingredients. Then oil is the sealant.

I think what you use as a moisturizer depends on your hair type. I have read of people who just put oil on wet hair after washing, and that is the end of their moisturizing process. Then you have people like me who use LOC or LCO (liquid oil cream, liquid cream oil) because we need a lot more moisture. I find it's easier to start small (water then oil, light leave-in then oil, heavier leave-in then oil) and figure out what works instead of going all in. Hope you find out something that works for you :)

jtschoof
November 27th, 2018, 12:00 PM
All right, so a liquid cream maybe. But do you guys just buy something at the supermarket, or is it an advanced products? I'm sorry I'm new at hair care department so I really don't know much about brands and stuff.

LittleTea
November 27th, 2018, 12:07 PM
All right, so a liquid cream maybe. But do you guys just buy something at the supermarket, or is it an advanced products? I'm sorry I'm new at hair care department so I really don't know much about brands and stuff.

There are lots of options in the supermarket, and if your supermarket has a "natural/organic" section there should be hair products there too. In contrary to popular beliefs, I don't believe that hair products need to be expensive in order for them to work well for your hair (and I'm sure others here agree).

A great resource for understanding how different hair product ingredients work is this website: http://science-yhairblog.blogspot.com/

It might be worth a look to gain a better understanding of the different ingredients. For example, some hair product ingredients may work better for those with fine-textured hair, some might work better for curly hair, or hair with not enough protein etc.

blackgothicdoll
November 27th, 2018, 12:11 PM
I just go to Target, Wal Mart, even Giant or whatever grocery store I'm in, in the hair product aisle where I find shampoo! You can do homemade stuff too, but you'd have to do a lot more research into that regarding pH, propensity to go rancid, proportions of ingredients etc.. I find it easier to just snatch something off the shelf and go. :)

ArabellaRose
November 27th, 2018, 12:12 PM
I use the LCO (a variation of the LOC method) on damp hair. I did it on wet hair fresh from the shower before (That had been in a towel for maybe a minute whilst I get dressed) but I found my hair took an unreasonable amount of time to dry.

So I wash my hair, put it in a towel for about 10-15 minutes, gently untangle with my hands, spray a leave in conditioner (L), add a cream (C) and then oil (O) to lock it all in. Between that, the Rinse Out Oil method, and using two conditioners, my hair is very happy right now.

Ylva
November 27th, 2018, 12:16 PM
Water is the only moisturizer, yes. Then there are humectants, which attract water. Glycerin is probably the most common one of those which you'll see in hair products. My hair prefers panthenol.

jtschoof
November 27th, 2018, 01:53 PM
Allright, I understand it now I think. But with the LCO things, what kind of cream do you use? How is it different from a leave in conditionner?

ArabellaRose
November 27th, 2018, 03:03 PM
Don't ask me the science behind it, I don't understand it I just know it works for me :D

I use Boots Sun Swim & Gym leave in spray conditioner followed with Loreal Dream Lengths No Haircut Cream. My hair loves both of these products!

lapushka
November 27th, 2018, 03:34 PM
Allright, I understand it now I think. But with the LCO things, what kind of cream do you use? How is it different from a leave in conditionner?

I sometimes use a curl cream instead of a leave-in, or a leave-in and then my gel, and then my serum. It depends on what mood I'm in. The key is, you don't need a lot of product per layer. It's all explained in the LOC/LCO thread, and you'll find the link to that in my signature.

maborosi
November 27th, 2018, 04:32 PM
My LOC steps are

1. A leave-in conditioner (I'm using Nightblooming's Selkie)
2. Mineral oil
3. Depending on if my hair will be in a protective updo or partially (or completely) down, I do either Freya's hair salve, or fekkai glossing creme.

My hair likes LOC on slightly damp hair. It doesn't like product on completely wet hair, so after I shower, I let my hair dry a bit before doing LOC. :)

almostghost
November 29th, 2018, 09:13 AM
Wow, I never knew this. Now I'm wondering why using coconut oil on my dry hair a couple hours before shampooing leaves my hair feeling so silky and soft once it dries back out.. maybe it's just that the oil keeps the lengths/ends from being stripped by the shampoo as much?

ArabellaRose
November 29th, 2018, 09:37 AM
Coconut oil behaves differently from other oils in that it's able to penetrate the hair, I believe?

spidermom
November 29th, 2018, 12:03 PM
I don't know why it's so popular to declare "oils do not moisturize". Being as the definition of moisturize is to relieve dryness, I can assure you that oils DEFINITELY relieve dryness, in many cases better than water. Take dry lips, for example.

MusicalSpoons
November 29th, 2018, 12:27 PM
I don't know why it's so popular to declare "oils do not moisturize". Being as the definition of moisturize is to relieve dryness, I can assure you that oils DEFINITELY relieve dryness, in many cases better than water. Take dry lips, for example.

Oils can provide lubrication, they can impart beneficial fatty acids to (i.e. 'nourish') skin and hair giving flexibility, softness, shine - but moisture = water. I find lip balm is great for keeping in moisture, but when my lips have dried out I have to use lotion (containing water) several times until they feel moisturised before lip balm will do any good again. The occlusive effect of oils only works if there's moisture to keep in (for both skin and hair) in the first place :)

Edit: I learned the hard way - I frequently went through winters keeping my lips well 'moisturised' with lip balm and they just got drier and drier throughout the season and I just thought that's the way it had to be. Turns out that's thankfully not the case!

PixieNixie
November 29th, 2018, 11:34 PM
Coconut oil behaves differently from other oils in that it's able to penetrate the hair, I believe?
There are a few oils that can actually penetrate the hair shaft. Coconut, avocado, olive, argan, and a few others... All other oils sit on the hair shaft and just coat it.

jtschoof
November 30th, 2018, 04:49 AM
Well thats what I noticed, that oil forms just a coat layer. After I shampood my hair, all the oil is gone and its just as dry as before. But Coconut, avocado and all those mentioned above behave differently?

Alibran
November 30th, 2018, 04:51 AM
Coconut oil behaves differently from other oils in that it's able to penetrate the hair, I believe?

Most oils penetrate the shaft to some degree (although there are a few oils - mineral oil is one example - that don't penetrate at all, and some do it better than others). They don't technically moisturise, but oil, being slippery fat, does make the hair feel less stiff and crunchy and 'dry', so it's really a matter of science vs perception. Hair needs oil to prevent it from becoming brittle.

The scalp produces some natural oil, but the amount varies from person to person, and it's rarely enough if you have long hair or curly hair, so adding penetrating oil is important for most of us. The problem is that hair needs both oil and water and, if you've ever tried to mix oil into a water spray, you'll know that they repel each other, and the oil floats to the top. If you use too much penetrating oil, it actually makes hair drier because the oil repels the water, pushing it out of the hair shaft.

The best results I've had come from mixing penetrating oil with conditioner because the emulsifiers (ingredients that make oil and water combine) in the conditioner help the oil to penetrate the hair without forcing the water out.

Ylva
November 30th, 2018, 04:52 AM
Here's a great, informative article on which oils penetrate and which do not and what that does to the hair.

http://science-yhairblog.blogspot.com/2013/06/oils-which-ones-soak-in-vs-coat-hair.html

jtschoof
November 30th, 2018, 05:07 AM
Wow that's a perfect article, thanks! A mixture of olive oil and coconut oil seems perfect then. :) Smells good as well.

Alissalocks
December 3rd, 2018, 08:03 PM
Snowys moisture treatment... 1/3 honey, 1/3 aloe vera gel and 1/3 conditioner of choice.

Leave on as long as desired :flower:

jtschoof
December 4th, 2018, 12:05 AM
But not as a leave in right? Honey usually sticks a lot :p

By the way, according to the link above, jojoba oil is absolutely zero penetratable? (is that even a word) Is this true, because then you can use it instead of MO?

Ylva
December 4th, 2018, 07:52 AM
But not as a leave in right? Honey usually sticks a lot :p

By the way, according to the link above, jojoba oil is absolutely zero penetratable? (is that even a word) Is this true, because then you can use it instead of MO?

As a deep treatment. :)

I think the main reason why some people would choose MO over something else is due to MO being less sticky/oily, as far as I understand, and lighter.

Dark40
December 8th, 2018, 04:57 PM
I've never read anywhere where it said that Oil wasn't a moisture. It's definitely a moisturizer. It seels in moisture after water. I use oil on my hair all of the time, and the oil is very beneficial. It gives my hair a beautiful shine!

Ju
December 8th, 2018, 07:05 PM
This has me wondering, is there benefit to using pure glycerine (like what you can get in the supermarket) on the hair and then using an oil on top?

Ylva
December 9th, 2018, 07:51 AM
I've never read anywhere where it said that Oil wasn't a moisture. It's definitely a moisturizer. It seels in moisture after water. I use oil on my hair all of the time, and the oil is very beneficial. It gives my hair a beautiful shine!

This is why some people like to make a distinct separation between moisturizer (water), humectants (draw moisture from the air) and sealants (oils etc). They all aid in the process of moisturization, but do different things. It's just about knowing exactly how things work, it's not to say that oil is no good when it comes to making the hair nice.

Dark40
December 9th, 2018, 10:30 AM
This is why some people like to make a distinct separation between moisturizer (water), humectants (draw moisture from the air) and sealants (oils etc). They all aid in the process of moisturization, but do different things. It's just about knowing exactly how things work, it's not to say that oil is no good when it comes to making the hair nice.

Ok. Yeah, water is a form of moisture and humectants do draw moisture from the air and sealants (oils etc.). Yes, they all aid in moisturizaton, but do different things. That is true about knowing exactly how things work. It's not to say that oil is no good when it comes to making the hair nice? Ok, I was just wondering.

Hairkay
December 9th, 2018, 11:40 AM
Oil is an emollient that can be beneficial to skin and hair once you learn how to use it. It also acts as a sealant. For my hair oil works when I use a tiny bit on damp hair. I don't need anything else. The water is the moisturiser then comes the application of oil. It's how I manage my dry sensitive skin condition too. I take a bath/shower then put on an oil based cream immediately after.