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P90
September 5th, 2018, 12:21 AM
Recently I began looking about possible scientific ways of curing gray hair and found out that there are several existing and possible future treatments for gray hair that actually cure it and don't just dye it. Here are the current and possibly future treatments for gray hair I found.

greyverse
There is product that works partially right now, It called greyverse http://www.visioncnt.co.kr/download.php?file=greyverse___techfile.pdf and it can actually stimulates the melanocytes(the cells that produce melanin, the natural pigment that gives hair and skin their color) in the hair follicles of gray hair to produce melanin, and I also found the article about the scientific research the company behind this product made on the active ingredient in the product(https://www.jidonline.org/article/S0022-202X(18)31627-0/fulltext) but apparently it only works when there is some melanocytes left in the hair follicle and that why it works partially and restore the color only to some gray hairs and not to all of them. so it can give some visible improvements in some cases.

Melanocyte Transplantation
Apparently it is possible with current technology to introduce new melanocytes into the hair follicles of gray hair and restore the color to it. There was few experiments on patients with vitiligo(a disease that cause the body to attack and destroy the melanocytes in the skin or the hair) to restore the melanocytes in hairs affected by the vitiligo(that made the hair to go gray) by a surgical procedure which transplant melanocytes from healthy skin(not affected by the vitiligo) in the area affected by the vitiligo. here is the article about one of those experiments: https://www.researchgate.net/publication/276491822_Treatment_of_Gray_Hair_in_Vitiligo_Patie nts_by_Direct_Melanocytes_Transplant_Using_Needlin g_Micrografting_and_Dermabrasion_Techniques
and here is another article by the scientists behind this experiment: http://www.odermatol.com/odermatology/20162/11.Follicular-SharquieK.pdf in which they explain the re-pigmentation of gray hair in those cases in that way: "In cases of gray hairs, the grafted melanocytes will move from regimented epidermis into the outer root sheath then move down to reach the hair matrix thus inducing pigmented hair".
I found another study from 4 years ago which is apparently the first large scale study on hair re-pigmentation due to melanocyte transplantation: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24372919 , it looks like the whole procedure of melanocyte transplantation is experimental especially for hairs and not widely used for now and it should be noted that this treatment doesn't actually cure the vitiligo itself and its just transplant new melanocytes in the area affected by the vitiligo and its only given to patients which their vitiligo is "stable" and stopped attacking melanocytes in the body.
I also managed to find a doctor who do this treatment and actually used it once to restore melanocytes in gray hair affected by vitiligo and he sent me an article he published about it with other doctors/scientists:https://drive.google.com/open?id=0BxrRMwppPO6sQUZrd1dueEZwSUpMR29IMDkzdEJ0T TRLZmQ0 (leukotrichia="whiteness of the hair")that show how they restored the melanocytes and color in the hair of a woman who has a patch of vitiligo in her head. I asked him about using this treatment on "natural" gray hair and he told me that he can do an experiment for 572$(the cost of the usual treatment he give to vitiligo patients) but also noted that this treatment doesn't always works well for hair(it can be seen in the example from the previous experiment with the woman with a vitiligo patch on her eyebrow that experienced re-pigmentation only in few hairs in her eyebrow while the rest remained white) and that "natural" gray hair may have additional causes(like the H2O2 accumulation in the hair follicles mentioned in the greyverse research), but anyway from the studies I read about "natural" gray hair the lack of melanocytes(or damage) is the main cause behind hair graying and the presence of melanocytes is crucial in other treatments like greyverse. so if someone want to do this experiment with him, his clinic is in india and the procedure will demand that you stay in india for 2 or 7 days depending on where do you want to remove the medical dressing(from the procedure), his email is in the article he sent me. personally I don't sure if its worth to do this for the one white hair I have but if someone really want to treat a visible amount of white hairs it might worth a try.

Medicines
There are more and more incidents(many of them are very recently) of medicines that have the unusual side effect of reversing hair graying. an experiment done a year ago got some attention from the media when 14 out of 52 lung cancer patients that participated in an immunotherapy drugs experiment experienced a complete reversal of gray hair: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/28700789
this medicine have pretty good response rate(considering the possibility that not all of the patients had visible amount of gray hairs) but immunotherapy drugs usually have some nasty side effects that are much more of a problem than a cosmetic issue like gray hair. I saw another interesting case(published just few months ago) with a drug that only have very mild side effects(cold-like symptoms) that happens only in 10% of the patients and found to restore hair color and hair in general in one patient: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6031562/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6031562/bin/gr1.jpg


the doctors behind this experiment also noted that this side effect happened with no relation to the disease itself(psoriasis) the patient have and that the drug probably reduce the effect of some cytokine(kind of proteins that involve in cell signaling) that have a bad influence on melanocytes and the reduction of this effect caused the reversal of gray hair. Its just one incident with one patient for this drug but it might be partially due to the fact that its a relatively new drug(first approved in 2015) with a ridiculous price tag of 4873$ for a monthly dose(at the beginning you take several each month...) it probably don't have too many users. There are other similar incidents with different drugs and according to some scientists who commented on the case with the immunotherapy drugs: "There is more work to be done but there are increasing clues that it may be pharmacologically possible to restore natural pigmentation to graying hair" (https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/dth.12560).


So it looks like there is more and more advancements in the field of treatments for gray hair and that "the cure" might exist right now in the form of different medical procedures/hair care products/drugs which will probably get more and more advanced in the future. But the case of medical treatment for gray hair might be like the case of medical treatment for male pattern hair loss where there is a really good cure(called dutasteride) that can eliminates the great majority of DHT(the hormone that cause male pattern hair loss) and can cause new hair growth in virtually anyone who suffer from MPHL depending on the dose with very low chances of trivial side effects like erection problems but almost nobody knows about this drug cause it only approved for treatment of hair loss in south korea and japan(and even that happened pretty recently considering the fact that the drug exist for almost two decades now) and your doctor usually won't tell you about it or give you a prescription for it and many people including writers in news article talk as if there isn't an effective cure for it. what I am saying is that a treatment for something can exist without it being approved/acknowledged by common doctors or known by common people or the general media.

sorry for the long thread, it got longer than I expected. and just to make it clear I don't have problem with people who likes their gray hair, everybody likes what he/she likes and this post is meant for the people who don't like gray hair.

akurah
September 5th, 2018, 12:29 AM
Just because a “treatment” exists doesn’t mean it’s safe. And drugs typically have side effects, some of which can be unbearable. If your hair starts to grey? Dye it.

P90
September 5th, 2018, 12:35 AM
Just because a “treatment” exists doesn’t mean it’s safe. And drugs typically have side effects, some of which can be unbearable. If your hair starts to grey? Dye it.

did you read the whole thread? I talked about the side effects and about other potential treatments that are safe, only the immunotherapy drugs I mentioned aren't safe.

Longlegs
September 5th, 2018, 12:51 AM
I agree it would be a lot simpler to just dye it.

P90
September 5th, 2018, 01:01 AM
I agree it would be a lot simpler to just dye it.
If it works with a melanocyte transplant it obviously both more convenient/simple and cheaper in the long run than dying even if we ignore the visibility of gray roots. please read the whole thread.

cjk
September 5th, 2018, 08:12 AM
The best solution is to accept the beauty of gray hair. I'm a man and have had visible grays since my twenties. I like to think they make me look distinguished, and as my beard grays I get steps closer to Wizard status.

Heck, I already compete on stage with Gandalf.

nycelle
September 5th, 2018, 08:36 AM
If it works with a melanocyte transplant it obviously both more convenient/simple and cheaper in the long run than dying even if we ignore the visibility of gray roots. please read the whole thread.

It's also a surgical procedure. Something I would not personally consider. At least not until it became a widely accepted cosmetic practice.

spidermom
September 5th, 2018, 08:48 AM
Even though I have fun dyeing it fantasy colors, I can honestly say that I love my silvery hair so much more than I ever loved my mid-range blonde.

lapushka
September 5th, 2018, 09:55 AM
It's easy enough to dye gray hair. Just get a box dye in your own color or close to it and make sure it guarantuees 100% gray coverage. Nothing beats that, and it's less of a fuss, for sure.

I don't believe that gray hair can be reversed, neither in age reversal. There may be research going on, that doesn't mean it is a good alternative to just plain simple regular dye.

If you can't live with the gray.

Are you gray? A lot? Didn't you just discover about one strand or two or so? Or am I mistaking you with someone else?

P90
September 5th, 2018, 11:19 AM
The best solution is to accept the beauty of gray hair. I'm a man and have had visible grays since my twenties. I like to think they make me look distinguished, and as my beard grays I get steps closer to Wizard status.

Heck, I already compete on stage with Gandalf.

you can't really make yourself love(you call it "accept") something you don't already love. you only "accept" things when they are a problem to you but you decide to live on with the problem and get a long with it as much as possible when you can't change it or can't afford yourself to do it.

Alibran
September 5th, 2018, 11:31 AM
It's easy enough to dye gray hair. Just get a box dye in your own color or close to it and make sure it guarantuees 100% gray coverage. Nothing beats that, and it's less of a fuss, for sure.

My hair doesn't cover that easily. Well, some of it does. Some of it covers way too easily, and tends to go much darker than the colour on the box. The rest doesn't cover at all, and reverts to grey after a few washes. I get my roots done every couple of months by a professional colourist, who confirms that my hair is 'a pain' to cover properly.

I can understand the desire to reverse grey permanently, for people who liked their natural colour in the first place. (Mine was dull medium brown, and I'd been colouring for years before it turned to dull grey.) I suspect there are ways to permanently and reliably reverse (or prevent) greying, but they probably require genetic modification. I wouldn't want to go there.

Grey hair looks terrible on me. If I let my natural grey come through, people either tell me I look tired or ill.

P90
September 5th, 2018, 11:35 AM
It's easy enough to dye gray hair. Just get a box dye in your own color or close to it and make sure it guarantuees 100% gray coverage. Nothing beats that, and it's less of a fuss, for sure.

I don't believe that gray hair can be reversed, neither in age reversal. There may be research going on, that doesn't mean it is a good alternative to just plain simple regular dye.

If you can't live with the gray.

Are you gray? A lot? Didn't you just discover about one strand or two or so? Or am I mistaking you with someone else?

if you can make your gray hair to grow black from their roots its already better than hair dye in some cases, and if it only require you to do it once a month or not at all after the first treatment its definitely better than hair dye in terms of convenience.
you don't believe in the sources I used in the thread?, it already happened as side effect in some drugs and in a hair care product. the only speculation here is in the melanocyte transplantation cause from the little I found about it in relation to gray hair was also due to vitiligo but since introducing new melanocytes into hair follicles is already proven to be possible it can at least be part of a current treatment(with greyverse) or develop into a complete treatment.
gray roots can be a problem to some people in some cases and it demands more hair dying. I am also not the only one who want a better solution than dying and the company behind the greyverse product wouldn't bother to waste money on research on it if they wouldn't be sure that it have a demand.

Alex Lou
September 5th, 2018, 02:58 PM
Gray hair doesn't need to be "cured". It's not a disease.

Interesting though.

lapushka
September 5th, 2018, 03:02 PM
Gray hair doesn't need to be "cured". It's not a disease.

Interesting though.

That was what I was kind of hinting at as well. I don't believe in reversing gray hair at all.

The easiest (maybe with the exception of Alibran ;)) is still dye. The rest is either very complex or not proven.

Lady Stardust
September 5th, 2018, 03:18 PM
My understanding is that skin pigmentation changes as you get older as well. If you underwent a process as described in this thread to stop your hair from losing colour - either fading (for example, from red to brown or blonde) or going white, so your skin would change but your hair colour would stay the same - wouldn’t it look too harsh against your skin?

If you dye your hair, rather than reverse the grey, you have the option to choose a more flattering colour as your skin tone changes. I think I read once that going back to the colour you had when you were about 3 years old is flattering when you’re older, it’s often a lighter version of your natural colour.

I’m just letting the grey grow in...

Groovy Granny
September 5th, 2018, 03:25 PM
Coloring is such a tedious process as the gray hair is more resistant; my DD finally just went au naturale at age 43 and she looks great :)

You said you are just 25 ...fixated on this .....but only have a couple of white hairs :confused:
https://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=147202&p=3579784#post3579784

There is plenty of time to investigate what will work for YOU...and time to save up your pennies for expensive treatments if you persist on this quest .
But IMHO it would be more worthwhile to come to accept what is and perhaps look into WHY such a natural process is so frightening to you :hmm:
It sure would be cheaper, healthier for body, mind, and spirit.....and at least you have hair ;)

akurah
September 5th, 2018, 05:37 PM
did you read the whole thread? I talked about the side effects and about other potential treatments that are safe, only the immunotherapy drugs I mentioned aren't safe.

Yes, I did see the whole thread, and to be frank, I see someone so scope-locked on curing grey hair they're overlooking potentially serious consequences despite statements of "yeah there are side effects". Going down this path could be harmful to your health and your hair.

P90
September 5th, 2018, 08:08 PM
Yes, I did see the whole thread, and to be frank, I see someone so scope-locked on curing grey hair they're overlooking potentially serious consequences despite statements of "yeah there are side effects". Going down this path could be harmful to your health and your hair.

I said that on sekukinumab which does have minor side effects and they happen in small percentage of the patients who takes them. I don't have the money to even try and see if its works for me with its current price tag of more than 4000$ so its irrelevant to my health. I noted the cases with the medications as a proof of concept for treating gray hair with medications.

P90
September 5th, 2018, 08:26 PM
That was what I was kind of hinting at as well. I don't believe in reversing gray hair at all.

The easiest (maybe with the exception of Alibran ;)) is still dye. The rest is either very complex or not proven.

when you say that you "don't believe in reversing gray hair at all" you mean that you think the sources in the thread are not reliable?. and wouldn't you prefer a potential gray reversal treatment that require one time treatment of 2 days or spray something on your scalp or just taking some medicine over dying your gray hair?, you my not care much about gray hairs but if you didn't liked the gray hairs and the gray roots? think about it.

P90
September 5th, 2018, 08:49 PM
Coloring is such a tedious process as the gray hair is more resistant; my DD finally just went au naturale at age 43 and she looks great :)

You said you are just 25 ...fixated on this .....but only have a couple of white hairs :confused:
https://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=147202&p=3579784#post3579784

There is plenty of time to investigate what will work for YOU...and time to save up your pennies for expensive treatments if you persist on this quest .
But IMHO it would be more worthwhile to come to accept what is and perhaps look into WHY such a natural process is so frightening to you :hmm:
It sure would be cheaper, healthier for body, mind, and spirit.....and at least you have hair ;)

at the beginning I got really nervous about it but calmed down a bit after realizing that it usually takes many years to progress. but I still don't like the one white hair on my head and do whatever I can to stop/reverse it as much as possible. it is frightening to me cause I simply don't like it and there is no point in accepting it if there are ways to fight it from dyes to actual ways of reversing gray hair from the root.

Crystawni
September 5th, 2018, 09:18 PM
Good luck with your endeavour, P90. It's a shame you're so prejudiced against a common hair colour, though. Oh, and yeah, you can embrace it, and love it, and even flaunt it. Change is inevitable as time ticks on (body-wise, as well as mind), and bending to it will serve you better than resistance. But meh.

ursaV
September 5th, 2018, 10:06 PM
Coloring is such a tedious process as the gray hair is more resistant; my DD finally just went au naturale at age 43 and she looks great :)

You said you are just 25 ...fixated on this .....but only have a couple of white hairs :confused:
https://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=147202&p=3579784#post3579784

There is plenty of time to investigate what will work for YOU...and time to save up your pennies for expensive treatments if you persist on this quest .
But IMHO it would be more worthwhile to come to accept what is and perhaps look into WHY such a natural process is so frightening to you :hmm:
It sure would be cheaper, healthier for body, mind, and spirit.....and at least you have hair ;)


Seconding this, and just saying you can definitely learn to love certain aspects about yourself you hate now, it's definitely a process but it can happen. Just treat your body well and be as healthy as possible and you'll look great as you age. If you freak out about a few little hairs in your twenties, will you accept yourself as your skin starts to sag or your body changes in middle age and beyond? I know you stated you weren't going to go through with this because of the cost, but I'm just worried you're very focused on minute "flaws"! I hope that you can come to accept your body, nature knows best (stress and worry does not help either)! If you need help we'll be here with lots of encouragement :heart:

lauren_alia
September 6th, 2018, 02:58 AM
Gray hair doesn't need to be "cured". It's not a disease.

Interesting though.

My thoughts exactly.


My understanding is that skin pigmentation changes as you get older as well. If you underwent a process as described in this thread to stop your hair from losing colour - either fading (for example, from red to brown or blonde) or going white, so your skin would change but your hair colour would stay the same - wouldn’t it look too harsh against your skin?

If you dye your hair, rather than reverse the grey, you have the option to choose a more flattering colour as your skin tone changes. I think I read once that going back to the colour you had when you were about 3 years old is flattering when you’re older, it’s often a lighter version of your natural colour.

I’m just letting the grey grow in...

That is a great tip, and totally makes sense.... I need to remember that if at some point years from now I want to cover gray (not likely, but I guess you never know ;)).

It's funny, just last night when I was braiding my hair for bed I found 2 silver hairs. I was so excited I took a picture, lol. They're like unicorn hairs! :inlove:

lapushka
September 6th, 2018, 06:04 AM
when you say that you "don't believe in reversing gray hair at all" you mean that you think the sources in the thread are not reliable?. and wouldn't you prefer a potential gray reversal treatment that require one time treatment of 2 days or spray something on your scalp or just taking some medicine over dying your gray hair?, you my not care much about gray hairs but if you didn't liked the gray hairs and the gray roots? think about it.

No I like my gray hair. Sorry. I don't want to be pushed into thinking it's "wrong" to have it either. :flower:

nycelle
September 6th, 2018, 06:25 AM
P90, I'm with ya, I won't accept it either. And when I feel there are more greys than I want, I'll color and have no problem doing it. Not all of us love grey hair for whatever our reasons are and that's fine too.

Still, like I said earlier, I wouldn't commit to any medical procedure that claims to reverse it. It's too soon without enough research I feel. But if it becomes a common practice 10,15 years from now, I can totally see myself going the medical route to get my color back permanently.

P90
September 6th, 2018, 08:45 AM
No I like my gray hair. Sorry. I don't want to be pushed into thinking it's "wrong" to have it either. :flower:

but what if you didn't like it?. not all of us like the same thing and there is nothing wrong with not liking gray hair.

lapushka
September 6th, 2018, 09:26 AM
but what if you didn't like it?. not all of us like the same thing and there is nothing wrong with not liking gray hair.

I didn't say that. But I do feel that it is still a long way for you with only a few grays appearing. Isn't it sort of a panic-reaction? :)

Did you pull them out or are you dyeing currently?

P90
September 6th, 2018, 09:32 AM
Good luck with your endeavour, P90. It's a shame you're so prejudiced against a common hair colour, though. Oh, and yeah, you can embrace it, and love it, and even flaunt it. Change is inevitable as time ticks on (body-wise, as well as mind), and bending to it will serve you better than resistance. But meh.

how its a prejudice? this is my taste in looks and not some negative opinion on some group of people. its not as if I said that people with gray hair are all criminals/terrorists or something like that.
I can't love it from the simple fact that I don't love it.
and how the fact that we get old have anything to do with the subject?, there is a very big difference between dying/reversing gray hair and wanting to be young forever. if you can change something(whether it have something to do with aging or not) why not just change it if you can and want to?.



Seconding this, and just saying you can definitely learn to love certain aspects about yourself you hate now, it's definitely a process but it can happen. Just treat your body well and be as healthy as possible and you'll look great as you age. If you freak out about a few little hairs in your twenties, will you accept yourself as your skin starts to sag or your body changes in middle age and beyond? I know you stated you weren't going to go through with this because of the cost, but I'm just worried you're very focused on minute "flaws"! I hope that you can come to accept your body, nature knows best (stress and worry does not help either)! If you need help we'll be here with lots of encouragement :heart:

if your hair dresser will decide to give you a green mohawk hair cut and tell you to "learn to love" it despite hating it now how do you feel about it? will you agree with him?...
and why you talk as if I plan to be young forever? I just consider different ways of restoring color to gray hair from dying the hair to actually reversing the gray hair from the root.
if you were an 80+ years old woman and some scientist will invent a pill that can restore your youth and even giving you a fit and athletic body on the way didn't you want to take it? or just "accept your body"?... that pill doesn't exist but ways to restore color to gray hair do exist so why not using them if you don't like gray hair?.

P90
September 6th, 2018, 09:44 AM
I didn't say that. But I do feel that it is still a long way for you with only a few grays appearing. Isn't it sort of a panic-reaction? :)

Did you pull them out or are you dyeing currently?

I cut it a bit shorter with a scissor to look at it but I don't think I will do something with it right now cause it can't be seen anyway unless I actually try to look for it.
my be it isn't what you said but many people here talk as if don't liking gray hair is something wrong and bad and that personal preferences ends with gray hair cause hating gray hair is like hating black people or jews.

Alex Lou
September 6th, 2018, 10:10 AM
I cut it a bit shorter with a scissor to look at it but I don't think I will do something with it right now cause it can't be seen anyway unless I actually try to look for it.
my be it isn't what you said but many people here talk as if don't liking gray hair is something wrong and bad and that personal preferences ends with gray hair cause hating gray hair is like hating black people or jews.

Your language is problematic. And yeah, it does come off as ageism. You may not mean it that way, but that's how it reads.

Chromis
September 6th, 2018, 10:14 AM
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ursaV
September 6th, 2018, 11:37 AM
if your hair dresser will decide to give you a green mohawk hair cut and tell you to "learn to love" it despite hating it now how do you feel about it? will you agree with him?...
and why you talk as if I plan to be young forever? I just consider different ways of restoring color to gray hair from dying the hair to actually reversing the gray hair from the root.
if you were an 80+ years old woman and some scientist will invent a pill that can restore your youth and even giving you a fit and athletic body on the way didn't you want to take it? or just "accept your body"?... that pill doesn't exist but ways to restore color to gray hair do exist so why not using them if you don't like gray hair?.

If someone did something to my body that I didn't ask for that would be different story. It's an inaccurate comparison, being shafted at the hairdresser is unacceptable but simply having a body and having it change over the years is completely acceptable. I related it with aging because you seem to have a problem with it happening to yourself, expressing it in hyper focusing on a few greys. And no I wouldn't take that pill, because I haven't earned that athleticism through hard work and age isn't unattractive. But aesthetics is all a matter of opinion, and you got plenty of them in this thread. I'm just going to reiterate that disproportionate worry isn't helping in keeping your hair grey-free, so just ignore those few hairs for now.

P90
September 6th, 2018, 02:08 PM
If someone did something to my body that I didn't ask for that would be different story. It's an inaccurate comparison, being shafted at the hairdresser is unacceptable but simply having a body and having it change over the years is completely acceptable. I related it with aging because you seem to have a problem with it happening to yourself, expressing it in hyper focusing on a few greys. And no I wouldn't take that pill, because I haven't earned that athleticism through hard work and age isn't unattractive. But aesthetics is all a matter of opinion, and you got plenty of them in this thread. I'm just going to reiterate that disproportionate worry isn't helping in keeping your hair grey-free, so just ignore those few hairs for now.

the "hyper focusing on f a few greys" was cause of the fear of it progressing more and more over the next few years. and for the green mohawk, it is an accurate comparison cause you will probably be more upset about the green mohawk you have rather than the fact that the hair dresser didn't bother to ask you before. and I think that it is hard to believe that when you reach the age of 80 you wouldn't take a pill that make you young again with good looking body if a pill like that would exist. you would take that pill and pay all the money you have to buy it like 99.99% of the old people in the world. I also think that you didn't really thought about those questions or wasn't honest about it.

Alex Lou
September 6th, 2018, 02:34 PM
the "hyper focusing on f a few greys" was cause of the fear of it progressing more and more over the next few years. and for the green mohawk, it is an accurate comparison cause you will probably be more upset about the green mohawk you have rather than the fact that the hair dresser didn't bother to ask you before. and I think that it is hard to believe that when you reach the age of 80 you wouldn't take a pill that make you young again with good looking body if a pill like that would exist. you would take that pill and pay all the money you have to buy it like 99.99% of the old people in the world. I also think that you didn't really thought about those questions or wasn't honest about it.

No, just no. When I'm 80 I hope to accept my own body, aging, and mortality. I may want to look "good for my age" but I won't want to look like a 20 year old. Most people want an appearance that reflects their identity. I hope to have good function and be relatively free of disease and pain. Gray hair is not dysfunctional. An older appearance suiting someone's years and experience is not dysfunctional.

MusicalSpoons
September 6th, 2018, 02:49 PM
the "hyper focusing on f a few greys" was cause of the fear of it progressing more and more over the next few years. and for the green mohawk, it is an accurate comparison cause you will probably be more upset about the green mohawk you have rather than the fact that the hair dresser didn't bother to ask you before. and I think that it is hard to believe that when you reach the age of 80 you wouldn't take a pill that make you young again with good looking body if a pill like that would exist. you would take that pill and pay all the money you have to buy it like 99.99% of the old people in the world. I also think that you didn't really thought about those questions or wasn't honest about it.

Actually it's not comparable because if a person does something to you against your will, that's technically assault. They actively *chose* to do something despite knowing you didn't want it - and that's why we have a lot of bitter hairdresser experiences posted here! Another intelligent being choosing to disregard your express wishes is completely different from the natural progression of the biological processes involved in going grey.

(I also don't see the equation of greying hair and the body ageing - the latter can be disabling, and is ultimately fatal. Hair turning grey is neither of those things. Though it's worth noting that in my experience with knowing older and elderly people, a surprising majority of them have thought about the hypothetical possibility of a cure for ageing, a reversal of its effects - and they overwhelmingly decide that no, actually, they're happy with a life well lived, despite their aches and pains and not-so-sharp senses. They tend to feel like they've had their time, and now it's the next generation's turn. ETA: I hope none of this comes across as offensive to anybody. I'm just trying to put it in terms relevant to OP's thinking.)

Usually when people don't like their grey hair and decide how they're going to deal with it, it doesn't seem to be a huge issue for them - more of an 'oh okay, I'm going to be dyeing my hair now' (or whatever their plan is) and they just get on with life. You are of course free to do as you wish with your grey hair when it eventually starts to show, just please don't stress or worry about it! :flower:

Groovy Granny
September 6th, 2018, 03:10 PM
and I think that it is hard to believe that when you reach the age of 80 you wouldn't take a pill that make you young again with good looking body if a pill like that would exist. you would take that pill and pay all the money you have to buy it like 99.99% of the old people in the world. I also think that you didn't really thought about those questions or wasn't honest about it.

Well, as someone who is closing in on 70, I have thought about such things often, and I can honestly say I WOULD NOT take anything like that.

The longer you prolong ACCEPTING the realities of life (wanted or not)....gray hair, illness, weakness, mortality....the less likely your days will be lived fully, peacefully, and joyfully.

That is all I have to say on this matter; the weather is clearing and it is time for me to get offline as I had planned, and enjoy life with my loved ones .

Life is too brief and precious to be wasted on worries about a head of gray hair you may have (or not) ~ I wish you all the best life has to offer :waving:

Crystawni
September 6th, 2018, 03:12 PM
how its a prejudice? this is my taste in looks and not some negative opinion on some group of people. its not as if I said that people with gray hair are all criminals/terrorists or something like that.
I can't love it from the simple fact that I don't love it.
and how the fact that we get old have anything to do with the subject?, there is a very big difference between dying/reversing gray hair and wanting to be young forever. if you can change something(whether it have something to do with aging or not) why not just change it if you can and want to?.

I get that you dislike the white hair that nature wants to bestow on you, and that's fine. I was referring to perception of the hair colour itself, though, not people. And no, I've never seen greying as aging, nor something that needs to be "cured". I just know experience factors into this and that comes with time.

P90
September 6th, 2018, 03:33 PM
No, just no. When I'm 80 I hope to accept my own body, aging, and mortality. I may want to look "good for my age" but I won't want to look like a 20 year old. Most people want have an appearance that reflects their identity. I hope to have good function and be relatively free of disease and pain. Gray hair is not dysfunctional. An older appearance suiting someone's years and experience is not dysfunctional.

loving gray hair or anything else have nothing to do with acceptance. we accept death and aging cause it is inevitable and not cause it is good and wanted by us. and green mohawk is also not a dysfunctional so you would like to have a green mohawk by a hair dresser or by a hypothetical "natural" cause?. I am trying to explain the big difference between accepting something and wanting it cause you really need to understand that you cannot try and force your personal taste about gray hair on other people and talk as if its wrong not to like gray hair.


Actually it's not comparable because if a person does something to you against your will, that's technically assault. They actively *chose* to do something despite knowing you didn't want it - and that's why we have a lot of bitter hairdresser experiences posted here! Another intelligent being choosing to disregard your express wishes is completely different from the natural progression of the biological processes involved in going grey.

(I also don't see the equation of greying hair and the body ageing - the latter can be disabling, and is ultimately fatal. Hair turning grey is neither of those things. Though it's with noting that in my experience with knowing older and elderly people, a surprising majority of them have thought about the hypothetical possibility of a cure for ageing, a reversal of its effects - and they overwhelmingly decide that no, actually, they're happy with a life well lived, despite their aches and pains and not-so-sharp senses. They tend to feel like they're had their time, and now it's the next generation's turn.)

Usually when people don't like their grey hair and decide how they're going to deal with it, it doesn't seem to be a huge issue for them - more of an 'oh okay, I'm going to be dyeing my hair now' (or whatever their plan is) and they just get on with life. You are of course free to do as you wish with your grey hair when it eventually starts to show, just please don't stress or worry about it! :flower:

so if there was a "natural" cause that gives you a green mohawk instead of your long normal hair you will be cool with it?. and I don't know who exactly do you asked but the fact is that the anti-aging industry already makes more than a hundred billion dollar each year without actually having products that do anything more than a subtle change for the appearance. and since there isn't a way to become young again its pretty obvious that the few people you asked chose to just look at the positive side but it doesn't mean that they wouldn't want to be young again if it was possible. I am trying to show the big difference between accepting something cause you can't change it and actually wanting it.

lapushka
September 6th, 2018, 03:49 PM
I cut it a bit shorter with a scissor to look at it but I don't think I will do something with it right now cause it can't be seen anyway unless I actually try to look for it.
my be it isn't what you said but many people here talk as if don't liking gray hair is something wrong and bad and that personal preferences ends with gray hair cause hating gray hair is like hating black people or jews.

Oh no problem then! :) :flower:

No, but the issue has 2 sides, there will always be people who like their gray hair as well as people who want to hide it. Kind of have to accept that. ;)

MusicalSpoons
September 6th, 2018, 03:50 PM
loving gray hair or anything else have nothing to do with acceptance. we accept death and aging cause it is inevitable and not cause it is good and wanted by us. and green mohawk is also not a dysfunctional so you would like to have a green mohawk by a hair dresser or by a hypothetical "natural" cause?. I am trying to explain the big difference between accepting something and wanting it cause you really need to understand that you cannot try and force your personal taste about gray hair on other people and talk as if its wrong not to like gray hair.



so if there was a "natural" cause that gives you a green mohawk instead of your long normal hair you will be cool with it?. and I don't know who exactly do you asked but the fact is that the anti-aging industry already makes more than a hundred billion dollar each year without actually having products that do anything more than a subtle change for the appearance. and since there isn't a way to become young again its pretty obvious that the few people you asked chose to just look at the positive side but it doesn't mean that they wouldn't want to be young again if it was possible. I am trying to show the big difference between accepting something cause you can't change it and actually wanting it.


Like I said, you don't have to like grey hair and what you do when yours starts to show is entirely up to you. I didn't actually plan to engage in this thread, so I'm just gonna refer you to GroovyGranny and Crystawni's comments above. And yes, the anti-ageing industry is huge, but so is the 'you have to have All The Possessions' industry, and the 'you have to change your physical features to be worth anything' industry, and those aren't healthy either. Basically most of the commercial system is based on 'you and your life are not good enough as you are'; and again I refer you to GroovyGranny's comment, specifically this part (bold emphasis mine):


The longer you prolong ACCEPTING the realities of life....gray hair, illness, weakness, mortality....the less likely your days will be lived fully, peacefully, and joyfully.

I sincerely hope that whatever you choose, your decisions bring you peace :)

P90
September 6th, 2018, 03:52 PM
Well, as someone who is closing in on 70, I have thought about such things often, and I can honestly say I WOULD NOT take anything like that.

The longer you prolong ACCEPTING the realities of life....gray hair, illness, weakness, mortality....the less likely your days will be lived fully, peacefully, and joyfully.

That is all I have to say on this matter; the weather is clearing and it is time for me to get offline as I had planned, and enjoy life with my loved ones .

Life is too brief and precious to be wasted on worries about a head of gray hair you may have (or not) ~ I wish you all the best life has to offer :waving:

I don't think you actually thought about it seriously and I am sure that if a pill that makes you young again was real you would take it.
and as I said before, there is a big difference between accepting something and loving it. you only accept something when you can't change it or can't afford yourself to do it. there is obviously no need to "accept" something you really like.
gray hair can be changed by dyes or even completely reversed so why to try to force yourself to love something when you can change it?, you can restore the color to your hair but you can't force yourself to like something you simply don't like.

I used these examples to show the difference between accepting the inevitable and actually liking something.

Cg
September 6th, 2018, 03:57 PM
Well, as someone who is closing in on 70, I have thought about such things often, and I can honestly say I WOULD NOT take anything like that.

The longer you prolong ACCEPTING the realities of life....gray hair, illness, weakness, mortality....the less likely your days will be lived fully, peacefully, and joyfully.

Another granny here and couldn't agree more. Infirmity, pain, sorrow, loss -- these enrich our lives. Perpetual youth would be a paltry substitute for the dimensional experiences of a long life well lived.

cathair
September 6th, 2018, 03:59 PM
you can't really make yourself love(you call it "accept") something you don't already love. you only "accept" things when they are a problem to you but you decide to live on with the problem and get a long with it as much as possible when you can't change it or can't afford yourself to do it.

Sometimes you don't know you want something until you have it.


My understanding is that skin pigmentation changes as you get older as well. If you underwent a process as described in this thread to stop your hair from losing colour - either fading (for example, from red to brown or blonde) or going white, so your skin would change but your hair colour would stay the same - wouldn’t it look too harsh against your skin?

If you dye your hair, rather than reverse the grey, you have the option to choose a more flattering colour as your skin tone changes. I think I read once that going back to the colour you had when you were about 3 years old is flattering when you’re older, it’s often a lighter version of your natural colour.

I’m just letting the grey grow in...

Can confirm, I lost all of the dark moles on my face quite early on in my getting process.


loving gray hair or anything else have nothing to do with acceptance. we accept death and aging cause it is inevitable and not cause it is good and wanted by us. and green mohawk is also not a dysfunctional so you would like to have a green mohawk by a hair dresser or by a hypothetical "natural" cause?. I am trying to explain the big difference between accepting something and wanting it cause you really need to understand that you cannot try and force your personal taste about gray hair on other people and talk as if its wrong not to like gray hair.



so if there was a "natural" cause that gives you a green mohawk instead of your long normal hair you will be cool with it?. and I don't know who exactly do you asked but the fact is that the anti-aging industry already makes more than a hundred billion dollar each year without actually having products that do anything more than a subtle change for the appearance. and since there isn't a way to become young again its pretty obvious that the few people you asked chose to just look at the positive side but it doesn't mean that they wouldn't want to be young again if it was possible. I am trying to show the big difference between accepting something cause you can't change it and actually wanting it.

I don't equate grey hair with death. Grey hair in some form happens to the majority of people in their twenties.

I also don't see aging as something negative. It has so many positives to it which are often overlooked. I think perhaps you are projecting your feelings about aging onto others.

P90
September 6th, 2018, 04:02 PM
Like I said, you don't have to like grey hair and what you do when yours starts to show is entirely up to you. I didn't actually plan to engage in this thread, so I'm just gonna refer you to GroovyGranny and Crystawni's comments above. And yes, the anti-ageing industry is huge, but so is the 'you have to have All The Possessions' industry, and the 'you have to change your physical features to be worth anything' industry, and those aren't healthy either. Basically most of the commercial system is based on 'you and your life are not good enough as you are'; and again I refer you to GroovyGranny's comment, specifically this part (bold emphasis mine):



I sincerely hope that whatever you choose, your decisions bring you peace :)

you just try to blame the industry in convincing people to not like things like aging while ignoring the truth that almost nobody really wants to be old.
I am trying to show the difference between accepting the inevitable and actually likes what you can change in case you didn't like it like gray hair.
so why should I try to do something impossible and stupid like forcing my self to like something I don't like if I can simply change it with dyes in case other possible solutions fails?, answer this question before you say anything else to me on this subject.

P90
September 6th, 2018, 04:11 PM
Sometimes you don't know you want something until you have it.

you can say that on being bald as well. do you want to try being bald?, Sometimes you don't know you want something until you have it...

Can confirm, I lost all of the dark moles on my face quite early on in my getting process.



I don't equate grey hair with death. Grey hair in some form happens to the majority of people in their twenties.

I also don't see aging as something negative. It has so many positives to it which are often overlooked. I think perhaps you are projecting your feelings about aging onto others.


I didn't equate gray hair with death, I tried to show the difference between accepting the inevitable and actually likes something you can change but I just got dishonest answers that were nothing than an attempt to ignore the point and keep trying to convince me to like something I simply don't like which is gray hairs.

Groovy Granny
September 6th, 2018, 04:12 PM
I don't think you actually thought about it seriously and I am sure that if a pill that makes you young again was real you would take it.
. :spitting:

You can think whatever you like....I am not inclined to speak untruths about myself...... and having 45 years on you, know what I believe!.

The only thing I regret at this point, is wasting my valuable time giving sincere and insightful feedback on a thread that now seriously :tbear:troll

Crystawni
September 6th, 2018, 04:15 PM
Yes, GG!

P90, I don't have a love affair with youth, sorry. Been there, done that. Like the way I've grown into myself and how things have changed. Ageless is a good place to be, but that's just me. :p

P90
September 6th, 2018, 04:15 PM
Oh no problem then! :) :flower:

No, but the issue has 2 sides, there will always be people who like their gray hair as well as people who want to hide it. Kind of have to accept that. ;)


you say that to me? you should say that to all the people who try to force their personal taste(or "acceptance") on me without accepting the fact that I don't need to like what they like.

cathair
September 6th, 2018, 04:15 PM
I didn't equate gray hair with death, I tried to show the difference between accepting the inevitable and actually likes something you can change but I just got dishonest answers that were nothing than an attempt to ignore the point and keep trying to convince me to like something I simply don't like which is gray hairs.

Just because people hold views you can't relate to, it doesn't make them dishonest.

For what it's worth, I do think scientists will be able to reverse greying at some point. If it makes you happy more power to you, but it's not for me. I'm really enjoying watching my hair change. It really does change day to day, I'd never have thought that possible when I had dark brown hair.

L'Oréal were doing some work on grey hair reversal. I haven't clicked on all your links, so don't know if you included it. But it might be interesting to you if you haven't seen it.

nycelle
September 6th, 2018, 04:19 PM
Oh no problem then! :) :flower:

No, but the issue has 2 sides, there will always be people who like their gray hair as well as people who want to hide it. Kind of have to accept that. ;)

Hide it? How about those that just don't like the color? No different than those that don't like black hair, blonde or red.

P90
September 6th, 2018, 04:29 PM
:spitting:

You can think whatever you like....I am not inclined to speak untruths about myself...... and having 45 years on you, know what I believe!.

The only thing I regret at this point, is wasting my valuable time giving sincere and insightful feedback on a thread that now seriously :tbear:troll

you only wasted your time trying to do something pointless like trying to convince somebody to like(or "accept") something he don't like which he can change if he wants.
like seriously what is your problem with me doing something like dying my hair or trying some other product or treatment that is scientifically researched? what do you want from me?.
that question is addressed to other people who tried to convince me to "accept" my gray hair here.

Crystawni
September 6th, 2018, 04:33 PM
Hide it? How about those that just don't like the color? No different than those that don't like black hair, blonde or red.

Not quite the same as what's being said about trying to "cure" the lack of hair pigment that happens to most of us across the board. And as someone who has all the hair colours sprouting from my head, I am not biased. :wethree:

MusicalSpoons
September 6th, 2018, 04:38 PM
Like I said, you don't have to like grey hair and what you do when yours starts to show is entirely up to you. I didn't actually plan to engage in this thread, so I'm just gonna refer you to GroovyGranny and Crystawni's comments above. And yes, the anti-ageing industry is huge, but so is the 'you have to have All The Possessions' industry, and the 'you have to change your physical features to be worth anything' industry, and those aren't healthy either. Basically most of the commercial system is based on 'you and your life are not good enough as you are'; and again I refer you to GroovyGranny's comment, specifically this part (bold emphasis mine):



I sincerely hope that whatever you choose, your decisions bring you peace :)


you just try to blame the industry in convincing people to not like things like aging while ignoring the truth that almost nobody really wants to be old.
I am trying to show the difference between accepting the inevitable and actually likes what you can change in case you didn't like it like gray hair.
so why should I try to do something impossible and stupid like forcing my self to like something I don't like if I can simply change it with dyes in case other possible solutions fails?, answer this question before you say anything else to me on this subject.

*Ahem* {points to the big, bold, underlined part in my previous comment}
You don't have to force yourself to like it. You also don't have to argue with those who enjoy and love their grey/silver/white hair, or those are genuinely looking forward to their first sparkly silvers. That is all I have to say on the matter. Toodlepip :waving:

P90
September 6th, 2018, 04:38 PM
Just because people hold views you can't relate to, it doesn't make them dishonest.

For what it's worth, I do think scientists will be able to reverse greying at some point. If it makes you happy more power to you, but it's not for me. I'm really enjoying watching my hair change. It really does change day to day, I'd never have thought that possible when I had dark brown hair.

L'Oréal were doing some work on grey hair reversal. I haven't clicked on all your links, so don't know if you included it. But it might be interesting to you if you haven't seen it.

I don't need to believe to someone who claim that he/she doesn't want to be young. but you should accept the fact that not everybody have your personal taste about gray hair and that you can't judge them if they want to dye or reverse their gray hair back to their original color. you also can't tell them what they should want cause its ridiculous to tell someone to like(or accept) something he simply don't like and while he can change it.


how do you feel if people will try to convince you to dye your gray hair all the time cause you need to like your original color? and they will do it all the time and on every post you make that have some relation to your gray hair.

P90
September 6th, 2018, 04:47 PM
Not quite the same as what's being said about trying to "cure" the lack of hair pigment that happens to most of us across the board. And as someone who has all the hair colours sprouting from my head, I am not biased. :wethree:

what is the problem to talk about curing something you don't like?. it is also reasonable to use the word "curing" cause I needed to make it clear that I am talking about actually reversing gray hair rather than hiding/dying it.
sorry if you got offended or didn't liked the title but it isn't an excuse for the way you just attack my personal preference in hair and my legitimate thread about reversing gray hair.

Crystawni
September 6th, 2018, 04:48 PM
I don't need to believe to someone who claim that he/she doesn't want to be young. but you should accept the fact that not everybody have your personal taste about gray hair and that you can't judge them if they want to dye or reverse their gray hair back to their original color. you also can't tell them what they should want cause its ridiculous to tell someone to like(or accept) something he simply don't like and while he can change it.


how do you feel if people will try to convince you to dye your gray hair all the time cause you need to like your original color? and they will do it all the time and on every post you make that have some relation to your gray hair.

Smile, and say I'm not here to decorate your world.

cathair
September 6th, 2018, 04:49 PM
I don't need to believe to someone who claim that he/she doesn't want to be young. but you should accept the fact that not everybody have your personal taste about gray hair and that you can't judge them if they want to dye or reverse their gray hair back to their original color. you also can't tell them what they should want cause its ridiculous to tell someone to like(or accept) something he simply don't like and while he can change it.


how do you feel if people will try to convince you to dye your gray hair all the time cause you need to like your original color? and they will do it all the time and on every post you make that have some relation to your gray hair.

I didn't try to convince you of anything. I simply stated what I enjoy. Please read my comment again.

Crystawni
September 6th, 2018, 04:49 PM
what is the problem to talk about curing something you don't like?. it is also reasonable to use the word "curing" cause I needed to make it clear that I am talking about actually reversing gray hair rather than hiding/dying it.
sorry if you got offended or didn't liked the title but it isn't an excuse for the way you just attack my personal preference in hair and my legitimate thread about reversing gray hair.

No worries. By what you say, my hair by extension is a disease--unhealthy, that needs curing. Thanks.

P90
September 6th, 2018, 04:52 PM
*Ahem* {points to the big, bold, underlined part in my previous comment}
You don't have to force yourself to like it. You also don't have to argue with those who enjoy and love their grey/silver/white hair, or those are genuinely looking forward to their first sparkly silvers. That is all I have to say on the matter. Toodlepip :waving:

they are coming to this thread and argue with me and not the other way around!

nycelle
September 6th, 2018, 04:52 PM
Not quite the same as what's being said about trying to "cure" the lack of hair pigment that happens to most of us across the board. And as someone who has all the hair colours sprouting from my head, I am not biased. :wethree:

I agree about using the word "cure" to describe grey. But I'm not sure if English is the OP's first language so I gave it a pass.

If we're honest though, I've seen some pretty nasty things said about people who do color their grey in the silver thread. Like "they're not fooling anyone" or "how it makes them look old." So what P90 has said is actually mild in comparison.

P90
September 6th, 2018, 04:57 PM
No worries. By what you say, my hair is a disease. Thanks.

if you had black hair(like mine) and you talked about curing the wretched illness of black hair and wanted to make it gray I wouldn't get insulted and try to argue with you about how you feel about black hair cause I really don't care if someone don't like the hair color I like. I might even try to give you some advice about turning your hair gray cause I like to help people sometimes.

P90
September 6th, 2018, 05:02 PM
Smile, and say I'm not here to decorate your world.

but what if they will keep nagging you and won't leave you alone?...

Crystawni
September 6th, 2018, 05:03 PM
Ignorance is bliss.

neko_kawaii
September 6th, 2018, 05:13 PM
Closing this thread as nothing new can be added to it.