Extremely shy waves

[leilan]

Alright, so a month ago I posted this thread: http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=138756 about my hair type changing. I've been experimenting for the last month with some methods to enhance my waves, including plopping, leave-in, gel, LOC, etc.

I have learned that my hair is just too fine and thin to do well with any product left in it. And the only thing so far that brings out the waves significantly is shampoo bars. Unfortunately, I don't really like the texture I'm left with while using them. It ends up rather rough and tangle-prone. Even just minor finger detangling pulls the waves out, as well. But it seems to me that it is the lack of conditioner that is letting those waves emerge- even just a little bit of weight from the coating ingredients left from conditioner pulls the waves out.

Here are a few things I've thought of to try: replacing conditioner with catnip, using a shampoo/conditioner combo (like Wen?), using a shampoo that folks have said don't need a conditioner after (specifically, Shea Moisture Fruit Fusion Weightless Shampoo).

So, does anyone have suggestions? I'd like to find an extremely light shampoo that doesn't have any (or many) coating ingredients, and maybe a super light conditioner as well. I don't know if there is such a thing!

I love my hair no matter what the texture is, so even if I can't get my waves out consistently, I'll still be happy. But I want to explore all my options first!

[lapushka]

I think in the end, just use what you *need* to use to keep tangles and mechanical damage at bay, and that usually means you need some sort of conditioning agent. And then whatever remains is what you have to work with, and in the end it is in part accepting what your texture can and cannot do. For the most part. :flower:

[leilan]

I think in the end, just use what you *need* to use to keep tangles and mechanical damage at bay, and that usually means you need some sort of conditioning agent. And then whatever remains is what you have to work with, and in the end it is in part accepting what your texture can and cannot do. For the most part. :flower:

Very true! It is quite likely that I will stick to using a conditioner, even if it means sacrificing my waves. But I want to explore all my options first! And perhaps I'll be able to find a very light conditioner that still allows my waves to show... I can hope, anyway!

[Anje]

Well, a shampoo shouldn't coat. They're supposed to remove that stuff! XD

One thing that might be worth trying is a bit of protein. It varies a lot person-to-person, but it seems like it might make your waves a bit more robust, if your hair is OK with it. That said, I hear you -- my waves brush out to not much pretty readily. Since I wear my hair contained normally, I don't stress about that.

[lapushka]

Very true! It is quite likely that I will stick to using a conditioner, even if it means sacrificing my waves. But I want to explore all my options first! And perhaps I'll be able to find a very light conditioner that still allows my waves to show... I can hope, anyway!

I think the Pantene Aqua Light conditioner is quite a light one. I have used it in the past at some point and it did not weigh my hair down. Also, the Inecto coconut conditioner (can't get my tangles out, it is so light) might be a good one to try as well. If they have that one in the US.

The Inecto has no silicones.

[leilan]

Well, a shampoo shouldn't coat. They're supposed to remove that stuff! XD

One thing that might be worth trying is a bit of protein. It varies a lot person-to-person, but it seems like it might make your waves a bit more robust, if your hair is OK with it. That said, I hear you -- my waves brush out to not much pretty readily. Since I wear my hair contained normally, I don't stress about that.

Anje, I've found that quite often with sulfate-free shampoos, they are chock full of plant extracts, some of which can leave a coating, I believe. And with regular shampoos, I know that some have started putting cones in.

I have actually been experimenting with protein, too! For the past month I've been using Aubrey Organics GPB Conditioner, which has been making my hair feel very soft. And I tried a very short gelatin treatment, since it was my first one. I want to try a longer one, though! So far, my hair seems to like protein pretty well.



I think the Pantene Aqua Light conditioner is quite a light one. I have used it in the past at some point and it did not weigh my hair down. Also, the Inecto coconut conditioner (can't get my tangles out, it is so light) might be a good one to try as well. If they have that one in the US.

The Inecto has no silicones.

Thank you for the product recs, lapushka! I'll look into both of those.

[samanthaa]

What about a citric acid or ACV rinse to follow up your use of shampoo bars? (I'm pretty sure I remember you posting a thread about troubleshooting shampoo bars [I really hope I'm remembering correctly! eek!]; can't remember if you were using an acidic rinse.) Maybe you can try a combination of things? Maybe using catnip tea/chamomile tea/other herbs as the "water" to dilute your acidic rinse? There are plenty of herbal conditioner substitutes. I've never bought from her personally so I can't recommend anything, but maybe you can look around this Etsy shop (https://www.etsy.com/shop/NightBlooming?ref=l2-shopheader-name) for ideas.

Protein is a good suggestion, as Anje said.

What about homemade flax seed gel as an enhancement for your waves? Again, I haven't used it so I can't make a personal recommendation, but I've read through the thread and I know that you can make it as strong or as weak as you need for you hair, and it shouldn't leave it hard like commercial gels.

Of course, there's always braids and buns to enhance waves, but I get it, that's not your "natural" texture. I'm sure I'd have way more wave to my hair if I didn't use conditioner/let it dry without combing or touching it (my hair seems to want to burst out of its 1b classification sometimes, especially at the very ends), but I have no plans to do that because it'd be unmanageable and probably would drive me up a wall.

[leilan]

What about a citric acid or ACV rinse to follow up your use of shampoo bars? (I'm pretty sure I remember you posting a thread about troubleshooting shampoo bars [I really hope I'm remembering correctly! eek!]; can't remember if you were using an acidic rinse.) Maybe you can try a combination of things? Maybe using catnip tea/chamomile tea/other herbs as the "water" to dilute your acidic rinse? There are plenty of herbal conditioner substitutes. I've never bought from her personally so I can't recommend anything, but maybe you can look around this Etsy shop (https://www.etsy.com/shop/NightBlooming?ref=l2-shopheader-name) for ideas.

Protein is a good suggestion, as Anje said.

What about homemade flax seed gel as an enhancement for your waves? Again, I haven't used it so I can't make a personal recommendation, but I've read through the thread and I know that you can make it as strong or as weak as you need for you hair, and it shouldn't leave it hard like commercial gels.

Of course, there's always braids and buns to enhance waves, but I get it, that's not your "natural" texture. I'm sure I'd have way more wave to my hair if I didn't use conditioner/let it dry without combing or touching it (my hair seems to want to burst out of its 1b classification sometimes, especially at the very ends), but I have no plans to do that because it'd be unmanageable and probably would drive me up a wall.

You are remembering correctly! I have been using an ACV rinse, but apart from the very first one, I've gotten pretty poor results. No help in detangling or softening. I will check out that etsy shop, though! Thank you. I'm just not sure I like the shampoo bars to stick with them.

Flaxseed gel is something I've seen and considered, but I kind of figured I'd wait on trying it until I could get my waves to show up reliably, lol!

I haven't found a good braid or bun that gives me waves that I like, unfortunately. I have very thin, fine hair, so even a single braid gives me very tight waves, and I end up with Hermione-level poofy hair. Cinnabuns give be some very weird, kinky waves. Are there any others I should try?

[samanthaa]

^ Braiding with a thick paranda should give you looser waves! And waves that go all the way to the ends of your hair, as long as your make your paranda long enough. A sock bun is great for curls. I also get some wave with a nautilus, but it never ends up staying. Braid waves stay better for me than bun waves.

We have very similar hair classifications (my ponytail circumference is just a tiny bit smaller than yours at 2.5"), I'm realizing, except I'm a 1b. I'm surprised braid waves are that crazy for you! I personally love the extra volume braid waves give me.

[Arctic]

Paranda braids maybe, they also help you to braid all the way to the tippy tips, so no straight hem.

(oops, samantha beat me)

[lithostoic]

Have you tried squish to condish?

[ravenheather]

It sounds like we have similar hair. I love flaxseed gel. Right now I am using Morocco method shampoos, no conditioner. I think it has bumped up my wave pattern. It is not cheap though. Also I found good results with kinky curly knot today as a detangler/leave in. Very light weight.

[leilan]

^ Braiding with a thick paranda should give you looser waves! And waves that go all the way to the ends of your hair, as long as your make your paranda long enough. A sock bun is great for curls. I also get some wave with a nautilus, but it never ends up staying. Braid waves stay better for me than bun waves.

We have very similar hair classifications (my ponytail circumference is just a tiny bit smaller than yours at 2.5"), I'm realizing, except I'm a 1b. I'm surprised braid waves are that crazy for you! I personally love the extra volume braid waves give me.

I'll have to try a paranda, never done that before! I can't for the life of me get my hair in a sock bun.


Have you tried squish to condish?

I have not tried this yet. My understanding is that with this technique, you end up not rinsing the conditioner out all the way, kind of as a leave-in. Is that correct? That would probably weigh my hair down and leave it greasy.

Ravenheather, thanks for the product suggestions!

[lithostoic]

Not necessarily. I rinse mine fully so my hair doesn't end up stringy before next wash (usually around 4 days). I just squish it under the water stream until I feel like it's all gone.

[Anje]

Thirding paranda-waves. My hair gives tighter waves from braids than I care for too, especially toward the ends. Paranda fixes that.

[leilan]

Not necessarily. I rinse mine fully so my hair doesn't end up stringy before next wash (usually around 4 days). I just squish it under the water stream until I feel like it's all gone.

Oh really! That is good to know. I will have to try this. Do you really find that it helps your waves show up? It's crazy that something like that would make such a difference. Does it work just squishing to rinse, or do you have to apply the conditioner by squishing in order to work?

[lapushka]

Isn't the whole idea of StoQ to leave-in a bit of the conditioner? If you constantly run your hair under water, there's not going to be much conditioner left, or... am I missing something. :confused:

[Decoy24601]

Isn't the whole idea of StoQ to leave-in a bit of the conditioner? If you constantly run your hair under water, there's not going to be much conditioner left, or... am I missing something. :confused:

I personally use it as a way to help ensure that I have very thorough coverage of my conditioner. I rinse all of mine out, but then I squish in a liquid leave-in (applied with a spray bottle). I like the control that gives me over how much product I end up with in my hair.

[leilan]

I personally use it as a way to help ensure that I have very thorough coverage of my conditioner. I rinse all of mine out, but then I squish in a liquid leave-in (applied with a spray bottle). I like the control that gives me over how much product I end up with in my hair.

I always put my hair up in a clip for a minute or two after applying conditioner. Would this still be possible doing squish to condish?

[Decoy24601]

I always put my hair up in a clip for a minute or two after applying conditioner. Would this still be possible doing squish to condish?

I don't see why not, as long as you squish it at some point :p. I normally try to leave my conditioners in for a bit too.

[leilan]

Well I'll try the squish to condish method... Though I must admit I'm skeptical that it will do much to bring out my waves. So far any conditioner seems like too much. I love a good test, though!

[Decoy24601]

Well I'll try the squish to condish method... Though I must admit I'm skeptical that it will do much to bring out my waves. So far any conditioner seems like too much. I love a good test, though!

It depends on what you do. If you leave a little bit of conditioner in somehow, whether applying a leave-in after rinsing all the regular conditioner out, it'll probably help. As long as you let your hair dry after squishing and don't manipulate it, you'll bring out your waves. I did this the other day and got full 2a waves out of my hair, but I didn't put anything in my hair to hold it. It was purely from squishing and scrunching my hair and letting it dry like that. If you want the waves to stay defined, you'll need to use some product probably. I've been trying to find a good hair gel to help hold mine and I do LOC (I detangle between each step and scrunch each in).

[leilan]

It depends on what you do. If you leave a little bit of conditioner in somehow, whether applying a leave-in after rinsing all the regular conditioner out, it'll probably help. As long as you let your hair dry after squishing and don't manipulate it, you'll bring out your waves. I did this the other day and got full 2a waves out of my hair, but I didn't put anything in my hair to hold it. It was purely from squishing and scrunching my hair and letting it dry like that. If you want the waves to stay defined, you'll need to use some product probably. I've been trying to find a good hair gel to help hold mine and I do LOC (I detangle between each step and scrunch each in).

I haven't tried squish to condish, but I have tried scrunching with aloe vera as well as with a leave-in. All I got was limp, kind of rough hair. Unless I use something extremely light as a gel or as a leave-in, I don't think it's going to do anything to encourage waves, sadly. LOC was just way too much for my hair.

[Decoy24601]

I haven't tried squish to condish, but I have tried scrunching with aloe vera as well as with a leave-in. All I got was limp, kind of rough hair. Unless I use something extremely light as a gel or as a leave-in, I don't think it's going to do anything to encourage waves, sadly. LOC was just way too much for my hair.

Aloe vera gel doesn't really have any hold. Flaxseed gel has more, but not a whole lot. When I do LOC I only do very diluted conditioner in a spraybottle, then 2-3 drops of oil over the entire length and thickness of my hair, and only a pea-sized amount of a buttery hair moisturizer. I have hair that gets buildup super easily and this is a bit product-y, but it's not overwhelming. My hair is hard to moisturize, so I make that compromise.

I like the dove style + care volumizing hair gel. It's pretty light and when you brush it out it still has some hold, but makes your hair very silky, soft, and shiny, so what you're left with after all the hold is gone isn't that bad.

In the end you might decide trying to bring out your waves is just too much product, so it's very YMMV.

[leilan]

Aloe vera gel doesn't really have any hold. Flaxseed gel has more, but not a whole lot. When I do LOC I only do very diluted conditioner in a spraybottle, then 2-3 drops of oil over the entire length and thickness of my hair, and only a pea-sized amount of a buttery hair moisturizer. I have hair that gets buildup super easily and this is a bit product-y, but it's not overwhelming. My hair is hard to moisturize, so I make that compromise.

I like the dove style + care volumizing hair gel. It's pretty light and when you brush it out it still has some hold, but makes your hair very silky, soft, and shiny, so what you're left with after all the hold is gone isn't that bad.

In the end you might decide trying to bring out your waves is just too much product, so it's very YMMV.

I like the sound of the Dove gel! Thanks for the suggestion! I think that if I found the exactly perfect products for LOC, I could probably make it work, but I just don't have the spare funds to try a bunch of different products :( I definitely having a light touch is the key to making it work, though.

You may be exactly right that waves will just be too much darn work to maintain. In a perfect world, I would be able to have waves without much maintenance or product. But it ain't a perfect world, lol!

When I'm able, I'm really thinking that I'll try the Shea Moisture Fruit Fusion Weightless shampoo and catnip as a conditioner. Who knows how that'll work, but I'll give anything a try.

[vampyyri]

Decoy, you're making me want to get that gel when I'm 85% sure gels are crunchy hair poop xD Then again, I was a doofus and picked up the LA Looks Mega Mega hold gel (idk what I was expecting).

LOC works for me, and I'm 1c/2a as well, but I have a medium texture. What works for me is a clarifying shampoo (greaseball, must do this every wash), V05 Strawberry conditioner to detangle, Suave Green Apple Conditioner squish to condished in (I need two conditioners after clarifying, because I strip everything). Once I get out of the shower before putting it up I use Shea Mositure's Curling Enhancing Smoothie (good stuff, can bring me up to a 2b texture), followed up with a tiny bit of aloe gel, and Garnier's serum to seal it all in. I scrunch my LOC in, and then scrunch my hair with my turbie twist to get the excess product/moisture out. If I leave it be, I have 2a/2b hair! I usually throw it up in my turbie twist though, and take it back down and re-scrunch it damp.

[leilan]

Decoy, you're making me want to get that gel when I'm 85% sure gels are crunchy hair poop xD Then again, I was a doofus and picked up the LA Looks Mega Mega hold gel (idk what I was expecting).

LOC works for me, and I'm 1c/2a as well, but I have a medium texture. What works for me is a clarifying shampoo (greaseball, must do this every wash), V05 Strawberry conditioner to detangle, Suave Green Apple Conditioner squish to condished in (I need two conditioners after clarifying, because I strip everything). Once I get out of the shower before putting it up I use Shea Mositure's Curling Enhancing Smoothie (good stuff, can bring me up to a 2b texture), followed up with a tiny bit of aloe gel, and Garnier's serum to seal it all in. I scrunch my LOC in, and then scrunch my hair with my turbie twist to get the excess product/moisture out. If I leave it be, I have 2a/2b hair! I usually throw it up in my turbie twist though, and take it back down and re-scrunch it damp.

vampyyri, thank you for the details of your routine! That is very helpful, since our hair seems similar. You don't find that the Curl Enhancing smoothie is too heavy in your hair? And, I mean no offense by this question, but does it bother you having that much product in your hair? Do you notice a big difference in texture and tangles? I ask because I have never used much/any product in my hair, and the few times I've tried, it felt overwhelmed.

[vampyyri]

vampyyri, thank you for the details of your routine! That is very helpful, since our hair seems similar. You don't find that the Curl Enhancing smoothie is too heavy in your hair? And, I mean no offense by this question, but does it bother you having that much product in your hair? Do you notice a big difference in texture and tangles? I ask because I have never used much/any product in my hair, and the few times I've tried, it felt overwhelmed.

For the curl enhancing smoothie, I only dip the tips of my pointer, middle, and ring fingers into the container, that's all I use of it! I rub that between my hands, and scrunch it in. The aloe gel is in a pump bottle, so I only use about half a pump of that, rub it in my hands, scrunch. Then my serum also has a pump, which I use another half a pump of, rub, scrunch. It's not a lot of product in the end!

As for texture, it's softer and bouncier. Tangles are not an issue for me because I always take care of those in the shower. Other than finger-combing my conditioner through, I don't run my fingers through it or brush it. When I detangle, it's very few mild ones... no snaggles like I used to get back when I was using my old routine. The whole run down is in my blog as well, which is a bit more in-depth!

[leilan]

For the curl enhancing smoothie, I only dip the tips of my pointer, middle, and ring fingers into the container, that's all I use of it! I rub that between my hands, and scrunch it in. The aloe gel is in a pump bottle, so I only use about half a pump of that, rub it in my hands, scrunch. Then my serum also has a pump, which I use another half a pump of, rub, scrunch. It's not a lot of product in the end!

As for texture, it's softer and bouncier. Tangles are not an issue for me because I always take care of those in the shower. Other than finger-combing my conditioner through, I don't run my fingers through it or brush it. When I detangle, it's very few mild ones... no snaggles like I used to get back when I was using my old routine. The whole run down is in my blog as well, which is a bit more in-depth!

Wow, and you notice enough of a difference to take you to a 2B just with that much of the curl enhancing smoothie? I might have to give that a try after all!

I will go take a look at your blog! I love the sound of softer hair.

[lapushka]

Wow, and you notice enough of a difference to take you to a 2B just with that much of the curl enhancing smoothie? I might have to give that a try after all!

I will go take a look at your blog! I love the sound of softer hair.

I use about a coinsize of the CES by Shea Moisture, and it takes my waves from 2b/c to 2c/3a. No joke. I have classic length though, so if you have shorter hair, use *far* less. It becomes sticky when you use too much of the product, and you don't want that.

[leilan]

I use about a coinsize of the CES by Shea Moisture, and it takes my waves from 2b/c to 2c/3a. No joke. I have classic length though, so if you have shorter hair, use *far* less. It becomes sticky when you use too much of the product, and you don't want that.

:agape: Wow. I thought that 'Curl Enhancing' was just a marketing gimmick. I never thought it might actually work! Well I'm definitely going to try that now!

[lapushka]

:agape: Wow. I thought that 'Curl Enhancing' was just a marketing gimmick. I never thought it might actually work! Well I'm definitely going to try that now!

I at one time used it as my cream in the LOC method + gel on top of it, but that didn't work much, so now I use it as my leave-in + gel + serum and that is *amazing*. I realized after the fact that the title said "curl enhancing". By then I'd seen the effect of it. Wow. It is just: wow. Best product I've tried in a long time. I haven't been so wowed by something since discovering the Eco Styler gel. :)

[leilan]

Alright, lithostoic, color me surprised. I tried squish to condish. And it worked! Not that I thought you weren't telling the truth, but rather, my hair tends to resist any sort of manipulation, so I figured any waves it encouraged wouldn't last. Here's a picture:

https://s9.postimg.org/9wr7ulde7/IMG_20160812_243906586_HDR.jpg

I definitely have some practice to do, because I still had a ton of conditioner in my hair that didn't rinse out. But I'm floored that my hair actually cooperated with this! The waves are much more stretched out than the ones I get from shampoo bars, but it's still very exciting. I didn't use any gel or anything for hold, because I don't have any.

There are a few more pictures in my album (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/album.php?albumid=12876). The last one is with shampoo bars.

[lapushka]

That's amazing. Look at that left side. :D

Anyway, just wanted to "notice" that you and lithostoic seem to have similar texture. Am I the only one noticing? ;)

[yogagirl]

I have the same problem with super shy waves :( so sad because I love all sorts of curls and waves. And I also can't stand sticky product in my hair.

I definitely would stay away from dimeticone conditioners. I have to use a conditioner, but I use amodimethicone now and want to try come free too sometime soon. Another thing I haven't seen mentioned yet is Amla. I add the powder to my conditioner every few weeks and it helps amp up the waves.

I have recently bit the bullet and experimented with leave ins and I have to say, it does help with retaining waves. For no wash days I've also used a spray bottle (important: use filtered or distileld water!) and scrunched in some of the leave in and it worked surprisingly well. i am currently mixing DevaCurl light defining gel and SheaMoisture curl enhancing smoothie as a leave in. I found both in travel sizes which is awesome for trying a new product.

[leilan]

That's amazing. Look at that left side. :D

Anyway, just wanted to "notice" that you and lithostoic seem to have similar texture. Am I the only one noticing? ;)

I know, right? :happydance: I was so psyched over that left side!
I've seen some of lithostoic's photos on the length threads, and I definitely had the same thought. Our color is even similar!


I have the same problem with super shy waves :( so sad because I love all sorts of curls and waves. And I also can't stand sticky product in my hair.

I definitely would stay away from dimeticone conditioners. I have to use a conditioner, but I use amodimethicone now and want to try come free too sometime soon. Another thing I haven't seen mentioned yet is Amla. I add the powder to my conditioner every few weeks and it helps amp up the waves.

I have recently bit the bullet and experimented with leave ins and I have to say, it does help with retaining waves. For no wash days I've also used a spray bottle (important: use filtered or distileld water!) and scrunched in some of the leave in and it worked surprisingly well. i am currently mixing DevaCurl light defining gel and SheaMoisture curl enhancing smoothie as a leave in. I found both in travel sizes which is awesome for trying a new product.

I also am having trouble adjusting to the feeling of product in my hair. I have gone literally my whole life with just s&c, so adding product to it just feels... weird. :lol: My current conditioners are cone free, and so far my hair has been fine with that. I will look into amla, thank you for the suggestion! Where did you find the travel size Shea Moisture?

[yogagirl]

I know, right? :happydance: I was so psyched over that left side!
I've seen some of lithostoic's photos on the length threads, and I definitely had the same thought. Our color is even similar!



I also am having trouble adjusting to the feeling of product in my hair. I have gone literally my whole life with just s&c, so adding product to it just feels... weird. :lol: My current conditioners are cone free, and so far my hair has been fine with that. I will look into amla, thank you for the suggestion! Where did you find the travel size Shea Moisture?
At Walgreens. Was so glad they had it there and I didn't have to venture out to Sally's. They had the curl enhancing smoothie in a big tub for 12(?) bucks and in a little squeeze tube for 4(?) bucks. The DevaCurl I bought at Ulta.

I don't mind the feeling of product so much. It's just I don't like sticky stuff running down my face and body when I work out and sweat a lot. My little mix actually makes my hair feel smoother than otherwise, but I have coarse hair, so that's a whole nother problem haha.

[leilan]

At Walgreens. Was so glad they had it there and I didn't have to venture out to Sally's. They had the curl enhancing smoothie in a big tub for 12(?) bucks and in a little squeeze tube for 4(?) bucks. The DevaCurl I bought at Ulta.

I don't mind the feeling of product so much. It's just I don't like sticky stuff running down my face and body when I work out and sweat a lot. My little mix actually makes my hair feel smoother than otherwise, but I have coarse hair, so that's a whole nother problem haha.

Oho, I'm definitely going to Walgreens soon. I'm all for trial sizes, since it takes me months and months to use up a bottle of anything.

Oh, I wouldn't like stickiness running down my face, either! My issue with it is more that my hair gets stringy and piece-y, which makes it more obvious how thin it is.

Lapushka, you mentioned the Eco Styler gel earlier in this thread. Would that be a good gel for me to try?

And just for another little update, I tried squish to condish again, this time using Sally's GVP conditioning balm. I tried to make extra sure to wash out all the conditioner,. This time, though, no waves, or rather, no more waves than what I get when washing normally. Here's a pic of my wavy underlayer, which is only wavy near the scalp. :shrug:

https://s3.postimg.org/9q56a919f/IMG_20160814_235334943_HDR.jpg

The clump of short hairs at my temples was almost a ringlet. O-o

[lapushka]

Lapushka, you mentioned the Eco Styler gel earlier in this thread. Would that be a good gel for me to try?

I'm not sure. It can be pretty heavy if you use a heavy hand. So I'd use a small coinsize for the entire hair, and that should be okay, I think. I use the olive oil version and love it to bits! I use a 2 eurocoin size for my classic length. Shorter hair? Less product, definitely!

[lithostoic]

Very nice! Yes, looks similar to my hair for sure. I can get great waves, even wurls with the loc method + plopping for a few minutes. I do have fine/medium hair though, idk if finer hair would be able to handle it.

[leilan]

I emailed Chagrin Valley asking about shampoo bars and waves, and here is the response:


Thanks for writing! We have had some other customers report that their natural curls or waves have been brought out using the natural shampoo bars as well. There are many reasons that this could occur, one simple reason could be that commercial shampoo is heavier, and weighs the hair down. In addition, your natural oils and moisture are not being stripped away when you use organic shampoo bars, so that could be playing into it as well, the bars are allowing your natural hair to do what it does!

Thought you all might be interested. Nothing conclusive, but interesting. I never thought of commercial shampoo as 'heavy'.

[lapushka]

I emailed Chagrin Valley asking about shampoo bars and waves, and here is the response:


Thanks for writing! We have had some other customers report that their natural curls or waves have been brought out using the natural shampoo bars as well. There are many reasons that this could occur, one simple reason could be that commercial shampoo is heavier, and weighs the hair down. In addition, your natural oils and moisture are not being stripped away when you use organic shampoo bars, so that could be playing into it as well, the bars are allowing your natural hair to do what it does!

Thought you all might be interested. Nothing conclusive, but interesting. I never thought of commercial shampoo as 'heavy'.

I think it rather depends. I have used soap in the past and thought it weighed my hair down (of course CV has to *sell* their goods and so it pays to call commercial shampoo "the devil" aka "heavy"). It did nothing for my wavy texture at all. On the contrary, I got a gnarly knotty mess, and yes, I rinsed after.

[leilan]

I think it rather depends. I have used soap in the past and thought it weighed my hair down (of course CV has to *sell* their goods and so it pays to call commercial shampoo "the devil" aka "heavy"). It did nothing for my wavy texture at all. On the contrary, I got a gnarly knotty mess, and yes, I rinsed after.

That makes sense about marketing their shampoo to be 'better' than commercial shampoo. I haven't loved my shampoo bars, because they left a bit of a residue on my roots, and especially because they left a 'soap' smell in my hair that stuck around forever and did not smell good at all! But they certainly do tighten up my waves.

I'm getting more and more sure that my hair has simply changed type. After my latest wash, I squished and squished, and my length ended up straight and stringy. But those curls/waves on my underlayer close to my scalp were still there. That's the only explanation that makes sense to me.