Water damage?

[Clarisse]

In november 2015, I pretty much ruined my healthy hair. It might have been adding juice to a cassia mix or using soap and a too strong dilution of vinegar or washing in super hot water to get rid of the cassia dye - I don't know. But I got so scared from the fact that "normal" chemicals in our surroundings can do this level of damage to hair, that I started rinsing my hair more frequently. It escalated to a point where I would rinse or wash my hair almost every day, some times many times a day, and not use towels to pat dry because it would create too much laundry, meaning my hair was wet a lot and took very long time to dry. I also would spend a lot of time rinsing my hair - sometimes 30 min, sometimes almost an hour, just to be sure. Now my hair feels very dry and has almost no elasticity. Even hair close to the scalp feels rough and velcro like when wet. I thought that plain water would not damage hair. Only now do I discover hygral fatigue and the fact that hair loses protein everytime it is washed. Has anybody else had this happen to them? How much elasticity is normal? I am very upset that in an effort to save my hair I probably ruined it. Again.

[likelikepenny]

Try protein treatments. A lot of people have over moisturized and used protein treatments to help bring their hair back to a healthy state.

This is also more common in people who have fine hair.

[lapushka]

Why don't you try a normal, simple, S/C routine? I find it is always best to go back to just the very basics if you have messed up a bit (can't be too too bad, can it?) so why not? No rinses, no nothing, just S/C and leave it be for a number of days before you rinse & repeat. And do towel-dry.

[Dendra]

I know the feeling. Several things I've done to try to help my hair have made it much worse! You'll come back from it though, because you want to.

I would do lots of nourishing oil treatments as well as using rich conditioners (all on the lengths and ends only). Use a silk pillowcase to sleep on, a soft towel to dry your hair with and wear your hair in updos.

By the way I also totally hygral-fatigued my hair thinking it was the best thing for it - I wasn't using shampoo or conditioner and so I rinsed my hair with water in the shower everyday (sometimes more than once), whilst rubbing and scratching at my scalp to get it clean. Cringe.

[Clarisse]

Likelikepenny: Perhaps I should try that. I'm afraid this is permanent damage though...

Lapushka: I'm going to try that. I believe the damage is pretty bad :/ It used to be springy (I think), now shed hairs just snap if I tug at them and my hair feels so dry. It got more water in 1 year than it would usually have in 4+ years.

Dendra: Good to hear I'm not the only one. I know it will grow back, but my hair is waist length... This will take so many years!

[lapushka]

If your hair is already brittle and snapping, you do not need protein! It might only make it worse.

[Clarisse]

Thank you lapushka. I hope the snapping is hard water build up. That is the hope I cling to. I'm going to a soft water area on vacation tomorrow, so time will tell. I am afraid this is bad hygral fatigue though... I really don't know why it didn't cross my mind that extremely excessive amounts of water was a bad idea before! Even just swirling hair around in water causes degradation/loss of proteins. I can only imagine what this has done. All to save my hair from minute amounts of damaging everyday chemicals like cola, lemon, citric acid, pineapple juice, other acidic stuff, cleaning supplies, tiny amounts of leaked battery acid, enzyme washing detergent, bird poop, stuff that dripped down from scaffolding, the list goes on... Tiny drops that would never have caused this huge amount of damage to my entire head of hair.

[Ophidian]

Maybe a clarifying shampoo if you are worried about hard water build up, followed by an SMT or other deep conditioning treatment? I've always heard that snapping hair usually indicates a need for moisture. If this gives you positive results, a regular schedule of conditioning treatments for a while might not be a bad idea. Reducing the frequency and amount of time that your hair is wet seems like a good idea to me. If your scalp is happy with gentler cleansers, maybe a moisturizing shampoo for regular use (not clarifying) could allow you to stretch time between washes without stripping your hair too much. Keeping it in protective styles between washes with a light oiling might give it some time to recover and you some time to forget about it. Benign neglect instead of over-attentiveness might help both you and your hair.

I have had good results using coconut oil as a pre-poo treatment, and it is known to reduce protein loss from hair shafts during washing. I also use small amounts of it as a leave in between washes and find it improves the condition and flexibility of parts of my hair that tend to be dry (mostly ends). Not everyone has good results with coconut oil though so if you try it and don't like the way it makes your hair feel, there's no need to keep using it. Just thought I'd put it out there since it has helped me.

Don't be too hard on yourself--there are many people that do daily rinses so I don't think it's an inherently terrible idea, it just is clearly not working for you. Having recognized this, I think there's a lot you can do to rehab your hair without doing anything drastic.

[meteor]

Sorry that this happened to you. :( I agree with the light oiling recommendation and just hopefully reducing the washing & rinsing frequency and/or intensity, if you can handle it. If your scalp needs very frequent washes, but your hair gets dried out and damaged, I'd go for Scalp-Only washing techniques whenever possible (to be able to stretch out full washes a bit more) and pre-poo oiling with coconut oil to help reduce some of that hygral fatigue (study on how it reduces damage from washing and post-wash combing: http://www.beauty-review.nl/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/Effect-of-mineral-oil-sunflower-oil-and-coconut-oil-on-prevention-of-hair-damage.pdf).
Also, wet manipulation can add some mechanical damage... I'd try to be very careful about how you handle hair in the shower and while it's drying. Hair is easy to break or stretch too much when wet, so try to be gentle on it. :)

Some Scalp-Only wash techniques:
- braid held by bra-strap: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VwREj8Kadlo
- partial scalp wash with bun: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7VBOVM-dHlc
- braid held by hand: (start braiding upside-down or pretty loose at the nape, don't forget to wrap it in plastic bag)
- with a Pony-Dry: http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=136047
- etc.. etc...

[Cherriezzzzz]

Wet hair is weak. Dry hair can take more before it breaks. Wet hair can stretch too much, so while it may not break right away, it most certainly will after it's dry. I agree with lapushka: SIMPLE shampoo and conditioner. Get that hard water off your hair too. Lastly, you're describing a "no poo" method and those sort of things (like soap for hair!) It's incompatible with hard water. That nasty feeling could be clarified off with a baking soda rinse, followed by acv rinse AND get into a deep conditioner, oiling, etc. The telltale sign is how your describing your hair while wet. That's classic no poo methods with hard water.

[likelikepenny]

Hair has a delicate protein/moisture balance. If your hair goes too far into moisture, it'll stretch and then snap aka no elasticity.

This link is very informative:
http://www.curlynikki.com/2014/11/moisture-protein-finding-right-balance.html

[lapushka]

Hair has a delicate protein/moisture balance. If your hair goes too far into moisture, it'll stretch and then snap aka no elasticity.

This link is very informative:
http://www.curlynikki.com/2014/11/moisture-protein-finding-right-balance.html

Hmm, so it can snap either way? :hmm:

[likelikepenny]

Hmm, so it can snap either way? :hmm:

Yes. It's just a matter of whether it stretches before it snaps or not.

If it stretches and stretches then snaps, you need protein.
If the strand has no give (elasticity) before it snaps then it needs moisture.

I believe I said that correctly?

[Nymphe]

Were you trying to do water-only?

[Clarisse]

Thank you for sympathy and suggestions everybody! Benign neglect is probably the way to go, it's just so hard when the hair feels so damaged.


Wet hair is weak. Dry hair can take more before it breaks. Wet hair can stretch too much, so while it may not break right away, it most certainly will after it's dry. .



Also, wet manipulation can add some mechanical damage... I'd try to be very careful about how you handle hair in the shower and while it's drying. Hair is easy to break or stretch too much when wet, so try to be gentle on it. :)


Yeah, I believe this has happened too. I have made some cinnabuns with drenching wet hair then locked it down with a super tight scrunchie around. I don't think there was enough give for the hair to contract properly when it dried. However, it's not only the length in the bun that feels damaged, so I guess it's not the sole reason. Actually, my hair (post 2015 growth when it got super damaged) feels pretty uniform in quality, so perhaps I somehow managed to not over-stretch my hair? I don't really know how, logic tells me it should be over-stretched.

[Obsidian]

Do you have hard water? If so, I can imagine there is a lot of minerals build up that needs removed with a chelating shampoo.

[lapushka]

Yes. It's just a matter of whether it stretches before it snaps or not.

If it stretches and stretches then snaps, you need protein.
If the strand has no give (elasticity) before it snaps then it needs moisture.

I believe I said that correctly?

I thought it was the other way round. :hmm:

[spidermom]

I thought it was the other way round. :hmm:
No, I'm pretty sure likelikepenny got it right.

I second or third going back to a simple shampoo and condition routine. It's popular with so many people because it works.

[Clarisse]

Do you have hard water? If so, I can imagine there is a lot of minerals build up that needs removed with a chelating shampoo.

I really hope this is just build up, but I don't think so :(


It's popular with so many people because it works. Great way to say it, haha. I do S/C, I just rinsed my hair too. A lot.

[Ophidian]

I really hope this is just build up, but I don't think so :(

Great way to say it, haha. I do S/C, I just rinsed my hair too. A lot.

So maybe you just need to wash less often and do some extra treatments to get a healthier protein/moisture balance back? I mean, you won't know if hard water buildup is part of the problem until you clarify/chelate or if protein is what you need until you try a protein treatment. Whatever you do, it seems like maybe more was going on with the intensive rinsing than just trying out a new wash routine? If I'm out of line in saying that please pardon me. It just seems like sometimes when we feel like something is out of whack in ourselves or our lives sometimes it comes out in the way we treat our hair. I used to get really depressed and dye my hair because I just really wanted something to be different and then shave it all off because I didn't like it and end up feeling worse. Dying and cutting hair is not symptomatic of any bigger problem for most people of course, but for me it said a lot about my state of mind. Anyway, I hope you're getting the support you need and that you can find out what your hair is wanting. You seem to be feeling like there's no hope, but I really do think you can get back on the right track with a pretty basic routine that emphasizes getting some protein back into your hair and keeping it dry and protected more often than not. A light oiling with something penetrating like coconut before washes can also help your strands not absorb too much water when you do wet them.

[Clarisse]

Whatever you do, it seems like maybe more was going on with the intensive rinsing than just trying out a new wash routine? If I'm out of line in saying that please pardon me. It just seems like sometimes when we feel like something is out of whack in ourselves or our lives sometimes it comes out in the way we treat our hair.

I think you are right. Thank you for sharing your story. I have been through a stressful year (wrote my thesis, finished my degree, been job hunting, started my first full time job, been broken up with etc) and the more stressed I was, the more I felt like my hair constantly needed to be rinsed very thoroughly to get rid of damaging pollutants when really I was probably trying to wash away other problems in my life. Only now do I realize that water itself will damage hair if it is rinsed this much. I just never heard about water being damaging and then assumed if a little water is okay, then a lot of water is okay too. My hair has probably been wet more often than it has been dry some months, being dry only at work. It has gotten many years worth of damage in a very short time. Cringe.

[Dendra]

I think you are right. Thank you for sharing your story. I have been through a stressful year (wrote my thesis, finished my degree, been job hunting, started my first full time job, been broken up with etc) and the more stressed I was, the more I felt like my hair constantly needed to be rinsed very thoroughly to get rid of damaging pollutants when really I was probably trying to wash away other problems in my life. Only now do I realize that water itself will damage hair if it is rinsed this much. I just never heard about water being damaging and then assumed if a little water is okay, then a lot of water is okay too. My hair has probably been wet more often than it has been dry some months, being dry only at work. It has gotten many years worth of damage in a very short time. Cringe.

I feel for you :blossom:

Sometimes life gets in the way and there's no way of controlling it, you just have to learn from it. So now you know about hygral fatigue, you can avoid it this time around. You'll get through this :flowers:

[renia22]

Clarisse- the water may have contributed to it, but in your post you also said you were using soap and too strong of a dilution of vinegar sometimes? This probably contributed to the dry hair (the alkaline/ acidic cycle can really mess with the hair cuticle). Anyways, I agree with others to maybe just try a regular shampoo and conditioner routine (ph balanced), and perhaps a very light coconut oil application prior to washing. I don't know if you've ever tried it before, but it's hard to wash out, so maybe just touch it until your fingertips are shiny and gently apply to damaged/ dry areas and leave on for 14+ hours, coconut oil has been proven to penetrate the hair shaft in that amount of time. Anyways, here's some info on ph:

http://science-yhairblog.blogspot.com/2013/07/ph-and-your-hair-little-redox-to-make.html?m=1

[Hairkay]

I'm water rinsing daily (more than once on very hot days) using hard water but I don't see a problem with my hair. I tend to spend 10 minutes at a time because my skin can't take more than that so I don't think my hair can either. My hair ends do get dry and are prone to ssk which is more to it being the oldest hair and the nature of tight curls. I put a little oil on it to seal in moisture. I don't use hair products so I'm unlikely to have silicone on my hair. I just do s & d to get rid of the knots.

[Clarisse]

Thank you, Dendra! :)

Renia: I stopped using soap and vinegar after serious damage in november 2015. Thank you for the coconut oil suggestion :)

Hairkay: Good to know that somebody has used water everyday with no damage. Gives me some hope for my hair :) (although my hair has been wet way more than 10 min a day)