Silky hair in England...? Is it possible?!

[stachelbeere]

Hello,

so I moved to Reading last October. And since then my hair has acquired more and more buildup (the culprint is most definitely the hard water here) - until last week when I went back home (to Poland) where the water is sooo much softer - at least where I lived. I washed my hair with a SLS shampoo, applied a SMT, did a final vinegar rinse and my hair was so incredibly silky! I was absolutely gobsmacked because I forgot how silky and tangle free my hair can be... I didn't realise how it had become more and more matte and hard to detangle. My tangle teezer was collecting so much dust on the bristles, it's absolutely crazy.

So I'm back now, I did a scalp wash and already I can feel that my hair is getting this... grippy, matte texture - even with a SLS shampoo. How do I combat this? I'd love to hear tips, product advice, what your routine is and other comments! I would greatly appreciate this, as I can't go back to having matte, tangle prone hair... :blossom:

[Arctic]

Do you know about chelating shampoos and rinses? Shower filters?

[stachelbeere]

Do you know about chelating shampoos and rinses? Shower filters?

I know they exist but I could never figure out what brands make chelating shampoos (here in England), do you have any examples of ones sold in Europe that I could look into? I never needed one before :/
I haven't heard about chelating rinses, I was always doing vinegar/ citric acid etc rinses (are they different from chelating rinses?)
Shower filters - that I need to look into. But I'd love to hear from someone who has a specific type of filter, I read somewhere that not all make a difference?

[redredrobin]

There is a shampoo that I think is chelating... I got it for that purpose so I hope so! It's the ORS aloe one, you can get it in Boots.

[stachelbeere]

There is a shampoo that I think is chelating... I got it for that purpose so I hope so! It's the ORS aloe one, you can get it in Boots.

thank you! I just looked it up :) does it work well for you?

[Arctic]

Look Fantastic website seems to have quite a few options. I searched with both "chelating shampoo" and "hard water shampoo". You could do google searches too. This looks interesting: http://areah2o.co.uk/shampoo/ but it was sold out from lookfantastic.


Meteor (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/member.php?u=47945) has written excellent and detailed posts several times in the past about hard water, chelating, chelating shampoos and chelating rinses. Try to find her posts, I think they would answer all of your questions (except maybe not UK specific ones).

There are also LHC articles about this, but I think they are currently available only at the Internet Archives (link from article section).

Sorry I don't have time right now for more detailed post.

[Amenahh]

I feel you, i have moved to the uk as well, I live not far from Reading.
For me, the jojoba shampoo and conditiner from Faith in Nature have helped a lot with this. I havent tried their other products yet, but i've read good reviews.

you can find them at health stores, i got mine from holland and barrett. Or you can order them online as well.

I don't know if they will work for you, but hopefully. :)

[stachelbeere]

Look Fantastic website seems to have quite a few options. I searched with both "chelating shampoo" and "hard water shampoo". You could do google searches too. This looks interesting: http://areah2o.co.uk/shampoo/ but it was sold out from lookfantastic.


Meteor (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/member.php?u=47945) has written excellent and detailed posts several times in the past about hard water, chelating, chelating shampoos and chelating rinses. Try to find her posts, I think they would answer all of your questions (except maybe not UK specific ones).

There are also LHC articles about this, but I think they are currently available only at the Internet Archives (link from article section).

Sorry I don't have time right now for more detailed post.

Thanks for the product suggestion arctic! yes, I know Meteor, her vast knowledge of hair related things is amazing and I read many posts about chelating and clarifying in the past. I was just asking for specific products that are available in England that worked for other people here :)


I feel you, i have moved to the uk as well, I live not far from Reading.
For me, the jojoba shampoo and conditiner from Faith in Nature have helped a lot with this. I havent tried their other products yet, but i've read good reviews.

you can find them at health stores, i got mine from holland and barrett. Or you can order them online as well.

I don't know if they will work for you, but hopefully. :)

thanks! I'll go on a lookout at Holland and Barrett...
yay for Thames Valley... and other places close to Reading :D

[redredrobin]

thank you! I just looked it up :) does it work well for you?

Yes, I think it's pretty good. Worth trying out at least.

[chen bao jun]

Miracle Water?
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=94090

This made a real difference for my hair.

[lapushka]

I have lived with hard water all my life, and I don't get it. My hair is perfectly soft. :shrug:

[Arctic]

I think, Lapushka, based on the posts I've read over the years, that what you mention is the key. People who are grown with and used to hard water don't seem to have problems usually. Almost always the posters have been someone who have moved to a hard water area. And vice versa, people not used to soft water feel it's unpleasant.

I assume that our hair and skin gets used to the water they grew up with. I can't explain it scientifically but this is my unscientific theory. (as always there are exeption.)

[Chromis]

I think, Lapushka, based on the posts I've read over the years, that what you mention is the key. People who are grown with and used to hard water don't seem to have problems usually. Almost always the posters have been someone who have moved to a hard water area. And vice versa, people not used to soft water feel it's unpleasant.

I assume that our hair and skin gets used to the water they grew up with. I can't explain it scientifically but this is my unscientific theory. (as always there are exeption.)

As someone who has moved a lot and been in both hard and soft water places, I agree with this.

In very hard water, my best option has been a combination ACV/citric acid rinse. You will need to play with ratios, but before we got a water softener I used a big glug of ACV and about 1/16 to 1/8 of a tsp citric acid to a two-cup measure. This is much stronger than I see most people making. Basically if your hair feels lank and oily super fast, you used way too much acid. If your hair still feels all coated and grippy, use more acid. I dip my length into the cup measure and hold it for a couple of seconds and then pour it over my head.

[redredrobin]

I haven't found that at all - my hair seems much better when I go abroad.

[stachelbeere]

Yes, I think it's pretty good. Worth trying out at least.

I'll definitely give this one a try first!


Miracle Water?
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=94090

This made a real difference for my hair.

I'll try that too :)


I have lived with hard water all my life, and I don't get it. My hair is perfectly soft. :shrug:


I think, Lapushka, based on the posts I've read over the years, that what you mention is the key. People who are grown with and used to hard water don't seem to have problems usually. Almost always the posters have been someone who have moved to a hard water area. And vice versa, people not used to soft water feel it's unpleasant.

I assume that our hair and skin gets used to the water they grew up with. I can't explain it scientifically but this is my unscientific theory. (as always there are exeption.)

I think I read or heard somewhere that products are designed to give the best results in the given environment we're in. So for example, I noticed that the conditioners I bought here in England contain citric acid and the ones I was using in Poland don't - I'm not sure about other ingredients as I'm not an expert. This could be the reason why people who live in hard water areas have soft and silky hair (like you, lapushka). Maybe if you used my shampoo and conditioner from Poland the results wouldn't be as great?
But that is why I want to try 'local' shampoos and routines that yield silky hair in England. Makes sense to me...? :)


As someone who has moved a lot and been in both hard and soft water places, I agree with this.

In very hard water, my best option has been a combination ACV/citric acid rinse. You will need to play with ratios, but before we got a water softener I used a big glug of ACV and about 1/16 to 1/8 of a tsp citric acid to a two-cup measure. This is much stronger than I see most people making. Basically if your hair feels lank and oily super fast, you used way too much acid. If your hair still feels all coated and grippy, use more acid. I dip my length into the cup measure and hold it for a couple of seconds and then pour it over my head.

The thing is that I always use quiet a bit of citric acid but it doesn't give me the same results as I did back home (agreeing with redrobin here) so I must be using the wrong products

[chen bao jun]

Miracle water adds citric acid and abscorbic acid. There's a formula. both work together.

I think the change from soft to hard bothers many (maybe not all) people's hair and also, as someone said, the same products are formulated differently to work with different kinds of water, which might affect someone's hair also if they are sensitive this way.

Different people's hair does have different porosity, too which would affect how much of the stuff from the water actually got into the hair (not just hard water but sometimes there are chemicals present) affected a different person.

I'm from a foreign country and I remember as a child, whenever our relatives came to the US AND to city water at the same time (they were all used to washing in rain water) the women would lose hair by the gobful. It was the same every time, some one would come and within a couple of months she'd be scared and upset by the horrific hair breakage and shedding. These were usually people with fragile type 4 hair, which is super sensitive to everything, of course, but I'd imagine that there would be few of any hairtype who would be totally immune to this. Sorry the OP is going through it.

[stachelbeere]

Miracle water adds citric acid and abscorbic acid. There's a formula. both work together.

I think the change from soft to hard bothers many (maybe not all) people's hair and also, as someone said, the same products are formulated differently to work with different kinds of water, which might affect someone's hair also if they are sensitive this way.

Different people's hair does have different porosity, too which would affect how much of the stuff from the water actually got into the hair (not just hard water but sometimes there are chemicals present) affected a different person.

I'm from a foreign country and I remember as a child, whenever our relatives came to the US AND to city water at the same time (they were all used to washing in rain water) the women would lose hair by the gobful. It was the same every time, some one would come and within a couple of months she'd be scared and upset by the horrific hair breakage and shedding. These were usually people with fragile type 4 hair, which is super sensitive to everything, of course, but I'd imagine that there would be few of any hairtype who would be totally immune to this. Sorry the OP is going through it.

Chen, that sounds horrible! Those women must have been so upset. I lived in Montana a few years back, the water in the house was hard as well. But from the beginning I was using their 'local' shampoos and conditioners and I didn't notice any problems - but I had short hair and I was oblivious to LHC so I can't really compare to what's happening now.

And it isn't as bad as it sounds now, I just forgot how soft and silky my hair can be when I went back home. I unfortunately don't enjoy it as much as I used to but on the plus side I do a lot of benign neglect. and since my hair is 'grippy' it holds a style easily.

Oh and I know where to find the recipe for miracle water, it circulates on the WO thread...

[Tabitha]

I use Joico K-Pak Chelating Shampoo (http://www.lookfantastic.com/joico-k-pak-clarifying-shampoo-300ml/10792319.html?utm_source=googleprod&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=gp_bodycare&affil=thggpsad&switchcurrency=GBP&shippingcountry=GB&gclid=CIPKuoTczMoCFQoTGwod_bUKxA&gclsrc=aw.ds&dclid=CMavyITczMoCFVMdFgod2kgCog) once or twice a month.

[stachelbeere]

Thank you Tabitha, I'll keep it in mind for the future.

A little update:

I washed my hair today and applied a SMT, blowdried it with warm + cool air.
I didn't want to try everything at once and I also only scalp washed my hair since I came back, so I figured that there shouldn't be too much buildup yet. I just changed one thing for now - the water. I didn't have ascorbic acid on hand so I mixed cold and boiled water together with 1/2 tsp of citric acid in a bucket and this was the only water I used for the whole process. It was a bit awkward to wash my hair that way but it yielded soft, comb-able hair - it's not quiet as silky but it's okay (maybe it's because I used a different conditioner mix?). I skipped my final citric acid rinse as pretty much every single product I used had citric acid in it... not too sure if I need ascorbic acid, but I'll still look into it.

so yeah, thanks for the suggestions, I'll be getting a chelating shampoo this weekend and look into shower filters :)

[hairandtherian]

I don't have product suggestions for England, sorry, but I hope you'r eon your way to finding the ones that work.

I did grow up in a hard water area (the Great Lakes/Lake Michigan) and my hair is affected by hard water. When I chelated the change was amazing, and I've been noticing that grippiness building up. I need to try an acid rinse I guess, but I've been changing so many other things that I haven't started on that yet.

[Kaya]

Moving from the USA to England, I had the same learning experience. The hard water (and a few other factors) wreaked havoc on my hair and worse, I didn't realize it until I took a length shot and saw my hemline had thinned horribly from breakage.

Long story short, I tweaked my routine to include a chelating shampoo and a shower filter and my hair's been doing lovely. (Mind you, I oil daily along with daily CO washes, so YMMV.)

But here are the two products I've learned to rely on.

Shower filter. It really does work; the amount of limescale noticeably decreased.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Inline-Filter-Removes-Chlorine-Reduces/dp/B005PXBA4M/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1454091481&sr=8-2&keywords=shower+filter

Chelating shampoo. I bought it locally at a salon that carries Redken. I use it about once a month and I'm still on the original bottle I bought last winter. :)

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Redken-S7B2RM14-0000-FN-Hair-Cleansing-Cream/dp/B0007X74CW/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1454091511&sr=8-1&keywords=redken+cleansing+cream

Best of luck! :flower:

[stachelbeere]

I don't have product suggestions for England, sorry, but I hope you'r eon your way to finding the ones that work.

I did grow up in a hard water area (the Great Lakes/Lake Michigan) and my hair is affected by hard water. When I chelated the change was amazing, and I've been noticing that grippiness building up. I need to try an acid rinse I guess, but I've been changing so many other things that I haven't started on that yet.


yeah, I know it's such a drastic difference, isn't it? acidic rinses help, I think.


Moving from the USA to England, I had the same learning experience. The hard water (and a few other factors) wreaked havoc on my hair and worse, I didn't realize it until I took a length shot and saw my hemline had thinned horribly from breakage.

Long story short, I tweaked my routine to include a chelating shampoo and a shower filter and my hair's been doing lovely. (Mind you, I oil daily along with daily CO washes, so YMMV.)

But here are the two products I've learned to rely on.

Shower filter. It really does work; the amount of limescale noticeably decreased.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Inline-Filter-Removes-Chlorine-Reduces/dp/B005PXBA4M/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1454091481&sr=8-2&keywords=shower+filter

Chelating shampoo. I bought it locally at a salon that carries Redken. I use it about once a month and I'm still on the original bottle I bought last winter. :)

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Redken-S7B2RM14-0000-FN-Hair-Cleansing-Cream/dp/B0007X74CW/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1454091511&sr=8-1&keywords=redken+cleansing+cream

Best of luck! :flower:

oh thank you Kaya! I already looked into the filter, I'll most probably get it. and thanks for the shampoo suggestion, I'll keep it in mind when I go shopping :blossom:

[dogzdinner]

Ive never really thought about hard water having that much of an effect but people mentioning hair being 'grippy' def hits home! I live in an area with hard water and my hair has always felt kinda clumpy and grippy (its why I have never been able to do any complicated braid styles as I dont have enough hands to try and seperate my hair as I braid).
Sadly I dont have a shower to filter and rinsing my hair with weird stuff tends to make it shed loads.....still, I might be tempted to buy some cheap bottled water to wash my hair in, just once to see if it makes a difference!

[Arctic]

Ive never really thought about hard water having that much of an effect but people mentioning hair being 'grippy' def hits home! I live in an area with hard water and my hair has always felt kinda clumpy and grippy (its why I have never been able to do any complicated braid styles as I dont have enough hands to try and seperate my hair as I braid).
Sadly I dont have a shower to filter and rinsing my hair with weird stuff tends to make it shed loads.....still, I might be tempted to buy some cheap bottled water to wash my hair in, just once to see if it makes a difference!

You don't need to pour any rinses to your scalp; you can dunk your length into a container and swish it there a bit.

[chen bao jun]

Thank you Tabitha, I'll keep it in mind for the future.

A little update:

I washed my hair today and applied a SMT, blowdried it with warm + cool air.
I didn't want to try everything at once and I also only scalp washed my hair since I came back, so I figured that there shouldn't be too much buildup yet. I just changed one thing for now - the water. I didn't have ascorbic acid on hand so I mixed cold and boiled water together with 1/2 tsp of citric acid in a bucket and this was the only water I used for the whole process. It was a bit awkward to wash my hair that way but it yielded soft, comb-able hair - it's not quiet as silky but it's okay (maybe it's because I used a different conditioner mix?). I skipped my final citric acid rinse as pretty much every single product I used had citric acid in it... not too sure if I need ascorbic acid, but I'll still look into it.

so yeah, thanks for the suggestions, I'll be getting a chelating shampoo this weekend and look into shower filters :)

So glad you got a little relief. Washing out of a bucket is a bit of a pain but I also found it worth it. (i actually mix the miracle water in a huge pot)
Remember when you chelate to moisturize .

[stachelbeere]

So glad you got a little relief. Washing out of a bucket is a bit of a pain but I also found it worth it. (i actually mix the miracle water in a huge pot)
Remember when you chelate to moisturize .

thank you chen! and yes, I found that a SMT was a wonderful treat afterwards :blossom:

[Deborah]

I have very hard water. After washing and rinsing my hair, I pour a 40 ounce bottle of very cold water into which I have pre-mixed a teaspoon or so of citric acid powder over my hair. I don't rinse it out (this is key), and my hair ends up soft, silky and shiny.

I hope you find something that works well for your hair. :flower:

[stachelbeere]

I have very hard water. After washing and rinsing my hair, I pour a 40 ounce bottle of very cold water into which I have pre-mixed a teaspoon or so of citric acid powder over my hair. I don't rinse it out (this is key), and my hair ends up soft, silky and shiny.

I hope you find something that works well for your hair. :flower:

ha... not rinsing the final rinse out - I'll keep that in mind for next time, thank you <3

[redredrobin]

Ive never really thought about hard water having that much of an effect but people mentioning hair being 'grippy' def hits home! I live in an area with hard water and my hair has always felt kinda clumpy and grippy (its why I have never been able to do any complicated braid styles as I dont have enough hands to try and seperate my hair as I braid).
Sadly I dont have a shower to filter and rinsing my hair with weird stuff tends to make it shed loads.....still, I might be tempted to buy some cheap bottled water to wash my hair in, just once to see if it makes a difference!

This is so annoying, isn't it? Certain braid styles are easier than others, but for some reason I really struggle with a french braid because of stupid unwanted braiding-itself braid!

[redredrobin]

Stachel and deborah, I'm going to try that final rinse thing too. I do rinses (when I remember) but always rinse them out because I get scared and chicken out :o

[Arctic]

This is so annoying, isn't it? Certain braid styles are easier than others, but for some reason I really struggle with a french braid because of stupid unwanted braiding-itself braid!

This is just a random idea, but if you haven't tried it already, do try Torrinpaige's french braiding method. She add hair to both sides at once, which I think will make the controlling and managing long, sticking-to-itself-hair easier. She has video(s?) about the method.

[redredrobin]

This is just a random idea, but if you haven't tried it already, do try Torrinpaige's french braiding method. She add hair to both sides at once, which I think will make the controlling and managing long, sticking-to-itself-hair easier. She has video(s?) about the method.

Thanks Arctic, I haven't seen that one! :blossom:

[gossamer]

I don't have product suggestions for England, sorry, but I hope you'r eon your way to finding the ones that work.

I did grow up in a hard water area (the Great Lakes/Lake Michigan) and my hair is affected by hard water. When I chelated the change was amazing, and I've been noticing that grippiness building up. I need to try an acid rinse I guess, but I've been changing so many other things that I haven't started on that yet.

Living next to Lake Michigan, I also definitely have to use an acid rinse. I also use a leave-in conditioner with some acid in it too (unless they've reformulated it!). Grippiness is definitely something I struggle with, however, especially during the times I've gone cone-free.

[Freija]

I've just discovered a conditioner that I am finding awesome at the moment. It's this one - http://www.powerhealth.co.uk/honey-cider-vinegar-conditioner/ - it's silicone-free, so I like to do WCC with this as the first C and then a 'cone-y conditioner (currently Aussie 3 Minute Miracle Moist, but there are plenty that would do) as the second C. For the W, I usually scalp wash only, using an ordinary SLeS shampoo (I like Alberto Balsam Tea Tree Tingle, or Simple Gentle Care Shampoo).

After washing and conditioning, I squeeze out the water, blot with a t-shirt or towel, then apply a peanut-sized amount of Nightblooming Freya salve to the lengths and ends, smooth four drops of argan, camellia, macadamia or sweet almond oil on top of that, then damp bun and leave to dry. My hair is mixed-textured and prone to frizz, but with this routine it's as smooth and silky as I think it can get. Once it's calmed down the day after washing, it feels a bit like cat fur. :)

[chen bao jun]

This is so annoying, isn't it? Certain braid styles are easier than others, but for some reason I really struggle with a french braid because of stupid unwanted braiding-itself braid!

My hair does this a bit now. I think it is a length issue too. It never used to happen with shorter hair.