Breaking news: No traces of aloe in several aloe vera gels!

[Seratopia]

Here is the link to the article.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-11-22/no-evidence-of-aloe-vera-found-in-the-aloe-vera-at-wal-mart-cvs

I found this article while browsing on reddit and thought it would be of interest of you guys here. I know some of you may use aloe in your SMTs. I purchased some pure aloe juice (as advertised) from walmart recently and now I am paranoid this isnt even aloe. I might skip walmart, target, and cvs aloe products altogether. Hope this will help anyone in the future.

Btw I am having the worse time getting into this site lately due to the webpage freezing up on me. I am just happy I can post this up while I can.

Thoughts and discussion are encouraged. :)

[teal]

Aloeveragate! If this is true, it might explain why people have such varied results! :thud:

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-11-22/no-evidence-of-aloe-vera-found-in-the-aloe-vera-at-wal-mart-cvs

[gthlvrmx]

Wow. Nevermind on the thought of trying out aloe gels from a bottle for SMT's. Right from the plant for me.

[ephemeri]

I've been using George's aloe (http://www.warrenlabsaloe.com) for my SMTs. It's definitely more expensive than FOTE but I was assured it was real. Still, I'm only taking someone's word for it. But hopefully it is real!

I've always been a little suspicious of the really cheap aloe gels, seeing as how it takes a lot of plant to get any significant amount of gel...
Anyway, sad to hear this news.

[Wildcat Diva]

Dammit!

No wonder my SMT almost always clumps and clots!

Damn them!!

*grabs pitchfork*

[Anje]

Well, this definitely makes me feel better about the fact that I started leaving it out of SMTs and the like because I didn't see much benefit.

I suppose I ought to get a plant again, some time.

[CindyOfTheOaks]

Doesn't that beat all !


smh...

[littlestarface]

Ugh, good thing I never bought that crap n did smts, I had been wanting to try one too and was thinking to get aloe from amazon but who knows if its even aloe. I'll stick with my own honey n conditioner method until I find a aloe plant.

[Obsidian]

Hmm, I bet this is why aloe gel always made my hair feel coated and plasticy. Now I feel bad that I let my giant aloe plant freeze outside:(

[Spinder]

Get aloe from a health food store - usually that's your best bet. "Aloe" products from the department/drug store are just about always fake/watered down/useless junk.

It's a lot like olive oil - real, pure stuff is shockingly very hard to find. The cheap "pure olive oil" you get from the department store either in fact watered down with cheaper oil, or outright pure fakery.

[Rebeccalaurenxx]

I buy my aloe gel from the health food store, but I know the aloe juice you are referring to and I am 95% sure that one is real aloe juice.
It also appears to be that they tested the Gel and those gels they tested are not the aloe you should be using, like the green.
The aloe juice is not the same btw, it is taken internally and the rules are more strict I believe... I think what you bought was probably fine.

[lithostoic]

Damn, I walk :/ Too bad, I was going to buy more aloe from CVS.

[Mrstran]

Lol I was tempted to get it, but then remembered not to slap too many things on my head

Good thing either way I guess. :spam:

[vampyyri]

But... I have one of these (Fruit of the Earth) and I've never realized anything strange from it... :couch:

[Nightshade]

Makes me happy I have and use my own monster aloe plant.

[Llama]

I heard about this. Makes me sick that companies would lie about the ingredients in their products.

Although I have always thought those kinds of aloe vera products had too many "other" ingredients in them anyways.

[Shorty89]

I was a bit worried since I purchased my latest bottle of AVG from Walmart but thankfully it was a brand name.

[teal]

But... I have one of these (Fruit of the Earth) and I've never realized anything strange from it... :couch:

Heh, I have a (mostly used) bottle of FOTE aloe "100% gel*" - as I just noticed on the front of the bottle, lol - and I now have no idea whether the aloe hair recipes I did try had legit results. I do remember applying it to my skin and thinking the gel didn't feel quite the same kind of sticky as the gel from my aloe plant. These days I'm pretty much only using it as replacement for shaving cream, though, so I'm not as concerned about the ramifications as I imagine some others here will be.


Makes me happy I have and use my own monster aloe plant.

My aloe plant is small and has been through several generations. It has been living in a mug for several years now and needs to be repotted. I'm not sure if our climate will ever let an aloe plant get huge, even indoors.

[hanne jensen]

Heh, I have a (mostly used) bottle of FOTE aloe "100% gel*" - as I just noticed on the front of the bottle, lol - and I now have no idea whether the aloe hair recipes I did try had legit results. I do remember applying it to my skin and thinking the gel didn't feel quite the same kind of sticky as the gel from my aloe plant. These days I'm pretty much only using it as replacement for shaving cream, though, so I'm not as concerned about the ramifications as I imagine some others here will be.



My aloe plant is small and has been through several generations. It has been living in a mug for several years now and needs to be repotted. I'm not sure if our climate will ever let an aloe plant get huge, even indoors.

I live in Denmark and have grown aloe plants with great success. They actually don't like strong sun so I have mine in a northwest window. If you don't have such a window, place the aloe inside the room. They also don't like a lot of water or nutrients. I blend aquarium gravel with potting soil, about 1/3 gravel with 2/3 soil for my succulents. Much cheaper than special soil for cacti and succulents. I water mine about once a month. If I remember. My aloe isn't huge but gives a lot of side shoots-babies. It's big in girth as I'm too lazy to pot each new plant. When the aloe starts to crawl out of the pot I'll cut the pot away and give it a bigger one.
'

[truepeacenik]

I have an aloe outdoors in the coolish part of the Bay Area. Bet you could do well, teal.

All four brands tested were not marketed as 100 percent aloe gel. They are claiming the aloe part is 100 percent pure.

Big difference. And marketing writing. Ugh.

[Anje]

My aloe plant is small and has been through several generations. It has been living in a mug for several years now and needs to be repotted. I'm not sure if our climate will ever let an aloe plant get huge, even indoors.

My former roommate has this enormous aloe grown indoors in Wisconsin that spits off babies constantly. It's probably 3 feet across. Repotted in larger pots (like 8" ones), the babies have gotten quite large too. There was a period after she moved out where we must have had like a dozen of the things, which managed to survive me not watering them for a year.

Husband went on an Aloe plant cleanse. Now we don't have any. :D

[lapushka]

I thought you had aloe gels + lidocaine (of course: for (sun)burns and such), and aloe - lidocaine, and that it was the last you needed to be on the lookout for. I don't see what's wrong with FOTE, TBH. :shrug:

[01]

...why it doesn't surprise me? Lol.

[Nightshade]

Heh, I have a (mostly used) bottle of FOTE aloe "100% gel*" - as I just noticed on the front of the bottle, lol - and I now have no idea whether the aloe hair recipes I did try had legit results. I do remember applying it to my skin and thinking the gel didn't feel quite the same kind of sticky as the gel from my aloe plant. These days I'm pretty much only using it as replacement for shaving cream, though, so I'm not as concerned about the ramifications as I imagine some others here will be.



My aloe plant is small and has been through several generations. It has been living in a mug for several years now and needs to be repotted. I'm not sure if our climate will ever let an aloe plant get huge, even indoors.

I'm in Minnesota, so not exactly the tropics XD My aloe plant was one I rescued from outside a dumpster when I was in college. It's now just massive with the biggest leaves wider than my hand. Its pot is on wheels because I can't possibly lift the thing XD

[Adiro]

I have some from Wallmart too, that i never had a chance to use yet.... maybe i should just toss it....i didnt like it taht it came in a plastick container,but i could not find otehr.... i wish i could find some stored in glass, because it has citric acid preservative added to it....

[TatsuOni]

I'm so glad that I have my own plants that I use. Thank you to my friend who gave them to me:)

[DarleneH]

Hmm, I bet this is why aloe gel always made my hair feel coated and plasticy. Now I feel bad that I let my giant aloe plant freeze outside:(

This thread had me thinking about putting a plant outside! I've never gotten one inside to be big enough to be much good. I live in the South so I probably have better weather for that than you do in Idaho. Plus I have a south-facing flower bed with nothing else in it right now. Do you have any tips for that? All I ever see is tiny plants, and I'm wondering how long it would take me to get one of those to grow to a good size?

[DarleneH]

I live in Denmark and have grown aloe plants with great success. They actually don't like strong sun so I have mine in a northwest window. If you don't have such a window, place the aloe inside the room. They also don't like a lot of water or nutrients. I blend aquarium gravel with potting soil, about 1/3 gravel with 2/3 soil for my succulents. Much cheaper than special soil for cacti and succulents. I water mine about once a month. If I remember. My aloe isn't huge but gives a lot of side shoots-babies. It's big in girth as I'm too lazy to pot each new plant. When the aloe starts to crawl out of the pot I'll cut the pot away and give it a bigger one.
'

OK, I didn't see your post until after my last comment. I also have a north-facing flower bed I could do this in. It's not northwest, so I'm not sure that due north would give it enough sun?

[Nymphe]

Not surprised, I was told years ago those clear gels were fake. The news media is so slow! Lily of the Valley was the only store-bought one I have dealt with, had better stuff with eBay vendors.

[Obsidian]

This thread had me thinking about putting a plant outside! I've never gotten one inside to be big enough to be much good. I live in the South so I probably have better weather for that than you do in Idaho. Plus I have a south-facing flower bed with nothing else in it right now. Do you have any tips for that? All I ever see is tiny plants, and I'm wondering how long it would take me to get one of those to grow to a good size?

Not sure how fast they grow, mine was big when it was given to me. I grew mine outside in the summer, brought it in for the winter. I just didn't have room for it this year so I left it out one night when it froze.

I've seen decently sized ones at home depot but I bet you could find a start on Craigslist. I'll have to get another next year.

I was able to keep mine in full sun but it did start to burn when it got really hot. Once it gets in the 90's, best to put it someplace with afternoon shade.

[meteor]

Wow, that's quite disappointing. Thanks so much for sharing, teal! :) That's great to know!
I only use a bit of aloe in skin care, and I definitely noticed a big difference between using fresh aloe from the plant vs. manufactured gels, but I thought the difference could have been explained by the additives... I've also been wondering for a while how on earth they manage to sell so much aloe gel every year so cheaply if it takes harvesting so many plants (according to the article, "making just 1 kilogram of aloe powder, the ingredient used in finished goods like gels and drinks, requires 400 kilos (882 pounds) of aloe leaves")? Well, replacing with maltodextrin could explain the mystery, I guess. :lol:

I am pretty happy that they are taking this issue to court to clarify the matter, as it's quite possible that something about the processing or the final formulation (ingredient interactions) could make markers not show as easily in the lab testing, maybe? I don't know, but for sure, it's worth taking the investigation further.

And I found it a bit telling that "the lab that did the testing requested anonymity to preserve its business relationships". I mean, they have to worry about their current or potential contracts just because of doing this job, testing the claims independently? :bigeyes: Wow.

I wish they'd also test different brands of aloe vera juice, as well. :)

[gthlvrmx]

Wow, that's quite disappointing. Thanks so much for sharing, teal! :) That's great to know!
I only use a bit of aloe in skin care, and I definitely noticed a big difference between using fresh aloe from the plant vs. manufactured gels, but I thought the difference could have been explained by the additives... I've also been wondering for a while how on earth they manage to sell so much aloe gel every year so cheaply if it takes harvesting so many plants (according to the article, "making just 1 kilogram of aloe powder, the ingredient used in finished goods like gels and drinks, requires 400 kilos (882 pounds) of aloe leaves")? Well, replacing with maltodextrin could explain the mystery, I guess. :lol:

I am pretty happy that they are taking this issue to court to clarify the matter, as it's quite possible that something about the processing or the final formulation (ingredient interactions) could make markers not show as easily in the lab testing, maybe? I don't know, but for sure, it's worth taking the investigation further.

And I found it a bit telling that "the lab that did the testing requested anonymity to preserve its business relationships". I mean, they have to worry about their current or potential contracts just because of doing this job, testing the claims independently? :bigeyes: Wow.

I wish they'd also test different brands of aloe vera juice, as well. :)
You know, I have read now in two or three separate places (first in a gardening book I got from the library) that ingesting aloe vera is harmful and toxic to humans, but that made me so confused. What about the aloe vera drinks that are sold? Unless they also don't have true aloe vera in it as well.

[Obsidian]

It's the outer skin of aloe that not safe, the inside gel is OK. I know the aloe drink I get sometimes had actual chunks of aloe gel in it.

[teal]

I live in Denmark and have grown aloe plants with great success. They actually don't like strong sun so I have mine in a northwest window. If you don't have such a window, place the aloe inside the room. They also don't like a lot of water or nutrients. I blend aquarium gravel with potting soil, about 1/3 gravel with 2/3 soil for my succulents. Much cheaper than special soil for cacti and succulents.

Thanks for this! :flower: As it so happens, I do have some spare aquarium gravel left over from setting up a new tank. Convenient! :thumbsup: I will repot my aloe and see if it goes on a growth spurt. It doesn't seem to be unhappy in the mug - the colour is right and it seems healthy enough, no signs of disease - but it doesn't really have much room.


I have an aloe outdoors in the coolish part of the Bay Area. Bet you could do well, teal.

All four brands tested were not marketed as 100 percent aloe gel. They are claiming the aloe part is 100 percent pure.

Big difference. And marketing writing. Ugh.

I will keep striving to grow the aloe to the best of its ability! WE WILL REPOT. :lol:


I don't see what's wrong with FOTE, TBH. :shrug:

Misrepresentation is what's wrong. If the bottle says it contains aloe vera gel, I think it should actually contain some aloe vera, and the packaging should be both honest and straightforward about how much aloe it contains. If people want a maltodextrin gel, that's totally ok as long as it's not sold masquerading as something else.

I mean, by the looks of this packaging, most people would think this is 100% aloe vera gel:
https://www.amazon.ca/Fruit-Earth-Aloe-Vera-100/dp/B000ALDK1A

Let's give them the benefit of the doubt and say there is actually some aloe in there. It's not 100%. It might not even be 1%. Whatever it is, the packaging should be honest.

[Rebeccalaurenxx]

Good thing I do not see a huge difference between using and not using aloe in my SMT!

[Maelyssa]

I'm in Minnesota, so not exactly the tropics XD My aloe plant was one I rescued from outside a dumpster when I was in college. It's now just massive with the biggest leaves wider than my hand. Its pot is on wheels because I can't possibly lift the thing XD

Holy WOW that's big! :) Let me ask...any issue with the fur babies nibbling on it? Is it mostly safe for them if they do?
I'm currently very much looking for a new plant because unbeknownst to me, two of my kids were watering my bonsai for me on top of my own watering so yeah...I don't think there's salvaging it. It looks mostly brown and dried out from death I believe. The new plant is going somewhere more out of reach and I think an aloe would be great to get.

[Anje]

Hey, I joined the two threads about this, so if it seems a little disjointed, that's why. :)

[lora410]

Sadly I see this all the time. I saw argan oil and when I looked at the label it was a blend of oils and the first wasn't argan. Always, always check your labels on everything

[meteor]

Sadly I see this all the time. I saw argan oil and when I looked at the label it was a blend of oils and the first wasn't argan. Always, always check your labels on everything

Very true. :) However, the issue in the article is that the ingredients lists do explicitly mention aloe vera gel or aloe barbadensis leaf juice or leaf extract, but the independent lab tests didn't find the markers to support those claims. So reading the ingredients lists would not help in that situation at all, since the ingredients lists are misleading. But an "argan" or "Moroccan" oil product that provides an honest ingredients list (with no mention of argan oil / argania spinosa there, for example) is different in that we can at least read the fine print of the ingredients list to establish the absence of this ingredient or its low placement on the list.

Listing stuff on the ingredients lists that isn't even there is what triggered legal action here. There is a possibility, of course, that the markers were not tested properly or some ingredient interactions interfered with results or something else happened..., but hopefully, all this will be established in the near future.

[PixieP]

This is why I stick to my Jäsön 98% aloe gel, even though I'm not too happy they added perfume to it. At least I know that it's aloe and working for me.

[Ligeia Noire]

mine is lily of the desert, man this is so frustrating, what good it serves us to read the labels if they lie regarding what it is there? Really hope the test was not very accurate...

[renia22]

I don't have a plant, but I buy my aloe from Mountain Rose Herbs. It's rather liquid-y, beige in color and only contains aloe and a little bit of xanthan gum as a thicker and citric acid as a preservative. It still needs to be refrigerated, though. That's a huge give away that it's not real aloe, is if you don't have to refrigerate it after opening.

[Stars]

Well gee! I have used Fruit of the Earth gel and juice for years. It must contain aloe because when I apply it to burns it soothes it perfectly and heals it. But just to be on the safe side, I'll find another organic brand to use. I hardly ever buy store-brands for cosmetics and health products because the quality assurance is often lacking. The FOTE juice I refrigerated just to be safe even though it contained citric acid as a preservative. I have never refrigerated the FOTE aloe gel (clear in the pump bottle) and it's still good years later so I guess it isn't pure aloe after all.

Even organic products have been found to be adulterated and full of pesticides so one cannot win for losing. I guess the only way to be absolutely sure is to buy a plant and extract your own gel and juice. People charge a premium for organic products and then use shoddy ingredients. Many brands and companies have been caught red-handed.

[Wildcat Diva]

I'm still randomly feeling pissed about this.


I found a scrubby little baby aloe plant abandoned in the flower bed and I've potted it now and moved it on the porch. I'll bring it in if it freezes. (Yeah right, it's hot here.)

[kuroi]

I use aloë pura brand gel, it stages it contains 99.9% organic aloë vera. I wonder if thats real then.
I also have a few plants myself but they're way too small to harvest regularly for my hair. I guess I need to give them a few years to become nice and big.

[betterhairday]

Heh, I have a (mostly used) bottle of FOTE aloe "100% gel*" - as I just noticed on the front of the bottle, lol - and I now have no idea whether the aloe hair recipes I did try had legit results. I do remember applying it to my skin and thinking the gel didn't feel quite the same kind of sticky as the gel from my aloe plant. These days I'm pretty much only using it as replacement for shaving cream, though, so I'm not as concerned about the ramifications as I imagine some others here will be.



My aloe plant is small and has been through several generations. It has been living in a mug for several years now and needs to be repotted. I'm not sure if our climate will ever let an aloe plant get huge, even indoors.

I live in Wales, UK and my aloe vera plant sits in front of a plate glass floor to ceiling window which is south facing and when it is sunny it has the benefit for most of the day, it thrives and I harvest the aloe vera gel from the plant once a week, mix it with rice flour and 1 teaspoon of brown sugar and use it as my scrub when I use my Monsia Sonic 3 facial cleansing brush. I keep 2 plants and alternate between the 2, seems to work OK, oh I feed them religiously also, I use tomatoe fertilizer! My plants have been going for the last 2 years but I did buy them when they were around 1foot approximately.

[renia22]

kuroi- your Pura aloe looks very similar to the Fruit of the Earth brand we have here in the US. I think when they say things like the use "99.9% aloe", what they mean is the aloe that is used is 99.9 % pure aloe, not that the gel itself contains 99.9 percent aloe. Basically they don't reveal what percentage of the product is aloe - a play on words. The Fruit of the Earth brand also says "100% gel"...yup it 100% gel alright..maybe there's some aloe in there, but you can't find a figure online that tells you what percentage of the product is actually aloe.

Once you get a Health food store brand that needs to be refrigerated after opening, it's easy to spot the ones that may not have a lot of aloe in them. Not needing refrigeration is a dead give away, but also if it's clear, green, or thick enough to be in a tube. Also the scent. Aloe does have its own natural scent, so if it doesn't have a scent, or it has added fragrance, it's probably not "real" aloe (or only has a small percentage in there somewhere).

I think some of them are fine, depending on what you are using them for. If you shave with it or want a styling gel for your hair or something, the store bought ones are probably fine. I use mine for hair loss, and have it around in case of burns, so for that reason I shell out more for the good stuff. Mountain Rose Herbs is always my first choice, but Aubrey Organics makes a 4 ounce size one too that I sometimes buy, but I have no idea if it's still good or not, since the owners kids took over the company and made a bunch of changes. I used to like that one for the small size and affordability.

[renia22]

Here's a photo of the Mountain Rose Herbs aloe in case anyone is interested. You can see it's not exactly a gel, but more liquidy, and rather than being totally see though and clear, it has a slight cloudy/ beige cast:






http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd39/elikitty/image_zps8o7iw3gs.jpeg (http://s225.photobucket.com/user/elikitty/media/image_zps8o7iw3gs.jpeg.html)

[Nightshade]

Here's a photo of the Mountain Rose Herbs aloe in case anyone is interested. You can see it's not exactly a gel, but more liquidy, and rather than being totally see though and clear, it has a slight cloudy/ beige cast:






http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd39/elikitty/image_zps8o7iw3gs.jpeg (http://s225.photobucket.com/user/elikitty/media/image_zps8o7iw3gs.jpeg.html)

Whenever I can't safely harvest from my plant without hurting it I use MRH aloe. It is the real deal and very good stuff :)

[vampyyri]

I'm still randomly feeling pissed about this.

Me too... So much so that I've put my FOTE gel into the cabinet of no return until I need it in the summer. I need to find another brand one of these days.

[HairPlease]

Is there nothing we can trust anymore? Kidding about that of course, but this is absurd. I hope it was just a bad test. I don't use any aloe gels, but it's good to know I should avoid the big commercial brands in favor of something more genuine.

[Nightshade]

Is there nothing we can trust anymore? Kidding about that of course, but this is absurd. I hope it was just a bad test. I don't use any aloe gels, but it's good to know I should avoid the big commercial brands in favor of something more genuine.

Sadly, a good indicator for this IS price.

If you've ever looked up the cost of powdered aloe, or fresh aloe, it is expensive and has a shelf life.

There is just no way you're getting nearly-pure (figuring a few preservatives) aloe in a giant tub from Wal-Mart for 99 cents on sale. It just isn't happening.

[renia22]

Whenever I can't safely harvest from my plant without hurting it I use MRH aloe. It is the real deal and very good stuff :)

They are one of my favorite companies, especially if I need something for medicinal purposes. Love them :)


^ true what you said about the pricing as well. Real aloe is not cheap :/

[littlestarface]

Whenever I can't safely harvest from my plant without hurting it I use MRH aloe. It is the real deal and very good stuff :)

Thanks for that i'll buy from there.

[Nightshade]

Here's the link (https://www.mountainroseherbs.com/products/aloe-vera-gel/profile):)

[Hairkay]

There's always buying fresh aloe leaves or the plant to have at hand. Even I see them sold at a local green grocer. I've seen some extract the gel and make it into ice-cubes ready to have a little at use when needed.

[swearnsue]

A few years ago they tested honey and found many had little or no honey in it. Including the cute honey bears. So good grief.

[Wildcat Diva]

^^^ damn SMT is some high maintenance ****.

[littlestarface]

A few years ago they tested honey and found many had little or no honey in it. Including the cute honey bears. So good grief.

What the? Which honey is fake?

[jfg1987]

Oh I remember this! My mom had a thing for Sue Bee clover honey and that brand ended up on the list of altered honey products. Busy Bee was also on the list. Now we just buy from a farmer's market when we go apple picking.

Edit: here's (http://www.foodsafetynews.com/2011/11/tests-show-most-store-honey-isnt-honey/) a good explanation with a list of products

Edit again: then there's this (http://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2011/11/25/142659547/relax-folks-it-really-is-honey-after-all) that says the above link is :bs:

So maybe we fell for the hype? But supporting your local beekeeper isn't so bad...

[Ligeia Noire]

everything is half fake boys and girls unless you grow it yourself, mom says

[Wildcat Diva]

I studied this same principle with olive oil. I don't trust regular store brands anymore.

https://www.google.com/amp/www.eater.com/platform/amp/2016/2/4/10903992/olive-oil-fraud-dangers-prevention

I get olive oil shipped from an olive ranch in my same state a few hours away. And it's (freakin') $22ish a bottle. Hey, but I got a co-worker to go in with me and we got free shipping.

https://texasoliveranch.com/

[Groovy Granny]

Well gee! I have used Fruit of the Earth gel and juice for years. It must contain aloe because when I apply it to burns it soothes it perfectly and heals it.

I have had the same experience.....though my hair hates aloe :p

[TatsuOni]

I buy my honey directly from a beekeeper :) It's a big difference and tastes better than the stuff you buy in the store.

[hanne jensen]

OK, I didn't see your post until after my last comment. I also have a north-facing flower bed I could do this in. It's not northwest, so I'm not sure that due north would give it enough sun?

Outside in the South USA your aloe should do very well in a north facing bed. Just make sure that the soil has very good drainage so the roots don't rot.

[renia22]

I buy raw local honey from a beekeeper next town over too. It's supposed to be the best for seasonal allergies/ your immune system. Good to know about the olive oil too, wildcat diva, I'm going to poke around and see what we have around here.

[Nightshade]

I buy my honey directly from a beekeeper :) It's a big difference and tastes better than the stuff you buy in the store.


I buy raw local honey from a beekeeper next town over too. It's supposed to be the best for seasonal allergies/ your immune system. Good to know about the olive oil too, wildcat diva, I'm going to poke around and see what we have around here.

I get my honey from the backyard XD

[teal]

A few years ago they tested honey and found many had little or no honey in it. Including the cute honey bears. So good grief.

What?! Good thing I get my honey from my friend who keeps bees for a living.


^^^ damn SMT is some high maintenance ****.

Right? You have to vet the supply chain of everything before you can even be assured it's an SMT :lol: ...

...unless SnowyMoon did the tests with products that were fraudulent...

:bigeyes:


I get my honey from the backyard XD

Rub it in why don't you :lala: :lol:

Soon... soon....

[littlestarface]

What?! Good thing I get my honey from my friend who keeps bees for a living.



Right? You have to vet the supply chain of everything before you can even be assured it's an SMT :lol: ...

...unless SnowyMoon did the tests with products that were fraudulent...

:bigeyes:



Rub it in why don't you :lala: :lol:

Soon... soon....

I know right looool.

Nightshade i'm gonna have to rob your backyard.

[Nightshade]

I mean you're welcome to try XD the 80,000 bees might say otherwise :lol: