Lazy wrap buns suddenly not wanting to stay put?

[AZDesertRose]

Hey, y'all.

Of the last month or two, I've had problems with LWBs falling out on me. My hair is somewhere between BSL and MBL (I'm not a fanatic measurer and I no longer have a good way to take length photos, so this is a guess). I gave it a trim at the beginning of June that probably took off about an inch of length, but it direly needed the trim as my poor hair hadn't seen scissors at all since February of 2015 when I had the layers cut out, so my ends were sad and needed trimming. My hair is relatively fine for dark hair, fairly thick but not ridiculously so, slightly wavy, henna'd every other month, and usually up in one way or another unless it's drying because I live in Florida where it is too darn hot to wear thick hair loose!

My routine: I wash about twice a week with prescription ketoconazole shampoo (to manage seborrheic dermatitis) and then wash again with a L'Oreal professional shampoo that I can't remember the exact name of right now but it's moisturizing and leaves my hair soft and shiny and smelling nice. I don't use conditioner at all because every conditioner I've tried seems to cause a seborrheic dermatitis flare-up, so I let my hair air-dry after washing, comb it gently, then oil it lightly with argan oil at the moment. (It used to be coconut oil but my mom gave me some argan oil that her hair didn't like but my hair loves, so I've been using that.) I use my BBB to distribute the oil as evenly as possible (which is about the only time I brush my hair at all), comb it to make sure it didn't get tangled again (because despite being only slightly wavy, my hair tangles if you look at it in a way it doesn't like :lol: ), and call it good.

My hair has never been what you'd call manageable (I dearly wish it would pick a texture! Straight or curly would be fine, but this somewhere in between mess is really irritating!), and since the advent of the seborrheic dermatitis, I seem to have to choose between hair that behaves half-decently or a scalp that doesn't scream with itching. I tend to favor the scalp not itching ferociously and let my hair just be a little haywire.

I've been able to do a LWB since a little before BSL, and up until a month or two ago, they generally held pretty well unless I did something silly like snagged the hair fork taking my purse off my head. (I use a cross-body purse due to neck and shoulder problems.) But here lately, they've just been falling out.

Any ideas? Thanks! :taz:

[turtlelover]

I'm at BSL, and a disc bun is my current favorite for staying put. Give that one a try. Hair can be fickle as it is growing, and what once worked often can change as it grows and gets trimmed.

[AZDesertRose]

Yeah, disc buns are in regular rotation for me (vertical works better for me than horizontal, as, if I orient a disc bun horizontally, my hair spits out the fork!).

But I was wanting to know if anyone had any ideas as to why, all of a sudden, LWBs just want to fall apart on me.

[lapushka]

I'm classic length, iii, and I only could do a LWB at waist/hip. How are/were you doing them at BSL, even? Too tight?

I find that I need to make the loop looser as it grows, to accommodate for the growth. Maybe try varying the starting loop in size.

[lapis_lazuli]

I had this issue a little while ago. The LWB is my go-to style although the version I do is oriented vertically. It started to suddenly get loose on me and I discovered the reason for it was that when I was picking up hair from the scalp (when levering the loop with the stick), I was moving the stick too far over.
If I insert the stick through the loop from (top) left to (bottom) right, then I should lever the loop to the right and pick up hair from the scalp on the right side.

The version I do is linked here: http://www.wikihow.com/Make-a-Lazy-Wrap-Bun

I hope this makes sense. I apologize if I am explaining a different version and this is not helpful. I hope you figure it out soon :)

[Nesoi]

This exact thing happened to me at that exact length and I'm sure I've seen several people on here say the same thing. It sorted itself out again once I got past MBL. I seem to remember I was doing a modified one for shorter length so part of it was making the loop bigger, as Lapushka says.

[AZDesertRose]

I'm classic length, iii, and I only could do a LWB at waist/hip. How are/were you doing them at BSL, even? Too tight?

I find that I need to make the loop looser as it grows, to accommodate for the growth. Maybe try varying the starting loop in size.

I started doing them wrapping the starting loop over only one finger, then went up to two fingers. Maybe I should try three now? Hmm.

That's a thought. Thanks!

lapis_lazuli, that wikihow is approximately how I'm doing them, but I'm not sure I'm correctly visualizing what you're saying about the stick and the loop and directions. This is probably a fail on my end, as due to medications/medical issues, I'm having some cognitive/conceptual problems around language right at the moment.

The LWB I started with this morning fell apart on me, so I redid it, and the redone one is holding so far (several hours and some housework later), so maybe I'm screwing something up with my fork insertion sometimes and other times getting it right. I mostly use my Ravenslair Artemis hair fork, which is a very simple two-prong hair fork made of aircraft aluminum. To me, it has the virtues of strength, comfort, and a simple design that goes with practically anything in my wardrobe.

[pailin]

I couldn't do a LWB until almost waist, and I'm only a thick ii. Before then they felt good and stable when I put them up, but fell out within 20 minutes or less (if I was doing something like walking, not sitting at a desk, then maybe 5 minutes :rolleyes: ). But with another 2 inches or so of length, everything changed and they hold like a rock now. Perhaps the trim put you back just that bit that makes a difference. And if they worked for you before at the length, maybe part of it is the difference in thickness of your ends. My guess is that in 2-4 months, it'll work again.

[lapis_lazuli]

Sorry for that, AZDesertRose! I probably didn't articulate myself well.

Once all hair is looped and wrapped, I insert the stick through the loop from the top left to the bottom right (as you insert the stick between your index finger and the hair, this is just how my loop is oriented).
Then, when you remove your finger and are levering the loop with the hair stick, you should move it to the right side of your head. The tip of the stick should be pointed downward at this point. From there, use the tip to catch hairs at the scalp from this (right) side, and twist and push the stick up (I usually push it to the top left of my head).

I hope this is a bit more clear! :)

[Agnes Hannah]

I have never ever been able to do the LWB! i'm at tailbone and I can do the nautilus and cinnamon, but LWB has always been undoable for me

[Nesoi]

Lol Agnes I'm the opposite - LWB was doable early on for me but at last waist a nautilus remains out of reach!

[Anje]

Sounds like you trimmed and now they're not staying? I've heard a lot of people complain that buns don't hold as well with thick ends. (Having perpetually thinnish ends myself, I wouldn't know. :P ) Or it could just be that it's at a dumb length right now where it won't stay. Give it a few months, and it'll probably hold great again. I've gone through a few of those, where the usual buns just won't hold for some reason -- take it as an incentive to get out of any bun ruts you're in.

[AZDesertRose]

Sounds like you trimmed and now they're not staying? I've heard a lot of people complain that buns don't hold as well with thick ends. (Having perpetually thinnish ends myself, I wouldn't know. :P ) Or it could just be that it's at a dumb length right now where it won't stay. Give it a few months, and it'll probably hold great again. I've gone through a few of those, where the usual buns just won't hold for some reason -- take it as an incentive to get out of any bun ruts you're in.

Well, they weren't staying so well for a bit before the trim either, so I'm somewhat disinclined to blame the trim. Sorry, I wasn't super clear. I did quite an info dump up there and I probably wasn't as articulate as I could have been (see a previous post: I'm having medical/medication issues that are causing me some cognitive problems around language).

I think it may be that sometimes I'm not anchoring the fork as well as others, but it may also be that I'm just at an awkward length for LWBs for my hair.

I do use disc buns a lot, particularly when I need something that I can trust both to look decent and to stay put through a long, busy day (like tomorrow, yikes!), but a lot of other buns I've tried I seem not to have enough length to do with all my hair, and being that it's July and I live in Florida, I'm unwilling to do half-ups right now. I'm also a bit unhappy with braiding it and letting the braid(s) hang loose, because it seems to have reached a length of getting in the way, but that's a bit off topic for the question I actually asked when I started the thread. I did recently try a braided vertical disc bun that I was really pleased with; it looked nice and stayed in place really well. I didn't take a photo because I don't have a good way to do it myself short of taking a mirror selfie in my poorly-lit bathroom, and my photography skills aren't great to begin with, which is compounded by a fine motor tremor (medication side effect). Also, my hair is dark enough that I'm not sure anyone would have been able to see any details anyway. :violin:

I know I'm whining a lot about my hair. It's probably just that I'm at an awkward length for the time being, and I simply need to keep choogling along and benign-neglect my way to a longer length that will be (hopefully) more cooperative. :lol:

[Anje]

Can you french/dutch braid? FWIW, I always felt like styles with a part (like 2 french braids, or more) felt a LOT cooler than simply having hair bunned or braided. Also, July in Indiana is hot enough -- I can imagine the air's so thick you could cut it with a knife in Florida.

[AZDesertRose]

Can you french/dutch braid? FWIW, I always felt like styles with a part (like 2 french braids, or more) felt a LOT cooler than simply having hair bunned or braided. Also, July in Indiana is hot enough -- I can imagine the air's so thick you could cut it with a knife in Florida.

I can both French and Dutch braid, yes, although French braiding comes more easily to me. (Funny thing: my daughter is the other way around and automatically does a Dutch braid unless she consciously thinks about French braiding. My mother, who has never worn her hair much past shoulder length, doesn't know how to do either and was totally stunned to watch me lace-braid the front of my hair for a special occasion last fall; the way she reacted, you'd have thought I'd done sorcery on my hair! :magic: )

That's a good point, about a center part keeping hair off the neck even if the braids are left hanging (rather than pinned up somehow).

As an Arizona native, heat doesn't bother me much. Humidity, on the other hand? :wail:

[Arctic]

Maybe two LWBs until it starts to work again with all of your hair.

[AZDesertRose]

Maybe two LWBs until it starts to work again with all of your hair.

That's a thought. Thanks! :D

[-Fern]

I also have good luck loosely braiding in an English braid and then doing the LWB. Braiding always makes things... grippier. :D

Like so:
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=23796&d=1467668711

[dansyl]

I'm classic length, iii, and I only could do a LWB at waist/hip. How are/were you doing them at BSL, even? Too tight?

I find that I need to make the loop looser as it grows, to accommodate for the growth. Maybe try varying the starting loop in size.

I'm at APL and I only wrap mine around once finger. Works perfect!

[PoysinIvy]

I have the same type of hair - fine, thin, and unruly (some hair is straight, some is wavy, some is curly - very annoying at times). LWBs didn't hold for me until recently, using only 1 finger for the loop. I've done nautilus buns for years though, held with sticks or a ficcare. And thanks to this thread, I just added the disc bun to my solid-hold repertoire.

Kind of snickering at myself after looking at Fern's lovely (and large) bun...mine isn't even a quarter of that size LOL

[spirals]

I'm having this problem with those and nautilus. I think that as my layers have been growing out my thickness has traveled down and that's making it difficult to bun at all. Twisted buns work better but if I want to do some kind of non-twisted bun then braiding first smooshes the volume down and makes it easier.

[-Fern]

PoysinIvy - Thank you... but truth be told, if I could split the difference with you and have us both be ii's, I would! The grass is always greener on the other side. :lol:

[mindwiped]

My hair is both super fine texture and super thin. As a plus, I'm able to do certain styles much earlier. I've got some arthritis, so I cheat on my LWB...I wrap around the stick, not my finger. This actually let's me do the opposite of everyone's advice, I leave my loop tighter/smaller. I also had a length where it would just unwrap itself, so I used one Amish pin to hold the end. I'm now long enough that this isn't happening, so it may just need a little more length.

[Zebra Fish]

Had same problem at more or less same length. just that I have much less hair. Just switched to nautilus as daily go to. Still can't do a lwb, no idea why :shrug:

[PoysinIvy]

PoysinIvy - Thank you... but truth be told, if I could split the difference with you and have us both be ii's, I would! The grass is always greener on the other side. :lol:

I'd take it! :D

[brickworld13]

LWB and brick are not good friends. Rarely will I get one to stay AND one of them broke the point off my Ravenscroft moon. :patrol: I tend to stay away from them as they spit out sticks like it's a sport.

[AZDesertRose]

LWB and brick are not good friends. Rarely will I get one to stay AND one of them broke the point off my Ravenscroft moon. :patrol: I tend to stay away from them as they spit out sticks like it's a sport.

I don't have an issue with the LWB spitting out the stick; it's just been falling entirely apart lately. :lol:

The bun that spits out the hair toy for me is a horizontal disc bun (I've heard other people say that's a design flaw of the bun that shows up for those of us with thicker hair volume), so I tend to orient my disc buns vertically, which seems to solve the "spitting its dummy" problem. :D

[spirals]

My hair spits out everything, including moisture.

[brickworld13]

My hair spits out everything, including moisture.

This is me.

[AZDesertRose]

I just tried a braided LWB today, because I'd started the day with a high braided cinnabun that spat out the hair fork on me (after several hours of wear). :lol:

So when I went to repin the bun, I thought, "Hey, what if I tried a braided LWB since it's already braided?"

Lo and behold, it's working (so far at least)! :happydance:

[lapushka]

I just tried a braided LWB today, because I'd started the day with a high braided cinnabun that spat out the hair fork on me (after several hours of wear). :lol:

So when I went to repin the bun, I thought, "Hey, what if I tried a braided LWB since it's already braided?"

Lo and behold, it's working (so far at least)! :happydance:

I'm glad it's staying put for you! :)

[mermaid lullaby]

A braided LWB?...I shall try this!

[AZDesertRose]

Reviving this thread because I'm having a different problem with the same bun. :rolleyes:

So now, I'm a little past waist, probably fairly close to hip. I may need to review tutorials for the LWB, because there is a strong possibility that what I've done the last couple of times is not actually the best way (at least for my hair) to form a LWB, but I've noticed the last few times I've worn one that it rotates on me. It doesn't come undone, but when I put my hair up in a LWB, I orient the stick/fork vertically, and within a few hours, the stick/fork is horizontal or headed that way. Again, it's staying; it's just rotating, which seems odd, and I thought I'd ask around and see if anyone else had a similar problem.

Right this second, I just washed it and I'm about to take it out of the towel and let it dry (and then likely go to bed before too much longer), but I will probably have some time tomorrow to review tutorials and make sure it's not "operator error!" :lol: But I was just curious if anyone else's LWBs go sideways without actually coming unsecured.

Thanks! :flower:

[lapushka]

Reviving this thread because I'm having a different problem with the same bun. :rolleyes:

So now, I'm a little past waist, probably fairly close to hip. I may need to review tutorials for the LWB, because there is a strong possibility that what I've done the last couple of times is not actually the best way (at least for my hair) to form a LWB, but I've noticed the last few times I've worn one that it rotates on me. It doesn't come undone, but when I put my hair up in a LWB, I orient the stick/fork vertically, and within a few hours, the stick/fork is horizontal or headed that way. Again, it's staying; it's just rotating, which seems odd, and I thought I'd ask around and see if anyone else had a similar problem.

Right this second, I just washed it and I'm about to take it out of the towel and let it dry (and then likely go to bed before too much longer), but I will probably have some time tomorrow to review tutorials and make sure it's not "operator error!" :lol: But I was just curious if anyone else's LWBs go sideways without actually coming unsecured.

Thanks! :flower:

It took me until hip with my iii hair to do a LWB. So the length shouldn't be an issue. I do notice that when I get closer to classic, and gain more length, I need to widen the loop, so make the bun bigger. Might help.

[Hairkay]

A braided LWB?...I shall try this!

All my lwb are braided or twisted otherwise I wouldn't be able to do them.

[lapushka]

All my lwb are braided or twisted otherwise I wouldn't be able to do them.

Yep, I always twist mine as well!

[AZDesertRose]

Reviving this thread because I'm having a different problem with the same bun. :rolleyes:

So now, I'm a little past waist, probably fairly close to hip. I may need to review tutorials for the LWB, because there is a strong possibility that what I've done the last couple of times is not actually the best way (at least for my hair) to form a LWB, but I've noticed the last few times I've worn one that it rotates on me. It doesn't come undone, but when I put my hair up in a LWB, I orient the stick/fork vertically, and within a few hours, the stick/fork is horizontal or headed that way. Again, it's staying; it's just rotating, which seems odd, and I thought I'd ask around and see if anyone else had a similar problem.

Right this second, I just washed it and I'm about to take it out of the towel and let it dry (and then likely go to bed before too much longer), but I will probably have some time tomorrow to review tutorials and make sure it's not "operator error!" :lol: But I was just curious if anyone else's LWBs go sideways without actually coming unsecured.

Thanks! :flower:

So I finally got a chance to review tutorials.

I'm not sure exactly what I was doing before, but it was NOT actually a LWB! :laugh: I either forgot how to make one correctly or was never doing it correctly in the first place! So the jury comes back with a verdict of "operator error" in the first degree. ;)

So I now have it in an actual LWB, and we'll see how it stays today.