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View Full Version : CO good for Seborrheic dermatitis - your opinions?



LittleTea
August 8th, 2016, 11:45 AM
Hello all, long time no see! :) I took a hiatus from LHC since getting dreadlocks but I am now back again after cutting them off and brushing them out. I have seborrheic dermatitis and was able to control it while I had dreadlocks and had no flareups for a looong time by just using medicated shampoo, however I went travelling to SE Asia during the hottest time of the year and my SD flared up badly. Combined with the heat and sweat that the dreadlocks produced (because they made my normally thin hair very thick), I cut them off out of frustration and my SD lessened slightly. I think the biggest factor was not having access to medicated shampoo while in Laos because otherwise my dreadlocks didn't bother my SD at all.

Fast forward to now and I've been co-washing regularly, as well as using medicated shampoos when I flare up, however for the most part I've been exclusively CO. I don't know if it's doing my hair any favours as I think I'm having excessive hair fall in the patches where I get SD. So I think I'm just gonna switch out to a sulfate-free shampoo for usage when I'm not flared up. When I had dreadlocks I just used shampoo bars and scrubbed my scalp and it worked, but I remember shampoo bars being drying on my "normal" brushed hair. I find scrubbing the scalp with the conditioner to help with the usual small flakes I get (while not flared up) since it seems to slough them off better.

What are your thoughts on CO-washing for seborrheic dermatitis? I think I'm going to switch up my routine to see if it's actually the conditioner causing me to lose excessive hair in the patches where I get SD. Thanks for your thoughts everyone. :)

lapushka
August 8th, 2016, 01:19 PM
You say yourself that it flared when not on medicated shampoo.

I have long not used Nizoral 2%, but I keep it at bay by using a harsh sulfate shampoo. I have tried going sulfate-free and have tried CO-washing. Both ended up in flare-ups. What is important with SD is that you cleanse your scalp thoroughly and sulfate-free & CO are both way too mild an option, for me. YMMV.

You can only try. I'm just giving you my experience!

Also, some people can't tolerate conditioner or oil on the scalp. Esp. oil is a no-no with SD, so conditioner is up there. There are people who experience excessive shedding when these products hit their scalp. So be careful!

I wouldn't mess with scalp & scalp-health, but that's just me.

Decoy24601
August 8th, 2016, 01:32 PM
I really doubt your SD would be fine with a CO routine. SD usually needs medicated shampoos or a harsher sulfate shampoo to keep it at bay.

Why not do something like CWC or scalp only washes so the shampoo doesn't get on the length of your hair that much?

LittleTea
August 8th, 2016, 01:32 PM
I think you're definitely on the spot with the scalp cleansing! I DO get excessive shedding when I've tried to put oil on my scalp in the past, so the conditioner must be doing the same thing. I'm just worried about using something too harsh as well since my overall skin tends towards extreme dryness, including the parts of my scalp that don't get SD. For the record the CO did help with the dryness on the parts of my scalp where I don't get SD.

I like to use an ACV rinse afterwards as well which helps with the SD patches and my dry scalp, however I need something that moisturizes the scalp that doesn't use oil or conditioner :p Do you moisturize your scalp at all? If so, how?

LittleTea
August 8th, 2016, 01:34 PM
I really doubt your SD would be fine with a CO routine. SD usually needs medicated shampoos or a harsher sulfate shampoo to keep it at bay.

Why not do something like CWC or scalp only washes so the shampoo doesn't get on the length of your hair that much?

I do use medicated shampoos when I get a flare. :) However I don't use medicated shampoos when I'm not flaring because I don't want my body to become "used to" the medicinal ingredient. This happened to me with Nizoral when I used it too much so my derm had to switch me to a different antifungal shampoo.

LittleTea
August 8th, 2016, 01:34 PM
I think you're definitely on the spot with the scalp cleansing! I DO get excessive shedding when I've tried to put oil on my scalp in the past, so the conditioner must be doing the same thing. I'm just worried about using something too harsh as well since my overall skin tends towards extreme dryness, including the parts of my scalp that don't get SD. For the record the CO did help with the dryness on the parts of my scalp where I don't get SD.

I like to use an ACV rinse afterwards as well which helps with the SD patches and my dry scalp, however I need something that moisturizes the scalp that doesn't use oil or conditioner :p Do you moisturize your scalp at all? If so, how?

This ^ post was in response to lapushka, I'm still getting used to the forum controls sorry! :)

Decoy24601
August 8th, 2016, 01:38 PM
I do use medicated shampoos when I get a flare. :) However I don't use medicated shampoos when I'm not flaring because I don't want my body to become "used to" the medicinal ingredient. This happened to me with Nizoral when I used it too much so my derm had to switch me to a different antifungal shampoo.

What I meant was you could use a harsher sulfate shampoo on the days you don't use your medicated shampoo :) for some people that's enough to keep it at bay enough to not have to use the medicated ones that often.

LittleTea
August 8th, 2016, 01:43 PM
What I meant was you could use a harsher sulfate shampoo on the days you don't use your medicated shampoo :) for some people that's enough to keep it at bay enough to not have to use the medicated ones that often.

Thanks for the suggestion! I'm going to head to my shopping centre to take a look for something. :) I'm sensitive to some fragrances so I imagine it would be a bit difficult to find an SLS shampoo that is free of them. The CO conditioner I was using didn't bother my fragrance sensitivity so maybe I'll look for something of the same brand.

Decoy24601
August 8th, 2016, 01:48 PM
Yeah, tell me about it. I'm allergic to fragrances too and it sucks when I find a great product that has one I'm fairly allergic too. If the product is good enough (and a styling product that I won't use often), I'll debate about using it anyways since I'm not deathly allergic.

If you can buy from LUSH where you live, they have SLS shampoo bars and my allergies can tolerate the montalbano and seanik ones. They do last a long time, so it's one of LUSH's least overpriced items. Inecto shampoos have SLS in them and they're really gentle on my allergies, but I don't think you can get them in the US, if you're there.

spidermom
August 8th, 2016, 01:55 PM
My scalp gets itchy when I get oil or CO on it.

LittleTea
August 8th, 2016, 01:56 PM
Yeah, tell me about it. I'm allergic to fragrances too and it sucks when I find a great product that has one I'm fairly allergic too. If the product is good enough (and a styling product that I won't use often), I'll debate about using it anyways since I'm not deathly allergic.

If you can buy from LUSH where you live, they have SLS shampoo bars and my allergies can tolerate the montalbano and seanik ones. They do last a long time, so it's one of LUSH's least overpriced items. Inecto shampoos have SLS in them and they're really gentle on my allergies, but I don't think you can get them in the US, if you're there.

I'm in Saskatchewan! ;) Hello fellow Canadian!

Do you have any other favourite brands aside from LUSH? I was going to go and take a look at Shopper's since the mall that has Lush is a bit out of the way during rush hour (which is when I'll be going on my shampoo hunt)...

Decoy24601
August 8th, 2016, 02:01 PM
Try the inecto shampoos :). I was able to find them at LondonDrugs. They contain SLS and do have a fragrance that's only labeled as "parfum", but it has a very light fragrance that doesn't bother me too much.

P.S. I'm actually from the U.S. :p I'm an immigrant.

LittleTea
August 8th, 2016, 02:05 PM
Hey well I don't know anyone who wouldn't WANT to live in BC lol. ;) I'm headed that way next week for a camping trip!

Thanks! :) I'll take a look around for them. Do you find that your scalp gets dried out at all? I'm sure the SLS shampoo would help with the SD patches on my scalp, but I'm afraid the rest of my scalp skin will get verry dry. Too bad they don't make lotion for your scalp. :p

lapushka
August 8th, 2016, 02:08 PM
Thanks for the suggestion! I'm going to head to my shopping centre to take a look for something. :) I'm sensitive to some fragrances so I imagine it would be a bit difficult to find an SLS shampoo that is free of them. The CO conditioner I was using didn't bother my fragrance sensitivity so maybe I'll look for something of the same brand.

I find the Pantene Aqua Light is very mild in fragrance and is light/harsh enough to cleanse thoroughly. It also doesn't dry my scalp out. Their volumizing shampoo is great too, and they do a clarifying shampoo as well (which I use ever so often). Harsh sulfates keep it at bay for me too. I think that is the way to go, honestly. :) Just MO.

Decoy24601
August 8th, 2016, 02:10 PM
Actually, inecto is fairly watered down for a shampoo :). It's not super watery, but it's not the thickest shampoo I've ever used. I have eczema on my scalp and a lot of shampoos that are harsher, including the LUSH shampoo bars, dry out my skin terribly and make my eczema flare up, but inecto has been just gentle enough to keep that from happening. I don't use it every day though; I try to only wash my hair every 2-3 days. The reason why I like harsher shampoos like ones with SLS is because I have a very very oily scalp and stubborn sebum.

Oh, have fun camping! The weather here has been pretty good, but we did recently have some scattered thunderstorms, so hopefully that's done with by the time you get here.

Shorty89
August 8th, 2016, 02:13 PM
I seem to be in the minority that finds that CO works far better. But, my doctor wasn't sure if I had SD, scalp eczema (is it the same thing?) or psoriasis. Mine acts somewhat similar to my skin eczema when it flares. Harsh, medicated shampoos (or any shampoo) seem to not only dry out my hair, but really dry out my scalp which makes it itch and even if I don't scratch it will start to weep. I find CO with a good scritch before with a comb, or scrubbing fairly vigorously while doing CO are what's best. SMT also really helps my scalp (it might be the honey). But, it does seem like the shampoo is working according to your post. :shrug:

Decoy24601
August 8th, 2016, 02:16 PM
Scalp eczema is not the same thing as SD. It's more similar to psoriasis than SD. Both scalp eczema and psoriasis have opposite reactions than SD. SD needs harsh shampoos, no question about that. Scalp eczema and psoriasis need gentler shampoos and moisture more than anything. Harsh shampoos can make it worse.

lithostoic
August 8th, 2016, 02:18 PM
I believe I have mild SD and I've recently been making a routine out of Head&Shoulders and natural conditioner on my ends and nape hairs only. When I was cowashing, (in between shampoos) my scalp didn't feel as clean, and I had to shampoo the next day because of the itchies. I don't think it was worth it tbh. When I get rid of this recent flare up I'll probably stretch to twice a week and that's it.

LittleTea
August 8th, 2016, 02:37 PM
I have another question for you guys: what do you do when exercising and sweating when it's not your wash day? Do you find rinsing your scalp sufficient? I think one of my main reasonings for going CO was I could wash everyday without stripping the dry (non-SD) parts of my scalp. My job requires me to be physical when I'm working outside of the office, so = sweat (and LOTS of it).

lapushka
August 8th, 2016, 02:40 PM
I have another question for you guys: what do you do when exercising and sweating when it's not your wash day? Do you find rinsing your scalp sufficient? I think one of my main reasonings for going CO was I could wash everyday without stripping the dry (non-SD) parts of my scalp. My job requires me to be physical when I'm working outside of the office, so = sweat (and LOTS of it).

Well, I'm disabled, so I don't exercise at all.

I think rinsing it will be better than CO-washing. I'd not rinse it at all TBH, but move wash day a day closer. How often do you wash now?

Decoy24601
August 8th, 2016, 02:41 PM
Personally, I find that rinsing my scalp with water only is sufficient. You can always dilute a shampoo in water too, to keep it from being harsh on your skin and hair when you don't need it. I normally only do this if I get super sweaty.

Some info on diluting shampoo: http://science-yhairblog.blogspot.ca/2011/10/how-to-tame-strong-shampoo.html

LittleTea
August 8th, 2016, 02:43 PM
Well, I'm disabled, so I don't exercise at all.

I think rinsing it will be better than CO-washing. I'd not rinse it at all TBH, but move wash day a day closer. How often do you wash now?

If I don't rinse and/or wash the sweat off I find it aggravates my SD. I've been washing once a week with a shampoo bar, but other than that just co-washing (and medicated shampoos when I need them).

LittleTea
August 8th, 2016, 02:46 PM
Personally, I find that rinsing my scalp with water only is sufficient. You can always dilute a shampoo in water too, to keep it from being harsh on your skin and hair when you don't need it. I normally only do this if I get super sweaty.

Some info on diluting shampoo: http://science-yhairblog.blogspot.ca/2011/10/how-to-tame-strong-shampoo.html

Thanks for the info! I do get super sweaty, I must have overactive sweat glands haha. :) Plus when I'm working out of the office I'm tramping around in the forest in 30+ Celsius weather (not uncommonly wearing a hard hat), so that doesn't help with the sweat issue. I think the next time I sweat and it's not a wash day I'll try rinsing with just water, and if that doesn't work, I'll dilute whichever shampoo I'm using.

meteor
August 8th, 2016, 02:56 PM
Generally speaking, I'd say CO-washes aren't ideal for typical SD. :flower: However, everything depends on your case and the product itself (there are medicated foams, liquids, conditioners/CO-washes out there with SD actives).

Check out the list on Science-y Hair Blog, for example: http://science-yhairblog.blogspot.com/2015/03/medicated-shampoos-and-conditioners-for.html

Most people probably won't have time to try out a bunch of medicated CO-washes, to be honest, so I think it's just easier to throw the "big guns" at it (say, Nizoral 2%) and then avoid SD flare-ups in the future by using relatively cleansing formulas for washing and not stretching washes too much (scalp-only washes are really excellent for cleansing the scalp enough in-between full washes, too).


I have another question for you guys: what do you do when exercising and sweating when it's not your wash day? Do you find rinsing your scalp sufficient? I think one of my main reasonings for going CO was I could wash everyday without stripping the dry (non-SD) parts of my scalp. My job requires me to be physical when I'm working outside of the office, so = sweat (and LOTS of it).

Usually rinsing with water alone is enough for me if the scalp is clean. Otherwise, Scalp-Only Wash techniques are brilliant for this. For example, I just wear a braided bun, cover the bun with a plastic shower cap, then wash the front area of the scalp and sides, then take the stick out and hold the braid (covered in plastic) above my head and wash the rest of the scalp with one hand. Works like a charm, prevents excessive tangling for me and dries super-fast (you can wrap your towel just around the scalp, leaving the braid out).

lapushka
August 8th, 2016, 03:03 PM
If I don't rinse and/or wash the sweat off I find it aggravates my SD. I've been washing once a week with a shampoo bar, but other than that just co-washing (and medicated shampoos when I need them).

Maybe try washing twice a week with a regular sulfate shampoo, and see what that does. If once a week is too little to keep it at bay, wash more, honestly it's not worth it. You do have to stick with it a while, no trying once and giving up on it.

LittleTea
August 8th, 2016, 03:13 PM
Maybe try washing twice a week with a regular sulfate shampoo, and see what that does. If once a week is too little to keep it at bay, wash more, honestly it's not worth it. You do have to stick with it a while, no trying once and giving up on it.

Yeah I think I will try that. :flower: When I think back to when I had dreadlocks I washed once a week with a shampoo bar and used medicated shampoo when needed, which was fine back then, but my scalp has seemed to change what it likes after brushing them out for some strange reason.

Anje
August 8th, 2016, 03:19 PM
For what it's worth, I do think GRU said that CO was the best thing she ever did for her SD. So it does work for some folks!

lapushka
August 8th, 2016, 03:19 PM
Yeah I think I will try that. :flower: When I think back to when I had dreadlocks I washed once a week with a shampoo bar and used medicated shampoo when needed, which was fine back then, but my scalp has seemed to change what it likes after brushing them out for some strange reason.

Maybe it needs time to regulate itself. If you have a regimen and you often times have to switch back to medicated shampoo, something is up with your regimen. That's how I learned too. I somehow found out that harsh sulfates keep the medicated shampoo away. I can stretch to a week, but 2 weeks and I get *massive* flare-ups and the medicated shampoo needs to come into play, so 1 week is my maximum of stretching. Your maximum may well be 3/4 days and no more. Try looking into scalp washing. If your hair is long enough you can try that. Or try diluting your shampoo. All good things to try, but I would try and go with washing twice a week first; see what it does for you.

Keeping my scalp clean enough for it not to bother me is key! For some it's a week, 2 weeks, 3 days, it depends.

But I really do think that busting out the medicated shampoo is a sure sign that you don't have your regimen on track. :flower:

lapushka
August 8th, 2016, 03:19 PM
For what it's worth, I do think GRU said that CO was the best thing she ever did for her SD. So it does work for some folks!

Yeah, but doesn't she wash daily? Or, often?

Anje
August 8th, 2016, 03:25 PM
Yeah, but doesn't she wash daily? Or, often?

Possibly. I'd have to check with her. It's not like I could go for a week without washing either lately. (Probably I should switch back to CO for a while. Shampoo is slowly but steadily increasing how frequently I need to wash. I was at a week once, now I can't do more than 2 days!)

LittleTea
August 8th, 2016, 03:26 PM
Maybe it needs time to regulate itself. If you have a regimen and you often times have to switch back to medicated shampoo, something is up with your regimen. That's how I learned too. I somehow found out that harsh sulfates keep the medicated shampoo away. I can stretch to a week, but 2 weeks and I get *massive* flare-ups and the medicated shampoo needs to come into play, so 1 week is my maximum of stretching. Your maximum may well be 3/4 days and no more. Try looking into scalp washing. If your hair is long enough you can try that. Or try diluting your shampoo. All good things to try, but I would try and go with washing twice a week first; see what it does for you.

Keeping my scalp clean enough for it not to bother me is key! For some it's a week, 2 weeks, 3 days, it depends.

But I really do think that busting out the medicated shampoo is a sure sign that you don't have your regimen on track. :flower:

For me I find that my SD and eczema on my body flares up with stress and also not eating properly...not necessarily my regimen, but it could be a combo of the two. :) I know one of the main culprits for my flare ups is beer; I tend to fare well when I keep my diet in check but when I'm camping I just can't resist a cold one once in awhile. :ale: hehe It's definitely a trade off/fine balance!

lapushka
August 8th, 2016, 03:29 PM
For me I find that my SD and eczema on my body flares up with stress and also not eating properly...not necessarily my regimen, but it could be a combo of the two. :) I know one of the main culprits for my flare ups is beer; I tend to fare well when I keep my diet in check but when I'm camping I just can't resist a cold one once in awhile. :ale: hehe It's definitely a trade off/fine balance!

Hmm, not a beer drinker. I can't drink (meds), and don't anyway (not out of religious convictions or anything, I just don't). Maybe with New Year and Christmas, I have a glass of bubbly but that's it.

Yeah, maybe for some medicated shampoo has to come into play. IDK. It's different for everybody, but I do think washing 2x is worth giving a shot, esp. with exercising and all.

turtlelover
August 8th, 2016, 07:17 PM
I absolutely can't CO, or I get flares. I have to wash every day and a half, and at least every other time has to be with a sulfate. If I keep up with that routine, I can avoid flares altogether. If I go a day or two too long, I end up needing a wash w/ Head & Shoulders to normalize everything, which I hate to do cause it is so harsh. The only time I use conditioner on my scalp is when i wash out my henna, but I wash a day later.

Obsidian
August 8th, 2016, 08:15 PM
Like most everyone else, I need to use a good sulfate shampoo to keep my SD under control. I tried CO washing for a week, gave me a terrible flair and excess shed, oils of any kind touch my scalp and I flair.
I can use sulfate free poo but I have to wash everyday and am prone to flair for no apparent reason. With sulfate poo, I can go 2-3 days between washing if I don't get sweaty.
I would love to be able to use sulfate free shampoo, I really like how soft it makes my hair but its just not feasible. With SD, you have to keep your scalp happy, hair comes second.

Shorty89
August 8th, 2016, 09:47 PM
Scalp eczema is not the same thing as SD. It's more similar to psoriasis than SD. Both scalp eczema and psoriasis have opposite reactions than SD. SD needs harsh shampoos, no question about that. Scalp eczema and psoriasis need gentler shampoos and moisture more than anything. Harsh shampoos can make it worse.

That's good to know. I've only had it checked out by my regular doctor when it wasn't bad and she couldn't tell at the time. But since I've had regular eczema then I figured that was the most likley culprit. Based on what you said then I think that's right. And good to know that they are opposites. :)

@Little Tea, could ACV rinses help with the exercise day hair? I sometimes use it in between washes. Also, I have some Selsin blue that didn't work for my scalp. I'm not sure if it would be worth trying to ship it to ya or not. I'm only in Alberta so it wouldn't have to go that far.

LittleTea
August 9th, 2016, 06:32 AM
@Little Tea, could ACV rinses help with the exercise day hair? I sometimes use it in between washes. Also, I have some Selsin blue that didn't work for my scalp. I'm not sure if it would be worth trying to ship it to ya or not. I'm only in Alberta so it wouldn't have to go that far.

I have medicated shampoo that works! :) I'm pretty sure Sk and Alberta both have similar brands as well. I am going to use the ACV rinses after sweating because I do know that they work for my scalp.

I went out and bought the Inecto sulfate shampoo and I think it worked! :) didn't bother my fragrance sensitivity either and I love the fake coconut smell haha. My scalp isn't itchy at all. Success!!

Maleficent
August 9th, 2016, 08:05 AM
I cannot top the excellent advice given on the topic in question (I have zero experience with it, myself), however as far as your being concerned with your scalp not drying out: it sounds like eating/drinking well is your best approach. Making sure you get enough hydration and good fats, etc. surely would help from the inside of your scalp whilst you ACV rinse each day, shouldn't it? :o

lapushka
August 9th, 2016, 08:23 AM
I cannot top the excellent advice given on the topic in question (I have zero experience with it, myself), however as far as your being concerned with your scalp not drying out: it sounds like eating/drinking well is your best approach. Making sure you get enough hydration and good fats, etc. surely would help from the inside of your scalp whilst you ACV rinse each day, shouldn't it? :o

Oh a newbie. :D Welcome to the forum!

Always good advice in general. Good diet, good nutrients, but I guess that probably goes without sayin'.

calmyogi
August 9th, 2016, 08:55 AM
I haven't been diagnosed with SD or anything but I am prone to an itchy scalp with flaking. I also benefit from a strong sulphate shampoo, it is the only way I can stretch my washes a few days. Something else that I feel helps me is exfoliating the scalp gently. You can do this with scrubs, combs, or boar bristle brushing.

LittleTea
August 10th, 2016, 07:34 PM
I tried the inecto coconut shampoo and it worked wonders, and the fragrance didn't bother my sensitive scalp. :) I used acv yesterday as well which helped a lot!

It's been a day since I washed, however my scalp is feeling a bit icky today because while working outside, the mosquitos were so bad they were getting underneath my hard hat. :p yuck. So I'll wash/condition tonight. The only thing is that sulfates make my hair super floofy and my hair is too short to braid/bun (so scalp only washes are out of the question hehe). :)

Decoy24601
August 10th, 2016, 07:46 PM
I tried the inecto coconut shampoo and it worked wonders, and the fragrance didn't bother my sensitive scalp. :) I used acv yesterday as well which helped a lot!

It's been a day since I washed, however my scalp is feeling a bit icky today because while working outside, the mosquitos were so bad they were getting underneath my hard hat. :p yuck. So I'll wash/condition tonight. The only thing is that sulfates make my hair super floofy and my hair is too short to braid/bun (so scalp only washes are out of the question hehe). :)

I'm glad it worked for you! I love that stuff. I have a bottle of the argan shampoo too, but it's a little more watery for some reason. I do ACV rinses on my scalp sometimes when my eczema is acting up, it's good for so many things.

Yuck, I hate mosquitoes. I used to live in Alaska and anywhere you go in the summer these huge mosquitoes are everywhere. Here in Vancouver, BC they aren't so bad. I haven't been bitten yet this summer.

Is your hair long enough to get into a ponytail? You can try doing that, and twist the hair that's in the ponytail and fold it in half on itself and secure it with a claw clip or something, and tie a plastic back around the ponytail. It likely won't perfectly keep it from getting soapy or wet, but if you're interested in scalp only washes at your length this might help.