PDA

View Full Version : Water wash or Hair Oil?



elfynity
April 19th, 2018, 09:57 AM
Over the last 4 months, I stopped doing all the bad stuff to my hair and now only need to water wash and brush with my BBB. I have for what seems like the first time in my life, quite healthy shiny hair. This is a major milestone as I thought that I was stuck with whispy, flat hair forever.

I have a small issue though that is confusing me. I want to oil my hair, especially using organic Castor Oil and Sweet almond oil and leave it in for a few hours - you know it's really good for so many reasons. The problem that I see here is the cleaning it off part. I have worked very hard to get my own sebum to moisturize my hair and make it look shiny, but I know my hair can do with oiling fortnightly.

I have an organic shampoo that I have watered down and can use to remove the oils, but I worry that it will strip my own natural sebum too. I am torn between continuing with water washing and hoping that my own sebum has got this, or oiling at least once every two weeks and then resetting with an organic shampoo.

Do you think that I should rather oil my hair or not. BTW, if I oil my hair as a leave in even just a tiny drop, it shows badly and looks like grease marks everywhere. Then I have to crazily use dry shampoo and then wash with organic shampoo again, resetting my sebum again - so I stopped using leave in oil.

Any advice?

ravenskey
April 19th, 2018, 10:12 AM
Maybe the oil you're using is too heavy for your hair, this can cause greasiness and weigh down hair.
Abyssinian, Argan and Light Coconut oil might be better or you could try putting the oil you have in a spray bottle and misting your hair with it.

Joules
April 19th, 2018, 10:29 AM
Co-washing is a great thing

elfynity
April 19th, 2018, 10:36 AM
I have read though that Castor Oil makes your hair grow like weeds which is why I have been wanting to use it.

elfynity
April 19th, 2018, 10:37 AM
Joules, you think CO would get the oil out? And leave my sebum in tact?

Reservechic
April 19th, 2018, 10:38 AM
Castor oil and sweet almond oils are good natural oils, however, castor oil is definitely the type of oil that many find to be very greasy, due to its thick consistency. All pure oils are oily and greasy in nature, therefore for some individuals hair they may end up weighing their hair down too much.

There are some individuals can't use pure oils on their hair and scalp at all. While on the other hand, there are quite a number that are able to do so, by finding out through trial and error which pure oils agree best with their hair and/or scalp overall. I used to use JBCO in my hair and on my scalp as a pre-poo treatment, and it is probably the thickest and greasiest oil that I've ever used on my hair and scalp in pure form. Plus, I don't know why, but it do anything major to my hair and scalp when I used it alone to pre-poo with. However, I actually can take castor oil being used in hair care products much better.

Oh, and when I do actually choose to pre-poo nowadays, I typically use pure coconut oil, or sometimes pure grape seed oil instead. I use shampoo only, no co-washing or any other hair washing methods, so I can say that without a doubt shampoo does get all of the oil out with no problems at all.

Joules
April 19th, 2018, 10:47 AM
Joules, you think CO would get the oil out? And leave my sebum in tact?

I know that it gets the oil out. You need to slather your hair and scalp in conditioner, put in as much as you can, I usually use up an entire 600 ml bottle of conditioner during one wash/two applications (I would say two applications are necessary here). It also removes whatever can be removed, so if there's excess sebum on your hair, it will go, too. It is definitely a more gentle method than a diluted shampoo.

MoonRabbit
April 19th, 2018, 11:19 AM
I've been using dp Hue acv hair rinse once a month when my hair needs something a little extra done to it. My hair doesn't like straight oils put on it, but this product is a shampoo/ conditioner substitute mixed with acv, and tons of oils. It's not exactly all natural but it seems to be the only thing that doesn't strip my natural oils out, and it is simplified for me than lathering my hair in oil, waiting overnight and using more product to get the oil out. Now I just wet my hair in the shower, squeeze it on my hair, detangle, let it soak while I finish my shower things and rinse it out.

Not sure if this product is of any help to you but just thought I would mention it.

elfynity
April 20th, 2018, 04:11 AM
The main thing here is not to remove my natural sebum at all, I would like it to remain intact and at the same time be able to oil my hair and take the oil out without tampering with the sebum too much. I think that you ladies have a point here that some oils are just easier to use and leave in or get out without leaving your hair greasy and looking wet, but still do the job. I literally have hair that is babysoft fine, so I would like my hair to be heavier.

I was so hoping to be able to use castor oil as I have heard so many excellent growth and health stories around it, especially if perppermint essential oil is added in. I think I may have to perhaps give in to shampoo once a month at least and do a complete castor oil hair mask and then wash most, but not all of it out, and then restart the whole sebum build up in my hair again. I just really feel there is no getting away from washing out the sebum with the oils.

I hope it doesn't effect the fact that my hair now has completely regulated it's oil production, and I literally don't need to wash it with shampoo anymore, yay. Thank you for the advice so far.

kwaarrk
April 20th, 2018, 05:00 AM
Unfortunately there isn't anything special about sebum vs other oils that anything that strips oils wouldn't also strip sebum (chemically) and you may have to pick one or the other: sebum hair or treated scalp. Perhaps you can find a dose level of cleanser of your choice that takes only most of the oil away, thereby leaving some of the oils embedded on your strands, though they would now be mixed oils and not pure sebum, and so would possibly behave a little differently in your hair (particularly castor, it's sticky). It would take some practice. Conditioner may work. It tends to replace the oils in your hair with the conditioning ingredients. So again, your hair would behave differently and would still go through the sebum replacement process. But maybe you could find a method or product that mimicks the way the sebum acts in your hair well enough to smoothly move between them. That would be holy grail eh? Maybe someone else has found one.

I'm also learning about how to stimulate scalp to produce more hair and faster. What I've found is that whatever kills demodex mites and various yeast that tend to live in the follicle and inhibit hair growth, and whatever stimulates blood flow and thus gets more nutrients to the hair root regularly will help. There's nothing that really stimulates the follicle directly, even minoxidil just improves blood flow it just does so over a longer period of time than a lot of other things like manual stimulation. I understand that the castor oil smothers the beasties (particularly demodex) and peppermint stimulates blood flow a bit temporarily, though once a month I think would not be enough. It has to be regular and concerted effort on both fronts. Maybe you could get away with once a month for the beasties once their numbers are low, though, and then just keep up the stimulation. If you have low levels of follicular parasites and have max blood flow already it won't make a difference, though I'd wager a guess that few people have those conditions and also still desire denser hair. An easy test to see if castor oil could work for you is smearing it on your eyebrows and eyelashes every night. See if after 6 weeks they are any denser or longer than usual. It's hard to find much in the way of actual research on herbs and oils and how they affect specific skin and scalp parasites, though, mostly anecdotes about effects which could be anything from wishful thinking and bias to unrelated effects to the desired cause and effect relationship.

Here's a thought: Maybe there are essential oils or herbs that help kill beasties and yeasties and maybe this could be suspended in a water based or evaporative medium so that it doesn't disrupt the sebum much, and then you can massage it in for extra blood flow.

Deborah
April 21st, 2018, 11:22 AM
If you are WO washing, you should not need to add any other oils. Just very gently brush a lot, and your natural oils will take care of everything. I once did WO for 22 months. It was pretty fun, but I eventually grew tired of it. It left my hair lovely though, and I was able to go to once a week washing quite easily after that.

Hairkay
April 21st, 2018, 01:02 PM
Over the last 4 months, I stopped doing all the bad stuff to my hair and now only need to water wash and brush with my BBB. I have for what seems like the first time in my life, quite healthy shiny hair. This is a major milestone as I thought that I was stuck with whispy, flat hair forever.

I have a small issue though that is confusing me. I want to oil my hair, especially using organic Castor Oil and Sweet almond oil and leave it in for a few hours - you know it's really good for so many reasons. The problem that I see here is the cleaning it off part. I have worked very hard to get my own sebum to moisturize my hair and make it look shiny, but I know my hair can do with oiling fortnightly.

I have an organic shampoo that I have watered down and can use to remove the oils, but I worry that it will strip my own natural sebum too. I am torn between continuing with water washing and hoping that my own sebum has got this, or oiling at least once every two weeks and then resetting with an organic shampoo.

Do you think that I should rather oil my hair or not. BTW, if I oil my hair as a leave in even just a tiny drop, it shows badly and looks like grease marks everywhere. Then I have to crazily use dry shampoo and then wash with organic shampoo again, resetting my sebum again - so I stopped using leave in oil.

Any advice?

I'm not sure I understand the problem. You have had good results with water washing yet you want to now add oil, why? I water wash but I do add a tiny bit of oil, less than a teaspoon to my hair ends only. That's because it is harder to get sebum down all my tight curls and kinks so the ends can get a little dry. I never considered heavy oiling at all. Even when I have a flaky patch that gets treated with a little olive oil then it's rinsed off as much as possible.

kwaarrk
April 22nd, 2018, 05:45 AM
Unfortunately there isn't anything special... extra blood flow.


Upon further reading I see that some of what I said was wrong. http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=141868 is a gold mine of information on various things to do for thicker, denser hair.

nycelle
April 22nd, 2018, 09:19 AM
Upon further reading I see that some of what I said was wrong. http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=141868 is a gold mine of information on various things to do for thicker, denser hair.

She mentioned Caucasian women losing more than 50 hairs a day, or Asian women losing more than 40 strands per day, "can be a warning sign" of thinning hair. I really wish she would take that out, as most women lose more than that on a daily basis and it's perfectly normal. Anything can be a warning sign but someone reading that may become worried needlessly.

As per my dermatologist, and my physician - losing up to 100 hairs a day is normal, and in many cases (wash days for instance), you can lose even more.

elfynity
April 23rd, 2018, 03:23 AM
Hi Kwaarrk, your post is very informative! Thank you! I never considered any beasties living in my hair, but I guess now that it is real hair and not being stripped of life by shampoos that it might be a nice home for them to live in!

I already did the castor oil on eyelashes and eyebrows beginning of this year and am now just smearing a little all over my face before bed every second day, and my eyebrows grew like crazy. I didn't see much growth or volume difference in my lashes though.

To solve the issue of blood flow, putting some peppermint essential oil into clean water into a spray bottle and spraying it on your head will get your flow going and also smells amazing. So that would be a solution to the blood flow that could literally be done daily.

I was literally slathering my hair with Castor Oil. I think it was useful because it seemed to really moisturize my hair and make it 'stronger' and helped to stop split ends? And I used it alot in the past few months and then used organic shampoo to wash most (not all of) it out. My hair was drying out with the shampoo straight atfter, so I would put in the castor oil again soon - and so the cycle continued. And of course, I was putting a huge amount of castor oil in which is thick and hard to get out and involves resetting my sebum production every time with a fair amount of shampoo.

But, since I have been water washing only (4 weeks now and I wash only once a week in medium hot water) and using the BB Brush twice a day, I have noticed that my hair is now very shiny and seems moisturized at the ends, especially the hairs at the front. I started brushing with head upside down too now and noticed that the hairs underneath near the ends are also getting shiny and moisturized. I guess I've answered my question there, if the sebum is keeping it moisturized, then no need for extra moisture from Castor Oil.

I wonder if diluting a little bit of castor oil in water and putting it into a spray bottle and spraying it on my scalp and hair would do the trick. I could add some peppermint essential oil in there too. If I got my balance right then I could do it regularily, maybe once a week or a month as you suggest, before my water wash, without needing to shampoo it out or worry about an oil build up, but at least keep the beasties at bay. I think this would be a really great solution.

You said "maybe you could find a method or product that mimicks the way the sebum acts in your hair well enough to smoothly move between them", I think I may have underestimated the incredible work of my own sebum and need to give it a chance to see how it conditions my hair at least over a 3 month period to see the results of moisture and growth.

elfynity
April 23rd, 2018, 11:54 AM
Hairkay, I thought that if I didn't oil my hair that it wouldn't grow. I've only been water washing for 3 weeks, and if that alone, with the bbb will give me healthy hair that I don't need to oil or shampoo at all - then that would definitly be first prize for me.

elfynity
April 23rd, 2018, 11:56 AM
Hi Kwaark, I saw that article and read a whole lot of it earlier! Very imformative! Thank you for sharing that link.

elfynity
April 24th, 2018, 10:37 AM
I put a small amount of oil in my hair yesterday and regretted it when i realised that it wasn't going to just sink in, I was going to have to shampoo it out. I broke my water wash fast and used a ridiculously diluted shampoo just on the most affected parts. But, alas, it stripped alot of my hard work on the sebum. Now when i brush with my bbb my hair is very static. The incredible gloss that covered almost half my hair has gone.

I think i thought that i had to extra moisturize my hair because after i wash my face I have to rub oil into my skin to moisturize it - and then it dawned on me that with my face i am removing the natural oils, so they need to be replaced, but with hair WO, I am not removing the oils - big duh! But i guess this is part of the learning.

I am devasted, nah, i'm just set back a bit and have learnt a very good lesson: My hair just needs water wash and it's own natural sebum to keep it properly moisturized and I shouldn't mess with that.

elfynity
April 26th, 2018, 02:11 PM
Had such a bad experience today at a Beauty Spa. went in for a massage, a voucher given to me and specifically told the lady that she must not get any oil in my hair because i don't wash with shampoo and wont be able to get it out. She promised. Then while she was massaging, I felt her hands or arms touching my head on the sides and asked here again if she was sure she was not getting any oil on my hair (I really should have put a towel over my head, and will make sure I do if i ever go into a spa again) and she said she wasn't.

Well, once she was done, there was tons of oil all over my hair. I got home and literally had to completely shampoo my hair to get it all out AND reset weeks of getting to this point of WO only.
The part that irritates me the most is that she promised she wasn't getting oil in my hair. Do I have a right to be upset?

I am feeling better now but I was very upset earlier. This has set me back again big time.