The Official NW/SO Thread

[Bedhead]

Welcome all to the all new NW/SO (No Water / Sebum Only) thread!

It's here we discuss cleaning our hair using mechanical cleansing methods, or using other methods that don't involve wetting our hair with water. We rely on the sebum to act as a natural anti-bacterial / anti-fungal layer that also repels water and protects our scalp and hair from harsh chemicals.

The basis for NW/SO is SMP, which stands for Scritch, Massage, and Preen. These techniques are used to mechanically clean and protect our scalps and hair.

Scritching is the process of gently scraping your scalp to remove excess sebum and dead skin cells from the scalp, using either your finger nails, or a comb. This is not to be confused with scratching. There is no digging into the scalp or hair follicles, simply a gentle scraping until you feel you're done.

Massage is just as it sounds. Massaging the head and hair. gently pressing into the grooves of your scalp. You can even use a similar technique used when washing your hair with shampoo, and move your scalp and hair around to stimulate blood flow, warming the scalp and sebum to help in the dispersal of the sebum.

Preening is the removal of excess sebum and spreading of it down the length of the hair, like birds do with their feathers. It is done by dividing hair into one inch or smaller sections and, beginning at the roots, holding the hair and rubbing it between the thumb and fingers, sometimes using your nails to help, while moving the hand lower down the shaft of the hair; it's somewhat like milking the length of hair. This will both smooth the hair and spread the sebum down the length of the hair. The goal is to cover the entire length with sebum. We all find our own technique.

Tools used by NW/SO practitioners to help with scritching and preening, and cleaning the hair or dust and excess sebum:

Hands and fingers
Wooden wide toothed combs
Horn or resin combs
Lice combs
BBB
Cloths


The Transition Period is a length if time it takes for your scalp to adapt to its natural state of being. Using shampoo and conditioner will repeatedly strip your scalp and hair of its natural sebum and so your scalp will respond with needing to produce more and more sebum. With the NW/SO method, the sebum is not removed, so the scalp will slow down on its production of sebum. Until this time, though, the scalp will continue to produce too much sebum, as is it is conditioned to, and your hair will appear quite sebum-rich. From the start to the moment when the sebum production slows down is what we call the "transition period".

Typically, the transition period lasts anywhere from 10 to 14 weeks, usually about 12. During this time a typical NW/SO practitioner will SMP twice a day, with it taking about 45 minutes each time. Once the transition period is over, some people need to continue with twice a day for a while, but the amount of time needed to to SMP get cut down once the sebum has covered the entire shaft. Eventually, people will begin being able to SMP just once a day, or maybe even once every second day.

Things that affect sebum production, skin cell issues, and smell issue are things like diet, stress level, pollution, allergies, exercise and of course, genetics and hair type. Our scalp basically yells at us for not treating ourselves well. It does not hold back! Treat yourself well and NW/SO will work for you!

The Secondary Transition Period will last for the following year and a half. At this point, there will be a subtle shift, where you'll notice a texture change, more lift and softness to the hair, maybe even a change in smell. SMPing can be stretched out even further, if you so desire. You'll need to find your own body's balance, given your biology, diet, and environment.

Washing/Rinsing the hair with Water depends on the person. Some will rinse or wash every month to 3 months, some with the change of the season, or the moon cycles. Some do not rinse at all, other than moments of getting caught in the rain. Again, each person will decide what works best for them.

Sweat seems to be something that comes up often when people are considering NW/SO, and all I can say is sweat seems to cleanse and condition my hair. I wait until it dries and do a little preening and I'm off!

The mental and emotional challenge of beginning NW/SO can be difficult. The media and society have taught you shampoo and conditioned hair is the only hair that is clean. It has taught you that having stripped hair is what clean hair looks like. It has taught you that the only shine your hair should have is from a product you put in your hair. And you've been taught sebum equals dirty and smelly. So going through the transition phase is not easy. You will feel self-conscious, wondering if you smell, or if people can tell you haven't washed your hair. That's what we're here for. We will support you and answer any questions you might have regarding your process.

By the time you get through this, you perspective of what healthy hair is will be the silky, soft, shiny hair you see in the mirror everyday!

[Bedhead]

Whew! If anyone has anything else to add, please feel free! :brains:

[Beeboo123]

Um I guess this sounds gross, but does anyone get a whitish waxy substance under their fingernails when they scritch? Is that normal? I would ask for photos, but I don’t think anyone else would want to see that >.<

[Bedhead]

Hi Beeboo123!

Yes, that's normal. That is the excess sebum and dead skin cells you're removing. This is why we need to scritch. ;)

[proo]

I had that Beeboo-
It eventually went away
I considered it mostly product residue which took several weeks to remove completely.

BH-
That is the most on point description of what’s going on here that I’ve ever seen or contemplated.
Beautiful job.
I’ll chime in as I think of stuff

[Bedhead]

Aww! Thanks hun! :flowers:

[Beeboo123]

One more question: how do you start? Do you stretch washes longer and longer, until you stop completely? Or do you quit washing cold turkey? And if you do, do you do one last clarifying wash, or do you condition as per normal? Would love to hear how everyone here transitioned into NW.

[Bedhead]

I just went cold turkey, and struggled, and others here made me realise I needed to do a clarifying wash to get all the product out, so my system would react to it anymore. It helped a lot! I highly recommend clarifying before starting.

As far as how you decide to do it, it's up to you. I had already stretched out my washes with WO, so going cold turkey wasn't as big a deal as someone who hadn't done that. I think proo just gradually stretched out her washes (she can tell you more about that).

For that last clarifying wash, I found putting a dab of a light oil only on the very ends when still wet helped, since the hair will first freak out a bit and the ends can go dry.

Good luck!

[SparrowWings]

BH-
That is the most on point description of what’s going on here that I’ve ever seen or contemplated.
Beautiful job.
I’ll chime in as I think of stuff
I was thinking the same! That's a great intro post.

Beeboo123, I went cold turkey as well. My washes were fairly stretched out anyhow (a week or more), and I generally used a 2-in-1. I never went back and did a proper clarifying wash, but with how much static I used to have, and with only scrubbing my scalp (though it all ran down the length during rinsing), I can't imagine there was actually much product interfering. I don't seem to produce much sebum, though, so that might've been the bigger reason why the lack of clarifying wasn't an issue.

[embee]

Excellent job, Bedhead! :)

I'd been doing WO for a while. Then winter and cold weather came. I didn't want to get my hair wet in this chilly old house, so I didn't. I combed and brushed and brushed and combed. ....

So then I was NW/SO.

[FrayedFire]

I am so glad that there's a brand new thread for this!

I should probably get some pictures on here so I can validate my credibility, but doing NW/SO - style care has made the biggest difference in my hair since I stopped dying it. It's like the ultimate in benign neglect, once you're through the transition period, and I'm glad I had already been stretching washes for so long beforehand.

This method may not be for everyone, or at least not fully, but even just trying it out or using bits and pieces can lead to profound improvement. If you have oily roots and dry ends, this is probably one of the best things to try.

ETA: Keep your tools clean. Once you've transitioned, you don't have to do a full SMP every day, but you're probably going to want to wear your hair up more. You can still wear it down if it's cooperative, but when is it ever? I find that this combines well with the inversion method (which combines well with yoga/stretching). There are many ways to preen, experiment. Same with scritching and massaging, both of which you can do while your hair is up. I use a combination of methods... the goal is to get the oil from your roots down to the ends. The first time you realize that your hair is acting like it has product in it is really weird. If it feels icky, CLEAN YOUR TOOLS, and be a little more thorough.

[proo]

I started with WO, it’s what brought me to the lhc-
My experience was similar to Bedhead’s:
Hair looked dull and felt coated for a couple of days after a rinse, then would sort of come around with some smp-
Eventually it was obvious that rinsing set me back, especially with manageability, so I began stretching out.
I’ve been in my 50’s for the whole thang, it helped with sebum reduction.
It’s been years now, I still rinse occasionally but not with plain water, making sure not to leave residue or strip my sebum.
Someone mentioned benign neglect- it’s been the opposite for me
Lots of trial and error, smp, hairdos, investigation, processes , the works.
It’s process over products; if something ain’t right I tweak how I’m handling my hair, not what I’m putting on it
It would have been cool to stay combined with WO imho,
We’re basically on the same path and could share helpful info.

[Bedhead]

Well said proo! Yep, haven't found this to be a benign neglect type of thing, not for the lazy. Tried it, made things more difficult for a while after. I believe NW/SO is what people who do benign neglect on purpose are trying to achieve.

I know, there is something nice about the merged NO/SO/WO thread, but in the end, there are differences, and people experience different forms of transitions and results. When I was figuring out what was best for my hair, I saw a very distinct difference between the two. After doing both, I can see where they overlap. You can still go and post in the other thread if you want.


FrayedFire, yes please to pictures! And good points!


One thing I'd like to add is, if your hair is feeling heavy and "dirty" despite your efforts in SMPing, try scritching your face in a hot shower. Works, every time.

[Bedhead]

So because of all this thread merging and a need for a new thread happened, it made me revive my BBB, something I haven't used since my first few weeks of NW/SO. What happened was interesting.

I know some people swear by these things, but for my particular hair, what it seems to do is rough up the second half of my length, to the extent that I know if i continued it's use, my ends would be fried. In saying that, however, the next day, the hair on my scalp lifted up more than it has since I began this regime, and I did like how it felt on my scalp (like a scritchy massage) while brushing with it. So, I think I'm going to do a little experiment and maybe use the BBB just on my scalp and the first 3 inches of my hair every few days, and see what happens.

[proo]

Interesting!
I continue to turban in soft cotton/silky scarves post smp-
It seems to allow sebum to absorb and spread, and generally spruces things up.
Lately, dealing with fridgid temps and dry heat, I’ve been experimenting with using a long, stretchy, thin plastic bag to turban.
Started a separate thread about it to which the consensus was “say what??”
Folks couldn’t understand baggying without product-
But of course sebum is the product ; there’s something about the plastic that boosts the turbaning effect.
Very moisturizing.

[Bedhead]

I can totally see how that would work! It might not be for me though. Unlike you, my hair produces a good amount of sebum, so I can only see my hair going limp, as if I've done an oil treatment. Ha ha! It would take me days to come back from, but, on second thought, would probably come back beautifully!

I love the winter days for my hair. It's always at its most glorious.... Here, anyway. I wonder if I moved back home if my hair would get past the extreme staticky stage? Perhaps the plastic bag turban would do the trick then, in the much drier environment?

Something interesting, I've noticed, is that the areas where my hair is only 5mm long, the sebum buildup is a lot thicker on my scalp. Protection from the cold perhaps? Amazing, these bodies of ours!

[FrayedFire]

Bedhead, what type of bbb is it? I have two - a stiff one I use on my scalp, and then I switch to a soft one for a few strokes down the length. I've been trying to use them and my TT less because I noticed that the ends of some of my strands were curling up, like what happens when you use scissors to curl a ribbon, and I can only assume that's the cause.

[FrayedFire]

~~~~~~~~~~~~~

[valkyrie90]

So I decide to give SO another try . Hopefully this time I'm not gonna chicken out and grab my herbal tea bottle . I'm used to herbal wash weekly and on day 7 of SO . Everything seems fine . I spend 30 mins to 1 hour to smp with fingers and my horn combs . What I notice is on day 6 and 7 my hair sheds massively when being detangled . It must be the way I handle my hair always kinda aggressive still I feel like the more I smp he more my hair sheds . I also notice the further I stretch wash , the more my hair sheds . I've been washing weekly for a while and the excess shedding didn't bother me much as now . I love SO so far , my hair is soooo soft , the ends feel and look the best , my LWB can hold for forever . I just wanna make it work but I don't wanna go bald . And if possible please post what SO successful hair looks like . I wanna be inspired !

[proo]

Hi valkyrie-
Do you mean “shred” or “shed”?
In either case, sounds like you’re being a bit too aggressive so perhaps back off the smp somewhat.
In my experience this method requires constant tweaking with regard to what’s going on with your body, what’s around it and what you put in it.
I really like this aspect because I like tweaking my experience in all ways
And it requires a certain sensitivity about my body that I didn’t cultivate when I was out there trying to find another product to fix something

[Shigure]

Question:
How can I improve constant 'wet hair' look?

[valkyrie90]

Hi valkyrie-
Do you mean “shred” or “shed”?
In either case, sounds like you’re being a bit too aggressive so perhaps back off the smp somewhat.
In my experience this method requires constant tweaking with regard to what’s going on with your body, what’s around it and what you put in it.
I really like this aspect because I like tweaking my experience in all ways
And it requires a certain sensitivity about my body that I didn’t cultivate when I was out there trying to find another product to fix something

Well said proo. Sorry for my bad English I meant "shed" . Maybe I will turn smp down a bit . Thing is I love to do the scritch and massage part with my fingers while the preen part I love to do with my horn comb which I can get too much enthusiastic with . I will try doing all with just my fingers and see how it goes. If I just let my hair be it will smell funky :(

[Bedhead]

FreyedFire, this is a firm, round, BBB. I bought it in my shampoo days. But keep in mind, I am doing an experiment. I don't know if I will continue with its use. The BBB did not work for me in the past, either damaging my ends or making my hair look more damp than it needed because it stimulates the scalp so much.

Shigure, SMP is key. Also some people find wiping their hair with a cloth helpful. But, really, if you are in mid transition... braids are your new best friend. Other things you might want to look at is your diet (we need a clean diet to be successful with NW/SO), your stress level, and environment. If those are all good, and you're SMPing religiously, then it's more a matter of time. Intertwining scarves with your styles will also help to absorb the excess sebum.

Valkyrie, I wanted to point out too, as many don't, you might not be aware of just how much your hair sheds when you wash with water. When you do this method, it's easy to witness it all, instead of it disappearing down the drain while our eyes are closed. Too, I found the closer I got to being fully transitioned, my shedding rate decreased significantly. Don't forget to eat a clean! I'd say SMP as much as you are, but, as proo suggested, maybe do it more gently.

[FrayedFire]

Yeah, I wouldn't use a firm bbb on the length too often, but now that you've mentioned it, sometimes it does seem to make my hair look more wet, but sometimes it helps, so, maybe just for occasional use. I think I might be nearing another transition, but I'm also finding that my ends are dry so I'm considering a treatment, but I'm not sure if there's a way to do it that won't set me back to square one...

[Bedhead]

That depends on what you mean by "treatment".

How long have you been on the NW/SO wagon? How long is your hair? This will help us answer your questions, because the answers can be different depending on where you're at in your journey.

I know when I was transitioning, lightly spritzing my ends with water, then oiling them with only one drop of oil for the entirety helped. I only did i when absolutely needed, though. One day I noticed I hadn't needed to for quite some time, and haven't needed it since.

One thing proo highly recommended to me during this time was to try doing a crown braid and really get your ends tucked up in there, right near your scalp. I'd try this first.

[proo]

I preen my hair into 2 rope twists
Then stroke the ends directly on my nape scalp, the most sebum- rich area for me.
If convenient, I’ll tuck the ends under the opposite twist and scarf it in there for awhile

[FrayedFire]

I'm not entirely sure... I spent about a year only washing like once a week, and then several months stretching it to multiple weeks, and the last time I washed was for the New Year, I think?

I dislike that this method makes my hair look darker, plus I like to enhance the natural reds and blondes in my colour, so I was wondering if I could do some henna/cassia glosses and honey lightening, plus those are good for hair and I'm babying old dyed hair as I grow in "virgin" hair.

I'm also mad at myself because I bought several sample CV bars because I thought I wanted to use them for a gentle monthly wash, but they're probably too finicky what with the acidic rinse, but on the other hand, it could be the perfect thing for the ocassional cleansing.

I'm actually trying to avoid braids for 2018, buns only, though I guess if I can figure out how to do a rope crown that would be pretty awesome, my hair is long enough, the taper is brushing tailbone.

[Bedhead]

Your hair looks darker, because you haven't yet transitioned. It will lighten up.

I don't colour my hair, and I've read many contradicting things regarding henna. Many have stopped NW/SO because they felt like they had to interrupt it too often to maintain their henna. BUT I did read about a woman who just didn't rinse it, and continued down the road of SMPing and NW/SO like nothing happened, and she felt it was fine that way.

If you find you want to rinse and use your bars, try making a diluted solution rather than lathering up right on the head. They'll last the rest of your life this way! Ha ha!

Buns work well too. I rarely braided my hair.

If you don't have one, I would highly recommend you get a lice comb. That changed so much for me.

[FrayedFire]

Ah! Okay, that's good. But I still would like to lighten and tint it occasionally, which is why I got excited when I learned about glosses, but it's not a maintaining thing, it's more of an every so often thing my goal is a natural looking reddish bayalage sort of deal, and I think the way to go may be honey and cassia along with a little bit of henna done as a gloss every so often. I'm really lazy and I hate root growth so I figured, well, if i make it deliberate, I don't have to keep up with anything, and I still get red hair... but I've been itching for a touch-up, pushing it off because I don't want to transition from scratch.

Oh, they definitely will last for a long time, that's for sure. I can't imagine how long it would take me to go through a full sized bar, no thank you!

Yes! I'm actually hunting for a lice comb and something to replace my TT, because I saw it mentioned in the old thread. So many options, in material as well as design.

[valkyrie90]

My shedding seems to decrease somehow. I shed a lot more on 2 last day of a washing cycle , day 6 when I oil my hair and day 7 when I wash it. Now even though I don't follow that schedule anymore my hair can't still keep up lol. So it still sheds massively on day 6 and 7 of a washing cycle and gradually decrease.Well that's just my theory.

Anyways Idk if I'm hallucinating but my hair feels and looks thicker as I do NW. It feels much more fluffy down the end too. Does it happen to your hair? And how do you know that the transition is over ? I've been no poo with indian herbs for over a year but can't still tell !!

[FrayedFire]

Mine felt fluffier too.

It's raining and I just couldn't resist, and I slightly regret it because I used some CV conditioner bar on the length, but I really wanted to try it... I won't know until it's dry.

At least I know at least the water was good - my hair /loves/ rainwater

[Shigure]

Your hair looks darker, because you haven't yet transitioned. It will lighten up.

I don't colour my hair, and I've read many contradicting things regarding henna. Many have stopped NW/SO because they felt like they had to interrupt it too often to maintain their henna. BUT I did read about a woman who just didn't rinse it, and continued down the road of SMPing and NW/SO like nothing happened, and she felt it was fine that way.

If you find you want to rinse and use your bars, try making a diluted solution rather than lathering up right on the head. They'll last the rest of your life this way! Ha ha!

Buns work well too. I rarely braided my hair.

If you don't have one, I would highly recommend you get a lice comb. That changed so much for me.

Why do you use lice comb? What is it for?

[Bedhead]

Why do you use lice comb? What is it for?

A lice comb is a multi-use tool. It removes dust and lint, it removes excess sebum, and it evens out the sebum along the shaft, which is great for once you have preened to the extent that the sebum covers your entire length.

[valkyrie90]

A lice comb is a multi-use tool. It removes dust and lint, it removes excess sebum, and it evens out the sebum along the shaft, which is great for once you have preened to the extent that the sebum covers your entire length.

For all that time I thought lice comb is only for when you have lice on your head. It always reminds me of gross stuff like lice eggs ( eww) and the pain when my mom combed my hair with it when I was a kid. I learn new thing everyday . Will definitely try it !

[Shigure]

A lice comb is a multi-use tool. It removes dust and lint, it removes excess sebum, and it evens out the sebum along the shaft, which is great for once you have preened to the extent that the sebum covers your entire length.

Nice. Now I need to find one in Poland. I doubt they are availible here. But from what you wrote I need one. Dust and lint are nigtmare for me now.

[embee]

Nice. Now I need to find one in Poland. I doubt they are availible here. But from what you wrote I need one. Dust and lint are nigtmare for me now.

You might try a veterinarian's office. A "flea comb" is probably very similar - may be the same, only marketed to a different group!

[Bedhead]

For all that time I thought lice comb is only for when you have lice on your head. It always reminds me of gross stuff like lice eggs ( eww) and the pain when my mom combed my hair with it when I was a kid. I learn new thing everyday . Will definitely try it !
Oooo! I've never had lice. I can only imagine. :pins:

Nice. Now I need to find one in Poland. I doubt they are availible here. But from what you wrote I need one. Dust and lint are nigtmare for me now.
If/when you find one, you'll know exactly what I mean. I got mine from France, not here, but it's a horn comb.

You might try a veterinarian's office. A "flea comb" is probably very similar - may be the same, only marketed to a different group!

"different group" Ha ha!

[Beckstar]

I'm guessing no one in this thread dyes their hair? I don't see how you can without doing at least a water only rinse.

[Bedhead]

I'm guessing no one in this thread dyes their hair? I don't see how you can without doing at least a water only rinse.

Not that I know of. But there are people who rinse every month to every 3 months. I suppose it would depend on how often you need/want to dye your hair. The bonus of this method, is those bright colours would stay in much longer!

[valkyrie90]

Day 21 of transition . I get used to the smp routine and found out that when you don't wash your hair anymore, you have to wash your combs much more often ! : D

Dust and lint are my nightmare now but a lice comb is helping a lot ! I love how it feels on my hair. One thing is I really need an effective way to clean my combs. I have a wide-toothed horn comb , a fine-toothed horn comb and a wooden lice comb.

Another thing that really bothers me is people's reaction. My aunt notice when I take my hair down to redo a bun or feel like doing a smp when my hand is free. She constantly suggests a wash with shampoo and conditioner which would never happen . I just said that's my way of taking care of my hair now. today when I was about to go out she asked when I will wash my hair. I said maybe after 2 months from now and she said don't be so crazy =))

How do your partners react to you doing NW/ SO?

[embee]

I don't share that kind of information unless it's here on LHC. I've learned that people want me to do what *they* do, not what *I* want to do, so best to wear my hair up and be quiet. ;)

[Bedhead]

I agree with embee. I told a few people. The only ones geographically close to me, are open to alternative ways.

I'd say, just stop taking your hair down around her, and it won't be an issue, giving you the emotional space to transition.

[melikai]

Day 21 of transition . I get used to the smp routine and found out that when you don't wash your hair anymore, you have to wash your combs much more often ! : D

Dust and lint are my nightmare now but a lice comb is helping a lot ! I love how it feels on my hair. One thing is I really need an effective way to clean my combs. I have a wide-toothed horn comb , a fine-toothed horn comb and a wooden lice comb.

Another thing that really bothers me is people's reaction. My aunt notice when I take my hair down to redo a bun or feel like doing a smp when my hand is free. She constantly suggests a wash with shampoo and conditioner which would never happen . I just said that's my way of taking care of my hair now. today when I was about to go out she asked when I will wash my hair. I said maybe after 2 months from now and she said don't be so crazy =))

How do your partners react to you doing NW/ SO?

I find a good way to clean combs is by using a bit of natural soap or baking soda on a toothbrush. That allows you to really scrub and get in between the teeth of even really fine-toothed ones.

[leayellena]

After shampooing my hair it feels thin, fine, it shows scalp cleavage. If I co-wash and do some screatching it feels good but it looks big unwashed. Yeah straight fine hair problems ikr. But my scalp and my hair love to be washed rarely. Less breakage. But daily moisture is a must, especially when weather changes

[Bedhead]

I find a good way to clean combs is by using a bit of natural soap or baking soda on a toothbrush. That allows you to really scrub and get in between the teeth of even really fine-toothed ones.

I find that if I quickly brush off the combs immediately after using them, I don't need to go through a formal cleaning of the combs very often, nor do I need to use soap. A fine layer of sebum can protect the combs as well.


After shampooing my hair it feels thin, fine, it shows scalp cleavage. If I co-wash and do some screatching it feels good but it looks big unwashed. Yeah straight fine hair problems ikr. But my scalp and my hair love to be washed rarely. Less breakage. But daily moisture is a must, especially when weather changes

Hi leayellena, I needed extra moisture for my ends for a while too, especially when I trimmed my ends, but at some point the need just disappeared.

[proo]

I rinse my combs with boiling water about once a week
Other than that, I wipe them occasionally, but don’t mind a light coating of sebum-
After all, that’s my conditioner
I use plastic/resin combs

[Shigure]

Successful SO.
Can you share photos of your hair down?

[Bedhead]

Successful SO.
Can you share photos of your hair down?

Regard my siggy!

[valkyrie90]

I rinse my combs with boiling water about once a week
Other than that, I wipe them occasionally, but don’t mind a light coating of sebum-
After all, that’s my conditioner
I use plastic/resin combs

I wipe my combs constantly but there're stil some lints and dust stuck in there. And I'm afraid of wetting my horn combs as I heard that it's not good doing so. I might try the tooth brush trick with some mild soap, though. My combs need serious clean .

I learn it the hard way to keep my mouth shut and my hair up around other ppl or they will think I'm going through a breakdown and stop taking care of myself lol. If only they knew how much time and effort I have been putting on my hair the past 1 year especially when I go NW/SO.

Another problem is how to tame hair in the ultimate humid weather ( from 60 to over 90% of humidity ) without rinsing. My hair will never dry after a water rinse. And I'm incapable of doing other rinses now as I'm not at home.

Last but not least I want pics plsss!!!

[Bedhead]

Just don't soak your horn combs. A quick wash/rinse and dry immediately will be fine.

[SparrowWings]

I'm not quite sure what to make of my hair right now. I definitely haven't been SMPing as often as I should (Time, come back to me!), but even on the occasions when I manage to do two close-together sessions, all it really seems to do is get rid of some (not even all!) lint and dandruff. So I'm winding up with a weird phenomenon of clean scalp, borderline reasonable roots, gross and smelly ears/chin-to-shoulders/APL, and happy or borderline dry from there down. The gross part is definitely travelling, slowly, but it's not that I'm just growing out never-handled transition buildup, because it's much too far down for the time span, and even during transition wasn't this bad. It just doesn't seem to want to even out properly. My attempts at lightly oiling my hands pre-SMP did help some, but even with as little oil as was available to transfer to my hair, it collected dust/lint a lot faster, so I don't love that approach, and it wasn't fabulously successful enough to want to deal with the lint tangles, either.

I got it in my head that I had seen Bedhead post something specific about her horn lice comb recently-ish, so I went looking. I didn't find what I was expecting! But I did find a (broken) link and description of the comb, from four years ago, plus a mention that a plastic fine-toothed comb preceeded it. It sounds like what I'm using currently is fairly similar, so now I'm questioning what it is that I really need. The fine-toothed plastic comb that I have has both tines and spacings of about 1mm, which matches how the horn comb was described, and isn't how I would've described a lice comb. I though the spacing on those was much smaller, nearly invisible. And if the plastic one isn't seeming quite narrow enough to really handle the sebum properly, would getting a similarly-spaced horn (or wood) one be any benefit? It doesn't look like smaller spacings are available in those materials. Bedhead, do you remember the spacing on the plastic comb you used originally? Was it the switch to horn that was the big help for you, or was the spacing different as well?

With that discovery in mind, I'm wondering just how much I should be looking for even smaller spacings, regardless of material, or if material actually has enough effect on its own. I've seen plenty of metal-tined lice combs with impossibly tight spacings, but they scare me a bit, between being that tight, and being metal. I've also seen bamboo-stick ones, though I'm not sure what to make of them. It looks like the tines might be too blunt, but if they're so small as it is, maybe they're not a problem? Have any of you ever used a bamboo comb, similar to this (https://www.amazon.com/Terminator-bamboo-Double-Professional-Remove/dp/B0792WZHCP)? I'm also worried the tines would be too fragile and break in short order... Or that they'd be too annoying to even use the comb, poking into my hand on one side while I try to comb with the other -- How do you actually hold/use double-sided combs?

[Bedhead]

I have to say, I have absolutely no memory of that. Sorry! But, yeah, lice combs typically have 1mm tines. I bought it from thomasliorac.com but they don't seem to carry the lice combs at this time, hence the broken link. I can tell you that I have never used a comb with tines that close together before in my entire life.

I bought horn, because my medium tine comb is horn and I really appreciated how it moved the sebum and cleaned my hair so evenly. The only wood comb I have is a wide tooth comb. I just have the three and use the wide and medium combs most often, along with my hands. I use the lice one about once a week or so, if I've been around a lot of dust or smoke, or if my hair is feeling particularly heavy that day.

Lightly scraping your hair with your nails while you SMP can help with dust too, if you don't have a lice comb.

[SparrowWings]

I have to say, I have absolutely no memory of that. Sorry! ... I bought horn, because my medium tine comb is horn and I really appreciated how it moved the sebum and cleaned my hair so evenly.
No problem! I knew it was a long shot, four years later. :) At any rate, I just ordered myself a horn lice comb; it should be here in a couple weeks. We'll see how it compares to the super-fine-toothed plastic comb I have. I'm expecting the spacing to be similar, but hoping it works better anyhow, whether due to material or stiffer tines or something else, we'll see. Because for all that the plastic one definitely removes dust and lint better, the wide-toothed wooden one seems to spread/remove sebum better, just not enough. I don't have a mid-spacing comb; depending on how this lice one turns out, maybe I'll have to look into one of them as well, in some material or other. I'll keep you all updated!

Is your (any of you that have one) lice comb double-sided? How do you hold it?

[proo]

My finest toothed comb was called a “beard comb” I think-
It’s plastic and double sided;
I hold one side and comb with the other

[SparrowWings]

The tines don't poke into your hand and get annoying and/or break?

[Bedhead]

I read a "beard comb" has 1mm tines too.

I just place my fingers on the centre, and no, it doesn't poke into my hand.

[proo]

The tines don't poke into your hand and get annoying and/or break?

No problem so far-
I go slowly and only use it when my hair is thoroughly smooth already.

[melikai]

I'm not quite sure what to make of my hair right now. I definitely haven't been SMPing as often as I should (Time, come back to me!), but even on the occasions when I manage to do two close-together sessions, all it really seems to do is get rid of some (not even all!) lint and dandruff. So I'm winding up with a weird phenomenon of clean scalp, borderline reasonable roots, gross and smelly ears/chin-to-shoulders/APL, and happy or borderline dry from there down. The gross part is definitely travelling, slowly, but it's not that I'm just growing out never-handled transition buildup, because it's much too far down for the time span, and even during transition wasn't this bad. It just doesn't seem to want to even out properly. My attempts at lightly oiling my hands pre-SMP did help some, but even with as little oil as was available to transfer to my hair, it collected dust/lint a lot faster, so I don't love that approach, and it wasn't fabulously successful enough to want to deal with the lint tangles, either.

I got it in my head that I had seen Bedhead post something specific about her horn lice comb recently-ish, so I went looking. I didn't find what I was expecting! But I did find a (broken) link and description of the comb, from four years ago, plus a mention that a plastic fine-toothed comb preceeded it. It sounds like what I'm using currently is fairly similar, so now I'm questioning what it is that I really need. The fine-toothed plastic comb that I have has both tines and spacings of about 1mm, which matches how the horn comb was described, and isn't how I would've described a lice comb. I though the spacing on those was much smaller, nearly invisible. And if the plastic one isn't seeming quite narrow enough to really handle the sebum properly, would getting a similarly-spaced horn (or wood) one be any benefit? It doesn't look like smaller spacings are available in those materials. Bedhead, do you remember the spacing on the plastic comb you used originally? Was it the switch to horn that was the big help for you, or was the spacing different as well?

With that discovery in mind, I'm wondering just how much I should be looking for even smaller spacings, regardless of material, or if material actually has enough effect on its own. I've seen plenty of metal-tined lice combs with impossibly tight spacings, but they scare me a bit, between being that tight, and being metal. I've also seen bamboo-stick ones, though I'm not sure what to make of them. It looks like the tines might be too blunt, but if they're so small as it is, maybe they're not a problem? Have any of you ever used a bamboo comb, similar to this (https://www.amazon.com/Terminator-bamboo-Double-Professional-Remove/dp/B0792WZHCP)? I'm also worried the tines would be too fragile and break in short order... Or that they'd be too annoying to even use the comb, poking into my hand on one side while I try to comb with the other -- How do you actually hold/use double-sided combs?

I'm not SO, but I read this thread. :redgrin:
I looked at the same bamboo double-sided comb, but I was worried that the tines would be really roughly cut and ragged, and thus could wreak havoc on your hair. The one I have is similar to this: https://www.amazon.com/GAINWELL-Sandalwood-anti-static-handmade-Pocket/dp/B01GCEQTA2, a sandalwood beard comb. The tines don't dig into my palm when I use it, but I hold it more with my fingers than in my palm.

[Bedhead]

No problem so far-
I go slowly and only use it when my hair is thoroughly smooth already.

Agreed, go slow. This is about cleaning your hair not "running a comb through your hair" on your way out.


I'm not SO, but I read this thread. :redgrin:
I looked at the same bamboo double-sided comb, but I was worried that the tines would be really roughly cut and ragged, and thus could wreak havoc on your hair. The one I have is similar to this: https://www.amazon.com/GAINWELL-Sandalwood-anti-static-handmade-Pocket/dp/B01GCEQTA2, a sandalwood beard comb. The tines don't dig into my palm when I use it, but I hold it more with my fingers than in my palm.

Lurker!!! :bigtongue:

But I agree. With the tiny tines, it would be hard to smooth out the wooden combs to a point where it wont be rough and catch/scrape the hair. I could be wrong, but it was a definite concern of mine.

[Bedhead]

My hair grows so fast, I've had to cut my hair 6 times since I first cut it this way, taking about 2/3cm (1/3") off each time.

What I'm finding with the ultra short hair (5mm->1" - can you tell I'm Canadian?! Ha ha!), is my hair quality is beautiful, but, with the cold weather this winter, I'm getting some flaking. It's not a horrendous amount of flaking, and only occurs when I scritch. It's not like there are flakes hanging out for all to see. I'm pretty sure it's because of the weather and the lack of protection with the shorter hair, because my longer hair section (shoulder length) is not flaking. It's also possible, I just don't notice flaking from the longer section, but that's most of my hair. On the other hand, the sebum is thicker in the shorter sections, I'm sure protecting my scalp against the cold.

Just some observations. I'll see what happens into the spring, and how the weather changes affect it.

[proo]

Interesting about the sebum protection on your shorter parts-
Are you maintaining the original ‘do when trimming or is it evolving?
I love trimming! But I guess that’s no secret

[Bedhead]

I am maintaining the original do, although, I'm making different mistakes each time. Ha ha! Luckily, it's so short the mistakes grow in in less than a week. Saying that, I have a much clearer understanding of what gives me the effects I want, and what doesn't, which is good, because I like this cut, It allows me to express the vast part of my self. It feel more like me than the beautiful hip length buns I had going before.

I've only trimmed the length once since the original cut. And, as I said before, my scalp no longer reacts to the cuts, and my ends stay hydrated even after a cut, without any moisture or oils added. It took my hair that full year and a half to get there, since then, it's stayed its course.

[SparrowWings]

I'm not SO, but I read this thread. :redgrin:
I looked at the same bamboo double-sided comb, but I was worried that the tines would be really roughly cut and ragged, and thus could wreak havoc on your hair. The one I have is similar to this: https://www.amazon.com/GAINWELL-Sandalwood-anti-static-handmade-Pocket/dp/B01GCEQTA2, a sandalwood beard comb. The tines don't dig into my palm when I use it, but I hold it more with my fingers than in my palm.

But I agree. With the tiny tines, it would be hard to smooth out the wooden combs to a point where it wont be rough and catch/scrape the hair. I could be wrong, but it was a definite concern of mine.
I do the same with the WO one, so that's fair! :D
I had wondered about the smoothness as well, and based on various pictures I found, it did seem like that could be quite a problem, but was perhaps more quality-dependent (like so many things!) than the two concerns I mentioned. At any rate, thank you both for backing up my hesitation! The comb you have looks like a nice one, melikai, and I'm glad to read that it doesn't hurt your palm. It it were going to, I would expect yours to be even more of a problem, with the one side having wider spacings, so that's a good sign for worry-wart me!


Agreed, go slow. This is about cleaning your hair not "running a comb through your hair" on your way out.
Definitely slow. Whether or not my current plastic comb is as fine as the to-come horn lice comb, it would be foolish to go quickly with it; my hair just can't get out if its own way fast enough, even if I did want to rush. I expect the same to be true for the horn comb.

And Bedhead, we're still waiting for pictures! I'm really curious, by now! :D

[melikai]

Yeah, that's one problem I have with double-sided combs - I have to go slowly and be somewhat careful, because my hair will wrap itself on the opposite side of tines! I only use that little one up at the top couple inches of my scalp, to sort of scritchy-preeny it.

I've decided to give up combs and brushes for the next month or so though, to see if they are the main culprit for my hair splits. Probably my bbb... feels so good though :headache: hrmph.
My fingers work best for preening anyway.

[SparrowWings]

It's official. My plastic comb is basically useless. I don't even have the horn comb yet, but commenting on how the wooden wide tooth comb seems to work almost as well made me finally realize something really obvious... Even wide tooth combs can be made to act somewhat like fine tooth combs. Insert into the hair, and pull down diagonally, one side lower than the other. Whether the tips of the tines or the top of the comb is lower doesn't matter, so long as one side is lower. And the angle dictates how "narrow" the tine spacings become. Doing that, it's ridiculous how much better the wide tooth comb worked than the fine. Sure, the plastic one turned whiteish-grey, it could remove some lint and dust and stuff, but it was pretty limited. Doing this angled thing with the wooden one, though... Oh my word. I thought it was just the one bad section in my hair that was overloaded with sebum. Now, I'm thinking that section is probably downright disgusting instead, and even the "ok" parts are a bit heavy too. I'm going to keep doing this each morning when I comb and see where it leaves me by the time the horn comb comes. Maybe it'll turn out that I didn't need the horn comb after all, but even so, I suspect it'll work better/faster, since it'll have more teeth with legit finer spacings, at the very least. I'm not sure why the plastic comb is so bad, but I'm glad I know for sure now! And it certainly proves that I'm right in feeling like preening by hand never worked very well for me. But if this can do the job, that's ok!

[Bedhead]

Yeah, that's one problem I have with double-sided combs - I have to go slowly and be somewhat careful, because my hair will wrap itself on the opposite side of tines! I only use that little one up at the top couple inches of my scalp, to sort of scritchy-preeny it.

I've decided to give up combs and brushes for the next month or so though, to see if they are the main culprit for my hair splits. Probably my bbb... feels so good though :headache: hrmph.
My fingers work best for preening anyway.

Maybe use each comb/brush and really concentrate on what you feel when they pass through your hair slowly. Some combs tend to be too sharp and scrape too much, my bbb, while it went through my hair in a lovely way, grabs the ends in a harsh way. And then sometime it's not the tool but the user and their technique. It can take a concerted effort to notice the subtle things.


It's official. My plastic comb is basically useless. I don't even have the horn comb yet, but commenting on how the wooden wide tooth comb seems to work almost as well made me finally realize something really obvious... Even wide tooth combs can be made to act somewhat like fine tooth combs. Insert into the hair, and pull down diagonally, one side lower than the other. Whether the tips of the tines or the top of the comb is lower doesn't matter, so long as one side is lower. And the angle dictates how "narrow" the tine spacings become. Doing that, it's ridiculous how much better the wide tooth comb worked than the fine. Sure, the plastic one turned whiteish-grey, it could remove some lint and dust and stuff, but it was pretty limited. Doing this angled thing with the wooden one, though... Oh my word. I thought it was just the one bad section in my hair that was overloaded with sebum. Now, I'm thinking that section is probably downright disgusting instead, and even the "ok" parts are a bit heavy too. I'm going to keep doing this each morning when I comb and see where it leaves me by the time the horn comb comes. Maybe it'll turn out that I didn't need the horn comb after all, but even so, I suspect it'll work better/faster, since it'll have more teeth with legit finer spacings, at the very least. I'm not sure why the plastic comb is so bad, but I'm glad I know for sure now! And it certainly proves that I'm right in feeling like preening by hand never worked very well for me. But if this can do the job, that's ok!

I'm glad to hear you're learning how to use your combs successfully! Combs have been a very useful part of my arsenal, and yeah, that slow methodical, feeling the relation of the comb to the hair, will really have a huge effect on your results. Too bad the plastic one isn't working for you, but I'm glad you figured out it wasn't. Sometimes it's just something about how the comb is made, no matter what it's made of.

[melikai]

That's a good idea Bedhead. It also sounds like more mindfulness - like what we were talking about in a different thread a while ago. :)

[proo]

I am maintaining the original do, although, I'm making different mistakes each time. Ha ha! Luckily, it's so short the mistakes grow in in less than a week. Saying that, I have a much clearer understanding of what gives me the effects I want, and what doesn't, which is good, because I like this cut, It allows me to express the vast part of my self. It feel more like me than the beautiful hip length buns I had going before.

I've only trimmed the length once since the original cut. And, as I said before, my scalp no longer reacts to the cuts, and my ends stay hydrated even after a cut, without any moisture or oils added. It took my hair that full year and a half to get there, since then, it's stayed its course.
It would be interesting to see if you could maintain sebum consistently to the ends if you grew out now.

[Bedhead]

That's a good idea Bedhead. It also sounds like more mindfulness - like what we were talking about in a different thread a while ago. :)
NW/SO is very much about mindfulness in all respects. We have to pay attention and adjust, until we find what works, and even then, we still need to pay attention, because what works now, might not work later down the road, and so we adjust again.


It would be interesting to see if you could maintain sebum consistently to the ends if you grew out now.
Oh, I'm sure that would be no problem at all!

If you remember, there was someone (started with a 'K' I believe), who was starting out with a buzz cut and growing her hair. I often wonder if she's still practicing NW/SO, and if so, how it's worked out for her.

I had to cut my hair again today (half an inch already), but I did a much better job, and went a bit shorter than last time (3mm), so I don't have to cut it as often. The bit that's left is definitely covered with sebum. It feels very healthy.

How's your do doing? Any changes?

[proo]

Yes I remember that person with shortshort hair starting SO-
That’s you now BH. .
As for my ‘do, moving up on SIXTY ovah here:
Bsl/waist abyss that seems to work for me lengthwise
Normal sebum production, easily moved downward with 2x daily combing,+ lack of product
Blunt cut, I love a thick paintbrush chop
Monthly rinse: cedar leaf tea/ epsom salt/vinegar
Conditioning: the wrap- either silk or plastic then wrap cap, I’ve gone on about it before
Micro trimming, well just often

[Shigure]

Yes I remember that person with shortshort hair starting SO-
That’s you now BH. .
As for my ‘do, moving up on SIXTY ovah here:
Bsl/waist abyss that seems to work for me lengthwise
Normal sebum production, easily moved downward with 2x daily combing,+ lack of product
Blunt cut, I love a thick paintbrush chop
Monthly rinse: cedar leaf tea/ epsom salt/vinegar
Conditioning: the wrap- either silk or plastic then wrap cap, I’ve gone on about it before
Micro trimming, well just often
How do you do epsom salt rinses? What does it do for your hair?

[proo]

I make a highly dilute rinse of the tea with salt for the wash-
About half a teaspoon in a bucket of water
Then condition with another highly dilute white vinegar rinse.
Then rinse again, preferably with snow water
And that’s it, maybe a couple drops MO smoothed through the ends.

The salt is somewhat alkaline and stripping but not at this dilution, so it works as a mild cleanser.

[valkyrie90]

Have you guys ever felt like going on a rollercoaster doing SO? Like some days I get up and my hair feels right , just how I want it. My confidence boosts to infinity I can let my hair down and all but some days it feels disgusting all wet and heavy and i just wanna wash it asap . Then I push for one more day and the good hair days come and the rollercoaster goes on and on. I'm on day 46 of SO , still too soon to tell but I sense that my transition days will be soon over. Will my hair ever be predictable, though lol.

[proo]

Hi Valkyrie-
Yep there’s ebb and flow, but of course there is with any method
At this point for me sebum production is waay down which can be an issue
But the overall look is quite consistent day to day
Recommending turbaning in a silky scarf post smp on those heavy days for about 20 minutes
This works for me whether my hair is feeling heavy or too dry

[Bedhead]

Yes, and remember to pay attention to what you ate, your stress level, the weather, your SMP schedule. What was different the day of or the days before?

But it could just be the basic adjustment going on. Totally normal.

Keep it up!

[SparrowWings]

The good news: I definitely feel like I've figured out how to make my wide-tooth comb do double-duty for me.
The bad news: My horn lice comb seems to have disappeared into a black hole in the mail system. :(

That said, this morning I think I might have felt comfortable wearing my hair down, had I had any desire to do so. It's actually back to looking clean, or maybe just slightly product-coated. It still feels a little strange, but I'm not even sure it's a bad thing... It's more even along the length, if nothing else. It's been an interesting month-ish, though. I did stick to tilt-comb-preening daily for most of a week, substantially the first 3-4 days, and shorter passes the rest of it. Partly because I ran out of time, and partly because at day 3 or 4, my hair turned all frizzy, despite still being super-coated. It was very odd. It's still acting somewhat frizzier and braid-shreddier than it had been, but it's also holding waves better, so I think it might be a shift to not being too heavy and getting back to wavier-than-I-knew.

That said, a few questions:
- Is it possible to remove too much sebum via dry preening with a comb and/or fingers?
- Is it possible that some hair refuses to accept sebum, even if it still acts like it's dry?
- How often does your hair seem dry, staticky, frizzy, etc. while properly preened? And in this case, I don't mean at the ends, which are older and more battered anyhow, but anywhere farther up the length where there is solid sebum coverage.

I started out the week trying to remove the excess sebum at the top by wiping it off the comb onto my ends, but that didn't seem to help them any, and it also seemed to make no (visible/textural) different at the top. Somewhere (I thought it was a post here, but I can't find it to properly credit) I got the idea to wipe the excess onto an old t-shirt instead, just to get it out of the way, in case it was going back to the roots instead of staying on the ends. That made a huge difference. Three times like that, each a few days apart (no time to do it on back-to-back days, so I had to make due!), brought me to where I'm at now. And the interesting part is that, while my hands and the comb felt a bit oiled by the end, anything that released to the shirt each time I wiped the comb was almost granular; it didn't stick to itself, to the shirt, to anything. As soon as it got touched again, or the shirt shaken, it disappeared, and the shirt was no dirtier than pre-wipe. I'm not sure if there was that much gunk in my built up sebum, or if that's what dry sebum does, or what to make of it, but if that's all I ever have for excess, I'm not sure how I'm supposed to get anything to my ends, much less keep it there or have it be useful for moisturizing. But even with that, I'm feeling better about the whole thing again, which is good, because it really is more convenient! I'm back on top of things and it should remain maintainable.

[leayellena]

Did it yesterday. My hair looks ok. I think washing on Sundays and Wednesdays is just ok for my hair, but I will start this only if necessary!

[leayellena]

That said, this morning I think I might have felt comfortable wearing my hair down, had I had any desire to do so. It's actually back to looking clean, or maybe just slightly product-coated. It still feels a little strange, but I'm not even sure it's a bad thing... It's more even along the length, if nothing else. It's been an interesting month-ish, though. I did stick to tilt-comb-preening daily for most of a week, substantially the first 3-4 days, and shorter passes the rest of it. Partly because I ran out of time, and partly because at day 3 or 4, my hair turned all frizzy, despite still being super-coated. It was very odd. It's still acting somewhat frizzier and braid-shreddier than it had been, but it's also holding waves better, so I think it might be a shift to not being too heavy and getting back to wavier-than-I-knew.

I wave it, fluff it etc. My hair is flat on top 1c
I am not sure about the 2a because I still have layers. Or it may be 2a on some days...

That said, a few questions:
- Is it possible to remove too much sebum via dry preening with a comb and/or fingers?

Hmm too much?! I don't think so... Didn't cross my mind. Maybe you would scratch too much and your scalp hurts?

- Is it possible that some hair refuses to accept sebum, even if it still acts like it's dry? - probably. You described my grandmother's situation. She washes her hair once a week but there's still no sebum even after so long time. Her hair is super dry. Probably dry scalp hates sebum?

- How often does your hair seem dry, staticky, frizzy, etc. while properly preened? And in this case, I don't mean at the ends, which are older and more battered anyhow, but anywhere farther up the length where there is solid sebum coverage.
Mine gets frizzy, not wavy. If I do screatching let's say today in the afternoon chances are I wake up with ok looking hair the next morning. But not clean, not like everyone has the idea of clean hair.

I started out the week trying to remove the excess sebum at the top by wiping it off the comb onto my ends, but that didn't seem to help them any, and it also seemed to make no (visible/textural) different at the top.
Maybe the combing doesn't do anything to your hair. Mine does, it goes flat(ish). But it doesn't remove the braid waves.
Somewhere (I thought it was a post here, but I can't find it to properly credit) I got the idea to wipe the excess onto an old t-shirt instead, just to get it out of the way, in case it was going back to the roots instead of staying on the ends. That made a huge difference. Three times like that, each a few days apart (no time to do it on back-to-back days, so I had to make due!), brought me to where I'm at now. And the interesting part is that, while my hands and the comb felt a bit oiled by the end, anything that released to the shirt each time I wiped the comb was almost granular; it didn't stick to itself, to the shirt, to anything. As soon as it got touched again, or the shirt shaken, it disappeared, and the shirt was no dirtier than pre-wipe. I'm not sure if there was that much gunk in my built up sebum, or if that's what dry sebum does, or what to make of it, but if that's all I ever have for excess, I'm not sure how I'm supposed to get anything to my ends, much less keep it there or have it be useful for moisturizing. But even with that, I'm feeling better about the whole thing again, which is good, because it really is more convenient! I'm back on top of things and it should remain maintainable.
T-shirt method doesn't do anything for me. I am glad it worked for u :)

[Shigure]

I need tips!!
My hair are oily to the point where no kind of bun can hide it. I need a way to deal/get read/hide greasiness.

[Bedhead]

SparrowWings, I experienced static this winter when I went home to mountain time. I just thought if I stayed longer my hair/scalp would adjust, but I don't know that for sure; I didn't stay more than 10 days.

Shigure, toques are still in style! And they absorb a lot of sebum. Some of my best days were after I spent time wearing a toque. If that's not your style, people have had luck with a paranda for you braids, or a scarf in general. Personally, I just did a nice tight dutch braid and that seemed to do the trick.

[Bedhead]

Just checking in with my NW/SO peeps!

How are you all doing?

I've been a lazy SMPer, this past couple weeks. I got a mild flu, but the interesting thing is, I noticed how my sebum production increased a few days before it hit. Another sign that my scalp knows what's going on!

Happy preening everyone! :)

[embee]

I'm still here. Things are going well. Except for one interesting development. My hairsticks... they don't want to hold my bun well any more.... they get spit out, the hair is so slippy. It feels really nice and soft and smooth, which is lovely, but I miss the tight Mean Old Librarian Bun of last year. :( ;)

[Bedhead]

Yes, there are days when it takes a tighter bun to hold the sticks so they can hold the hair. Saying that, I find that shifts too, here and there. Embee, is this a seasonal shift thing happening?

I have to admit, since I cut my hair, the hair sticks have been put aside and I've been using hair elastics to attain a messy bun when I want, which is a lot of the time.

[proo]

I’m still here
Finally got a silk bonnet ! which I’m using during the day after smp-
Usually I doobie (tubi?) wrap under it, which continues to work well as a method to smooth things out and moisturize ends
In other news: still enjoying pine needle tea, in the process of brewing up some local cedar ointment
And procured a miswak which I learned about from you BH

[SparrowWings]

I'm still around. It's a bit of a mixed bag. My horn lice comb finally (!!) showed up a couple weeks ago, and I've been trying it out, but I'm still not sure what to make of it. It does in fact have slightly wider tines/spacings than the crap plastic comb (7 on the plastic comb for every 6 on the horn), but it's a bit stiffer than the plastic, which probably makes a bigger difference. It certainly wasn't an instant fix-all, though. It definitely removes the dust and gunk more/better/faster, but I'm not sure about how much it helps with the sebum.

It's a bit odd, actually. The wide-tooth wooden comb strips out excess pretty well, but because it has so few tines, it's a slow, uneven process. The horn comb seems to be able to strip similarly, and with more, smaller tines, it can work better... But it seems to require 10-15 minutes of running the comb through before it actually starts collecting sebum. The first few passes, it loads up with lint, dust, flaky stuff. Then not much of anything for a while, making it seem like I'm done and should quit. If I really try, I can get some sebum to prove there's excess. But if I keep going (because I know there's way too much sebum on there!), eventually it starts coming out like crazy; I can't comb long enough for it to slow down. And this is on the hair itself, not because of lots of scalp massaging or anything. I don't do much more than periodically run the tips of the tins along my scalp while combing through the hair, yet the entire comb is covered, so the sebum has to be coming from the hair instead. Does excess sebum create a hard shell or something, and I need to break through it before I can get to the soft stuff? Have any of you ever had anything similar happen?

I'm also still curious what, if any, thoughts you long-timers have on these:

That said, a few questions:
- Is it possible to remove too much sebum via dry preening with a comb and/or fingers?
- Is it possible that some hair refuses to accept sebum, even if it still acts like it's dry?
- How often does your hair seem dry, staticky, frizzy, etc. while properly preened? And in this case, I don't mean at the ends, which are older and more battered anyhow, but anywhere farther up the length where there is solid sebum coverage.

[embee]

Yes, there are days when it takes a tighter bun to hold the sticks so they can hold the hair. Saying that, I find that shifts too, here and there. Embee, is this a seasonal shift thing happening?


I don't know. Don't recall it from last year but that means nothing! ;) Currently am trying a braided Gibralter topknot and that seems to hold pretty well, but I miss my Orchid bun a lot.

No doubt this too shall pass! :D

[SparrowWings]

Since I keep saying how much preening doesn't seem to move anything for me, and I had a chance to take a new length shot finally, I figured I'd roll it all into one:

http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=31431&d=1524867373

That's after a thorough scritching, one of the most thorough and lengthy massage sessions I've ever done, and the better part of two hours of preening with the shiny new lice comb, with small bits of scritching and massaging mixed in when the comb was at my scalp. My tshirt-rag was so covered in sebum that I was having a hard time wiping the comb by the end, the top still looks slimy, and the ends still look frizzy and ultra-dry, but not for lack of trying to get the excess top sebum onto them -- they alternately refused to actually clean the comb, or if I could wipe the comb with the ends, running the comb through the next time wound up with it all back on the comb again anyhow.

That said, once it's been braided or bunned again for a little while, the ends look/feel fine; they just don't like having every individual strand separated. They're still not super-silky, but they're not terribly dry, either. But the top... There's no help for it. And I've been making a point of having extra oils in my diet lately, too, in the hopes that it'd help the sebum spread... It's made no difference. There's no more sebum, it's no oilier, it neither spreads nor removes any better, it just stays stubbornly at 'impossible to get it clean enough to not leave a residue on your hands any time you handle it while still remaining hide-able because there's no oil slick effect'. I don't get it. And these days, my hair is always bunned, so the ends are always right up against my scalp. Yet the sebum still doesn't transfer to them, even then!

Is this just a weird never-ending partially-transitioned sort of thing, a year and a half later and still unchanged? Or is there a trick that I'm missing?

[FrayedFire]

*slides in and flips hair* *carefully detangles hair after flipping* Hey y'all!

[Bedhead]

Since I keep saying how much preening doesn't seem to move anything for me, and I had a chance to take a new length shot finally, I figured I'd roll it all into one:

http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=31431&d=1524867373

That's after a thorough scritching, one of the most thorough and lengthy massage sessions I've ever done, and the better part of two hours of preening with the shiny new lice comb, with small bits of scritching and massaging mixed in when the comb was at my scalp. My tshirt-rag was so covered in sebum that I was having a hard time wiping the comb by the end, the top still looks slimy, and the ends still look frizzy and ultra-dry, but not for lack of trying to get the excess top sebum onto them -- they alternately refused to actually clean the comb, or if I could wipe the comb with the ends, running the comb through the next time wound up with it all back on the comb again anyhow.

That said, once it's been braided or bunned again for a little while, the ends look/feel fine; they just don't like having every individual strand separated. They're still not super-silky, but they're not terribly dry, either. But the top... There's no help for it. And I've been making a point of having extra oils in my diet lately, too, in the hopes that it'd help the sebum spread... It's made no difference. There's no more sebum, it's no oilier, it neither spreads nor removes any better, it just stays stubbornly at 'impossible to get it clean enough to not leave a residue on your hands any time you handle it while still remaining hide-able because there's no oil slick effect'. I don't get it. And these days, my hair is always bunned, so the ends are always right up against my scalp. Yet the sebum still doesn't transfer to them, even then!

Is this just a weird never-ending partially-transitioned sort of thing, a year and a half later and still unchanged? Or is there a trick that I'm missing?

Hi there,

Are your ends actually dry? They look healthy from here. Or are they just not as sebum-rich as the top?

One thing I see that's possibly happening is over stimulation. You mention using the lice comb past the point when it feels "done". I suspect going past that point is just creating friction, which heats the hair and sebum, making it harder to move (liquid vs. wax), and stimulating the scalp to create more sebum. Here in your picture you gave yourself a long massage, and it's normal for your scalp to relax and ooze sebum.

Saying all that, my theory is to lay off a bit on how long you're doing everything. Do a shorter SMP session. Skip a day. Too much of anything is too much. It's about balance. your hair isn't going to balance out if you're constantly highly stimulating your scalp into releasing more sebum. Also, pay attention to if anything you eat tends to trigger a larger sebum output. Are you eating a whole foods diet? Or are you eating packaged foods? Etc..

[Bedhead]

I’m still here
Finally got a silk bonnet ! which I’m using during the day after smp-
Usually I doobie (tubi?) wrap under it, which continues to work well as a method to smooth things out and moisturize ends
In other news: still enjoying pine needle tea, in the process of brewing up some local cedar ointment
And procured a miswak which I learned about from you BH
Oh! A silk bonnet!?! I'm curious how that works out for you! Please let us know!
I love my miswak!


I don't know. Don't recall it from last year but that means nothing! ;) Currently am trying a braided Gibralter topknot and that seems to hold pretty well, but I miss my Orchid bun a lot.

No doubt this too shall pass! :D
I hope it does! Please let us know if or when it does. I really suspect there's some sort of shift happening there.

[SparrowWings]

Are your ends actually dry? They look healthy from here. Or are they just not as sebum-rich as the top?
A good question, for which I have no good answer. Historically, they were perpetually staticky, and ranged from felt-ok (at least comparatively!) to felt-like-straw. They're certainly better than that, now; felt-ok would be the low end. But I don't know what truly-not-dry really is, so I can't say if they're there or not. What I can say is that if I ever do any ponytail variations (the few times I've done it lately, it's been comet-tail rather than true ponytail, which keeps them at or above BSL), by the end of the day they feel super rough, but if I braid/bun for the night and next day, with or without any preening, they feel mostly ok again.


One thing I see that's possibly happening is over stimulation. You mention using the lice comb past the point when it feels "done". I suspect going past that point is just creating friction, which heats the hair and sebum, making it harder to move (liquid vs. wax), and stimulating the scalp to create more sebum. Here in your picture you gave yourself a long massage, and it's normal for your scalp to relax and ooze sebum.

Saying all that, my theory is to lay off a bit on how long you're doing everything. Do a shorter SMP session. Skip a day. Too much of anything is too much. It's about balance. your hair isn't going to balance out if you're constantly highly stimulating your scalp into releasing more sebum. Also, pay attention to if anything you eat tends to trigger a larger sebum output. Are you eating a whole foods diet? Or are you eating packaged foods? Etc..
Hmm. A couple parts I'm not sure, a couple I hadn't thought about. Excess friction is bad, but I thought warm was good? And wouldn't liquid be easier to spread than wax, making warm even better? Do I have that all backwards?

Also, as clarification, in this instance, yes, I actually had a crazy-long chunk of time for a change. Usually I have little to no time, and am lucky if I can do a little preening every 3-7 days. So while it may well have been an over-stimulation thing this time (but I had time, so decided to give it a shot and see what happened), that shouldn't apply most of the time. But perhaps the erraticness of it all is hurting me more than I realized, even if it isn't typically over- or under-stimulation in any given instance? In hindsight, the short-lived experiment with a steeply slanted wide-toothed comb did seem to have about as good a result as the lice comb sebum-wise (which still means lots of excess, just not as ridiculous), if not lint-wise, for the week that I tacked that on to the end of my morning detangling for 2-15 minutes most days. So maybe that really is all it takes, and the lice comb should only be a sporadic lint-removal step. But the lint comb is so much more convenient to clean; it's nicer for it to be the one that gets dirty! But it's harder to preen quickly with it, too.

At the same time, I did start figuring some of this out as the seasons started shifting, and that's already come up with some of you here, so maybe that's the biggest thing I'm "fighting" right now. I doubt it's food, at least. My diet is pretty stable, and mostly whole foods, and the days that it's not or that there's more oil or fat, I really haven't noticed a change, and I have paid attention to that in the hopes that something will have a discernible difference so I can at least see if there's something not to do!

It's just been really confusing me how the top can have/hold so much sebum and yet still refuse to even out with what's on the ends. Whether by having less on top, or more on the bottom, or a little of both, it seems like it ought to have been able to even out better.

[leayellena]

I did this for 2 days since the last wash (usually I do this 3 or 4 days after washing) and my hair looks good in a braid. I will wash it today and take the length shot ;)

[Bedhead]

SparrowWings, now I see it. This is what using a BBB did to my hair, over stimulation and removal of sebum on the lower part, resulting in frayed ends. Are you using your hands to preen, or just the combs? I'm thinking you're over using the combs and not using your hands enough. I only use the combs to clean, not to preen, but that is what works for me.



I did this for 2 days since the last wash (usually I do this 3 or 4 days after washing) and my hair looks good in a braid. I will wash it today and take the length shot ;)

How about not washing your hair? This is the NW/SO thread after all! ;)

[SparrowWings]

SparrowWings, now I see it. This is what using a BBB did to my hair, over stimulation and removal of sebum on the lower part, resulting in frayed ends. Are you using your hands to preen, or just the combs? I'm thinking you're over using the combs and not using your hands enough. I only use the combs to clean, not to preen, but that is what works for me.
I use my hands for the scritch and massage parts, the comb(s) for the clean and preen parts. I've never been able to figure out how to make preening with my hands do anything, top or bottom, except the one time I scraped carefully along a super-small (50 strands? Not sure, but it was TINY.) section, but as soon as it touched the other hair you'd never know, and because I have basically no nails (yes, I pick at them constantly...), that tiny thing took at least half an hour, and I just don't have that kind of time to do my whole head. So I went back to comb-preening. I have thought about getting/trying a soft BBB, but I'm not sure if I want to bother. I have tried a stiffer one, and it did nothing good, and various bad, so I very quickly gave up on it. I've looked for suggestions of how people do the preening with their hands, but it's always been either too vague to help, or focused on using nails to help scrape sebum into even levels, or a couple times saying just finger combing is enough, which I've tried as well, but like every other hand-preening attempt, it also does nothing useful, and doesn't even help it sit smoothly so I have to go back and comb it after anyhow. So I still haven't found any hand methods that would work for me. But that does sound like as likely a theory as anything else, at this point, so it'd be great to find some way out of it!

[Sarahlabyrinth]

Could someone do a video tutorial on how to scritch and preen, maybe? I am having trouble visualising how it works.

[Bedhead]

Okay, let's get you using those hands of yours!

I'm going to describe MY preening technique, along with the rest of my SMP regime in as much detail as possible. I will use layman's terms for everything. I call my preening technique "Milking" for obvious reasons, at least it's obvious once you know what I do. Keep in mind, most people find their own technique, so this is not the only way. In fact, maybe the rest of you could write your own description of what you do...?

Let's see. I start off with scritching. Nothing too intense, just thorough, only going over parts again if there seems to be an extra layer of sebum in the area. Next, I massage, enough to be thorough and to warm the sebum to the point of coating my fingers. Finally, I move to the length.

I start off simply running my knot comb through my hair to detangle anything, and follow with my medium toothed comb to remove basic dust and excess sebum. This is when the preening begins.

The amount of hair I preen with is about one cm squared on my scalp. It's not a lot, but with that amount it goes fast, yet thorough. I use both hands. I'm primarily right handed so my main preener is my right. So, starting up at the roots, right against my scalp, I squeeze the end section of my thumb against the first section of my pointy finger. The rest of my fingers are wrapped around the length, pressing it firmly against my palm, loosely enough to allow my hand to slide. Right at the scalp, I begin the move my thumb horizontally (across) the hairs and against my finger. It moves fast, like a laser printer, and my hand moves down the hair at a speed where my thumb crosses every section of hair on that length.

At the moment I reach a third of the way down, my left hand reaches up and grabs the section of hair at the roots and begins following the other hand, simply stroking the hair, only the thumb pokes through the length of hair, like it's detangling it. It all happens very fast - right, left, right left, the thumb of the left poking through at a different spot with each stroke.

Every few strokes I curl my lower finger even more so instead of a grip, the backs of my nails, not the tips, scrape against the hairs, smoothing them. Smoothing them, helps make the spreading of sebum go much easier.

I continue this milking routine until the hairs are smooth and the entire length feels the same in thickness, smoothness, and amount of sebum. then I twirl it a bit to keep it in place. When I first began, and the sebum hadn't reached the lower half of my hair, this took a long time per section. Now, since the hairs are evenly coated, it only takes a few strokes, but I still go until I get that even feel.

Next, I move to the next section, doing the exact same thing, except in the end I pull the first section into it, milk it a couple times, and then twirl the two sections all together. And onto the next, until my entire head is complete.

I wait, with my hair down while the scalp breathes and calms from the stimulation. About 15 minutes later, my scalp will slightly itch, asking for another quick scritch.

Where my lice comb comes in is if I happen to have done some work that might have dirtied my hair, or if my hair is beginning to feel a little heavy or slightly waxy, and for general cleaning every few days to remove dust, grime and excess sebum to that next level. I don't preen with it, and I use it after the two other combs.

And that's it! I hope this helps!

If you have any questions or need more detail on any part of my SMP process, please ask away and I'll do my best to answer them.

[Sarahlabyrinth]

Okay, let's get you using those hands of yours!

I'm going to describe MY preening technique, along with the rest of my SMP regime in as much detail as possible. I will use layman's terms for everything. I call my preening technique "Milking" for obvious reasons, at least it's obvious once you know what I do. Keep in mind, most people find their own technique, so this is not the only way. In fact, maybe the rest of you could write your own description of what you do...?

Let's see. I start off with scritching. Nothing too intense, just thorough, only going over parts again if there seems to be an extra layer of sebum in the area. Next, I massage, enough to be thorough and to warm the sebum to the point of coating my fingers. Finally, I move to the length.

I start off simply running my knot comb through my hair to detangle anything, and follow with my medium toothed comb to remove basic dust and excess sebum. This is when the preening begins.

The amount of hair I preen with is about one cm squared on my scalp. It's not a lot, but with that amount it goes fast, yet thorough. I use both hands. I'm primarily right handed so my main preener is my right. So, starting up at the roots, right against my scalp, I squeeze the end section of my thumb against the first section of my pointy finger. The rest of my fingers are wrapped around the length, pressing it firmly against my palm, loosely enough to allow my hand to slide. Right at the scalp, I begin the move my thumb horizontally (across) the hairs and against my finger. It moves fast, like a laser printer, and my hand moves down the hair at a speed where my thumb crosses every section of hair on that length.

At the moment I reach a third of the way down, my left hand reaches up and grabs the section of hair at the roots and begins following the other hand, simply stroking the hair, only the thumb pokes through the length of hair, like it's detangling it. It all happens very fast - right, left, right left, the thumb of the left poking through at a different spot with each stroke.

Every few strokes I curl my lower finger even more so instead of a grip, the backs of my nails, not the tips, scrape against the hairs, smoothing them. Smoothing them, helps make the spreading of sebum go much easier.

I continue this milking routine until the hairs are smooth and the entire length feels the same in thickness, smoothness, and amount of sebum. then I twirl it a bit to keep it in place. When I first began, and the sebum hadn't reached the lower half of my hair, this took a long time per section. Now, since the hairs are evenly coated, it only takes a few strokes, but I still go until I get that even feel.

Next, I move to the next section, doing the exact same thing, except in the end I pull the first section into it, milk it a couple times, and then twirl the two sections all together. And onto the next, until my entire head is complete.

I wait, with my hair down while the scalp breathes and calms from the stimulation. About 15 minutes later, my scalp will slightly itch, asking for another quick scritch.

Where my lice comb comes in is if I happen to have done some work that might have dirtied my hair, or if my hair is beginning to feel a little heavy or slightly waxy, and for general cleaning every few days to remove dust, grime and excess sebum to that next level. I don't preen with it, and I use it after the two other combs.

And that's it! I hope this helps!

If you have any questions or need more detail on any part of my SMP process, please ask away and I'll do my best to answer them.

Thanks for explaining this. How long does it take to do your whole head? And do you get the sebum right to your ends?

[Bedhead]

Thanks for explaining this. How long does it take to do your whole head? And do you get the sebum right to your ends?

Hi! At this point it takes me about 10-15 minutes, but I have an undercut now and my length is only shoulder length, so there's a lot less hair. When my hair was hip length, with a full head of hair, it took about 25 minutes. But this was way after I had transitioned.

In the beginning, one SMP session took me about 45 minutes to an hour, twice a day, with APL hair, because getting the sebum down to the ends is a challenge at that stage. After the 14 weeks it took for me to go through the initial transition, I SMP'd once a day, and continued for 45 minutes. This slowly got easier. The sebum stayed and it was more about evening things out, so only took about 35 minutes. Then I went through the next transition a year and a half later and my need to SMP was spread out to every couple days and my scalp had relaxed and shifted just that amount where I could SMP for 25 minutes, or even give myself a quickie 10 minutes SMP. Every couple weeks I'll still give myself a good 45 minute thorough SMP. (Times are approximate guestimations due to my hazy memory - it's been a while!)

[Sarahlabyrinth]

Hi! At this point it takes me about 10-15 minutes, but I have an undercut now and my length is only shoulder length, so there's a lot less hair. When my hair was hip length, with a full head of hair, it took about 25 minutes. But this was way after I had transitioned.

In the beginning, one SMP session took me about 45 minutes to an hour, twice a day, with APL hair, because getting the sebum down to the ends is a challenge at that stage. After the 14 weeks it took for me to go through the initial transition, I SMP'd once a day, and continued for 45 minutes. This slowly got easier. The sebum stayed and it was more about evening things out, so only took about 35 minutes. Then I went through the next transition a year and a half later and my need to SMP was spread out to every couple days and my scalp had relaxed and shifted just that amount where I could SMP for 25 minutes, or even give myself a quickie 10 minutes SMP. Every couple weeks I'll still give myself a good 45 minute thorough SMP. (Times are approximate guestimations due to my hazy memory - it's been a while!)

Gosh, I don't know that I would have the patience to do all that....plus with my knee length hair, it doesn't sound practical at all. Great that it works for you though!

[Bedhead]

Gosh, I don't know that I would have the patience to do all that....plus with my knee length hair, it doesn't sound practical at all. Great that it works for you though!

Keep in mind, I don't know about you, but when I have a full head of hair, even at APL, it takes my hair 5 hours to fully dry without a hairdryer, there's no washing time in the shower, so your shower is shorter, and people play with their hair anyway. A lot of people will SMP while watching a show, for instance, so no time lost.

[Sarahlabyrinth]

Keep in mind, I don't know about you, but when I have a full head of hair, even at APL, it takes my hair 5 hours to fully dry without a hairdryer, there's no washing time in the shower, so your shower is shorter, and people play with their hair anyway. A lot of people will SMP while watching a show, for instance, so no time lost.

Yes, I hadn't thought about that. I don't play with my hair though, as it's always either bunned or in a sleep cap, I try to avoid much manipulation if I can to protect it. It's all down to what we choose to do with our hair, and it's so interesting, the various ways of caring for it! :)

I would think that preening would involve a lot of manipulation and might cause breakage on my more fragile, older ends. I don't think I would want to risk it, myself.

[Bedhead]

Yes, I hadn't thought about that. I don't play with my hair though, as it's always either bunned or in a sleep cap, I try to avoid much manipulation if I can to protect it. It's all down to what we choose to do with our hair, and it's so interesting, the various ways of caring for it! :)

I would think that preening would involve a lot of manipulation and might cause breakage on my more fragile, older ends. I don't think I would want to risk it, myself.

I'm not a hair twirler either, but some do.

Actually, people have found their hair to be stronger, no more split ends or breakage, no more frizziness, and thicker, both the individual hairs and the hair in general. It's a very healing practice and none of the SMP techniques are meant to be done rigorously; on the contrary, it's all done gently with total awareness, so adjustments can be made as you develop your technique. It's healing enough that some use NW/SO as a short term healing break for their hair.

But I'm not here to convince you or anyone else to do it. You decide for yourself.

[Sarahlabyrinth]

I'm not a hair twirler either, but some do.

Actually, people have found their hair to be stronger, no more split ends or breakage, no more frizziness, and thicker, both the individual hairs and the hair in general. It's a very healing practice and none of the SMP techniques are meant to be done rigorously; on the contrary, it's all done gently with total awareness, so adjustments can be made as you develop your technique. It's healing enough that some use NW/SO as a short term healing break for their hair.

But I'm not here to convince you or anyone else to do it. You decide for yourself.

Well, i'm enjoying reading about all the benefits you mention and it's certainly food for thought. I have a question: Why not use water on your hair, though? Surely it's not bad for it?

[embee]

For me, why to not use water...

It took so *long* to dry. Which was *horrible* in winter - my house is old and it was drafty and chilly and unpleasant. I'd been doing WO for a while and thought, well, let's see what happens. And it was great. Yes, there was a brief period of "waxy" feeling but not a big problem. Probably because I was moving from WO.

I did not do all that much preening but brushed a lot with my Denman brush morning and every evening. I wore my hair up every day (work and convenience). If there was too much static (when it was really cold and dry) I'd spritz my hair with water first, so it didn't tangle itself up.

And by spring my hair was still happy, I was happy, so I kept on.

Now when I work out in my summer garden and get sweaty, I'll shower with my hair in a topknot covered with plastic bag, but the scalp gets a bit of a rinse. Not a wash, not a scrub.

[Bedhead]

The 5 hour dry time, along with winter, certainly is a factor, but what started me out, was I was having trouble with my hair going from auburn to a rusty yellow, sick colour. My hair was matting at the nook of my neck, and I couldn't figure out why. I went on a natural hair care journey, only to find improvements, but something was still not right. All of my work led me to WO, and eventually, I began hating wetting my hair, along with the waxiness that came with it. The one thing I did that changed that something, was filter my water. Alas! It became clear, I have crappy water, living in century old buildings with lead pipes and whatever else was in the water. It was either buy a filter for my shower every few months, use the bucket system with my Brita water like I was doing, or don't use the water. I chose not to use the water; I already hated wetting my hair. Besides that, I had already accidentally (lost track of time) not WO'd for almost 4 weeks, and my hair was doing great!
That's what altered my "Egh, that's going a bit too far for me" attitude toward NW/SO.

As I went along, I discovered other benefits to NW/SO, such as my hair doesn't need to adjust to the water when I travel, camping is a dream haircare-wise (seriously!), things like house paint simply pull out of my hair, if ever I'm in a drought situation or the water is not available suddenly (happened last fall here, the city water was turned off for about 4 days), I'll never need to adjust my haircare regime for that. Water can also be drying, so my hair never dries out, splits, frays, breaks, and even after a year of growth, the ends stayed thick. not to mention the very noticeable health benefits to the scalp, itself!

The sebum is anti-bacterial, anti-microbial, and protects the hair from pollution, and UVA rays.

Do I ever get the urge to plunge my head into some water, or have water cascading over my head, or walk in a summer's rain? Absolutely! But it's a rare moment, and when I do, I figure it's just time, and I tend to go for the rain. So, while I don't officially rinse/wash every once in a while, I have been out in the rain at least a few times per year, and I don't wear anything over my hair in the shower; I'm fine if I get slightly splashed on here and there.

In the end, my answer to your question is, I really don't think our hair is meant to get wet that often.

[proo]

Water only was harsh for my hair-
Not only did it create the dreaded helmet head with dry staticky ends, but the water itself (not hard) seemed too stripping.
It reminds me of the adage to drink absolutely as much water as you can for optimal health;
Not true and downright dangerous for some
Water isn’t inert or benign

[melikai]

Interesting...we also have somewhat poor quality and very hard water here, which actually has just led me to give up on WO, after trying for around 1.5 years. It's damaging my hair too much, and I feel like I'm having to do increasingly elaborate routines just to have my hair look at all decent, and it's still breaking off.
However, I only need to shampoo/cleanse my hair every 2-3 weeks or so, and wonder if inbetween I could do SO methods. Not sure if that would "count" as sebum-only, but :shrug:

I don't think I would ever fully do NW/SO, only because I don't want to focus on my hair much, and it seems that at least in the transitional time, it requires some dedication and time. As Sarahlabyrinth says, it's food for thought.

[Bedhead]

I focus on my hair less since I've been doing NW/SO. It's just the initial transition that takes that extra time.

Good point, proo!

[proo]

I rinse about once a month
Tweaking it constantly based on my hair’s desires
Always HIGHLY dilute so as to maintain the benefits of SO
In truth it’s unnecessary, but it’s fun and pampering
My silver hair positively gleams afterward
But yes, I totally ascribe to and identify as SO

[SparrowWings]

45 minutes twice a day? Good grief! I'm lucky if I can get 15 minutes in a typical day, and that includes take-down, detangling, and putting back up. The longer sessions, maybe once or twice a week, might be 30-45 minutes. The 2 hour chunk I had a couple weeks back was super-rare. Though, like Saralabyrinth, I don't tend to play with my hair either, and when it's down, I can't really do anything else between it getting in the way and not being able to see with my glasses off, which also cancels out the very short time I ever spend in front of a TV.

Timing aside, thanks for the detailed description, Bedhead! I think you've explained parts of it before, but not quite that in-depth. How does the cross-rubbing not wind up with your hair all knotted, though? Especially with yours being wavier/towards curly? And I'm still not sure I quite follow the part with your palm. For one, I'm not sure if I would be able to scrape with my nails in any configuration, they're that short, but even if they were longer, how does that work? It seems like if anything, the hair would end up under your nails, rather than scraped by them? And how do you have the hair go along the back of the nails on those passes without coming out of your hand altogether? How quickly did you start seeing/feeling this milking make a difference? Was it within the first session, or did it take multiple days (longer?) to decide it was helping?

embee, what type of Denman brush do you have? Presumably it's a BBB, but is it soft or stiff? 100% boar, or a boar/nylon blend? I did try a stiffer one for a very short time, but it did nothing good. I have seen others posting that one version was awful but the other was great, though, and that it varied by person, so I have wondered if it's worth getting a soft one to try as well... What do you do to keep it clean? Have you found any easy-ish/quick-ish way to get the trapped lint and gunk out of the bristles?


And on a different note, I had a strange detangling/cleaning session yesterday... I was out in the sun all day, and it was a bit dusty. While showering, the water splashed around more than usual, so my hair also saw more water than it has in a year and a half. It was mostly the scalp and ends, and definitely not dripping, but solidly wet. I didn't have time to wait for it to dry, though, so went about detangling carefully anyhow, which historically was a BAD idea... It didn't give me any trouble at all. Aside from being wet, it was almost the same as detangling dry has been lately. So I gave the lice comb a try, also no problem. But the sebum and gunk that came out was positively gummy. Sticky and gross. I couldn't get it to rub off my fingers, much less the comb, so I promptly washed both, and after that it seemed ok, but it was strange. It also felt like it was removing/spreading better than ever, though, and it does feel cleaner this morning, though I haven't done a proper detangle yet for a fully-valid comparison. I'm going to have to investigate this further, but if the answer is moistening my hair slightly before preening, with actual water instead of even natural scalp oils, and if it needs so little water that it's nearly dry by the time I'm done de-linting 15 minutes later, that's not so bad. Not quite NW/SO, but still not a sopping wet head. We'll see!

[embee]

embee, what type of Denman brush do you have? Presumably it's a BBB, but is it soft or stiff? 100% boar, or a boar/nylon blend? I did try a stiffer one for a very short time, but it did nothing good. I have seen others posting that one version was awful but the other was great, though, and that it varied by person, so I have wondered if it's worth getting a soft one to try as well... What do you do to keep it clean? Have you found any easy-ish/quick-ish way to get the trapped lint and gunk out of the bristles?

I use the Denman D3. Or a Sally's store clone. It's like running many combs through at once. Love the feel on my skin.

Never did like a BBB, never felt like it got to the scalp - and my hair is not thick nor curly. Odd.

I used to have linty hair, but not anymore, not that I notice. Sure there is shed hair in the brush and I clean it out, but it's not dusty like it used to be years ago. No clue what happened there but I like it. :)

Note that I am not freaking out about some breakage.

[Bedhead]

45 minutes twice a day? Good grief! I'm lucky if I can get 15 minutes in a typical day, and that includes take-down, detangling, and putting back up. The longer sessions, maybe once or twice a week, might be 30-45 minutes. The 2 hour chunk I had a couple weeks back was super-rare. Though, like Saralabyrinth, I don't tend to play with my hair either, and when it's down, I can't really do anything else between it getting in the way and not being able to see with my glasses off, which also cancels out the very short time I ever spend in front of a TV.

Timing aside, thanks for the detailed description, Bedhead! I think you've explained parts of it before, but not quite that in-depth. How does the cross-rubbing not wind up with your hair all knotted, though? Especially with yours being wavier/towards curly? And I'm still not sure I quite follow the part with your palm. For one, I'm not sure if I would be able to scrape with my nails in any configuration, they're that short, but even if they were longer, how does that work? It seems like if anything, the hair would end up under your nails, rather than scraped by them? And how do you have the hair go along the back of the nails on those passes without coming out of your hand altogether? How quickly did you start seeing/feeling this milking make a difference? Was it within the first session, or did it take multiple days (longer?) to decide it was helping?



45 twice a day was for the first 12 - 14 weeks. I've been at this for well over 6 years, so that's not happening anymore, not even close.

The hair is held taught and therefore straight, the crossover is gentle and ends up at a diagonal since your stroking your hair as the thumb moves. The nails thing, the fingers are slightly pointed up, and are stroking the hair into the palm. The palm is also preening.

I felt the difference immediately and results within 2 or 3 days.

[Bedhead]

Well, it's time. I'm getting the urge to do a wash/rice, and since I can't eat rice anymore, I don't have any in the house, so I'm going to try a fermented rye rinse instead. This should be happening before the end of the week, so I'll let you know how my hair reacts and how it adapts afterward.

[Bedhead]

So, my fermented rye water wash happened today, and it had similar affects to the rice wash. I did a write-up on it in the Fermented rice water thread:
Here's an excerpt that is relevant to the NW/SO crowd:

I did notice, however, that my scalp itched a bit while the rye water sat on my hair, in the same manner it does when I've been SMPing and my scalp releases old sebum and needs an extra scritch (very gentle scratching), so I scritched very gently, to find sebum that had basically melted into almost a gel, as oppose to wax-like. I'm assuming it's doing that on the hair shaft as well.
https://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=134907&page=40&p=3555738&viewfull=1#post3555738

I'll let you know the repercussions, if any, over the next few days.

Hope you're all well and enjoying the season! :)

[Bedhead]

So, it's been a week or so, and nothing too exciting happened. My hair went a bit limp and felt heavyish on the second day, and then it just went back to normal, lifting at the roots and feeling soft and silky. I didn't really SMP since the fermented rye water wash, and am now just feeling the need to.

So that's it! Hope all is well in your world!

[lithostoic]

I wish I could do this! I love the idea of not using anything harmful for the environment.

[embee]

Now it is summer here and I'm finding that I need to do some scalp rinse about once a week. Too much sweat working outdoors in the heat. Length is in a topknot and does not get wet. This is still working well for me. Not sure how long I've been doing this - a couple of years? Three? Lots of brushing tends to keep things in line.

[proo]

Update: self trim to APL
Fermented rice rinse once /month

Interesting how the trim 6ish” has cut down on my low shed rate to bout zero

[Beckstar]

Every time I see this thread title I read it as NSFW thread. ;)

[emilyruthus]

Hi everyone! I'm new to nw/so, and have been lurking here for a few weeks :) (thank you all for the awesome info). My last wash (full shampoo/conditioner) was three weeks ago, and since then I have done nothing but BBB and smp, and I'm starting to see some hope for a non-greasy future. Woohoo! However, I've come across an issue, and am wondering if anyone can help me:

Does anyone deal with kinked hair from sleeping on it funny? Particularly right next to the scalp? I sleep with my hair down, since it's quite short (just below my chin...I know, I'm an imposter on the long hair community...), and both sides have spots that are now sticking up right against my scalp - kind of like what causes a "rooster tail". The length of my hair falls back down and covers up the funny part, but it is getting quite uncomfortable. Normally, washing my hair would remove this short of thing, but I'm going for the whole "no water" thing now.

Anyway, I hope that made sense, and I hope one of you awesome ladies has some advice for me.

Thanks!

[embee]

I did not have that rooster tail problem, but can easily imagine how it would be for short hair - my bangs used to do this (in my other life, before long hair) To be honest, I came to NW/SO from WO, and my hair was already long.

If this were my problem, I'd see about wetting that little kinked part, probably by putting a wet wash cloth against it until it settled. Then BBB to encourage it to lie down again? :)

[proo]

You could try wrapping your hair, either while you sleep or after for a bit.

[Bedhead]

Lithostoic, no one's stopping you!

How are you liking the FRW, proo? Very interesting on the trim. Keep us updated on if that continues. I have to agree though, when I "trimmed" off the 2 ft of hair, I have virtually no shedding, once in a blue moon I'll find a hair now.

Beckstar!!! :pirate:

Hi emilyruthus, Is a "rooster tail" a "cow lick"? Are you growing your hair? I'd say get that hair down with a spritz, not too much, or water, then do something like the scarf or a braid to train it down. If it's more of a hair cleavage thing ( this happened to me for a while), just keep going, it will go away.

[emilyruthus]

Thanks for your suggestions! I'll give them a try. I'd never considered that these spots of funky hair might be cowlicks, but they may be, now that you mention it, Bedhead. I think I'll leave them alone for a few more days and see what happens.

[Bedhead]

So a rooster tail isn't a cowlick then? Ha ha! I honestly don't know what that is.

Also, hair cleavage happens for some in the beginning months. It goes away for most form what I have seen.

[FrayedFire]

My hair is still doing great, I've can't remember my ends being this nice, I can hardly even feel the difference when I run my fingers along the length, and I'm like... not doing anything except using a bristle boar wet brush, and repeatedly cleaning it when I use it. It's amazing, gets the lint and dust out of my hair like nobody's business, and I don't have to preen anymore, though I still do sometimes, cause it feels good. ^^

[Bedhead]

That's the magic of NW/SO, FrayedFire! Glad it's working so well for you!

[SparrowWings]

Checking in again, a couple months later, and I think the water was the answer. After the accidental over-splashing in the shower, I tried intentionally misting the surface with a spray bottle and comb-preening/removing the gummy wet sebum. I did that three times over the next couple weeks, and for the first two, the ends started looking/feeling better, and the roots were less over-coated. The third one still felt ok at the roots, but the ends started feeling stripped again. So the next time I skipped the water, and both roots and ends were happy. I haven't used water again since then, but the comb still seems to be working better than before, and the last couple times it's even found some spreadable sebum for the ends.

The new process, only different in the details from the old, is that I now comb-preen as far as my arm comfortably reaches, making no effort to go all the way to the ends. I do a reasonably thorough but quick job all over my head, letting everything build up on the comb. One side, the leading side, has gunkier sebum that I wipe off and toss. The backside has cleaner sebum, so I reverse the comb and lightly run it through the ends until the comb is mostly clean. I'll repeat that process another time or two, as necessary. I still only do it once every week or two, depending on when it starts feeling too gross or acting too grabby-tangly, and when I have time. And I still do a reasonably thorough not-quite-scritching rough massage each morning before detangling. It may not be exactly where it should be, but it seems to be working well enough.

I did try the hand-preening technique again, Bedhead, but I can't seem to make it do anything. It's too uncomfortable to pinch my hand tightly enough to make the nails actually touch the hair, and it's still not tight enough to do any amount of scraping. And even though the roots-to-hand are held taut, below that likes grabbing at any other hair it can reach and making it impossible to glide down the chunk in my hand. I can see how it might work (aside from the clenching comfort thing), even for me, with substantially shorter hair, but at FTL+, I think I'm going to stick with combs. I did appreciate the thorough explanation, though!

I may try a soft BBB at some point, too. I haven't really decided. I know the stiff one I have didn't do anything good, but I'm still curious. We'll see if I end up buying one.

[Bedhead]

Hmm, I have a feeling you're not understanding what I wrote, and I can't write it any clearer than what I have, sorry. There's nothing about my technique that requires you to hold anything tight, especially to an extent that it's uncomfortable, The nail thing is just a stroking thing in place of your palm. Curl fingers in toward you palm and stroke your hair. Hope that helps a bit, but you might want to re-read what I wrote from an easier, more gentle perspective.

My personal experience with a softer bbb is it tends to make my hair quite wet looking.

Glad you're finding something that works for you!

[leayellena]

It's nice to go back to your routine and NW/SO is one of them. The weather in Germany is cooler than that of Romania so I can get away with washing my hair once a week again.

[proo]

As I’ve mentioned before, preening in medium sized twists works great for me:
It keeps things organized and by the time I get to the end of a twist numerous passes have been made and the ends are well moisturized.
My fingernails are very short and not involved.
I continue scouring naturalista YouTubes for twist styles
Aaand because it’s my beloved rabbit hole tbh.

[embee]

I never did preen much with my fingers and nails. Used a wide tooth comb. Eventually I just went with my Denman brush, but it needed cleaning out rather often. Obviously it was picking up plenty of sebum to move, especially if the air was warm and damp - like after a shower or summer morning in the garden. Personally don't care for a BBB.

[Bedhead]

What's the difference between a BBB and a Denman, isn't the Denman a type of BBB? Or am I mistaken?

[SparrowWings]

As I’ve mentioned before, preening in medium sized twists works great for me:
It keeps things organized and by the time I get to the end of a twist numerous passes have been made and the ends are well moisturized.
My fingernails are very short and not involved.
I continue scouring naturalista YouTubes for twist styles
Aaand because it’s my beloved rabbit hole tbh.
Learning how to do decent twists/rope braids is on my bucket list; I've managed them a few times, but it's really slow and arduous thanks to lack of practice. That said, I have found that French/Dutch braids after a comb-preening session work really well, especially if I do two of them. But I rarely have the time for a single one, much less to part my hair and do two, so I don't consider it part of the routine, just a helpful bonus when I get the chance. It's the same concept as your twists, though.


What's the difference between a BBB and a Denman, isn't the Denman a type of BBB? Or am I mistaken?
If I'm remembering correctly, embee uses one of their nylon-bristle brushes, rather than one of their BBBs? They make both.

[proo]

To my knowledge a denman is plastic with medium spaced teeth-
Curlies use it to define

[Bedhead]

Hmph, all this time I thought it was an expensive brand of BBB. Thanks!

[embee]

What's the difference between a BBB and a Denman, isn't the Denman a type of BBB? Or am I mistaken?

https://www.denmanbrushus.com/product/d3-medium-7-row-styling-brush.html

Thick nylon "bristles" like comb teeth. Feels *wonderful* on my scalp, just lovely. :)

... and it is not expensive.

[Bedhead]

https://www.denmanbrushus.com/product/d3-medium-7-row-styling-brush.html

Thick nylon "bristles" like comb teeth. Feels *wonderful* on my scalp, just lovely. :)

... and it is not expensive.

Thanks! once I saw the grooming ones with the red backing, I was like, "Oooohhh! Thoooose!"

My friend's family had one when we were growing up.

[EliseMarie]

Im on day 7 of sebum only hair care. My hair looks and feels really nice. It is not frizzy or dry and I think I have sebum on the entire length now. It was pretty crazy to see how oily it got when I pulled the oil down and even more amazing how it just kind of absorbs back into my hair leaving my hair softer and less frizzy by the day. (Layered barely shoulder length hair). I have been scritching and preening in the morning and bbb'ing before bed. I have never gone this long without washing my hair! Also my scalp feels really good to with the daily massaging.

Hopefully my scalp adjust quickly and I can just carry on with this method. The one question I have is what do you use the combs for? I want to add it in to my routine but not sure what the combing does.

***edit to say I just went swimming and got my hair wet, so headed over to the WO thread. I can definitely see why I would need a comb now. Do some of you ever let their hair get wet?

[TwilightMermaid]

Is there any way to refresh curls on this method or do you kind of let it turn into that uniform brush wave look? To my understanding, I'd brush and eventually, all the oils would be there so would that act as my "curl definer" and would they eventually separate again into curls? I love this minimal way of taking care of my hair and if I wasn't able to do this I'd definitely be water only.:o

[saff.cel]

Can some one explain to me what the benefit is of a wooden comb vs. some other material? I like my plastic comb because I can really, really clean it, I would think that wood and horn would be much harder to clean. How often are you SO and NW ladies washing your brushes if you have them, and how are you doing it? Am I crazy for not wanting to use shampoo on my brushes if I don't want to use it on my hair?

[leayellena]

I don´t know why but my scalp loves nw/so and wo better than shampooing. I feel like shampoo either cleans my scalp way too much or at all. finishing my bottle of shampoo and then I think I will stick with nw/so, wo and co-wash in summer... strangely it took me years to understand this fact...

[proo]

I clean my wide-tooth plastic comb with boiling water

[SparrowWings]

Can some one explain to me what the benefit is of a wooden comb vs. some other material? I like my plastic comb because I can really, really clean it, I would think that wood and horn would be much harder to clean. How often are you SO and NW ladies washing your brushes if you have them, and how are you doing it? Am I crazy for not wanting to use shampoo on my brushes if I don't want to use it on my hair?
Plastic causes static for me, no matter what the weather, and now that I've spent some time with the wooden and horn combs, the plastic didn't actually work that well (for detangling or preening), either. It wasn't awful at detangling, but not great, and it was nearly useless for preening. That said, I do still have my fine-toothed plastic comb, because it does the best job at smoothing the roots of a sleep-frizzed braid if I'm running too late in the morning to redo the whole thing. It also does the best at cleaning the toothbrush, which brings us to your next question...

I don't wash the combs quite as often as I should (There's so much stuff on the continuous to-do list that I can never do anything as often as I should!), but it probably averages 7-10 days. Whenever it looks too dirty, or doesn't seem to be helping my hair, or I just did a major preening session, or I have time. I wash all three in a row. Wide tooth first, run it under warm water to get it wet, get the toothbrush wet, apply soap (in my case, hand soap, but I imagine anything would work) to toothbrush, quickly run it across the comb tines to spread it, then scrub between each tine, flip the comb over, and scrub each tine again, and rinse thoroughly. I usually use the toothbrush to scrub while rinsing, to make sure all the soap is removed. Repeat with the horn comb (fine toothed), and again with the plastic. When I'm rinsing the plastic, I use the teeth to help "scrub" the toothbrush bristles and make sure they get clean as well. If it still looks dirty after rinsing the comb, I'll put a tiny bit more soap on the toothbrush and quick-scrub the comb to make sure the soap gets all through the toothbrush, then re-rinse/scrub both. Then I towel-dry the combs, stick the wood and horn ones into my hair (not actually combing) a couple times to make sure there's no major moisture caught between the tines, and let it all air dry for whatever's left.

I don't use brushes anymore, but I do remember them being a nightmare to try and clean as a kid, even with shampoo. They just couldn't be scrubbed properly to remove all the grime from all the little snags and crevices and surfaces. My mom liked making sudsy soap water in the sink and dumping the brushes in to let them sit for hours untouched, but I was never convinced that did much of anything since they always came out looking the same as they went in, just wet! But scrubbing combs with a toothbrush works wonderfully.

[saff.cel]

Plastic causes static for me, no matter what the weather, and now that I've spent some time with the wooden and horn...

Thank you so much for your in depth reply. I’m scrubbing my plastic comb with a little scrub brush similar to a toothbrush, and I’m pleased with how it leaves my comb. I had a horn comb at work I’d been neglecting (read: no monthly lanolin) and I recently tried cleaning it manually and ended up with a regrettable amount of lint in my hair. I’ve just ordered a little Mason Pearson BBB, so I’m hoping to find a good brush cleansing technique. Any more info on the virtues of wooden combs would be appreciated, especially links to the ones you ladies are using.

[TwilightMermaid]

Can you do this with curly hair?

[leayellena]

Can you do this with curly hair?

of course! with every hair type from straight to kinky! <:)

[EC]

I am new to this forum, really not sure how I found it?? I have longish hair, almost to my waist. My hair has been uncut for most of my adult life. I am a part of a group of believers that hold to a tradition based on the New Testament that a woman should have long, uncut hair. So I have seen many beautiful heads of hair. Really gorgeous... My hair at one time was below my hips, but had emergency surgery and lost so much of it. I know a lot of the ladies in church never wash their hair everyday... Not sure of everyone's routine. I'm getting close to 60... And I still love my hair. I don't use any heat on it, never was a fan of blow drying... Or electric curlers. But in these later years, I have re thought a lot of my living practices. From industrial food, and clothing, cosmetics and everyday living ... Household items. I do not like the way we have been taught to use so many harmful products and chemicals. I was washing my hair 2x a week, for many years, and then to 1x a week, then to every couple weeks. I found that the longer I went, my hair would feel more "healthy" ... of course sometimes it would feel a little oily... I am a knitter and love, love wool. The REAL kind, from a sheep. I had a couple wool hats and found this last winter that when I wore those lovely hats it did something wonderful for my hair, liked it just cleaned it. Not sure how, but my hair and head was softer and lustrous after wearing my hats. It helped me so much this winter that I just didn't wash my hair. And wanted to see what would happen. So here I am, learning here... And glad to find others on a same journey... ����

[Bedhead]

Yes. Love my wool toques! It's true, there's a cleansing or balancing that happens with them.

Welcome EC!

And welcome to all you newcomers!!! :cheese:



TwilightMermaid , The amount your hair curls will be a lot less, but yes, you can do it.

[Beeboo123]

I got lazy and just stopped washing my hair after 21 July, so i think i belong here now. Strangely, there was no adjustment period for me at all! My hair feels greasy maybe once every couple of weeks, but then i just have to comb and braid it, then it gets fine the next day. I miss my wurly hair though, it is much straighter now

[lithostoic]

Do you guys purposely not get your hair wet, like at all? I would love to try this but I live in a rainy place and getting wet is inevitable even with an umbrella. Plus brushing/combing pulls out my waves so I often dampen my hair to make my waves come back afterward.

[TwilightMermaid]

I got lazy and just stopped washing my hair after 21 July, so i think i belong here now. Strangely, there was no adjustment period for me at all! My hair feels greasy maybe once every couple of weeks, but then i just have to comb and braid it, then it gets fine the next day. I miss my wurly hair though, it is much straighter now
To fix that you could WO wash whenever you feel like wearing it wurly. That's what I did for a while, but transfered to full WO because of my frizz.

[embee]

Do you guys purposely not get your hair wet, like at all? I would love to try this but I live in a rainy place and getting wet is inevitable even with an umbrella. Plus brushing/combing pulls out my waves so I often dampen my hair to make my waves come back afterward.

I do not worry about it. When I take a shower I put my hair in a topknot and cover that with a plastic bag. My scalp always gets wet, and that's ok with me - partly because I sometimes get zits at the hairline. Once or twice a year I *may* have a complete rinse of everything, like WO.

If I were to swim in a chlorinated pool or the ocean I would certainly rinse my hair. It's just the shampoo conditioner oiling stuff that is completely omitted in my regular routine.

Seems to me WO and NW/SO are loosely defined, and if you do not rinse or wash your hair as part of your routine, then you've gone NW/SO. ;) YMMV

[Bedhead]

I don't bother with anything covering my head in the shower. If it splashes a bit, it splashes. And if I get caught in the rain, I let me hair down and let it get drenched, which happens about twice a year. Maybe that's why I don't feel the need to actively rinse?

[lithostoic]

Thanks guys! Getting more and more curious haha.

[elfynity]

Hi everyone, I really am happy I have found this thread - I have transitioned into SO without actually really realising it. I last WO 2 weeks ago and was only doing it because I thought I had to. This thread has really changed my view and I really want to try out this method and see what results I get.

So here goes. My sebum production now is actually quite slow. My roots get greased up nicely, but my ends are dry and frizzy and it's not good. I read in this thread that using a BBB can actually cause ends to become dry! I have dry ends and use my BBB at least about 100 times day to try to spread the sebum. So what I have been doing is leaving organic conditioner on my ends so that they aren't so dry.

I have just done a full preening, whic has taken about an hour, following Bedhead's example and am hoping now that the sebum wont be so concentrated on the roots and will start to move down to my ends. If I can't get my ends healthy, my hair just isn't going to grow.

I am a firm believer in natural methods so am excited to transition to this. I just want to know from others who are using this method if preening actually does get the sebum down to the ends and if using a BBB is actually damaging.

Thanks so much!

[elfynity]

Hi everyone, I really am happy I have found this thread - I have been actually doing a kind of SO without actually really realising it. I wash my hair with water every 2 to 3 weeks. At that point the roots get too oily and I need to wash. This thread has really changed my view and I really want to try out this method and see what results I get.

So here goes. My sebum production now is actually quite slow. My roots get greased up nicely, but my ends are dry and frizzy and it's not good. I read in this thread that using a BBB can actually cause ends to become dry! Shocker for me, but I think this may be true as I have dry ends and have been using my BBB at least about 100 times day for the last 5 months or so. So what I have been doing is leaving organic conditioner on my ends so that they aren't so dry - which has been helping, but I have to apply everyday.

I have just done a full preening, which has taken about an hour, following Bedhead's example and am hoping now that the sebum wont be so concentrated on the roots and will start to move down to my ends. If I can't get my ends healthy, my hair just isn't going to grow.
EDIT: I have spent the morning preening again and the sebum travelled down to my ends!!! There are still dry parts, but alot of it actually moved from top to bottom.

I am a firm believer in natural methods so am excited to hopefully transition to this. I just want to know from others who are using this method if preening actually does get the sebum down to the ends for them and if using a BBB is actually drying.

Also just wanted to add here that I could probably never be totally SO only. I will swim in the sea over summer, and sometimes I will put too much oil on my hair and will need to wash it out (and then I use cornstarch shampoo) - but the main emphasis is to try to be NW / SO as much as possible. What could be better for my hair than my own hair oils?

Thanks so much!

[elfynity]

My hair is a bit oily in places and I am considering doing a WO or a cornstarch shampoo on my roots. I will see how the day progresses after some intense preening.

[Bedhead]

Hi elfynity,

If you are serious about doing NW/SO I wouldn't recommend any sort of dry shampoo or corn starch on your roots. It will just create a negative, sebummy cycle.

It takes people, on average, about 12 to 14 weeks to transition. The 3rd to 10th weeks are the hardest. I did the same as you, with accidentally going for 2 weeks without washing and finding myself here, but then the next few weeks were challenging. If you want to WO that's up to you, obviously, but if you have the luxury to allow your scalp to find its balance, I'd say at least try some SMPing a couple times a day and using material, either through a pranah(sp?) (textiles woven through your hair), a toque, a sleeping cap, or a scarf, or just wiping your hair to help absorb the excess sebum and spread it out as your transition. And yes, the sebum really does spread down to the tips eventually.

As for the bbb, there seems to be mixed results. you might have to figure that out for yourself.

[Bedhead]

I washed my hair with a literal drop of shampoo today for the Autumn equinox. It felt right. And now I'll go on with my life.

Have a great day!

[leayellena]

I started it since yesterday on the 3rd day after wash day. My hair looks fine really. I will cinnabun it and tuck it into a beanie. Winter's coming early this year?

[elfynity]

Hi Bedhead, thank you for getting back to me. I have been leaving organic honey conditioner in the ends for moisture and using the tiniest amount of oil through the length, and this coupled with the sebum production turned into a big greasy / oily mess and I felt that I needed to cornstarch shampoo wash yesterday, which I did. It was a very gentle wash, so it just took out the main buildup but it is not a clean slate so to speak!

I am going to keep going with the SMP. I really enjoy the preening part alot, and love how my hair scalp and hair feels afterward. It's really great! I am going to have to keep putting conditioner on my ends because I just cannot leave them dry. They are still quite nourished though as only a miniscule amount of cornstarch shampoo rinsed through them in my wash yesterday.

I would like to stretch as far as I can go, and then cornstarch shampoo with an even more diluted dose and perhaps get to NW / SO, or really close to it, without having to transition cold turkey. I am trying to keep as much of my natural sebum on my hair as possible because I know how freaking amazing it is for hair!

[Bedhead]

So, I am now simply just "washing" my hair now every morning with a bit of combing. What I mean by that is I use the same technique of washing my hair as if I was washing with shampoo, so a little bit of massage, and a little rubbing, and a little stroking / a super quick preening. I comb it out, and voila! Beautiful hair! It takes all of a minute or two. I do it again if going out in the evening, if I'm wearing my hair down.

I should note for all you people just considering this, that this is only possible because I've been doing this for so long (almost 7 years?). So, don't think you can do this after a few weeks. My scalp is fully adjusted, so just goes with it.


elfynity, I really suggest you stay away from the dry shampoo if you want to do this. As far as I've seen, in 9 years of this thread, anyone who has ever used it never got through their transition and moved onto something else. proo had good success in using a drop or two if a clarifier heavily diluted in lots of water and slowly stretched it out, but she also used other things like textiles and a crown braid, tucking the ends in good to get them some sebum.

[calmyogi]

This thread has been a interesting read. I have been lurking, and have read through every page the last couple of days lol. I got a shower filter and started WO washing again, but I want to try and stretch out the rinsed as far as I can. Currently I am 9 days away from my last shampoo, and about 6 away from my last water rinse. I have already stretched washes and experimented with WO in the past so this last transition hasn’t really been that bad. My hair is about waist length and the sebum seems to be about half way down my length at this time. I have been using my MP BBB pocket size to exfoliate my scalp and pull the sebum. I’m not sure if it is causing any excess damage. My observation would be no? I think it is because the ends just aren’t coated yet, so they seem dry. I was curious how long I should give the BBB a chance before I give up on it not helping my ends?

But, my real question for this thread is, is there a quick throrough way to scritch and preen that isn’t quite as long as Bedheads? Sorry if this is kinda a stupid question.... I just don’t have 45 minutes to a hour, twice a day, to spare these days.

[Bedhead]

But, my real question for this thread is, is there a quick throrough way to scritch and preen that isn’t quite as long as Bedheads? Sorry if this is kinda a stupid question.... I just don’t have 45 minutes to a hour, twice a day, to spare these days.

Everyone wants it quick! Getting the sebum spread evenly and helping your scalp breathe are keys to your success. Your hair history, health, stress level, diet, hair type, and scalp are all going to be factors on how long it takes you to SMP and eventually to transition in the end. No one can say exactly how long a good SMPing will take, you just have to feel it. Your hair will let you know when you're done. Over time, that time will get shorter and shorter, but in the beginning, it's like teaching an old dog new tricks.

It's been said many times, "NW/SO is not for the lazy."

[SparrowWings]

Holy weather change! In the span of a couple days early last week, I went from maybe being a bit greasy-looking if I get a little lax periodically, to having an entire head full of flakes if I don't at least SM thoroughly every 2-3 days. I'm not honestly sure if it's a really thin layer of dry skin or dry waxy sebum (I'm guessing the sebum, though), but my word has it been a dramatic, fast shift. If I keep up with the SM part, the preening can stay about the same as ever, but if I wait, I end up having to do a bit more preening anyhow, just to help get the loosened flakes out. Though, I think I'll have to increase the preening regardless, because this time around, the ends definitely seemed drier than they have been. And once the careful increasingly-staticky detangling switched to plain old preening, oh my did it fix itself up quickly! It was great how well that worked, just a couple strokes and it was almost static-free again! We'll have to see if that remains enough all winter, but it seems decent enough for right now, at least.

I don't remember if I'm starting my second year, or third, but I definitely don't remember this last year. I don't remember the weather going from one extreme to the other so fast last year either, though. Even my eyebrows have been flaky this past week. I don't think I've ever had that!

How are all the rest of you doing?

[Bedhead]

Yep, I too experience static just last night. I hadn't experienced this since going NW/SO, other than when going home for Christmas, but that's one of the driest places in the world. I just threw everything into a braid and let it be.

I have to say, I really love dry cutting my hair on NW/SO. Once I transitioned, it's just cut/trim and just go on with life!

Hope everyone is doing well!

[SwanFeathers]

Well, i'm enjoying reading about all the benefits you mention and it's certainly food for thought. I have a question: Why not use water on your hair, though? Surely it's not bad for it?

For me, when I'm SO and then try to rinse it, it turns into a terrible tangled mess! It dries out my already dryish hair and takes away all my slip, leaving me with a wax ball that takes days to dry. I rinse every coule of months just because I have pollen allergies and its always a bad day :(

[SwanFeathers]

So I finally found a wood comb in my area, can those of you who have been doing SO for awhile tell me if it is suitable for scritching? Last time I used a tightly spaced metal flea comb, but it snags on the edges and I'd love to reap the benefits of wood.
https://i.postimg.cc/DSGBhXT8/20181217-154759.jpg (https://postimg.cc/DSGBhXT8)

[HAJ]

Hi All :)

So I've been SO since the beginning of October this year. Before that I was WO since July and before that various different types of no poo 'washes' and rinses for years. I've been following this thread for a few weeks now and have found it very helpful! My question is about 2 weeks ago I was still pretty oily all over my hair and this week suddenly my hair looks stringy and is staticy and super dry in a mid length section and again at the very tips (my hair is BSL). When I preen may hair last week I'm fairly sure I had all the length coated fully and evenly. Then by the weekend or so I started having chinks of extremely bone dry sections in the mid section of the length and on the ends. By the end of my preening it'd be coated again but, it would soon dry out in these areas again. My diet hasn't really changed and the I get this in these areas regardless of what hairstyle I try.

I was wondering if this is common? I did self cut/trim my hair at the end of last week would that have dried my hair suddenly? Or would this maybe the winter weather, monthly hormone changes or a sign I am preening to much suddenly? Today I had to oil it in parts because I cannot cover certain sections near the front of my head cause of how dry it had become and how little oil that area makes.

Is it advisable to oil the hair often? I am not opposed to doing so, I just worry that suddenly I may have too much and have a hard time cleaning it up again if this is likely a temporary thing. Or, if its caused because I should really back off the preening I do, or cause I should switch up my tools a bit.... Both of which I have been trying out to see how that helps.

But, I figure it doesn't hurt to ask you wonderful people, as well as to say 'hi' and join the group ;)

[SwanFeathers]

Hi All :)

So I've been SO since the beginning of October this year. Before that I was WO since July and before that various different types of no poo 'washes' and rinses for years. I've been following this thread for a few weeks now and have found it very helpful! My question is about 2 weeks ago I was still pretty oily all over my hair and this week suddenly my hair looks stringy and is staticy and super dry in a mid length section and again at the very tips (my hair is BSL). When I preen may hair last week I'm fairly sure I had all the length coated fully and evenly. Then by the weekend or so I started having chinks of extremely bone dry sections in the mid section of the length and on the ends. By the end of my preening it'd be coated again but, it would soon dry out in these areas again. My diet hasn't really changed and the I get this in these areas regardless of what hairstyle I try.

I was wondering if this is common? I did self cut/trim my hair at the end of last week would that have dried my hair suddenly? Or would this maybe the winter weather, monthly hormone changes or a sign I am preening to much suddenly? Today I had to oil it in parts because I cannot cover certain sections near the front of my head cause of how dry it had become and how little oil that area makes.

Is it advisable to oil the hair often? I am not opposed to doing so, I just worry that suddenly I may have too much and have a hard time cleaning it up again if this is likely a temporary thing. Or, if its caused because I should really back off the preening I do, or cause I should switch up my tools a bit.... Both of which I have been trying out to see how that helps.

But, I figure it doesn't hurt to ask you wonderful people, as well as to say 'hi' and join the group ;)

What tools are you using?

[Bedhead]

Welcome to the thread HAJ! :cheese:
When I was first NW/SO, I did need to dampen and oil just the tips of the ends when I trimmed my hair. Keep in mind oil removes both oil and sebum, so oiling the lengths would remove the sebum. I think a few months in, a shift happened where I didn't need to oil them anymore.

As for the preening, keep it up. nothing spreads the sebum like preening. It sounds like your hair is just adjusting itself (you're still in the first stage of transitioning). you also might want to keep track of your diet, stress level and menstrual cycle, just to note how these affect you. Being on NW/SO, you'll find your scalp and hair will speak volumes about your state of balance on all levels.

SwanFeathers, I have to say, I can't help you there. I've never used anything else but my hands to sctritch, but I've heard of others who use combs too. I think this is more of a try it and see how it works for you sort of thing.

[HAJ]

What tools are you using?

With my hair being so oily I had been favoring horn combs, fingers and BBB. Since its been dry I moved to my wood combs, fingers and wood brush.

[HAJ]

Welcome to the thread HAJ! :cheese:
When I was first NW/SO, I did need to dampen and oil just the tips of the ends when I trimmed my hair. Keep in mind oil removes both oil and sebum, so oiling the lengths would remove the sebum. I think a few months in, a shift happened where I didn't need to oil them anymore.

As for the preening, keep it up. nothing spreads the sebum like preening. It sounds like your hair is just adjusting itself (you're still in the first stage of transitioning). you also might want to keep track of your diet, stress level and menstrual cycle, just to note how these affect you. Being on NW/SO, you'll find your scalp and hair will speak volumes about your state of balance on all levels.

SwanFeathers, I have to say, I can't help you there. I've never used anything else but my hands to sctritch, but I've heard of others who use combs too. I think this is more of a try it and see how it works for you sort of thing.

Thanks Bedhed:D

I didn't really think about how the oil added it can strip the sebum but that makes total sense given the ways it can be used. Good thing I only did that once on the midsection LOL.

I am very happy to hear it is not preening to much. I have to say I find it therapeutic and really enjoy it so I will keep it up. I didn't think I was done transitioning yet especially since this look to it is odd and incomplete appearing. Maybe I'll look into a more exact diary to try and help see what causes the changes though I think I know what it is... SO is definitely more noticeable to your health than the other methods of hair care. It should really help to keeping a healthy mind, body and lifestyle better.

[01]

Not SO/NW, I'm always coming back to hardcore or hybrid WO (I'm so predictable, eh?) but when I still combed my hair (I buzzed them!) I found that horn is least damaging. Wood was quite damaging to my hair, actually (a lot less than plastic, plastic just butchered my hair). I liked it for styling, because it didn't made my hair oily as fast as horn but didn't frizz up and rip through my hair like plastic. So it's between plastic and horn. I personally wouldn't use wood daily. But it's me and my hair... And my hair are really fragile. Wood is nice for occasional combing when I wear straight styles.


So I finally found a wood comb in my area, can those of you who have been doing SO for awhile tell me if it is suitable for scritching? Last time I used a tightly spaced metal flea comb, but it snags on the edges and I'd love to reap the benefits of wood.
https://i.postimg.cc/DSGBhXT8/20181217-154759.jpg (https://postimg.cc/DSGBhXT8)

[Cate36]

What were the differences you noticed once your hair had transitioned? Did it grow faster? Thicken? Do you brush it/detangle it each day? I find it hard to brush my hair until wash it and have conditioner on the length to stop it breaking... Was your hair in good condition when you started? Is it easy to style?

So many questions!

[SwanFeathers]

What were the differences you noticed once your hair had transitioned? Did it grow faster? Thicken? Do you brush it/detangle it each day? I find it hard to brush my hair until wash it and have conditioner on the length to stop it breaking... Was your hair in good condition when you started? Is it easy to style?

So many questions!

Each time I do NO/SO my hair becomes super soft and doesn't tangle as much. it is easier to style in buns and braids but wearing it down takes planning and careful timing with my grooming. The best thing that happened was a happy scalp after years of trouble and lots of new growth, however, I have to be really delicate while styling or the extra fuss of grooming would cause breakage.
P.s. it hated water after transitioning.

[Bedhead]

Well, it seems I'm going to find out about growing out buzzed hair on NW/SO, proo. I've decided to grow it out. So I'll let you know if I see anything significant or not.

Cate36, most people find their hair stronger, shinier, and generally healthier all around. It calms down frizz, split ends to the point where there aren't any. Updoos look beautiful.

My hair had damage when I started. NW/SO, along with a few tweaks in my diet, was the best thing I could have done.


Happy New Year everyone!!!! :disco:

[proo]

Hello O my people!
Chiming in about preening (reiterating):
The game changer for me is doing it in twists which requires running/smoothing the lengths repeatedly for each twist.
It keeps things organized so I don’t miss parts and allows attention to specific parts if required.
Recommending GreenBeauty channel for smp instructions as well a plethora of other wonderful info.
Yo Bedhead! I like your hair “washing “ analogy, very evocative.

[lithostoic]

Is there a way to successfully transition without daily manipulation? When I tried going WO I lost a good bit of hair from daily preening and brushing.

[proo]

smp is like lymphatic massage-
Light, gentle touch and consistency of practice
Mine is usually around 5 minutes morning and night

I’ve come to love it
Very pampering

[Bedhead]

Is there a way to successfully transition without daily manipulation? When I tried going WO I lost a good bit of hair from daily preening and brushing.

I lost hair on WO too. Not so with NW/SO. Remember, your daily manipulation is the actual cleaning process. But how much? only you can find your answer - different body, different environment.

[lithostoic]

Interesting! Yeah I'm aware the manipulation is the cleaning, but I'm just not sure if my hair can handle the daily preening/brushing. I already do daily (brief) scalp massages but it's the lengths of my hair that can't handle the tugging especially without conditioner.

[Tinyponies]

Hi there,

I’m owning up to long time lurking here - at the moment I’m wo and washing infrequently with cold water (once every two or three weeks) and occasionally under a shower if there’s a good one any place I’m staying (rarely).

Really happy with chilling out getting to know my hair, and not messing with it too much day to day.

It’s early days yet but I wanted to own up, introduce myself and thank you for the valuable information here.

[proo]

In the beginning I too was under the misconception about smp-
That it’s a 45 minute procedure, the point being full sebum saturation.
Now that I’m down the road with it I’m realizing it’s like any journey,
Slow, gentle and consistent wins long term.
That’s what I love about the twists, I do about 8:
I can work on one when I feel like it, no biggie
Then tuck the ends up to my scalp with a topsy tail.

[TwilightMermaid]

Bedhead, I see you are a fellow wurly/curly:cool:. Does your hair form waves or ringlets even though it's dry/brushed?

[Bedhead]

Hi TwiliightMermaid! The parts that were wurly pretty much straightened out with NW/SO - brushing never took that away no matter how I cleaned my hair before. The curly parts - the parts that can have spirals if the circumstances are right - are now wurly (see pic in my sig below) on NW/SO. I should note, I don't brush my hair with a brush, just combs; my hair is happier that way.

proo, I'm not sure if that was a misconception. To feel what I feel now when I finish my two to 7 minute SMP, I really did need to do a 45 minute SMP when starting out, otherwise my ends would have gotten dry. Or do you mean, you think it could have been shorter back then, and would just take its natural course and get there? I wonder....

[proo]

Ezackly Bedhead-
Now I think if I’d lightened up on all that transition would have been smoother.

[Bedhead]

I guess we need a guinea pig then! Anyone? :silly:

[proo]

Perhaps all that manipulation was stimulating my scalp as much as shampooing?

[TwilightMermaid]

I would and I want to but I have to use up to conditioners first, and I don't know how to stop my scalp from getting itchy past the third day. But then again I'm not doing smp. Did anyone here with a not necessarily oily but itch prone scalp manage to become become SO? I want to see if there is some hope for me:confused:

[Bedhead]

I believe someone in the old thread that got merged did, TwilightMermaid. One of the benefits of NW/SO is the very healthy scalp. And, Yes, SMP is the key, plus you might want to clarify before really beginning - that in itself might help. Too, you might want to consider your diet. It's best to have a very clean diet on NW/SO.

[TwilightMermaid]

I've got a moderately healthy diet (love me some sugar). I'll be studying the merged thread:writer:, but I think my clarifying shampoo (intense sulphate one) caused my scalp to go crazy when I first tried.

[Bedhead]

I have to laugh! It's a little cold here (-21˚C = -6˚F), and I wore my hair down the other night. On my way home, it got colder and my hair, along with the sebum, froze! I felt like I had loads of product in my hair, like they used to do when they did beehives! My hair was NOT moving! Ha ha ha!

[Tinyponies]

Hi all, I consider myself to be hovering between nw and wo still, haven’t felt the need to water rinse since before I last checked in here a few weeks ago. I think it’s just easier for me if I don’t try to label myself (I am always getting worked up about labels!).

Tonight I had my hair down during an evening out, I kept it smoothed over my shoulder but it felt so nice to let it free for the evening rather than have it bunned up. Pretty comfortable right now and thought it might be nice to share.

Bedhead - that’s crazy that your hair froze! Haha :)

[FrayedFire]

I'm sad, I have to leave this thread - Made it a full year, and my hair loved it, but part of an agreement with my family means I had to go back to washing my hair more regularly. It was nice while it lasted, though! <3

[Bedhead]

Welcome to the thread TinyPonies! :cheese:
As you know, many of us were WO to begin with and kind of slipped into the NW/SO way. Please keep us updated on your progress and feel free to ask any questions.

FrayedFire, oh so sad! Well, at least you have a strong understanding of the benefits, and perhaps one day you will be in the position to rejoin us. Fair the well!

......

And so life went on, I was doing my things and decided to try oil pulling again, using coconut oil and occasionally sesame oil - not for anything but my teeth. Low and behold, it created a greater balance in both my hair and scalp! In recent times, I would wake to a higher amount of sebum closer to the scalp and drier ends - not a lot but enough to warrant a quick SMP to balance it out. After two weeks of daily oil pulling, my ends were perfect, and I no longer wake to any visual imbalance. My hair is nicely hydrated, without being sebum rich in any way. I just quickly scritch, massage a few second and stroke/wash my hair to the ends for about 30 seconds. If it wasn't near the end of winter, I would have thought my hair had adjusted to the winter, but the timing with the oil pulling was apparent. I plan on continuing it anyway, so I'll see how the change into the warmer seasons go this year.

How are all of you doing?

Have a great day! :disco:

[embee]

I'm still here, with some scalp rinses. When the weather gets really warm maybe I'll rinse the length as well, but that's not right soon as there was snow falling this morning. Brrrrrrrr. It's cold enough now that even with sebum there's a lot of static in the length. Bummer.

Of course, at my age, with the thyroid issues, and with the length of time without shampoo, maybe I don't have sebum any more?

[Tinyponies]

Hello!

All going well over here. Had a rinse over at my mums house in Wales where the water is dreamy, that was maybe three weeks ago. I was in a really happy comfy place but wanted to see if a wash would improve anything - if it was something I could maybe keep up my sleeve for a predictable result when I felt like it - but I felt that my hair came out of it feeling more oily near my head and weirdly dry at the ends. It’s getting back to a good place again now and I’m just going to keep on taking it day by day.

My ends are starting to feel soft again and I’m still feeling like my shedding has remained under control - some days more, some less. I have a moderate amount of flaky white dandruff but I tend to see that as a process and glad that my scalp can release what it needs to. You can’t rush these things. I have ridiculously sensitive skin and allergies etc etc and for me simple is always better so mentally it’s not a stretch to ditch the s&c again (I used to wash maybe once every three months when I had knotty hair and that was mostly water only).

Bedhead I’ve only ever done oil pulling with organic cold pressed sunflower oil, I learned it years back in the book moon time by Johanna Paungger and Thomas Poppe who are quite adamant that it only really *pulls* with that oil. It’s amazing and kind of gross because when you spit the oil out it’s completely (and utterly, repulsively almost) different from when it went in... if you get the chance, do give it a try! Ha! I’ve never had that same effect when trying it with coconut oil more recently, though very interested to hear in the balancing effect you have experienced, that’s great.

embee yep I’ve got the static too but only when using boar bristle brush. Apart from that it’s all very well behaved, much more so than it was stripped.

[Beeboo123]

I did NW/SO for 4 months, but then had to wash because a bird pooped on my head. My hair was super soft and shiny, but preening took up way too much time. I’m back to co-washing

[Bedhead]

I'm still here, with some scalp rinses. When the weather gets really warm maybe I'll rinse the length as well, but that's not right soon as there was snow falling this morning. Brrrrrrrr. It's cold enough now that even with sebum there's a lot of static in the length. Bummer.

Of course, at my age, with the thyroid issues, and with the length of time without shampoo, maybe I don't have sebum any more?

Ha ha! I'm sure you have some sebum.
I experienced static when I went home last year (extremely dry there), but it's so humid where I live now, I never experience it. I wondered if I lived in a drier environment, if my hair would adjust.


Hello!

All going well over here. Had a rinse over at my mums house in Wales where the water is dreamy, that was maybe three weeks ago. I was in a really happy comfy place but wanted to see if a wash would improve anything - if it was something I could maybe keep up my sleeve for a predictable result when I felt like it - but I felt that my hair came out of it feeling more oily near my head and weirdly dry at the ends. It’s getting back to a good place again now and I’m just going to keep on taking it day by day.

My ends are starting to feel soft again and I’m still feeling like my shedding has remained under control - some days more, some less. I have a moderate amount of flaky white dandruff but I tend to see that as a process and glad that my scalp can release what it needs to. You can’t rush these things. I have ridiculously sensitive skin and allergies etc etc and for me simple is always better so mentally it’s not a stretch to ditch the s&c again (I used to wash maybe once every three months when I had knotty hair and that was mostly water only).

Bedhead I’ve only ever done oil pulling with organic cold pressed sunflower oil, I learned it years back in the book moon time by Johanna Paungger and Thomas Poppe who are quite adamant that it only really *pulls* with that oil. It’s amazing and kind of gross because when you spit the oil out it’s completely (and utterly, repulsively almost) different from when it went in... if you get the chance, do give it a try! Ha! I’ve never had that same effect when trying it with coconut oil more recently, though very interested to hear in the balancing effect you have experienced, that’s great.

embee yep I’ve got the static too but only when using boar bristle brush. Apart from that it’s all very well behaved, much more so than it was stripped.
It sounds like all is going well for you!

Sesame oil (what I know as the traditionally used oil) is very expensive in Canada. It worked very well, I liked the taste too, but I'd rather use it for my food if I'm going to pay that much. Coconut oils a bit cheaper, and I use it for other things. Plus I read many are having better effects with coconut oil for their teeth, and since I was focussed on my teeth, I went with that. Maybe I'll check out sunflower oil too. :)



I did NW/SO for 4 months, but then had to wash because a bird pooped on my head. My hair was super soft and shiny, but preening took up way too much time. I’m back to co-washing
I can only imagine bird poop playing havoc with NW/SO. Too bad it wasn't paint; paint comes out so nicely. Good luck with CW!

[embee]

I did NW/SO for 4 months, but then had to wash because a bird pooped on my head. My hair was super soft and shiny, but preening took up way too much time. I’m back to co-washing

Ugh. I've had that happen, but thank goodness it was years ago before I went to NW/SO. But so yukky.

[Bedhead]

I have bought a small bottle of sunflower oil and will try that for a bit. I've only used it once, so not even close to enough time to report back on how it affects my hair. I will report back when I have something to say.

[Tinyponies]

I have bought a small bottle of sunflower oil and will try that for a bit. I've only used it once, so not even close to enough time to report back on how it affects my hair. I will report back when I have something to say.

Have you got dry ends?

[Bedhead]

Have you got dry ends?

NO, my ends are perfect. Why?

[Tinyponies]

Hi Bedhead, just interested to know why you might add oil when you seem to be doing well on your nw routine. Could have framed it better, apologies.

[Bedhead]

Hi Bedhead, just interested to know why you might add oil when you seem to be doing well on your nw routine. Could have framed it better, apologies.

Oh! Ha ha! I should have been more clear. I'm trying it for oil pulling. ;)

[Tinyponies]

Oh! Ha ha! I should have been more clear. I'm trying it for oil pulling. ;)

Oh my, that’s hilarious. Of course! I’m losing the plot today! :laugh:

[Tinyponies]

Nw is working very nicely for me. Im just about ready to stop kidding myself that I want to soak my hair again. I’m settling into a routine lately where I am doing my combing in the morning instead of the evening, then I bun it up and forget about it. I take it down for a couple of hours before bed.

A good few years ago after I first cut off my knotty hair I was interested in going without shampoo and bought a bbb and a horn comb but didn’t have the info to really make them work for me, so they just sat in a drawer. When I went for a trim last year, the hairdresser recommended I get a wide tooth comb so I got a green sanadalwood one.

So the last few weeks it’s been going sandalwood wide tooth - narrow tooth horn - boar bristle. I comb very slowly and for as long as I am comfortable, usually ~20 mins.

I can see a quick scalp wipe/rinse might be a nice thing if I feel the mood, but I feel lately like my old wooden chopping board, “do not immerse”. !

[HAJ]

How do you go about the brushing? Do you section it still or alternate between top and under side? Or brush from the top only?

[Tinyponies]

How do you go about the brushing? Do you section it still or alternate between top and under side? Or brush from the top only?

Hi HAJ, I’m kind of new here (only months, rather than years in), so still settling into a long term routine.

I stopped using my BBB for a long while as I thought it was affecting my fragile, mech damaged ends, but I’m now thinking that I was probably being too rough, brushing too fast so that the ends kind of flicked through quickly by the time I got to them. Once I get to the brushing part I have already spent quite a long time with the other combs so there are no tangles at all, and I do kind of gently separate sections so that I can brush them slowly root to tip but I don’t “section” it *properly*, just concentrate on areas as I feel. Again, there are people here much more experienced than me, but this seems to be working ok for my very fine hairs.

How are you getting on?

[HAJ]

I'm not doing to badly. Been at NW about 5 months now.
My roots and ends are usually pretty good but the length still often looks... stringy perhaps? I'm also struggling a bit with the smell when I sweat, but these two problems are likely due to my poor health I've been struggling with.
Actually, since changing to NW it's really helped me fine tune my health better than before, for the parts I can controle. For what is beyond my control for the most part, it's really neat to see how it alters my hair. It gives me a much better and deeper understanding than I ever had before on what's going on with my health which is cool. It makes things easy being that the hair is easier to see problems and usually will show your health change quickly so you can likely know a general cause.
I have noticed several patches of crazy course hair that always drive me nuts when I try to preen them. They don't feel oily or dry really but wiery... They don't seem to absorb much oil either unless I work in these parts almost in a strand by strand fashion...
Does anyone else have odd areas like this?

[Tinyponies]

HAJ, Your hair sounds very similar to mine, with stringy-ish (to me) looking lengths. From your profile we have a similar hair type too.

Love what you put about your hair and your health, and will try to pay more attention to see what mine might telling me.

I haven’t noticed any areas of coarser hair (my hair is fine) but I have noticed the occasional lone hair that is super wiry and dark, and my silver hairs that are coming in (between 1 and 4-5 inches long) are definitely more coarse than the rest of it.

ETA still going well, this week I got myself a good sturdy hair fork which has made my buns a lot more stable and comfortable.

[PeaceTeaRules]

Hello new people! And old people!

It’s been a long time since i’ve Been on the site in general. Thought my account got deleted somehow, lol. Nope, new thread which I need to catch up on. Read the initial posts great concise information bedhead!

Messing around with kind of water only atm. Dipping my combin the water and combing it through my hair repeatedly, scratching and not getting my scalp wet. After going back to using surface laiden shampoo at least once a week.. so that’s where I am.

Had also cut my hair a while ago and am dealing with the awkward stage that is bangs in face and almost shoulder length :?: ends? Idk how I dealt with hair in my eyes when growing it out last time. Maybe I ignored it. But Ye, had it short for like a year because I almost can’t get past the hair in eyes phase. It’ll take years to get it as long as I had it before I cut it; I cut it short because st some point I gave up and it was too matted to untangle... the hairdressers just chopped it off. I hope to never let it get that bad ever again! :shudder: it would’ve been gorgeous if I didn’t take benifpgn neglect to the extreme. Thinking about it is slightly soul crushing...

Sorry for the rant, just wanted to let you all know what was going on since hadn’t been here in s couple of years.

[Tinyponies]

Hiya PeaceTeaRules, and welcome back :)
I went from a buzz cut, and got through it by wearing headscarves and buff type tubes a lot. If you’re at the stage where it’s making you crazy, then maybe it can only get better from here? (Fingers crossed... for me it felt like a long time).

[PeaceTeaRules]

Ye, just need to stop paying attention to it and push through. Is what I did when growing it out before. What’s that tube you mentioned? Never heard of such a thing. Sounds interesting tinyponies.

Still chilly so am guessing and hoping that a beanie would work just the same? I don’t have any scarves. Can’t wait until I can tuck the ends of the bangs behind my headphones as well. It’s almost there. Just the fringe in the very front.

[Tinyponies]

Ye, just need to stop paying attention to it and push through. Is what I did when growing it out before. What’s that tube you mentioned? Never heard of such a thing. Sounds interesting tinyponies.

Still chilly so am guessing and hoping that a beanie would work just the same? I don’t have any scarves. Can’t wait until I can tuck the ends of the bangs behind my headphones as well. It’s almost there. Just the fringe in the very front.

^ cool, yeah I don’t know where you are, but we have “Buffs” here in uk sold a lot at outdoorsy type shops. It’s basically a long fabric tube that you can wear in multiple ways like as a scarf, hat, headband etc. I don’t look very cool in mine (a cotton non brand similar thing) but it wins on usefulness :lol: I just wear it over my bun tied closed like a beanie.

On topic, I’m having a very great hair day today. Which defies logic as we went out for a curry a couple of nights ago and I’ve been expecting the oil slick. I’ve been sticking with my morning thorough combing routine and think I might be catching up with myself from when I got a bit lazy. Or I’m still coming out of transition. My dandruff is much reduced and my hair has a nice shine.


https://i.imgur.com/L7DFz2U.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/r77guBW.jpg

[PeaceTeaRules]

Awesome! Shiny glorious wavy hair! Wonderful, tinyponies! Also I live in the middle of the US.

Still makes me sad that I let benign neglect go too far; because of that is now short. May post pics though it isn’t interesting.

[sallytz]

Hi everyone, just wanted to introduce myself. I also made a general introduction thread here (https://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=149308).

Browsing around the forum some more I think that NW/SO is where I'm heading. In many areas of my life - movement, diet, time outdoors, footwear(!) I've found that "going natural" as much as is practical has made the most intellectual sense and has been the most beneficial for my health. I just wish the same were true for my hair!

I don't know if it's hard water, humid climate, some much spice or meat in my diet, or what - but that most I've ever been able to achieve has been good hair days or, at most, weeks. I just wish I could reliably have decent, manageable hair.

The best it's ever been was probably when I was washing (or rinsing) it the least, but... then I started to get a noticeable, unpleasant odor. It would just cling to my fingertips, not hang in a cloud around my head, so it wasn't terrible, but it was more than I could tolerate. A couple of T-Gel washes knocked the odor out, but then I got dandruff. Oat/flaxmeal and cassia rinses (together with tea tree, rosemary, and laverdar oils) seem to have gotten the dandruff under control - it always felt dry and itchy, never really oily.

Anyway, I was starting to really despair, but after reading around some more, I still believe that my hair's natural oil is there for a reason. I think I was being too harsh with my combing/brushing (my hair is fine and thin and wavy - 2c I guess?) and now I'm ready to get back in the saddle toward NW/SO (probably with an occasional rinse, as needed) because it just seems like, intellectually, that ought to be the healthiest routine for my hair.

Maybe I need to work on my scritching and preening skills, since I'd been relying pretty heavily on my wooden comb, nit comb, and BBB.

[sallytz]

Also I'm sorry, I'm typing this when my computer's about to crash, so I'm going kind of quickly, and I just started posting so I'm not able to go back and edit my work! Sorry for all the mistakes - my thoughts were kind of all over the place, and my writing reflects it.

[sallytz]

Forgot to mention - my biggest issue right now is that my hair seems pretty damaged. It tangles very, very easily. As in, if I have it in a ponytail and take the ponytail down, just the movement of strands form one direction to another results in tangles.

I use jojoba or argan oil on the ends, and it just soaks it up (above the ears gets greasy). I've tried a diluted ACV spray (with some essential oils), which helps to detangle when I comb it but doesn't leave any lasting slip. If anything, it seems like it might be making it worse.

[Tinyponies]

Hi sallytz , welcome back :)
Hope you soon find a way to make friends with your hair again :heart:

[sallytz]

Hi sallytz , welcome back :)
Hope you soon find a way to make friends with your hair again :heart:

Thank you!

I don't hate my hair, but I feel like I'm not treating it well for it to be its best self! I want to give NW/SO a proper go before I try anything else, because I really think, if it works, this could be the best fit for me.

It's already been a few years since I shampooed regularly, so I don't produce a ton of sebum. ...Well, I didn't think so, anyway, but I stopped using my nit comb a couple of days ago (since my hair seemed to be getting somewhat damaged) and the roots are started to get greasy.

https://i.imgur.com/iTJZ37q.jpg

I'm trying to get (back) into scritching and preening, but when I try to preen, my hair tangles and feels rough just a couple of inches down from my scalp.

Any tips on how to preen frazzled hair? I was reading through the beginning of this thread, about spreading serum, and I don't think my serum is that thick. o_o I can't even feel it on my fingertips - I just see and feel it on the roots of my hair. I can get it to spread down an inch or two but that's it.

[Tinyponies]

Hi sallytz,

Your hair looks really lovely :)

You mentioned adding oil and essential oil, could it be that you need to clean all that out? (Could well be a no but I don’t know how much you used) could there be residue from other things hanging out in there?

I would think that there’s not much a boar bristle brush can’t shift, as long as you wash the brush out well every day or three (it was every day for me for weeks).

The way I see it, is that nw and wo hair is different in texture than stripped hair, it takes a bit of getting used to. That oiliness kind of travelled down (for me) and evened out.

I feel like my hair coating has a waxy like candle wax element and an oily like olive oil element and I wonder if these are two mutually supportive traits of what we call sebum. So I don’t see the wax as an issue per se, because it is like a shell on my hair. When I tried wo, it felt as if I was disturbing the process, maybe washing the oil (a transport agent and conditioner?) and leaving the wax to build up.

But that’s just my own thoughts and observation, others may say different of course!

Re scritchy feeling hair,-

Are you taking lots of time to preen and comb slowly and thorough (but very gently) each day? Like 20 min+

Are you bunning your hair in the day, with ends tucked in? That has been my biggest help in getting my ends silky soft.

Do you protect it at night? Mine stays coiled under sleep cap, same effect as buns, I leave it stashed away as much as I can.

I can wholeheartedly say that you can surely get your hair to be in much better shape and don’t have to cut it off, mine was in a similar sounding condition when I started here only in early winter 2018.

It’s been a big inspiration reading threads here where people are dealing with chemically and heat fried hair, and still managing to find ways to make it work.

My hair is really grabby, it gets tangled super easily too and even more so in the last couple of inches. I’m still learning to be more patient and gentle and avoid sectioning it or getting it in the wind etc. It’s basically up all the time but oh man when it’s down for combing in the morning, and swishing around in my back when getting ready for bed it’s a joy, compared to how it always was when using cleaning products.

:blossom:

[Tinyponies]

PS sorry for the essay, I’m just so in love with everything that’s going on for my hair right now and OMG feels good to share :)

Another thing I thought of, my hair loves silk. Not man made fibres satin - real silk with a satin weave. I’m sure it has added to my hairs sleekness. I wear a silk scarf on my head over my bun around the house and a cotton buff type thing out and about (still not cool but less uncool perhaps)! And silk sleep cap.

If your hair is as like mine as it looks it’s a matter mostly of getting it hydrated and oiled, and coaxing the little shingles to lie down flat again. All doable! Xx

[PeaceTeaRules]

Purple fuzz and perhaps product from shampoo constantly being combed out of my hair, waxy sticky sebum as well. Interestingly enough the only purple thing I have is a bag, where’s the fuzz coming from? It looks wet as well. Time to transition again I suppose. Would ox horn combs or wooden ones help with the wet look? Am slightly worried about over combining hair tho. Will I combtoo much and thin my hair out if I comb frequently?

It’s been so long since I tried this, or wo for that matter. I forgot how relaxing scritching and preening could be. Hopefully it causes my hair to grow faster as well! Am tired of it being short. Wanted to cut it to the length of my fringe; but all of the work down the tubes if I did. Growing out fringe is a pain. Have noticed it is curling more.

Glad you’re having success tinyponies!

[Bedhead]

Hi sallyz, welcome to the thread! :cheese:

I have to agree with everything tinyponies said. The other thing most newbies overlook is the power of the M part of SMP i.e. massage. Massage opens up the pores, relaxes the roots an stimulates the scalp to release sebum and whatever toxins/bacteria have built up beneath the surface, both from your environment and whatever needs to be released from your system. I find the sebum in this case a little more on the oily side rather than waxy. Scritching removes the layer of sebum (more waxy) and bacteria sitting on the surface. Too massage will coat your fingers with what you need to coat your length.

It sounds as though you have some mild damage in your length. Part of the preening process is what people call, "smoothing". So we clean, smooth and spread the sebum, removing the excess via preening. If you focus on the idea of smoothing the rest will be accomplished too. This is where your nails will come in handy (no, they don't need to be long to do this, you just need the edges).


PeaceTeaRules, welcome back! Good luck on your return! And yes, you're going to need to put benign neglect aside.

Have a great day everyone!

[PeaceTeaRules]

I certainly will indeed bedhead! It’s what lead me to chop off my /glorious/ locks many years ago. Nowi’ll Actually care for it.

Short horror story, I let it get to the point it was practically un detanglable. The poor hairdresser had to cut the poor matted mess, at least I donated it. Bet they had fun untangling it then. Made me really sad, won’t do that again. It would’ve been glorious as it was like classic at that point... :oops:

[sallytz]

Thanks, y'all!

There definitely is some residue from how I'd been trying to manage it before. Not a lot, but I can smell it on my hair. What's the best way to clean it considering I have hard water?

Also I'm on the fence about my BBB. I've had it for years. I clean it whenever it's funky, about every week or two. I've never had really good results with it, even when I try to make sure I go slow. Maybe I just need a better one? Mine was pretty cheap, from Sally's Beauty Supply. Seems like it was advertised as the real deal.

[Bedhead]

You'll need to use a clarifier, sallyz, and filtered water (bottled, Brita etc.).

Personally, I don't use a brush. They don't work for me. They're great for stimulating your scalp though and getting that sebum flowing! At least that's been my experience. Other's swear by the BBB or Denman (sp?).

[Tinyponies]

With regard to the BBB, it does make my hair sleek and oily. But at this point (late transition?) the benefits of getting out dirt, lint and skin cells and moving waxy sebum makes it worth it.

I seriously need to wash it every day, and well (soaking in warm water with a detergent and then scrubbing it with a scrubbing brush). The most I can leave it if I really can’t be bothered is three days (this may get longer in future), and I feel the difference.

[sallytz]

One more question: Is a clarifier the same as a clarifying shampoo?

My hair already feels better than it did yesterday. On the greasy side, but smoother and softer. I also trimmed the ends.

[PeaceTeaRules]

I forgot how to wash the combs? I figured for ox horn and wood just clean them off with an old toothbrush or something as I don’t think you’re supposed to get them wet. What about plastic combs or any others? You all still use shampoo or dish soap to wash them? I’ve dug through the old thread and hadn’t seen anything regarding it.

[Tinyponies]

I forgot how to wash the combs? I figured for ox horn and wood just clean them off with an old toothbrush or something as I don’t think you’re supposed to get them wet. What about plastic combs or any others? You all still use shampoo or dish soap to wash them? I’ve dug through the old thread and hadn’t seen anything regarding it.

Wood and horn keep dry, you could use a bit of cloth, tissue, toothbrush, anything. I’ve read about some people using a damp cloth, or a toothbrush with soap and water then dry quickly. the particular horn comb I have would hate that though.

Plastic yeah totally, anything like that, in warm water, just rinse the soap off very well.

There is some build up on my combs on the “following” (not leading) side, so be careful to check it often and wipe anything off before going from another angle and risking putting the stuff back in your hair. I use an old T-shirt on my lap for this, so I can just wipe each side quickly a couple of times against my leg. The T-shirt catches any dust and I pile shed hairs up there too, then can ball up the sheds and shake the dust outside really easily.

[PeaceTeaRules]

Idk what happened but my horn comb is cracked in two places. :( thanks tinyponies! If the things cracked, can I still use it? Am sad it’s cracked. Should’ve figured you didn’t want to get horn wet.

Scritching and preening and massaging to help with sebum distribution. Am now an oil slick and highly self conscious out in public... though people care less than you think initially so idk. Dealt with it before and no one but mom seemed to care. Or notice.

Have a good day/night everyone! Happy preening!

[Tinyponies]

Idk what happened but my horn comb is cracked in two places. :( thanks tinyponies! If the things cracked, can I still use it? Am sad it’s cracked. Should’ve figured you didn’t want to get horn wet.

Scritching and preening and massaging to help with sebum distribution. Am now an oil slick and highly self conscious out in public... though people care less than you think initially so idk. Dealt with it before and no one but mom seemed to care. Or notice.

Have a good day/night everyone! Happy preening!

Depends where the crack is, and if it’s the kind of thing that is going to rip or constantly snag your hairs. Mine is kind of surface cracked in one area from when I tried to wash it, but it’s not an issue. The oil from your head should feed it pretty well.

You definitely get most oily right after a good session, and that’s good because you’ve moved it all around a bit. Persistence and patience and regularity are good. I do mine in the morning before bunning it up and it always looks best right when I take it down before getting ready for bed.

Braids and buns are the way to go when you’re feeling like an oil slick. When mine is up in a bun it looks shiny but never greasy. I really don’t think you’d ever know. And I wear it up all the time anyway cos I just prefer it, and a good bun gets the ends tucked up by the head and they can get some of the protective oil that way.

[Bedhead]

One more question: Is a clarifier the same as a clarifying shampoo?


Yes........ ;)

[PeaceTeaRules]

Awa. Thanks! My hair is currently way too short to braid tho unfortunately. Has more wave now at least.

Bought a horn comb for someone and it has a hairline fracture that’s slightly splitting the teeth a little wider than normal. Hadn’t even opened it yet. Hope everyone is doing well! Happy massaging!

[Bedhead]

Awa. Thanks! My hair is currently way too short to braid tho unfortunately. Has more wave now at least.

Bought a horn comb for someone and it has a hairline fracture that’s slightly splitting the teeth a little wider than normal. Hadn’t even opened it yet. Hope everyone is doing well! Happy massaging!
Why don't you see if you can exchange it for one without a fracture? It's worth a try.

[PeaceTeaRules]

Was so tired I didn’t think of that! Thanks bedhead!

[PeaceTeaRules]

Guess i’m Doing something right, scalp isn’t itchy and combed my hair while sitting in the bathtub, no fuzz or lint of any kind, it feels lighter and more fluffy as well. If that makes sense.

[Tinyponies]

Awa. Thanks! My hair is currently way too short to braid tho unfortunately. Has more wave now at least.

Bought a horn comb for someone and it has a hairline fracture that’s slightly splitting the teeth a little wider than normal. Hadn’t even opened it yet. Hope everyone is doing well! Happy massaging!

Ah sorry , brain fart! I knew that. We were supposed to be moving house a few months back but our buyer dropped out at the last minute after we said goodbye to friends, wrapped up work and all our stuff is in storage and we are feeling like we’re in limbo now.

On the positive side, we are travelling a lot to visit family who are all spread out, so house sitting, volunteering, camping and weddings so it’s great - and my hair loves me every day for having this stable routine.



Guess i’m Doing something right, scalp isn’t itchy and combed my hair while sitting in the bathtub, no fuzz or lint of any kind, it feels lighter and more fluffy as well. If that makes sense.

Yay!

[PeaceTeaRules]

Hope all goes well for you tinyponies! Being in limbo and having to deal with uncertainty bites; such as life tho I suppose. Your travel plans sound fun; hope the weather is nice!

Tried to bold your username but idk how on mobile interface. Derp.

[Bedhead]

Here's my 7 year + 2 month update:

I have decided to grow my bangs from 5mm down to just past my eyebrows (currently 1.5" long), and am back to using coconut oil for oil pulling, because the sunflower oil didn't work well for me. My hair is now at the top of my shoulders (shaggy bobbish thing) and I have maintained my undercut on both sides (I'm having fun cutting in lines etc.). I wear it down now and then, without any of the concerns or issues I once had when starting out here.

I made it, and I'm happy I went down this path.

Good luck to all of you who are just starting out here! It's a journey of wonder, and challenges - from others and, surprisingly, ourselves. It's a discovery of full body and emotional health. And it brings us into alignment with our true personal values, well beyond our bodies and into how we live our lives. I can't believe the friendships and support I've had throughout my time exploring, playing and stressing. Nothing can match this powerful experience we call NW/SO!

I'm going to take a small break from the internet, but keep going and keep supporting one another. There's so much information both here, and in the accidentally merged NW/SO and WO one ( if you don't mind sifting through it!).

Happy preening! :flower:

[saff.cel]

Possibly off topic, but if you ladies are having trouble keeping your horn combs in good shape, you should consider getting some lanolin (https://www.evitamins.com/uk/pure-lanolin-now-34750). Once a month if you coat your comb in lanolin and wrap it up in cellophane and leave it over night, then wipe it well with a soft cloth, it'll keep your comb from drying, warping, and cracking. Lanolin is pretty cheap and you don't need more than a squeeze, so a 7oz. bottle should last a year or more.

[Tinyponies]

Bedhead so great to hear about your experience so far. Seven years is a wealth of it, thank you for continuing to share. Wishing you a peaceful and restorative internet free break.

Perhaps coconut and (cold pressed)sunflower oils serve different functions with the oil pulling.

Over at the beginning of my journey, this was my hair one morning this week immediately after a long smp and comb/bbb. (My equinox check-in).
https://i.imgur.com/SYHfw8v.jpg
It’s feeling softer and less oily as I go, particularly I n the back of my head where there’s most oil (I’ve upset my eating routine lately, eating more oily foods) and in the fringe area where it is very mechanically damaged and used to be dry (now pretty silky).

I’m getting a few more broken bits coming off now, from old white dots. I suppose that all the manipulation is wearing them out and they’re fraying. There’s so much of the damage in the first few old inches that was severely mistreated before I knew better, eventually I expect I will have to start trimming it out, but not today.

I stopped wearing my favourite cotton jersey head wrap thing about two weeks ago :violin: as I was getting an awful lot of little blue lint from it. It was probably getting old. Instead I’m wearing a silk scarf with a wool wrap on top, it’s not ideal but the amount of lint in my hair has already reduced drastically.

[sallytz]

So I tried to do a scalp only wash the other day but it didn't exactly work the way I wanted it to. I think part of the problem is that my hair isn't long enough to get much protection in a braid. I bundled it up inside a plastic bag and the ends stayed dry, but the mid length still got damp and probably also got some shampoo in it.

Also I think I used too much shampoo. I had a bottle of sulfate free shampoo (still kind of strong though) that was less than a quarter full, and I filled it up the rest of the way with water. It still made a lot of lather.

My scalp feels better, but the few inches of hair closest to my head are frizzy, and the mid length seems to be picking up tangles.

Going to try to go at least a week or two until the next wash, and I'm going to modify this technique or try something else entirely.

[Tinyponies]

So I tried to do a scalp only wash the other day but it didn't exactly work the way I wanted it to. I think part of the problem is that my hair isn't long enough to get much protection in a braid. I bundled it up inside a plastic bag and the ends stayed dry, but the mid length still got damp and probably also got some shampoo in it.

Also I think I used too much shampoo. I had a bottle of sulfate free shampoo (still kind of strong though) that was less than a quarter full, and I filled it up the rest of the way with water. It still made a lot of lather.

My scalp feels better, but the few inches of hair closest to my head are frizzy, and the mid length seems to be picking up tangles.

Going to try to go at least a week or two until the next wash, and I'm going to modify this technique or try something else entirely.

Hope you find your happy place, sounds like next time you’ll have a better idea of how you want to go about it.

I’ve had three days now that I’ve noticed another wave of dandruff, I was at a party just a couple of days before that (I don’t drink or smoke, but ate some lentil salad and lots of snacks) and wonder if I stressed myself more than I thought (I don’t do crowds). We also had another hurdle to get through with our house sale. I took some extra time massaging and scritching this morning and will again tomorrow but that’s made it look loads worse of course. White flakes. I also got very dehydrated and had two consecutive nights of nearly no sleep due to sleeping out in a van where it was cold.

[sallytz]

Ugh! Too bad about the flakes! In the past have they resolved on their own or have you done some sort of treatment?

[Tinyponies]

Ugh! Too bad about the flakes! In the past have they resolved on their own or have you done some sort of treatment?

They *reduced* quite a bit. I always had flakes off and on no matter what I’ve been using on my hair/head.

I don’t mind them so much as they are a useful guide to how more important things are doing (aka inside my body). I don’t at the moment do anything other than keeping thorough and regular with my once a day smp & combing/BBB.

I personally don’t see them as something that needs stopping, more as something that is a symptom of a bigger story. I’m not into suppressing symptoms without addressing the underlying root issues, so I am helping the process along as I see it (on myself, in this case) as a rebalancing action made by the intelligent head-skin.

I used to have terrible recurring eczema in patches all over my body that have resolved with my changing habits, mental state and diet. I get really excited about this kind of stuff (please excuse my blathering) and like to keep it simple... like with many issues of the body it’s more about what you can stop doing than what you can add (unless we are talking fresh air, gentle exercise, stretching, contentment etc!).

Best wishes!