Calculating terminal length. Let's do it here!

[Wusel]

I've found this today:

http://igorsbelltower.blogspot.de/p/estimating-your-terminal-length.html

I'm sure many of you know this but I didn't until today. And, of course, started calculating instantly :cool:

To estimate my average shed I took the average of one of the past weeks:
Day 1 (wash day): 80 hairs
Day 2: 20
Day 3: 30
Day 4: 30
Day 5 (wash day): 70 hairs
Day 6: 20
Day 7: 30

The average of it => 280 / 7 = 40.
So, I shed an average of 40 hairs per week. And 14.600 per year (40 x 365)

I have black-brown hair, so about 100.000 hairs are growing on my head.

100.000 / 14600 = 6,85

When my hair grows an average of 17cm per year my terminal would be

6,85 x 17 = 116,46cm.

It's only 5,46cm below classic... as classic for me is 111cm... :justy: And even less when it grows 16. I'm not sure how much it grows in a year exactly. Last year it was 17 or so.

But it's not reliable... right? :) (I want knee length hair!!!)

Do your calculating please!!!

I'd love to hear from those of you who already reached terminal... If your calculation matches the length you've reached.

[Anya15]

I didn't know about this either! So exciting. :D

I shed an average of 25 hairs per day approximately.
Annual shedding=25x365 = 9125 hairs a year

And I'm black haired, so lets say 100,000 hairs.
100,000/9125=10.95

My growth rate is 2.5 cm a month (my hair is growing so fast these days) so 30 cm a year.

And final step=10.95x30=328.5 cm
HOLY...This is not real, i cant possibly have some 3 meter long terminal length! :agape: There is some problem somewhere.

ETA: Wusel, I'm sure it's not too reliable, based on the result I got...:) You will have knee length hair for sure!

[Wusel]

I didn't know about this either! So exciting. :D

I shed an average of 25 hairs per day approximately.
Annual shedding=25x365 = 9125 hairs a year

And I'm black haired, so lets say 100,000 hairs.
100,000/9125=10.95

My growth rate is 2.5 cm a month (my hair is growing so fast these days) so 30 cm a year.

And final step=10.95x30=328.5 cm
HOLY...This is not real, i cant possibly have some 3 meter long terminal length! :agape: There is some problem somewhere.

ETA: Wusel, I'm sure it's not too reliable, based on the result I got...:) You will have knee length hair for sure!

You are from India. The longest hairs you can find live in India. 3 meters for India isn't that unrealistic. :)

GROW, ANOU, GROW!!! :cheer: :cheer: :cheer:

[parkmikii]

Nah, it can't be too right. According to this site linked there (http://www.allvidzhaze.com/phptest/hairgrowth.html), ''Your growth potential is 21.62 inches.''.
My hair is almost 37 inches already and still growing :D

[Kiiruna]

That calculator told me that my growth potential is 0.04 inches :D Oh wow

[Wusel]

The calculator doesn't work properly. That's why I did it manually and didn't refer to it. My growth with the calculator was 0,01 inches too.

[parkmikii]

The calculator doesn't work properly. That's why I did it manually and didn't refer to it. My growth with the calculator was 0,01 inches too.

Actually, still the same to me.
50 sheds a day x 365 =18250
My hair is auburny brown, so 100.000
100000/18250=5.47

Growth rate is 1 cm a month, so 5.47*12=65.64 cm

My current length is 94 cm. What did I do wrong?

[Wusel]

Actually, still the same to me.
50 sheds a day x 365 =18250
My hair is auburny brown, so 100.000
100000/18250=5.47

Growth rate is 1 cm a month, so 5.47*12=65.64 cm

My current length is 94 cm. What did I do wrong?

You did nothing wrong. :) That's why I started this thread. I wanted to know if I can grow longer even though the calculation gives me only 116cm. When you are already longer that your calculation, GREAT! That's what I want to find out. How reliable it is. :)
But... are you sure that you grow only 1cm a month? That's not much, less than average... When you add only 0,1 it gives you a bigger result number.

[Anya15]

You are from India. The longest hairs you can find live in India. 3 meters for India isn't that unrealistic. :)

GROW, ANOU, GROW!!! :cheer: :cheer: :cheer:

Haha thanks, but I doubt it. 3 meters is too much, it's like 2x my height. I could probably grow to knee with proper care and a few trims along the way to get rid of splits, but anything beyond that is doubtful.

A question - how do you know when you reach your terminal length? I never quite understood how to tell.

[parkmikii]

You did nothing wrong. :) That's why I started this thread. I wanted to know if I can grow longer even though the calculation gives me only 116cm. When you are already longer that your calculation, GREAT! That's what I want to find out. How reliable it is. :)
But... are you sure that you grow only 1cm a month? That's not much, less than average... When you add only 0,1 it gives you a bigger result number.

Yes, my hair grows really slow usually and nothing seems to help and make it grow faster, but I got used to that. It'll just take me a bit more to reach different milestones :)

[Wusel]

A question - how do you know when you reach your terminal length? I never quite understood how to tell.

You simply don't grow longer any more. The length stays like it is for ever.

[Anya15]

You simply don't grow longer any more. The length stays like it is for ever.

But that could happen if you hit a stall, too, right? Or if your ends get too damaged and split-y?

[Cg]

Wusel, ignore the chart, a perfect example of pseudoscience. I've had almost knee-length hair several times in my life before cutting, and it wasn't "terminal" then. Knee length may well be possible for you.

[Wusel]

But that could happen if you hit a stall, too, right? Or if your ends get too damaged and split-y?

When you stop growing because of splits it stops growing because of breakage. That's not terminal. Terminal is when you have healthy hair and it stops growing.

[Wusel]

Wusel, ignore the chart, a perfect example of pseudoscience. I've had almost knee-length hair several times in my life before cutting, and it wasn't "terminal" then. Knee length may well be possible for you.

Thank you. I hope so :)

[Hairkay]

I'd have trouble just working out how much I shed a day. I could be shedding a few hairs right now but that won't show up days away or until I do my weekly detangle and remove them from their hiding places.

[Silverbrumby]

My calculations are hard because of a hard to count shed rate. But i came out at 20.25 inches. To date the longest shed hair Ive measured is 18.25 inches.

The calculation is based on strand length, not our LHC measurements. According to the way we measure here im at 29 inches.

[Mavi]

Hey guys, I thought people interested in calculating their terminal lengths might like this blog post that I made. It is for calculating the number of hairs on one's head, and if you do it properly, it should help you get a more accurate terminal length measurement.
Using the calculations my head has 133 435 hairs.
I shed ~40 hairs/day.
40x365=14600.
133435/14600=9.1
9.1x20cm/year=182cm. (I can believe this number)


I should be studying, so naturally I instead chose to engage in some hair-related mathematics, and try and calculate the number of hairs on my head.

I was unsatisfied with the commonly accepted notion of blondes having ~120 000, brunettes having ~100 000, and red-heads having ~90 000. This just didn't make sense to me! Someone with coarse, (i) thickness hair is going to have fewer hairs than someone with fine hair and a 10cm pony circumference, regardless of hair colour.

I therefore took matters into my own hands.

First, what is the area of the cross section of my individual hairs?
We need to start with a diameter measurement.
I used the science-y hair blog method of determining strand thickness and was able to pack 12 hairs into a mm, making each hair roughly 83um in diameter.
The area of a cross section of an average hair would therefore be:
A=Pi(41.5um)2
A=5411um2

Second, what is the area of the cross section of my ponytail?
My circumference is 9.525cm (squeezed as tightly as humanly possible).
Radius=9.525cm/2Pi
Radius=1.516cm or 15160um (converted by multiplying by 10 000)

Ponytail XS Area=Pi(15160um)2
=722 018 417um2

Next, divide the two.
722 018 417um2/5411um2=133 435 hairs (there will be error for air spaces in the ponytail, that's why you really have to squeeze)

15 minutes well spent

How many hairs do you have?

[parkmikii]

Hey guys, I thought people interested in calculating their terminal lengths might like this blog post that I made. It is for calculating the number of hairs on one's head, and if you do it properly, it should help you get a more accurate terminal length measurement.
Using the calculations my head has 133 435 hairs.
I shed ~40 hairs/day.
40x365=14600.
133435/14600=9.1
9.1x20cm/year=182cm. (I can believe this number)

Thank you a lot! I'll try that one out once I find a way to measure my hair thickness without ripping it all off (I tier it with a thread once and besides that I didn't manage to get a number because I've cut the thread pretty bad, it also broke off a few hairs :( )

[lapushka]

I'd have trouble just working out how much I shed a day. I could be shedding a few hairs right now but that won't show up days away or until I do my weekly detangle and remove them from their hiding places.

Same here. Plus I already grew beyond classic a bit. Goal reached, so... Hey, it can be what it is. :shrug:

[meteor]

Great find! :D
I think, a significant issue with this model is the huge sensitivity to each factor, so the input data has to be absolutely precise, which is hard to achieve for something like annual shedding. Because if you say you shed 20 strands a day vs. 30 strands a day, you'll get huge variations. And I would assume people shed different amounts during different years or months, partly depending on their health status, for example. Over the period of many years that it takes to get to terminal, these variations do add up a lot!
Or if your hair is blonette and you say your hair is blonde vs. brown, you'll get vastly different results. Or if your hair is auburn and you choose brown vs. red, you'll get vastly different results.
But even if your hair color is unambiguous and is, say, brown, your thickness could still be i, ii, iii, iii+ ... it's not like your color defines your thickness, the model does not account for that aspect as it was based on some averages for # of strands correlation with hair color (I know these numbers are often quoted in many sources, but if somebody knows the original source for how the numbers were obtained, please do share with us :flower:)

Another factor that is not taken into account is that not all hairs will reach overall terminal. So some hairs (say, around hairline) have a higher replacement rate, they will be renewed more frequently: they will fall out and be replaced with new strands after shorter periods of time than other strands - the ones by which overall terminal length is judged. This is one of the factors that accounts for natural taper, for example.

By the way, all these methods of estimating terminal length (including based on hair color, or ponytail circumference, or taper measurements at different lengths, etc) are available in this spreadsheet (check out last tab "Terminal Length Calculations"):
Managing Hair Growth Data: http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=36275 - it's a really cool tool for keeping track of growth, etc. ;) And if you test it out, you can see how one can get vastly different results depending on the methods used and depending on each slight change of a variable. For example, I get everything from 120 cm to 350 cm. (My current length is 132 cm without any serious taper, so probably far from terminal.)

Honestly, I am under the impression that growing hair out without cutting, without damage and without running into alopecia issues is the only reliable way to truly know one's terminal. :)

[Dovahkiin]

Math?

shudder:

The calculator gave me 104.17". That would... um... drag quite a lot. Gosh, I'm curious now!

[Anya15]

Ooh, this cross section method is a nice way of finding how much hair I have. But according to the calculation, I have over 40,000,000 hairs...that can't be real can it? :lol:

And if I use that number for calculating terminal length...I will end up with some ridiculously long number!


Meteor, I love that spreadsheet...going to download it right away!

[Seeshami]

Calculator says
Your growth potential is 101.69 inches.

Because I am lazy and has no desire to maths.

[Wusel]

My current length is 132 cm without any serious taper, so probably far from terminal.)



So, as long as my hemline is thick and not tapered and thinned, I still can grow? It starts getting near terminal when it starts to taper much?
That would be great because my hemline is still very thick with almost no taper. Even though I didn't trim since 18 months.

[lapushka]

OTOH I would *love* to know what my terminal length would be, OTOH classic is more than I can take, so... it's all about taking good care of the hair you got, IMMHO. What would I be with longer, badly groomed hair? Not a thing. :shrug: It is a tough choice, because there is that nagging feeling you know, the curiosity...

[Cg]

So, as long as my hemline is thick and not tapered and thinned, I still can grow? It starts getting near terminal when it starts to taper much?
That would be great because my hemline is still very thick with almost no taper. Even though I didn't trim since 18 months.

Yes, a taper shows that many hairs have stopped growing. Your thick hemline without taper says your hair is still going strong!

[meteor]

So, as long as my hemline is thick and not tapered and thinned, I still can grow? It starts getting near terminal when it starts to taper much?
That would be great because my hemline is still very thick with almost no taper. Even though I didn't trim since 18 months.

Yes, I think so. :D I agree with Cg. :agree: Hair typically doesn't just stop growing all at the exact same length, but naturally develops gentle taper as different strands are coming closer to their terminal lengths. You probably have lots and lots of length to go before reaching any sort of terminal. ;) Happy growing, Wusel! :cheer:

[Silverbrumby]

Yes, I think so. :D I agree with Cg. :agree: Hair typically doesn't just stop growing all at the exact same length, but naturally develops gentle taper as different strands are coming closer to their terminal lengths. You probably have lots and lots of length to go before reaching any sort of terminal. ;) Happy growing, Wusel! :cheer:

I have tons of taper starting just after shoulder. I've always thought taper could indicate a shorter terminal if there is no health condition or damage.

[Sarahlabyrinth]

I end up with lower calf length. Well, that would be nice :)

[meteor]

I have tons of taper starting just after shoulder. I've always thought taper could indicate a shorter terminal if there is no health condition or damage.

I think if there is no damage at all and no excessive shedding (or recovering from past shedding) going on, then taper could indicate coming closer to terminal... but not necessarily. :D
Here is what I mean: not all hairs will reach overall final terminal. Some hairs (say, around hairline, temple area) tend to have a higher replacement rate, so they will shed and be renewed more frequently, i.e. not reaching that final terminal that some other strands will reach. This is one of the factors that create natural taper. So even if one has a lot of taper naturally, the person may still have very, very long terminal length, just possibly with a bit more visible, maybe sometimes "steeper" (?) taper.
It really depends, and I think it's genetically coded so probably not much we can do about this. :)
However, avoiding false terminal by avoiding damage, cutting and practices that could lead to alopecia is something we do have a bit of control over, if reaching terminal is a goal. :)

[BVU]

Been wondering about this, since I started collecting shed hairs I can finally do it.

Day 1: 22
Day 2: 24
Day 3: 26
Day 4: 21
Day 5: 25
Day 6: 20
Day 7: 21
159/7 = 22 is my average loss
22 x 365 = 8030
I'm blonde so I have about 120,000
120,000 / 8030 = 14 years
I grow on average 1.2 inches or 3cm a month, though it can drop to 1 inch in winter.
About 14.4 inches or 36cm a year
14 x 36 = 504
198in/504cm as a terminal length? Someone call DYQ because I'm coming for that length lmfao. Seriously though, if this is accurate I don't know if Ill be growing to term anymore lol

[foreveryours]

I did it a different way almost 2 years ago

https://forums.longhaircommunity.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=44829&d=1616341438

I found my ponytail circumference goes to zero 56" below the nape (roughly ankle on me). Within 2 years I "should" be there, knock on wood, but I expect ends to be really thin. I think this estimate might be pretty accurate.

[BVU]

I did it a different way almost 2 years ago

https://forums.longhaircommunity.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=44829&d=1616341438

I found my ponytail circumference goes to zero 56" below the nape (roughly ankle on me). Within 2 years I "should" be there, knock on wood, but I expect ends to be really thin. I think this estimate might be pretty accurate.

Hopefully! :blossom:Maybe if youre lucky you can thicken them up too. I tried that method using ribbon instead of elastics, which may have messed with results, but i calculated zero at 168" the first time and 172" the second time. If I ever buy elastics I'll do it again and see the results.

[lapis_lazuli]

foreveryours, I remember you inspired me to find my terminal length the same way! https://forums.longhaircommunity.com/entry.php?b=142968

It's amazing how linear the relationship is :eek:

This graph predicted my circumference at floor would be exactly 1 cm. Real measurement now that I'm here: honestly kind of impossible to measure when it's this small, but not quite 1 cm, maybe between 0.5 and 0.75 (I can't make string or the measuring tape wrap tightly enough to be accurate!). So off track for my projected terminal length of 203 cm / 80", but I have some damage to cut off before my ends are back to virgin and their full potential. So 80" may still be possible, although I doubt that I'll be seriously growing for terminal any time in the near future!

[foreveryours]

foreveryours, I remember you inspired me to find my terminal length the same way! https://forums.longhaircommunity.com/entry.php?b=142968

It's amazing how linear the relationship is :eek:

This graph predicted my circumference at floor would be exactly 1 cm. Real measurement now that I'm here: honestly kind of impossible to measure when it's this small, but not quite 1 cm, maybe between 0.5 and 0.75 (I can't make string or the measuring tape wrap tightly enough to be accurate!). So off track for my projected terminal length of 203 cm / 80", but I have some damage to cut off before my ends are back to virgin and their full potential. So 80" may still be possible, although I doubt that I'll be seriously growing for terminal any time in the near future!

:hifive: Well, you never can tell ...

About 2 years ago, from the "early" and "late" parts of the curve, my "damage line" started about 20" below nape. It's where my taper really starts. About 4 years from where my ends are now. Hopefully I'll still have ends then :p

[Dark40]

Yes, my hair grows really slow usually and nothing seems to help and make it grow faster, but I got used to that. It'll just take me a bit more to reach different milestones :)

My hair grows fast but not fast enough. It grows a half an inch per month, and I totally agree with you that if your hair grows slow it's going to take you a bit more to reach different milestones :) I feel the same way about myself as well