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Blondieee
September 27th, 2017, 11:56 PM
Now that my ferritin levels are finally coming up and my hair is regrowing, I'm ready to go blonde! But I need advice. I'm looking for a very NATURAL golden dirty blonde hair color. So I want a mix of golden blonde combined with my natural light brown hair. I'm not looking for platinum or anywhere close to that. I want people to look at my hair and think it's my natural hair color and that I haven't had color put in it. I have Hashimoto's so as a result, my hair is extremely dry. So I really want to avoid bleach if I can. Hairstylists in the past when I've asked about it have said they can use blonde dye on me since my hair is very light naturally. My natural hair color is a very light brown. When bleach was used on me once (horrible experience with it) my hair lightened so quick because I was a blonde all growing up and my natural hair color is so light that my hair turned platinum and had no color to it. It looked like all the color had been taken out of my hair and people were telling me to get a hair color. So since bleach is very unpredictable and extremely unhealthy, I would prefer not to use it if possible.

I'm also looking to wear my hair natural. I know my profile says otherwise. I haven't updated that in forever. I have naturally curly hair and want to wear it curly. Occasionally I would like to maybe use a curling iron to make a beachy wave or braid it or something to make it wavy? But I'm not using heat and I'm not going to flat iron it and all that. I just want long blonde curly hair.

So my questions are:
1. Can the hair stylist use dye instead of bleach to avoid the funky colors, extreme drying of the hair, purple shampoo, etc?
2. Is blonde dye drying to the hair? When I've had dye done on my hair before (Redken Shades EQ) it was in a light brown color but it made it extremely moisturized. My comb glid through my hair like butter. No tangles, no dryness. But bleach there was dryness and that was before the Hashimoto's started so now it's super dry. So I want to do what will be healthiest for my hair.
3. I LOVE the look of the balayage. Absolutely love the balayage whenever I see it done. It looks so natural and pretty! Does it have to be done with bleach or can they do a balayage with blonde dye?

Please share experiences that you have with bleach and blonde dye. I'm not looking to go platinum so I wouldn't see why I would need bleach. Thanks in advance!

diddiedaisy
September 28th, 2017, 12:19 AM
I donít think you can go lighter without bleach, but you can do things to help protect your hair during the process such as coconut oil and olaplex.

Blonde hair dye still contains bleach. My hair is bark blonde but I box dye it lighter. My hair is soft and shiny and it isnít dry. I do however use overnight oils and treatments to keep it that way. Be prepared for more maintenance.

Good luck :)

Rhoward
September 28th, 2017, 12:53 AM
It all depends what's in your hair now, if its all virgin then colour in a level 8N (I'm going to assume you're about a level 6 since you said your natural hair colour is light brown) with 20 volume developer would get you a very natural looking result. BUT if you have any colour AT ALL on any of your hair (dying your hair 3 years ago still counts) then you are going to need bleach to lighten it. Colour can not lift colour, even 4 year old colour you think isn't there anymore, trust me its still in there!

diddiedaisy
September 28th, 2017, 01:01 AM
20 volume developer is still bleach though. :)

honey.pie
September 28th, 2017, 01:02 AM
My hair is currently balayaged with "blonde dye", [not bleach] so yes, it can be done. My hair was dark blonde normal virgin hair when I did this. It didn't lift as much as I wanted, it was very subtle. And yeah, it still weakened my hair [and thus caused plenty of damage, though not as much a normal bleaching]. I think any time you go lighter, that's the case. Some hair does handle it better than others, and of course how it's done & how you take care of it make a big difference. My hair is naturally pretty fine & fragile, and I did it at home, not at a salon, so it probably wasn't the best circumstances for me. i'm not sure if it was worth it. So I'd if your heart is really set on it, go to professional & let them know your concerns. I hope it works out for you, cuz I totally understand. I love being blonde.! But you do have to be careful.

diddiedaisy
September 28th, 2017, 01:07 AM
Ive never seen or heard of a blonde dye that doesnít contain peroxide (which I call bleach), what brand is it? :)

torosaurus
September 28th, 2017, 01:12 AM
I'm also looking to wear my hair natural. I know my profile says otherwise. I haven't updated that in forever. I have naturally curly hair and want to wear it curly. Occasionally I would like to maybe use a curling iron to make a beachy wave or braid it or something to make it wavy? But I'm not using heat and I'm not going to flat iron it and all that. I just want long blonde curly hair.

So you have naturally curly hair.. and you want to wear it curly? I'm not sure I am understanding. I guess you should just wear it curly?
There are many different ways that you can style your hair without heat. Using rollers/curlers the night before will dry your hair in a curled shape without the use of heat (though it does a small amount of damage to your hair.)
Personally, to create the look of a beachy wave, I twist my hair into two sections when it is about half dry. I just keep twisting it (gently) until it's dry, and it will end up wavy. Here's an example:
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-yW-w_xvtx6M/T_HIZnXcTOI/AAAAAAAACXU/h6uy-nKIGxQ/s1600/beach+hair.jpg


So my questions are:
1. Can the hair stylist use dye instead of bleach to avoid the funky colors, extreme drying of the hair, purple shampoo, etc?
2. Is blonde dye drying to the hair? When I've had dye done on my hair before (Redken Shades EQ) it was in a light brown color but it made it extremely moisturized. My comb glid through my hair like butter. No tangles, no dryness. But bleach there was dryness and that was before the Hashimoto's started so now it's super dry. So I want to do what will be healthiest for my hair.
3. I LOVE the look of the balayage. Absolutely love the balayage whenever I see it done. It looks so natural and pretty! Does it have to be done with bleach or can they do a balayage with blonde dye?

1. You cannot lighten your hair with dye. Dye deposits color into your hair. The only way to lighten your hair is to use a bleaching agent. You can accomplish this without totally murdering your hair, but it will still inevitably dry your hair out and you will need to maintain it with special shampoos/conditioners.
2. Processing hair will dry your hair out because it is damaging. No matter what, when you color or bleach your hair it will damage it. Sorry. However, if you use a very gentle method (low volume developer, salon products, Olaplex) and are careful to condition and maintain your hair afterward, it will reduce the amount of damage you do.
Box dyes from the grocery store are bad for your hair. The only reason your hair probably felt soft afterward is because of all the silicons in the deep conditioner that comes with the box.
3. Lightening your hair requires bleach. Blonde dye has bleach in it. You could get a subtle blonde balayage done at a salon and it would be a very nice way to have color but no super obvious roots would come in, so growing your hair out will be easier.

Another thing you may want to consider doing is partial babylights. They are very natural looking highlights that can be done without a high volume developer and it will make your hair change tone slightly without having to deal with too much upkeep.

However, I must warn you that it is difficult to grow your hair super long while still color processing it. Your hair is already dry and damaging it with color even more will make it worse. Perhaps you can grow your hair out to your desired length now and keep it as healthy and moisturized as possible, and then you can make a color change if you would like to.

honey.pie
September 28th, 2017, 01:17 AM
Ive never seen or heard of a blonde dye that doesn’t contain peroxide (which I call bleach), what brand is it? :)

haha, that's true, in general any lighteners contain bleach to some degree. They just like to call it a "high lift" or whatever. Most hairdressers I've been to like to act as if it's something different. I'm not sure how much safer it is than "regular" bleach though.

diddiedaisy
September 28th, 2017, 03:07 AM
Great advice from torosaurus.

The only thing I would disagree on is that you canít have soft moisturised hair when itís bleached, because mine is even without silicones. Maybe Iím lucky in that my hair is naturally and always has been super soft, shiny and slippery, and bleaching hasnít changed that. Thatís my hair type. Of course itís not in the same condition as virgin hair, But I work to make sure I maintain it in the best condition it can be. I also have very few splits.

Bleached hair in good condition takes a lot of maintenance, but it can be done. :)

Rhoward
September 28th, 2017, 04:31 AM
20 volume developer is still bleach though. :)

Developer is not bleach, it is hydrogen peroxide, which when mixed with tint (colour) or bleach powder or cream (lightener) gives the product strength to work, peroxide comes in different strengths depending on how much water content is in the peroxide, but it is not bleach. It can do some serious damage if you dont know what you are doing and use high strength peroxide (e.g. 40 vol mixed with bleach could melt your hair in 10 minutes but bleach and 10 vol would leave the hair in much better condition)

Tint (colour) and developer will lighten virgin hair e.g. level 6 virgin hair using level 8N tint and 20 volume developer will lighten the hair up to 2 levels, giving you a natural/golden level 7-8 blonde.

Blonde tint (colour/dye) lightens hair via a mixture of ammonia (or substitute) in the tint and the level of peroxide in the developer. Bottom line is tint (colour), even high lift tint, is not bleach and doesn't have bleach in it.

Tint (colour) will not lift existing tint, you need bleach to lighten your hair it if it is not virgin

lucid
September 28th, 2017, 05:27 AM
Bleach is just the trivial name of chemical compounds that lightens or whitens materials. One typically think of calcium hypochlorite or sodium hypochlorite when referring to bleach. However, there are many other types of bleaching agents - like peroxide, which also lightens hair or clothes.

To make it clear - hydrogen peroxide is a type of bleach.

diddiedaisy
September 28th, 2017, 06:20 AM
If you do go ahead and lighten your hair I would suggest you use plenty of oils which are able to penetrate the hair shaft. After lots of experimenting over the past few years I have found sunflower oil to be the best one, especially if your hair doesn't like coconut oil. At the moment I am using a mix I have made up of mostly sunflower oil, some olive oil, a bit of argan oil, and a smaller bit of babassu butter. Sorry I don't measure!!! All of these apart from the argan oil will penetrate the hair shaft and help to strengthen it.

I apply this to dry hair and leave overnight before washing out in the morning. Although applying it to dry hair doesn't moisturise it as such, it does improve the ability of your hair shaft to naturally hold on to moisture and protein. It also helps to protect your hair when you wash.

As a daily washer I use this mix about 4 or 5 times a week. On the nights I don't oil, I will use treatments on damp hair such as Philip Kingsley Elasticizer which I still leave on overnight. I probably don't need to do all this as much as I do, but I have my little pampering clean up routine going in the evening that relaxes me and puts me off bounds to the rest of the household for a short while haha ;)

After washing I use a leave-in conditioner, my favorite being an cheap Avon one, followed by a serum.

Oh, and I use a natural shampoo bar 98% of the time on scalp only.

Like I said before, you have to put the work in. :)

Just to be clear I do use the term bleach as an umbrella term (thanks for pointing it out lucid :)) for many things, one of which is peroxide, lazy linguistics on my behalf, so apologies if I have caused some confusion. :)

Rhoward
September 28th, 2017, 06:49 AM
Just to be clear I do use the term bleach as an umbrella term (thanks for pointing it out lucid :)) for many things, one of which is peroxide, lazy linguistics on my behalf, so apologies if I have caused some confusion. :)

No confusion, OP was talking as if she intended on going to a salon to get it done, so I was just speaking as a hair dresser. In hair colouring theory powder or cream/oil based bleach and developer (different volume levels of hydrogen peroxide) are very different products for very different uses :)

e.g. If OP has previous chemical colour on her hair, tint (colour) and developer (hydrogen peroxide) are not going to lighten it, because colour cant lift colour no matter what strength developer you mix with it, it will take powder/cream/oil bleach (lightener) to lift the hair to the desired level (depending on the lift required and health of the hair bleach will either be mixed with developer or sometimes hot water).

But if her hair has no chemical colour on it, tint (colour) and developer (hydrogen peroxide) will be enough to lighten the hair a few levels depending on the strength of the developer used.

diddiedaisy
September 28th, 2017, 07:24 AM
My point was that developer contains peroxide which is a bleach. Doesnít matter the strength or name itís called, itís still a type of bleach. :)

Arciela
September 28th, 2017, 08:21 AM
From my experience there is no way to safely go blonde. I thought if I only did my roots then my length would stay healthy..nope. Even going to top NYC salons here, just doing my roots led to losing a lot of hair each time I did the roots and then the top of my head became so tangled I had to cut parts out, my curl pattern got destroyed and now my hair is two toned. Due to so much tangles on my hair it got a ton of splits. It's just not worth it at all imo. Most days my hair looks fried and so bad I have to put it up and forget about it. All the natural shine is gone from when I had virgin hair and it looks..icky.

I had to do a trim, I am between tailbone and classic now and its in better shape after not touching my hair for 5 months, my waves came back but I can say, I have TOUGH hair (which is probably why its still so long for now), took care of it like antique lace, have tons of the top products for it and still it got destroyed by the bleach. I am never, ever messing with my hair again.

If you really want to be blonde, you could do it but there is no way to grow it super long and healthy.

lapushka
September 28th, 2017, 08:23 AM
Developer is not bleach, it is hydrogen peroxide, which when mixed with tint (colour) or bleach powder or cream (lightener) gives the product strength to work, peroxide comes in different strengths depending on how much water content is in the peroxide, but it is not bleach. It can do some serious damage if you dont know what you are doing and use high strength peroxide (e.g. 40 vol mixed with bleach could melt your hair in 10 minutes but bleach and 10 vol would leave the hair in much better condition)

Tint (colour) and developer will lighten virgin hair e.g. level 6 virgin hair using level 8N tint and 20 volume developer will lighten the hair up to 2 levels, giving you a natural/golden level 7-8 blonde.

Blonde tint (colour/dye) lightens hair via a mixture of ammonia (or substitute) in the tint and the level of peroxide in the developer. Bottom line is tint (colour), even high lift tint, is not bleach and doesn't have bleach in it.

Tint (colour) will not lift existing tint, you need bleach to lighten your hair it if it is not virgin

It is (of course) not household bleach, but dye/peroxide for hair is commonly referred to as "bleach" anyway. Just FYI! :)

Rhoward
September 28th, 2017, 07:06 PM
I'm not trying to argue with anyone I am just trying to help the OP who sounds very much like she is going to a hairdresser to get this done.

I worked as a hair dresser for 12 years. To a hairdresser there is a VERY big difference between blonde dye (tint colour mixed with developer/peroxide) and bleach (usually powder because its cheaper mixed with developer/peroxide or even hot water sometimes).

Please dont tell the hair dresser you are ok with bleach in your hair if you really mean you are ok with tint mixed with developer/peroxide (blonde dye) If a hair dresser hears you want to go blonde and are ok with bleach then that's what you will end up with on your head - powder bleach - because its cheap and easy, but it will cause more damage than tint/colour mixed with developer.

Ask instead if you can achieve your colour goals without the use of bleach, the hairdresser will understand that. But if your hair is all virgin and has no colour on it at all you wont need bleach, if on the other hand you DO need bleach to lighten your hair then ask questions, lots of them. You want someone who will use cream/oil based bleach and you want it mixed with as low volume peroxide as possible and use olaplaex or similar, there will be way less damage that way.

Good luck and I hope you get the colour you are after

Peonyrose
September 28th, 2017, 08:28 PM
Any type of colour can damage hair, it's just a matter of degree.
Herbal colour ( henna, indigo), while it helps most hair, can damage and dry out certain people's hair and the resin deposit can make some hair types brittle.
Honey lightening uses the natural production of peroxide to lighten hair- it's just very dilute and much more controllable ( so dilute that you could debate whether it does anything at all).
'Bleach' for hair usually refers to the process of dramatically lifting colour , usually several levels, eg from a level 5 to a 9. This is what will leave hair orange or yellow unless a toner or another depositing colour is used on top. It will damage hair the most.
'Blonde dye' is just controlled bleaching plus a colour deposit in the one step, eg a box dye that states 'golden blonde level 8'. On someone who is eg a natural level 6 or 7 it will have enough peroxide in the developer to lift the LEVEL of colour to an 8, at the same time DEPOSITING a tone eg golden or ash. If you are a level 4 or 5 and do this you will find the peroxide will lift a level but won,t get you to a blonde - simply not strong enough. Still a damaging process but more controlled than bleach. Hairdressers can control the addition of tones etc to compensate for underlying tones in natural hair to get the result you want, whereas a box dye will just be a one size might fit all, so depending on your starting hair colour you might end up more red/gold/ ash than you want.
Neither bleach nor the other type of dye will lift colour from previously coloured hair. You first need to remove the old colour molecules with a colour remover eg colour oops. Then bleach or colour to what you want. If you have level 6 hair coloured with an 8 ash dye colour then your hair has been lifted (bleached) to a level 8 with ash deposited on it. The colour remover will remove the ash, but the bleached bit may then look yellow or orange. Bleach or lightening will remove the hair pigment and the only way to change that is colour it back to add in the lost pigment.

Blondieee
September 30th, 2017, 11:04 PM
Thank you everyone!

Several hair stylists have told me that they do not have to use bleach on me and my hair is so light naturally that they could just use dye. And they wanted to use dye instead of bleach because my hair is so thin and just now starting to recover from low ferritin. They didn't feel comfortable bleaching my hair as thin as it is.

I haven't had any color on my hair for 5 years and even then, it was a demi-permanent.

I'm assuming I shouldn't have them use bleach when they don't need to, but I don't understand the concept of blonde dye being the same thing as bleach. I saw one girl who had long blonde healthy hair that was color treated and I told her I had been wanting to go blonde and she said don't bleach it. Wouldn't the hair stylists not have insisted on using the dye if it's the same as bleach? They said bleach thins out your hair, but they acted like blonde dye won't do that.

lucid
October 1st, 2017, 02:44 AM
The damage from what what they refer to as bleach is significantly worse than the damage you'll get from dye (depending of course on the strength of the developer, but still).

How long are you planning on keeping/growing your hair? That is important to know actually. My hair could take several rounds of bleach (highlightings) when I kept my hair between apl and bcl. But now that my hair is bcl, it couldn't even take one round of highlights on virgin hair. F hair is fragile, and I learned it the hard way... It took a year until I started seeing any damage, but now it's significant in the highlighted parts. This was regular bleach though.

But just mentioning it - it's good to be aware not only of immediate damage, but also long term damage.

LeonineMane
October 1st, 2017, 09:35 AM
So my questions are:
1. Can the hair stylist use dye instead of bleach to avoid the funky colors, extreme drying of the hair, purple shampoo, etc?

Definitely don't have the stylist use bleach, your hair sounds the same lightness (or level) as mine. Bleach is overkill even if its mixed the lowest volume of peroxide, it will just go a very light blonde and the colour will wash out a lot faster as all the pigment is gone and they need to darken it again, it just doesn't stick the same.
Personally i'd recommend covering your hair in coconut oil and leave it in for an hour before getting your hair dyed (it doesn't interfere with lightening, just make sure it's still in a liquid state in your hair when the dye is about to be applied, it melts very easily with a hair dryer) coconut oil greatly reduces peroxide damage.
Ask your stylist to use a level 7 or 8 Neutral/ Beige blonde demi-permanent dye, if you're a 7 already they will use an 8. Definitely don't go higher than a level 8 as that will look too blonde with your natural colour (you're a 6 or 7 by the sounds of it) and you said you want it to look natural. Level 9 may be okay on your ends if your hair is very long. Neutral/ beige blondes look great when you have a natural golden tone to your hair.

2. Is blonde dye drying to the hair? When I've had dye done on my hair before (Redken Shades EQ) it was in a light brown color but it made it extremely moisturized. My comb glid through my hair like butter. No tangles, no dryness. But bleach there was dryness and that was before the Hashimoto's started so now it's super dry. So I want to do what will be healthiest for my hair.

When your colour fades your stylist can use a toner instead of a dye to upkeep it instead of redying (redying will lighten your hair more and make the colour fade faster unless it's deposit only (what toner is), toner is extremely healthy and will cause the least damage of all the dyes/ bleaches. Like I mentioned you can keep using the coconut oil method 1 hr before each dye session (even just toner ones) and that will keep your hair in great condition.

3. I LOVE the look of the balayage. Absolutely love the balayage whenever I see it done. It looks so natural and pretty! Does it have to be done with bleach or can they do a balayage with blonde dye?

It can definitely be done with a dye!

Bleach is a powder that is mixed with peroxide and put on the hair without a colour pigment added. It's sometimes in "hi-lift" blonde dyes (they contain colour pigments), but you won't need that in your hair, hi-lift dyes are only used on very dark or stubborn hair.
The stylist will use a dye that is a pigment, likely with ammonia added (they all have ammonia or something similar that does the same thing) that is whats in the tube of colour you see them use, then they mix the peroxide in (the liquid they pour into the bowl along with what came out the tube). Peroxide is what lightens the hair and the pigment then deposits. Ammonia is there to open the hair shaft so the colour can enter and exit.

Blondieee
October 7th, 2017, 03:10 PM
Thank you for your advice everyone!

lapushka
October 7th, 2017, 03:13 PM
Thank you for your advice everyone!

How's it going now? :)

Blondieee
October 7th, 2017, 03:20 PM
Thanks for asking! :) My hair loss was looking a lot better and the bald spots were filling in, but now it seems to look bad again. I just want my hair back! I don't even care about color at this point. I just want thickness back before I even think about going blonde. I thought my thickness was coming back but it doesn't look like it.